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January 7, 2010 9:16am by David Farrar

General Debate 7 January 2009

Whoops a database error saw the previous one subsumed by the employment law post.

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General Debate

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General Debate 7 January 2009
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Comments (72)

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Angus

Andrew Breitbart launches “Big Journalism”.

http://bigjournalism.com/
http://biggovernment.com/
http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/
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January 7, 2010 9:18am
Redbaiter

Republican candidates start the year by opening a nine-point lead over Democrats, the GOP’s biggest in several years, in the latest edition of the Generic Congressional Ballot.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/mood_of_america/generic_congressional_ballot

The new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey shows that 44% would vote for their district’s Republican congressional candidate while 35% would opt for his or her Democratic opponent.

While the Republican lead has reached a new high, it should be noted that support for GOP candidates rose just one point over the past week, while support for Democrats dropped four points to its lowest level in years.

In addition, the number of Americans identifying themselves as Democrats fell to the lowest level recorded in more than seven years of tracking.
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January 7, 2010 9:31am
Redbaiter

Yep, Kudos to Mr. Breitbart.

The left wing political agents that make up the mainstream media and daily bring us socialist propaganda disguised as objective comment can go fuck themselves.
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January 7, 2010 9:34am
Redbaiter

Repost from munted GD thread-

Chart showing how the left have incrementally crippled the US economy-

http://static.businessinsider.com/~~/f?id=4b43aad900000000006afad2
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January 7, 2010 9:39am
Elijah Lineberry

The ACT party has long claimed to be against ‘privilege’ and ‘subsidies’ whilst being in favour of ‘choice’ and ‘freedom’.

Can one of the ACT chappies therefore explain to me why, with regards to these Scholarships so grubby poor people can attend Private Schools, the policy seeks to:

1. Make one group of people ‘privileged’ …(as an example of being against privilege?!?!)
2. Achieve this by subsidising them …(as an example of being against subsidies?!??!)
3. Make it compulsory for everyone else to pay for it through their taxes ….(as an example of ‘freedom’ and ‘choice’?!?!?)

I feel the word “duh!” coming on….

(P.S I know that all ACT MPs read Kiwiblog every day so you will notice that not one of them will respond to this post and basically admit to lying hypocrisy; presumably they will claim not to have read it) 😉

http://www.nightcitytrader.blogspot.com
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January 7, 2010 9:42am
Pete George

Repost from subsumed GD thread – chart showing how everyone is crippling the US economy.
http://static.businessinsider.com/~~/f?id=4b43aad900000000006afad2
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January 7, 2010 9:43am
Murray

Whos got form?

http://barbadosfreepress.wordpress.com/2007/03/20/earthrace-collision-at-sea-one-presumed-dead/

Ady Gil got form!
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January 7, 2010 9:44am
CharlieBrown

Elijah… The ACT party is about freedom to choose. Which the idea of subsidising the student rather than the school achieves.
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January 7, 2010 9:47am
MyNameIsJack

Redbaiter (8336) Says:

January 7th, 2010 at 9:34 am
Yep, Kudos to Mr. Breitbart.

The left wing political agents that make up the mainstream media and daily bring us socialist propaganda disguised as objective comment can go fuck themselves.

I find it hard to “fuck myself” when i am laughing so hard at your preferred candidates, their idiotic ideas and the stupid belief that Sarah Palin can ever be anything other than a no brain, no ticker, serial quitter.

A young American’s view of Palin

The stupidity of a palin supporter
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January 7, 2010 9:50am
Redbaiter

Sigh.

MNIJ demonstrtates one again the left’s obsessive fear of the lady from Alaska.

Take your paranoia to the Standard you boring fuckwit.
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January 7, 2010 9:53am
peterwn

I just thought of the best way that the cops, Crown Law and the judges can ‘fix’ Whaleoil. The judge should haul the lawyers for both sides into chambers, find out how much time is needed for a defended hearing and set a date. The judge can then remand him at large until then – no more status etc hearings. Each hearing merely plays into Whale’s hands publicity-wise and avoiding hearings would starve him of publicity oxygen.
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January 7, 2010 9:53am
wreck1080

Yesterday, Niwa shouted across our news that the last 10 years were the warmest ever.

Unfortunately for Niwa, the real story is now emerging. We find out, that it was only hotter by a few hundreths of a degree. In fact, given margins of errors it is quite possible that temperatures actually decreased a little.

Further, extrapolate this out to 100 years time, then it would indicate that temperatures would only be 0.3c higher than today.

Thanks Niwa, you’ve given me something to laugh about today. Losers.
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January 7, 2010 9:57am
MyNameIsJack

Redbaiter (8339) Says:

January 7th, 2010 at 9:53 am
Sigh.

MNIJ demonstrtates one again the left’s obsessive fear of the lady from Alaska.

bullshit, you knuckle dragging, layabout thieving scum. How can anyone “fear” such an idiot and the dweebs who have hitched themselves to her fading star.

Isn’t it about time you got off the dole, found yourself a job and saved the taxpayer some $$?
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January 7, 2010 10:00am
Murray

Given that NIWA have altered the raw data it is certain that we have had cooling wreck.
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January 7, 2010 10:02am
Murray

“bullshit, you knuckle dragging, layabout thieving scum.”

Ah the icy grip of left wing logic has us all trapped in its web of reason once more.
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January 7, 2010 10:03am
Redbaiter

” Thanks Niwa, you’ve given me something to laugh about today. Losers.”

A scientific research body so politically compromised should not be government funded.

Cut their funding and sack these self serving alarmist pseudo scientists.
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January 7, 2010 10:04am
Manolo

NewsTalkzb reports “Climate change and China likely to be on the agenda when Hillary Clinton meets with PM John Key during visit to NZ next week.”

China I can understand, but climate change? Will these two talk about the dismal Copenhagen conference and its inability to agree on anything? Will the empty-suit Key try to convince Hillary to pass leading-edge, pioneering legislation such as our economy-destroying ETS?

Why is this Prime Minister hellbent on climate change while far more important matters require his government’s attention, e.g., welfare and tax reforms?
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January 7, 2010 10:15am
Redbaiter

” Why is our PM hellbent on climate change while far more import matters require his government’s attention,”

Because he’s a complete fucking drongo.
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January 7, 2010 10:18am
Murray

Disagree Red, I don’t think hes a complete drongo, I think hes missing a few sandwiches in the picnic barsket and is therefore an incomplete drongo who thinks we’re all for sending our money to the Russians so we can feel good about achieing nothing while sitting on 10,000 years worth of coal.
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January 7, 2010 10:25am
side show bob

Yeah NIWA, what a pack of hired goons, a hundred of a degree difference and these sad arse pricks are betting on the end of the world. I would have hoped that with the demise of the evil, lying, self serving socialist bastards two years ago things might have made a change for the better, no such fucking luck. I suspect the pricks are embarrassed that they backed the wrong horse and were pipped at the post, thus they continue with the fast. Meanwhile the brain dead twits that now beat the drum of AGW are nowhere to be seen or heard. Yeah Shonkey we have your number mate, you and your hairy arse mates are no better then the throwbacks you replaced. Dump the EFS, you claim to be for business and growth but you speak with forked tongue. One can only draw the conclusion that the government has an agenda to sell its country to higher powers that couldn’t give a flying fuck about climate change, it’s about money and power, traitor bastards.
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January 7, 2010 10:50am
starboard

Why is this Prime Minister hellbent on climate change while far more important matters require his government’s attention, e.g., welfare and tax reforms?

welfare and tax too hard basket…balls are too small to tackle welfare…stand aside JK let someone with larger sacks take on and deal to the bludgers…its what we want and you aint doin pal.
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January 7, 2010 10:59am
minto57

Talking about the weather not going to fix it.
Its the the enviroment.
Just been up Mt Eden where you can see where the slackers have left rubbish for others to appreciate
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January 7, 2010 10:59am
MikeNZ

Starboard
You may be right but I think we should have a NZdebtclock.org.nz like the US one so we can hold their feet to the fire properly.
That with DPF’s idea of having all expenses over $1,000 (local and central Govt) on the web for the old ladies to look at would give us, the people the power to not get screwed as we are.
That and binding referendums with a canton system might be the best way to go.

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

Anyone here know how to do this and can?
Betcha there will be few takers in Parliament for it.
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January 7, 2010 11:20am
MikeNZ

Elijah
We’ve gone through this before.
People who send their kids to private schools already pay more tax than the average taxpayer, each kids fee is probably more than the average taxpayer pays in tax ($12,000) and some people send all their kids whereas some send only those that either benefit or that they can afford too.

Also many parents work two jobs to send their kids to private schools, these are ordinary people not high plyers or Govt ministers!
This is because they rightly or wrongly don’t want their kids to be politically indoctrinated instead of getting a good education.
They want their kids to succeed in life and not on the backs of others like the left do.

More importantly, they pay more tax, tax they get NO BENEFIT from!
If anything against their will they are subsidising the indoctrination of thousands of Kiwi kids!

Not only that they are actually SAVING all the other taxpayers money 🙂
Including all the beneficiaries (that includes the benefit for the middle class WFF) because they are paying for their kids education at private schools.

1. It would be fine if the state funding was per bum on seat and went wherever the kid went.
believe me if this was the system many many more people would send their kids to private schools as they would use the state funding as a subsidy once it were explained to them.
2. They were able to claim their kids education off of taxable income.

Duh!
What is worse is they are screwed over twice and you don’t see anything wrong with that.
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January 7, 2010 11:35am
MikeNZ

I posted this at 8am about Khameni’s riches, this the supreme ruler of IRAN.
http://homylafayette.blogspot.com/2010/01/makhmalbaf-secrets-of-khameneis-life.html

This while average Iranians are having a hard time.
Just another Oligarchy feeding at the trough only claiming religious protection as a Mullah.
maybe every country should have a Debtclock so everyone can know what their money is doing.
http://www.usdebtclock.org

I like Archbishop Cranmer’s little suitcase of his personal debt run up by the UK Govt.
http://archbishop-cranmer.blogspot.com/

Elijah don’t you think of all the parties, ACT would set this up if they were in power!
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January 7, 2010 11:49am
Grizz

Minto has just been arrested, again.
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January 7, 2010 11:51am
MikeNZ

good
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January 7, 2010 11:55am
Pete George

Republican candidates start the year by opening a nine-point lead over Democrats, the GOP’s biggest in several years, in the latest edition of the Generic Congressional Ballot.

It’s only a question of how much the Dems will lose. After gains in the last couple of election cycles they are sure to lose ground due to anti-incumbent syndrome and also disillusionment with Obama. If the economy and unemployment improve and healthcare fades from voter importance they may be able to limit the losses to acceptable (to them) levels.

The GOP have a prime opportunity to recover from their past losses – their biggest obstacle will be disunity, and how successful the hard righties are at promoting candidates that may not be strong attractions to independent voters.

There could be a lot of least worst voting.
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January 7, 2010 12:11pm
Bok2

We have seen the data manipulation and other underhand methods employed by the proponents of AGW.
Even the IPCC now admit that the trend has lately been a cooling one.
But let us accept for the sake of this argument that AGW is real and that CO2 is to blame ( just for the sake of the argument!)

The stupidity of Key and others who support a ETS is beyond understanding, even if you are going to accept AGW.

Taxing as a preventative measure does not work as a rule. Look at smoking. And drinking for that matter.
The numbers of smokers decreased not because of tax (Percentage wise the big taxes went on in the eighties and nineties for smokes) but because of inconvenience. (Not allowed to smoke inside, on planes, in clubs etc.)

The second point is that China is able to manufacture at a smidgen of the price any-one else can (so can India) the reason, numbers.
A friend of mine who is in the construction business was taken around by a welding supply company in China. The cutting of the rods were done by people in their homes. Minimal pay. In his opinion the Germans and the Yanks just could not even bring their cost down to 6 times that of the Chinese. So let’s say that you get the chinese and Indians to buy into the ETS world wide. And let’s say it doubles their costs. Increases it by a 100% (I am purposely using extremes here to demonstrate the stupidity) And lets say that that then increases the sale price by 200% ( say a 10cent rod now costs 20 cents to make and they sell it for 45cents) they are still only at three quarters of what it costs others to MAKE the rod. And that is before those have to apply their ETS effects.

The difference now is that ETS would mean that the NZ, US and German manufacturers also have to increase costs and prices to account for the ETS. And that means the only point of distinction, quality, becomes less important. The builder and welder will still buy as many rods, he will just settle for the cheaper and sometimes inferior Chinese one. (Not because all Chinese goods are inferior, but the cheap goods are.)

This means a number of other things will happen.

Quality of products will go down
Employment (manufacturing) will be lost to China and India.
Emissions will go up (less spent on cleaner products by the cheaper manufacturer)

And the Billions taken out of the consumer’s pocket will just go into a scheme of trading. No positive end result.

Now if every country taxed emissions and that money was strictly funneled into research and development of emission reduction (if you even believe that it was needed) you could make a case for the tax.

However it is not. World heroes like Mgabe, Amedinejad and Shavez spoke to tumultuous applause at Copenhagen. It was agreed that they (and the rest of the third world ) will need to be financially rewarded. No one knows what for, or to do what. Just that they need loads of cash for Climate change. Not one sane person in this world believes that any penny going to Zimbabwe would end up anywhere else than in Switserland in the account of Mr Mgabe. And would he be the only one?

I have been abused by our host and kicked out for challenging him on this but I really would just like some-one to explain even the slightest bit of logic behind this madness. Just one little bit and I will go okay.
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January 7, 2010 12:20pm
MikeNZ

Go Sarah Palin for 2012
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January 7, 2010 12:21pm
Pete George

I really would just like some-one to explain even the slightest bit of logic

The logic is simple. If you increase costs locally more manufacturing will move offshore, but you have already filled the gap left in local business with the new ETS market.

We could also increase trading in futures and derivatives and we could become a veritable market economy.

It would also help if we could get our marketers to create a convincing campaign that bathing in milk powder (costs less to ship than liquid form) was anti aging, anti wrinkling, anti fattening and anti bacterial and also helped get you onto reality TV. It’s important to go with the trends. Getting Sarah Palin to endorse it may be risky though.
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January 7, 2010 12:36pm
Grizz

“Go Sarah Palin for 2012”

Mike, which one of your two heads is doing the thinking here?
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January 7, 2010 12:44pm
MikeNZ

both left and right brain.
I work on the principle of if it isn’t good for the left and the UN then it is good for me and you.

Go Sarah Palin for 2012.
Screw the Democrats.
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January 7, 2010 12:51pm
minto57

ETS has nothing to do with the weather it is about funny money and way it is biased, so we will all be losers. Key and his mates need to take notice as to what is happening across the Tasman with Tony Abbott
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January 7, 2010 12:53pm
Pete George

Review revue?

For Obama, a former president of the Harvard Law Review, the response to the Under-bomber has been a veritable Review Revue. His instinct when facing all types of problems — Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, the Fort Hood shootings, the pending Gitmo closing — has led him to the same approach: Order a review.

After eight years of seat-of-the-pants leadership, calm reflection and reasoned action has much to recommend it; if Dick Cheney were president today, we might already have invaded Iran to punish al-Qaeda for training the accused Nigerian bomber in Yemen.
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January 7, 2010 1:27pm
edhunter

Climate change & global warming has nothing to do with CO2 emissions & everything to do baby emissions, there are 5.5 billion more of us than there was 150yrs ago, thats 6.7b as opposed to 1.2b & we keep increasing this by 75million a year thats the population of Germany or Egypt the 14th & 15th most populous nations on this still beautiful planet.
Of course there are going to be changes, deforestation, pollution & the need to feed all those mouths would put a strain on any environment. The ETS is akin to trying to apply a sticking plaster to an amputated limb, a waste of time.
Which is why I dont understand how Environmentalists & Humanatarians can make such good bedmates on the one hand they want us to hug a tree & then on the other save a child, that’s like having your cake & eating it too. You can either save the Planet or save Starving Marvin you can’t do both.
But then the left has never made much sense to me.
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January 7, 2010 1:42pm
Rufus

Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. – Winston Churchill
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January 7, 2010 1:52pm
Redbaiter

Academics should never be permitted within a light year of the reigns of power. Always architects of disaster.
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January 7, 2010 1:55pm
Murray

“Whoops a database error saw the previous one subsumed by the employment law post.”

Hang on… this is bloody geekspeak for the dog ate my homework Farrar!
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January 7, 2010 2:03pm
MikeNZ

does our David make mistakes?
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January 7, 2010 2:25pm
Captain Neurotic

Can somebody please tell me what has happend to Philu? Whilst I don’t miss his comments, I have noticed he has been missing for about a month now…
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January 7, 2010 2:36pm
MikeNZ

hooray
Now to add MNIJ/Zapper/Billy
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January 7, 2010 2:48pm
Pete George

Phil was on a demerit initiated holiday, unstated for how long, I presume that’s while he is still absent.

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2009/12/a_fun_night.html#comment-642203
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January 7, 2010 3:01pm
Manolo

“Can somebody please tell me what has happend to Philu?”

I regret to inform you Whoar died peacefully in his sleep (induced by copious quantities of dope and assisted by a meagre vegan diet), so he’s no longer with us. Nah, just kidding.

The bludger must be enjoying Her Majesty’s hospitality (i.e., behind bars) somewhere.
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January 7, 2010 3:04pm
MikeNZ

Maybe he’s at the Tennis?
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January 7, 2010 3:08pm
tautokai.baxter

Its 2010 btw.
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January 7, 2010 3:18pm
southtop

Reply to Bok2 @ 12.20.
Having recently returned from China I know exactly what you are getting at, the production capability is amazing.
With regards to the ETS, the only explanation that I have heard is the following:
The majority of our dairy product is made into milk powder.
The main purchaser of milk powder is the UN
The UN also controls the main proponent of this farce; the IPCC therefore
unless lil NZ is seen to be doing something our milk powder sales plummet and further economic disaster awaits.

Now how much weight (whey) this conspirancy theory should carry is anyone’s guess however I have not heard another reason why supposedly ‘intelligent’ individuals such as Key, Smith etc would sign up for an ETS when the science is anything but settled.
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January 7, 2010 3:30pm
Pete George

Its 2010 btw.

Maybe Phil is locked out until Kiwiblog advances to 2010.

..if you are missing him..
..can always see..what he is up to..
..on his own blog..
..www.whoar.co.nz
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January 7, 2010 3:31pm
MyNameIsJack

HEY JOHN KEY-

Where’s the outcome of the jobs summit? How many jobs saved again?

Where’s my fucking cycleway?

Why am I being forced to pay for 5 times MORE Herceptin than is medically necessary?

When are you going to go after those at the top of the P Money train? Or are they all your mates?

Nice to see you walk away from your roots and not give a banker’s cuss for your old school.

When will you stop making policy by the front page of the Dom Post and begin some long term planning for national growth?

Why is Gerry Brownlee?

Can you understand the benefits of splitting the ownership of waitaki power stations? The engineers can’t.

When will you stand up to the thugs in the maori Separatist Party?

When will you stand for your principles? What are they, by the way, I never hearb you enunciate them?

Maybe you should heed the words of Paul Kelly.

Little boy you look so clear around the eyes
And what they’ve got in store for you
you may not realise
So be careful when you hear the voices call
Watch out little boy don’t lose your balls

‘Cause you never know the rules until you play
First they stroke you then they screw you,
try to take your balls away
And once they’ve gone they’re way beyond recall
Watch out little boy don’t lose your balls

Balls run wild
Balls may get way out of line
You may not even know you’ve
left your balls way behind

You know money only buys you what you want
And you can’t buy your balls back
like you buy a pair of pants
And once they’re gone you’ve really got fuck all
Watch out little boy don’t lose your balls
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January 7, 2010 3:35pm
Bok2

@Southtop
Thank you for the explanation however it does not explain why any-one would think that an ETS would be beneficial to the enviroment. It explains that you have a gutless government that is held to ransom and blackmailed. Surely Key coming out and saying “you know, this is a crock, but our hands are tied” would have been more honest.

The thing is I just don’t buy into the theory that NZ is that important to the rest of the world. Australia said no, now France, Denmark and Holland have said no. Surely those countries would be far better to be made an example of.

Key has publicly stated that he was impressed by Gore and utterly convinced by an inconvenient truth. The answer I think lies right there.
I voted before I left NZ and I gave my vote to the Nats. What a waste. At least Helen was being blatant about being a crook. This guy….
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January 7, 2010 3:41pm
hj

Global warmings not happening. There’s a chap looking at the darwin data and it’s all wrong (and this is just the beginning!).
The eco system revolves around the Chamber of Commerce and the baptist Church!
Twenty -nine thumbs up!
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January 7, 2010 3:42pm
Grizz

Mike,

I am not a Democrat or anything close. However, I think Palin was found to have too many deficiencies in the last election to be presidential material. I think you like her because she gives you a hard on. If this is true, go to the video store and rent yourself a DVD.
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January 7, 2010 3:49pm
hj

“Scientists have known about the greenhouse effect since 1824, when Joseph Fourier calculated that the Earth would be much colder if it had no atmosphere. This greenhouse effect is what keeps the Earth’s climate livable. Without it, the Earth’s surface would be an average of about 60 degrees Fahrenheit cooler. In 1895, the Swedish chemist Svante Arrhenius discovered that humans could enhance the greenhouse effect by making carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas. He kicked off 100 years of climate research that has given us a sophisticated understanding of global warming.”
http://environment.nationalgeographic.com/environment/global-warming/gw-overview.html
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January 7, 2010 3:54pm
Ross Miller

mynameisjack and I am a looser. You spent all of last year bemoaning Labour being found out and now you turn your invective against John Key … Gueez it must really piss you off that more than 50% of Kiwis prefer him and his Party over all others.

And I know it must be hard for you that unemplyment is now projected to come in at 20,000 less than forecast. Might it just be that Government had something to do with that?

And congrats to you for following the dictate of Trevor Mallard that all Labour Party Parliamentary staffers should post on kiwiblog under pseudonyms.
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January 7, 2010 3:59pm
Captain Neurotic

Cheers guys – No thanks Pete I’m enjoying the holiday away from him!
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January 7, 2010 4:06pm
jaba

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, just watched Mintos arrest .. good job BUT if prosecuted it will be a $250 fine plus costs.
hey Ross .. the labour supporters hate JK because he slurrs his words (NZ accent too strong) and think he got his $ illegally. I pointed out that if they had proof then front up .. guess what .. no-one fronted up, Williams tried and failed ,.. sigh.
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January 7, 2010 4:09pm
side show bob

MNIJ, you sure it shouldn’t be my name is Jacky : “Why am I being forced to pay 5 times More Herceptin then is medically necessary ??????

Southtop not sure if the UN buys our milk powder but if they are the highest bidder they can have it. A lot of milk powder is now sold on world wide auction, highest bidder wins. I really don’t think your conspiracy holds sway. I suspect the government backs an EFS because they can see money to be made. Shonkey is a “suit” and he hangs out with Queen street “suits’, any chance of making a dollar without breaking a sweet would get the big tick from this lot. Shonkey after all was very keen to see Fonterra floating on the NZX, this isn’t because of his deep love for us farmers more for the deep love of money that can be made through shuffling bits of paper. The EFS would involve lotsssssss of paper shuffling but when it’s all said and done it’s our pockets the cash will be coming out of.
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January 7, 2010 4:21pm
Pete George

No matter what the cause, this sort of change could be much more of a problem than a few points overall.

Scientists have uncovered what appears to be a further dramatic increase in the leakage of methane gas that is seeping from the Arctic seabed.

The findings come from measurements of carbon fluxes around the north of Russia, led by Igor Semiletov from the University of Alaska at Fairbanks.
“Methane release from the East Siberian Shelf is underway and it looks stronger than it was supposed [to be],” he said.

Methane seepage recorded last summer was already the highest ever measured in the Arctic Ocean.

According to a report by the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (Noaa), the springtime air temperature across the region in the period 2000-2007 was an average of 4C higher than during 1970-1999.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8437703.stm
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January 7, 2010 4:42pm
Elijah Lineberry

Mike NZ: 11:35am

Do not misunderstand me, Mike, I am all in favour of Private Schools; indeed I attended one myself and enjoyed it (even if it was rather regimented, and staffed by sadists and paedophiles).

What I am opposed to is the ACT party compulsorily taxing people in order to send other people’s children to Private Schools.

If these scholarships are such a good idea then vast numbers of willing donors would voluntary chip in to provide the funding.

Ironically (as a Private School advocate) I am on the side of Private School opponents who object to their taxes being used to pay fees of other people’s children.

The thing which frustrates and confuses me about the ACT party, Mike, is you chaps have a number of good ideas (private health/education/superannuation etc) but then say “oh, this is such a good idea we will make it compulsory”

http://www.nightcitytrader.blogspot.com
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January 7, 2010 4:49pm
Southern Raider

Just saw on 3 News an article about a Bhutan family who have had to move out of a Housing Corp flat because of the neighbours who’s kids have been urinating on the lawn, throwing pet food at the kids and general bullying.

The skanky neighbour (wearing gang colours and tats up her neck) said her children are only small so what could they do and at any rate the Bhutan didn’t deserve a Housing Corp house when there are born and bred New Zealanders like her waiting for one.

Not sure about you but my vote is to keep the Bhutan family in NZ and send this piece of trash to Bhutan as a swap.
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January 7, 2010 7:19pm
tristanb

Just saw the same thing. Don’t you love New Zealand culture? And that scum with the neck tattoo, she was absolutely disgusting.

http://www.3news.co.nz/Refugees-driven-from-their-new-home-by-neighbours/tabid/423/articleID/136459/Default.aspx

Dole bludging arseholes harassing refugees (who looked like decent people). Housing NZ won’t do anything – they should kick out the trash.
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January 7, 2010 7:22pm
grumpyoldhori

Grizz whoops you have upset a few Palin supporters on here.
Some believe she has the intellectual fire power and the standard of education that Thatcher holds.
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January 7, 2010 8:48pm
jaba

Palin as Pres??? sorry people, the thought of wanting the shag the Pres of the USA really sounds weird.
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January 7, 2010 8:57pm
MikeNZ

This is what investors in US are saying to their people.
http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAnalysis/Article.aspx?id=517128
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January 7, 2010 10:03pm
Fletch

Re: NIWA, they ran the story on Prime news about it last night. They had a guy from NIWA and also Jeanette Fitzsimons from the Greens saying, ‘see, we told you so – it’s the hottest decade on record’.

Pathetic.

If anyone has been checking out The Briefing Room and TGIF magazine, they’ll have read the post about how a scientific magazine in the 1980s basically ran the same story (saying the temp had gone up one degree) and it was poo-pooed by the head of MET Service Jim Hessell (he was debunking a young Salinger even then) –

Now, a study published in the NZ Journal of Science back in 1980 reveals weather stations at the heart of NIWA’s claims of massive warming were shown to be unreliable and untrustworthy by a senior Met Office climate scientist 30 years ago, long before global warming became a politically charged issue.

The story is published in tonight’s TGIF Edition, and has international ramifications.

That’s because the study’s author, former Met Office Auckland director Jim Hessell, found a wide range of problems with Stevenson Screen temperature stations and similar types of unit.

Hessell debunked a claim that New Zealand was showing a 1C warming trend between 1940 and 1980, saying the sites showing the biggest increases were either urbanized and suffering from urban heat island effect, or they were faulty Stevenson Screen installations prone to showing hotter than normal temperatures because of their design and location.

One of the conclusions is that urbanized temperature stations are almost a waste of time in climate study:

“For the purpose of assessing climatic change, a ‘rural’ environment needs to be carefully defined. Climatic temperature trends can only be assessed from rural sites which have suffered no major transformations due to changes in shelter or urbanisation, or from sites for which the records have been made homogenous. Urban environments usually suffer continual modifications due to one cause or another.”

“It is concluded that the warming trends in New Zealand previously claimed, are in doubt and that as has been found in Australia (Tucker 1975) no clear evidence for long term secular warming or cooling in Australasia over the last 50 years [1930-1980] exists as yet.”

Hessell divided weather stations in New Zealand into two classes, “A” and “B”, where A class locations had suffered increasing urbanization or significant site changes, and B class locations had not.

“It can be seen immediately that the average increase in mean temperatures at the A class stations is about five times that of the B class”, the study notes.

Among the studies listed as a contaminated A site is Kelburn, which was at the heart of the NIWA scandal a fortnight ago.

A link to the study can be found in TGIF Edition.

From the story in TGIF Magazine –

“This investigation [has] found that the widely held view that the mean temperature over New Zealand is presently about 1C warmer than in 1940 is very probably erroneous.”
This comment, made in 1980, is highly relevant given Jim Salinger’s ongoing claim in 2009 that weather station records show a 1C increase between 1908 and today. Salinger is the scientist Hessell was debunking back in 1980.
And here’s something else to consider. If temperatures
had risen by 1C by 1980, and NIWA is still claiming a 1C rise to today, then technically that would imply there has been no significant warming since 1980 in New Zealand.

That’s the money quote in bold (boldness added by me).

The entire Hessell report can be downloaded in PDF format.
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January 7, 2010 10:36pm
hj

http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAnalysis/Article.aspx?id=517128

Shouldn’t an article like that be referenced? That way we can read what prop AGW scientists say about it.
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January 7, 2010 10:49pm
hj

Ahhh the global warming thing keeeps unravelling?
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January 7, 2010 10:50pm
Fletch

hj, yep. Every day it seems more facts are coming to light showing real scientific info and how the warmists have been manipulating data for years. It just keeps getting worse for them.

We also learn today that the BBC is doing an investigation into itself over complaints of bias in it’s coverage of climate change and ignoring the other side of the argument.
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January 7, 2010 11:02pm
hj

NIWA’s analysis of measured temperatures uses internationally accepted techniques, including making adjustments for changes such as movement of measurement sites. For example, in Wellington, early temperature measurements were made near sea level, but in 1928 the measurement site was moved from Thorndon (3 metres above sea level) to Kelburn (125 m above sea level). The Kelburn site is on average 0.8°C cooler than Thorndon, because of the extra height above sea level.

Such site differences are significant and must be accounted for when analysing long-term changes in temperature. The Climate Science Coalition has not done this.

NIWA climate scientists have previously explained to members of the Coalition why such corrections must be made. NIWA’s Chief Climate Scientist, Dr David Wratt, says he’s very disappointed that the Coalition continue to ignore such advice and therefore to present misleading analyses.
http://www.niwa.co.nz/news-and-publications/news/all/niwa-confirms-temperature-rise
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January 7, 2010 11:03pm
hj

NZ Study may* hold key to faulty world temp data

A long-forgotten scientific paper on temperature trends in New Zealand may be the smoking gun on temperature manipulation worldwide.

* and it may not? If it’s the big news why doesn’t Ian sit on it until it’s deemed water tight?
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January 7, 2010 11:08pm
Grizz

Grumpy, RE: Upsetting Palin supporters.

I do not care. If I were an American republican, I would be embarassed to have such a bumbling idiot as my leader. Look, living adjacent to the Arse end of Russia and a forgotten Territory of Canada is not a sound basis for foreign policy and not being able to tell when a Sarkosy impersonator is taking the mick during a phone call is not good for appearances. However, she does tickle the wee head below.
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January 7, 2010 11:46pm
Grizz

By the way Grumpy, Thatcher Vs Palin. Think Tua vs Cameron, but all done and dusted way before the first bell.
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January 7, 2010 11:48pm

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