Advice from Keating

June 5th, 2010 at 9:00 am by David Farrar

The Herald reports that once tried to teach how to hate his opponents. He also advised:

Keating also had some tips for Blair on economic issues, telling him that if he ever became prime minister he should avoid income hikes at all costs.

“Tony, promise me you won’t raise income tax. It’s death.

“Labour parties around the world have enough to contend with without hanging that round their necks. It’s not worth it.”

Luckily in NZ, Labour is suggesting they will campaign in 2011 on a policy to increase income tax for rich pricks.

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16 Responses to “Advice from Keating”

  1. Adolf Fiinkensein (2,903 comments) says:

    And thirty percent of New Zealanders are dumb enough to fall for it.

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  2. jcuknz (704 comments) says:

    The skill comes in the balance in detirmining the higher level they should pay becuase they have it more than the “70%” and the level at which they devote considerable time to devising avoidance schemes. As it is they have been given 5% of their money back and charged 2.5% on money spent … surely an incentive to save and invest. [My figures are from memory so I may be a bit out but you get the idea I'm sure. I'm not in that bracket so didn' pay much attention to their details]

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  3. Manolo (13,767 comments) says:

    Just remove the word income and the phrase “John, promise me you won’t raise tax. It’s death.” is even more appealing. Key, should heed this sage advice instead of giving us new more taxes in the form of the dreaded ETS.

    Is the PM blind? Is Nick Smith’s influence on him so potent?

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  4. metcalph (1,430 comments) says:

    I’m not sure why Blair would need that advice considering that Neil Kinnock lost the previous election by explicitly promising to raise taxes. Methinks Keating is either ignorant or bignoting himself.

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  5. RKBee (1,344 comments) says:

    It sounds to me Keating is saying the people don’t like socialist policy’s move to the right.

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  6. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    but do those’rich pricks’ deserve what they earn…?

    or are they just re-packaging widgets..?

    http://whoar.co.nz/2010/you-probably-need-a-raisewe-need-laws-that-help-us-fairly-divide-what-we-produce-as-teams/

    “… Bon Jovi charges $1,875 for a front row seat … and fan Jim Leaman bought a ticket.

    “I have money,” Leaman told The New York Times, “and I don’t care if it costs $100 or $1,000.”

    But is it his money?

    Leaman apparently makes his money from a propane distribution company that he owns.

    Of course, Leaman does not produce propane.

    By himself, he most likely does not produce anything else either.

    Such a company no doubt employs workers who fill the propane bottles, phone operators who take orders, technicians who maintain the equipment, forklift operators who load the bottles on trucks, drivers who distribute them to customers …

    … and a manager who coordinates these activities.

    The bottling and distribution of propane is a team effort … as is the production of almost everything else.

    A bus driver and a bus may deliver 40 passengers … but the driver without the bus would deliver no passengers …

    … and neither would the bus without the driver.

    A surgeon operates on a patient who was prepped for surgery by others; she uses tools that were sterilized and are handed to her by nurses who also operate machines without which the surgery would not have been possible.

    The team that produces a high-rise is bigger still.

    How is the income that a team generates divided among the members?

    In 1776, Adam Smith explained that the factor determining how income is shared is bargaining power, and that this power consists of the ability of each side to hold out for a better deal and to harness the support of the government.

    On both accounts the employers are stronger: …

    …First, they are richer, and, therefore, “in all such disputes, the masters can hold out much longer.”

    But the government also sides with them: …

    …“The masters … never cease to call aloud for the assistance of the civil magistrate …

    … and the rigorous execution of those laws which have been enacted with so much severity against [the unions] of servants, labourers, and journeymen.”

    A third factor that determines bargaining power is, of course, the availability of replacement workers.

    When several workers compete for the same job, and these workers are not protected either by a minimum wage law or a union …

    … masters once again have the upper hand.

    If the owner of a business takes for himself a large enough share of the income of the team that he can afford $1,875 concert tickets without thinking twice …

    … isn’t it fair to ask whether the money is justly his?

    In the latter part of the 19th century … workers raised this very question.

    The government responded with violence:…

    …. Workers were killed and labor leaders hanged—the Haymarket Massacre was one of those events…”

    phil(whoar.co.nz)

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  7. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    and here is obama…blowing yr ‘less taxes for the rich’ bleat…totally out of the water…

    ..and also explaining how you tories scam the rest of us…with yr bullshit tax arguments…

    http://whoar.co.nz/2010/quote-of-the-day-obama-on-republicans/

    …From Barack Obama, explaining the Republican attitude toward governing:

    “…It’s a belief that government has little or no role to play in helping this nation meet our collective challenges.

    It’s an agenda that basically offers two answers to every problem we face: …

    … more tax breaks for the wealthy … and fewer rules for corporations.

    ….As November approaches, leaders in the other party will campaign furiously on the same economic arguments they’ve been making for decades.

    Fortunately, we don’t have to look back too many years to see how their agenda turns out.

    For much of the last 10 years we’ve tried it their way.

    They gave us tax cuts that weren’t paid for … to millionaires who didn’t need them.

    They gutted regulations … and put industry insiders in charge of industry oversight.

    They shortchanged investments in clean energy and education … in research and technology.

    And despite all their current moralizing about the need to curb spending …

    … this is the same crowd who took the record $237 billion surplus that President Clinton left them …

    … and turned it into a record $1.3 trillion deficit…”

    mmm..kay…?

    btw…you do know yr policies/politics of personal-greed/self-interest are so way out of step with where we are heading…

    ..that you are the new-luddites…?

    ..eh..?

    phil(whoar.co.nz)

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  8. Johnboy (16,554 comments) says:

    ““Tony, promise me you won’t raise income tax. It’s death.””

    Sounds like Johnkey was listening in. He’s raised the total taxes and lowered the income tax.

    Now that’s what I call a sharp operator.

    Guess what we still love him.

    That could of course be because we can still visualize his dreadful predecessor.

    Using of course whatever photo shopped image of the ex dear leader we prefer to choose.

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  9. kaya (1,360 comments) says:

    Johnboy – good point. It certainly feels like a case of the former bad being worse than the current bad. Not a great position to be in.

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  10. Johnboy (16,554 comments) says:

    Ah kaya:

    Other than that oracle that is DPF (who of course has NO vested interest) did any of us hardened political observers ever suspect that Johnkeys lot would really be any different than Helengrad.

    It just don’t happen in the Peoples Socialist Republic of Lalaland that is our home (temporary according to Hone).

    We just traded a smiling, big nosed bloke for an ugly, bitter, snaggle-toothed old hag.

    Sit back and think about it and realise what fuck-wits we really are and then rush out and cheer for Johnkey and co.

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  11. Viking2 (11,471 comments) says:

    Well I will put my hand up Johnboy.
    The Nats. have never been any different. They consider themselves born to rule pricks.
    They rarely make change for the National good and they in the past certainly continued Labour Policy and attacked the middle class.
    Voting for the Nats. was voting for the same old same old. And so it has proven so far.
    Same old self interest.

    I was reading this morning about what Rebstock was going to do for beneficiaries etc. Well fuck me Richardson in Drag.
    They are clueless when it comes to cause and effect. These people simply don’t understand people, yopuknow the other buggers that live on this earth.

    Something that pisses me off mightily is the manner in which our young people are treated. Not allowed to control their own destiny nor take on their own responsibilities.
    Its time that the young were represented by stronger advocates. If a person is old they are apparently protected from age discrimination but if one is 15 or 16 that’s not so. Its all sit up shut up and do as you are told. No, you can’t leave school and get a job and no an employer cannot pay you what you need to live and be competitive in the world.

    To my reckoning this is against the Human Rights legislation in this country and hopefully someone with more ability than I will take the Govt. to Task over these issues. Someone smarter than me must be able to take a complaint to the Human Rights Tribunal ,over a persons right to leave school and their right to negotiate a suitable rate for their job.

    That of course wouldn’t give them a right to a benefit and neither it should unless the job fold under them.

    How about it oner of you lawyers. Lets get our young people working again and rejoining our society instead of being disenfranchised and angry.

    Any offers?

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  12. Johnboy (16,554 comments) says:

    I just don’t think we can change it Viking its same old same old. We have been manipulated for years (ever) by Politicians.

    Tell me how the hell can we get rid of state handouts to the shit of society?

    The first honest poli who stands up and says it has just written his retirement letter.

    We are fucked buddy.

    Just go the Groser way…..get pissed…..have fun…..see if you can get some other poor wanker to pay the tab!

    Shit…….maybe the Magpie is smarter than all the rest of us here after all?

    Now that IS a worry.

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  13. Jeremy Harris (319 comments) says:

    @Philu, Adam Smith was saying that when government regulates business it almost always does so for “big business” and monopolies, since they can afford the lobbyists and that the best thing for the little guy is to get government out of business as much as possible…

    I don’t agree that all regulation should be eliminated but what happened in America over the last decade was the looting of the country by the super wealthy (who have forgotten about private charity) via government, it certainly wasn’t capitalism…

    If government has increased remarkably in America since 1950 and the departments and regulations overwhelming favour the wealthy, you think it is a good idea to increase the size of that government and the number of regulation that the top 1% control via lobbying..?

    The answer in America is to get rid of the Fed, get rid of their military empire and start getting back to following their constitution…

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  14. Manolo (13,767 comments) says:

    “maybe the Magpie is smarter than all the rest of us here after all?”
    To call him magpie is an insult to that bird. He’s much closer to a vulture, which lives on carrion, decomposed bodies and refuse.

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  15. jcuknz (704 comments) says:

    The former Bad being worse than the current Bad is surely an improvement? It depends on if you are an optomist or a pesimist.

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