Latest from Dom Post
July 31st, 2008 at 2:50 pm by David FarrarI’ve been in meetings up until now, so only catching up with the latest from the Dom Post.
First we have the undisclosed $20,000 deposit in 1999. If the deposit was all from the same donor it has to be declared. Now possibly it was made up from a number of different donors. The Dom Post doesn’t specify – I assume they may have more than they have published to date.
Then we have the wonderful audio file of Phil Kitchin phoning Winston for comment. The whole clip is 12 seconds long of which six seconds is the phone ringing, three seconds of Kitchin saying who he is and then three seconds of Winston saying
“Phil, I told you I’m not talking to a lying wanker like you. See you.”
and hanging up.
They also have a story on the explanation Peters had walking into the House:
“Let me just say, any moron who knew anything about political parties and election expenses would have known exactly what that was about.”
Vernon Small is unimpressed with the bluster:
There are signs in his behaviour in the past week that he is beginning to believe his own legend, that all he has to do is bluster, attack the messenger and flash his smile to rise above any and all allegations, even those of hypocrisy. He cannot and he has not. …
Of course, the trust fund, and Mr Peters’ refusal to engage with any questions about it, is not an issue of ministerial responsibility but is one of his own credibility with his supporters – but still an area of legitimate interest to the media.
Not accusations, but legitimate questions that deserve answers from an elected representative so the jury in the court of public opinion can come to a verdict.
Labour’s delay of the confidence and supply vote from today until next week is not a coincidence. There are growing concerns in Labour about how their final weeks leading up to an election campaign could be tainted by association with Peters’ tactics.
If the SFO do decide to investigate (and in 2002 they investigated National over similar allegations), then Clark will be under real pressure to suspend Peters. He would react very badly to being suspended and this is why the timing of the confidence vote is increasingly important.
Related posts:
- Campaign 08 on Winston
- A vote for NZ First is a vote for a new election
- Will Clark seek confidence next week?
- Is the Dominion Post also a liar?
July 31st, 2008 at 3:19 pm
David, has there been any political poll in the Tauranga electorate? If there hasn’t there should have been because the result will have major effect on the outcome of the election.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 3:20 pm
I wonder if the Media will follow Kitchin around for the next week asking him if indeed he is a lying wanker. The accusation is made, now there are questions to be asked. over and over and over again. Phil knows the answer, but he’s not talking.
Headlines for next week:
“No lies, but wanking not ruled out.”
“Kitchin: I was 13, what’s the big deal?”
“Woman says still hungry after Kitchin promised to buy her lunch.”
“No admission yet, but only a fool would admit it.”
“Kitchin: Ewen Street once made sperm donation.”
“Seed of lie spill into media hands.”
I can hardly wait. This is how journalism works isn’t it? It must be, I been learning real good all month.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 3:22 pm
Has anyone got Winston’s c/p number just so I can call him, tell him that I’m not talking to a lying wanker like him, and then hang up!
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 3:27 pm
“Let me just say, any moron who knew anything about political parties and election expenses would have known exactly what that was about.”
But we don’t. Thus the questions. I guess the upside is we don’t qualify as morons. On the other side, since he seems to be the only one who knows “exactly what that was about” he would be the moron then yes?
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 3:31 pm
fat chance that Grant L will do anything As I posted earlier hes shit scared of offending SHE WHO MUST BE OBEYED in the final days of the SFO
Can you just imagine Grant having to front H1 and H2 and tell them hes going to prosecute Luigi. Jeez he wouldnt need the lift to get from the 9th floor to the ground.
The dying days of this corrupt Socialist administration is providing endless fun for students of good governance.
An ongoing cornucopia of examples of how NOT to
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 3:42 pm
All I know is that I was stupid enough to vote for this [to use his own words] lying wanker because he promised before the last election that his party would remain on the cross benches and vote issue by issue. But having betrayed those who voted for him, by this outright dishonesty and lack of integrity, it now seems he can do anything, because holding onto his support is more important to Clark and apparently Key than any issue of truth.
Now try explaining that to one of your kids – this is how democracy works, this is the ideal of a state that helps those unable to help themselves, this is based on fairness and common sense, consideration and honesty – like this Cabinet Minister being driven from one side of the street to another to avoid journalists who he later tries to dictate to what step they need to stand on while asking him questions he won’t answer, and saying he’s given the money he owes Parliamentary Services to charities instead, but he won’t name because they may suffer a backlash from his transparent intelligent actions.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 4:20 pm
winnie is more slippery than a jar of vasiline, shit you can put a mongrel called winnie in a suit and in parliment and call this liar HONOURABLE ?? SHIT but you cannot take the mongrel mob out of winston (SLIPPERY) peters, a born liar PRAYS ON OLD WHITIES, a ??????lawyer
so sue me winston i cannot give a straight answer
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 5:28 pm
Also among those items in today’s ComPost was a charming report of Ron Mark’s interjection labelling Rex Widerstrom a “paedophile” in the house yesterday.
Do you have to be a certifiable idiot to be a NZ First MP?
Is this the same Ron Mark who has a conviction for statutory rape – a conviction for rape of an underage girl? The hypocrisy is breath-taking when we have a total knob like Marks cowardly smearing somebody (from the cushy protection of Parliamentary Privilege) with a baseless claim of the behaviour of which he has been found guilty himself.
What little respect I had for the gutless little creep Marks has gone forever. He is as bad as the rest of the lying hypocrites who infest the NZ First party – Winnie’s little helper is as venal and corrupt as his master.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 5:42 pm
Well what about Widerstroms ‘ recovered memory’ of his overhearing something about the Spencer Trust 15 years ago.
Thats was before the trust was formed.
Plus ‘Kitchen’ clearly says there are more than one cheques on the deposit slip.
Thats why he doesnt show the cheques this time. he hasnt got a story. Only lies
And yet that load of lies was a front page lead in the Granny herald. Does Audrey apologise for misleading the country.
Does Widerstrom tell about his time in court ?
There is no such crime as statutory rape. Making things up 3 coil
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 5:52 pm
She could sack Peters but National could agree to abstain on the supply bill and any other miscellaneous supply measures (if any) on condition she announces the election date. The delay is interesting, but I cannot work out why.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 5:55 pm
The issue here is again hypocrisy.
The Dompost have again highlighted that NZF takes large donations, just under the level required for disclosure, while Winston Peters speaks out against them.
Again I congratulate Phil Kitchin and the Dompost, they are correct to do so.
However I wonder if they are playing into Winston’s hands by doing so. It would almost be certain that this deposit was of two cheques, each for $9999. There is nothing illegal in this. It does not need to be disclosed. I am sure every politcal party has received donations for exactly $10,000 without disclsoing them ( which is incidently is the level required for non -disclosure…….$10,000.01 is the trigger point.). It is also not illegal to bank two cheques together. This merely gives Peters the ability to make the dismissive remarks he made today and to stand up at a Grey Power meeting and argue he is being unfairly hounded by the media.
However I am very pleased the media is pursuing it because it is blatantly clear that Peters has received a large amount of funding form wealthy indiciduals and organisations over many years, whilst he spoke out against the practice. He also voted for the Electoral Finance Act which restricts our rights to campaign against him and his practices, and justified his actions on the grounds it would keep ‘secrest money” out of NZ politics.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 6:02 pm
DPF, You should read the Herald instead. John Armstrong’s on the money when he point sout that Peters’ confrontations with reporters serve a purpose; they provide a visual reinforcement for his story of a vast media conspiracy against him.
Hell, I see that I agree with Boscowen on this particular point.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 7:09 pm
ghostwhowalks2 says:
Please refer to this comment I made yesterday for an explanation, The short version – I don’t believe Winston did anything wrong, nor that the simple fact the Spencer Trust exists to be either legally or morally wrong. Until Sir Bob Jones spoke out I assumed that everyone who “donated” to the Spencer Trust did so in the full knowledge that their money was to be funneled through a trust to help pay Winston’s legal bills.
It only becomes qustionable – possibly legally and certainly morally – if donors did not know or, worse, were in fact told explicitly that the money was going to NZF.
If Winston had said “Damn it, poor management on our part. My sincere apology to Bob Jones. Would he like his money back or is he happy to have the Trust transfer it to the party?” I wouldn’t have said a thing. However when what he said was “I don’t solicit donations” (wrong), “I know nothing of the Spencer Trust” (wrong), and “Bob Jones is wrong” (wrong) I spoke out after being asked to by several journalists. You’d rather I lied, or pretended not to remember?
Winston made it an issue, ghostie. Otherwise, like the Adelaide professor dragged from obscurity to back Jones’s view, I wouldn’t have even known there was an issue.
You mean the one fact Winston does know about the Trust he knows nothing about is that it didn’t exist when I was there?
I gave a 6 1/2 minute extended interview to “Holmes” at the time the charges were dropped. I’m not about to bore Kiwibloggers rigid with my life story but if there’s something you’re absolutely burning to ask, go right ahead. Honestly.
Thank you, by the way, for challenging me on the facts (which I’m always happy to debate) and not stopping to Ron Marks’ level of innuendo.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 7:10 pm
Jafapete -Thats John Boscowen or maybe Mr Boscowen to you, no need to be impolite, just makes you look like the small man.
Now Ghosty – could you tell us when the trust WAS formed? You appear to have the inside info.
And are you saying Ron Mark wasn’t convicted for having sex with a minor? Just wondering how far you’ll go defending the indefensible.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 7:16 pm
Been watching “Winnies World” nightly on the tv news, this soap opera is fast becomming a tragedy. Winnie if you are reading this please apply for compassionate leave, for yourself.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 7:19 pm
Ghost
You are a typical example of a gutless left wing cunt who is happy to dish out the dirt but cannot take it when it is thrown back your way.
DPF allows you to “contribute” here (fucked if I know why) yet you offer nothing at all to the site, you abuse people, smear them with false accusations that you never back up yet you run back to your heavily censored Standard (funded by Labour party staff members and tax payer dollars) and scream with faux outrage when ever somebody evens suggest that dear corrupt leader might be anything less than a saint.
Oh and DPF….bring on the demerits, I don’t give a shit how many I cop for this post but I am not going to sit back and let a cunt like Ghost smear people just because they do not support his fucked up view of the world.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 7:40 pm
Good on ya bruv – if cunt was in my lexicon, I would have used it too.
Rex – you sound to me like a honest and honorable man, I enjoy your posts here.
Just saying.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 7:54 pm
….Not in my lexicon either, but as I understand it, c##ts are useful.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 8:06 pm
Chicken Little: Thanks. Hey, given your monicker and all, you’re not a strategy advisor to Peters and Marks are you? Coz, you know… they are behaving like they think the sky is falling. Just saying.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 9:12 pm
Chicken & Paul
Sorry for the strong language but sometimes there is just no other word to describe somebodies behaviour.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 9:12 pm
GhostWhoWalks (5:42pm) – you are in lala land.
The irony is sublime – you are agueing this exactly as Winston Peters would. But just saying something (no matter how adamantly) does not make it so. Outside in the real world, you just…sound as ludicrous as Winnie does. Winston is hallucinating in some weird state of uber-denial (very possibly certifiable) – what’s your excuse?
Why desert your dignity to try and stand up for a slimeball like Peters anyway? Have you no self-respect?
Edit: are you Winston?
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 9:42 pm
Just one small point David.. the idea the Government delayed the vote on appropriations because of fears of losing the confidence motion does not stack up. If they feared losing it, surely they would have brought it forward not pushed it back to next week. It could have passed this afternoon, but they brought forward the Lawyers and Conveyancers Bill. This was because they stuffed up the original amending legislation and if this hadn’t passed from tomorrow a whole bunch of stuff would have become technically illegal. Including lawyers working for unions being employed by unions and giving them legal advice, which obviously was an unintended consequence of the law change.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 9:42 pm
Even if the Government collapses at this stage how is that going affect the election date? It would still be on for 8 November. It would just look bad that Hels can’t manage a government any more. Similar in that respect to Cullen not being able to manage the economy.
Time for a change.
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 9:54 pm
heh.. just googlestumbled on this:
“The government is also looking at ways we can help raise private sector
awareness of bribery and corruption laws here and overseas. We need to be
vigilant in our fight against all forms of corruption, not just bribery of foreign
public officials, to be an attractive place to do business,” Mr Peters said.
source: Media Statement from Rt Hon Winston Peters, Nov 2006
Vote:July 31st, 2008 at 10:53 pm
Rex you suggested at 7.09 that the Spencer trust was used exclusivley to pay Winston Peters personal bills ( and by implication that practice continues today).
If that is subsequently proven to be the case, that changes things considerably. In my posts I have always been prepared to give Peters the benefit of the doubt. Innocent until proven otherwise. Just because there is no disclosure of a donation from the Spencer Trust to NZF does not mean there was not actually a donation. ( I argued an innocent explanation is that 3 or more bank cheques of $10,000 or less anonymously donated to NZF did not need to be disclosed).
If however the Spencer Trust is used exclusively for Peters personal use ( legal bills etc) that changes things enormously. The Dompost have not produced evidence of this ( yet…although they may either already have it, or get it). If it was proven that Jones’s $25,000 did not go to NZF that would be very damaging.
Vote:August 1st, 2008 at 8:01 am
which obviously was an unintended consequence of the law change.
Vote:Isn’t that a surprise – this Labour Government passing a sloppy law / amendment with unintended consequences…
August 1st, 2008 at 8:23 am
Winnie and the Trust Fund of Doom. Watch as Winnie swings his short arse across alligator infested press galleries while winking at the handsome young gal coquetteshly batting her eyelids at him from the other side of the coallition chambers.
Earlier contributers are correct Winnie and Hulun are hoping to bluff and bluster their way out of this one – why do I have a funny feeling the water temperature is rising but they havent noticed yet.
Vote:August 1st, 2008 at 10:20 am
Rex – Any self respecting chicken would not be involved with those two characters.
And I am a self respecting chicken.
In regards to their strategy, I would sum it up thus – spray shit, keep moving, hope.
Vote:August 1st, 2008 at 10:29 am
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Vote:Fishing for Winson – Moreu
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August 1st, 2008 at 5:46 pm
John Boscawen – The Spencer trust could of course have been set up for Winstons personal benefit and as such payments of a capital nature to him would not be declarable.there may be a question mark over gift duty though. If the donations to the trust however were intendeed for NZ1 however then fraudulent conversion becomes a possibility
Vote: