Who would have thought
October 15th, 2010 at 10:00 am by David FarrarYahoo News reports:
A federal judge issued a worldwide injunction Tuesday immediately stopping enforcement of the military’s “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy, suspending the 17-year-old ban on openly gay U.S. troops.
U.S. District Judge Virginia Phillips’ landmark ruling also ordered the government to suspend and discontinue all pending discharge proceedings and investigations under the policy. …
the Log Cabin Republicans, a gay rights organization that filed the lawsuit in 2004 to stop the ban’s enforcement.
So who would have thought that Don’t Ask Don’t Tell would not be killed off by Obama (who had promised to do so), but instead by the Log Cabin Republicans.
Tags: Barack Obama, Republicans
October 15th, 2010 at 10:06 am
It’s called “celebrating
Vote:perversitydiversity”.October 15th, 2010 at 10:13 am
No, andrei, it’s called basic human rights and respect.
Something you know very little about.
The only thing perverse is your pathological homophobia. And that of some other infamous commentators here.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:14 am
It’s interesting. The Republicans are a pretty broad church, and many of my American friends who are definitely not Democrat, also have difficulties with a lot of the large government, socially conservative, path that the Republicans have taken in recent decades. The traditional liberals have nowhere to go – both parties like big government, and the Republicans often put religion and enforcement of religious ideals ahead of getting the government out of people’s lives.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:21 am
Where did the Log Jamming Republicans stand on the issue?
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:21 am
And remember, Don’t Ask Don’t Tell was signed into law by President Clinton under a Democrat-controlled House.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:31 am
Whats even wierder is that the Obama Administration will appeal the Federal judge’s ruling on DADT even though Obama is trying to get Congress to change the law – that’ll piss off his liberal base even more because he announced only a few days ago that his administration would also appeal another Federal judge’s ruling against Congress’ Defence of Marriage Act designed to prevent gay marriages in liberal states being recognized in other states. Depressed Democrat base turnout = even more Republican seats on 2 Nov!
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:34 am
Actually, I think you’ll find Lady Gaga’s highlighting of this issue has really helped.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:37 am
There you go Red,, Sarah Palin is obviously gay and is working from with within your beloved republicans to turn the US in to a total modern Sodom
What’s next Glenn Beck on paedophilia charges? Its all going to hell in a hand basket.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:40 am
1: Aren’t we all meant to be against meddling judges imposing their activist agenda on the people? Or is it OK when it’s a Republican group who brings the case?
2: Blaming Obama for not lifting Don’t Ask/Don’t Tell is a little … disingenuous. The measure was contained in a Defence Bill placed before the Senate about a month ago. However, there weren’t the 60 votes required for cloture – hence the measure failed. Why weren’t there 60 votes? Well, the Republicans block-voted against it and got joined by Blanche Lincoln and Mark Pryor from the Democrats. So there’s your guilty parties right there …
[DPF: Heh I love it when I get bites. Yes my preference is for legislatures to change the law, not Judges strike it down. I am just enjoying the irony.
Obama could not appeal the decision. The fact he is, will not go down well with his base]
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:56 am
Well the post told me a bit abuot what has happened and the comments have told me more about most of you than I care to ever know.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:05 am
I still don’t see how having gays in the military is a good idea – it just isn’t. These soldiers have to spend huge amounts of time in close quarters, to say nothing of the barracks. Having a gay person in a sleeping barracks is like having males in female barracks, or the other way around – or would they house gay men with the women? The whole thing is not a good idea and is sure to weaken the military.
[DPF: NZ military seems to have coped fine]
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:24 am
“The whole thing is not a good idea and is sure to weaken the military.”
Almost every army across the entire world would disagree with you. Who do I trust to be in charge of military affairs? A bunch of highly-trained experienced military officers backed by a civilian mandate or a homophobic bigot? hmmmmm.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:30 am
Fletch are you fucking serious? – I hope your tongue is firmly planted in your cheek.
Get out more, all the services and NZ Police have a large gay component and always have. having spent over 25 years in one of these organizations its not an issue. Its only an issue for the small minded and socially naive .
Homosexuality is not contagious or I would have caught it years ago in places I have worked. FFS
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:42 am
Actually, I think you’ll find Lady Gaga’s highlighting of this issue has really helped.
Yeah, cause she was just sooooo well known in 2004….
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:56 am
pauleastbay – unfortunately his tongue is not firmly planted in his cheek (or anywhere else remotely fun it would appear from his constant wowser-ish posts).
Vote:He’s one of those all-embracing, loving christian types. His bigoted buddies (andrei, lucia and kkkris) will be along shortly to help him out and espouse their loving christian views. Just you wait……
October 15th, 2010 at 11:58 am
Yeah, cause she was just sooooo well known in 2004…
April 2001, actually.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:59 am
I think most Republicans are pretty relaxed about gay people. I don’t think the Republican party has seriously advocated interfering in people’s bedrooms since Dan Quayle complained about Murphy Brown having a baby out of wedlock. Which was 18 years ago.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 12:13 pm
I believe the law will inevitably be changed but I do know mid level officers in the military here in the US who tell me that the top brass support for repealing DADT is extremely unpopular amongst the rank and file and middle command because they do believe there are morale issues.
It would be interesting to know what is being said inside the NZ military as I’m sure the official line is that openly gay soldiers fighting alongside each other works fine. I have a good mate in Auckland who is wired into the SAS in a major way. I will ask him to ask the question.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 12:32 pm
“coping fine” isn’t good enough. With all respect to the NZ military, I’d prefer to emulate the US military, given the choice. My understanding is a military unit is meant to be a homogenous group with such interferences not able to play a possible role. They can only undermine cohesion. Military experts know what they’re freakin doing. Life and death situations aren’t the place for distinctions between doing your best and coping. Sops to PC social engineering are a sure signs of weakness, as is the recently introduced medal for “courageous restraint”. So much for making the other poor bastard die for his country instead of you. Where’s Patton when u need him…
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 12:36 pm
Fletch do you Beleive the bollocks you gave written on this topic or is it a wind up. FFS I would have hoped homophobic crap such as that was a relic of the bigots of the past.
I have never been intimidated or threatened by gay people. Just like every girl on the city is not falling at your feet you are probably a little optimistic if you think that gay men may fancy you either. I suspect they are more interested in other gay people frankly.
As for weakening the armed forces, on what basis to you reach that hypothesis.
Makes little difference in war soldiers are soldiers.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 12:44 pm
Fletch: My mate in the Army is gay and during commissioning he slept in our barracks just like any other. He is a top man and would beat the shit out of any homophobe.
How about you fuck off and stop talking about shit you know nothing about.
[DPF: Warning - telling people to fuck off will attract demerits]
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 12:51 pm
April 2001, actually.
In the Gay/Lesbian community maybe – the vast majority of the world didnt have a clue who she was until Poker Face.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 12:53 pm
I wouldn’t want gays in my army. They’re like girls and would probably hold their rifles upside-down. Or back-to-front. Or load their magazines with lipsticks instead of bullets. Shit like that. You can’t shoot people with lipstick.
Actually I wouldn’t want girls in my army either. They’re just like gays.. Shit like that.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 1:06 pm
I nominate Malcolm for best comment award.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 1:19 pm
Look, isn’t there a reason that men and women share separate sleeping quarters to begin with? If there isn’t, then they may as well all sleep together under the one roof. There’s nothing “homophobic” (a word made up by gays to portray anyone who doesn’t agree with what they do as hate-filled bigots) in the statement. It’s just common sense.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 1:30 pm
@Bevan, you’ve proved my point. These guys have been working on this since 2004, but it took only a handful of tweets from Lady Gaga this year to see things change. No wonder she is the 7th most powerful woman in the world…
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 1:56 pm
Fletch lots of places are all co-ed now get with the times.
Why do sanctimonious types like yourself presume that most people are not in control of their sexual behaviour.? My local cafe owners are gay as big gay things but they have yet to get it on in front of the customers, rather they are like me and the wife once a month at 9.16 pm for 2 minutes.
Having been shot at, I can honestly say the last thing I felt like was partaking in the wild thing and even if I did no one else with me was feeling up to it so I was left high and dry. Sexuality has nothing to do with you being able to partake in acts of violence or to serve your country and community with pride.
To try and hide behind your comments as common sense is fucked on a grand scale, I pity , and thats not too strong a word pity, any member of your family who may be a bit different from your way of thinking
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 2:07 pm
@BlairM, re Murphy Brown incident you are right but interesting to note that Candice Bergen totally agreed with Quayle’s comments:
Vote:“I never have really said much about the whole episode, which was endless. But his speech was a perfectly intelligent speech about fathers not being dispensable and nobody agreed with that more than I did.”
http://209.157.64.201/focus/f-news/714436/posts
October 15th, 2010 at 2:36 pm
Now maybe Chris Carter will apply to join the U.S. Marines if he can find a desirable opening.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 3:24 pm
Pauleastbay, I am not disputing that people who are gay can serve their country well. It’s the general working and living conditions I was talking about. Are you suggesting that somehow gay people can control their urges or desires better than other people? That’s like saying that a heterosexual man living in a women’s barracks is never going to be overcome with sexual urges or desires. Maybe he will and maybe he won’t, but it’s not a good situation for him to be in. How is this different for a gay person who is attracted to men, living with men? You’re singling out gay people as somehow being supernaturally immune to this type of thing. I’m not saying a gay person couldn’t be an exemplary soldier, but just that I don’t think it’s the best of situations
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 5:53 pm
The White House has already announced its decision to appeal. One reason mentioned is that the government must defend its legislation, although it seems there is precedent for it not to do so. It is much more satisfactory for DADT to be repealed, but if it does not occur in the next, lame duck, session, the US is probably stuck with it for years.
And for the homophobes, the only army in NATO that discriminates against gays is the US. Also, the fact is that gays have always been in the military, just as in other walks of life.
There is a lot to admire about the US people, but a lot to cringe at as well. They do witch hunts so well!!
One more thing, it was Clinton who introduced DADT, but it was because he campaigned on a policy of ending the discrimination altogether, and DADT was the best he could get through.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 6:18 pm
Now maybe Chris Carter will apply to join the U.S. Marines if he can find a desirable opening.
Im sure they could slot him in some rear….ummm I mean where.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 7:36 pm
Now the gays will kill ussss all.
And war movies will never be the same.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 7:42 pm
The inside of the tanks should look good though……………oh! I luuuuuuuv what you’ve done with your turret Ssteve and those drapes are de-viiiiiiiiiiiiine!!
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:34 pm
Huh! Bet you there are next to no fags in the NZ Army. Working well in New Zealand? It ain’t an issue cause the fags wouldn’t dare let on they are faggy.
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:37 pm
Hah ha, quite a few “openings” by the sounds of it. He should join the navy instead and stand on the poop deck…LOL
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 10:53 pm
Anyone who wants examples of the tyranny of the majority need only visit Kiwiblog!
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:03 pm
Don’t be like that Luc, some of us are only having a bit of fun, was Billy T a racist?
Vote:October 15th, 2010 at 11:12 pm
What this whole sorry episode actually shows is how sad America has become for the average educated voter. Neither party is “small government”, the republicans “small government” is only in the small areas they define and then argue the large parts are where government belong, its a contradiction. And the Democrats have just gone and spent too much for their tax take and have balls the size of a prepubescent boy.
There is no party unfortunately who truly represents small government in all angles, both economically and socially and that is the issue. It is this issue which means that whilst I do not agree with legislation via the court as a principal, it actually works pretty well for a place like America where the legislature refuses to pass anything in fear of being kicked out and the bible belt ensure unfair practises are continued. Without it segregation would possibly still exist, hell the right to freedom of sexuality most probably would not exist in some states.
And Fletch and co, I am sorry but your arguments are so weak they cannot support the disgusting discrimination that is currently happening. Most modern military forces in the world allow people who are homosexual to serve. Hell Israel (love em or hate em) who have one of the most potent military forces in the world allow gay people to openly serve alongside females on the front line. People just need to get over their prejudices.
And I understand for the record most Americans are in favour of allowing gays to openly serve, the Republicans in the senate have been relatively disgraceful in this regard, especially mr change my spots McCain alongside the Democrats who crossed the floor to vote against.
Vote: