The Palin-Biden debate
October 4th, 2008 at 10:27 am by David Farrar42% more people watched the Vice-Presidental debate than the Presidential debate. How weird is that?
Consensus seems to be Biden did best, but Palin exceeded expectations and held up okay.
However Obama now has a commanding leads in the polls – almost 6% nationally and almost 2:1 in the electoral college.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:41 am
Palin is a star who connects with the middle class. That is why the cowardly leftist “intellectuals” and their media acolytes have carried out an even larger campaign of lies, hate, denigration and smears than ever before. They as always, seek to snatch the megaphone from anyone who promotes ideas they, in their infinitely superior wisdom, consider “unapproved”.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 10:49 am
David, consensus amongst the left is that Biden won. Strip out the 18 or so flat out lies he told and you’ve got a very different picture. He was a tired, old, garrulous political windbag who has told so many lies and had so many factual hallucinations that he needs memory plugs along with those for his hair..
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 10:51 am
“Consensus seems to be Biden did best”
What damn consensus?? There’s a tonne of information out there to challenge this assertion. Palin won, and what’s more, in doing so she destroyed the credibility of the whining whimpering spite driven left who have for weeks now attempted to portray her as a bumbling backwoods hillbilly who wouldn’t have a snowball’s chance in hell of mixing it with “real” politicians like Biden. Sarah Palin made idiots of them all.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 10:53 am
Yep, Redbaiter:
From “The Australian” report on the debate:
“…….(Palin) smiled in response and said: “I may not answer the questions the way that either the moderator or you (Biden) want to hear, but I’m going to talk straight to the American people and let ‘em know my track record also……”
HA.
DPF:
“….Consensus seems to be Biden did best……”
As Redbaiter would say, and I’m surprised he hasn’t said it already: Whose “consensus”?
The same liberal media that had anointed Kerry/Edwards President and Vice at around this time in 2004?
HA again……
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 10:53 am
Umm, we debated this on the general thread yesterday if anybody’s interested. I think Bob Beckel sums it up best:
“Have we reached the point of mediocrity in this country that Sarah Palin’s debate performance was actually acceptable to her supporters (fortunately, Independents in early polls do not share that view) because she didn’t fall on her face, as many conservatives feared? That’s your standard? No wonder there are still some of you who still think George Bush, the very definition of mediocrity, is a good president.
In a word, Palin’s debate performance was awful. She couldn’t win a high school student council election with those homespun platitudes, repetitive inane comments about the war, and most strikingly her refusal to answer not a few but EVERY question put to her that demanded a direct answer.”
I’m surprised and disappointed that Redbaiter would support someone who is so manifestly inadequate. Just chosing Palin as a potential VP is a huge insult to the American people.
That’s it from me. I’m off to revel in the US polls at RCP.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 10:55 am
And Biden only lied 10 times.
Sweet.
Must be great to have the media running your campaign for you.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:00 am
“I think Bob Beckel sums it up best:”
Of course you would, but who is Bob Beckel? A senior Democrat Party operative. Like he’s ever going to provide an objective critique of Sarah Palin’s performance in the debate?? What else would he say for chrissakes??? Worthless.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:01 am
So will Biden step down citing bad health, or WP/HC AXIS disease, and who would replace him? Hilary Clinton is being mooted, but her negative Karma points on Kiwiblog would suggest that this is a non option. She did very well on the standard however.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:08 am
The trouble with Obama’s lead is that he’s only up six in one of the worst financial crises over the past hundred years? Clinton won by five percent in 1992 during a comparatively modest recession. What happens in two weeks once memory of the bailout fades and the public have yet to feel the pain inflicted on their paychecks?
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:08 am
..and up yours to the NZ Herald editor too, snivelling little leftist sycophant who has bashed Sarah for weeks now. You were wrong arsehole. Completely uninformed. Which is a pretty sad state of being for someone who presumes to edit NZ’s foremost newspaper. Try some information sources outside your simpering look-a-likes at the New York Slimes. Fucking incompetent dinosaur.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:09 am
“Just chosing Palin as a potential VP is a huge insult to the American people.”
i’m afraid that’s probably exactly the response McCain wants to get out of liberals- it plays into the Elite vs Ordinary narrative. the huge and unprecedenteted interest in the VP stakes is all due to Palin – she’s the story. Now send her out into the battleground states to fight for the large number of undecided voters. The national polls don’t really mean much at this stage of the game – this will be decided in states like Ohio and Florida just like in 2000 and 2004.
Given the considerable advantages the Dems had going into the campaign plus the gift of the current econmic crisis, that McCain has managed to keep this race close is quite an achievement.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:14 am
Mark Steyn Live with Hugh Hewitt:
“…..I heard the first part of the debate on radio. And I loved Sarah Palin’s voice. I think people underestimate, or the experts underestimate the appeal of someone who just talks in the cadences of the American people. And by contrast, you know, Joe Biden gave a very smooth and accomplished performance, but when he tried to do the Joe Six-Pack routine, when he said in that rather stilted way, he made a reference to “Home Depot”, “where I spend a lot of time,” it sounded incredibly stilted. American politics, in a way, is about the art of faking authenticity in the Biden school. And it doesn’t really quite know how to handle someone who is authentically authentic, which is what Governor Palin is……
“…….I gather from some guy who was in the media tent at the debate, that all the working journalists were rolling their eyes, and they thought Biden won it. Well, we’ll see about that. I think Sarah Palin is like the Harry Truman-Calvin Coolidge figure. I go to Coolidge’s birthplace in Plymouth Notch, Vermont a lot, and it’s very unusual these days to have a political candidate so rooted genuinely in a sense of place, and an authentic small town experience. Someone like Barack Obama is like this 1-800 candidate. He’s this sort of Chicagoan, Hawaiian, Kenyan, Kansan, Indonesian mélange. And good luck to him for it. But by contrast, Sarah Palin is an extremely rooted vice presidential candidate that we don’t see in contemporary politics…….”
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:16 am
It’s great to hear the tired war horses of the Democratic party claim Biden victory in the debate.
Vote:Biden sounded like a tired 38 veteran of the USA senate, speaking of the past but producing a whole pack of inconsistencies.
Remember Biden was the man who stole a speech from ex-UK Labor leader, Neil Kinnock during the 1988 campaign. But if you are left wing you can do that, just like HC does in NZ.
I think the people of the USA need to look carefully at this man Obama. Inexperienced and never been in an executive position.
As for Bob Beckel ! Campaign organizer for Democrat Walter Mondale in 1984 while being one of the resident Democrats on Fox News. Come on Jafapete, don’t continue your patterns of leftist disinformation.
Be wary of organization and institutions like CNN,NBC,The Washington Post,Newsweek, New York Times and the LA Times.
October 4th, 2008 at 11:17 am
“As Redbaiter would say, and I’m surprised he hasn’t said it already: Whose “consensus”?”
I said it later, after I’d simmered over it for a while.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:18 am
Redbaiter, you just beat me to it, at 9.51 you posted the very comment that I was in the middle of composing, and posted at 9.53……..great minds think alike, eh?
You’ve had a go at the Herald Editor, let’s give a nod to Tim “Emmeline” Pankhurst at the DomPost too, eh, finding a really, really OBJECTIVE commentator on Sarah Palin, ooooh, that’s a toughie……HEY……NAOMI KLEIN…..!!!!
SPEWWWWWWWW…………
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:19 am
And in the event that hell freezes over, we will see an NZ paper running an Ann Coulter column on Obama, by way of balance….
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:24 am
DPF is right. Biden wins on points. The VP debate doesn’t effect the trend. And the trend is not McCain’s friend.
Good God, the Republican expectations of Palin were soooooooo low that with simply breathing and blinking at the same time she got points.
http://voices.kansascity.com/node/2299
A gauge of randomly selected questions:
CNN/Opinion Research Biden 51 Palin 36
Vote:CBS Biden 46 Palin 21
Fox Biden 61 Palin 39
October 4th, 2008 at 11:37 am
Anyone note this element?
Damn right.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:39 am
Magic moment for me was when she got so caught up in her winking she couldn’t stop. What a 1 trick pony she is.
Sure to push Redbaiters buttons. I bet he cracked a fat every time she winked. Why I swear she was lookin right at me!
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:41 am
How the heck DPF and the liberal media can spew up all this drivel about Biden ‘winning’ the debate. FFS on foreign policy the guy is a total wowser. He stated during the debate:
The French and USA kicked Hezbollah out of Lebanon, WTF is this idiot talking about?
Over at The Corner they have blogged about this amazing gaffe by old Joe:
If Palin had dropped a clanger like this one Couric, Beckel and all the other leftwing nuttters would have been all over it like a rash.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:42 am
Hey Phil B, it interesting to note the gladness that prevails in that so many people are so pleased to see a politician who says what they want to say. It points so clearly to the fact that real opinion and discussion has been stifled for too long, where political discourse has been held tightly in the grip of the leftist intellectuals and their media acolytes, who have frozen out real people speaking real words about real ideas.
It is my view that so many of today’s problems result from this alliance, where as we once (a long long time ago) had a media who would confront government, we now have newspapers and television stations who are now in reality mere clearing houses for socialist political ideas. The crime situation is one excellent example. With the country drowning in violent crime, and the Police offering no protection, we have the propagandizing media still promoting the view that crime is down, or there is nothing to worry about. If they had been doing their job, crime would never have risen to the unacceptable level it is at today. Submission to soviet socialist political ideas is what has kept them quiet on the issue.
The widespread disdain for Sarah Palin that exist in NZ has been promoted here by the same dangerous and destructive alliance of the Marxist intellectuals and their media cronyists. As every day goes past, and witnessing attack after attack on the democratic process by the leftist media, I am convinced that today, the biggest enemies of freedom and democracy are the very people we once entrusted with its care.
The fourth estate are traitors and treasonists, and we must take them down. I urge you to stop spending money in the main stream media, and to ask your friends to do the same. Don’t buy it, but better still, don’t advertise in it. These anti-democratic soviet scum, the enemies of so much that traditional Western Culture holds dear, must be taken down.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:42 am
Peggy Noonan, in the Wall Street Journal:
“…….Interviews are about thinking, about reflecting, marshaling data and integrating it into an answer. Debates are more active, more propelled—they are thrust and parry. They are for campaigners. She is a campaigner. Her syntax did not hold, but her magnetism did. At one point she literally winked at the nation.
As far as Mrs. Palin was concerned, Gwen Ifill was not there, and Joe Biden was not there. Sarah and the camera were there. This was classic “talk over the heads of the media straight to the people,” and it is a long time since I’ve seen it done so well, though so transparently. There were moments when she seemed to be doing an infomercial pitch for charm in politics. But it was an effective infomercial.
Joe Biden seems to have walked in thinking that she was an idiot and that he only had to patiently wait for this fact to reveal itself. This was a miscalculation…..
“The heart of her message was a complete populist pitch. “Joe Six-Pack” and “soccer moms” should unite to fight the tormentors who forced mortgages on us. She spoke of “Main Streeters like me.” A question is at what point shiny, happy populism becomes cheerful manipulation.
Sarah Palin saved John McCain again Thursday night. She is the political equivalent of cardiac paddles: Clear! Zap! We’ve got a beat! She will re-electrify the base. More than that, an hour and a half of talking to America will take her to a new level of stardom. Watch her crowds this weekend. She’s about to get jumpers, the old political name for people who are so excited to see you they start to jump……”
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:44 am
On the last “Saturday Night Live”, Tina Fey as Sarah Palin and Amy Poehler as Katie Couric, skewered the infamous “interview” wickedly……..
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:52 am
Biden’s 14 lies and the National Review Online has found some more.
Old slow Joe is so far out on most of this stuff he’s missed the target altogether.
And we’re told he won the debate. Yeah right!
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:53 am
Hey RB, if you’re so confident that Palin won the debate, prepared to go on record and say you believe McCain will win the election? Kiwi in America made that claim and has now gone very silent on the mater…
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:57 am
that’s great, thanks, Lindsay! can’t help but wonder where the MSM analysis of this is.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:03 pm
hard to know which is worse – Biden not knowing what he and Obama actually said about those elections, Obama supported them, or impying that Obama would have intervened to prevent the elections from happening.
And as for his statements about Lebanon – this guy is supposed to be the foreign policy expert, clearly Palin doesn’t know much but then she hasn’t had a career in Washington. But Biden getting all that wrong is really disturbing.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
I think Palin was a clear winner, and 84% of Fox viewers also thought the same.
Not because she is a woman, but because she is real.
Joe Biden is what you get with Clark, Cullen and Peters, when you let your representatives
hang around in parliament for much of their adult life. Institutionalized politicians.
Leading the country isn’t an exercise in theory, its a practical course.
Vote:One where your experience comes from being amongst the people not above the people.
October 4th, 2008 at 12:17 pm
“FRONTPAGE” Magazine:
The “Pit Bull” Returns
By Jacob Laksin
FrontPageMagazine.com | Friday, October 03, 2008
“In the weeks preceding yesterday’s vice presidential debate, one might have been forgiven for suspecting a vast right-wing conspiracy to lower expectations for Sarah Palin. A platitude-filled interview with Katie Couric, spoofed on “Saturday Night Live” and lamented by unnamed but oft-quoted “top advisers to John McCain,” seemed to underscore the impression that the attractive Alaska governor was all style and no substance – and certainly no match for a Senate heavyweight like Joe Biden.
Palin did nothing to discourage such deflationary talk. For instance, she suggested that she was overmatched by the experienced Biden when she said that she’d been listening to his “speeches since I was in the second grade.” So pronounced did the underselling of Palin become that even the Obama campaign felt compelled to bolster the case for the really “terrific debater” who would “give a great performance next Thursday.”
Alas for the Obama camp, their spin was more precise. Time and again in their Thursday night debate, Palin not only stood her ground against Biden but, on issue after issue, outperformed her Democratic counterpart. This political pit-bull, it turns out, has bark and bite……..
“……..In one of her most effective lines of the evening, she rebuffed Biden’s partisan attempts to tie McCain to the Bush administration by observing that “for a ticket that wants to talk about change and looking into the future, there’s just too much finger-pointing backwards to ever make us believe that that’s where you’re going.” As with so many other times in the debate, Biden had no compelling answer.
Nor could the Washington veteran match Palin’s engaging presence, which ultimately turned the debate in her favor. Charming, gracious, and politically fluent, she deftly inserted populist references to “Main Streeters like me” and even forced a crack in Biden’s steely façade when she premised a rejoinder with a ringing, “Say it ain’t so, Joe!”
Biden, by contrast, was stiff and hectoring, with his recurrent admonition – “Let me say that again” – calling to mind all the pompousness of the entrenched political class. One almost expected the Senator to address himself in the third person, which in fact he did, when he assured his interviewer, Gwen Ifill, that “no one in the United States Senate has been a better friend to Israel than Joe Biden.” That is debatable. More certain is that Joe Biden has had better debates……..”
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:20 pm
DICK MORRIS:
“Last night was a big, big win for Sarah Palin.
She showed originality, charisma and sass – a style that is refreshing and different in our politics. She didn’t just win the vice-presidential debate, she showed that she belongs with Ronald Reagan and Bill Clinton as among the best communicators of our modern political times.
Her sallies against big government were brilliantly conceived and well executed. Her line that she didn’t understand how Washington worked because politicians vote for something right after they vote against it, for example, was just wonderful.
Another classic came when she bit back at moderator Gwen Ifill and opponent Joe Biden and said she’d answer the questions as she wanted to, not necessarily as they wanted her to do.
Gone, long gone, are the worries about how good or well-prepared Sarah Palin is.
Most important, she showed how John McCain would bring change to Washington. Would that McCain could articulate his own sense of change as well as his running mate did!
For his part, Biden sounded like the warmed-over has-been that he is – he seemed to be on downers. Where she was thrilling and exciting, he was hypnotically boring. He seemed like more of the same, while she seemed like a breath of fresh air.
Without trepidation, she tossed aside the Bush years and spoke of the “blunders” in Iraq. She was able to skewer Wall Street and show Republican opposition to the greed there.
She even handled Biden very well on his turf, foreign policy – meeting him head-to-head on every issue, and winning.
Everyone realizes that Palin has been in this field for only five weeks; her ability, nonetheless, to prevail against a veteran like Biden is a testament to her intellect and skill.
That smiling face, those novel phrases, that informal style – it was all a pleasure and a refreshing change.
And she got her ticket off on the right foot for October – making the tax issue stick and zinging Barack Obama’s economic programs and his big-spending plans.
The Alaska governor did a wonderful job of displaying her experience and justifying her candidacy in terms of her expertise on energy issues. It’s now far harder to dismiss her as an unqualified flake.
More, she connected in a way that few politicians do: She speaks for us.
Palin did a lot to help McCain last night – illustrated the best about him. But she did more to help herself – vaulting to a leading role among women in American politics. Her authenticity and unique style will be with us for years to come.
Last night’s Palin victory will have an immediate impact on the presidential race – arresting McCain’s fall and slowing Obama’s surge.
The only question is whether it will be enough to reverse Obama’s gains of the past week. It might go a long way in that direction.”
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:21 pm
“Hey RB, if you’re so confident that Palin won the debate, prepared to go on record and say you believe McCain will win the election? Kiwi in America made that claim and has now gone very silent on the mater…”
I went on record in December 07 and January 08 saying McCain will win the election, david.
That doesn’t mean I think it’s a good thing. I don’t think either candidate will be anything other than destructive.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:23 pm
“One where your experience comes from being amongst the people not above the people.”
Damn right. Eventually we will get relief from the soft tyranny of socialism, and every time we elect a politician like Sarah Palin that goal is closer. Every time we elect a politician like Klark or Obama, or some other elitist “intellectual”, or one of their lackies, (like Biden) that goal is further away.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:26 pm
“Consensus seems to be Biden did best, but Palin exceeded expectations and held up okay.” Farrar
What! Been trolling those MSM sites for that line Farrar. They’re all in it for Obama and the faithful CNN Democrats that get polled are always going to give it to their boy. Wow, I thought our media were in the tank for the left but the MSM in the states are just creaming themselves over Nobama. Sick!
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:32 pm
One of the major issues with both camps in the entire US govt: Executive and Legislative, is their unequivocal and almost unanimous support of the same zionist institutions and policies that have wrought such wonderful success in the ME throughout Bush 43′s term. Does the world really want more of the same? No. Is it going to get it anyway? Yes.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:33 pm
# david c (161) Vote: Add rating1 Subtract rating 1 Says:
October 4th, 2008 at 11:53 am
“Hey RB, if you’re so confident that Palin won the debate, prepared to go on record and say you believe McCain will win the election? Kiwi in America made that claim and has now gone very silent on the mater (sic)…..”
Hey, you left me out of it. I have been saying all along, and still do, that this is Kerry/Edwards all over again, only Obama is better-looking than Kerry and has the ADVANTAGE that he would be America’s first ever black president if elected.
But more crucial, he would be America’s first ever president to have come up all his life under the influence of radical Communist mentors like Frank Marshall Davis; to have risen through the most radical leftwing part of the corrupt Chicago Machine including political partnership with Bill Ayers, “Weatherman”; to have been associated with the “black power” Chicago church; and to have had the most leftwing legislative voting record of anyone in his time.
Who the heck thinks THIS is going to happen, APART from the “Long March Through The Institutions” fellow-travellers who infest the “Mainstream” media?
Here is the columnist “Spengler” in Asia Times Online; one of the commentators I most respect; he wrote this weeks ago:
“……..Obama will spend the rest of his life wondering why he rejected the obvious road to victory, that is, choosing Hillary Clinton as his vice presidential nominee. However reluctantly, Clinton would have had to accept. McCain’s choice of vice presidential candidate made obvious after the fact what the party professionals felt in their fingertips at the stadium extravaganza yesterday: rejecting Clinton in favor of the colorless, unpopular, tangle-tongued Washington perennial Joe Biden was a statement of weakness. McCain’s selection was a statement of strength. America’s voters will forgive many things in a politician, including sexual misconduct, but they will not forgive weakness.
That is why McCain will win in November, and by a landslide, barring some unforeseen event…….”
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:41 pm
On the bright side I have at least found the politician I’d rather be stranded on a desert island with…
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:47 pm
“Hey RB, if you’re so confident that Palin won the debate, prepared to go on record and say you believe McCain will win the election? ”
Get real. Whoever won the debate, it is still a subjective matter, and not related in any great way to who might win the election. Ever heard of “might over right”? That’s what elections are in the US. The comparatively tiny forces of traditional Conservatism against the overpowering might of the leftist intellectual-mainstream media conglomerate. The right haven’t won an election in years, and its almost a miracle that even a group so minimally right wing as the Republicans have achieved that feat.
Predicting a Republican win is like predicting someone in a rowboat will survive a tidal wave. Its unlikely, but it does happen. Given that such a win depends upon the craven leftist Republicans doing just enough to win the support of the Conservatives, if it was just down to the haplessly politically confused McCain, they’d be doomed. With the fresh and energetic Palin’s natural appeal and her message that resonates with the real people of America, there’s some hope.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:47 pm
Old slow Joe Biden’s 5 best gaffe’s of the campaign up until the approximately 22 he made in one 90 minute debate yesterday:
Yeah he sounds fit and ready to be the veep!
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:49 pm
The left are not dealing with reality when they bash Sarah Palin like they have. Sun Tsu has something to say about not knowing your enemy. Bill Clinton warned his own about underestimating her.
Vote:This inability to deal with the reality speaks volumes of the weakness of the Democrats’ own candidates. It’s just those fawning double standards that has actually weakened the Democrats over the decades rather than benefited it, and produces shallow – if controllable – candidates like Obama. If only they had two good legs they could be walking upright instead of “bent”, for the mainstream media is their big crutch.
Same with Labour here: the more Clark has gotten away with things the worse the scandals have gotten, until the party becomes an embarrassment even to long-time supporters.
Media bias weakens the parties it benefits; by failing to hold government and politicians accountable – media’s main job – it inevitably breeds corruption.
October 4th, 2008 at 12:50 pm
the deal Obama made with the Democrat party elite was “NO CLINTONS”. I still think Obama will win – only just – but agree it was a mistake not to make sure of victory with Hillary on the ticket.
But Obama owes his nomination in large part to the East Coast patrician families, the Kennedys, Gores, Kerrys, who believe only their scions were born to be President – not hillbillies from Arkansas – and so tipped the nomination towards Obama as a bit of payback.
However and luckily for the Dems, unlike Al Gore Obama is not from that patrician background and has much more in common with Bill Clinton and unlike Gore – who refused to have Clinton campaign on is hehalf and so lost – Obama has got Bill out on the hustings in Florida and other battleground states.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 12:51 pm
Oh, I forgot to include in my little resume of Obama’s past, his involvement in the Leftwing groups like ACORN which spent years shaking down banks and lending institutions to cough up mortgage finance for people who wouldn’t otherwise qualify; and his current connections with numerous people on Wall Street who are helping with that record level of fundraising he is noted for; AND the fact that no other politician has received a fraction of the donations from Fannie Mae that Obama has.
Hmmmmmm……….
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:00 pm
“…almost unanimous support of the same zionist institutions and policies…” reid
C’mon man, are you on planet Pilger? Crikey, don’t you know that the Yanks are doing us all a favour supporting the “zionist institutions and policies”. Cracking down on the Arabs/Mussies from time to time keeps them further away from the bomb and other undesirable devices. Some people need to be trodden down!
Hopefully Sarah (or unhopefully the other lot) can threaten with ‘itchy finger on the trigger’ talk when it comes time to dealing with the Iranian, Syrian, Taliban,…. nutjobs.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:07 pm
I’m so very impressed by Redbaiter’s defence of the indefensible, that I think that some of Palin’s poetry is in order. Courtesy of Salon:
“On Good and Evil”
It is obvious to me
Who the good guys are in this one
And who the bad guys are.
The bad guys are the ones
Who say Israel is a stinking corpse,
And should be wiped off
The face of the earth.
That’s not a good guy.
(To K. Couric, CBS News, Sept. 25, 2008)
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:08 pm
Sometimes even lefties are right Dazzaman.
You can’t understand US politics if you don’t understand zionist influence. If you think that the US ME foreign policies are working you’re not thinking straight.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:10 pm
jafapete, sounds like sound logic to me!
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:15 pm
Of course they’re working, these Arab/Mussie nutters need to be kept down. And the zionist influence in the states is a natural thing when you see your ancestral homeland/roots/religion being attacked by….let’s get this right…craven uncivilised dogs. It’s a natural reaction to all of the persecution that has occurred historically. All power to them!
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
Dazzaman, That’s the point. It is logic that any 3rd grader would grasp straight away. And it is the limit of Palin’s understanding. But international politics is a lot more complex than that.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:30 pm
Jafa, you’re struggling, son. The latest I hear is the loony left in the US is claiming Palin won the debate because she winked!!!
Ye Gods!! She won because she was ten times smarter, more eloquent and more likable than her dozy opponent. Hell, if she keeps this up McCain will swap places with her.
I’ll laarrffff my arse off if McCane wins and then karks it or steps down. Then sit back and watch Hillary spew from sea to shining sea.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:37 pm
Adolf, I’m sorry, but I’d have to agree with Charles Krauthammer’s conclusion on this one:
“Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr. famously said of Franklin Roosevelt that he had a “second-class intellect, but a first-class temperament.” Obama has shown that he is a man of limited experience, [blah, blah. Overdoes this bit, but it is Krauthammer after all.]… Nonetheless, he’s got both a first-class intellect and a first-class temperament. That will likely be enough to make him president.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/02/AR2008100203043.html
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:38 pm
“1. “Stand up, Chuck, let ‘em see ya.” –-Joe Biden, to Missouri state Sen. Chuck Graham, who is in a wheelchair, Columbia, Missouri, Sept. 12, 2008″
That is just sick.
And yeah? Well I’ve got a second-class intellect AND a second-class temperament. So what do you say to that then, Mr smarty-pants?
Yeah, that’s right… keep running…
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 1:56 pm
Redbaiter, when exactly did this golden age of journalism happen? Who exactly do you consider good journalists?
And I’m very happy Philbeast had the courage to go on record and pick McCain to win. Go you for having some guts.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:00 pm
jafapete, without dipping into any ‘intellectual’ discourse on this subject…it just so happens to be true! Don’t you get it? Or are you just another leftie prone to veiled taunts about other posters intelligence.
Palin is right, whatever level she is speaking to….and I hope 3rd graders (is that primmer 3 here? or what) do get what she says!
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
“Good journalists” were the ones sending their reports in on pigeons from the beaches on D-Day.
They’ve been a little thin on the ground since.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:11 pm
It do not think there was a clear winner of the deabte, as they are just talking point fests anyway. It was clear that Joe Biden is a superior debater, however Sarah Palin not crying or curling up on the foetal position was all she needed to do to at least NOT lose.
The reality is most people watching will have already made up their minds. Those who are Palin fans will have found things about her to like, those who don’t would have found things to dislike about her performance.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:16 pm
I asume that “superior debater” is left speak for “told lots of lies that we’re going to pretend not to see”.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:16 pm
Re Biden’s numerous foreign policy gaffe’s in yesterday’s debate I remind everyone he is currently the Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee…..
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:17 pm
Yeah, he may be a blithering idiot, but hes our blithering idiot according to the media.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:24 pm
Lee C: “And yeah? Well I’ve got a second-class intellect AND a second-class temperament. So what do you say to that then, Mr smarty-pants?”
Um, I wasn’t aware that you were running for office Lee. Are you on the ACT Party list too? Sounds like you are well qualified for it.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
The only missing from Auckland is a 100′ high tide.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 2:45 pm
Rudy Juliano(dont know if I spelt his name right) stated that not only did Palin win the debate she gave the best performance in a debate he had ever seen. Carl Rove also seemed to hold a simil;ar opinion. Our Socialist National Radio pronounced Biden the winner yesterday changed it to a Draw this morning so maybe the Media Watch will declare Palin the winner tomorrow.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 3:06 pm
By suprior debater, I mean his performance was very good. He was natural, informed and expressive. That kind of thing comes with practice, and he’s been around the block a few times so it makes sense that he would be a better debater.
Sarah Palin hasn’t had to debate on a national stage before, so naturally expectations for her performance were a lot lower. Especially after the Couric interviews, where she stuffed up a little. That is what I mean when I say by not being a complete catastrophe, she was deemed as having “held her own” against a far more experienced debater. Of course the Republicans are going to say she did better, and Democrats are going to say Biden performed better. That’s their job. Karl Rove and Rudy Guiliani will both say Palin was better. The Clintons will say Biden. That’s how it works.
Given both sides basically spurt talking points, the way those talking points are presented does have an impact. Both candidates may have spun their answers, but Biden appears to be more convicted whereas Palin actually sounded as though she was reeling off memorised talking points even though BOTH campaigns do this. It came across as this because she wasn’t expressive.
A natural debating style comes with practice. It’s a lot different to reading off a teleprompter in a speech.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 3:07 pm
Just got back from the states and the most shocking thing for me is how distorted the news is we get here about the US. After its several filterings by the extreme leftist media what we are left with is not worth wiping your backside with.
Vote:Like the last US election which we were told would be a sure democrat victory, we will not really know until election day.
Sarah Palin has struck a chord with a great many people and most Americans see this election as the most crucial in over a hundred years, it also amazed me how many americans believe another assasination is quite possible.
October 4th, 2008 at 3:35 pm
Biden really does present and defend his delusions in a smooth and credible manner. Picking him the winner on the day might not have been a horrible mistake but continuing to do so after his many “mistakes” are brought to light, is.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 4:27 pm
I knew the first comment on this thread would be Redbaiters. I swear that guy has nothing better to do than wait for DPF to post something and then start ranting and swearing.
Anyway, I didn’t see much of the debate yesterday but the parts I did see were pretty average. It would appear – if the informed and intellectual commenters who have stated their opinions here – that Biden is a liar and therefore unfit to be VP. I would argue the Bill Clinton was quite a liar also, and his administration’s eight years of peace and prosperity are probably looking quite good to Americans right about now.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 4:59 pm
# jafapete (715) 1 6 Says:
October 4th, 2008 at 1:07 pm
“I’m so very impressed by Redbaiter’s defence of the indefensible, that I think that some of Palin’s poetry is in order. Courtesy of Salon:
“On Good and Evil”
It is obvious to me
Who the good guys are in this one
And who the bad guys are.
The bad guys are the ones
Who say Israel is a stinking corpse,
And should be wiped off
The face of the earth.
That’s not a good guy.
(To K. Couric, CBS News, Sept. 25, 2008)”
# jafapete (715) 0 5 Says:
October 4th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
“Dazzaman, That’s the point. It is logic that any 3rd grader would grasp straight away. And it is the limit of Palin’s understanding. But international politics is a lot more complex than that.”
JAFAPETE.
On what intellectual basis do you read such “deeper complexities” into the rhetoric of the leadership of Iran, not to mention their whole course of action (vis-a-vis the IAEA, for example), that you might conclude they don’t mean what they say? I suppose you would have condemned Ronald Reagan and Winston Churchill in their day, too?
In – Fricken – CREDIBLE.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 5:21 pm
Good call PhilBest
Vote:When the left consolidate control of foreign policy, people end up dieing, lots of people, always have always will.
You will never get a left wing nut bar to accept prevention of a wider conflict with limited force, they will just keep arguing that it shouldn’t have got to that stage and we should all just get along like we did in ……………..hang on, we have never got along!
October 4th, 2008 at 5:44 pm
“Palin won.”
“No, Biden won.”
“NO, PALIN WON!”
“NO, BIDEN WON!!”
“NO, PALIN WON!!”
Why on earth do you people persist with this? Those who watched the debate and are eligible to vote will make their own minds up. Get a life! It’s saturday evening. Go and see a movie or get laid or something.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 5:58 pm
Interestingly, “Shunda Barunda”:
http://www.humansecurityreport.info/
“The first “Human Security Report” documents a dramatic, but largely unknown, decline in the number of wars, genocides and human rights abuse over the past decade. Published by Oxford University Press, the Report argues that the single most compelling explanation for these changes is found in the unprecedented upsurge of international activism, spearheaded by the UN, which took place in the wake of the Cold War…….”
Some of us would argue “The Bush Doctrine” has something to do with it too……..
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 7:07 pm
the problem for Palin was she didn’t have what it takes to pull Biden up over such flagrant nonsense. it would have been some easy points.
but what’s interesting is how there’s been absolutely no comment about how Biden thinks Obama would have prevented elections being held in the occupied territories and that he doesn’t have a clue about what’s been going on in Lebanon.
that seems to be far more worthy of analysis than Palin’s winking.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 7:22 pm
forgot to add
I never feared Obama would be ringing Juan Cole or Robert Fisk for advice on foreign policy but I did think that they would do things differently and take US foreign policy back to the liberal internationalism of the last Democrat administraion. i thougth it was something they were serious about. but Biden does not inspire convidence. Just making things up doesn’t suggest they really take this seriously.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 9:50 pm
You must remember the entire reason why everybody is watching the VP debate and taking an interest in this all, it isn’t just about Palin. Although the most excellent call before by Lee about which politician he would like to be on an island with was a great call.
It is about why Obama picked Biden, and that was because before that the consensus was Obama was way too inexperienced to become President. Obama is STILL too inexperienced to become President, and his shady links to the far left and organised Labour is also bloody scary. Biden is there to add experience so this is why the media are all over him.
I watched the debate late last night, and I must say Palin was good. A breath of fresh air. Biden has been in politics for decades so of course he is going to be able to rattle off lies and stats that never happened.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 10:47 pm
Why hasn’t anyone mentioned the importance of the numbers of viewers? The reason so many more watched the VP debate was because of Palin. Polls show that at least 55% thought more of her than before the debate. How many votes does that translate into?
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 10:53 pm
Obama & Biden both make me wanna puke but after watching the Katie Couric interview and watching Palin babble like my brother’s wife after a few sherries, I became very afraid. Last thing the free world needs is a Christian hockey mom calling the shots.
Vote:October 4th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
“Last thing the free world needs”
..and who the hell would a silly little ignorant dipshit like you be to speak for ‘the free world’? Arrogant ill mannered fool.
Vote:October 5th, 2008 at 12:08 am
I can think of a lot worse people to be President, kisekiman…. however Palin doesn’t scare me one bit. I am amazed at all the idiocy surrounding the anti Palin campaign. I would love to see what theory you have backing up the reason why we shouldn’t have a VP who is a christian “hockey mom”.
This is also an interesting article on Obama… http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/09/big_labors_billion_dollar_bet.html
Vote:October 5th, 2008 at 3:09 am
RB
“.and who the hell would a silly little ignorant dipshit like you be to speak for ‘the free world’? Arrogant ill mannered fool.”
You are in fact a complete twat!
Rarely have I come across anybody as angry about nothing in particular. The focus of your angst should be directed at those in Public Service.
Find it funny that the other posters on here give you positive Karma just to keep you wound up!
Wonder what you do for a living? I am retired and find it hard to keep up with information.
You would be an ideal candidate for the BNP if you lived in Britain.
Vote:October 8th, 2008 at 2:37 am
Sarah Palin is awesome!!
McCain is going to win the US presidency on 4 November.
Vote: