Benson-Pope accusers step forward
February 26th, 2006 at 5:05 am by David FarrarWhen I read on the Investigate Magazine website yesterday that there had been several more anonymous allegations against David Benson-Pope, specifically of inappropriate behaviour with female students, my first reaction was that it wasn’t that serious. After all the alleged behaviour, while very creepy, was not illegal.
In fact I’ve been on record as saying it has been how Benson-Pope has lied in response to the allegations that has been the issue, more than if he did one stick a deflated tennis ball in a kid’s mouth.
But today’s Herald on Sunday reveals that three of the four further female complainants have agreed to be named. This makes it far far worse for the person whom Helen Clark appointed as Education Minister last year.
When the accusers are not named it is relatively easy to deflect the issue. However with the girls having signed statements it means that MPs in the House can directly ask whether the statement of xxxxx is true or not.
The Prime Minister is being ridicolous by saying that there is no further issue at all unless complaints are made to the Police. The behaviour complained about is not illegal just very very inappropriate for a teacher (or any adult).
Some of the stuff former students have complained about is not that serious in my opinion. Throwing a blackboard duster happened often at my school. Even the tennis ball incident and making kids stand outside in the cold can be excused or at least seen in context. As a former youth group leader I’ve done the odd thing which isn’t quite in the manual, and have some sympathy for not having a microscope examine every action you did years later.
However the accusations that he punched or hit a student in the face was very serious. These further accusations of entering female changing rooms are also very serious. Every teacher and indeed any adult should know that is quite unacceptable.
I think these latest allegations will mean it will be untenable for Benson-Pope to continue as Welfare Minister. Unless he sues the students for defamation (as he has now threatened) he is now too damaged to continue.
February 26th, 2006 at 8:32 am
It’s now getting to the point where Clark will have to deal with him. And deal to him she will.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 8:38 am
Is he a list or electorate MP? Depending on how the media play this he might have to resign from Parliament.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 8:40 am
“These further accusations of entering female changing rooms are also very serious. Every teacher and indeed any adult should know that is quite unacceptable.”
I have been involved in adjudicating (mostly after-hours) debates at 3rd through to 7th Form level (dunno what “year” that is now
) as well as having been a non-parent at several Brownie camps (my then fiancee was a senior leader).
Both occasions saw me taken aside, to be made to read a set of rules and to agree to them which basically came down to
1. NEVER put yourself in a position where you find yourself alone with a student/child. If you do, phone/call/yell/run/panic to be joined by another adult as soon as possible.
2. NEVER enter any ablutions/sleeping quarters/other private area without
– a) first telling another adult you’re going there
– b) if possible, having said adult observe you at all times (with the exception of being on the toilet yourself)
3. In the event you find yourself in a situation which can be construed as inappropriate (5 year old girl runs up half naked to tell you girl X stole her pants) — AT THE FIRST OPPORTUNITY tell other adults what happened and how you dealt with the situation.
These rules are to protect the adult as much, if not more, than the children.
One you have the childrens’ trust, they will ask you to do things which are ok for a parent, but not for another adult. Suck is the innocence of youth. The appropriate response is to either find their parent or find another adult to be a witness to the event.
To walk into the showers and gawk at them until they yell at you to leave is just soooo over the line.
The man is not fit to be an MP. He’s got to go.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 8:57 am
The problem BP has is he has just the sort of bullying personality that makes this all too credible.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 9:50 am
While I am most definitley NOT a Labour supporter, I feel that this situation is becoming more like a witch hunt.
These so called events took place about a decade ago and were never serious enough to be addressed at the time.
Now as the accusations fly and more people jump on the bandwagon, I actually feel very angry that all of a sudden these events are suddenly very traumatic.
Its pathetic.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 10:42 am
Ok armoured they were addressed at the time. The school failed to act on complaints.
The issue of DB-P lying about it in parliments remains a serious issue here.
Do you really think that if someone gets away with something for long enough they should be given a free pass?
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 10:58 am
This is trial by media. A court would never accept attributions of intent like this example as “evidence”:
“He knew we were in there and he did it on purpose, thinking it was okay for him to be in there.”
Some of you have already decided he’s guilty on the basis of these kinds of allegations. It says more about your political allegiance than your appreciation of the rule of law.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 11:12 am
“This is trial by media.”
If you’d like to push for trial of another kind feel more than welcome. However, I suspect that the only way we’re going to see that is the media informing us of the allegations – it’s how a lot of political scandals, including those that result in official inquiries or criminal charges begin.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 12:14 pm
I’ve said before that if the incident with the gimp-gagging was with a female Clark would of turfed him out as fast as Dover. Expect to see him disciplined now that females are involved – purely because the PM is sees females as fully human and males less so.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 4:44 pm
The allegations are just that – allegations.
Nothing illegal appears to have happened.
However, regardless of what happened, these allegations have tainted the Minister and won’t go away.
Perception is reality, and he should just resign in order to effectively end the matter once and for all.
When you are a public figure, or a taxpayer-funded representative, unfortunately you can’t just ignore these sorts of things in the same way a private citizen might be able to — you ultimately have to front up and deal with it.
His biggest “crime” was attempting to deny it in Parliament, and then avoid any sort of responsibility whatsoever.
I am firmly of the belief that if he had fronted up at the start of this whole affair and said “yep, there is some truth to what is being alleged, and yes it is regrettable, and yes I do absolutely regret what happened and unreservedly apologise” then the matter would have ended right there and then. He should also have offered to resign (and that way ultimately the PM has to decide how important these things are to your ability to be a Minister).
Even if he absolutely did not feel that he should have to apologise, reality is that he needed to in order to manage the issue and get past it.
His refusal to do anything of the sort has simply protracted the issue and inevitably bought other things out (such as these fresh allegations).
My advice. Offer to resign as Minister. Apologise. Express regret for what appears to have happened. Leave with at least some dignity.
Scott.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 5:24 pm
Well there is a good variety of opinion here. Sadly some have failed to study the enemy (Labour) to any great degree.
DBP is completely safe. There is no election looming & this is the PM’s third term. Hence the boot is firmly on her foot. Here is a salient point, they won’t yeild an inch. There is no need to, & they will stoutly defend old DBP just to stick it to the opposition. Yet more corruption from the Government that deals in the currency of lies.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 5:56 pm
Labour won’t touch DBP. He has Helen over a barrel. Thus these comments:
The Prime Minister is being ridicolous by saying that there is no further issue at all unless complaints are made to the Police.
And, even if more complaints are made, there will still be no action unless he’s found guilty.
Imagine the quetsions if DBP is sent packing:
Now that the prime minister’s own election conduct has been referred to the police, will she follow her own advice to DBP and resign herself?
keep your eyes on the prize. DBP is not the prize.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 7:26 pm
I think Scott has a good point. The political adage that “it’s not the crime that kills you, it’s the cover-up” isn’t any less true because it’s old as the hills.
Still, if this story proves to have legs I’m sure we’re going to see the parade of DBP proxies swing back into action. These women are all politically motivated, mentally unstable liars who were really slutty little teases back in the day. Anyway, even if all the allegations are true that’s just how men behaved, and it never did anyone any harm.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 7:37 pm
Quote: Do you really think that if someone gets away with something for long enough they should be given a free pass? Unquote
Get away with what?
Furthermore, we have a boxer who is deemed worthy enough to “represent our country” in the Commonwealth games who has actually committed MANSLAUGHTER.
http://www.newstalk.co.nz/newsfeature.asp?storyID=90513
And the media jump on top of an MP with a few allegations.
Its pathetic.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 7:39 pm
Quote: Do you really think that if someone gets away with something for long enough they should be given a free pass? Unquote
Get away with what?
Furthermore, we have a boxer who is deemed worthy enough to “represent our country” in the Commonwealth games who has actually committed MANSLAUGHTER.
http://www.newstalk.co.nz/newsfeature.asp?storyID=90513
And the media jump on top of an MP with a few allegations.
Its pathetic.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 9:03 pm
Armoured_Passionfruit:
And your point is? Soulan Pownceby was actually prosecuted (big spot the difference right there), plead guilty, if my memory serves, and was sentenced to prison for his offending. When David Benson-Pope was facing serious allegations of criminal misconduct as a teacher, we just saw how very different the standards are for the powerful and well-connected.
But, hey, we can all have a giggle when the Minister of Social Development (who happens to be responsible for Community and Family Services & Youth Development) wants to get on his soapbox and start pontificating about appropriate treatment of children, and parental responsibility for their behaviour. After all, he’s such a splendid role model.
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 10:11 pm
DPF was a youth group leader!!
Would somebody please think about the children
Vote:February 26th, 2006 at 10:22 pm
When a politician throws allegations of defamation around you can be generally assured that the alleged defamatory statements are true.
DBP’s threats are meant to intimidate and only add to the weight of evidence.
DBP is a bully. I would gladly represent those girls in any defamation proceedings for the extraneous joy of cross-examining him, he seems to sleep easily.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 8:20 am
Craig: And your point is? Soulan Pownceby was actually prosecuted (big spot the difference right there), plead guilty, if my memory serves, and was sentenced to prison for his offending.
I would think that surely the “big difference” is that Pownceby killed his baby daughter, and DBP now is accused of, um walking into a girls’ dormitory where some pupils might not have been fully dressed; and walking into a girls bathroom to hurry up pupils in the shower (although all shower doors were shut and he couldn’t have seen the girls). In the latest round he is further accused of, um, throwing dusters (the horror …) and striking a girl on the thigh with a ruler …
DBP’s own present behaviour and previous denial that he’d ever been subject to a complaint will probably further tarnish his reputation, perhaps critically. But I see Rodney Hide has called for the police to investigate. He didn’t say on what grounds, but that’s the point, isn’t it? The HoS trumpted “new questions”, but didn’t ask them. The innuendo is the only thing that keeps the story afloat. I sort of wish someone would just accuse him of being a paedophile and get it over with.
Cheers,
Vote:RB
February 27th, 2006 at 8:50 am
I have to agree with those that say it is a ‘witch hunt’. It is the same mentality that exists throughout New Zealand at the moment where a group of women get together and bolster each others stories of things that were really not much of a deal at the time. The stories grow, and are exaggerated, and all of a sudden they become a desire for attention, money, or an excuse for why their lives are now traumatised.
Vote:Yes the man is/was a bully but this is totally over the top.
I could dig out historical incidents in my own life that are similar, but that’s the way school was in those days.
These girls need to grow up and move on.
February 27th, 2006 at 9:13 am
http://www.oldfriends.co.nz/MessageBoardViewThread.aspx?thread=757603&institution=389
Here’s the original “oldfriends” thread… sounds like a different teacher to DBP was known for entering girl’s showers & changing rooms.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 9:17 am
Yes Russell, but if it was a National MP you’d be feverishly blogging about it with links to every bit of information you can find. Stop pretending you’re not as partisan as we are.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 9:23 am
Very interesting message board thanks for posting Llew.
Vote:There are always two sides to a story, and I actually feel sorry for the man.
February 27th, 2006 at 9:32 am
It sounds like someone has an axe to grind. If this case were to go to a REAL court, it could never be a fair trial. It relies on ‘word against word’, with the media having added far to much to the equation. It’ll become a toned down version of the Michael Jackson circus. There is no way any jury, if they were doing their job properly, could find him guilty.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 9:47 am
Russell Brown, don’t be a hypocrite.
Imagine if what you really posted above was this:
“I would think that surely the “big difference” is that Pownceby killed his baby daughter, and Don Brash now is accused of, um walking into a girls’ dormitory where some pupils might not have been fully dressed; and walking into a girls bathroom to hurry up pupils in the shower (although all shower doors were shut and he couldn’t have seen the girls). In the latest round he is further accused of, um, throwing dusters (the horror …) and striking a girl on the thigh with a ruler …”
I put it to you Russell, and I’m happy to go back through some feverish previous posts of yours, that if this was Brash, or George W Bush, the left wing media bunnies who control the MSM in this country would be all over it like rats for weeks, and Helen Clark (if it were Brash) would be stridently calling for accountability and an end to the sleaze.
Get real. We’re talking about a new recent allegation of criminal assault (corporal punishment years after corporal punishment was repealed) and lecherous sexual harrassment of vulnerable schoolgirls by a card carrying Labour Party member and union official.
I can only presume you condone that kind of behaviour.
We also appear to now have an issue of several former senior teachers at Bayfield making false statements to last year’s police investigation, which is itself a criminal offence, and further allegations of misconduct at Bayfield by teachers against students.
I’ve said it in The Briefing Room and I’ll say it here: the only reason Investigate gives Labour the once-over on a regular basis is because so many of my journalistic colleagues are so far up the backside of the Labour Party it’s no surprise they can’t see the light because – contrary to government spin – the sun does not shine out of Labour’s posterior.
Somebody has to actually be the Fourth Estate in this country. I gave National and Act a right going over in the Winebox days…now it’s Labour’s turn.
You squeak on about Brethrengate and the vast right wing conspiracy, but tolerate all manner of putresence in the name of the Left.
Give me a break.
Ian
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 9:56 am
“If this case were to go to a REAL court, it could never be a fair trial.”
With relatively minor charges such as common assault or assault on a child, or disorderly behaviour, I doubt very much that DBP would be charged indictably. He’d only get a jury if he personally asked for one.
Of course most of this behaviour is not really serious enough (or recent enough) to warrant the intervention of the courts, the real question is whether it is appropriate that a person who does something of this nature ought to be in cabinet.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 10:01 am
And one final thing to clear up any confusion:
These women did NOT meet to cook up a story. They were all approached separately and independently by Investigate and the Herald on Sunday during a trawl through the 96 and 97 class records.
I initiated that trawl after receiving a tip from a Dunedin resident who’d worked with a mother who’d made a formal complaint.
In fact, apart from the girl who was assaulted, I didn’t speak to any of the girls that Herald on Sunday found, I spoke to others, so the total number of potential complainants that I’m aware of his higher than the “four” quoted in the HOS.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 10:03 am
I’ve said it in The Briefing Room and I’ll say it here: the only reason Investigate gives Labour the once-over on a regular basis is because so many of my journalistic colleagues are so far up the backside of the Labour Party it’s no surprise they can’t see the light . . . Somebody has to actually be the Fourth Estate in this country.
Well hooray for Investigate Magazine. This might be a valid point if the original story about the allegations hadn’t been broken by TV3 – who have vigrously covered the DPB issue at every opportunity, and if the instructions-to-leak-the-police-report mini-scandal hadn’t been broken and comprehensively covered by NZPA and run in every newspaper in the country. Far from leading the charge, Investigate is trailing far behind the rest of the pack.
lecherous sexual harrassment of vulnerable schoolgirls . . . former senior teachers at Bayfield making false statements to last year’s police investigation . . .
Now, I’m not a fancy big city lawyer, but I’m pretty sure that anything you say on this blog would be discoverable in the defamation suit that DPB is waving around. It’ll never happen, of course – no Minister wants to sit in court while a small army of vengeful former pupils slag him off – but I’d be a little more careful with my rhetoric if I were you.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 10:23 am
Hi Danyl Mclauchlan,
How come your email address resolves to dim@paradise.net.nz? That belongs to a regular commenter on Kiwiblog who uses the pseudonym of “Dim”?
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 10:36 am
I am so pleased benson-dope is fighting this – (see http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0602/S00402.htm ) it will just let the issue carry on ands damage Benson-dope and labour even more – question time in parliament tomorrow will be great. problem is that National are too spoilt for choice.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 10:54 am
RB wrote:
The innuendo is the only thing that keeps the story afloat. I sort of wish someone would just accuse him of being a paedophile and get it over with.
I reply:
Russell, with all due respect, that’s being bloody silly and you’re smart enough to know it. I’ll freely admit that I’m bringing my own life experience to the table here – I’ve seen what happens to victims and whistle-blowers in a school where a bully culture is tacitly accepted. I’m not talking about discipline, but outright thuggery and petty sadism among a significant minority of teachers and pupils. It’s not pretty – especially when it all comes out in the open -, and cracks like that are part of the problem.
I’d also make the point that the big difference between Soulan Pownceby and David Benson Pope is that attitudes towards domestic violence and parental abuse of children have changed a lot (and mostly for the better) over the last thirty years. Back then, he might never have seen the inside of a courtroom let alone been convicted. Bullying and creepiness from male teachers, well… sometimes I have to wonder. (And just as a matter of curiosity, what would be your reaction if the name in this story had been Alan Peachey? You’d feel entirely comfortable with him keeping his education spokesman role? Well, I sure as shit wouldn’t.)
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 11:01 am
Here’s the original “oldfriends” thread… sounds like a different teacher to DBP was known for entering girl’s showers & changing rooms.
Yes – that occured to me too. Impossible now to unravel, I guess, but it seems quite a stretch to suppose that the women would have remembered the wrong teacher altogether.
Ian: you have demonstrated in the past – abortion and breast cancer; soy milk and homosexuality, etc, etc – that your standard of proof tends to be governed by your personal fervour.
Cheers,
Vote:RB
February 27th, 2006 at 11:27 am
I’d also make the point that the big difference between Soulan Pownceby and David Benson Pope is that attitudes towards domestic violence and parental abuse of children have changed a lot (and mostly for the better) over the last thirty years. Back then, he might never have seen the inside of a courtroom let alone been convicted.
Craig, it was the 1970s, not the dark ages. I think that even then it would have been customary bring charges against a man who killed his daughter.
Bullying and creepiness from male teachers, well… sometimes I have to wonder.
Which is rather my point. The “wondering” seems to extend a good deal further than the evidence does.
(And just as a matter of curiosity, what would be your reaction if the name in this story had been Alan Peachey? You’d feel entirely comfortable with him keeping his education spokesman role? Well, I sure as shit wouldn’t.)
On the basis of the recent revelations, I genuinely think I’d feerl the same no matter who was involved. It doesn’t reflect very well on DBP – indeed, his handling of the whole thing has reflected poorly on him – but there’s a very great gulf between that and what is being tacitly implied in this case.
Cheers,
Vote:RB
February 27th, 2006 at 2:39 pm
Russell
Can I take you to task on the whole post?
You wrote:
“Here’s the original “oldfriends” thread… sounds like a different teacher to DBP was known for entering girl’s showers & changing rooms.
“Yes – that occured to me too. Impossible now to unravel, I guess, but it seems quite a stretch to suppose that the women would have remembered the wrong teacher altogether.”
Yeah, it is a stretch, and if anyone had bothered to check they’d find the posts about the other teacher come from students who attended in the 80s and early 90s.
For the record, Investigate has been given the names of five teachers who slept with children at Bayfield – four men, one woman. We’re working through that list getting corroboration.
You then continue:
“Ian: you have demonstrated in the past – abortion and breast cancer; soy milk and homosexuality, etc, etc – that your standard of proof tends to be governed by your personal fervour.”
Yeah, let’s take a look at that shall we? Abortion and breast cancer…proven links according to many medical studies. But the left wing media don’t like it so highlight the studies that don’t show it. Nonetheless, many – the majority in fact, do. Get over it.
Soy and homosexuality? Taken out of context by GayNZ, but the essence of the argument was this: being gay cannot be an inheritable condition in the normal way because it runs totally counter to the much beloved theory of natural selection favouring breeding. Ergo, could it be caused by environmental factors? Answer, possibly yes. There is copious research on the damage of phytoestrogens (particularly manmade ones) in the environment, causing gay behaviour in animals and also hermaphroditism.
Is it beyond possibility that this is a factor in human homosexual behaviour? Of course it is a possibility. Nothing more, nothing less.
Once again, stop playing the social-liberal conspiracy theorist and start dealing with the substance of the stories. Take your best shot.
Ian
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 3:06 pm
being gay cannot be an inheritable condition in the normal way because it runs totally counter to the much beloved theory of natural selection favouring breeding
An easy canard – a homosexual gene is entirely possible if it confers a selective advantage on family members of organisms expressing the gene.
For an extreme example of how this works look at worker ants – they’re sterile but part of an evolutionarily successful species.
Abortion and breast cancer…proven links according to many medical studies.
Well, a couple of medical studies carried out by Dr Joel Brind, an endocrinologist (NOT a statistician) and, not incidentally, a fervant pro-lifer.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 3:34 pm
Abortion and breast cancer…proven links according to many medical studies.
From a “Abortion and breast cancer: a case-control record linkage study“…
There is controversy about whether interruption of pregnancy, particularly if it is induced rather than spontaneous, increases the risk of breast cancer. Individual studies, and reviews summarising them, have given conflicting results.
Recent guidelines from the UK Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists (http://www.rcog.org.uk) state that the evidence is inconclusive but that, when only those studies least susceptible to bias are considered, induced abortion does not seem to increase risk.
Most studies of this association have been case-control interview studies. An important and much discussed consideration is whether such studies are inherently subject to reporting bias—that women with breast cancer may be more likely than control women to tell the interviewer if they have had an induced abortion when questioned about their reproductive history.
If there are systematic reporting biases in interview studies, neither pooling of data across studies in meta-analysis nor further similar studies will eliminate their effects. The overall odds ratio calculated in Brind’s meta-analysis relied exclusively on data from 21 case-control studies. By contrast, prospective cohort studies and studies based on linkage of independent records cannot be influenced in this way by reporting bias. However, only three such studies have been published.
[emphasis added].
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 6:03 pm
Russel, I know you like to really try to throw doubt on allegations against B-P, unfortunately for you (and B-P) the original complaint filed with the school specifically against B-P has come to light. No chance I’m sorry, that this is a misremembered incident against other teachers. Poor old B-P’s memory seems so bad, can’t remember something potentially as serious as a sexual harrasment complaint only 8 years ago, that I would venture that he is unfit to be a minister. Of course, I am sure that it won’t be in the “public interest” to investigate any further, would it ? And the inestimably independent speaker is highly unlikely to allow a further privileges complaint, after all this has all been subject to a complaint already hasn’t it ?
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 7:08 pm
Of course gayness is genetic. It is attached to the neatness gene and the ability to use just enough hair ‘product’ gene.
Actually, wouldnt it be remarkable if a gay gene does exist, and that it confers upon the person extraordinary fertility!
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 7:15 pm
Ed Snack – just because a complaint was laid, doesn’t make it true. Someone might do that out of spite, and then let it go because their conscience get the better of them. Remember that denying it an earlier allegation is not an option in these situation. You must stick to the story at all cost.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 7:27 pm
I’d say that actively asking people for dirt on a person, and publicising that dirt with the specific intent of screwing up their reputation, with lashings of unproven hyperbole like “lecherous sexual harrassment of vulnerable schoolgirls” is closer to bullying than the odd bit of petty sadism. It’s not journalism, at any rate.
It also takes a lot of nerve to accuse someone of being a conspiracy theorist on the same page as suggesting your pet medical theories are suppressed by left wing media and that you’re the only one investigating this because most other journalists are Labour Party lackeys.
One of my teachers asked me out a couple of years after I left school. Perhaps Ian Wishart could investigate whether he belongs to any political party and persecute that for a while.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 8:36 pm
Well put Andrew, it is time to start attacking those nasty children, slags probably, all of them, who want to do good ‘ol David down. After all, parents are always making untrue allegations, in writing too, for just that purpose. Now is a good time to start undermining their reputations, make them look bad, and it’s all for a good cause, the continuation in office of that good and kind man, David Benson-Pope. But don’t worry, Helen has the power to protect him, might will prevail.
How low will the Labour party stoop this time, I wonder.
Vote:February 27th, 2006 at 11:29 pm
“Ed Snack – just because a complaint was laid, doesn’t make it true.”
Quite write, but it does mean you shouldn’t say that there never a complaint.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 7:31 am
The Herald have published the letter of complaint sent to the school. The more we hear about Mr Benson-Pope the more loathsome he sounds, and although I think the current witch-hunt is pretty sleazy, it couldn’t have happened to a nicer guy.
You have to wonder what would have made him deny any complaint was made against him (to the house!) when he was aware that this letter was sitting in someones filing cabinet somewhere?
‘Our daughter xxxx of xx went to school camp from August 24 to 29. While she was there she experienced some very uncomfortable moments.
While xxxx doesn’t have much confidence in herself, she did give abseiling a go, and once over the top she started to descend and lost her footing. Xxxx had to be lowered down. Xxxx was asked to do it again, which she refused to do. I feel that most people that haven’t done it before would have been put off from trying again, and to expect her to do it again was wrong. After a short interval Mr Benson-Pope told everyone to go back to the van and xxxx was asked to stay behind. He asked xxxx to give it another go and she said “No” several times.
Mr Benson-Pope said “I’m losing my temper now, get up there,” which was a grass bank. He asked xxxx to go back down it, which she did. He then asked her to do it again and said, “Listen to what I say, don’t move your feet”. Xxxx tried it, she felt she was going to fall and so she moved her feet. With that Mr Benson-Pope said, “Don’t move your feet”, and slapped her on the thigh. He told xxxx that he thought of her as a failure and this made him a failure.
Other incidence [sic] happened also.
1. That Mr Benson-Pope entered the girls’ showers while the girls were showering and told them to get out.
2. Mr Benson-Pope walked on to [sic] the girls’ dorm while they were dressing and stood there and talked to them.
I know how tiring and trying that a camp with so many children can be, but there really isn’t any excuse for what Mr Benson-Pope did. There were five females in attendance at the camp and we both feel that if the girls had to be spoken to then it was better for one of them to go to them.
Everyone is entitled to privacy and both my husband and I feel that a breach of trust has been broken. We will not be allowing xxxx to travel anywhere with the school again if this is the standard of conduct from those in charge.
September 1, 1997′
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 8:27 am
Memo to Dover Samuels: Well Dover, arn’t you feeling just a slightly bit peeved? You were fired by Aunty Helen for failing to disclose an impropriety in your past … and that after you had supported her when she lost her rag on the lower Marae at Waitangi. Perhaps you were too honest in owning up … seems what you should have done was to say you had no recollection of the incident. That seems to be the ‘acceptable’ standard for a Minister circa 2006. Pay fast and loose with the truth and we’ll pass it all off as a trifling matter all part of the huge right wing conspiracy to bring down the Government.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 8:58 am
Russell Brown really is sickening with his defence of Benson-Pope and disgraceful behaviour in general. As David Cohen once wrote about him (and I can only paraphrase): “When a National MP is in trouble, Brown blogs about the great scandal, but when a Labour MP is in trouble, Brown thinks we all want to read about old Mum’s pork chop recipe”.
Here we have it again, in Brown’s comment from yesterday: “On the basis of the recent revelations, I genuinely think I’d feerl the same no matter who was involved. It doesn’t reflect very well on DBP – indeed, his handling of the whole thing has reflected poorly on him – but there’s a very great gulf between that and what is being tacitly implied in this case.”
What a load of crap. If this was Brash, Brownlee of Peachey, he’d be screaming to high heaven. I don’t think he “genuinely thinks [he]‘d feel the same” at all – he is either tryign to delude us about his political “objectivity” or he doesn’t know himself very well.
And the typical Labour “his handling of the whole thing has reflected poorly on him” really is sick. These Labour activists don’t seem to think that what he has done is worthy of condemnation at all (after all the boys were bullies and the girls slags) only that he hasn’t spun the press gallery well enough. How amoral is that!!!???
Brown is an absolute creep. What’s the bet his next blog is about some “interesting” IT issue, or, indeed, Mum’s latest recipe.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 9:02 am
Ed – No I don’t think we should attack the children, and yes I do think if it were true that it is a serious issue. No question. However, this situation is far too murky and there are far too many people who are trying to score points here. I am questioning the motives, firstly of the people who laid the complaints, and second of the people pushing the issue. Think back to your own school days. How many teachers at your school were considered sleaze-buckets, perverts and freaks? And how many of those actually were. All I am saying is, let’s be rational about this. Hysteria will take us nowhere, other than sell a lot of advertising!! Unfortunately the evidence is very difficult to assess.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 9:09 am
I was disappointed that on Campbell Live last night it seemed that the headmaster would keep his mouth shut firmly so we could never know if DBP knew about the complaint so we could know he lied to parliament of if the headmaster would take the bullet and let everyone think he was incompetent.
You can imagine my joy to read in the ODT this morning that the headmaster has come clean. He absolutely did tell DBP about the complaint.
DBP is a liar. (Well that much we already knew).
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 9:15 am
So the headmaster nailed BP to the wall and saved his own arse?
Typical leftie.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 9:29 am
Andrew Bannister says:
“Think back to your own school days. How many teachers at your school were considered sleaze-buckets, perverts and freaks? And how many of those actually were.”
To answer his questions, I would say “very few” and “all”. I suspect BP was even sleazier than these claims suggest, and there were many more dodgy incidents, but only a few incidents were black-and-white enough to make formal complaints about. That would be my recollection from how sleazy teachers used to behave.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 9:30 am
“Typical leftie.”
How on earth do you know he was a leftie.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 9:43 am
“I suspect BP was even sleazier than these claims suggest”
That’s pretty good proof. Lets hang the fucker.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 9:55 am
The headmaster obviously dealt with the complaint from the parents the way a lot of cowardly people in managerial positions choose to. He covered for a staff member and swept the problem under the carpet hoping his incompetence at dealing with the issues raised would not be brought to light.
Vote:Now there are two issues to be dealt with more than a decade apart, and instead of being handled in a quiet, and private setting, he is now part of a public media battle which is not painting him in a very favourable light.
The whole thing is entirely out of hand, and once again the investigations of Mr Benson-Pope are being paid for by the tax payer.
February 28th, 2006 at 10:15 am
All too easy to make retrospective allegations. The party making them has all the advantages, and the party defending invariably suffers from the average person thinking “no smoke without fire”.
And it is worth bearing in mind that 14yr old schoolgirls are absolutely the pits. Ask any experienced secondary teacher…they full of their own bitchy self-importance, and whereas the boys usually respond to raging hormones with stupidity and crassness, the girls are downright nasty and vindictive when they want to, especially as they know that there is not a lot the average male teacher is going to do about it. Asserting your authority in those circumstances is not especially easy. Now unless I was willing to put my hand up to do the job, I am inclined to hold back on the judgmental leaps some of you are all too happy to make.
Personally I am uncomfortable with the idea that the public and the media have the right to hold politicians and public servants to a so much higher standard of purity, that almost all the rest of us would fail to pass. All we seem to be doing is just opening the door to smear politics even wider.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 10:26 am
How do I know the headmaster is a leftie?
Recent election. Clear Labour party supporter.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 10:30 am
Logix,
The issue isn’t really about whether or not the girls who’s privacy DBP violated ‘deserved it’ (what a creepy argument), but about the fact that he seems to have mislead Parliament by denying that any complaint was made about him. Its now difficult to deny that at least one serious complaint was made regarding his teaching.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 10:42 am
Didn’t you hear Dim? BP is suffering from Amnesia.
Poor, poor thing. Lets have a round up for some choccies and flowers. I’ll play the violin.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 10:44 am
The lefties defence of that lying, leering, cowardly bullying perverted prick truly shows how stupid they really are.
Logix above is one of the most stupid. Nothing and no excuse for a male teacher to enter into the shower area of 14 year old school girls. If a teacher did that to one of my daughters who were 14 – I would deck the prick – I would ensure he is embarrassed in front of the whole school and I would ensure he was sacked. I would also ensure the prick would never have anything to do with my daughter again.
The appropriate standard of behaviour for any girl between the ages of 10 and 18 is sensitivity to the fact they are going thru puberty and there are situations where the requirement for privacy (such as washing, dressing) must be respected.
The prick has been found out. He should have been gone by breakfast. Clark is spineless. Rodney deserves this scalp.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 11:00 am
Didn’t you hear Dim? BP is suffering from Amnesia.
Poor, poor thing. Lets have a round up for some choccies and flowers. I’ll play the violin while the pigs flutter overhead.
Vote:February 28th, 2006 at 11:38 am
Dim – my reading of logix wasn’t that he was saying the girls “deserved it”. He clearly stated:
“the girls are downright nasty and vindictive when they want to, especially as they know that there is not a lot the average male teacher is going to do about it”.
Not the same as saying they “deserved it”. Read!!
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