One thing that occured to me about the flag on the bridge is that it seems to show a great concern with status. Early Maori culture was very status oriented, I remember from anthropology that body-adornment, such as tatoos, were all about status and status hierarchy, as I recall status in Maori society was fixed based on birthright, exept for status earned in warfare.

Perhaps this is why some Maori sometimes say they were better off before “colonialism”. To most non-Maori this seems bizarre, all the food, medicine, technology, all that invalable knowledge from around the world.

But there is one respect in which they have not clearly benefited, status. Maori culture is given huge respect, from the state and perhaps even a majority of non-Maori most of the time, but almost all statisitics in crime, education, wealth send a different message, they appear to fair unfavorably in all these hierachies, they are no longer unquestionably number one, especially those from the upper casts have arguably lost their place.

The other problem is most non-Maori are fairly egalitarian when it comes to status, disliking overt, proud, displays of status, even for wealth earned from hard work or great contribution to society.

If this is part of the issue I don’t have an answer although a little tolerance, recgnition and acceptance of differences and patience on both sides would probably be a good start.

I see the Maori Party as a Cargo Cult, an attempt to get all the white-mans stuff while making the white man go away (or today, all non-Maori go away, or become subordinate).

I don’t think they are really interested in Maori Culture in any serious sense of the word, language for instance is superficial, (which language is used makes no difference at all to how a civilisation is run, any language can express anything any other language can express), conspicuous, usually aggressive, rituals and tatoos for instance are also utterly superficial compared to technology, exhange systems and introduced food or medicine compared with pre-Eurpean equivalents.

I see the Maori Party and their flag as attempts to get as much of the fruits of hard-working New Zealanders as possible with as little effort as possible, no surprise they’re getting along with a PM with a history in the stock-exchange, I suspect with that background he wants do do exactly the same but is a hell of a lot more stealthy about it (I don’t know, it just seems likely).

I don’t feel I’m insulting Maori race or culture, I think the Maori Party are by using it as a con for greedy and lazy ends.

If only they’d had the internet. They could have the fought the war by anonymous abuse. Brave indeed.

You are the one who works assiduously to destroy what they fought for, as an undercover coward.

My maternal grandfather was shot in the chest in France.

My paternal grandfather:
The 3rd Company were no less assiduous in their efforts, nor less steadfast in maintaining a high standard of efficiency and cool bearing. 2nd-Lieutenant E. W. George was particularly prominent in the operations at Pont a Pierres and won the Military Cross.

An uncle died in Italy in 1945, another uncle was traumatised serving in the navy age 16, my father served in Italy and was in J-Force.

I doubt any of them thought “what a cool flag, I’ll go and risk my blood for that”.

Does it then follow, the New Zealanders of all extractions lying in Passchendaele and Gallipoli mean so little to you?

I’m pretty sure those fine men created our National Identity. And The Flag you appear to have so little respect for was brought by the blood of those men, regardless of weather or not one thinks we should have been there those men will never come home and to throw away The Flag they died for is a massive affront to their memory.

The fact is, this flag represents one race of people, not all New Zealanders. Just like the Maori party – named after a race of people, that represents them only. I thought Key was better than this. First he dismisses the views of most of NZ on smacking laws, and now he does this. All he is doing is giving them further incentive to perpetuate the grievance industry, which is a shame. We should expect better.

How do you know anything about how things are in my world? For all you know I could be in a Mainlanders Advocating Division group.

Mr. Key does not do anything at all. In every case, he is told what to do by his ministers and minders, including the Maori Party, since his fabled decision powers have deserted him completely.

By the way, Neville Key will disappear soon on his way to the “Earth-saving” meeting in Copenhagen. He’s a bloody hardworker.

Pete George — I could not disagree more. But look in your world everything is okay, there is no need to worry, Maori separatists are relatively short lived and there is no threat at all that one day this could become a movement to divide New Zealand into 2 countries.

Linda Munn, the last surviving member of the trio who designed the flag recalled last month, it was meant to be about Maori empowerment, “not walking around with a big chip on your shoulder”.

The red and black banner with its white koru represented renewal and hope. Its co-opting by separatists was relatively shortlived.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10615773&pnum=0

Its a bit like the British government flying the Scottish Independence flag on the Bucking ham’s palace and on other British government buildings – imagine the outcry across Britain if this was endorsed?

The sovereignty of New Zealand is in affiliation with Great Britain as a colony and clearly flying an illegitimate flag on our government buildings will send the wrong message to Britain and possibly cause offense – especially now that the Prince has announced an upcoming royal visit…

Is this the kind of message we want to convey to his excellency?

- That even though New Zealand is not an independent republic we see no harm in endorsing an unrecognized sovereignty on our government buildings? Maori might be the natives of this land but are they the owners of our sovereignty as declared in treaty?

You see the treaty can work both ways and I do not recall a clause in the treaty accepting “partial sovereignty to all Maori” – or in this case 80percent.

This may be “just a flag” for some people but for others it is a step in the wrong direction for this nation of diversity and it is in defiance of the Treaty and of the True Sovereignty of New Zealand.

Shame on the government!

Brilliant, LOL!

St George’s cross has links to the crusades and slaying of dragons.
St Andrew is said to have been martyred on such a cross (as on the Scottish flag).
St Patrick’s Cross is controversial and is not even universally accepted in Ireland.
At least the Southern Cross doesn’t have religious connections, but one out of four ain’t good.
Welsh heritage is not represented – this doesn’t bother me because I don’t feel any Welshness, it is just an historical curiosity.
The republic of Ireland is also not represented, nor are the many other countries that have provided immigrants to NZ.

What if the English decide they want “their” country back?

Meeting between John Key and Pita Sharples….

PS: “John, I want the Government to legislate so that every white mother****er has to engage in bestiality and pay for every oppressed Mordi to have a round the World trip”

JK: “ummmm, gosh Pita that – ”

PS: “John, if you don’t do it I will scream like a wounded bull at how racist the National party honky’s are”

JK: “Oh Pita, don’t do that; okay I will pass the law ASAP making it compulsory for White people to engage in bestiality and pay for Maoris to have overseas holidays; and I will get my pratboy Farrar to give an enthusiastic endorsement of it on his blog”

PS: “cheers bro”

[moral of the story - 1. Grow some balls 2. Ask the question "where will it end?" ]

http://www.nightcitytrader.blogspot.com

What good can come of this? Do we want the nation divided into two countries?