A thoughtful post
January 18th, 2010 at 1:52 pm by David FarrarJordan Carter has a thoughtful post on what Labour must do to win the next election. Some extracts:
We lost in 2008 for reasons I have canvassed before – people thought we were focused on issues that weren’t important to them; we’d been in office for a long time; there was a recession; people had fallen out of love with our political style; some of our policies were not working out or were unpopular; and failures of political management added on top of this combustible pushed us over the edge.
That’s what we did wrong. The Nats also did things right: they really did move to the centre, and they selected a leader who people like. Actually, they *really* like him – for the time being anyway.
Jordan seems to be one of the few in Labour not in denial about Key.
That’s policy, in some areas, but it is also in the politics or statecraft of the party. For better or worse, the fifth Labour government was a baby boomer government. The political methods of the 70s and 80s were those which ran it: it was tightly managed and focused.
I get the sense though that people are looking now for something a little different. Some in Labour look at Key’s hands off approach and see a weakness. I see a strength. The rise of ICT, the end of “deference” towards authority, and growing generations of people who are as comfortable online as offline mean that a political party that is centralised and top down cannot really capture the public imagination.
These are wise words for National, as well as Labour.
What Labour must do is turn itself inside out. As we say “this is what we are hearing, what do you think?”, we also have to invite people in to join with us and help shape what we are doing next. We have to use the best technology there is to do it, as well as the traditional means of face to face and direct mail politics. We need to be the party that people see as grassroots based, and where they know that if they want to raise an issue or a concern, it will filter through to what our policy is and what our politicians are saying and thinking.
We have to do this if we are to be relevant, and if we want to win there is nothing more important than being relevant.
National in 2002 was not relevant. Labour in 2010 are not relevant. The challenge for Labour is can they become relevant by the end of 2011?
Tags: Jordan Carter, Labour
January 18th, 2010 at 2:07 pm
Good post.
No chance Labour will adapt by 2012. They are teachers and unionists after all. takes forever for them to change.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:09 pm
Labour will remain irrelevant until they boot out all of the Clark era MP’s.
Mallard, Dyson, and co serve as nothing more than a reminder of what the public voted against.
Labour can and will become relevant in a hurry if they promote the likes of Kelvin Davis, until then they will remain on the opposition benches for the foreseeable future.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:18 pm
“Some in Labour look at Key’s hands off approach and see a weakness.”
The election will be a boxing match between Labour Lite and Labour, the neo-socialists against the old-school socialists.
On the blue corner, we’ll have empty-suit Key, famous for dancing around the ring without throwing any punches while grinning all the time. On the red corner, we’ll have Filler Goff, whose left arm has a reach of 20 centimeters and doesn’t hurt a butterfly.
With either of these hopeless candidates New Zealand will be the loser by K.O. in the first round.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:19 pm
>For better or worse, the fifth Labour government was a baby boomer government. The political methods of the 70s and 80s were those which ran it: it was tightly managed and focused.
I laughed every time Clark or another Labour MP mentioned the 1981 Springbok tour or the 1984 nuclear ships policy. They were just like elderly relatives banging on about the good old days when they had to walk 10 miles each way to school, couldn’t afford shoes, but it didn’t matter because of the spirit of the Blitz.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:27 pm
If enough of them (many more than one) understand and want to become relevant by then they can. Some are trying but they are fighting against their own bubble.
And if they do become sufficiently relevant by the end of next year it will still be difficult for them to peg back National’s lead enough.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:29 pm
I think they should bring back Helen Clark as leader and Michael Cullen as deputy.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:31 pm
A/ The answers is Facebook according to the lemmings at RedAlert.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:54 pm
Excellent analysis
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 2:55 pm
I don’t know if I agree, if Helen Clark could rule for 9 years, anything is a possibility . There are more stupid people out there than he realises.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 3:05 pm
Jordan did forget to mention that many people were sick of the ‘attitude’ of Labour. That is, anything goes as long as it keeps us in power. He appears still to be in denial as to the role of perceived ‘character’ and ‘moral fibre’ in the true sense. (Nothing to do with Christianity but everything to do with decency and honesty.)
NZ Labour were the most dishonest and indecent government I can remembers since 1965 – here and in Australia.
Check it out here:
http://nominister.blogspot.com/2010/01/lest-we-forget.html
or just ask John Tamihere.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 3:09 pm
They need to do an attitudinal about face, plus get some new faces, then Facebook may work – a little.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 3:16 pm
The phrase re leopards and spots springs to mind.
Vote:I have known the NZLP structure for a long time, and the fundamentals have remained the same for the 35 odd years of my knowledge.
January 18th, 2010 at 3:55 pm
Labour seems to have a least one supporter who’s both capable of analysis and actually recording what he sees.
David P noted “I laughed every time Clark or another Labour MP mentioned the 1981 Springbok tour or the 1984 nuclear ships policy”- but left out the number of times Clark used to sneer at Ruth Richardson’s “mother of all budgets” that was directly caused and resulted from Labour’s excesses and inefficiencies between ’84-90 in which she’d been a participant. Funnily enough, Clark never seemed to see the irony of her doing so.
Funny too, how so many Labour MPs suffer identical problems with conveniently faulty memories. But maybe not – if one looks at the absence of intellect in those they supposedly represent.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 4:32 pm
Good post from Jordan But what he like so many leave out is that good governance is all about good ethics and good morals.
the best definition I have is “What I must do” The majority will define the standards Those who seek to govern successfully need to not only meet those standards but exceed them.
JK is yet to be tested to any degree so the jury is out IMHO.
Clark Cullen et al failed the ethics and morals test time and again and it was only that they had enough citizens with their standards to support them that they survived.
Of as regards the baby boomer generation and the increasing voters from gen X and Y it will be interesting to see how the ethical and moral standards change and whether Labour ot National are able to reflect the majority.
The winner will be the one that can.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 4:49 pm
I suspect a majority of GenX aren’t interested in a policy of wealth redistribution and have grown up learning that you’ll need to look after yourself, trusting no politician too far. I’m one of them.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 4:59 pm
bevanjs So do I suspect that you may be one of those who will tell the baby boomers who havent provided for their retirement and covered themselves for medicare to Foxtrot Oscar when they demand the Gumint raises taxes on Gen X and Y.
It will be interesting to see who this intergenerational conflict plays out over the next couple of decades. Pity the Gen X and Y pollies who are going to be caught in the cross fire
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 6:30 pm
relevant, Labour is about as relevant as a half chewen minty!
In saying that, it is scarier the fact that so many people supported a party that was not at all relevant…..
Labour = National + National = Labour (they are more or less joined at the hip in policy it seems)
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 6:33 pm
Two Nationals equal one Labour, so one National equals half a Labour?
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 7:20 pm
As a longtime Labour supporter, and even employee at one stage, I finally lost it with the Party when they decided to legislate to allow men to marry men and to turn our immigration ‘system’ into a farce (even without the nutty woman running the show who let all her rellies in). Oh, that and turning the univesities into businesses and allowing anybody to attend, providing they can pay the fees.
Vote:NZ started to feel to me like another planet.
So there’s three issues for them to re-consider before I”ll go anywhere near voting Labour again.
January 18th, 2010 at 7:54 pm
The Labour Party are constantly trying to redefine themselves. They have finally reduced themselves as a party that simply wants power and provide well paid jobs for careerists. They defend their various sacred cows, they treat the taxpayer with contempt, they simply do not recognise the science of economics. It is all about gimmie gimmie gimmie to various people who are on the lookout to get something for nothing. I despise them.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 8:16 pm
Carter will be a nobody in Labour until the old ones go. Anyone who challenges posts at Rednotsoalert get deleted or banned. They are targeting the younger generation through things like their blogging and facebook but they are an empty rudderless vessel at present. What do they stand for other than increase benefits, increase state servants pay, screw the taxpayer on the ETS/Carbon Trading fiasco, become a republic, dump all work on the so called super city etc etc.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 8:29 pm
“We do have strengths though. People generally get the message that we ran the economy well, that health and education got better, that we ran a foreign affairs policy people can be proud of, and that we had a capable government that was doing its best for the people.”
Really Mr Carter?
“We ran the economy well…”
The state sector expanded massively under Labour, the trade deficit ballooned to unprecedented levels, the high NZ dollar hammered exporters, high inflation, people gorged themselves on debt, New Zealand dropped from 20th to 22nd on the OCED wealth index and the NZ economy went into recession before the rest of the world.
“..Health..”
Massive increase in public health spending but tiny improvement in service.
Example
1999-$6.1 billion on Health
2005 $9.7 billion on Health
A 57% increase in state spending.
Results:
2000-2001 number of operations: 269,000
2003-2004 number of operations: 272,000
A 1.3% improvement. Actual need however for operations probably went up due to population increase which means Labours spending had even more inefficient and wasteful.
“..and education got better…”
In 2005 in an ERO annual report it was estimated 1 in 5 kids were not succeeding at school. More than half of Maori boys failed to achieve even NCEA level 1. The re-introduction of school zoning ghettoized kids into an underclass if they found themselves living in the wrong suburb.
University and polytechnic student debt increased to never before seen levels as interest free loans encouraged irresponsible borrowing and meaningless taxpayer funded courses appeared such as the scandalous Cool I.T rip off.
“..we ran a foreign policy people can be proud of..”
The NZ ‘Cullen’ Super Fund invested in hotels and cell phone towers in Burma and in overseas corporations involved with Nuclear weapons production, Labour sent a foreign minister to pay a visit and exchange gifts with the North Korean Regime and our relations with Australia and the U.S reached all time lows.
“..we had a capable government that was doing its best for the people.”
The Owen Glenn affair, tolerating the rampant corruption of Winston Peters, the suppression of free speech by the Electoral Finance Act, shunting the smacking referendum till after the election costing the taxpayer millions, out of control spending on junkets, Paintergate, Doongate, Speedgate, Corngate, corruption in the immigration service, the pledge card scandal and of course lets not forget: Taito Philip Field.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 9:42 pm
Richard Hurst
I agree, Jordan starts off well, looks like he has had a good hard look in the mirror but really he is just churning out low grade spin where he appears to be reflective but ultimately is still just seeing an oil painting through rose coloured glasses thinking it is his own parties image.
Lefties can’t survive without propaganda. Their ideology is a failure and they simply refuse to see it, or let others see it, for what it is.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 9:55 pm
Burt,
To their credit, at least the last last lot had an ideology. The current bunch seem bereft of one.
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 10:17 pm
Oh the hypocrisy of the so called educated right wingers.
Vote:Was there one of you who arrived at university stating I want to pay the full fees that overseas students pay ?
Nope, not one, no surprise in that.
One thing I notice about generation X and Y is the mindset by so many of them that they are owed at age eighteen, what the fuck does NZ owe you at that age ?
Christ, what a bunch of whining children too many are.
January 18th, 2010 at 10:23 pm
Richard – fantastic succinct post….. A sad sad decade for NZ, and it will take many many decades to get things back on an even keel….. Has Teflon John Key got the capability?
Vote:January 18th, 2010 at 11:28 pm
grumpyoldhori
They are all lefties at uni, terribly unpopular to be paying for stuff your parents already paid for when you are playing the poor student role. Everyone hates the rich prick uni students who don’t need to work, whose parents pay for a swanky apartment and provide them with a car. The cloak comes off when they need to cut it in the real world, or they stay indoctrinated forever and become a student union representative and eventually come to rest in the Labour party.
Vote:January 19th, 2010 at 7:43 am
‘people thought we were focused on issues that weren’t important to them’
Even if we ALL don’t realize it we should ALL be sooooo fuckin’ happy we have gay marriage thanks to labour. It’s soooo important to ALL of us.
(sarcasm off)
Vote:January 19th, 2010 at 9:26 am
It would be an easy call for Labour to return to their core values.
However Helen Clark’s Government not only veered away from those, they repudiated them, ripped up the fabric they were written on and kicked them so far from the field of play that it is almost impossible for them to retrieve without wholesale retirement of those associated with the “glory days” of the Clark regime.
So we now see a “party”, bereft of ideas, searching vainly and perhaps wistfully for something that will resonate with the voters. Doesn’t really matter what it is, the party will adopt, adapt and offer a cocktail mish-mash of populist (but meaningless) blatherings to the public along with an apparent but not real lurch back to the centre where their advisors have been telling them time and time again, the votes lie.
IMHO, the voting public will see that for what it is and will even further turn their backs on this sad and sorry bunch of losers whose time has gone.
The great thing is that we can thank Helen Clark, Margaret Wilson and Michael Cullen for leading this development and creating the climate where their legacy cannot easily be erased or denied.
Vote:January 19th, 2010 at 10:14 am
Pork barrel politics by Labour has seriously damaged the economy. Trevor Mallard seems to be promising more of the same with his $15 minimum wage. The swinging voters are not stupid. Such a policy will appeal to the far left but also keep Labour in opposition.
Vote: