GST to 15% and top income tax to 45%
October 20th, 2008 at 8:57 am by David FarrarLabour have left the economy with a projected decade of deficits and the latest economic news, coupled with Labour’s massive spending promises, could push the country into a structural deficit.
Top tax expert John Shewan has looked at what might have to be done to break out of Labour’s decade of deficits. He says GST might need to go from 12.5% to 15.0% and the top tax rate from 39% to 45%.
Is this what Labour has planned for its December mini-budget?
October 20th, 2008 at 9:00 am
oh come on, they are going to re-announce a few road building projects as well.
(and tell the scarfies they can get a job to pay off their debts after bribing them pre voting time).
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:01 am
“You’re better off with Labour!”
If we could harness the methane from labours bullshit we’d be able to power the country for the next 1,000 years.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:16 am
NZ is broke. Labour spent 9 years upgrading the government from a toyota corolla to a luxury SUV – the gas and parts cost a lot but the cashflow has dried up.
Under labour, we could see tax rates of 66%. But, thats only the rich pricks so doesn’t matter of course.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:19 am
wreck – good analogy and to take it further we still have dirt roads.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:27 am
Labour must come clean and announce the costings of their “mini-budget” before the election. We all know they’ve got a plan to cancel the tax-cuts and increase taxes and the electorate should know by exactly how much. That will allow people to make an informed choice, especially once the Green’s (unworkable) policy concessions are factored in.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:31 am
Eh? Isn’t the line from top tax experts supposed to be that cutting tax will solve all our economic problems??
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:31 am
I would vote for 15% GST, Food, childrens clothes, and Fuel to be exempt from GST.
But only on condition that we got a 30% max income tax.
Everyone wins then
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:34 am
We’d be STUFFED if a plan like that DID get adopted, increases in tax and and increases in the size of government PROLONG recessions. Does any remotely knowledgeable student of economics believe otherwise?
DUH?
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:52 am
I have no doubt that Labour will raise taxes should we be stupid enough to give them a fourth term however there is no chance that the bastards will ever campaign on it.
The interesting thing I learnt yesterday at a “meet the candidate” meeting is that the only party brave (or stupid enough) to say that they will raise taxes is United Future, of course they did not describe it as a tax increase they said it was a new “levy” to cover increased costs in the health sector.
One can only hope that the people of Ohariu are not as stupid as they have been in the past and toss Dunne out on his ear.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 9:56 am
Whoops i see, he was saying it was possible, rather than advocating it.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 10:04 am
15% GST on top of the bucket loads of tax the ETS will accrue?
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 10:24 am
I suspect that John is actually trying to get some focus on outlandish spending commitments by raising the spectre of tax increases. He has succeeded in making his point. In terms of tax design GST is an efficient tax and in principle it is helpful to tax spending – as well as taxing income. The main thing NZ has to consider is whether it wants to keep expanding the size of the State or whether we want to keep more of the incomes we earn. Loading up debt levels to grow spending is merely deferring future tax increases (or spending cuts). Its not very transparent or honest – regardless of which party is doing it.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 10:29 am
“One can only hope that the people of Ohariu are not as stupid as they have been in the past and toss Dunne out on his ear.”
Big bruv is letting his anti-Dunne bias get in the way of the facts. United Future’s website sets out a very clear tax reduction programme involving income tax rates of 10%, 20% and 30%.
On health United Future have said that they would look to use private sector hospitals (as well as public sector ones) to get elective surgery done more quickly and to reduce waiting lists. What part of that doesn’t make sense?
Vote:I can’t see Dunne getting ousted from Ohariu – he’s too good a local MP.
October 20th, 2008 at 10:34 am
We all need to know what are the contents of the declared mini-budget before election day.
Sure as hell it aint tax cuts!
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 10:44 am
45%? hahahaa holy FUCK!
Are they insane? hahahaaa dear oh dear, excuse me….
so, looks like Air NZ are going to do a sudden trade in Australian one way tickets.
there really isn’t going to be anyone left capable of funding Labour “initiatives” pretty soon.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:03 am
No, this is not required. Fresh Labour policy announcement today: “Cash for citizenship payments to go directly to consolidated fund”…
I understand that a few Labour-led govt MP’s will be be required to trim their lifestyles back to match their official salaries and this is why the policy needs a special budget announcement which will include one-off lump sum payments to Labour-led govt ministers to compensate for the loss of this regular income.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:05 am
“45%? hahahaa holy FUCK!”
Are all the other countries that have that rate insane?
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:19 am
The government should never under any circumstances take more than a quarter of a person’s income. Ever.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:19 am
centerforward
“Big bruv is letting his anti-Dunne bias get in the way of the facts”
Oh really!, then perhaps you can tell me why Judy Turner admitted yesterday that United Future were going to raise taxes to pay for this?
” can’t see Dunne getting ousted from Ohariu – he’s too good a local MP.”
Care to give an example?
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:26 am
“Are all the other countries that have that rate insane?”
Yeah they are actually. You whitebait/ lemming/ant style commies will just never understand the point that the majority is often wrong.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:28 am
How many other countries have a top tax rate that kics in at about half the middle class welfare entitlement threshold ?
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:30 am
“The government should never under any circumstances take more than a quarter of a person’s income.”
You silly garbled little irrational prick. What the fuck has “a quarter” got to do with it??
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:34 am
Bring it on!
I’ll just setup more LAQCs and buy more -ve geared rentals to offset the tax increase…
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:37 am
“Yeah they are actually. You whitebait/ lemming/ant style commies will just never understand the point that the majority is often wrong.”
It wasn’t actually my point that they’re right, it was more that many of these other countries are held up as examples of being so much better than NZ – the fact they have this high level of tax isn’t pushing their people out, presumably.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 11:52 am
Are all the other countries that have that rate insane?
When it applies to anything earned over $60K, then yes they are. You cant defend our Tax rates by saying Australia’s top rate is higher, when their top rate only applies to income earned well in excess of $60K
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:04 pm
“When it applies to anything earned over $60K, then yes they are. You cant defend our Tax rates by saying Australia’s top rate is higher, when their top rate only applies to income earned well in excess of $60K”
I know that all these countries (yes im referring to oz, the US, UK, really) have the tax on income way way more than 60k – surely that is what this very hypothetical proposal would involve anyway.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:07 pm
“You silly garbled little irrational prick. What the fuck has “a quarter” got to do with it??”
Your insults are starting to wear thin. For once could you please demonstrate that you have two brain cells to rub together.
25% (which is the “one quarter” I was referring to) is the amount of tax that for me is the limit. A person should never have to pay more than that in my opinion. You may disagree, but you would as a – to use your terminology – uneducated irrational dumbfuck.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:11 pm
Stephen, I see you noticed that Mr Shewan was just running some figures on this, not advocating one way or the other. I would suspect if he DID advocate it, he would be being deliberately mischievous, knowing how quick a death it would bring to the economy and to the politicians who did it.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:23 pm
“25% (which is the “one quarter” I was referring to) is the amount of tax that for me is the limit”
Why is it “the limit” you poor half educated lamer?? Let me educate you- to answer the criticism you need to make a case explaining why you prefer 25% over say 10%. Get it??? What’s so special about 25%???? On second thoughts, don’t bother. You’re just a waste of time and bandwidth with your semi-literate infantile crap. Go away.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:30 pm
“Redbaiter (3937) Says:
You whitebait/ lemming/ant style commies will just never understand the point that the majority is often wrong.”
Now, THERE’S a good quote to pull out, the next time Ratty starts banging on about “freedom” and “you controlling socialists…”
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:30 pm
“the fact they have this high level of tax isn’t pushing their people out, presumably.”
Jezuz H Christ on a bike- Yeah- people love paying it, that’s why Marxists like you need in every western country a massive enforcement regime that has powers that are an insult to any civilized person. Here’s a test- make two tiers of tax, 20% and 40% and make them both voluntary. See then how fucken popular your 40% is, you deceitful communist propagandist.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:30 pm
Yes Philbest I ‘spose DPF was stirring a little – IMHO the ‘more tax’ approach would be the preferred Labour approach to the deficits situation – or certainly under the current lot.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:35 pm
Redbaiter – enough vitriol, we’ve all got your point.
On the Aussie top rate, it kicks in at $150,000, quite a long way away from labour’s $60k=RichPrick approach.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:35 pm
sorry red
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:44 pm
“Redbaiter – enough vitriol, we’ve all got your point.”
Why don’t you fuck off Plod. Take a course in manners, and you might discover what your apparently clod hopping parents failed to teach you, -that it is the height of ignorance to presume to speak for all. Leftists love you to talk about “how much tax”, because it legitimizes their presumed right to steal from us. They need to be confronted on the basic principle, not lamely kow towed to and allowed to frame the discussion in terms that suit them. That’s how we ended up where we are today.
“sorry red”
Apology not accepted.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:48 pm
“Why is it “the limit” you poor half educated lamer?? Let me educate you- to answer the criticism you need to make a case explaining why you prefer 25% over say 10%.”
Why do I have to make a case for that? It is only an opinion. This blog does not influence government policy. If we all had to make a case to support our opinions on this blog it would take forever.
“Why don’t you fuck off Plod.”
This is not your blog to tell people to fuck off from.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:49 pm
i paid 47% in aussie
was horrible.
it stops you from getting ahead..
it came down to this – i could work a lot harder to increase my income by $1000 per month.. afte rtax it became $515 (1.5% medicare levy). that became $120 a week in my hand for working a LOT harder.. what the fuck was the point?
Labour – the envy party!
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:52 pm
“It is only an opinion.”
Correct, and silly me for expecting you to be able to justify it.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 12:57 pm
I’m not sure why you would be under the impression I have to justify anything to you? Get over yourself.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:13 pm
will try harder next time Red, i promise.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:18 pm
John Shewan has just gifted we of the right a perfect opportunity to scare the bejusus out of the leftie supporters All we gotta do is get the rumour going that this is the Minibudget Cullens promising in December.
Now if we can get the dumb arse MSM to pick up on it and then Fran and Guyon do their breathless poke the mic into Mikeys face and ask him to deny it ( Oh I forgot They only do that to JK not their favourite Min of Fin )
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:20 pm
“I’m not sure why you would be under the impression I have to justify anything to you?”
Yeah well, leaving aside the fact that you couldn’t even if you wanted to. That’s what a discussion forum is for. Myself, I welcome being challenged. The expression of lame opinions without any accompanying argument is for chat rooms. Maybe you should confine yourself to that medium.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:42 pm
“Myself, I welcome being challenged.”
And i’m Postman Pat with a black and white cat.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:42 pm
“Myself, I welcome being challenged.”
Here is the problem though: When someone disagrees with you you just start cursing at them like a deranged psychopath, and calling names like a child.
I have a hunch that you would never talk to people’s faces the way you do on this blog. You are a coward. Anyone can say anything on a blog.
And I was unaware Kiwiblog was a “discussion forum”. I was under the impression it was a “blog”. Hence the “blog” part of “KiwiBLOG”.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:44 pm
“will try harder next time Red, i promise.”
That’s OK, I know you do your best. The fact is that percentages of taxation contributions are arbitrary. The argument should be why should one man pay any more than any other. Unless you have a good argument to support this, then the real debate should be why should tax not be a one off annual payment of the same amount for every taxpayer. Progressive taxation is a Marxist concept.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:49 pm
“When someone disagrees with you you just start cursing at them like a deranged psychopath, and calling names like a child.”
Not everyone. Just you and people like you. Time wasters and infants who just want to lamely express opinion rather than engage in reasoned debate. You just stated that you didn’t need to justify your POV, and now you have the hypocritical gall to accuse Redbaiter of not debating issues. Get a brain.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
“And i’m Postman Pat with a black and white cat.”
You wouldn’t know, you never have the balls to try it.
Vote:October 20th, 2008 at 2:02 pm
Heh.
Vote:October 21st, 2008 at 6:35 am
Given earlier comments about rioting in the streets if Shewan’s proposal goes ahead, I’m interested in whether anyone will actually get up and do anything about it. That’s the problem with the well-heeled Right: they are too polite, which is why the Left get away with their attacks.
Maybe it’s time to fight back – using peaceful means, of course. Suggestions?
Vote:October 21st, 2008 at 10:14 pm
Duxton – an anti-Labour propaganda campaign a la Shepard Fairey.
Vote: