Greens and National
Russel Norman blogs on the MOU with National:
The Green Party’s agreement with the Government took a step forward today – a small, practical and principled step.
The latest news is that we’ve agreed with National on a draft proposal for the regulation of natural health products. Natural health products includes many vitamin and herbal supplements as well as lotions, gels and shampoos.
New Zealanders have a right to know these types of products are safe and it is government’s job to set up and monitor rules to ensure safety. That’s a fairly straightforward idea, but it got complicated under the previous Labour government that wanted to regulate natural health products jointly with Australia.
Our Sue Kedgley has worked persistently on this issue for many years and now we’re that much closer to rules that are better for local businesses and protect consumer. Good stuff.
I think it is a sign of maturity for both the Greens and National, that they can agree to disagree on so many areas, yet agree to work together constructively in a few areas where they do agree.
March 20th, 2010 at 5:09 pm
Yes David. All National has to do now is steal the Greens’ genuine environment policies and leave the commies to rot with less than 5% party vote.
March 20th, 2010 at 5:11 pm
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
March 20th, 2010 at 5:15 pm
Adolf
That’s what Labour tried to do, they just choose the popular environmental policies rather than the genuine ones.
March 20th, 2010 at 5:28 pm
Actually that is what they are supposed to do. What all parties are supposed to do.
Because what people seem to forget is that all of National, Labour, Act, The Greens, Maori party etc are actually in government.
Unfortunately with old idiots like Goff and Mallard, they think they are there to cause as much trouble as possible because they don’t have a majority, when in fact they should be working out how many ways they can work with National, while maintaining their ideological principles
March 20th, 2010 at 5:31 pm
“Unfortunately with old idiots like Goff and Mallard, they think they are there to cause as much trouble as possible because they don’t have a majority, when in fact they should be working out how many ways they can work with National, while maintaining their ideological principles”
Which planet did you say you came from then?
March 20th, 2010 at 5:36 pm
Who gives a toss what the Green’s think?
March 20th, 2010 at 5:38 pm
Will this maturity mainifest itself in sensible decisions such as
1. The outlawing of “homeopathic remedies”?
2. The outlawing of anything that claims to be a “cleanse”, such as Lemon Detox Diets, liver cleansers, etc.?
3. A supervisory regime with real enforcement powers to prosecute the charlatans?
Thought not.
March 20th, 2010 at 6:09 pm
I agree with rouppe, this cooperation should be the starting position with all elected parties.
A point on natural health remedies – an article in the ODT today (can’t see it online):
You can’t get a much more natural remedy than the sun, it costs nothing. Surely a regular safe dose would be better than paying for vitamin supplements. Old people rattle enough as it is with the amount of drugs they are given.
March 20th, 2010 at 6:10 pm
@rouppe, Tiger and Goff are doing a good job. Who are you “rouppe” next Leader of the Opposition?
Let them be, please
March 20th, 2010 at 6:18 pm
@LeftRightOut,
What about the Spleen? Dirty ugly ofal part of the body.
Don’t you just love it when the lefties vent their spleen? Duck now.
Sorry let me know when Tiger co-operates about anything
March 20th, 2010 at 6:21 pm
NANNY STATE!
This will be nothing but grief. They will outlaw perfectly good supplements. bastards. i should start stocking up now.
March 20th, 2010 at 6:26 pm
“You can’t get a much more natural remedy than the sun, it costs nothing. ”
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freik%C3%B6rperkultur
Quite right Pete. That looks like you third from the left I suspect
March 20th, 2010 at 7:06 pm
More rubbish from Key. I was a big fan of his but quite frankly he has no spine at all. He spends his time pandering to the people that never voted for him and never will and you watch the continuing drop in his polling. What has he done so far for the people who elected him, what has he done for the productive sector, what has he done to make capital markets transparent (and punish the crooks), what happened to being a fast follower on the ETS. Lets see, higher interest rates beacause of a hike in ACC levies without cutting entitlements and getting costs under control, higher inflation by .4% because of the ETS, smack people in the head for buying a rental property…..
I could go on but I have no objection to some of his mental pandering to various interest groups but he really needs to start delivering for the bulk of NZers who want the country to get ahead. Governing by the whims of who grabs the biggest headline is pathetic, he needs to take his personal convictions out for a ride and see what he can achieve.
The water cooler majority is dissapointed with him, we will vote accordingly.
March 20th, 2010 at 7:12 pm
But what about your $12 a week tax cut Pongo. Show some gratitude man.
If you ask nicely the Murri may let you go for a swim on their beaches.
Trust Smiling Neville. He knows what he is doing you know!
March 20th, 2010 at 8:02 pm
According to the Press when the Foreshore and seabed Act is repealed DOC is worried about it’s responsibilities re marine mamals etc. The Minister of Conservation is the Crowns representative (and the crown owns the Foreshore and Seabed). It is Green party Policy that Moari should own the Fore shore and seabed as long as it isn’t sold, but the Moari Council has said that this is a violation of tinorangitiratanga.
March 20th, 2010 at 8:09 pm
aye? ban the sun? that sound like a pretty fucked in the head ideah, fucken loony even, rofl.
See the greens aint so bad after all, are they boys and girls, lmao.
banning homeopathic remedies sia fucken stupid ideah, i personally know too many people around the world that have had the world of good out of them. And teh people that want to ban them say that they are just water and nothing, in that case whats teh problem? perhaps they are charlatans?
March 20th, 2010 at 8:22 pm
Political parties agreeing on more new laws, who’d a thought?
March 20th, 2010 at 9:03 pm
From this classical liberal’s perspective, National and the Greens are indistinguishable. Both want to spend ever more of other people’s money, both want more regulation, both lust power, neither believes the individual is in any sense sovereign. Both publicly assign low or zero value to individual liberty. Liberty and freedom are words simply missing from the vocabulary of the politicians of both parties. That the Greens want to regulate pies and raise tariffs a bit higher than National would is neither here nor there.
March 20th, 2010 at 9:54 pm
There are a couple of people here who seem to have a bit of trouble understanding why this law is coming about
While there are a number of “natural health” products that are genuinely useful to people they are currently unregulated but their artifical medicine forms which have been perfected as much as possible are, this means that people who take a natural aspirin have no official knowledge of how much aspirin is in that product being sold, the potential risks and the quantity. There are also many “natural health” products which are of complete uselessness in non psychiatric terms – ie, they are a sugar pill or placebo (that doesn’t taste as nice as a tic tac or M&M :p ) in a natural form such as palm syrups and such which are used for detox etc, then of course there is the almst ridiculous to be allowed to be sold in pharmacy dilution medicines which unlike the idea that small amounts of certain poisons can slowly build you a tolerance to them, this idea effectively dilutes a “toxin” or otherwise to such a level that tap water contains more of that toxin than the vial ( some up to enough Dilution for 1 billion times the mass of earth) in question that is being sold.
I think it’s good the greens are finally going to quit sulking and join the party (heheh) at least to do something, I do wish they’d leave so much at 4.8% (mwhahaha!) but this is a good move forward
If a Natural Health cure is genuine it will continue to be sold, if it is not it will be moved to the confectionery aisle or pulled from the market – it’s not Nanny State, It’s Common Sense – at the present time people could legally et away with saying based on the activities of the Exec of South Africa in this Regard that HIV is cured through eating lemons and then sell it as a Holistic Medicine – It wouldn’t happen though of course- Nzers know enough now
March 20th, 2010 at 10:30 pm
This one isn’t nanny state, I don’t think. As far as I can tell, and I am open to the possibility that I could be wrong, this policy is about correcting the asymmetries of information in the market.
@LeftRightOut, I agree, claims made should be verifiable and verified, so I can accept your point there. But I believe this is potentially a step in the right direction, particularly if they do go against your expectations.
March 21st, 2010 at 12:25 am
rouppe: “Because what people seem to forget is that all of National, Labour, Act, The Greens, Maori party etc are actually in government.”
I agree with your sentiments about cooperating but that sentence above is bollocks mate. Those parties are all in parliament but the only people in government are the ones in cabinet.
And as others say, this isn’t “nanny state” this is informing us as consumers about what we’re buying. Supposed to be that dizzy bint Heather Roy’s job but don’t hold your breath waiting for her to lift a finger for the consumer.
March 21st, 2010 at 8:30 am
I am trying to think if National are neutering the Greenies by helping them – I hope that is the strategy – only a % point or two and the crazies disappear off the political landscape (and leave Labour without any friends)
March 21st, 2010 at 9:27 am
black paul: I see where you’re going with that, though don’t think you’re quite right either.
Cabinet ministers have ministerial portfolio’s for policy areas. I’ll grant you that those in cabinet generally set policy direction though not always as evidenced by Sue Bradley’s s59 repeal.
In any case any law change still requires votes from outside of cabinet to be made law. Therefore it is all the parliamentarians that decide on law change. Perhaps I should have said “all of National, Labour, Act, The Greens, Maori party etc are actually in parliament to govern.”
March 21st, 2010 at 9:28 am
Just like they have neutered the Maori by having so many Maori Nats that everything else gets usurped to their whishes. Maori Party + Maori Nats equals Maori Govt.
Simple weight of numbers.
That’s why a;ll things Maori are tasking precedence over all other happenings. Except for taxing maori Trusts as they should be at 39%
March 21st, 2010 at 9:40 am
MIKMS, it is purely nanny state. The greens and Labour wanted to control the vitamins and pharmaceuticals and have a board with Australians to decide what we can take.. purely political because helen clark wanted roads into the states and this was one way of doing it. An alliance with australia was an alliance with the states and they control all pharmaceuticals sold to australia denying the cheaper pills like the generics and the states have been trying to control the vitamins industry for years heavily lobbied by the pharmaceutical industry to wipe out their competition. That is what King wanted to do while health minister at that time. I have been taking vitamins for years and stop taking the bad ones like Centrum. Plus your going to see the cost of vitamins rise which doesn’t have to happen like electricity and oil because of National’s ETS bill. MIKMS you are only speaking rhetoric and it is nanny state control and power and another mark against National for reasons Pongo mentioned.
March 21st, 2010 at 10:23 am
ANYTHING coming from the greens that includes “New Zealanders have a right to…” and/or “…it is government’s job to…” has a 99% probablity of being some commie state control shit.
As it is.
That national want to play the same game simply deomstrates that they don’t have the sligest clue how they came to be the government. Very few people voted for them, a lot of people voted against socialism.
Get on message or be a one term government.
March 21st, 2010 at 10:32 am
>> Vitamin lack blamed on sunburn fear
>>
>> “Politically correct” attitudes to sunburn mean
>> people now need to be medicated with vitamin D, a
>> district health board was told.”
>> ACC is promoting and paying for rest-home
>> residents to have two years worth of vitamin D
>> supplements.
> You can’t get a much more natural remedy than the
> sun, it costs nothing. Surely a regular safe dose would
> be better than paying for vitamin supplements. Old
> people rattle enough as it is with the amount of drugs
> they are given.
IIRC if an older person has a hip fracture than it’s likely they’ll be dead within 12 months – not from the fracture but from the major disabling effect it has and the ongoing limitations. Vitamin D is really important for keeping bone density high and while younger people can get enough with only a small amount of sun exposure, older people have very low efficiency for generating vit D in that way.
March 21st, 2010 at 10:54 am
Viking2
Yes indeed, the old South Africa would be proud of us having special tax treatment based on race.
March 21st, 2010 at 11:05 am
It only counts when you’re a white mofo burt, you know that. Hell its even racist to mention it.
March 21st, 2010 at 11:18 am
National the sensible party.. that is willing to take on other parties sensible policies.. All the other parties will be left are policies that know one wants.. you can almost sense a landslide win for sensiblity next election.
March 21st, 2010 at 11:23 am
Up until now I hadn’t warmed up to Russell Norman. Maybe it’s at least partly because he isn’t a soundbite politician.
I thought he came across very well on Q+A this morning, on water resources. Well informed, with a reasonable mix of idealism and realism.
March 21st, 2010 at 11:27 am
Not always but generally RKBee, and more than has happened before. If things keep moving in the current direction does that suggest Labour could end up being perpetual purposeless party poopers.
March 21st, 2010 at 11:54 am
How long before the New Zealand National Maori Party join up with the Maori Party. They might as well for they are the one for all intents and purposes.
Bring in the Greens as well and the rest of us squatters will have to leave. Aussie is looking good apart from Crudd.
March 21st, 2010 at 12:02 pm
I’m with dime on this one. What’s going to end up happening is that you’ll have to go to the doctor just to get some vitamin E or something. Everyone talks about the “dangers” of health supplements, but the truth is that more people die each year from drugs prescribed by doctors than from any natural medication. Drug companies don’t want people to have access to natural vitamins that might heal them: they want you to buy their expensive drugs. It’s how they make their living.
In 2006, the acting chair of the Coroner’s Council found a zero percent death rate from natural medicine as opposed to death by prescribed medicine –
As usual, it’ all comes down to being about money rather than the wellbeing of Kiwis.
March 21st, 2010 at 12:09 pm
Despite a diligent search of Coronial records and the literature, no instances have been found to demonstrate that in fact these products have any serious public health issue or risk.
Then the search wasn’t very dilligent at all.
Of course homeoptahic remedies alone don’t kill, they are, after all, just the most expensive water anywhere on Earth,
What DOES kill is when the foolish, the gullible or children are treated with “natural remedies” instead of medecine die of such simple affliction as acne.
March 21st, 2010 at 12:37 pm
What is the Harm of Alternative Medicine?
Lots of harm if you’re being treated by an iridoligist
Yvonne Maine believed she was being treated for a benign cyst but it turned out to be a highly invasive malignant cancer. The skin cancer is so invasive that the Feilding woman’s skull has rotted away.
March 21st, 2010 at 12:42 pm
What is the Harm of Alternative Medicine?
Lots of harm if you’re being treated by an iridoligist
Yvonne Maine believed she was being treated for a benign cyst but it turned out to be a highly invasive malignant cancer. The skin cancer is so invasive that the Feilding woman’s skull has rotted away.
March 21st, 2010 at 2:47 pm
@Fletch: I hope that doesn’t end up being the case. I wouldn’t want them to have to be prescribed through a doctor. What I do want is for claims made to be verifiable and verified.
March 21st, 2010 at 5:21 pm
Viking2 11:54 am ” Aussie is looking good apart from Crudd.”
Untill the Liberals join the Aborigine party.. ah Viking.. then where will you and your followers go.
March 21st, 2010 at 6:54 pm
rouppe:
Yep, I was just being a bit of a dick about the word “government” but I basically agree with everything you wrote. There’s plenty can be done from anywhere in parliament with the will to do it.
March 21st, 2010 at 9:35 pm
black paul
I also agree with rouppe, the problem I see is election time. Then the muppets will revert to type and start campaigning “two tick me” preferring to chance their hand governing alone rather than loosing overall numbers to growing minority parties.