Tackling Labour MPs on Field
Shaun Wallis commented yesterday:
I had a long debate with Phil Goff last night about this particular matter when he came to speak at my Hall of Residence.
Good on Shaun for raising the issue. I urge everyone who meets a Labour MP to do the same. Think of it as tough love – the aim is to get them to abandon their no comment policy. A party which had one of its MPs (and Minister at the time) found guilty of corruption should not be allowed to escape without any comment on whether they agree he was guilty, whether they condemn what he did, and whether they regret defending him.
He feels that he did not know enough about the situation at the time (bollocks in my opinion)
Now this is bollocks. The Ingram Report laid out Field’s conduct in massive detail. If a Labour MP claims they did not know enough at the time, ask themif they read the Ingram Report, and if not why not. If they did read it, then ask them how could they approve of a strategy to defend Field and praise him as a hard working MP, after reading the Ingram Report.
and then he later stated after many questions from me [i.e. there is a massive difference between accepting a decision and approving of a decision, and why hasn't Labour stated that they approve of the High Court decision], and his response (again him not getting to the point) is that at the time, they did not think Taito had done anything hugely wrong.
Well this is interesting. Phil Goff presumably read the Ingram Report, and didn’t think it disclosed Field had done anything wrong.
Now I read that report carefully. I blogged a list of 44 damning facts revealed by Ingram.
And even putting aside the illegal stuff, Phil Goff is saying that at the time he did not think having immigrants work on properties for around $2 an hour was “hugely wrong”. Let’s remember that when Labour call for the minimum wage to go up.
So we now know that Phil Goff didn’t think Taito had done anything wrong despite the Ingram Report. This explains why they won’t apologise for defending him. It does still leave the question as to whether or not Labour now agrees that Field did anything wrong. Not a single Labour MP has said on the record they think Field was corrupt, let alone they are ashamed of what he did
BTW: The students that he spoke to last night in our hall were not overly impressed by him.
Not even 4.6% of them?
October 20th, 2009 at 3:11 pm
Phil Goff is saying that at the time he did not think having immigrants work on properties for around $2 an hour was “hugely wrong”. Let’s remember that when Labour call for the minimum wage to go up.
I haven’t followed this that closely, but might that be because the work was a ‘gift’ – the gift being doing it on the cheap..?
No one flame me, TPF = bad.
October 20th, 2009 at 3:14 pm
Dead horse, feel the wrath of my flogging-stick…
October 20th, 2009 at 3:20 pm
Can we all stop calling him “Taito”? That’s like calling a person with a knighthood “sir” after they’ve gone to jail for corruption. It’s an honoury title and doesn’t belong on a dishonourable person.
October 20th, 2009 at 3:30 pm
David
You are being so polite and decent here I want to Kotch, but instead will buy you a drink at the next Wellington Bloggers night or if I’m in Auckland at the next Auckland one I’ll shout you there for being so thoroughly decent.
Phil Goff like the rest of the Labour caucus is Lying.
The man (Phillip Field) had no audit trail (of receipts or agreements to work) and they all knew it because it was a system of favours.
That in itself is ok for the hoi poloi like us but for a politician in a democracy it is not on. No discussion, no debate, Never.
The fact that they have not said as much publicly as individuals or as a party says they aren’t competent to judge issues of character.
October 20th, 2009 at 3:30 pm
Obviously the whole thing is deeply embarrassing. So by hunkering down they hope the thing will simply go away. But I think the Labour Party owes the public an explanation. Would they tolerate such behavior AGAIN in a Minister. It seems they would, that is the obvious conclusion.
October 20th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
RRM, this is not a dead horse, and is even less a beltway issue. Field’s behaviour goes to the very heart of our Westminster system. In my view the fact that he got some tiling done on the sly by someone he was helping through immigration is the very least of his sins. He (presumably) convinced the PM to establish an inquiry the predetermined the outcome. He then lied to that inquiry. He coerced (or tried to coerce) others into lying to police. He invented invoices and other material evidence. He is the first sitting Minister to ever be imprisoned for corruption in New Zealand. Field remains a dark stain on a Labour regime that is very stained without him. The fact that none of his former colleagues will condemn him, or their party’s continued support for him following the release of the Ingram report, or will even agree with the decision of the Court that his behaviour was corrupt, remains a dark stain on the entire party.
Trevor Mallard, you’re about the bravest of the Liarbore caucus. At least, the only one willing to venture into “enemy territory” to put Liarbore’s position on issues. Where are you on this one? Why has nobody from your party said they agree with the decision of the Court? Why has nobody from your party explained why, after reading the Ingram report, your corrupt former leaders continued to support Field?
Punchy?? Paging Punchy The Duck??
October 20th, 2009 at 3:38 pm
If my memory serves me right GOFF along with O’Connor was one of a select few that Taito hosted at his house while the Thai Tiler was working on it.
October 20th, 2009 at 3:46 pm
Alistair
You are wasting your time, this is an issue of character and they have none, or else they would have spoken before now including Trevor Mallard and especially Phil Goff their leader.
The EFB alone should hold up this issue all to see as that was a collective decision made by the entire cabinet.
October 20th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
I hear twice as many students were impressed by Helen Clark, and she wasn’t even there.
October 20th, 2009 at 3:51 pm
Backster, your memory is correct on that fact, as a search of Hansard will attest to.
October 20th, 2009 at 4:01 pm
Alistair Millar 3.35 , BIG BRAVE DRAGON SLAYER trev the wus declined to come to KB yesterday on this subject, in spite of having at least two bites at the preceeding post, so he wont front here. So much safer at the red blert where he can control the delete/ban buttons, and drop names to give his ego a boost. The people of our democracy deserve much much more from the party who still don’t think they should have been sat on their arse by the ungrateful voters. Disconnect? HeHeHe.
October 20th, 2009 at 4:22 pm
What Labour MP’s think or what Labour MP’s don’t say about Field is irrelevant, and frankly, those Nat’s who keep pushing this are nothing more than cheer leaders, Field is old news, even our MSM have lost interest in this story.
Rehashing the Field saga is nothing more than a weak attempt to take the spotlight off what has been a disastrous couple of weeks for the Government, read same for the constant and boring jibes about Goff’s pathetic poll ratings.
Nobody outside of the “beltway” (fuck I hate that term) or political junkies give a flying fuck about Field or the poll ratings.
I know this may be a new concept for the cheer leaders but how about turning your attention to your local National MP, how about keeping the pressure on Key and English to deliver what they promised and how about reminding your local National party MP that they cannot rely on your vote, also remind them that you will no longer be taken for granted by Neville Key and the rest of the socialists National Party.
[DPF: You really act well retarded at times. Seriously. You think corruption does not matter. You also blathe ron about how this is some distraction for the Government, when they're fucking 33% ahead. And are you so blind you didn't even read my multiple posts last week lashing the Government on half a dozen different issues.
More bluntly stop fucking whining about what I choose as topics. And stop suggesting what my motivation is as you are talking shit. If you don't like my choice of topics, then go blog your own]
October 20th, 2009 at 4:39 pm
Can we just agree to say “Wellington” instead of “Beltway”? That term really gives me the shits.
October 20th, 2009 at 5:49 pm
the real hypocrisy is that Labour are still going on about English (and Key re houses in Wgtn .. a recent inclusion on RednotsoAlert) even though he/they did nothing illegal .. big Phil is a crook (I love that term, Richard Nixon once used it I think) and has been convicted as such. Labour are doing the Helen Clark specialty which is to stonewall and wait for the issue to die down. They are doing the reverse with English by raising the issue every few weeks.
They should front up, take it on the chin and move on BUT oh no .. is there something stopping them that is just waiting to bite them on the arse?
October 20th, 2009 at 6:46 pm
But RRM, how can the horse be dead when Labour swears black and blue there’s nothing wrong with it ? It would be accepted as dead if they would come out and say “the horse became lame and started running crookedly so it was put down.” But they’re insisting the horse is alive and well and in fne form, so it’s natural for people to to be a bit perplexed and want to poke a stick at the bloated and rather pungent corpse…
Maybe they ought to just say a few words and bury it ? The smell is overpowering.
October 20th, 2009 at 6:54 pm
I may be incorrect but there could be a very good reason why Liarbore are keeping their heads below the parapets. Over the course of Field’s various court appearances there was a lot of talk about Liarbore skeletons in closets and when was Field going to sing like a canary. If I was a Liarbore minister I to would be very cautious about criticizing Field, there could be few ministers still sweating and if Field decides the bastards are dissing him there will be retribution. At the moment Field is taking the the rap but if his old mates start putting the boot in, well…………, there could be trouble.
October 20th, 2009 at 7:31 pm
BTW: If trying to get an answer out of him regarding Taito was bad enough, you should have heard him go around the point when Lauren Brazier asked him about his stance on VSM. Neither a yes or no. My thoughts – his heart says pro-VSM [since he was pro-choice/freedom in the 80s with Roger], but his party says otherwise.
October 20th, 2009 at 8:43 pm
DPF
Of course corruption matters, where the fuck did I say that it did not?, my point (which you seem to have missed in your juvenile and tantrum like reply) was that it is old news and news that those of us who live in the real world have long ago filed away under “Yawn”
The comments I made were not directly aimed at you but if I have inadvertently struck a raw nerve then so be it, I don’t give a fuck really, and, if you want to get into personal abuse then so be it, I had thought you were a bit smarter than that but I guess I got that wrong.
As for your “lashing” of the government, please!, who are you trying to kid?, from what I have read you offer mild criticism at best, to suggest it is anything other than mild is being economic with the truth.
It may come as a surprise to you David but some of us do not read every single word you write, some topics are of no interest, so if I have missed a genuine “lashing” of the government then I genuinely apologise, however, as I said, I suspect it was nothing more than a mild ticking off, certainly your criticism of this government does not match or even come close to the way you went after the previous lot.
So there you go, take it or leave it, as I said, I really don’t give a fuck.
[DPF: I am sick of you lying about me all the time. Most fo all I am fucked off you keep attack my sincerity and motives. You are like a right wing equivalent of The Standard.
In the last week I criticised the Govt over the Immigration Act (I think the Government is making a mistake by not conceding the law (passed by its predecessor) needs changing., Capital Gains Tax (While Key has not ruled it out entirely, I think it is unhelpful he has been so dismissive of the possibility, while the tax working group does its stuff.), Peter Ellis (Words can’t express how gutted I am that Simon Power has declined a Commission of Inquiry into the Peter Ellis case), RWC (My God, the Rugby World Cup free to air rights issue is a mess, to put it kindly. A fiasco maybe.), Melissa Lee (From a political management point of view, this should have been sorted out within weeks, not months, of the issue being raised.), asset sales (What a shame that the British Labour Party will sensibly sell some assets that are better in private hands, and the NZ National Party will not do the same.), ACC changes (Less forgivable is the failure to have the numbers for the law changes, before you announce them. This is MMP Politics 101.), and league tables (A couple of months ago Anne Tolley was the champion of transparency and the media right’s to compare school assessment records. Then this week she announces a deal with the unions where she will work to make it as difficult as possible for the media to publish league tables.).
So I've criticised or attacked Government policy, management or decisions in eight different areas. Yet you still wank on about how I am a cheerleader.
Let me make this really clear for you for I do not intend to have this discussion again. I give my honest opinion on all issues. Of course I fucking agree with the Govt more than I disagree with it. There would be something very very wrong if I did not. And of course I whack at Labour more. Who the fucks thinks I won't. But I will never ever praise something I do not believe deserves praise, and I do and will continue to constantly criticise the things I disagree with.
In fact, with the likely exception of Whale, I would suggest my ratio of criticising MPs in my own party to agreeing with them, is greater than almost any other political blog in NZ. ]
October 20th, 2009 at 9:02 pm
“If you don’t like my choice of topics, then go blog your own”
David – this nancy boy blouse is a wacko. You are one strange gutless wimp blouse. Where is your blog blouse?
When we having a meeting blouse?
October 20th, 2009 at 9:53 pm
Looks like BB on Kiwiblog is about as well informed as the one on Frogblog.
October 21st, 2009 at 10:55 am
For BB anything else but grovelling sycophantry at the feet of Douglas is akin to treason.