Nice exchange
June 28th, 2007 at 9:20 am by David FarrarWhale Oil highlights this exchange in the House:
Rt Hon HELEN CLARK: Can I stress, again, that John Key made exactly the same commitment for a thousand extra police. No doubt, Bill English thinks that is a gimmick too, but it might explain why when Mr Key was interviewed this week on whom he was leaving in charge while he was away, he listed Moonbeam, the family cat, before he got to Mr English.
Hon Bill English: Moonbeam the family cat could get recruited as a policeman these days!
Simon Power: He’s too bright!
Heh.
No tag for this post.
June 29th, 2007 at 7:37 am
They try and find a difference between Bill English and John Key and then give the impression the National Party has problems with unity. But it is the fake image of unity in the Labour Party that is the real issue. No one believes that exists. Bill English and John Key can work very very well together, even if there is creative tension from time to time. Blair and Brown were a formidable combination, and so was Howard and Costello. It is the Finance Ministers’ job to say no even to the Prime Minister, that is something Cullen has never managed.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 8:00 am
Tim. And you would know that how!
Secret member of the cabinet are you.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 8:16 am
Cullen should be culled, as he is a gutless made in kiwiland wimp who allows morticia Clark and her feminazi rottweilers (H1 & H2) to carry on with the subterfuge. The male labour party MP’s are disgraceful and an insult to masculinity, courage and decency!
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 9:27 am
It is not rocket science. The fake unity of the Labour Party is laughable. They have worked themselves into a standstill, incapable of doing anything except spend money and handle small issues such as SOEs cutting off power or smacking legislation.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 9:50 am
So now the Nats are insulting undermining our police force? Nice work guys.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 10:04 am
You’re happy with the state of NZ Police force James?
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 10:21 am
James … seems to me the Police have done a pretty good hatchet job on themselves when you consider:
- politically inspired prosecutions (or not)
- Clint Rickard et al
- Beazley Report
- banning acredited media from the Beehive
- the 111 debacle
- deliberate lowering of entry standards
Its true that 90%+ of the police force are good people doing a hard job to the best of their (perhaps limited) ability. Its also true that they are led by donkeys and polically compliant donkeys at that.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 11:04 am
National and Act are always going on about how we need more police, and now when we get more police they complain about the quality.
Just how to they propose to get more police?
They’re not going to pay them more are they? Cos that would mean they’d need to steal more money from me. Sorry, I mean “raise taxes”.
And they should stop all this dissing of the police too. You’re either for the police or against the police, and if you’re against the police you should fuck off and go live somewhere else. I hear they’ve got great police in Cuba, you commie bastards.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 11:18 am
Actually National at the last election, if I recall, said they wanted to change police priorities rather than necessairly increase the numbers.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 11:45 am
Actually National at the last election, if I recall, said they wanted to change police priorities rather than necessairly increase the numbers.
Even better. Crime is out of control, gangs are ravaging communities, it’s not safe to walk the streets anymore. Kids are seeing crime as a viable alternative to education, people are getting raped and murdered all over the place, and New Zealand is turning into a south Pacific version of Johannesburg or Bogota.
But na, we don’t need any more police, says the National party. There’s enough, we just need to change their priorities.
Instead of going after the those speeding drivers we’ll make them just go after hard crime. Sure, about a thousand more people will be added to the road toll every year, but half of those will be lefty-loonies, so who really cares.
And yeah, there might be a slight reduction in police revenue since they won’t be issuing any more speeding tickets. But we can always make that up by stealing more money. Oops, I mean raising taxes.
And ok, yeah we said hard crime, but there still won’t be enough police to solve all of it… So we’ll just go after the really really bad crimes.
I mean robbery isn’t really that bad, and I’m sure most of those gang members are nice young men deep down. It’s good of those paedophiles to teach our kids about sex, we can save money on sex-ed. Plus everybody knows woman only get raped because they ask for it.
So the police will just go after the murders, and what a great country we will have.
Thanks National!
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
Feel better after your little rant rickyjj. The last nine years of YOUR administration have seen the police force go from heros to zeros in the public estimation.
Proud of that are we?
So, in YOUR brave liitle world, it is to be labelled as ‘treason’ to raise legitimate concerns about an organisation that, in recent years, has lurched from crisis to crisis.
I want a police force, led by competents, free of political bias, and staffed by officers with an IQ considerably better than that of a typical Labour apologist.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 1:18 pm
Feel better after your little rant rickyjj.
A little, yeah
The last nine years of YOUR administration have seen the police force go from heros to zeros in the public estimation.
Why’s it my administration? Is everybody who doesn’t support National now a Labour member?
And I thought people were pissed off cos of all that stuff the police did in the 80′s?
The 80′s weren’t in the last 9 years were they? What’s your IQ again?
And then after the 80′s didn’t National come into power for 9 years too? Why didn’t they clean it all up? Weren’t the same idiots in charge of the police now around in the 90′s? I bet they got promotions in the 90s too. Thanks National!
So, in YOUR brave liitle world, it is to be labelled as ‘treason’ to raise legitimate concerns about an organisation that, in recent years, has lurched from crisis to crisis.
Maybe? Haha but na, I was more trying to look at it from the right-wing point of view… You know, like the whole if you’re against the war you’re against the troops thing.
It’s just that IQ thing again, like you guys clearly don’t understand rational argument so I was trying to put it in your own language. It’s much better if we can all understand each other
I want a police force, led by competents, free of political bias, and staffed by officers with an IQ considerably better than that of a typical Labour apologist.
Me too. Higher IQs the better I say. And while we’re at it we might as well get competent teachers and health-care professionals too.
Oh wait, that’ll cost more money hey. And you guys aren’t really into the whole taxes thing…
Oh well, was a nice dream while it lasted.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 1:44 pm
I dunno Ricky, you’re not sounding that coherent at the moment. …”thousands to the death toll…”
I think changing police priorities is a great idea. See, any monkey can issue a speeding infringement. Even a machine can do it.
Why waste cops time doing it?
I also think looking back at ‘who done what’ in their respective governments isn’t that helpful. Things change. Most of Nationals front bench is new, much of Labours is too.
Vote:4th Labour government anyone?
June 29th, 2007 at 1:50 pm
well Rickyjj … certainly appear to have got you going but have to say your bluster just doesn’t ‘cut the mustard’. Just refresh me as to who held the Police portfolio between 1999 and 2005 … I remember now, the one with the towering intellect, the Hon Member for Manurewa George Hawkins … the man who did such a good job that he was dumped from cabinet … and now YOUR Party is trying to dump from his seat. Well done Labour.
This whole thread started out with a rather humourous exchange highlighting the very low IQ of some police recruits … and in your latest response you agreed the need to raise standards of our police and expanded that to include teachers and health professionals.
So, in one posting you have managed to attack the credibility and effectiveness King, Mallard and, Hodgson.
Not hard to do but well done.
With friends like you, Labour doesn’t need enemies.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 1:53 pm
Speaking of the Police, Ian Wishart seems to have Broad in his sights, if his latest post on The Briefing Room (http://www.tbr.cc/) is to be believed.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 2:32 pm
rickyjj – did selma or sonic slip you some of their party pills as I can’t understand what you have written ?
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 2:42 pm
I also think looking back at ‘who done what’ in their respective governments isn’t that helpful. Things change. Most of Nationals front bench is new, much of Labours is too.
I agree. But if people are saying this Labour goverment has been so crap, why shouldn’t I point out that so was the National government before that? And yes the Labour one before that was too, but so was the National one before that. And so on.
Helpful would be debating policy, instead of accusing other sides of conspiracies and hidden agendas and all that bullshit. Most politicians want exactly the same thing, they just disagree on how to do it. They’re not out to get anyone!
If National has a problem with employing ‘dumb’ cops they should come up with a solution, cos at the moment I’m not convinced they have one.
So, in one posting you have managed to attack the credibility and effectiveness King, Mallard and, Hodgson.
I don’t think so. Either the health, education and police are doing a perfect job, or there’s room for improvement. And I’m sure those ministers would agree that everything isn’t ‘perfect’. However this doesn’t mean that National would be able to do any better.
There’s always things going wrong with departments and people making mistakes. In every Labour government and every National government. And so I think it’s a bit rich to criticise Labour for employing ‘dumb’ cops without coming up with a better policy yourself.
With friends like you, Labour doesn’t need enemies.
Friends who think independently and aren’t afraid to tell the truth? As opposed to National supporters who unite in their immature name-calling?
The right constantly bags Helen for being a commie lesbian, where as I don’t feel the same need to criticise John Key. He’s obviously an impressive and intelligent man, but I do disagree with some of the ways he wants to go about doing things.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 2:45 pm
But ricyjj John Key is a FAMILY MAN and has CHILDREN !
Save the FAMILY !
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 3:19 pm
rickjj … for the record I would never characterise HC as a ‘commie lesbian’. Intelligent yes, control freak yes, poll driven yes. Never to be underestimated.
But simply HC represents the past rather than the future and NZ deserves better than what we have now.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 3:36 pm
Now I’m certain Rickjj you are just looking for a reaction but the fact is that reprioritisation of the Police force would be a extremely good idea.
For example, official records show that up 40% of the average policemans time is spent writing speeding tickets. The government is making huge revenue from this, but when you consider that half of their remaining time is spent doing a mountain of paperwork then you don’t have to be too clever to realise they simply don’t have time to address crime. A colleague who has recently returned to the police after a long absense is surprised at how many corners are being cut in todays investigations.
If we were to remove this mindless speed ticket work and put them onto things they were trained to do then you would automatically see the equivalent of a dramatic increase in police numbers.
But this is typical of a socialist government. They are supposedly very concerned for public good, but in reality have no interest except in control.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 3:52 pm
You’re either for the police or against the police, and if you’re against the police you should fuck off and go live somewhere else.
Rickyjj, your previous comments on other issues had you firmly registered in the back of my mind as someone whose name, when it appeared on comments here, would cause me to always stop and read what you had to say.
But I’m sorry, that is the single stupidest thing I’ve read anywhere in a long time.
I’m “for” the Police in that I want my children to live in a NZ that’s safe and where they’re protected from criminals.
I’m “against” the Police because I also want my children to grow up in NZ in which their civil rights are respected, they’re not milked of cash for the most trivial of road “offences”, and the chances of their arrest and possible imprisonment based on the dodgiest of evidence is nil.
To hold such a black-and-white view of the Police your encounters with them can’t have extended much beyond the odd traffic ticket. If they had you would, I suspect, hold a slightly different view.
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 5:07 pm
“The right constantly bags Helen for being a commie lesbian, where as I don’t feel the same need to criticise John Key. He’s obviously an impressive and intelligent man, but I do disagree with some of the ways he wants to go about doing things”
She is a commie lesbian…..DOH!
Vote:June 29th, 2007 at 5:50 pm
The fact of the matter is that the NZ Police has developed a perception of being rather wiffy and more than somewhat incompetent.
A police force’s good name, image and reputation is the most valuable asset it possesses since these qualities link into everything it set up to accomplish: from recruiting through to solving crime etc..
Like most police forces, the NZ Police has always been a bit dodgy around the margins. However if one is looking for reasons why public perceptions have plummeted in recent years, then the finger must be unerringly pointed at its own actions and omissions.
Personally I question whether the NZ Police even cares very much any more about what the public thinks of it. Consequently the best policy seems to be to place a strict and highly discretionary limit on any form of voluntary contact with any member of this organisation.
Vote:July 30th, 2007 at 1:01 am
The majority of the police officers that I have had dealings with over the years, particularly during protests, have shown themselves to be corrupt in one way or another. It used to be that hardly any of their corruptness made it on the news; now ‘serious crimes’ committed by police officers are on the news. Hopefully in the future, their ‘lesser forms of corruption’ will be put in the spotlight, such as illegally searching people’s homes (without a search warrant, that means), pulling over vehicles simply because of the ethnicity of the driver, the list goes on and on.
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