The honest minor parties

September 23rd, 2008 at 7:30 am by David Farrar

It is of huge significance that the Maori, and parties all voted not just to recommend Peters be censured, but to state they believe he lied to the . This leaves isolated with NZ First, and puts paid to Winston’s hysterical cries about “echoes of Zimbabwe” as if he is some sort of victim.

There is an echo of Zimbabwe all right – a politican who thinks he is above the law, who is unaccountable and untouchable, and is protected by the ruling party.

All five parties in the majority deserve congratulation for not shying away from their duty, each for a somewhat different reason.

  1. for having the guts to pursue Peters in the face of explicit threats from Peters, and laying the complaint with  the Speaker.
  2. for putting aside potential Government by ruling out Peters and NZ First, and saying that even if doing a deal with Peters could put them into Government, they would rather stay in Opposition.
  3. Peter Dunne and United Future for being willing to condemn the behaviour of a fellow Minister of the Crown.
  4. Russel Norman and the Greens for putting what’s right ahead of what is best for the centre-left. If only Labour could ever do the same.
  5. Te Ururoa Flavell for also doing what’s right, despite potential solidarity with Peters personally as Peters is of Ngati Wai descent. It would have been very easy to use this as an excuse to abstain.

Now assuming their recommendations are accepted by the House 63-58, then the question arises as to whether those minor parties could support a Government that includes Peters in it. I mean, if you have just voted to (politely) condemn the man as a cheat and a liar, then how credible would it be to support a Government which has him as a Minister?

So it would be interesting to ask Jeanette or Russel if there are any circumstances now in which they would support a Government that had Peters in it. Likewise for United Future and the .

It is obvious that Labour can not be easily shaken from their position that they will keep Peters on, no matter what. But the minor parties can remove that choice from them by maing it an either/or (which is what Peters did to the Greens last election ironically).

Politically it would be better for National if Labour were not forced to rule Peters out. Winston as a Minister will be a good tool to bash them with. And imagine the fun we can have at Meet the Candidates meetings asking Labour candidates to defend Peters.

To quote Idiot/Savant at No Right Turn:

Typically, Winston is unrepentant to the end. And sadly, Labour is backing him all the way. Which is a good reason to be contemptuous of them as well. Some things are more important than politics, and political transparency is one of them. Sadly, Labour seems to have forgotten that. And they deserve everything they get from the public as a result.

But there is a greater good here. Keeping Peters out of power is more important than getting a National-led Government. One just can not have a Minister of the Crown who gives false evidence to the Privileges Committee, let alone one who receives personal $40,000 gifts from people in an indsutry he uses his portfolio to pour money into.

So even though it will remove a stick that one can bash Labour with, it is important for the integrity of our democracry that Labour rules Peters out. And if they won’t do it willingly, then let us hope the honest minor parties will force them to do it.

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19 Responses to “The honest minor parties”

  1. Michaels (1,317 comments) says:

    How can Labour possibly rule out Peters now???
    Clark has said time and time again that she will wait for fair process and for the privileges committee result, but now she is saying she will wait for the SFO result!!!
    The woman can’t be trusted and has only one goal, that is to get a 4th term no matter what sort of corruption she must approve of.
    If anyone was the weasel down there, it’s her!!!

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  2. Glutaemus Maximus (2,207 comments) says:

    Can’t decide whether a weasel or a ferret would be worse in her pants?

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  3. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    “..But there is a greater good here. Keeping Peters out of power is more important than getting a National-led Government..”

    gee..!..dpf..with those words..you have just confirmed something i had heard from a few sources..but had dismissed..

    ..that is..that national is so obsessed with getting rid of peters..that they are philosophical about not winning this election..

    ..just as long as peters is gone..(!)

    is this true..?

    (i can see the logic..in that nz first voters are 90% former nattys’..so no nz first..and those votes return to national..but..)

    ..and so..the ever-growing groundswell of sympathy/support..and likely votes..from maori..

    ..has really put the kybosh on that ‘plan’..eh..?

    ..so..it may well end up lose lose..

    ..with peters still there..

    ..and national having sacrificed possible victory..

    ..for nought..

    (oo-err..!…eh..?..)

    ..phil(whoar.co.nz)

    [DPF: I don't think National is obsessed with getting rid of Peters. I would say National is fairly keen on winning the election. As an individual, I am saying I regard getting rid of Peters as more important than National winning the election. Many in National would disagree with me]

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  4. pushmepullu (686 comments) says:

    Russel Norman and the Greens for putting what’s right ahead of what is best for the centre-left. If only Labour could ever do the same.

    What’s good for the centre-left is never right.

    Te Ururoa Flavell for also doing what’s right, despite potential solidarity with Peters personally as Peters is of Ngati Wai descent. It would have been very easy to use this as an excuse to abstain.

    It is getting to a pretty disgusting state of affairs when a politician is praised for not letting another politician off because of a family connection. If they were a pair of whiteys we would call that corruption. But for the brownfellas, no, it is ‘solidarity’ and apparently excusable. What the hell?

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  5. Pascal (2,015 comments) says:

    philu:

    ..that is..that national is so obsessed with getting rid of peters..

    No, asshat. It’s called integrity. Look it up in your dictionary.

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  6. GJ (329 comments) says:

    While we are talking about honest minor parties, my sources inform me that one of them will have their own fire to fight sometime this week. It is certainly a sad day in NZ politics to have so much dishonesty and corruption coming to the surface.
    Sadly we are only ever shown the face of the existing parties and newer sensible alternatives have a real battle on their hands even to get a mention!
    This election certainly shows all the signs of producing a few surprises.
    The silent majority and undecided voter may well play a huge part in this election.
    All of the signs for that to happen are certainly already very evident.

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  7. Murray (8,835 comments) says:

    Those labour MP’s who did the three monkeys impersonation should be stuck in front of a press conference and be required to explain themselves.

    Then little Jimmy can jump out with his “slippery” sign.

    Absolutely shamelss corruption, the legacy of labour.

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  8. sbk (299 comments) says:

    Finally the (redundant) Greens do something useful for the country.

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  9. pkiwi (111 comments) says:

    wet. bus. ticket. They should have really tested the minor parties mettle and gone for suspension not just censure.

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  10. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    “..# Pascal (1643) Vote: Add rating 2 Subtract rating 0 Says:
    September 23rd, 2008 at 8:22 am

    philu:

    ..that is..that national is so obsessed with getting rid of peters..

    No, asshat. It’s called integrity. Look it up in your dictionary…”

    gee..pascal..

    ..when you think of the national party..=history and all..

    ..’integrity’ is not a word that comes to mind..eh..?

    ..why..in recent history we had the race-baiting of brash..

    ..the ‘hollow men’..

    ..and let’s not forget that ‘most-lying-govt-ever’..the ’96-’99 national govt..

    ..(still present in the national front bench..)

    ..they must be better at it by now..the lying..eh..?

    i mean..ten years of it..you’d think they’d learn..eh..?

    but no..now we have key..and his ‘inappropriate’ trading in transrail shares..while opposition spokesperson on transport..(whoar..!)

    ..and what compounds that..is his lying/evasions of the truth when questioned..

    ..so as you can see pascal..

    ..there is not a lot of ‘integrity’ there..eh..?

    ..in national..

    ..phil(whoar.co.nz)

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  11. PhilBest (5,112 comments) says:

    DPF:

    “….There is an echo of Zimbabwe all right – a politican(sic) who thinks he is above the law, who is unaccountable and untouchable, and is protected by the ruling party…..”

    Yes, I’ve been saying all along that in another time and place, Winnie would have made a good Mugabe……thank goodness he isn’t as entrenched, although this Helen/Winnie Administration has come frighteningly close to getting “absolute power”…..I hope Kiwis wake up and insist on the winding back of the trend of the last couple of decades and the reinstatement of checks and balances on executive power. Actually, my comment “in another time and place…..”, applied to Helen, doesn’t bear thinking about……

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  12. gd (2,286 comments) says:

    Watch Guyon and Fran demand answers from Cullen about how he and the other Socialists found Luigi not guilty watch them

    Oh sorry TVNZ is a STATE OWNED broadcaster Mustnt rock the boat

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  13. toad (3,654 comments) says:

    DPF said: So it would be interesting to ask Jeanette or Russel if there are any circumstances now in which they would support a Government that had Peters in it.

    Jeanette and Russel have both said that they would prefer to not have to work with Peters as a Minister after the election. That is about as strong a statement as they can make, because the decision is not theirs. Under Green Party rules, decisions on whether to support a proposed Government on confidence and supply are made by the Green Party members through a Special General Meeting of the Party. So Jeanette and Russel can’t absolutely rule anything out or anything in re post-election arrangements to support a Government, because the party’s membership might decide otherwise.

    They have given a pretty strong indication that they don’t want to work with him though, and I’m confident the Green membership will agree with them.

    [DPF: I think they can do something stronger than prefer. They can say "We would not recommend to our members that we support any Government with Peters in it]

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  14. Hagues (711 comments) says:

    Toad, they of course could say that he is such a scumbag and they will not have anything to do with him. Then say if the green party membership want Green MPs to deal with such a scumbag then their Green party resignation will be immediately rendered. Or is it simply a case of if the membership condones working with a scumbag such as Winnie then its OK? Personal morals???

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  15. Rex Widerstrom (5,124 comments) says:

    philu posits:

    ..that national is so obsessed with getting rid of peters..that they are philosophical about not winning this election..

    ..just as long as peters is gone..(!)

    Well “obsessed” may be too strong a word but other than that, one would hope you’re absolutely correct phil.

    If I’d shut up about the policy corruption I saw in 1996, where Laws was quite deliberately charting a course of saying one thing while intending to do another (and exhibited the required levels of mendacity toward the lycra-clad genius) then it was generally accepted before he came on the scene I’d have been a Minister in any Cabinet in which NZF had places.

    But it made me physically ill to simply sit and observe – let alone take part in – the weaving of an intricate web of deceit, so I blew the whistle and got sacked. I’m not holding myself up as a lone martyr – several other people walked away too.

    Power is nice, but you still have to look at yourself in the mirror each morning.

    In the past you’ve condemned P dealers and rightly taken offence at implications you are one. So imagine if a dealer offered you money and power if only you’d facilitate their operations. Not touch the stuff, just keep a lookout, pass messages, launder money… not commit the primary offence, just facilitate it, as Labour are doing. My bet is you’d think of the cost to others and say no.

    Well, National have thought of NZ and said no, even though it may be at some cost. The Greens, UF and the Maori Party have also put principle ahead of power.

    Regardless of their past principles (or lack thereof – and I’ve called Dunne on being NZ’s biggest political prostitute enough times in the past) surely they all deserve acknowledgement when they finally do show some integrity?

    If we don’t acknowledge it when they behave properly, they’ll never learn – think of it like house training a litter of incontinent puppies :-D

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  16. petal (698 comments) says:

    DPF: “But there is a greater good here. Keeping Peters out of power is more important than getting a National-led Government”

    (THUD) <- me falling off my chair

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  17. freethinker (648 comments) says:

    I disagree with your view of Dunne being honest, his past actions have demonstrated he is either totally incompetent, dishonest or more likely both with his main interest being – self – wasted $28m on a families commission. The Maori party have however demonstrated democracy by actually consulting their members and abiding by their wishes evidenced by the support they have given toother parties, even ACT who you would expect them to be totally opposed to . The integrity and mana of Tariana Turia has exceed that of all the government support parties combined and this is a view very different from that I held of Tariana at the last election even though I may not agree with all her policies.

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  18. stephen (4,063 comments) says:

    “even ACT who you would expect them to be totally opposed to”

    Who the hell knows what the Maori party support/oppose…

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  19. OECD rank 22 kiwi (2,786 comments) says:

    ACT took the lead on this issue. Everyone else followed.

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