Edwards v Garner

June 28th, 2010 at 4:30 pm by David Farrar

One of the amusing blog fights of recent times has been between Brian Edwards and Duncan Garner regarding an alleged incident between Garner and Chris Carter. Some extracts – first Brian:

But first a little history. It is no secret around Parliament  that, roughly 11 months ago,  Garner and Carter had a verbal stoush in the Auckland Koru Club.  Following the release of the report detailing the 2008 travel expenses of Labour Ministers, Garner had run a story alleging that Carter was a big-spending Minister whose travel could not be justified in what was essentially a domestic portfolio – Education. The story also referred to Carter’s long-time partner and travelling companion, Peter Kaiser, and included the name of the primary school of which Kaiser is principal.

Not surprisingly, there was bad blood between the two men. Carter and Darren Hughes were in the Koru Club waiting for their flight to Wellington to be called when Garner approached them. He is reported as having said, ‘Travelling on the fucking taxpayer again, Chris.’ Carter told him to ‘fuck off!’

Carter had already taken his seat on the plane when Garner, who had boarded later, stopped next to him, jabbed his finger into Carter’s chest and said loudly, ‘I am going to fucking get you, Carter. If it takes me to Christmas I am going to fucking destroy you.’ Sitting directly behind Carter was Dame Margaret Bazley. Appalled by what she had heard, she commented loudly, ‘What a disgraceful man. You don’t have to put up with rubbish like that on a plane, Mr Carter.’ Garner moved on down the plane. …

‘If I am wrong, I invite to respond to this blog and,  providing nothing in it is defamatory, I undertake to publish that response unedited.

‘If I’m right, TV3 should be considering whether their Political Editor is fit to hold the job.’

Duncan responded on the blog:

I have never denied there was an incident between myself and Chris, indeed I told everyone about it at the time because I was shocked that Chris would call me by a four letter word – that your version of this story doesn’t reflect.

So Carter called Garner a c**t first? Might be some other four letter word.

Unfortunately your version of it is very, very wrong and you do yourself no favours.

You have relied on the word of Chris Carter and even Phil Goff can’t rely on that.

Yes Darren Hughes was there and he will confirm what happened if people wish to approach him.

Darren may even wish to write on this site?

But why rely on my word? Surely the Chief Whip, Mr Hughes will launch a defence of the incident for Mr Carter. Or will he?

I bet he doesn’t. Because Carter behaved disgracefully in the Koru Club that evening and provoked the incident.

So far Darren has (wisely) not said anything.

I will consider posting the full version on the 3News website tomorrow. I certainly won’t do it here to satisfy former broadcaster and Labour Party raffle ticket seller .

Oh I hope he does.

Brian then responded:

Duncan, the post you complain of, was headed ‘Incident on an Air New Zealand Flight’. What the post was about is your allegedly having said to Carter, ‘‘I am going to fucking get you, Carter. If it takes me to Christmas I am going to fucking destroy you.’ If I were in your shoes, I would consider this the more damaging allegation made about you. Yet not only is there no denial of this event in your reply to me, it is not even mentioned. I would consider that admission by omission. If in fact Carter ‘behaved disgracefully’ to you in the Koru Club before the flight, then you may well feel that what you are alleged to have said to him on the plane was understandable. But it is no less unacceptable from the political editor of a major television network.

To which Duncan responds:

I ’swear’ I did not say to Chris; “I am going to fucking get you, if it takes me to Christmas I am going to destroy you.”

And I certainly did not touch Carter – that’s not my style. If I touched Carter why doesn’t he lay an assault charge? Because it simply did not happen.

Brian you have taken the Carter version and you have taken it hook line and sinker. It is wrong. Simple.

As I have always said there was an exchange. I was first to talk about it. Carter never said anything about it for months.

It’s Carter who is now running to you almost a year later still trying to make excuses for his behaviour.

As I have said Darren Hughes was there – he saw it – he may wish to put his version on the website. But I totally refute and reject your version.

Then joins the fray:

I have the privelege of producing Duncan on “the Nation”. I have questioned him about your allegations. I am satisfied they are substantially wrong. I thought his reportage of Chris Carter’s indulgent travel was excellent. I can testify that both Duncan and “The Nation” continue to have excellent relations with the Labour caucus. I think Duncan did journalism proud with his journalistic pursuit of Mr Carter.

However I would not expect Duncan to get any credit on this blog which seems to have a vendetta against him — and any programme he is associated with.

Brian responds to Duncan:

We now have a ‘conflict of evidence’. You claim you did not use these words to Carter; I have approached Carter and asked him whether he stands by his version of events on the plane. He says that he does. I wasn’t there, but I do know for certain that what you said to Carter on the plane was overheard and that it was extremely unpleasant.

Brian also responds to Harman:

Absolute rubbish. Your defence of a colleague is admirable, but I suggest you read all the posts on Garner. If, having done so, you decide that he was not engaging in a personal campaign againt Carter, your judgement is less than I would have expected from you. In my review of your first edition of The Nation, where I thought Garner did a particularly poor interview with Steven Joyce, you will also find this sentence: ‘I have grown to respect Duncan Garner’s down-to-earth, no-nonsense analysis of politics. His interviewing improved significantly in later programmes. Judy thought he was very good. I don’t think this amounts to a vendetta.

joins in:

Brian ….. I work with Duncan. I can tell you he isn’t a homophobe (the sauna shot was to illustrate Carter’s use of his credit card to pay for a sauna in Berlin). He doesn’t play favourites in his coverage; nor does he use his position in the “Get Carter” way you perceive. He’s certainly a robust character though and I can believe he’d give as good as got in any exchange.

For my 2c, Duncan is not at all partisan. He went after National with the “secret tapes”in 2008 with as much glee as he went after Carter with his excessive travel.

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92 Responses to “Edwards v Garner”

  1. Pete George (23,299 comments) says:

    He went after National with the “secret tapes”in 2008 with as much glee

    I think that highlights the problem – scandal glee seems to be the overriding criteria, it might suit the magazine show but it looks like lightweight shite.

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  2. m@tt (608 comments) says:

    If Garner did in fact have a public exchange of that nature with Carter then he is not fit to be a political journalist. The rest is a side show.

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  3. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    media/poli bitch-fight..!

    cool..!

    phil9whoar.co.nz)

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  4. Sonny Blount (1,847 comments) says:

    It would be a great thing if both of these pinkos disappeared.

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  5. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    ” If Garner did in fact have a public exchange of that nature with Carter then he is not fit to be a political journalist. ”

    What crap. Since when do journalists have any kind of reputation to upkeep?

    Garner is right about one thing. Edwards has always “sold raffle tickets for the left”. He cannot really appoint himself an objective arbitrator in a case like this.

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  6. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    “It would be a great thing if both of these pinkos disappeared.”

    Pinkos?

    Since when has crimson been a shade of pink??

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  7. slightlyrighty (2,499 comments) says:

    Edwards calling Garner partisan?

    really?

    I Mean…….

    REALLY?

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  8. RRM (9,638 comments) says:

    I don’t buy it. Duncan Garner just doesn’t seem like a crude, unprofessional thug. My opinion.

    Bryan Edwards’ “It is no secret around parliament that…” version events; what is its source? It sounds far too dramatic to have come straight out of any horse’s mouth…

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  9. krazykiwi (9,189 comments) says:

    So Carter called Garner a c**t

    Hardly an authority on the subject I should have thought.

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  10. kowtow (7,925 comments) says:

    a pox on the lot of ‘em.

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  11. lastmanstanding (1,240 comments) says:

    Sadly Garner confirms the low level of the MSM in NZ. We lack a media who has any understanding of Governance and the principles there of. This was typified by their totally missing the point over ther Ministerial expenditure matter.

    Rather than analyse and critique the governance non performance they sank to usual tittering over the contents of the expenditure.

    And dont even begin to expect any of them to be able to deal with such principles as conflicts of interest. They fail to see these on a daily basis or attempt to pass them off as a product of the small numbers of people involved in the process.

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  12. Rex Widerstrom (5,327 comments) says:

    I agree with DPF’s summation. When I knew him, Duncan certainly wasn’t partisan at all. Admittedly that was because he was determined to grab the next scoop, claim the next scalp, and boost his own reputation. But hell, I don’t care what a journalist’s motives are as long as they cause him or her to act fairly and not sit there recycling press releases or repeating “Parliamentary sources”. A mixture of those motives and some desire to effect change was what drew me to journalism initially.

    He may well have reached the conclusion Carter was a trougher. He may well have decided that a further investigation might add a scalp. But that’s the very reason I don’t believe he would be stupid enough to issue some sort of public “I’m comin’ to get ya” to the target of his investigation. Not only is he not biased, he doesn’t want to look biased because that would devalue his subsequent investigation and damage his career.

    Sadly, Brian Edwards used to be as ambitious and thus as dogged, with the added attraction of considerable intellect which he brought to his interviews. He was one of my early inspirations, along with Ian Fraser and David Beatson. How he became so enamoured of Labour that the “seller of raffle tickets” jibe is apt, I don’t know.

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  13. MikeNZ (3,234 comments) says:

    Rex Over time with being personal friends with her highness I should think.
    it happens.

    If he were a hostage we’d call it Stockholm Syndrome.
    She and Peter are personable people and have a life outside politics of sorts.

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  14. george (398 comments) says:

    This whole debate is pathetic.
    Politicians and journalists should have profound differences, often.
    This will lead them, as highly-charged individuals, to have a crack at one another when they come across one another in private or semi-private situations.
    Sometimes (shock! horror!) they may even go over the top in these situations, as both the Carter thief and Garner sound like they may have.
    What do we want?
    Journalists and politicians to be back-slapping buddies even when one is a thief and the other has a public persona of being a pretty aggressive and sometimes unpleasant political editor?
    Yes, Carter and Garner would have been better to have just averted their eyes in the Koru Lounge and not talked to one another.
    But this is the real world, and perhaps after a DB and a champagne or two, they had a bit of a go at one another.
    So what?

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  15. Manolo (13,516 comments) says:

    What a surprise! Edwards, Clark’s media spin doctor, assisting Carter another one of her proteges.
    The Sicilian Cosa Nostra pales by comparison.

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  16. davidp (3,557 comments) says:

    I love it! The Left is working itself up in to a red faced frothy mouthed rage because Garner is daring to expose their troughing, rather than falling in to line line and doing as he is told like Edwards would have. And in doing so they’re putting Carter’s story back on to the front page. Do they really think that Garner is going to hold back just because they’re attacking him? Do they really think that people are going to start thinking that Carter is a poor innocent man who was persecuted by a journalist in some personal vendetta? They’ve tried running with the “only because I’m gay” story and it failed. Now they’re working on an even more indept strategy.

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  17. bhudson (4,736 comments) says:

    It would seem to me that Brian Edwards is trying to spin a story to try to salvage something of Carter’s reputation – make him look like the poor victim instead of the lying, thieving, elitist trougher that his Ministerial credit card shows him to be.

    A simple play at deflecting attention away from Carter towards those that are ‘out to get him.’ If he can do enough of this he’ll be able to start asking the question that “perhaps the whole expenses show was manufactured so that Chris’s enemies could get to him”

    The lefties, of curse, will just lap it up.

    A good plan perhaps. Unfortunately two things will undo it:

    1. Too many people have already decided that Carter is a trougher
    2. Carter will put his foot in his mouth (again – e.g. lack of acceptance/contrition.) He can’t help himself. He and Len Brown are cut of the same cloth

    It should provide some amusement as it plays out though

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  18. lilman (920 comments) says:

    Never forget what edwards was like after the election defeat in an interview on tv.
    What a sad, beaten little man he was,the pure hatered in his eyes as he struggled to swallow a massive defeat was unforgetable.
    little Weaner.

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  19. pollywog (1,153 comments) says:

    If i were Garner I’d be going thru Edwards trash to find any credit card statements to really shame him with and questioning his travel habits…PFFFFT

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  20. Michaels (1,318 comments) says:

    With a passion I can’t stand Edwards, however Garner is right down there with him. I think Garner is exactly the same as what I called that other leftie tosser Soper last election that managed to get me a little ban from here. (oh and mentioned above)

    In saying that, just maybe Garner is on the mend and earning enough money to see who really is looking after him.

    AND IT AIN’T LABOUR!!!

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  21. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    The media are mostly a pack of useless left wingers, but I would take Garner’s word over Carter’s any day. At least Garner, (if you leave aside the fact that he is a mainstream media journalist), still has some degree of personal credibility. What fool would believe anything Carter says, not only after his troughing, but also when he promises a scoop to two news outlets at once and sees nothing wrong with it?

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  22. expat (4,048 comments) says:

    Interesting that “The Edwards Tapes” are coming out after a) Carter has had his troughing ass kicked b) Carter has gone crying to Helen.

    If you were cynical you’d say that Helens old media adviser Brian has taken on the ugly duckling Carter to try and shore up his position in Te Atatu.

    Good luck to you Brian, Carter has proved to be a fucking liability time and time again.

    NB: Oh fuck I agree with Redbaiter, pass the whiskey.

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  23. Fletch (6,142 comments) says:

    2. Carter will put his foot in his mouth (again

    :)

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  24. philu (13,393 comments) says:

    “..little Weaner.”(sic)

    heh…!

    phil(whoar.co.nz)

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  25. dad4justice (7,967 comments) says:

    “Carter will put his foot in his mouth”

    Has Carter got the dreaded foot and mouth disease or the mad bull disease?
    Have another bong phool and do try not to rob the Chemistshop this year.

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  26. big bruv (13,552 comments) says:

    Does anybody else get the feeling that Brian Edwards is doing this on the orders of somebody else?

    Somebody who is a ‘close personal friend’ of Carter and Edwards, somebody who does not want to see Carter out of the house because that person still has plans about how they want to see NZ run, could it also be that the same person needs people in the Labour party who remain loyal and whose vote and support they can rely on when the next stage of their plan is ready to be implemented?

    Make no mistake, Edwards is not running this campaign off his own back.

    The question is this, who is strong enough among Labour people to be able to ask this favour of Edwards?

    All roads lead back to one, very powerful and influential person.

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  27. expat (4,048 comments) says:

    see 6.38 pm above DQ

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  28. tom hunter (4,562 comments) says:

    Gosh – the situation over on Edward’s blog has become positively……..well, the following seem apropos in light of his oldest expertise:

    Although he realised at once that he shouldn’t have spoken aloud, and that by doing so he had, in a sense, acknowledged the stranger’s right to oversee his actions, that didn’t seem important at the moment.
    …….
    “And you should talk less in general; almost everything you’ve said up to now could have been inferred from your behavior, even if you’d said only a few words, and it wasn’t terribly favorable to you”
    …….
    The unexpected question, however, confused the man, which was even more embarrassing since he was obviously a man of the world, who would certainly have retained his self-confidence elsewhere

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  29. JC (933 comments) says:

    At least this debate between Edwards and Garner is collegial, reasoned and civil.. not like the stuff you read on blogs at all.

    JC

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  30. bhudson (4,736 comments) says:

    @fletch

    suddenly the 12th man springs to mind and his take off of Richie Benaud – “it didn’t look like a foot to me…”

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  31. RKBee (1,344 comments) says:

    Garner has always had a mean.. too big for his boots.. ill show you type vendetta chip on his shoulders ever since his TV1 days. I’ve been around a couple off political campaigns that he has covered… and over hearing some of his personal mean school boy side remarks on others.. when he doesn’t get his way are just nasty… He’s just a prized little prick that thinks the world owes him somethink… Although I have no time for Carter or Edwards and their self righteous egos… I tend to believe them over Garner.. from what I have seen and heard from Garner personally… he’s no angle.

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  32. aardvark (417 comments) says:

    I love it, a politician and a journalist fighting over who said what…

    All we need is the addition of a used car dealer and an insurance salesman and we’d have all four of the least trustworthy professions at it.

    Who cares who said what to who… they’re all untrustworthy leaches on the taxpayer and/or society.

    When we get politicians and journalists who have backbone, some morals a hint of ethics and an understanding of who they’re actually supposed to be working for — then there’s something to write about.

    In the meantime, there’s nothing to see or hear here… move a long please.

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  33. RKBee (1,344 comments) says:

    No angel….

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  34. Rex Widerstrom (5,327 comments) says:

    RKBee suggests:

    from what I have seen and heard from Garner personally… he’s no angle.

    To which I can only respond: you can be right without being an angle :-D

    (Sorry RKBee, couldn’t resist)

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  35. rouppe (941 comments) says:

    Right at the top of this conversation was the fact that Dame Margaret Bazley was a witness.

    Has anyone asked her?

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  36. tom hunter (4,562 comments) says:

    How he became so enamoured of Labour that the “seller of raffle tickets” jibe is apt, I don’t know.

    It’s fairly simple Rex.

    Brian arrived in Old Zealand, a land of egalitarian milk and honey, where doctors earned the same as dustman and National and Labour merely squabbled over who could best manage the re-distribution of all that Arcadian cash via the State Services Commission and the Ministry of Works.

    The 1980′s were The Fall – and as an immigrant who’d fallen in love with Old Zealand, Brian Edwards felt the impact more than most. He has never forgiven or forgotten. Embittered does not even begin to cover it. But you’d have to read The Public Eye to really get a feel for the whole setup.

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  37. RKBee (1,344 comments) says:

    Brian arrived in Old Zealand.

    When NZ was still learning the banjo…. and anyone with a foreign accent with Dr in front of their name… must be intelligent.
    Now we know better.. he was nothing more than a left wing socialist load mouth one step away from a union delegate.

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  38. MikeNZ (3,234 comments) says:

    Either way Carter becomes more of a liability to Goof and to Labour.
    Is this the image they want of their top dogs?
    Brian Edwards has clearly lost his way as he should be shutting Carter up and keeping him out of the limelight.
    The brand is being damaged by every mention.

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  39. Tauhei Notts (1,644 comments) says:

    Brian Edwards
    I lost all respect for that creature after the 1972 election. Norman Kirk lead a Labour Party that defaecated upon National from a great height. The whole of Wellington went Labour. The whole of Wellington except Miramar where Labour put up a sick doctor from Belfast. What a crock. National won that seat against all odds. Was there an arrogance in that Labour Party that put such a drongo up in such a winnable seat. Only a dong beater, dingbat and dickhead could have lost Miramar for Labour in 1972.

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  40. toad (3,672 comments) says:

    Can’t we give this crap a miss for a while, and concentrate on the real issues.

    After all, Nick Smith has been exposed as telling a pack of porkies about ACC.

    And hardly anyone on the MSM sees that as serious, because they are all preoccupied with Duncan Garner and Chris Carter.

    FFS, look at the political issues – the personalities are largely irrelevant.

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  41. reid (16,106 comments) says:

    whose vote and support they can rely on when the next stage of their plan is ready to be implemented?

    Good spotting, bb.

    Tally Ho.

    We attack at dawn.

    FFS, look at the political issues – the personalities are largely irrelevant.

    But we don’t want to, toad. Your issues are much more interesting.

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  42. big bruv (13,552 comments) says:

    Toad

    You do not see the abuse of tax payer funds as an important issue?
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    Silly me!, of course you don’t.

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  43. big bruv (13,552 comments) says:

    Edwards arrived in NZ to escape the hatred and small mindedness of Northern Ireland, as soon as he got off the plane he started his very own Kiwi based version of small mindedness and hatred.

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  44. krazykiwi (9,189 comments) says:

    Only a dong beater, dingbat and dickhead could have lost Miramar for Labour in 1972.

    I’d be happy for a dong beater, dingbat and dickhead to take it from Labour in 2011, but sadly someone fitting that description will in all likelihood hold it for them.

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  45. eszett (2,365 comments) says:

    # big bruv (6695) Says:
    June 28th, 2010 at 8:47 pm

    Edwards arrived in NZ to escape the hatred and small mindedness of Northern Ireland, as soon as he got off the plane he started his very own Kiwi based version of small mindedness and hatred.

    So says the openminded big bruv, who’s heart is full of love

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  46. bhudson (4,736 comments) says:

    Toad

    “personalities are largely irrelevant”

    Yes. And you’d struggle to find many more irrelevant than Nick Smith, so you’ll not be surprised to find no takers here

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  47. RKBee (1,344 comments) says:

    Edwards arrived in NZ to escape the hatred and small mindedness of Northern Ireland, as soon as he got off the plane he started his very own Kiwi based version of small mindedness and hatred.

    And Miramar were the first to see him coming… 1972 election results..

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  48. reid (16,106 comments) says:

    toad, it’s not a bad point you make however, but if you want to debate ACC, suggest take it to GD.

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  49. RKBee (1,344 comments) says:

    toad… Whats this about Nick Smith and ACC… I can’t hear you.

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  50. Peter (1,663 comments) says:

    Nick Smith may as well join the Green Party. He’s that irrelevant.

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  51. Fale Andrew Lesa (473 comments) says:

    I must say that it is certainly out of character for Garner to act in the way that Carter is suggesting here, and unless evidence can be produced I see little need for further discussion.

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  52. RKBee (1,344 comments) says:

    Brian Edwards and Duncan Garner .

    Under Helen the left were not alloud to be seen fighting with each other in public.
    Duncan must see himself as a Maori Party supporter… now Carter and Edwards are the enemy.

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  53. Michaels (1,318 comments) says:

    # toad (2295) Says:
    June 28th, 2010 at 8:36 pm

    Can’t we give this crap a miss for a while, and concentrate on the real issues.

    After all, Nick Smith has been exposed as telling a pack of porkies about ACC.

    And hardly anyone on the MSM sees that as serious, because they are all preoccupied with Duncan Garner and Chris Carter.

    FFS, look at the political issues – the personalities are largely irrelevant.

    5,000 demirets for Toad for posting off topic AGAIN!!

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  54. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    “Only a dong beater, dingbat and dickhead could have lost Miramar for Labour in 1972.”

    The kind of stuff that makes Kiwiblog so much a better read than all of its smug pretentious leftist competitors.

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  55. expat (4,048 comments) says:

    A liberal academic Northern Irishman in working class Miramar circa. 1972 – gee wonder why he lost chuckle.

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  56. axeman (251 comments) says:

    ‘Does anybody else get the feeling that Brian Edwards is doing this on the orders of somebody else?’

    ‘If you were cynical you’d say that Helens old media adviser Brian has taken on the ugly duckling Carter to try and shore up his position in Te Atatu.’

    This is probably true as it seems Edwards has probably got no other work on at the present time. Having to advertise his business continually leads one to suspect that the ‘sad, beaten little man with the pure hatered in his eyes as he struggled to swallow a massive defeat in the election’ has been struggling for clients in the last couple of years.

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  57. fatman43us (166 comments) says:

    God they’re at it again. Clark and her Media Mentor Edwards holding up Carter to the world for an examination of his veracity.

    Carter is a liar, Garner is a Commentator – do we need to know very much more of their characters. To paraphrase Churchill, I long to see the last Commentator strangled with the guts of the last poof Labour Cabinet Minister – and in the Koru Club Lounge foyer for preference.

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  58. Rich Prick (1,634 comments) says:

    As some one who was in the lounge at the time I can report it was hand-bags a flying. Carter was the penultimate outraged poof with an over developed sense of self-importance (funded by us all). Garner did himslef no favours, but at least he’s not snout down in the trough.

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  59. Rich Prick (1,634 comments) says:

    Lesson here, if you are a petulant gatekeeper, never pull on a pig’s tail while it is feeding. They get angry. Very angry. They will run, and skiter, but they will make it back to the trough eventually.

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  60. hj (6,714 comments) says:

    Hairy Mc Leary went to the dairy with John Tamahere, and John Tamahere called Chris Carter a ‘tosser”.

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  61. niggly (813 comments) says:

    If it were ever possible for Brian Edwards … to come across another (identical) Brian Edwards ….

    Within seconds they would be using “the Queen’s English” and their “intellect” to out-do one another, to gain superiority over the other…

    Within a couple of minutes, with their ego’s in over drive, they would probably come to blows and fisty-cuffs ….

    (It’s just a strange picture I have in my head of two Brian Edwards, not at all comfortable that there is someone else “better” than him. Let alone some whipper young-ish journo, who relishes digging the dirt on labour – and he did on national in prior years – nothing Partisan about Garner IMO – just a journo with an ego etc …. who “unfortunately” has come across a much, much bigger ego than his (and much too grand for the good folks of Miramar at the time))!

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  62. John Ansell (874 comments) says:

    Lovely metaphor, Rich Prick.

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  63. nickb (3,675 comments) says:

    Lets not forget this gem from the senile communist dinosaur:

    http://creativefreedom.org.nz/story.html?id=414

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  64. Muzza M (291 comments) says:

    Why doesn’t that arrogant, insecere, troughing, fucking poofter called Carter just fuck off. Why doesn’t Phil tell him to just fuck off. I think BB has got it right, the Labour party is being run fron NY.

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  65. the deity formerly known as nigel6888 (858 comments) says:

    Edwards is a sad old tosser desperately trying to win back favour with she who must not be named, and the rainbow wing of the labour party.

    Why he would bother to sacrifice what little is left of his reputation on that useless trougher is merely a sad reflection on how unemployment can focus even the most enfeebled mind.

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  66. Clint Heine (1,568 comments) says:

    Why listen to Edwards? He’s got both feet inside the Labour Party and will do anything if it means to defend his party.

    I don’t like Garner but he loves taking everybody down… so is Edwards against Garner doing his job properly or that fact he did it to hurt his party? Typical Labour meddling!

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  67. GPT1 (2,103 comments) says:

    For my 2c, Duncan is not at all partisan. He went after National with the “secret tapes”in 2008 with as much glee as he went after Carter with his excessive travel.
    So he’s an equal opportunity asshole?

    For mine Garner is about his ego and any story, news or not, that will run and boost his profile.

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  68. SHG (369 comments) says:

    This is the article that Edwards deleted from his website.

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/21588267/Brian-Edwards-Public-Libraries-Are-Theft

    It’s umm…. enlightening.

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  69. Put it away (2,888 comments) says:

    I’ve noticed it seems to be traditional to refer to Edwards as an “intellectual”, and he certainly describes himself that way at every possible opportunity, but has he ever actually said anything intelligent ?

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  70. kiwi in america (2,473 comments) says:

    Tauhei
    I’d forgotten about Edward’s Labour candidacy for Mirimar in the 1972 election – if memory serves me correctly (or at least my memory of Alan McRobie’s analysis), Mirimar saw a slight swing to National against the 1972 landslide which saw an almost 8% nationwide swing to Labour.

    Edward raising this tet a tet a year after it happened is clearly the work of Helen. Carter has gone crying to mother and Her Highness has called in a favour from her fawning biographer. Garner nailed it when he decribed Edwards as a “Labour Party raffle ticket seller”.

    Carter’s tin ear on his troughing has no limits. Helen’s political instincts have fled – by siccing Edwards onto Garner to rehabilitate Carter all she’s ended up doing is pissing off one of NZ’s more boisterous and aggressive political journalists who now has a green light to revisit the greedy minister theme all over again – on national TV! Total own goal – Phil Goff must be saying “who will rid me of this turbulent priestess”!

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  71. Manolo (13,516 comments) says:

    “All roads lead back to one, very powerful and influential person.”
    Do you mean Phil(ler) Goff? :-)

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  72. James Stephenson (2,087 comments) says:

    @Put it away – whatever makes you think that there’s some kind of correlation between being an “intellectual” and actually having intelligence? I’ve always used the tag as an insult meaning “all talk and no ability”.

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  73. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    Make no mistake, Edwards is not running this campaign off his own back.

    The question is this, who is strong enough among Labour people to be able to ask this favour of Edwards?

    All roads lead back to one, very powerful and influential person.

    What a load of conspiratorial horseshit.

    Whether or not you agree with Edwards’ opinions, he has been expressing them volubly and without assistance for decades. These days, he writes a blog. He’s written about what he regards as Garner’s overly keen interest in Carter’s sexual relationship before.

    What you’re presumably claiming is that this is a conspiracy orchestrated by Helen Clark, whose foul grasp extends across the oceans; and that she has cunningly induced Edwards to — gasp — say something he already thinks. In a blog! Will her wicked ways never end?!

    Sorry to to break the spell by actually uttering the Ice Queen’s accursed name, but methinks some of you weenies think about Helen Clark way more than is healthy.

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  74. george (398 comments) says:

    Sorry Russell, according to Goff’s office, the Labour Leader is furious about Edwards’ intervention. Goff himself believes Edwards is being encouraged by Clark. It is not a conspiracy but it is a fact that Carter, Edwards and Clark are all close personal friends and it would be extraordinary if they hadn’t been talking about all this over recent weeks.

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  75. Pete George (23,299 comments) says:

    according to Goff’s office, the Labour Leader is furious about Edwards’ intervention. Goff himself believes Edwards is being encouraged by Clark.

    How do you know this?

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  76. Pete George (23,299 comments) says:

    It is not a conspiracy but it is a fact that Carter, Edwards and Clark are all close personal friends

    …that doesn’t sound like a conspiracy…

    and it would be extraordinary if they hadn’t been talking about all this over recent weeks.

    …it’s possible but sounds like a guess.

    But it’s a huge leap to claim that Clark is dictating to Edwards what to write, without any facts supporting this claim it sounds like part of an ongoing conspiracy story.

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  77. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    But it’s a huge leap to say that Clark dictating to Edwards what to write, without any facts suporting this claim it sounds like part of an ongoing conspiracy story.

    Well, quite. And the idea that it’s a “campaign” is hilarious. Edwards wrote a sodding post in his sodding blog.

    If Clark has had any role here, it appears that it may have been to have advised Carter to get over his hissy fit and acknowledge his situation.

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  78. tom hunter (4,562 comments) says:

    Speaking of conspiratorial horseshit:

    That’s politics. But it’s silly to pretend this dropped out of the sky. It looks quite well organised to me.

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  79. Manolo (13,516 comments) says:

    I can only enjoy the mud-throwing spectacle between an ageing left-wing spin doctor and an overweight hack.

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  80. Pete George (23,299 comments) says:

    You could be on to it Manolo. This could be anything between being a blog spat amongst egos, and being a World Takeover Council directive via Clark that Edwards have a blog spat amongst egos.

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  81. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    __Speaking of conspiratorial horseshit:__

    That’s politics. But it’s silly to pretend this dropped out of the sky. It looks quite well organised to me.

    You may want to catch up with Jock Anderson’s story in last week’s NBR.

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  82. cabbage (455 comments) says:

    …it’s possible but sounds like a guess.

    Carter is on public record that he spoke to H1 about this while in parliamentary exile. As for Edwards involvement, certainly more of a guess but perhaps not so outrageous as you intimate.

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  83. nighthawk006 (4 comments) says:

    The most surprising aspect of this story is that Carter would know what a c**t was. ;

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  84. Pete George (23,299 comments) says:

    Carter is on public record that he spoke to H1 about this while in parliamentary exile.

    Yep, then he did his time out and came back with a detailed apology (sincerity questionable).

    As for Edwards involvement, certainly more of a guess but perhaps not so outrageous as you intimate.

    No, not outrageous, but there could be many possible variations to what was said and who chose to do what. Guessing one possibility (or choosing one) is meaningless at best, or can be seen as deliberately try to slur.

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  85. Redbaiter (13,197 comments) says:

    If he’s not asking falsely based questions, he’s (PG) demanding that nobody should express an opinion.

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  86. RRM (9,638 comments) says:

    ^^^ No, he’s saying that opinions are merely opinions.

    I would have thought someone who loves pointing to the failings of “The MSM”as much as you do would appreciate the problem with reporting theories, suspicions and hypotheses as fact?

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  87. voice of reason (491 comments) says:

    Now it seems there are several Duncan Garners posting comments –

    thoughts of Garner Island a la Clarkson Island

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  88. Sonny Blount (1,847 comments) says:

    I think Tom Sowell was talking about the Brian Edwards type here:

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  89. Pete George (23,299 comments) says:

    RB, to some people there’s a difference between expressing opinions and stating as a fact.

    Sorry Russell, according to Goff’s office, the Labour Leader is furious about Edwards’ intervention.
    Goff himself believes Edwards is being encouraged by Clark.

    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2010/06/edwards_v_garner.html#comment-711861

    This sounds as if the poster knows facts – “according to Goff’s office” and “Goff himself believes” – and I asked how they knew that. No response, which could mean the poster hasn’t been back since making the claims, or chooses not to explain.

    Also:
    What a surprise! Edwards, Clark’s media spin doctor, assisting Carter another one of her proteges.
    The Sicilian Cosa Nostra pales by comparison.
    - http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2010/06/edwards_v_garner.html#comment-711719

    God they’re at it again. Clark and her Media Mentor Edwards holding up Carter to the world for an examination of his veracity.
    - http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2010/06/edwards_v_garner.html#comment-711821

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  90. kiwi in america (2,473 comments) says:

    Edwards isn’t stupid – he knows that Carter has made a prize dick of himself – he’s been involved in political spin meistering and consulting for decades. Carter himself admitted that he had a cry on Helen’s shoulder. The rigid control of H2 and H1 meant both were fully aware of Carter’s troughing but were insufficiently sensitive to public’s likely reaction knowing that any detailed analysis was years down the track.

    Edwards friendship with, and admiration for, Clark is also well known. Clark doesn’t need to tell one political friend to help another political friend – that’s far too blatant even by Clark’s manipulative standards. Edwards has been around the media and political process and the dark arts of politics long enough to know what to do here.

    Where on Edward’s blog is the condemnation Garner 11 months ago? I’m not a reader of his blog and perhaps the hissy fit in the Koru Lounge was commented on after it happened. Edwards may feel some sense of loyalty to Carter regardless of the known closeness of Carter and H1. Either way he’s made a serious accusation against a prominent member of what was for a time his own profession. Garner is not like Ian Fraser and will not take such accusations lying down.

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  91. pollywog (1,153 comments) says:

    hah…if i was a seasoned media pro with no scruples and wanted to shut down a blog debate, go back on my word, big up myself and play Edwards for a fool

    I’d set up a troll email account from my own workplace using my own name and post some arrogant stuff that in all essence is believed to be true.

    Then log in later using my real email and deny it was me who did it.

    Well played doughnut !!!

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  92. Honest John (204 comments) says:

    Garner is a straight up Tory. Also, he also creeped out one of my flambo gay friends when he hit on him in a pub, and he’s got a wife! How Tory can you get?

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