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The Obama birth certificate issue is another example of the political scene in the US, where lies and misinformation are deliberately perpetuated because there are people who want Obama to fail by any means possible. These are people who don’t care about the democratic process. And they know how to flock their sheep.
Is it surprising this method of deceit carried out by many who claim they are Christian?
Exodus 23:1 “You shall not bear a false report; do not join your hand with a wicked man to be a malicious witness.”
Bill English claiming all this cash for his wellington house is crap.
When I was working for a large international corporate, they would be on top of such silliness.
If a person was required in wellington for night stay trips, the company would pay either actual accommodation costs, or, if you chose to stay with someone you knew you could only claim the per diem plus a smaller preset amount which you could give to the person you stayed with.
These MP’s are using this to pay off their houses then bank the capital gains. It is disgraceful for MP’s to make profits from expense arrangements.
MP’s should be made to pay such profits back to the taxpayer.
Who is sick of being sick, having sick people around them, coughing and spluttering, in fact sick of this winter so far? I never believed in SAD until this winter
It would be very interesting to know what the bretheren in New Zealand have negotiated for themselves as their members take pay cuts during the recession.
Amen to that Brian – I’ve had a viral bronchitis for about three weeks now, and I’m heartily sick of coughing my guts out evry time I speak or try to do anything remotely physical
Who is sick of being sick, having sick people around them, coughing and spluttering? I never believed in SAD during the summer until the past few in London
Bird flu, swine fever, what next canine distemper?
Cerium, every US President has had a conspiracy theory associated with him. Clinton murdered Vince Foster, Bush planned 9/11 etc etc. The Birther movement is just a bog-standard group of conspiracy theory nutters. I don’t think their existence tells us that much about the US political scene. Most mainstream Republicans have run a mile from the Birthers.
SBY, the birther movement is being desperately stoked, and there are significant numbers who have been taken in by it. A recent survey showed:
28 percent of the Republicans surveyed said they did not believe President Obama was a natural born citizen,
30 percent of Republicans said they were not sure
42 percent said they thought he is a natural born citizen.
93 percent of Democrats and 83 percent of independents believe President Obama was born in the United States.
47 percent of those surveyed in Southern (bible belt) states believed Obama was born in the United States
Over 90 percent believe Obama is a natural born citizen in the Northeast and Midwest
The significance here is that there are some that want to use this dishonest model of influence in NZ politics.
Homer: Wait a minute wait a minute wait a minute. Lisa honey, are you
saying you’re *never* going to eat any animal again? What about
bacon?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Ham?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Pork chops?
Lisa: Dad! Those all come from the same animal!
Homer: [Chuckles] Yeah, right Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal.
Ninety six thousand views of the thread on Free Republic, almost three thousand comments.
Obama’s mainstream media flunkies and his corrupt government officials and his lying cheer squad cannot stop the train of truth.
The people are not stupid, and as they come to know more of the deceit and dishonesty that underpins Obama’s Presidency, he will either be forced to resign or taken from the White House in handcuffs by US Marshalls.
Why can’t the Big Magpie see that the fact he doesn’t get the snuffles has more to do with the fact that he avoids any contact with the workforce and instead remains rooted to his couch watching television (well apart from getting up on alternate weeks to change his underpants).
I prefer the motorcar of mendacity to “the train of truth”. I will occassionally take the airplane of awareness. As I am in Rarotonga next week I shall also ride the “bike of banality”.
Funny ain’t it, how so many people caught up in the Obama religious movement have pushed a worthless COLB from Hawaii with no signatures or detail as positive proof of Obama’s birth.
Yet when a much more authentic document surfaces, complete with the missing detail and with signatures that will be authenticated, they claim it as fake.
Such is the derangement of the left, and the Obama camp in particular.
I prefer the motorcar of mendacity to “the train of truth”. I will occassionally take the airplane of awareness. As I am in Rarotonga next week I shall also ride the “bike of banality”.
Just make sure you drop by and see my mate Dave at Chili’s Sports Bar. He has steinlager on tap for less than $5 a glass and NPC rugby on TV. Cheaper than Wellington. Makes a decent pizza as well.
Obama is a few percentage pts away from being a lame duck. The leftist media have ensured he has lasted six months but by Xmas Obama will be a lame duck. It going to be a long 3 years and its going to be ugly.
Love it how the socialists advise us to ‘Just trust the leadership, they’re all kosher etc’ when it’s their mob in power…. meanwhile they’ll condone trawling through rubbish bins, dispatching the smear-finder general (aka Williams) to Oz to dig dirt etc in an attempt to discredit any opposition.
re the birth cert, if Obama supporters are so sure of his legitimacy (and after 220 years of such legitimacy that’s not an unreasonable starting position) then why don’t they welcome investigation… the result probably being vindication, and egg on the faces of the conspiracy theorists.
John Key in his political naivety and ignorance and his misguided supplication to the concept of Maoridom is as damaging to NZ as Helen Klark ever was.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:31 am
@ Brian thanks for the tip. I’m hoping to avoid TV and news (but not beer) for a week.
I would suggest hiring a bike and riding there. Drunk in charge of a bike is not an offence in Raro as far as I could make out. Mind you, I was pissed at the time.
One of the leaders in the movement to prove Obama is not constitutionally qualified to be President is Alan Keyes. In fact he is named on Orly Tait’s legal submission aimed at authenticating the Kenyan Birth Certificate.
Alan Keyes served in the U.S. Foreign Service, was appointed Ambassador to the Economic and Social Council of the United Nations under President Ronald Reagan, and served as Assistant Secretary of State for International Organization Affairs from 1985 to 1987.
And of course, like every other person who abhors Obama’s extreme left socialism, Keye is a racist bastard who really just hates Obama because Obama is African American.
You can tell this is so true by just looking at Keye’s photo.
I’m not going to engage with the conspiracy theorists any longer on this issue, because I’m wasting my time.
But before I go I suggest that if anyone wants to read how each and every Birther argument has been demoslished, they should go to Wikipedia and search “Birthers”. It’s got a good summary of the arguments and the rebuttals, and plenty of links to actual hard evidence.
@ brian – I always hire a bike in Raro, it’s the coolest way to get around. I also like getting the license and then trying to use it as ID in other countries.
“And of course, like every other person who abhors Obama’s extreme left socialism, Keye is a racist bastard who really just hates Obama because Obama is African American.”
So Obama IS an American? Not that I care, he could be born on the moon. He will still go down in history as one of the worst presidents ever, it just may take a couple of decades for history to know.
“I’m not going to engage with the conspiracy theorists any longer on this issue, because I’m wasting my time.”
Haha..
You call this “engaging”??
“What?! John Key was born in Kenya? Who knew?”
or
“If enough people believe there are pixies at the bottom of their garden, does it become true?”
and to cap it off..
“Red, you clearly have no intelligent arguments to make if all you can do is revert to personal insults.”
SBY and his inane comments exists as living proof of my assertion at 9:30 am.
The left have nothing to logically and rationally rebut accusations that Obama is a counterfeit president, and instead resort to ridicule, lies and smears.
Alan Keyes is out of his natural mind. The man is a certifiable lunatic and it’s a wonder that he’s even remotely relevant in politics. Since the election of President Obama, Keyes has maintained an unending vigilance to denouncing his qualifications.
But it’s not the statements that are so mind-boggling as it is the serious fervor with which he seems so convinced. There’s a reason why Keyes and those of his ilk are relegated to the fringes of politics…
This is one Telethon that I urge all Kiwibloggers to ignore, there is not one child in NZ whose parents cannot afford to cloth or feed, once again ordinary hard working Kiwi’s are being asked to hand out money to derelict parents.
big bruv – I agree. We fed wife and I and one daughter on $47 this week. We have eaten well every day. A little boring perhaps but food none-the-less. That included lunches and some stuff we already had in the freezer (some fish and some unidentifiable meat that was right at the bottom and went into a stew). Onions and carrots were under a $1 a kilo at Pn Slave this week. No one needs to “starve” or go to school unshod unless their parents don’t look after them.
People always expect to have to pay for things in one whack – here is an idea – save money each week for kids shoes and raincoats. Even at $1 a week for a year that is a pair of shoes and a raincoat from the warehouse.
Anyone here got any argument as to why Obama is born in America?? I don’t see it. All I see are attempts at ridicule. Allegations of racism and insanity and what…???
I guess that means you’ve got nothing, and that fact would be so plainly apparent to any objective observer reading this exchange.
If Obama is an American citizen all he has to do is prove it by releasing the data he keeps hidden in Hawaii and all of the other documentation he has had sealed by Presidential decree. Even the Huffington Post agrees.
That the left at large fail to investigate the case, and instead choose to go along with a bunch of Chicago thugs and gangsters in confronting a major requirement of the American Constitution proves what I have always said about leftists to be completely true.
1) They’re dumb.
2) They’re liars and cheats
3) They’re crooks,
..and from Helen Klark to Bill Clinton to Hugo Chavez, from Barack Obama through to almost every left winger posting on this forum, the truth of this is born out and is shown to be more and more true every day.
The left will commit any atrocity for power. Mostly, their actions are covert and so incremental they’re unnoticeable. Occasionally they get caught out, as per Helen Klark and Owen Glenn, and now Obama too with his crony commie buddies, has pushed too hard.
They’re crooks cheats and liars, and Obama will go down because unless he releases his personal data ( as he himself forced John McCain to) he will be unable to govern.
There will be revolution. If he won’t go, this cheating lying communist thug has to be removed by force.
“Anyone here got any argument as to why Obama is born in America?? “
I’ll go with that US courts, the US Senate and the US Congress have indicated unanimously.
RB: “The left will commit any atrocity for power. There will be revolution. If he won’t go, this cheating lying communist thug has to be removed by force.”
RB: “The smell of panic and fear overwhelms everything you say.”
GM- I think the problem we have is that players are all contracted by the NZRFU. That means that even if they are crap, they still get picked because they have already been paid for. All players should be owned by provinces – they get extra pay if they get picked for the ABs. That way the best we have available at any particular time will be able to be picked for the ABs.
As Key said, the rules entitle Bill English to the $1000 PW, therefore he is morally entitled to it too.
However, if Bill really must keep the whole family in Wellington, then out of a good NACTional spirit of accountability and fiscal responsibility couldn’t he sharpen the pencil a bit?
Wreck1080 at 8.02: “…Bill English claiming all this cash for his wellington house is crap…”
I guess in hindsight you are right. He should have sold his house and taken the free ministerial house like the Labour ministers, even though that would cost the state more if you looked at opportunity cost of capital, etc.
What is the problem with taking an allowance for a privately owned house in lieu of occupying a free ministerial house any way? Only some sort of inverse snobbery sees advantage to the State in a higher cost so that a deputy Prime Minister doesn’t live in a family-owned home.
The real problem with MP handouts are the continuing allowances in travel etc for long-serving MPs and their spouses before the cut-off was imposed. Peter Davis will be eligible for these on his visits to New York presumably.
Is that okay Wreck1080?
RRM at 12.14 raises the question of cheaper Wellington properties. He/she wouldn’t be raising this if the Labour spendthrifts were still in power, with their love of BMW ministerial cars, speeding cavalcades, and tripping round the world (first class, of course). The NZ Left hasn’t been known for financial humility, right back to the days when the old union leader, Walsh, owned a dairy farm while he was rabbiting on about low wages.
Can Wreck1080 assure us he isn’t some public servant pissed off about austerity calls in his sector. Family home or tea and biscuits for the public service? No question which is the better spending in my view.
Thanks for the link. I don’t think many people realise what is in store for them or for this country. If the Sheeple think the Seabed and Foreshore is going to be a minor worry, this is going to be a monumental disaster for the country. It will be interesting if there is reasonable debate to see if an indigenous person in this country can be defined and what small minority will benefit most. What a total shambles this once proud place will become. it definitely won’t be the place my old man fought for.
I thought this Government and Simon Power had more sense. It may that Clark H and her mob may have been the ones with sense, well on this matter anyway.
The Obama birth story is significant: if, as some claim, he was born by Caesarean section, or if anaesthetics were used during the birth process, then he is *not* a “natural-born” citizen, and is therefore *not* eligible to be President of the USA.
Grant, I first laughed at that, then changed to worrying about what would happen if RB got his teeth into that one as well. So I thought I had better head him off at the pass (is that likely to stop him?).
…the Constitution as ratified failed to provide any definition of citizenship itself, let alone “natural born” citizenship.
This changed with the adoption of the Fourteenth Amendment in 1868. Its Citizenship Clause provided that
“ All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.”
1862 opinion of the U.S. Attorney General
In 1862, Secretary of the Treasury Salmon P. Chase sent a query to Attorney General Edward Bates asking whether or not “colored men” can be citizens of the United States. Attorney General Bates responded on November 29, 1862, with a 27-page opinion concluding, “I conclude that the free man of color, mentioned in your letter, if born in the United States, is a citizen of the United States, … .” In the course of that opinion, Bates commented at some length on the nature of citizenship, and wrote,
… our constitution, in speaking of natural born citizens, uses no affirmative language to make them such, but only recognizes and reaffirms the universal principle, common to all nations, and as old as political society, that the people born in a country do constitute the nation, and, as individuals, are natural members of the body politic.
There is a heap more on this but you should get my drift.
The Obama birth story is significant: if, as some claim, he was born by Caesarean section, or if anaesthetics were used during the birth process, then he is *not* a “natural-born” citizen, and is therefore *not* eligible to be President of the USA.
MCCAIN: Let fall thy words on vulnerable targets; I bear a charmèd life, which must not yield to one of woman born.
OBAMA: Despair thy charm, and let the angel whom thou still hast served tell thee, Obama was from his mother’s womb untimely ripped.
would these birther people be complaining so strongly if John McCain (born in Colon, Panama) had been elected president?
Okay, It’s unclear if that excludes him, because Colon was part of a US-administered territory at the time, but I’ll bet they wouldn’t be arguing about whether to interpret that as making him ineligible. I suspect they would argue (correctly) that it has no effect on someone’s suitability for the role, and ignore the constitutional issue.
Cerium – Obama’s birth certificate has never been made public and he has spent almost a million $’s on legal fees to keep certain bits of his life away from public scrutiny. Sounds like someone who has nothing to hide!
Something different. Can anyone spot the error in this latest news realease on Stuff?
House ablaze in Lower Hutt
Last updated 17:52 03/08/2009
BREAKING NEWS: Firefighters are battling a large scrub fire at Titahi Bay, Porirua, north of Wellington.
The blaze was producing a lot of smoke, which was covering Porirua, central fire communications shift manager Murray Dunbar said.
Emergency services were called to the fire at Moki Street shortly after 4.15pm.
Three fire appliances were at the scene and rural fire crews and a helicopter were on the way to assist, Mr Dunbar said.
A waste water treatment plant near the fire was not threatened, but a strong westerly was pushing the flames towards a pine plantation, Mr Dunbar said.
I know of this guy I think.
Pretty sure I interviewed him a couple of years ago.
IF, it’s the same guy (95% sure) he claimed to have worked in John Tamihere’s office as they were good mates.
His CV stated also that he had been a decorated soldier.
House ablaze in Taita, scrub fire in Porirua
Last updated 17:42 03/08/2009
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AA pays out after it approved lemon Women hurt, men robbed Missing man declared dead Having a ball at Phoenix open day Lundy 500 cancelled Leg bone fills gap in boy’s face Rugby match stopped after violence Glider pilot’s emergency landing ‘Cowardly’ indecent assault in Wellington Teen mugged by pair in park
LATEST: Firefighters are battling a large scrub fire in Titahi Bay, Porirua, north of Wellington.
The blaze was producing a lot of smoke, which was covering Porirua, central fire communications shift manager Murray Dunbar said.
Emergency services were called to the fire at Moki Street shortly after 4.15pm.
Three fire appliances were at the scene and rural fire crews and a helicopter were on the way to assist, Mr Dunbar said.
A waste water treatment plant near the fire was not threatened, but a strong westerly was pushing the flames towards a pine plantation, Mr Dunbar said.
Emergency services are also at the scene of a house fire in Lower Hutt.
Police said all occupants of the house on Molesworth St in Taita were believed to be accounted for.
Molesworth St was closed to traffic and pedestrians between Cooper St and Tocker St.
As I write this (1910 hours, 3 August 2009) TV3′s socialistally-inclined -duo Gardener and Campbell have just tried to beat-up the fact that various National-party MP’s are daring to own more than one house! All the usual leftist ‘how-dare they at our expense’ and faux outrage that we saw so blatantly from the self-same pair during the 2008 election campaign. Press-neutrality? Objective journalism? A-political reporting and reference to the actions of other political parites (aside from an admiring, grovelling, reference to Dear Leader)? No, not one (and even a later, very ill-tempered jibe from Campbell when talking about New Zealand houses).
Conduct unbecoming? Certainly – and TV3 wonders why its loosing ratings (not that TV1 is any better).
All of which merely reinforces that ‘Public Broadcasting’ in New Zealand is as farce and that politically-neutral, and delibratley objective broadcating is a thing of teh past.
Makes you wonder why they still bother to have Journalism classes doesn’t it?
How much do you get from the tax payer every week?
Tomorrow is money in the bank day
..has the amount changed.. therefore you..
..can not tell us..
..is the trough so full an you missed out..
..on your turn being a piggy..
..could have been asleep after last weeks..
..pigout on the taxpayer..
..more money today to buy..
..stuff that makes you feel good..
..NZ should all be like you solves..
..all the problems..
pokokohua.co.nz
Mawm, I said earlier in this thread that I wouldn’t engage the conspiracy theorists on the Obama thing, but I just can’t help myself. Here’s some facts:
– Hawaii doesn’t issue original birth certificates. It issues what are called “certifications of live birth”. The original is held by the authorities.
– Obama made his copy public in 2007. Copies of it are available on various websites, but I’ve put a picture of it at http://imperatorfish.blogspot.com/2009/08/conspiracy-watch-birthers.html
– The director of Hawaii’s Department of Health has verified that the state has the original birth certificate on record
– Independent researchers have viewed the original and confirmed it is the same as the copy released by Obama.
Case closed. Honestly, how much evidence will ever be enough?
“Mawm, I said earlier in this thread that I wouldn’t engage the conspiracy theorists on the Obama thing, but I just can’t help myself.”
In other words, “I’m a slack jawed moron completely incapable of standing by what I say.” Or, “I had no argument back then, but I’ve looked it up since and now feel that I’m really well informed”.
“Here’s some facts”
Not one of these claims is a “fact”. They are assertions, and every single one is wrong. (and its “here are some facts” you poor under-educated well indoctrinated illiterate commie)
“Hawaii doesn’t issue original birth certificates.”
It issues birth certificates, and it issues copies of original birth certificates. Here’s one, for a lady who was born a few days before Obama claims to have been born.
He has not made it public. He has merely posted an image on the web, and once again, this document does not verify that the holder (Obama) was born in Hawaii. It only verifies that his birth was registered in Hawaii. NOT THAT HE WAS ACTUALLY BORN THERE. Plenty of people have such COLBs who were not born in Hawaii. (Obama’s sister for example, who was born in Indonesia)
“The director of Hawaii’s Department of Health has verified that the state has the original birth certificate on record”
Dr Fukino did make a statement saying the the DOH held Obama’s “original birth certificate” but has since renegged on that statement and stated that her Dept holds “the original vital records”. She did not state what those records were or how they “verified” Obama was born in Hawaii. She has refused to answer simple questions that her finely parsed statements give rise to. Questions such as “what were those vital records?”
“Independent researchers have viewed the original and confirmed it is the same as the copy released by Obama.”
This is a complete lie. No “independent researchers” have viewed the “original”, and if they had, it of course raises the question as to why would Obama show it to them and not the general public who wants to see it.
SBY should have stuck to his word and not “engaged” (smirk), for all his idiot statements show is that like most who argue from his perspective, he does not have a damn clue what he is talking about, and only feels the need to defend this Chicago thug and gangster because SBY is sympathetic to Obam’s communist political objectives.
SBY regards the law as merely a nuisance and something that can be bent and broken by socialists at will.
Another dangerous and ignorant fool whose ambition is to see freedom destroyed and replaced by suffocating totalitarian socialism, and will guiltlessly promote any lie to those ends.
Just to help those who may be genuinely interested-
There are still many (Mr. Farrar for example) who are confused as to the real issue here. The Obama camp originally issued a COLB (and called it a Birth Certificate) however this document was initially only issued on line as a digital document. Some people claimed this was a fake.
Following the “fake” claims, the Obama camp issued a photograph of a document that had been folded. This was not a digital image but an actual photograph. Again, the document was still only the COLB.
It is this document (in the photograph) that Fact Check and Snopes have “verified” as being genuine. In other words, it compared accurately with the original digital copy.
Neither Snopes, of Fact Check, or anyone of importance in the matter has checked, seen or verified in anyway the documents on file at the Hawaii Dept of Health.
These documents are what is important, not the COLB, and it is these documents that people want released. Obama constantly refuses to do so.
Why???
The above summary is an attempt to break through the web of lies and the smokescreen of confusion that the Obama camp has woven about the issue.
There is more on the digital/ original part of the issue here
for anyone who is interested, but it is really not important to the core issue. That is- What are Obama’s “vital records” in the Hawaii DOH, and what do they show?
You failed with the fake certificate yesterday. Please, for the love of God, try to be more careful next time while looking for a more authentic Kenyan certificate.
Orly Tait is landing in the UK tomorrow morning to attempt to get the Kenyan Certificate verified by officials there. Your claims about the date of the Republic are worthless smoke screening rubbish.
Ooooh yayyyyy another debate with his holiness the Redbaiter
“I did not. See- Assertions are so so easy.
Anyone can do them, and you’re full of them. “
Right, and you aren’t. You are so stuck up in your perfect little place you dismiss anyone who dares disagree with you as a snivelling leftist retard, well guess what, Reddy, I’m not one of them.
That means Kenya WAS NOT a republic on the 17th day of February 1964 thus invalidating the certificate. Orly Tait is going to crash and burn miserably.
Trouble is, they’re under challenge on many different levels.
Whereas it suits you to find data that agrees with your political bigotry on this issue, and accept that data as unchallengeable, there are in fact many reasons why it can be questioned.
I suggest you read this thread on FR through to the end, (an objective informed discussion) and after you have, you’ll discover just how daft your certainty on this issue is.
Whereas it suits you to find data that agrees with your political bigotry on this issue
You’re the same as me Redbaiter, you will also find data to suit your needs. FreeRepublic I believe is far from a neutral website: You don’t agree with the moderator, you get booted off. Even Fox News dislikes the site.
I admit Redbaiter, the Freeper discussion is definitely more rational than I thought it would be. Still there is just a little more evidence supporting Obama’s case.
For once (regarding FreeRepublic) I’m eating humble pie – for now.
Copyright lobby was mouthing off on one news. Apparently they think the proposed copyright legislation is too weak, and want two educational notices then an immediate termination of an internet account for the third infringement of supposed copyright violation.
They are also upset with a 90 day enforcement time. Apparently they’d rather have people kicked off the internet fast than have due process done.
They also have the movie rental crowd onboard, who are convinced that internet piracy is damaging their industry (as opposed to, say, overpricing of the rentals and a flawed business model). Personally I find the movie rental group’s involvement slightly ironic, considering they were, for a while, a good source for pirates: pay $5 to rent and rip a dvd vs $30 to buy. Indeed if a pirate wanted a full DVD iso rather than a recompressed rip (at lower quality with all the extras removed), they’d still find it cheaper to pay the $5 to rent than the $9.60 to download 8GB over NZ home broadband prices (based on the ~$1.2/GB at telstraclear for 10GB blocks).
According to nationmaster NZ actually ranks very low in terms of video/software piracy, probably due to our crappy internet speed. As such I dont see why we should be introducing a more draconian set of sanctions for piracy than any other western country. Indeed were I in government I’d chuck the whole thing on the backburner and focus on something important like improving our productivity.
However marginal they appear now, they were effectively running the US between 2000 and 2008. It was their birther logic (an oxymoron if ever there was one) that provided the mindset, legwork and frontline troops for the Bush era. Iraq was invaded because it could not prove that it did not have something it truly did not have. “We would say, ‘Iraq should present any anthrax’,” explained UN weapons inspector Hans Blix shortly after the invasion. “While the US and UK were inclined to say, ‘Iraq should present the anthrax.’” Guantánamo Bay is still full of people who were incarcerated because they were not able to prove they were not guilty and whose guilt was to some extent inferred by their incarceration.
The birthers’ claims might be crazy. But so was Whitewater, which ended with Clinton’s impeachment, and the Swift Boat saga helped torpedo John Kerry’s presidential campaign.
It’s not just this pathetic birth certificate crusade that is the problem. It is the method employed. Led by people who think they have a god given right to be lying, deceitful, destructive, to force their own way. So many contradictions in how they live, and in what they say. They keep accusing others of doing what they do themselves.
I don’t want to see this sort of crap get legs in NZ.
Karl Rove: The Kenyan ‘Birth Certificate’ Is ‘Likely a Forgery’
“Several of the lawyers and activists who are following or pushing this story have grown irritated with Taitz’s incompetence and wild antics. This might be a breaking point.”
See over in Aussie they have busted some Somali (Australians) who were planning suicide attacks. Will be our turn soon enough. Militant Islam declared war on the West, not just the USA and a few European countries, and the last time I looked women here were allowed to walk around uncovered so I suspect we are included in “the West”.
August 3rd, 2009 at 7:58 am
The Obama birth certificate issue is another example of the political scene in the US, where lies and misinformation are deliberately perpetuated because there are people who want Obama to fail by any means possible. These are people who don’t care about the democratic process. And they know how to flock their sheep.
Is it surprising this method of deceit carried out by many who claim they are Christian?
Exodus 23:1 “You shall not bear a false report; do not join your hand with a wicked man to be a malicious witness.”
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:02 am
Bill English claiming all this cash for his wellington house is crap.
When I was working for a large international corporate, they would be on top of such silliness.
If a person was required in wellington for night stay trips, the company would pay either actual accommodation costs, or, if you chose to stay with someone you knew you could only claim the per diem plus a smaller preset amount which you could give to the person you stayed with.
These MP’s are using this to pay off their houses then bank the capital gains. It is disgraceful for MP’s to make profits from expense arrangements.
MP’s should be made to pay such profits back to the taxpayer.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:04 am
God botherer go home.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:07 am
Who is sick of being sick, having sick people around them, coughing and spluttering, in fact sick of this winter so far? I never believed in SAD until this winter
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:20 am
Trade union leaders receive huge pay rises despite redundancies and salary cuts among members
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5960724/Trade-union-leaders-receive-huge-pay-rises-despite-redundancies-and-salary-cuts-among-members.html
It would be very interesting to know what the bretheren in New Zealand have negotiated for themselves as their members take pay cuts during the recession.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:21 am
Amen to that Brian – I’ve had a viral bronchitis for about three weeks now, and I’m heartily sick of coughing my guts out evry time I speak or try to do anything remotely physical
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:27 am
Who is sick of being sick, having sick people around them, coughing and spluttering? I never believed in SAD during the summer until the past few in London
Bird flu, swine fever, what next canine distemper?
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:36 am
RGW
I know what you mean. I have stopped going to the Doctor and shifted to a vet.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:38 am
Cerium, every US President has had a conspiracy theory associated with him. Clinton murdered Vince Foster, Bush planned 9/11 etc etc. The Birther movement is just a bog-standard group of conspiracy theory nutters. I don’t think their existence tells us that much about the US political scene. Most mainstream Republicans have run a mile from the Birthers.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:38 am
What’s the life of a child worth?
Sixty days in prison.
It should be life.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/31/AR2009073103302.html
At least in NZ the children would be taken from these nutters and placed in proper care.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:40 am
Bird flu; swine flu. Does that mean that bacon and eggs is off the menu?
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:41 am
lol brian, lol
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:41 am
NOOOOOO. They are the only things that make life worth living. With a side order of mushrooms of course.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:49 am
SBY, the birther movement is being desperately stoked, and there are significant numbers who have been taken in by it. A recent survey showed:
28 percent of the Republicans surveyed said they did not believe President Obama was a natural born citizen,
30 percent of Republicans said they were not sure
42 percent said they thought he is a natural born citizen.
93 percent of Democrats and 83 percent of independents believe President Obama was born in the United States.
47 percent of those surveyed in Southern (bible belt) states believed Obama was born in the United States
Over 90 percent believe Obama is a natural born citizen in the Northeast and Midwest
The significance here is that there are some that want to use this dishonest model of influence in NZ politics.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:50 am
Homer: Wait a minute wait a minute wait a minute. Lisa honey, are you
saying you’re *never* going to eat any animal again? What about
bacon?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Ham?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Pork chops?
Lisa: Dad! Those all come from the same animal!
Homer: [Chuckles] Yeah, right Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal.
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:55 am
“The significance here is that there are some that want to use this dishonest model of influence in NZ politics.”
What?! John Key was born in Kenya? Who knew?
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:58 am
“WND was able to obtain other birth certificates from Kenya for purposes of comparison, and the form of the documents appear to be identical. ”
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=105764
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:59 am
those who are feeling sick/chesty should not consume any dairy products..
..(at the very least ..for the duration..)
..they just manufacture mucus..
..when i was vegetarian..i would still get colds/flu’s every winter..
..and they would drag on for days/weeks..
..since being vegan..(ten years..)..i have only had a few colds in all those years..
..and the ones i got..
..i was able to get rid of in a couple/few days..(no lingering chesty-coughs..)
..(f.w.i.w..)
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:02 am
Redbaiter, do you know you are being dishonest? Or are you just one of the sheep?
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:07 am
this could distract the ill..
http://whoar.co.nz/2009/porn-for-women-sex-with-context-15-examplesi-once-joked-to-a-male-friend-that-real-porn-for-women-would-show-a-man-cleaning-a-woman%e2%80%99s-house-and-then-going-down-on-her-for-an-hour/
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:10 am
Ninety six thousand views of the thread on Free Republic, almost three thousand comments.
Obama’s mainstream media flunkies and his corrupt government officials and his lying cheer squad cannot stop the train of truth.
The people are not stupid, and as they come to know more of the deceit and dishonesty that underpins Obama’s Presidency, he will either be forced to resign or taken from the White House in handcuffs by US Marshalls.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:12 am
There are a lot of stupid people in the US. And at least one here (unless he is trying to flock his stupids).
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:12 am
Why can’t the Big Magpie see that the fact he doesn’t get the snuffles has more to do with the fact that he avoids any contact with the workforce and instead remains rooted to his couch watching television (well apart from getting up on alternate weeks to change his underpants).
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:13 am
I prefer the motorcar of mendacity to “the train of truth”. I will occassionally take the airplane of awareness. As I am in Rarotonga next week I shall also ride the “bike of banality”.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:19 am
Funny ain’t it, how so many people caught up in the Obama religious movement have pushed a worthless COLB from Hawaii with no signatures or detail as positive proof of Obama’s birth.
Yet when a much more authentic document surfaces, complete with the missing detail and with signatures that will be authenticated, they claim it as fake.
Such is the derangement of the left, and the Obama camp in particular.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:19 am
The evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii is overwhelming.
“Ninety six thousand views of the thread on Free Republic, almost three thousand comments.”
Which proves what? If enough people believe there are pixies at the bottom of their garden, does it become true?
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:21 am
Spread all the lies, smears, and false allegations you want you pathetic leftist drongoes.
The smell of panic and fear overwhelms everything you say.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:25 am
@SBY “Which proves what? If enough people believe there are pixies at the bottom of their garden, does it become true?”
No it becomes a religion.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:26 am
^ No it becomes reality.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:30 am
LOL Banama Llama only wikiality, not reality
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:30 am
Just make sure you drop by and see my mate Dave at Chili’s Sports Bar. He has steinlager on tap for less than $5 a glass and NPC rugby on TV. Cheaper than Wellington. Makes a decent pizza as well.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:30 am
One always knows when the left have no answer and no argument and when they are scared shitless-
They turn to ridicule.
And they’re reaching for that artifice more and more often in the US as Obama’s house of cards begins to collapse.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:30 am
Does anyone else find this http://www.nzcpr.com/weekly191.htm disturbing.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:31 am
@ Brian thanks for the tip. I’m hoping to avoid TV and news (but not beer) for a week.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:35 am
Red, you clearly have no intelligent arguments to make if all you can do is revert to personal insults.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:35 am
Obama is a few percentage pts away from being a lame duck. The leftist media have ensured he has lasted six months but by Xmas Obama will be a lame duck. It going to be a long 3 years and its going to be ugly.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:35 am
Love it how the socialists advise us to ‘Just trust the leadership, they’re all kosher etc’ when it’s their mob in power…. meanwhile they’ll condone trawling through rubbish bins, dispatching the smear-finder general (aka Williams) to Oz to dig dirt etc in an attempt to discredit any opposition.
re the birth cert, if Obama supporters are so sure of his legitimacy (and after 220 years of such legitimacy that’s not an unreasonable starting position) then why don’t they welcome investigation… the result probably being vindication, and egg on the faces of the conspiracy theorists.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:35 am
“Does anyone else find this http://www.nzcpr.com/weekly191.htm disturbing.”
John Key in his political naivety and ignorance and his misguided supplication to the concept of Maoridom is as damaging to NZ as Helen Klark ever was.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:36 am
the whole birther debate is more about defining the racism of ‘the believers’..
..i mean..mcain ‘looked into it’..the hillary-team ‘looked into it’..
..those with the strongest motives to find it..haven’t/didn’t..
..but red..you down there in tauranga…
..with your constant diet of far-right american blogs/hate-sheets..
..you have the ‘cred’ on this..eh..?
..(and that you cite the number of comments on/from one of those rightwing hate-sheets..as ‘evidence’ supporting yr ‘case’..
..only really goes to show how ..
..’removed from reality’ .. you really are..
..eh..?
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:41 am
oh red..!..brilliant timing there..!
..for a bit of ‘indigenous-bashing’..eh..?
..did you just q.e.d. the first line of my 9.36..?..or what..?
right on cue..!
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:44 am
I would suggest hiring a bike and riding there. Drunk in charge of a bike is not an offence in Raro as far as I could make out. Mind you, I was pissed at the time.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:44 am
lol? those Pixies could be as real as it gets for those that claim to see them
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:45 am
One of the leaders in the movement to prove Obama is not constitutionally qualified to be President is Alan Keyes. In fact he is named on Orly Tait’s legal submission aimed at authenticating the Kenyan Birth Certificate.
Alan Keyes served in the U.S. Foreign Service, was appointed Ambassador to the Economic and Social Council of the United Nations under President Ronald Reagan, and served as Assistant Secretary of State for International Organization Affairs from 1985 to 1987.
And of course, like every other person who abhors Obama’s extreme left socialism, Keye is a racist bastard who really just hates Obama because Obama is African American.
You can tell this is so true by just looking at Keye’s photo.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/Alan_Keyes.jpg/225px-Alan_Keyes.jpg
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:48 am
Brian Smaller said “Mind you, I was pissed at the time.”
Well there you go then Brian – you haven’t got the flu – just the lingering after-effects of Rarotongan Brewers’ Asthma
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:54 am
I’m not going to engage with the conspiracy theorists any longer on this issue, because I’m wasting my time.
But before I go I suggest that if anyone wants to read how each and every Birther argument has been demoslished, they should go to Wikipedia and search “Birthers”. It’s got a good summary of the arguments and the rebuttals, and plenty of links to actual hard evidence.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:56 am
@ brian – I always hire a bike in Raro, it’s the coolest way to get around. I also like getting the license and then trying to use it as ID in other countries.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:58 am
“And of course, like every other person who abhors Obama’s extreme left socialism, Keye is a racist bastard who really just hates Obama because Obama is African American.”
So Obama IS an American? Not that I care, he could be born on the moon. He will still go down in history as one of the worst presidents ever, it just may take a couple of decades for history to know.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:05 am
“I’m not going to engage with the conspiracy theorists any longer on this issue, because I’m wasting my time.”
Haha..
You call this “engaging”??
“What?! John Key was born in Kenya? Who knew?”
or
“If enough people believe there are pixies at the bottom of their garden, does it become true?”
and to cap it off..
“Red, you clearly have no intelligent arguments to make if all you can do is revert to personal insults.”
SBY and his inane comments exists as living proof of my assertion at 9:30 am.
The left have nothing to logically and rationally rebut accusations that Obama is a counterfeit president, and instead resort to ridicule, lies and smears.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:07 am
I wonder where the post on why National is resiling from its tax cut pledge is?
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:11 am
aww..!..isn’t that nice..?
red has absolved himself from birther=racist accusations..
..by saying that one of the birthers is a far-right american politician..
..who happens to be ‘of colour’..
brilliant there red..!
..is he your ‘best friend’..?..too..?
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:17 am
Redbaiter, it’s funny how you criticise me for not “engaging”, when you’re the master of personal insults and attacks.
Let me make myself clear: I’ve no intention of debating your nutcase theories.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:19 am
andrei (213) Vote: 1 0 Says:
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:07 am
I wonder where the post on why National is resiling from its tax cut pledge is?
Locked in the same drawer as the plans for the national cycleway
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:23 am
Spread all the lies, smears, and false allegations you want you pathetic leftist drongoes.
The smell of panic and fear overwhelms everything you say.
Once again Red, the boomerang returns. You do what you accuse. But that’s the standard approach isn’t it.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:27 am
Cerium,yes it is The Standard approach.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:32 am
Wow, even all of those extreme right racist nutjobs at the Huffington Post have joined the chorus..
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mark-joseph/the-only-thing-weirder-th_b_248227.html
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:36 am
Alan Keyes is out of his natural mind. The man is a certifiable lunatic and it’s a wonder that he’s even remotely relevant in politics. Since the election of President Obama, Keyes has maintained an unending vigilance to denouncing his qualifications.
But it’s not the statements that are so mind-boggling as it is the serious fervor with which he seems so convinced. There’s a reason why Keyes and those of his ilk are relegated to the fringes of politics…
http://www.bvblackspin.com/2009/02/23/alan-keyes-americas-greatest-crisis-is-not-economic-its-ob/
Although the description fits I’m not trying to suggest Redbaiter is Alan Keyes, just ilk.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:37 am
the answer as to ‘why not release it’..is politics 101..
when your opposition is digging a huge hole for themselves..
..and exposing themselves as conspiracy whack-jobs..
..you don’t take their spade away..
..eh..?
phil(whoar.co.nz)
[
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:44 am
RB you are now in the league of Sep 11 deniers and other nutjob conspiracy theorists. Congradulations.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:59 am
This is one Telethon that I urge all Kiwibloggers to ignore, there is not one child in NZ whose parents cannot afford to cloth or feed, once again ordinary hard working Kiwi’s are being asked to hand out money to derelict parents.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2712870/TV3-to-take-a-cut-of-donations-to-charity
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:59 am
Although the description fits I’m not trying to suggest Redbaiter is Alan Keyes, just ilk.
Do you think Alan Keyes is Mr Russell Fletcher, of Tauranga?
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:09 am
Crikey, there’s a pheasant in the garden!
Just sayin…
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:14 am
this whole troughing-business is really a matter of ‘class’..
..in this case a political-class..
..that feels itself seperate from the rest of us..
..and that the same rules/imperatives that apply to the rest of us..
..don’t apply to them..
..this class-grouping is only confirmed by the resounding silences from the troughers of the other parties..
..a class conspiracy of silence..
..over/around..the question of reform of their troughing-ways..
..who owill drive this..?
..the herald made a start this morning..with an editorial calling for the culture of perks…
..(with some of these perks lasting 20-30 years after the recipients time in parliament/at the main trough)..
..calling for there to be reform/an ‘ending of the perks’..
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:14 am
big bruv – I agree. We fed wife and I and one daughter on $47 this week. We have eaten well every day. A little boring perhaps but food none-the-less. That included lunches and some stuff we already had in the freezer (some fish and some unidentifiable meat that was right at the bottom and went into a stew). Onions and carrots were under a $1 a kilo at Pn Slave this week. No one needs to “starve” or go to school unshod unless their parents don’t look after them.
People always expect to have to pay for things in one whack – here is an idea – save money each week for kids shoes and raincoats. Even at $1 a week for a year that is a pair of shoes and a raincoat from the warehouse.
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:19 am
And there’s 5 swamp hens.
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:21 am
Anyone here got any argument as to why Obama is born in America?? I don’t see it. All I see are attempts at ridicule. Allegations of racism and insanity and what…???
I guess that means you’ve got nothing, and that fact would be so plainly apparent to any objective observer reading this exchange.
If Obama is an American citizen all he has to do is prove it by releasing the data he keeps hidden in Hawaii and all of the other documentation he has had sealed by Presidential decree. Even the Huffington Post agrees.
That the left at large fail to investigate the case, and instead choose to go along with a bunch of Chicago thugs and gangsters in confronting a major requirement of the American Constitution proves what I have always said about leftists to be completely true.
1) They’re dumb.
2) They’re liars and cheats
3) They’re crooks,
..and from Helen Klark to Bill Clinton to Hugo Chavez, from Barack Obama through to almost every left winger posting on this forum, the truth of this is born out and is shown to be more and more true every day.
The left will commit any atrocity for power. Mostly, their actions are covert and so incremental they’re unnoticeable. Occasionally they get caught out, as per Helen Klark and Owen Glenn, and now Obama too with his crony commie buddies, has pushed too hard.
They’re crooks cheats and liars, and Obama will go down because unless he releases his personal data ( as he himself forced John McCain to) he will be unable to govern.
There will be revolution. If he won’t go, this cheating lying communist thug has to be removed by force.
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:22 am
The Obama regime is murdering perfectly good cars. Where is the outcry? Where are the protests? Where are the demands for justice in the Hague?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/31/AR2009073101173.html
As for phool, I’ll be setting a maths test for later so I hope you flexed your mighty brain to figure out double digit numbers.
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:22 am
Oh god, Red’s lost his Diazepam again.
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:24 am
“Drunk in charge of a bike is not an offence in Raro as far as I could make out.”
It seemed to be compulsory.
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:35 am
Haha phil’s going off about troughing again…
Talk about the sow calling the pig greedy..
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:39 am
“Anyone here got any argument as to why Obama is born in America?? “
I’ll go with that US courts, the US Senate and the US Congress have indicated unanimously.
RB: “The left will commit any atrocity for power. There will be revolution. If he won’t go, this cheating lying communist thug has to be removed by force.”
RB: “The smell of panic and fear overwhelms everything you say.”
Once again speaking for yourself?
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:48 am
RB
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090728/ap_on_re_us/us_obama_birth_certificate
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:51 am
$500 says that the pretty boys in the All Blacks won’t make the semis in the RWC in NZ.
Useless, pumped up chokers!
Go on folks, looks like another Boks/Poms final to me!
The problem the Red Rose players have, is having to wait up to 4 years between Finals.
Don’t suppose the Jessies in Black know how that feels?
August 3rd, 2009 at 12:07 pm
GM- I think the problem we have is that players are all contracted by the NZRFU. That means that even if they are crap, they still get picked because they have already been paid for. All players should be owned by provinces – they get extra pay if they get picked for the ABs. That way the best we have available at any particular time will be able to be picked for the ABs.
August 3rd, 2009 at 12:14 pm
As Key said, the rules entitle Bill English to the $1000 PW, therefore he is morally entitled to it too.
However, if Bill really must keep the whole family in Wellington, then out of a good NACTional spirit of accountability and fiscal responsibility couldn’t he sharpen the pencil a bit?
e.g:
Johnsonville $520 PW
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-me-property/Residential-property/Houses-to-rent/auction-232310788.htm
Island Bay $560 PW:
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-me-property/Residential-property/Houses-to-rent/auction-231359154.htm
Petone $625 PW:
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Property/Residential-Property/Houses-to-rent/auction-214204195.htm
Hataitai $695 PW:
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-me-property/Residential-property/Houses-to-rent/auction-208245516.htm
Shall I go on?
August 3rd, 2009 at 12:37 pm
Wreck1080 at 8.02: “…Bill English claiming all this cash for his wellington house is crap…”
I guess in hindsight you are right. He should have sold his house and taken the free ministerial house like the Labour ministers, even though that would cost the state more if you looked at opportunity cost of capital, etc.
What is the problem with taking an allowance for a privately owned house in lieu of occupying a free ministerial house any way? Only some sort of inverse snobbery sees advantage to the State in a higher cost so that a deputy Prime Minister doesn’t live in a family-owned home.
The real problem with MP handouts are the continuing allowances in travel etc for long-serving MPs and their spouses before the cut-off was imposed. Peter Davis will be eligible for these on his visits to New York presumably.
Is that okay Wreck1080?
RRM at 12.14 raises the question of cheaper Wellington properties. He/she wouldn’t be raising this if the Labour spendthrifts were still in power, with their love of BMW ministerial cars, speeding cavalcades, and tripping round the world (first class, of course). The NZ Left hasn’t been known for financial humility, right back to the days when the old union leader, Walsh, owned a dairy farm while he was rabbiting on about low wages.
Can Wreck1080 assure us he isn’t some public servant pissed off about austerity calls in his sector. Family home or tea and biscuits for the public service? No question which is the better spending in my view.
August 3rd, 2009 at 12:42 pm
Gee Biffo
Thanks for the link. I don’t think many people realise what is in store for them or for this country. If the Sheeple think the Seabed and Foreshore is going to be a minor worry, this is going to be a monumental disaster for the country. It will be interesting if there is reasonable debate to see if an indigenous person in this country can be defined and what small minority will benefit most. What a total shambles this once proud place will become. it definitely won’t be the place my old man fought for.
I thought this Government and Simon Power had more sense. It may that Clark H and her mob may have been the ones with sense, well on this matter anyway.
August 3rd, 2009 at 12:43 pm
Perhaps the All Blacks should train with Coconuts? And insist they are the match balls for the RWC!
Only way they will win? Even then they will drop, fumble, and screw up!
August 3rd, 2009 at 12:50 pm
Jack5: “He/she wouldn’t be raising this if the Labour spendthrifts were still in power”
(1) WTF ever.
(2) Facts cease to exist when they are pointed out by someone who talks about “NACTional”???
August 3rd, 2009 at 12:56 pm
Why would he fly all that way to sleep in a dumpster?
August 3rd, 2009 at 1:34 pm
The Obama birth story is significant: if, as some claim, he was born by Caesarean section, or if anaesthetics were used during the birth process, then he is *not* a “natural-born” citizen, and is therefore *not* eligible to be President of the USA.
August 3rd, 2009 at 1:42 pm
i understand that many of the birther-droolers/knuckledraggers.
..not only believe obama is not an american..
..there is a strong current/thread in that birther movement..
..that believes/swears that obama is an alien reptilian shape-shifter..
..(they are know within the movement .. as ‘the shifties’..)
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 1:50 pm
Phool
Are you going to tell us today?
How much do you get from the tax payer every week?
August 3rd, 2009 at 2:03 pm
Grant, I first laughed at that, then changed to worrying about what would happen if RB got his teeth into that one as well. So I thought I had better head him off at the pass (is that likely to stop him?).
…the Constitution as ratified failed to provide any definition of citizenship itself, let alone “natural born” citizenship.
This changed with the adoption of the Fourteenth Amendment in 1868. Its Citizenship Clause provided that
“ All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.”
1862 opinion of the U.S. Attorney General
In 1862, Secretary of the Treasury Salmon P. Chase sent a query to Attorney General Edward Bates asking whether or not “colored men” can be citizens of the United States. Attorney General Bates responded on November 29, 1862, with a 27-page opinion concluding, “I conclude that the free man of color, mentioned in your letter, if born in the United States, is a citizen of the United States, … .” In the course of that opinion, Bates commented at some length on the nature of citizenship, and wrote,
… our constitution, in speaking of natural born citizens, uses no affirmative language to make them such, but only recognizes and reaffirms the universal principle, common to all nations, and as old as political society, that the people born in a country do constitute the nation, and, as individuals, are natural members of the body politic.
There is a heap more on this but you should get my drift.
August 3rd, 2009 at 2:29 pm
“I conclude that the free man of color”
But Obama is so beholden to organi(z)ed labo(u)r that he cannot be said to be free,
August 3rd, 2009 at 4:21 pm
Bruv
Phil told you on Sunday. You weren’t paying attention.
August 3rd, 2009 at 4:58 pm
MCCAIN: Let fall thy words on vulnerable targets; I bear a charmèd life, which must not yield to one of woman born.
OBAMA: Despair thy charm, and let the angel whom thou still hast served tell thee, Obama was from his mother’s womb untimely ripped.
August 3rd, 2009 at 5:34 pm
Ah Repton.
MacBeth speaks truth.
August 3rd, 2009 at 5:36 pm
Glutaemus Maximus I think that’s been the problem
August 3rd, 2009 at 5:49 pm
anyone see this on Family Guy last night…………..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJzgSDOJAfA
gold
August 3rd, 2009 at 5:52 pm
would these birther people be complaining so strongly if John McCain (born in Colon, Panama) had been elected president?
Okay, It’s unclear if that excludes him, because Colon was part of a US-administered territory at the time, but I’ll bet they wouldn’t be arguing about whether to interpret that as making him ineligible. I suspect they would argue (correctly) that it has no effect on someone’s suitability for the role, and ignore the constitutional issue.
August 3rd, 2009 at 6:16 pm
Cerium – Obama’s birth certificate has never been made public and he has spent almost a million $’s on legal fees to keep certain bits of his life away from public scrutiny. Sounds like someone who has nothing to hide!
August 3rd, 2009 at 6:20 pm
Something different. Can anyone spot the error in this latest news realease on Stuff?
House ablaze in Lower Hutt
Last updated 17:52 03/08/2009
BREAKING NEWS: Firefighters are battling a large scrub fire at Titahi Bay, Porirua, north of Wellington.
The blaze was producing a lot of smoke, which was covering Porirua, central fire communications shift manager Murray Dunbar said.
Emergency services were called to the fire at Moki Street shortly after 4.15pm.
Three fire appliances were at the scene and rural fire crews and a helicopter were on the way to assist, Mr Dunbar said.
A waste water treatment plant near the fire was not threatened, but a strong westerly was pushing the flames towards a pine plantation, Mr Dunbar said.
August 3rd, 2009 at 6:25 pm
Village Idiot
“Bruv Phil told you on Sunday. You weren’t paying attention.
I missed that, what is the amount?
August 3rd, 2009 at 6:31 pm
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/2715524/Alleged-sex-offender-posed-as-truancy-officer
I know of this guy I think.
Pretty sure I interviewed him a couple of years ago.
IF, it’s the same guy (95% sure) he claimed to have worked in John Tamihere’s office as they were good mates.
His CV stated also that he had been a decorated soldier.
August 3rd, 2009 at 6:33 pm
we had sorta forgotten about this one..eh..?
http://whoar.co.nz/2009/warning-oil-supplies-are-running-out-fastcatastrophic-shortfalls-threaten-economic-recovery-says-worlds-top-energy-economist/
that should focus attention again..
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 6:54 pm
The way the story probably was meant to be.
House ablaze in Taita, scrub fire in Porirua
Last updated 17:42 03/08/2009
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Wellington
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LATEST: Firefighters are battling a large scrub fire in Titahi Bay, Porirua, north of Wellington.
The blaze was producing a lot of smoke, which was covering Porirua, central fire communications shift manager Murray Dunbar said.
Emergency services were called to the fire at Moki Street shortly after 4.15pm.
Three fire appliances were at the scene and rural fire crews and a helicopter were on the way to assist, Mr Dunbar said.
A waste water treatment plant near the fire was not threatened, but a strong westerly was pushing the flames towards a pine plantation, Mr Dunbar said.
Emergency services are also at the scene of a house fire in Lower Hutt.
Police said all occupants of the house on Molesworth St in Taita were believed to be accounted for.
Molesworth St was closed to traffic and pedestrians between Cooper St and Tocker St.
- The Dominion Post and NZPA
August 3rd, 2009 at 7:35 pm
As I write this (1910 hours, 3 August 2009) TV3′s socialistally-inclined -duo Gardener and Campbell have just tried to beat-up the fact that various National-party MP’s are daring to own more than one house! All the usual leftist ‘how-dare they at our expense’ and faux outrage that we saw so blatantly from the self-same pair during the 2008 election campaign. Press-neutrality? Objective journalism? A-political reporting and reference to the actions of other political parites (aside from an admiring, grovelling, reference to Dear Leader)? No, not one (and even a later, very ill-tempered jibe from Campbell when talking about New Zealand houses).
Conduct unbecoming? Certainly – and TV3 wonders why its loosing ratings (not that TV1 is any better).
All of which merely reinforces that ‘Public Broadcasting’ in New Zealand is as farce and that politically-neutral, and delibratley objective broadcating is a thing of teh past.
Makes you wonder why they still bother to have Journalism classes doesn’t it?
August 3rd, 2009 at 7:49 pm
um..!..komata..hate to puncture yr thesis there..
..but tv3 is privately owned..eh..?
and your howlings to one side..
..they were reporting key announcing a review..
..and they also noted that clark had done the same thing..
..do your prejudices render you deaf..?
(and kudos/big-ups are due to (gulp!) peter dunne..heather roy..and chris finlayson..
..we are told that they are the only mp’s..from any party..
..who live in wellington..
..but aren’t troughing on the accomodation allowance..)
..(maybe just koma wd be a more accurate/descriptive moniker for you..?..)
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:03 pm
Phool
Are you going to tell us today?
How much do you get from the tax payer every week?
Tomorrow is money in the bank day
..has the amount changed.. therefore you..
..can not tell us..
..is the trough so full an you missed out..
..on your turn being a piggy..
..could have been asleep after last weeks..
..pigout on the taxpayer..
..more money today to buy..
..stuff that makes you feel good..
..NZ should all be like you solves..
..all the problems..
pokokohua.co.nz
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:13 pm
Obvious that insult was over the top and moderated.
Sorry but the title fits the repugnant tax bleeder
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:18 pm
Mawm, I said earlier in this thread that I wouldn’t engage the conspiracy theorists on the Obama thing, but I just can’t help myself. Here’s some facts:
– Hawaii doesn’t issue original birth certificates. It issues what are called “certifications of live birth”. The original is held by the authorities.
– Obama made his copy public in 2007. Copies of it are available on various websites, but I’ve put a picture of it at http://imperatorfish.blogspot.com/2009/08/conspiracy-watch-birthers.html
– The director of Hawaii’s Department of Health has verified that the state has the original birth certificate on record
– Independent researchers have viewed the original and confirmed it is the same as the copy released by Obama.
Case closed. Honestly, how much evidence will ever be enough?
August 3rd, 2009 at 8:26 pm
How many phools does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
28: 15 to screw in the bulb and 42 to swit-oh wait, hang on.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:21 pm
“Mawm, I said earlier in this thread that I wouldn’t engage the conspiracy theorists on the Obama thing, but I just can’t help myself.”
In other words, “I’m a slack jawed moron completely incapable of standing by what I say.” Or, “I had no argument back then, but I’ve looked it up since and now feel that I’m really well informed”.
“Here’s some facts”
Not one of these claims is a “fact”. They are assertions, and every single one is wrong. (and its “here are some facts” you poor under-educated well indoctrinated illiterate commie)
“Hawaii doesn’t issue original birth certificates.”
It issues birth certificates, and it issues copies of original birth certificates. Here’s one, for a lady who was born a few days before Obama claims to have been born.
http://www.wnd.com/images/090728birthcert.gif
“Obama made his copy public in 2007.”
He has not made it public. He has merely posted an image on the web, and once again, this document does not verify that the holder (Obama) was born in Hawaii. It only verifies that his birth was registered in Hawaii. NOT THAT HE WAS ACTUALLY BORN THERE. Plenty of people have such COLBs who were not born in Hawaii. (Obama’s sister for example, who was born in Indonesia)
“The director of Hawaii’s Department of Health has verified that the state has the original birth certificate on record”
Dr Fukino did make a statement saying the the DOH held Obama’s “original birth certificate” but has since renegged on that statement and stated that her Dept holds “the original vital records”. She did not state what those records were or how they “verified” Obama was born in Hawaii. She has refused to answer simple questions that her finely parsed statements give rise to. Questions such as “what were those vital records?”
“Independent researchers have viewed the original and confirmed it is the same as the copy released by Obama.”
This is a complete lie. No “independent researchers” have viewed the “original”, and if they had, it of course raises the question as to why would Obama show it to them and not the general public who wants to see it.
SBY should have stuck to his word and not “engaged” (smirk), for all his idiot statements show is that like most who argue from his perspective, he does not have a damn clue what he is talking about, and only feels the need to defend this Chicago thug and gangster because SBY is sympathetic to Obam’s communist political objectives.
SBY regards the law as merely a nuisance and something that can be bent and broken by socialists at will.
Another dangerous and ignorant fool whose ambition is to see freedom destroyed and replaced by suffocating totalitarian socialism, and will guiltlessly promote any lie to those ends.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:32 pm
Redbaiter, you’re barking mad. Which is why I can’t be bothered “engaging” with you.
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:42 pm
what’s the bet hurf is spondre..?
phil(whoar.co.nz)
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:45 pm
Just to help those who may be genuinely interested-
There are still many (Mr. Farrar for example) who are confused as to the real issue here. The Obama camp originally issued a COLB (and called it a Birth Certificate) however this document was initially only issued on line as a digital document. Some people claimed this was a fake.
Following the “fake” claims, the Obama camp issued a photograph of a document that had been folded. This was not a digital image but an actual photograph. Again, the document was still only the COLB.
It is this document (in the photograph) that Fact Check and Snopes have “verified” as being genuine. In other words, it compared accurately with the original digital copy.
Neither Snopes, of Fact Check, or anyone of importance in the matter has checked, seen or verified in anyway the documents on file at the Hawaii Dept of Health.
These documents are what is important, not the COLB, and it is these documents that people want released. Obama constantly refuses to do so.
Why???
The above summary is an attempt to break through the web of lies and the smokescreen of confusion that the Obama camp has woven about the issue.
There is more on the digital/ original part of the issue here
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=105817
for anyone who is interested, but it is really not important to the core issue. That is- What are Obama’s “vital records” in the Hawaii DOH, and what do they show?
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:50 pm
“Redbaiter, you’re barking mad. Which is why I can’t be bothered “engaging” with you.”
SBY, you have got nothing but worthless assertions (the above is another) and its why you should not ever dare to “engage” with Redbaiter or anyone.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:03 pm
I am not Spondre nor do I have anything to do with sponges.
Thanks for playing.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:06 pm
Reddy.
You failed with the fake certificate yesterday. Please, for the love of God, try to be more careful next time while looking for a more authentic Kenyan certificate.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:15 pm
“You failed with the fake certificate yesterday.”
I did not. See- Assertions are so so easy.
Anyone can do them, and you’re full of them.
Orly Tait is landing in the UK tomorrow morning to attempt to get the Kenyan Certificate verified by officials there. Your claims about the date of the Republic are worthless smoke screening rubbish.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:29 pm
Ooooh yayyyyy another debate with his holiness the Redbaiter
“I did not. See- Assertions are so so easy.
Anyone can do them, and you’re full of them. “
Right, and you aren’t. You are so stuck up in your perfect little place you dismiss anyone who dares disagree with you as a snivelling leftist retard, well guess what, Reddy, I’m not one of them.
Kenya declared independence on the 12th December 1963 and on the 12th of December 1964, Kenya became a republic. The day is known as Jamhuri Day (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/1450900/Jamhuri-Day).
That means Kenya WAS NOT a republic on the 17th day of February 1964 thus invalidating the certificate. Orly Tait is going to crash and burn miserably.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:37 pm
philu (5019) Vote: 0 2 Says:
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:42 pm
what’s the bet hurf is spondre..?
phil(whoar.co.nz)
..whats the bet whore pulls his pud on the hour..every hour…
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:40 pm
Great to see you attempting some facts.
Trouble is, they’re under challenge on many different levels.
Whereas it suits you to find data that agrees with your political bigotry on this issue, and accept that data as unchallengeable, there are in fact many reasons why it can be questioned.
I suggest you read this thread on FR through to the end, (an objective informed discussion) and after you have, you’ll discover just how daft your certainty on this issue is.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2306640/posts?q=1&;page=1
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:43 pm
“If Sarah Palin looked like Golda Meir, would we even be talking about her today?”
– GOP strategist Mike Murphy
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:49 pm
Whereas it suits you to find data that agrees with your political bigotry on this issue
You’re the same as me Redbaiter, you will also find data to suit your needs. FreeRepublic I believe is far from a neutral website: You don’t agree with the moderator, you get booted off. Even Fox News dislikes the site.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:51 pm
phlu, how’s that technorati ranking going? have you made it out of the bottom 1%?
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:55 pm
“FreeRepublic I believe is far from a neutral website:”
Obviously you did not read the thread, for the issue is argued objectively and rationally from both points of view.
August 3rd, 2009 at 10:56 pm
RightNow – leave him in his comfort zone!
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:16 pm
I admit Redbaiter, the Freeper discussion is definitely more rational than I thought it would be. Still there is just a little more evidence supporting Obama’s case.
For once (regarding FreeRepublic) I’m eating humble pie – for now.
August 3rd, 2009 at 11:45 pm
“For once (regarding FreeRepublic) I’m eating humble pie – for now.”
Thank you for that gracious concession. Such dignity is rare on Kiwiblog.
August 4th, 2009 at 12:04 am
elvis lives, the moon
landing was faked, and barack’s
a kenyan eh red?
August 4th, 2009 at 12:17 am
Copyright lobby was mouthing off on one news. Apparently they think the proposed copyright legislation is too weak, and want two educational notices then an immediate termination of an internet account for the third infringement of supposed copyright violation.
They are also upset with a 90 day enforcement time. Apparently they’d rather have people kicked off the internet fast than have due process done.
They also have the movie rental crowd onboard, who are convinced that internet piracy is damaging their industry (as opposed to, say, overpricing of the rentals and a flawed business model). Personally I find the movie rental group’s involvement slightly ironic, considering they were, for a while, a good source for pirates: pay $5 to rent and rip a dvd vs $30 to buy. Indeed if a pirate wanted a full DVD iso rather than a recompressed rip (at lower quality with all the extras removed), they’d still find it cheaper to pay the $5 to rent than the $9.60 to download 8GB over NZ home broadband prices (based on the ~$1.2/GB at telstraclear for 10GB blocks).
According to nationmaster NZ actually ranks very low in terms of video/software piracy, probably due to our crappy internet speed. As such I dont see why we should be introducing a more draconian set of sanctions for piracy than any other western country. Indeed were I in government I’d chuck the whole thing on the backburner and focus on something important like improving our productivity.
August 4th, 2009 at 12:41 am
Orly Tiatz, Lawyer, Dentist and real estate agent. WTF, sounds more like a professional document forger!
August 4th, 2009 at 6:35 am
“To engage the birther fantasists is futile; to dismiss them, reckless”
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/aug/02/obama-birthers-us-presidency
However marginal they appear now, they were effectively running the US between 2000 and 2008. It was their birther logic (an oxymoron if ever there was one) that provided the mindset, legwork and frontline troops for the Bush era. Iraq was invaded because it could not prove that it did not have something it truly did not have. “We would say, ‘Iraq should present any anthrax’,” explained UN weapons inspector Hans Blix shortly after the invasion. “While the US and UK were inclined to say, ‘Iraq should present the anthrax.’” Guantánamo Bay is still full of people who were incarcerated because they were not able to prove they were not guilty and whose guilt was to some extent inferred by their incarceration.
The birthers’ claims might be crazy. But so was Whitewater, which ended with Clinton’s impeachment, and the Swift Boat saga helped torpedo John Kerry’s presidential campaign.
It’s not just this pathetic birth certificate crusade that is the problem. It is the method employed. Led by people who think they have a god given right to be lying, deceitful, destructive, to force their own way. So many contradictions in how they live, and in what they say. They keep accusing others of doing what they do themselves.
I don’t want to see this sort of crap get legs in NZ.
August 4th, 2009 at 6:44 am
Karl Rove: The Kenyan ‘Birth Certificate’ Is ‘Likely a Forgery’
“Several of the lawyers and activists who are following or pushing this story have grown irritated with Taitz’s incompetence and wild antics. This might be a breaking point.”
http://washingtonindependent.com/53547/karl-rove-the-kenyan-birth-certificate-is-likely-a-forgery
August 4th, 2009 at 7:59 am
“I don’t want to see this sort of crap get legs in NZ.”
Too late!
http://imperatorfish.blogspot.com/2009/08/mr-key-what-are-you-hiding.html
August 4th, 2009 at 8:29 am
Ha, yeah, just like that. Except that some have serious intentions, albeit fraudulent.
August 4th, 2009 at 12:31 pm
@ Cerium
Karl Rove said that? Hell, that’s pretty much like Charlie Manson saying we should calm down a bit.
August 4th, 2009 at 12:45 pm
See over in Aussie they have busted some Somali (Australians) who were planning suicide attacks. Will be our turn soon enough. Militant Islam declared war on the West, not just the USA and a few European countries, and the last time I looked women here were allowed to walk around uncovered so I suspect we are included in “the West”.