New Year’s Honours
December 30th, 2006 at 4:26 pm by David FarrarNo time for a full review, but with no disrespect to Lloyd Geering, what exactly has he done to be seen as one of the 20 greatest living New Zealanders (being granted The Order of New Zealand), except face a heresy trial 30 years ago?
I’m not being nasty – not got a thing bad to say about the man. Just I honestly can’t think of what he has done of national importance since then.
Even though I am not personally familiar with Dr Doreen Blumhardt, I can see why she would be included with her decades of services to the arts at the highest level. I just can’t work out Professor Geering’s award. Sure for any of the lesser awards, but the supreme award i meant to be for extraordinary service which has touched the nation so to speak.
Anyway the full Honours list is here. Comment away on them!
Related posts:
- The 2012 New Years Honours
- New Years Honours
- Another Republican who supports titular honours
- The 2011 New Years Honours
December 30th, 2006 at 5:17 pm
The thing that Geering has done, over a long period of time (the “heresy” trial was 1967) is to be a thinker.
As a philosopher (he may not use the term himself, but that’s what he is) he has absolutely no peer in NZ. He certainly has no peer in the ONZ (Jonathan Hunt, Jim Bolger need not apply
NZ needs more thinkers. Even though I am a militant atheist (and Geering is a Christian, he says), I’m glad to see recognition of one of them.
Vote:December 30th, 2006 at 5:27 pm
I agree. Lloyd Geering is a bizarre choice. He is a man who denies the existence of the things he studies, yet insists that spirituality is vital to society. His own lack of any real faith is no encouragement to anyone to develop a faith. How does he set an example for other Kiwis? What is there to applaud or admire?
Vote:These already tinpot awards are being further debased, and a better model to identify real contribution to our society will be “Mucking In”
December 30th, 2006 at 7:01 pm
So Tim Selwyn will be due for an ONZ about 2036 then?
Vote:December 30th, 2006 at 7:21 pm
Just I honestly can’t think of what he has done of national importance since then.
Decades of service to theology at the highest level?
Not that I have any time for theology, but if we hand out high honours for lifetime achievement in other academic disciplines, I don’t see why it should be excluded.
Vote:December 30th, 2006 at 7:51 pm
A worthy associate for Jumbo Hunt,though in my view Bishop Tamaki has done more to advance the values of christendom. Still there are numerous clergymen up and down the country who do make a difference. Wellington’s Des Britton for example and those in other centres who put a lot of effort into bringing Christmas to the homeless. Those that if permitted by political correctness bring comfort to the sick and dying.Ironic that a Jesus Denier who almost fits Liabour’s vision for New Zealand takes centre stage. The next vacancy will probably be filled by a Moslem (Ahmed Zauoi perhaps)in the expectation that perhaps it might deter their next generation from trying to jihad us.
Vote:December 30th, 2006 at 9:29 pm
It seems to me to be trendy to dis’ the established religions, especially if one is purporting to be religious. It’s not surprising some people think he should be rewarded for this.
’100 years ago, churches stood for something’ Geering laments. They still do. The fact that they might be emptier now is that society in general thinks those standards were too high.
The shift in perception on the role of the church and religion in our society is not the sole blame of the church. Geering needs to look around him and think a little deeper about how much society has actually lost as it liberalized.
Not every change has been for the better. The Church is more a casuality than a cause. And Geering gets a reward for kicking it when it’s down. He can hang it on his altar of hubris.
Vote:December 30th, 2006 at 9:43 pm
Geering has helped the gay rights wing of the Labour party divide the Presbyterian Church as well as other mainline churches. LOL.
Vote:December 30th, 2006 at 9:54 pm
Didn’t he attack traditional Christian beliefs? If so, then it is no surprise he was ‘honoured’
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 7:29 am
The bar has been set pretty low; if the former Min of Wine and Cheese can be one of the top 20 then surely someone who should have come clean and left the church should be able make it.. Maybe a little message in this from the PM for religious tolerance, accepting someone within the church that doesn’t actually believe
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 9:19 am
I’d never even heard of Geering or Blumhardt before until I read this.
I see Sam Neill got his reward for sychophantic services to the sisterhood in ’05.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 10:27 am
The media reporting of Geering has been worse than the normally pretty woeful standards of NZ reporting. The news reports focussed on his heresy trial. But nothing on his enormously influential books and articles, or how his regular radio shows brought theology to a wider audience, etc. Geering has always sought to keep intellectual enquiry and reason at the forefront of Christian belief, even at a time when the churches are increasingly turinging inwards and becoming more dogmatic. Geering’s most important role has been to articulate liberal Christian theology, and he is an internationally respected theologian. He is also the most acute and perceptive observer of religion in NZ (even though many Christians don’t like what he is saying). I think the Order of NZ award to Geering is long overdue recognition for NZ’s most important, and an internationally respected, religious thinker.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 10:54 am
It is what you would expect from this anti-Christian govt. to put a ”Claytons Christian” up on a pedistal.
Geering has forged a reputation on talking and writing about his apostasty.With Christianinity being all about faith this man delighted in talking about how he had no faith.And then being able to express this with the ”respectabilty” of academic ”speak” of course he become the darling of the athiestic left.
But as for Geering being one of the top twenty living New Zealanders;you have got to be kidding!It has to be seen as a deliberate snub to all Kiwi Christians.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 1:06 pm
Heres a the list of members of The Order of New Zealand, most of them probably haven’t achieved enough to be on it.
http://www.dpmc.govt.nz/honours/lists/onz.html
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 3:21 pm
Geering fell out of favour with the Presbytarian Church.
Obviously since the Presbytarian church are a bunch of bigots that must be “marginalised out of existence”, Geering is a hero.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 3:34 pm
I/S – that would be fine for any of the other honours but this is meant to be NZ’s Top 20. There’s 500+ Professors who could claim decades of service to their area.
I just have this feeling that if he had never be tried for heresy by a church (which is something of no importance to the state – it is an internal matter) he would never have got this honour.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 4:25 pm
I agree with Andrew W.
In fact I beleive there would be several hundred thousand hard working, non-complaining and non-well-known NZers just as worthy.
Considering the number of ex-MPs that get these awards and the dame HC will no doubt get one I have no interest in following this bizzare archaic ritual.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 5:14 pm
As a philosopher (he may not use the term himself, but that’s what he is) he has absolutely no peer in NZ.
What a silly thing to say. Kim Sterelny (Victoria), Rosalind Hursthouse (Auckland), Max Cresswell (Emeritus at Victoria), and Alan Musgrave (Otago) all have superb international reputations, and other NZ philosophers are held in high regard, as is philosophy as a discipline in this country. And that’s without naming eminent NZ philosophers who are working overseas.
You might get away with arguing that as a theologian he has no peer in NZ, but confusing theology with philosophy simply demonstrates ignorance.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 6:46 pm
I am simply astounded that ANYONE who pontificates as much as spirit of 76 does would admit to have never having heard of Lloyd Geering. Lloyd Geering is one of our most distinguished thinkers and religious philosophers, and has been for over four decades.
More evidence that appalling ignorance never stopped a right winger expressing an opinion.
Vote:December 31st, 2006 at 10:35 pm
DPF: And how many of those 500+ other professors can you name? Geering may be one among many – but he is, for better or worse, famous for his accomplishments (though maybe “notorious” would be a better word) – and not just within his discipline.
(I’m also pleased to see a general emphasis on academics this year. As Gordon said, we need more thinkers; hopefully greater recognition of those we have might encourage people to take academia more seriously).
Vote:January 1st, 2007 at 1:14 am
Zen, excellent post – I don’t agree, but that’s neither here nor there; I hope you weren’t expecting an intelligent reply?
Vote:January 1st, 2007 at 11:16 am
David
I think you are right. Compare Geerings work with that of someone like Jeremy Waldron a former Otago student who is now one of the leading political scientists in the world.
Contrary to what Gordon has posted it is false that Geering is a talented philosopher. Much of what he says in philosophy of religion is extremely superficial and at times extremely dated. Anyone, familiar with the field of philosophy of religion in the last 40 years and who has read say the works of Mackie, Flew, Plantinga, Swinburne, Craig, et al will recognise this. See for example http://www.qsmithwmu.com/metaphilosophy_of_naturalism.htm for a survey of the current state of play in this field.
I suspect you would be hard pressed to find any of Geering’s articles published in any of the major philosophy of religion journals, nor would his contributions even be mentioned in a standard text or course on the subject. I suspect that outside of NZ almost no one has ever heard of him.
Matt
Vote:January 1st, 2007 at 11:40 am
And nothing for Dr D T Brash….
Vote:January 1st, 2007 at 12:03 pm
Not that I have any time for theology, but if we hand out high honours for lifetime achievement in other academic disciplines, I don’t see why it should be excluded.
I agree that honours should be handed out of lifetime achievement in academic disciplines including theology but I seriously question your comment “Decades of service to theology at the highest level?”
If you know anything of the field (and being married to a Dr of Theology I do) Geering is NOT considered to be anywhere near the highest levels of the discipline.
Pick up the peer reviewed journals, check out the works of the most prestigious in the field and you won’t find Geering’s name or his work anywhere and if you read the work on offer, particularly in the field of philosophy of religion you’ll find theories like his were debunked years ago.
Geering is like L&P – world famous in New Zealand, yet like the P part of L&P, considered a bit of a fraud and no longer the genuine thing.
Vote:January 1st, 2007 at 12:19 pm
Geering is New Zealand’s most important theologian – founder of religious studies as an academic discipline in NZ. He is internationally respected as a leading scholar in his field, and a founding member of the Jesus Seminar.
Vote:The extent of ignorance exhibited in some of the comments here is absolutely depressing. I suppsoe this ignorance is not helped by media reporting which focuses on his heresy trial, yet ignores his academic leadership, and a steady series of highly influential books and articles. His lectures were simply awesome – a man of humour, humility, and a razor sharp intellect.
One of New Zealands towering intellectuals. His title is long overdue.
January 1st, 2007 at 7:13 pm
Most New Zealaanders, the rest of the Commonwealth along with the Yanks say “ONZ”? “Is that as good as a knighthood?”.
Vote: