St Molesworth: Top 10 signs you’re not likely to win a Labour Party list seat
March 31st, 2005 at 2:55 pm by David FarrarVery funny this week.
Top 10 signs you’re not likely to win a Labour Party list seat
1. You once employed someone with your own money.
2. When Helen Clark spoke glowingly about the Swedish model, you assumed she was referring to Tiger Woods’ wife.
3. You acknowledge that the UN sex scandals exist and may undermine the organisation’s moral authority.
4. You thought Jim Anderton was joking when he announced the appointment of Brian Easton to the Growth and Innovation Advisory Board.
5. You innocently asked President Mike Williams whether the Labour Party was required to include the Radio NZ budget in its statement of political donations.
6. You’ve eaten all the cheese, drunk all the wine, been made a member of the NZ Order of Merit and been pensioned off to London.
7. You think Michel Foucault may have played fullback for France during the 80s.
8. You don’t think disarming New Zealand ‘s military will turn the country into a moral superpower.
9. Chris Carter doesn’t immediately spring to mind when someone says “average Kiwi bloke”.
10. You’re the Minister of Police.
–
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March 31st, 2005 at 3:09 pm
Well when did Don and Gerry qualify under number 1
Vote:or does public servant and woodwork teacher not count
March 31st, 2005 at 3:40 pm
I thought the Nats disarmed the NZ Defence Force. Take a look at the capital items in the inventory and ask which government purchased them.
Vote:National is full of shit on defence and so many other things.
March 31st, 2005 at 4:00 pm
Don has worked in the private sector. And Gerry worked in the family business didn’t he?
Michael: National had planned to replace existing capabilities with slightly betters ones.
Labour has turned the RNZAF into ‘Royal New Zealand Air’ by removing the combat arm, and they blew $650mil on the 105 LAV’s when I see the Aussies are spending only $AU400mil on upgrading their M113′s and buying real M1A1 tanks with the leftover cash.
Labour has also screwed the Hercules replacement programme, and screwed the Orion electronics upgrade. They have also screwed up the Land Rover replacement by purchasing off a Brit company with no experience mass producing vehicles.
They have turned the Navy into a glorified Customs Patrol, and I have yet to see a public announcement on the go-ahead of the ‘multi-role’ ship.
Labour has in fact screwed pretty near everything up. Also American ships are still banned from our waters, even though they no longer carry nuclear weapons.
Grow a brain, you peacenik ignoramus.
Vote:March 31st, 2005 at 4:20 pm
Wake up and smell the roses AL-
“purchasing off a Brit company with no experience mass producing vehicles….”
The pinzgauer has been in production for ages with many defence forces ( including UK) and many 1000′s made.
The Aussies have spent about $600 mil on the M1A1( used tanks by the way) alone
Vote:March 31st, 2005 at 4:32 pm
This from defense-aerospace.com
Under this agreement, the US Government will provide 59 refurbished and updated M1A1 Abrams tanks, seven M88 Hercules Armoured Recovery vehicles, advanced gunnery and driver training simulators, training and other support equipment and a range of spares. This agreement is the central component of the $530 million Abrams package, which also includes tank transporters, refueling vehicles and ammunition.
What was the spare cash you were talking about ?.
Maybe you were totally wrong about the pinzgauer’s too, wrong about the nuclear ships ( 9 years of national didnt change anything) wrong about the Orion upgrade ( contract let late last year see ‘Flight’ weekly), wrong about the hercules ( with only 25000 hrs they are equal to 5 years of an ANZ 747)
Vote:March 31st, 2005 at 5:10 pm
buzzcut, buzzcut, buzzcut.
the full item buzzcut should have referenced:
http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi-bin/client/modele.pl?prod=35163&session=dae.11216031.1112244698.QkuB2sOa9dUAAFljeZ0&modele=jdc_1
Lets do the maths:
Aussies:
59 real tanks + 8 ARV’s, (tanks with real guns and armour, and those funny tracks that are often useful in mud and sand). The deal also includes lots of other goodies:
The Foreign Military Sales (FMS) offer for the M1A1 includes, spares, training, support vehicles, Armoured Recovery Vehicles, simulation systems, radios and ancillary equipment as part of the overall package.
The cost is $AU600mil, including the much more expensive recovery vehicles. So lets say $AU550 mil. for entire deal.
350 refurbished M113′s for ~$AU400mil
http://www.tenix.com.au/Main.asp?ID=437
Our cost for 105 untracked light armoured cars: ~$650mil, which does not include quite a few other costs as outlined by the 2nd Auditor General report available as a link on Labour Scandals. In fact evidence for most other points is also on Labour Scandals.
Total cost for Australia: $AU950mil for 410 Tanks + APC’s, = maybe ~$NZ1.1 billion.
Total cost for NZ: ~$NZ650mil for 105 LAV’s, not including costs hidden away as part of the general Army budget (or not costed at all as reported by the Auditor General).
NZ doesn’t have proper ARV’s so i didnt include them in the costs.
I’ was recently emailed that the NZLAV can technically fit inside our Hercules, unfortunately its flight radius is reduced to about half so it can’t even get across the Tasman. But they do have 25mm cannons, while the M113′s will only have 12.5mm machine guns.
If you want the precise figures, ive linked to some sources on LS. I haven’t ensured my figures here are completely accurate.
But good try buzzcut. Do you still think it was a good deal for NZ?
Vote:March 31st, 2005 at 5:49 pm
Mark Burton on the LAV purchase:
Media: Did you buy too many
Vote:March 31st, 2005 at 6:39 pm
I see Labour has agreed to buy new NH90s for the RNZAF. This would have happened under National? -yeah right.
Vote:The MRV is under construction in the Netherlands as we blog. Due to commission in about 18 months.
To the blogger who called me a peacenik – I served in the RNZN for 8 years so stick it up your arse.
March 31st, 2005 at 8:04 pm
AL for President.
Allah protect us
Vote:March 31st, 2005 at 9:14 pm
AL you were wrong about the cost of the Aussie M1A1 deal. I of course was right , but you just repeat my facts and claim them as your own
NZ’s amour was disposed of by National in the early 90′s (Scorpion), are you suggesting we really need to reverse that and have heavy armour. of course not that would mean you say National were wrong in the first place, believe me its much easier just to say the Aussie $400 mill M1A1 plus m113 deal you made up.
The reason we have only 2 Anzac frigates, is that national( and NZ First) cancelled the option to buy a 3rd in 1997. But didnt have any project to replace the last of the 2 steam figates. Of course labour has gone for 2 1700t corvettes ( actually ordered, not a fantasy fleet), was it the best option ?. But sure beats doing nothing which was national policy.
Sure the Hercs were built in the late 60′s, but an airframe is based on the number of flight hours. The last B52 built is actually older but the US is retaining them too. Same goes for the US KC135 fleet, in airframe hours they are only halfway through their life.
Of course they do need an upgrade which is planned.
Just announced the new medium helicopters, I suppose you found something wrong with them.
I read the complete Auditor general reporton the LAV, the only cost he faulted the Army over was ‘ in his opinion the army should have bought $40 mill of spares to sit and rust for the next 15 years’. hello, NO ONE puts all your capital into having spares sit around. The supply chain will just deliver spares as needed with the army paying out of the maintenance budget just like the real world. The pinzies production line was moved to the UK after 20 years in Austria. Yes unfortunately military hardware is prone to glitches ( ask the Aussies about their subs, their Seasprites, the f111′s never got over their engine problems,the UK has had problems with Apache, Merlin, I wont go into all the US problems with new and upgraded hardware but if you really wanted not to buy anything at all this is the excuse you would use) and NZ previously had problems with the macchi jets engines( rolls Royce ??) and the frigate gas turbines and hull structure. Send them all back they are junk ? ? .
Sure the combat jets were axed ( interestingly the original air combat force was the Wellington bombers ordered by the labour govt in 1938- to save money which had been mostly spent on the navy of the time)
Vote:WEll times change. Having NEVER used the air combat force since the end of the WW2 ( in the late 50′s in malaya we borrowed the RAF venoms/canberra’s)
Not Korea ( why not), not Vietnam ( why not)
not Gulf War I or II ( why not) hint the answer for Gulf II is labours fault.
As for give me glory or give me death the airforce jet pilots chose to spend their time in the bar.
March 31st, 2005 at 9:25 pm
I admit I exaggerated rather a lot with the ‘extra cash’ comment. I would like to contribute more to this debate but I unfortunately don’t have time tonight.
Vote:March 31st, 2005 at 9:32 pm
1) Yes I do, so spank me.
Vote:2) Does a Volvo count? They have models you know 870, 940, sure they aint as curvy as Tigers, actually they look a bit like bricks, but I like that in a model.
3) I acknowledge the UN sex scandals, but am left wondering where mine are, and why every one else is having all the fun.
4) You should have stopped at the word “joke”, because that’s what Jim Anderton is.
5) RNZ now offers politically correct whanagnga funded Labour Party politcal studies courses but with NCEA type results.
6) The barrel only managed to see him get to the car to the airport, damn it evaporates so fast in Wellington’s humidity.
7) With that haircut?
8) A finger-wagging superpower yes undoubtably, but I prefer the explody stuff if its to make a point.
9) Chris, Mum’s calling …. you to sort out that load of crap called the Building Act 2004, fast law is always bad law.
10) Do we have a Minister of Police?