General Debate 28 June 2012

June 28th, 2012 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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204 Responses to “General Debate 28 June 2012”

  1. immigant (950 comments) says:

    First! Peow Peow!!

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  2. East Wellington Superhero (1,151 comments) says:

    The French. So easy to despise.

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  3. Keeping Stock (9,791 comments) says:

    Is the tide turning on public opinion over partial asset sales? Stuff’s poll is suggesting that it may be:

    http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2012/06/is-tide-turning.html

    So now that the heat has gone out of this debate, what will Labour and the Greens decide to die in a ditch over next?

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  4. Other_Andy (2,079 comments) says:

    Another philu-free day?

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  5. David Garrett (5,150 comments) says:

    Andy: I have the feeling we should treat it as a cancer patient does remission….a reason to cherish every day – nay every hour – when one is both symptom free and not undergoing unpleasant chemotherapy…but with the realisation that that happy state could end at any time..

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  6. DavidR (102 comments) says:

    Well it was Phil-free for 3 comments, Other-Andy!

    Everyone moans when he’s here, then when he’s not they talk about that too – for months sometimes.

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  7. Other_Andy (2,079 comments) says:

    Businesses to Admit Mini Horses as Guide Animals

    Mona Ramouni, who is blind, rides a bus to work with her guide horse in Lincoln Park, Mich. Growing up in Detroit, Ramouni could never get a dog because her devout Muslim family considered dogs unclean.

    http://cnsnews.com/news/article/new-disability-regs-limit-slope-mini-golf-holes-require-businesses-admit-mini-horses

    However, “Ponies and full-size horses are not covered.”

    Well, that’s a relief…!

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  8. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    KS – Labour seem to be aiming at dying in a ditch over asset sales again, they keep thinking it’s a winner for them when they have already lost resoundingly on it, twice.

    It’s a heck of a big call for them to bet the next election on it. Maybe they will wake up to the “repeating mistakes” adage before 2014.

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  9. immigant (950 comments) says:

    You guys are making a mistake naming the one who’s name shall not be spoken. It will only attract him and his dark powers to the blog.

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  10. Scott Chris (5,682 comments) says:

    Most likely Ewan Macdonald will be acquitted even though he probably murdered Scott Guy. There’s simply not enough evidence to nail the guy. Curious summing up by his lawyer though:

    Macdonald had already said all he needed to say in more than 40 hours of police interviews since his brother-in-law was gunned down outside his rural Feilding home in July 2010, King said.

    Throughout those interviews, Macdonald steadfastly denied any involvement in a fire that gutted an old farmhouse on Guy’s Aorangi Rd property in October 2008, an axe attack on his house three months later, and the theft of two deer from a nearby farm.

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  11. Carlos (684 comments) says:

    Child Driven Education:

    http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20120626-the-child-driven-education

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  12. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    Check out this amazing news-

    http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/derm-is-dead-and-doomsayers-are-too-emotional-seeney-20120627-2128c.html

    Why can’t Key do something like this?

    I’ll tell you- he ain’t got it in his head.

    He’s a weak and compromising lefty with no ability to draw people to his point of view even if he had a POV that was worth more than a pinch of goat shit.

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  13. immigant (950 comments) says:

    @Carlos

    Yeah because children know what skills will be relevant in the real world. Good one.

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  14. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    Scott-Chris – really? Those acts, and denials later admitted, are some of the strongest “suggestions” of possible guilt.

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  15. Carlos (684 comments) says:

    @ immigant

    Don’t be a dick. You know that’s not what it means.

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  16. Brian Smaller (3,915 comments) says:

    If you like nostalgia and a glimpse at our past.
    http://mangamahu.wordpress.com/

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  17. Brian Smaller (3,915 comments) says:

    You guys are making a mistake naming the one who’s name shall not be spoken. It will only attract him and his dark powers to the blog.

    Don’t say it three times or you will summon it from the Underworld to wreak havoc.

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  18. kowtow (6,723 comments) says:

    scott chris

    Careful what you print. His lawyers could come after you for that . Correct me if I’m wrong.

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  19. Rufus (606 comments) says:

    Vegans…sigh…

    From Stuff:

    “Geoffrey Bruno James De Santis-Burke, 20, waiter, Newtown:

    Doesn’t eat out often. When he does “it’s one of those times I’ll splash out, buy a nice wine, eat nice food”. Wouldn’t eat offal: “I don’t eat anything that was alive.” “

    Thinks plants aren’t alive. Silly kid.

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  20. David Garrett (5,150 comments) says:

    Scott: McDonald’s lawyer Greg King hasn’t “summed up” anything (although even NatRad got it hopelessly wrong this am). That was the defence’s OPENING statement…now we get the defence case (consisting of two witnesses apparently, not including the accused) THEN King will close the defence case…and only then will the Judge sum up the case…Sorry to be pedantic, but I cant help it…The Nat Rad report this morning can only have been written by someone without any understanding of how trials work – although to be fair this is an unusual one, in that witnesses kept being called back to give evidence rather than giving their evidence in one go…perhaps RES or Graeme E could explain why that was…

    And I agree that he may well walk…but that neither means he is “found innocent” (no-one is “found innocent”) nor that he actually IS innocent…it is merely a finding that the prosecution has failed to prove its case to the required very high standard of “guilty beyond reasonable doubt”.

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  21. kowtow (6,723 comments) says:

    Another insight from newly liberated Egypt.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2165445/British-journalist-Natasha-Smith-22-recalls-horrific-sexual-assault-Egypts-Tahrir-Square.html

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  22. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    @Scott Chris
    Yeah I got a sneaky suspicion the jury will deliver McDonald the benefit of the doubt. But he has a definite cloud hanging over him

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  23. immigant (950 comments) says:

    This whole McDonald saga is just going to be another Bain saga. Everyone know he did it, but because there is ‘doubt’ and teh jury is a bunch of pussies, they will let him go.

    My question, if I was on the jurry would be – If not you? Then who?

    Who else in a sleepy farm community would go out and shotgun to death a farmer with a wife and 2 kids in the middle of his driveway for no material or financial gain what so ever?

    Total joke if they don’t put him away.

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  24. Nookin (2,891 comments) says:

    There are very many things that are not good in the camp of the accused. And, unlike Bain, there is no non-participating scapegoat upon whom to heap the blame. Scott and TheContrarian may yet be surprised at the outcome.

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  25. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    @Nookin

    Don’t mistake my thinking he’ll get the benefit of the doubt for protesting his innocence

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  26. 3-coil (1,184 comments) says:

    DomPost article (“Rugby rape accused told to ‘fess up”) re the Baby All Blacks rape story from South Africa reveals interesting tidbit: “Mr Tew said the player had been drinking, but not excessively, and had broken the ‘no women on floor’ policy that applied to all national rugby teams”. No wonder the innocent young lads get into trouble.

    It took a grand total of 3 “journalists” to write the story, so presumably it’s accurate…

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  27. grumpyoldhori (2,410 comments) says:

    What did this Canadian judge do wrong ?
    She gave her husband a blowjob in the privacy of their home and the dumb arsehole posted the photos to a website, chains, bondage, jeez who the fuck should care.
    The only mistake she made was in marrying an idiot.
    Yet it seems in parts of Canada it is, judges have sex lives, oh the horror.

    http://abovethelaw.com/2011/02/madam-justice-lori-douglas-underneath-her-robebremyes-we-have-the-nude-pictures-em/

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  28. James Stephenson (1,885 comments) says:

    perhaps RES or Graeme E could explain why that was…

    I thought they were just choosing to split their case into sections by time (say, the day before the murder) and have all their witnesses give evidence on that aspect and then move on to the next (ie day of the murder) and get all the witnesses evidence on that, rather than splitting the case by each witnesses evidence in total.

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  29. immigant (950 comments) says:

    @grumpyoldhori

    Well you seem to care because you just reposted this peice of irrelevance.

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  30. kowtow (6,723 comments) says:

    goh…. ajudge exercising a lack of judgement is in my book a very serious matter,think about it.

    This tale from Iran has a lot of ingredients that should appeal to the anti semites out there.You couldn’t make this stuff up.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0627/breaking36.html

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  31. Scott Chris (5,682 comments) says:

    And, unlike Bain, there is no non-participating scapegoat upon whom to heap the blame.

    Yes but the little evidence directly implicating Macdonald is too easy to cast doubt upon, such as the boots which may have been size 11s not 9s according to one interpretation – and also Macdonald’s knowing that Guy had been shot before his manner of death was established could be explained away by Macdonald claiming he’d heard the shots and put two and two together.

    If I were on the jury I’d have to vote not guilty simply because I’m not certain that he did shoot Guy.

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  32. David Garrett (5,150 comments) says:

    immigant: come on man! “Because the jury is a bunch of pussies” ??! Is that what you really think?? We have the “beyond reasonable doubt” standard of proof…whether you think that is an appropriate standard is another matter…but if Greg King makes enough of the “boot doesn’t fit” argument and other points to create genuine doubt in 3 or more of 12 jurors minds, then they must and ought to acquit him, because that’s what our law requires.

    You may well think “if not you then who”, as will many other people, but that is not a question the jury will be told to consider.

    I know it’s a cliche, but if you were wrongly accused of an offence that could see you in jail for 15 years or more, would you really want the jury to be thinking “we’ll, he’s probably the guy, and there is no-one else in the frame, so that’s good enough” ?

    Last point. There is no statute of limitations in this country. There was and is no reason the cops could not have left him sweating (I say that because they of course assume he is guilty) until the passage of time, when more evidence – such as a guilt induced confession – made their case a lot stronger. It was their call to go with it now.

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  33. Brian Smaller (3,915 comments) says:

    Anyone who buys shoes knows that while you may be a Size 9, sometimes shoes fit that can be anywhere from Size 8 -11. Not all shoes are made to the same “sizing”.

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  34. Brian Smaller (3,915 comments) says:

    @Grumpy. The judge is human and enjoys sex. Her hubby should have blurred her face before posting the pics.

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  35. Brian Smaller (3,915 comments) says:

    This tale from Iran has a lot of ingredients that should appeal to the anti semites out there.You couldn’t make this stuff up.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0627/breaking36.html

    I don’t know where those evil Jews find the time to control the world’s drug trade, what with all the kidnapping of Muslim children to make their passover bread they have to deal with.

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  36. immigant (950 comments) says:

    @David Garrett

    Well yeah you are right, I am overeacting, but I still do not have much faith in the juries after the Bain case.

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  37. immigant (950 comments) says:

    On a lighter note my younger sister was repremanded at school for hugging a female friend.
    To which she replied – “Miss are you implying I’m a lesbian?” So the teacher gave her detention. Nice work there… nice work…

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  38. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    Scott Chris: If I were on the jury I’d have to vote not guilty simply because I’m not certain that he did shoot Guy.

    If I was on the jury I’d have sat through all the evidence and wouldn’t just have to rely on a bit of media coverage and some blog banter.

    So I don’t know how I’d vote.

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  39. Fletch (5,726 comments) says:

    An interesting article by the highest ranking Soviet official ever to defect to the West.
    In the article, he explains how Marxism has invaded the U.S, and first used the name “Socialism”, then, “economic determinism” and finally “progressivism”.

    He explains how after the Nazis were defeated, their entire network was disbanded, but with Communism, the same people are really still in charge.

    Editor’s note: Lt. Gen. Ion Mihai Pacepa is the highest-ranking Soviet-bloc official ever to defect to the West. In December 1989, Romanian President Nicolae Ceausescu was executed at the end of a trial whose accusations came almost word-for-word out of Pacepa’s book, “Red Horizons,” subsequently republished in 27 countries.

    After President Carter approved his request for political asylum, Pacepa became an American citizen and worked with U.S. intelligence agencies against the former Eastern Bloc. The CIA has praised Pacepa’s cooperation for providing “an important and unique contribution to the United States.”

    Can you imagine a democratic Germany run by Gestapo officers?

    Putin is indeed trying to make Russia the first intelligence dictatorship in history. In 2004, nearly half of all top governmental positions were held by former officers of the KGB. The Soviet Union had had one KGB officer for every 428 citizens. In 2004, Russia had one intelligence officer for every 297 citizens.

    WND: Many Americans would roll their eyes at the phrase “Marxism in America,” even though with every passing year we are becoming more and more Marxist. Why are so many Americans so blind?

    Pacepa: They are not blind. They just do not really know what Marxism is. Few Americans will roll their eyes hearing the world “Nazism.” Why? Because the hideous crimes committed by Nazism were publicly exposed and their main authors were publicly tried and hanged. Unfortunately, there was no trial of Communism, although this Marxist heresy had killed 10 times more people than Nazism killed. Nazi archives have been opened to the public, who could learn about Nazism’s atrocities from the horse’s mouth. Most Soviet archives are still sealed.

    Stalin was famously quoted as saying: If it is not written, it did not happen. But Marxism did happen, it generated a dreadful empire of gulags and it spawned a 44-year Cold War. Let’s open that Pandora’s box. The United States of America is a unique country of freedom, built by people who came to this land of opportunity in search of religious, economic and personal freedom. Once Americans know the truth, they will never allow themselves to become puppets of Marxism.

    Interesting reading.

    http://www.wnd.com/2012/06/top-soviet-bloc-defector-marxism-infecting-u-s/

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  40. Paulus (2,299 comments) says:

    McDonald case

    Can we introduce wise very old Scottish Law “Not Proven” ?

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  41. Nostalgia-NZ (4,697 comments) says:

    In the MacDonald case the defence closed yesterday having called 2 witnesses, one showing that a over/under shotgun couldn’t fire 3 rapid rounds, and another giving evidence that high voltage overhead power lines didn’t effect the accuracy of digital clocks, therefore placing the shotgun sounds, by a witness account, as after MacDonald was at home where he was met by the farmworker waiting outside the MacDonald house. The Crown started summing up this morning at 10am, facing a number of hurdles including the claim of the ‘print made by MacDonald’ having been disproved.

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  42. kowtow (6,723 comments) says:

    fletch

    “americans would roll their eyes at the mention of marxism in america”

    Yep and that conditioning goes on everyday with the likes of the super wealthy Hollywoodians like G Clooney and his attacks on McCarthy.

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  43. hj (5,705 comments) says:

    CTV construction company boss lives high life
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/7182714/CTV-construction-company-boss-lives-high-life
    I wonder if this story makes japan?

    ….. …. ….

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  44. Scott Chris (5,682 comments) says:

    Pete in case you hadn’t noticed, we are in a blog forum where we are free to speculate based on what we know just as you are freely speculating as to what I don’t know. So spare us the sanctimony okay?

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  45. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    SC, say what you think based on what you know then, not what you’d do as a juror when you’re not one.

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  46. Nostalgia-NZ (4,697 comments) says:

    my 11.12 above

    should have read ‘when’ he was at home rather than ‘after.’

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  47. KevinH (1,129 comments) says:

    @Pete George
    I have done jury duty and it was a difficult and tiring experience. However if the accused has lied on other matters it seriously compromises his status in the minds of the jurors. The defence will have to work hard to persuade the jury that Macdonald is not a serial liar, if the defence don’t succeed, Macdonald will not get the benefit of the doubt.

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  48. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    @KevinH
    It’s hard to know about evidence like footprints, timing and when shots were heard without having seen all the detail and questions and answers.

    But I agree, there’s a big hurdle of credibility, MacDonald denied some fairly major crimes directed at the victim and his wife, and only admitted when evidence made denial pointless. So there may be some onus on the defence to demonstrate that on this one thing – murder – he has remained honest.

    Is there only one charge in this trial? If he gets off for murder could he still be charged with vandalism, breaking and entering, sustained harrassment and arson?

    If he is truly innocent of the murder he’s still been a nasty bastard.

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  49. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    @Fletch:

    World Net Daily is a pathetic website. An awful place for shills and birther conspiracies.

    Just sayin’

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  50. Scott Chris (5,682 comments) says:

    Pete – Having followed the trial I’m familiar enough with the pertinent evidence just as I am with the respective sides’ arguments regarding the relevance of said evidence to picture myself deliberating as a juror.

    It’s called ‘having an imagination’. No need to foist your stuffy conservatism on me.
    _________________________________________________________________________________________________

    KevinH – I would suggest that Macdonald would claim (if he were ever to testify) that he lied about the vandalism etc. because he feared it would implicate him in the murder which in of itself is a reasonable excuse. No doubt his lawyer will convey this view when he sums up.

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  51. slijmbal (1,134 comments) says:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2165202/Did-ONE-high-tech-worker-bring-RBS-knees-Junior-technician-blamed-meltdown-froze-millions-accounts.html?ICO=most_read_module

    Not the greatest fan of outsourcing technically complex matters to another continent, normally in another timezone where one has limited visibility of what is really going on.

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  52. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    Russel Norman’s Overseas Investment (Restriction on Foreign Ownership of Land) Amendment Bill has been pulled from ballot.

    That will be interesting. Rusty and Winnie united?

    The others are:
    24 Habeas Corpus Amendment Bill Chris Auchinvole
    35 Local Government (Salary Moderation) Amendment Bill Hon Annette King
    52 Prohibition of Gang Insignia in Government Premises Bill Todd McClay

    I think I’ll wait for DPF for the details.

    Clare Curran’s Far Too Late To Save TVNZ 7 Bill didn’t come up.

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  53. hmmokrightitis (1,458 comments) says:

    slijmbal, believe it.

    Was consulting at a “large bank” when the GFC really hit, and watched it utter horror as the automated trading software for the bank started rejecting calls for settlement from other banks – a sign that other banks internationally were looking for that indicated a bank could not settle its debts. For an hour international banks stopped trading with this NZ bank, and it took a call from the CEO to the Head of the Reserve Bank to make it happen again.

    For the sake of a flimsy piece of software, a “large bank” in this country was nearly bought to its knees.

    I shit you not.

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  54. Lance (2,311 comments) says:

    @KevinH
    Agree totally about juries.
    I have been on several juries and every jury I have been on the people there take it very very seriously.
    You can only assess the information given to you, without the benefit of wider speculation. There has always been wide cross section of people as well.
    Tensions run high, there was even a near fist fight in one deliberation.

    Cheap comments about them being stupid are ignorant rantings from shallow people.
    Its more about how the system is manipulated by various lawyers.

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  55. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    … but, but ..

    Scott Chris (4,344) Says:
    June 6th, 2012 at 8:38 am

    Did Ewan Macdonald kill Scott Guy?

    Crown prosecutor Ben Vanderkolk pointed to several crimes Macdonald admitted at the time of his arrest, which showed he was trying to scare Mr Guy away from Byreburn.

    They included setting fire to an old house on the Aorangi Rd site where Mr and Mrs Guy were about to build a house in October 2008, attacking their new house with an axe and spray painting abuse on it in January 2009, and leaving three notes in the Guys’ mailbox, containing phrases such as “Stay away from him Kylee, you whore”.

    Seems quite likely Macdonald is the killer on the face of it. On the other hand, compared to the overwhelming evidence which ultimately failed to convict David Bain, the crown case looks a little thin.

    Quite clear there that there is no need to bother with the formalities of cross-examination and the defence case. Seems like yet another a solid call from Scotty.

    … but … but …

    Scott Chris (4,344) Says:
    June 28th, 2012 at 10:12 am

    Yes but the little evidence directly implicating Macdonald is too easy to cast doubt upon, such as the boots which may have been size 11s not 9s according to one interpretation – and also Macdonald’s knowing that Guy had been shot before his manner of death was established could be explained away by Macdonald claiming he’d heard the shots and put two and two together.

    If I were on the jury I’d have to vote not guilty simply because I’m not certain that he did shoot Guy.

    Now hang on, I’m confused … Scotty’s confused … we’re all confused. What brought this about?

    Was it the mysterious disappearing boots? Did they just explode – perhaps implicating Grytpype Thynne and Count Moriarty?

    Budget substitute to NZ judicial system: NOPE
    Poser: CHECK
    Narcissist: CHECK
    Pat Lam Syndrome: CHECK

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  56. publicwatchdog (1,840 comments) says:

    Here you go Kiwibloggers!

    Sink your gums into this one! :)

    _____________________________________________________________________________________________

    OPEN LETTER TO THE GOVERNOR-GENERAL- Asking him to use ‘Reserve Powers’ not to grant Royal Assent to the Mixed Ownership Bill – now up on http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    June 27, 2012 | Author Penny Bright

    ‘OPEN LETTER TO THE GOVERNOR-GENERAL’ – Please consider using your ‘Reserve Powers’ to refuse Royal Assent to the Mixed Ownership Model Bill (if passed).

    The Mixed Ownership Model Bill is not yet law – it still does not yet have ‘Royal Assent’ (according to Parliamentary staff to whom I spoke on Wednesday 27 June 2012, from the Table Office – who are responsible for facilitating ‘bills’ into legislation.

    Apparently, ’Royal Assent’ from the Governor-General, is a few days away…..

    ‘OPEN LETTER TO THE GOVERNOR-GENERAL’ – Please consider using your ‘Reserve Powers’ to refuse Royal Assent to the Mixed Ownership Model Bill (if passed).

    (Sent Monday 25 June 2012, 5.12pm)

    Penny Bright
    to Antony.Paltrid., saphron.powell,

    (I apologise for the lateness of this email. It unfortunately involved more work than originally anticipated).

    My intention was to try and get it to the Executive Council as an ‘Item of Business’ for the consideration of the Governor-General.

    Please can you forward this correspondence to the Governor-General at your earliest opportunity?

    Thank you.

    Penny Bright

    ____________________________________________________________

    25 June 2012

    ‘OPEN LETTER TO THE GOVERNOR-GENERAL – The Rt Hon Sir Jerry Mateparae

    Please consider using your ‘Reserve Powers’ to refuse Royal Assent to the Mixed Ownership Model Bill (if passed).

    Dear Governor-General,

    I understand that the Executive Council, comprising of all Ministers of the Crown, meets today, 25 June 2012 at Parliament at 4pm, and you will be presiding over this meeting.
    http://gg.govt.nz/content/executive-council

    The Executive Council is the highest formal instrument of government. It is created by the Letters Patent that also establish the Office of Governor-General and is part of the executive branch of government that carries out formal acts of government.

    The Executive Council comprises all Ministers of the Crown, whether those Ministers are inside or outside Cabinet.

    The Governor-General presides over, but is not a member of, the Executive Council.”

    I wish this letter to be included as a urgent ‘Item of Business’ for this meeting of the Executive Council, whose members have sworn the following oath:

    http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1957/0088/latest/whole.html#DLM316134

    19 Executive Councillor’s Oath

    (1)The oath in this Act referred to as the Executive Councillor’s Oath shall be in the form following, that is to say:

    I,…, being chosen and admitted of the Executive Council of New Zealand, swear that I will to the best of my judgment, at all times, when thereto required, freely give my counsel and advice to the Governor-General for the time being, for the good management of the affairs of New Zealand. That I will not directly nor indirectly reveal such matters as shall be debated in Council and committed to my secrecy, but that I will in all things be a true and faithful Councillor. So help me God.

    ____________________________________________________________

    I understand that as the Governor-General of New Zealand, you do have the power to refuse ‘Royal Assent’ for legislation, although, to date, this power has yet to be used.

    http://gg.govt.nz/role/powers.htm

    In a very few instances, the Governor-General may exercise a degree of personal discretion, under what are known as the “reserve powers.” The most important of these is the appointment of a Prime Minister following an election, or accepting the resignation of an incumbent Prime Minister.

    By convention, the Governor-General will always appoint as Prime Minister the person who has been identified through the government formation process as the person who will lead the party or group of parties that appears able to command the confidence of the House of Representatives. The Governor-General expects that there will be clear and public statements that a political agreement has been reached and that a government can be formed that will have the support of the new Parliament. The Governor-General abides by the outcome of the government formation process.

    Other reserve powers are to dismiss a Prime Minister, to force a dissolution of Parliament and call new elections, to refuse a Prime Minister’s request for an election, and to refuse assent to legislation.

    These powers to act without or even against ministerial advice are reserved for the most extreme situations and with the exception of the appointment of a Prime Minister following an election, no New Zealand Governor-General has ever needed to use them.

    ____________________________________________________________

    In my considered opinion, as an ‘anti-corruption campaigner’, the passage of the ‘Mixed Ownership Model Bill’, would constitute a ‘most extreme situation’, and Royal Assent should be therefore refused for the following reasons:

    1) Although the National Party ‘campaigned’ on asset sales during the 2011 General Election, they only received enough votes to return 59 out of 121 Members of Parliament.

    (Irrespective of the number of votes cast by electors – it is votes cast in the House which determine the passage of legislation.)

    59 National MPs out of 121 is NOT a majority – so National’s claimed ’mandate’, has arguably no basis in fact.

    No majority – no mandate.

    2) If National genuinely believe that the majority of New Zealanders support the ‘partial privatisation’ of key State assets, then why not support the confirmation of this belief through a public referendum on this matter?

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/7162589/Asset-sales-set-to-pass-last-hurdle-this-week

    3) As it stands, provided the 3 Maori Party MPs vote against the Mixed Ownership Model Bill at its third reading, National are dependent on the pivotal votes of United Future’s Peter Dunne, and the ACT MP for Epsom, the Hon. John Banks.

    Herein lies the problem:

    a) Complaints have been lodged with Police, alleging electoral fraud against the Hon. John Banks.

    I know, because I, along with fellow ‘community activist’, Lisa Prager, am one of the complainants:

    On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 3:55 PM, BENEFIELD, Mark wrote:

    This email is to formally acknowledge your complaint under the Local Electoral Act 2001(LEA) in respect to the 2010 Mayoral Election and allegation of a false return made by the now Hon John BANKS in respect of his returns under section 109 LEA.

    For future reference File 120427/9334 refers.

    At this point in time I will be your point of contact.

    Regards

    Detective Inspector Mark Benefield

    Field Crime Manager Auckland City District

    Extn: 95766

    DDI: 09 3026 766
    Mob: 0274 741902
    Fax: 09 3754652″

    _____________________________________________________

    However, it is unclear if the Police have even questioned the Hon. John Banks about this alleged electoral fraud, although the complaint was made on 27 April 2012, almost 8 weeks ago, as per this recent correspondence with the Auckland District Commander of Police, SuperIntendent Mike Clements, dated 20 June 2012:

    ………………………………
    _____________________________________________________

    There are a LOT more reasons which help substantiate why the Mixed Ownership Model Bill should NOT be granted ‘Royal Assent’ – READ MORE on http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    Penny Bright
    ‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

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  57. RightNow (6,348 comments) says:

    Crap, there goes my scrollwheel

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  58. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    edit …

    Judicially recognised trespasser
    Fuckwit of epic proportions …

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  59. Manolo (12,640 comments) says:

    The dreadful Miss Dim has returned. Run for the hills to avoid the bludger.

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  60. graham (2,211 comments) says:

    So Penny:

    You consider the ‘Mixed Ownership Model Bill’ constitutes a ‘most extreme situation’. Sufficiently so that you are calling on the Governor-General to act in a way that, as you yourself point out, he has never needed to do before in history, and overturn a democratically elected Government.

    Why am I not surprised? Your entire modus operandi throughout the years seems to be “I, Penny Bright, think something is not right, so I want everybody to do what I think is right. Screw democracy, screw elections, screw the law, everybody should do what I say.”

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  61. alex Masterley (1,439 comments) says:

    Thats GD gone for the day then.

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  62. alex Masterley (1,439 comments) says:

    Got it in one Graham.

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  63. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    Oh dear.

    graham, Masterley: you read it??

    graham, your point has been made about 50,000 times (to no avail); including by you previously as I recall. I’m thinking this makes you an optimist. :)

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  64. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    “World Net Daily is a pathetic website. An awful place for shills and birther conspiracies. Just sayin”

    Correct. You are “just sayin” you repellent little commie propagandist. Its an opinion, except far more worthless than most given its complete lack of supporting argument.

    For an example of an opinion that is more validated, I could say that CNN is a pathetic network, an awful place for Marxists and Obama worshippers, and this is why they are at the lowest point ever in their broadcasting history.

    “Coming off its least-watched month in primetime in 20 years in May, CNN has taken another big ratings blow: The cable news network has registered to its lowest-rated quarter in primetime since 1991. “

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  65. graham (2,211 comments) says:

    Yeah, I’m a sucker for punishment, tdm :(

    Actually, one more point: From the website that Penny kindly provided, I read the following -

    The Governor-General’s constitutional role is to maintain the legitimacy and continuity of government by ensuring there is always a government in office with a democratic mandate to govern. Legitimacy is the foundation of civil peace and the order that is maintained by the rule of law.

    In asking the Governor-General to effectively overthrow a democratically-elected government, Penny is asking him to basically take his constitutional role and flush it down the crapper.

    Damn, she really doesn’t believe in democracy and proper constitutional process, does she?

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  66. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    “I think something is not right, so I want everybody to do what I think is right. Screw democracy, screw elections, screw the law, everybody should do what I say.”

    Penny is far from alone, I’ve seen that sort of attitude a lot. I’ve even been accused of being anti-demacracy by some exhibiting this self-lefteousnous.

    Occupational Democracy – ‘by the people, for the people, as long as it’s what I demand’.

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  67. publicwatchdog (1,840 comments) says:

    How am I a ‘bludger’ if I am self-funded Manolo?

    That the best you can do?

    Situation normal – can’t handle the debate yet again Manolo?

    Where’s the ‘Man’ in Manolo?

    Asking nicely in a reasoned, courteous way ………….. :)

    Ahhh….. the goldfish are gumming – always a good sign.

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright
    ‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

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  68. graham (2,211 comments) says:

    Sooo, who’s saving up to buy those shares? :)

    I’m thinking they’ll form a significant part of my retirement plan.

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  69. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    I’ll consider buying Mighty River shares, but it will depend on how the IPO stacks up in the market at the time. If they look like a reasonable earner at a reasonable price (or better) I’ll be in – as long as the market doesn’t look like it’s about to turn to custard.

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  70. mikenmild (8,894 comments) says:

    World Net Daily is a pathetic website pedalling lunatic fundamentalist christianity and nutjob conspiracy theories. Evidence of this? Check it for yourself – wait till a bit after lunch though; it might make you queasy.

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  71. David Garrett (5,150 comments) says:

    I wonder why it is that most of us can simply ignore that one, but the other one was like an itch you just have to scratch? Is it the style of writing? the fact that she doesnt actually viciously attack people? sorta like you can ignore someone swinging ah

    Some times I wish I had done more papers in PSYC all those years ago…

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  72. grumpyoldhori (2,410 comments) says:

    Hell National are doing a fine job in selling off (giving away ?) assets owned by all New Zealanders.
    So which merchant band did they use ?

    How long before they go back to no more patients in hospitals you are just customers ?

    The good part about the Nats selling the assets is come the next election we punters can ask two questions, are you better off under the Nats, and do you trust the Nats not to sell off all of NZs assetts.
    The answer to both those questions will be no, fuck even long term Nat voters are starting to wonder if Key’s government is one for Kiwis or for foreigners.

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  73. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    WND is a shill site for Goldline, Jerome Corsi and lunatics like Joseph Farrah who is completely shocked that Americans would exercise their democratic rights and *gasp* vote for an ATHEIST!! How dare they!

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  74. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    “Check it for yourself”

    I don’t need to.

    The hate hysteria and bigotry exhibited by communists like you (and the Contrarian) against WND is enough evidence to show the website is probably speaking the truth.

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  75. grumpyoldhori (2,410 comments) says:

    Hell National are doing a fine job in selling off (giving away ?) assets owned by all New Zealanders.
    So which merchant bank did they use ?

    How long before they go back to no more patients in hospitals you are just customers ?

    The good part about the Nats selling the assets is come the next election we punters can ask two questions, are you better off under the Nats, and do you trust the Nats not to sell off all of NZs assetts.
    The answer to both those questions will be no, fuck even long term Nat voters are starting to wonder if Key’s government is one for Kiwis or for foreigners.

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  76. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    “The hate hysteria and bigotry exhibited by…”

    Who said that? A boomerang statement.

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  77. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    Hi guys,

    just in response to DGs question at 9.38am, witnesses can be recalled for a number of reasons, given broad discretion by s99 of the Evidence Act 2006. Usually witnesses are recalled to answer an issue raised by a subsequent witness that was not covered in their original evidence but which really demands an answer. To be honest, the point is to avoid defence ‘gotchas’, allowing the prosecution to shore up holes in the case that have been picked in it by the defence. Not really ideal from a prosecutor’s point of view, because it brings in an element that you were not prepared for, but that is the nature of the game.

    immigant,

    your question ‘if not you, then who?’ is totally wrong in the context of the trial. It is not for the defendant to show who the real offender is if he/she says it is not him/her. Indeed, if McDonald did that, surely many here would be decrying his ‘unwarranted slur on the reputation of someone who doesn’t have the chance to defend themselves’, a la Bain?

    It is the job of the Police to show who, and to do so beyond a reasonable doubt. Which means the jury must be ‘sure’ that the defendant is guilty. If they cannot do it to that standard, then the defendant has no obligation to show who it might be.

    That said, any defendant who lies in police interviews is going to have a much greater amount of suspicion placed upon them by the jury than had they not lied. It is just the nature of things. While it is bad reasoning (he lied about that, so he must be lying about this), it is human nature to assume such a thought as truth. It would be wrong, though, and should not be validated.

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  78. publicwatchdog (1,840 comments) says:

    The ‘extreme’ situation – in my considered opinion, is that the passage of the Mixed Ownership Model Bill has been dependent upon the pivotal vote of the arguably yet-to-be charged, corrupt, ‘white collar’ criminal – the ‘Hon.’ John Banks, current ACT Leader and MP for Epsom.

    Having made formal complaints to the Police, against John Banks, alleging electoral fraud; having made formal complaints to both the SFO and the Police, against John Banks alleging bribery and corruption – having petitioned Parliament for an inquiry into prosecutions relating to Huljich Kiwisaver Scheme registered prospectuses dated 22 August 2008 and 18 September 2009, (which contained untrue statements) – it’s not like I haven’t made some attempt to follow ‘lawful due process’?

    Seems that NZ ‘perceived’ to be the ‘least corrupt country in the world’ (according to the 2011 Transparency International ‘Corruption Perception Index’) desperately needs a genuinely ‘Independent Commission Against Corruption’?

    Because when it comes to investigating complaints alleging ‘bribery and corruption’, especially against current politicians who hold the balance of power – both the SFO and the NZ Police are arguably ‘useless’?

    That is how I for one ‘perceive’ it.

    Penny Bright
    ‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

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  79. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    “The hate hysteria and bigotry exhibited by communists like you (and the Contrarian) against WND is enough evidence to show the website is probably speaking the truth.”

    Heh, I’m a communist. Wish someone would have let me know before accumulating personal wealth. Boy do I feel silly.

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  80. Fletch (5,726 comments) says:

    World Net Daily is a pathetic website pedalling lunatic fundamentalist christianity and nutjob conspiracy theories. Evidence of this? Check it for yourself – wait till a bit after lunch though; it might make you queasy.

    Irregardless of what you think of the WND site, I would have thought that the opinion of the highest ranking Soviet defector as regards Marxism had merit? Who better to judge the state of Marxism in the U.S?

    You’re creating a strawman via what you think of the WND website itself rather than judging what the author of the article says.

    It’s like making a case against someone who has an article published in the NZ Herald, based on what you think of the NZ Herald.

    If you have comments to make on what the author says, that would be good, but dissing WND isn’t getting anyone anywhere.

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  81. Aredhel777 (271 comments) says:

    Haha, Fletch, you read WND. My estimation of you just increased. I thought I was the only one who read that website. Life’s guilty pleasures.

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  82. graham (2,211 comments) says:

    You’re confirming what I said earlier, Penny:

    Your entire modus operandi throughout the years seems to be “I, Penny Bright, think something is not right, so I want everybody to do what I think is right. Screw democracy, screw elections, screw the law, everybody should do what I say.”

    You appear to ‘percieve’ that:

    - John Banks is dodgy
    - He is being protected at the highest level politically
    - John Key is dodgy
    - The SFO is useless
    - The NZ Police are useless
    - The 2011 Transparency International ‘Corruption Perception Index’ is wrong

    all because you disagree with them.

    I have little doubt that, should your request to the Governor-General be denied, you will hold this out as ‘proof’ that HE is also dodgy, useless, and wrong.

    “I, Penny Bright, think something is not right, so I want everybody to do what I think is right. Screw democracy, screw elections, screw the law, everybody should do what I say.”

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  83. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    graham

    Arguing with Water Woman is very like bashing your head repeatedly against a concrete wall…..it doesn’t achieve bugger all but it feels good when you stop. :)

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  84. David Garrett (5,150 comments) says:

    FES: Yes, I get that ( recalls to shore up holes created by the defence) but in this case it was announced at the outset that the witnessess were all going to have to give evidence several times over several days, with breaks in between…do you know why they did it like that?

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  85. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    “You’re creating a strawman via what you think of the WND website itself rather than judging what the author of the article says.”

    Of course.

    Its the only defence they’re capable of and they do it all the time.

    Then they wonder why real RW blogs won’t tolerate their worthless excrement.

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  86. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    DG

    My understanding is that after consulting with Scott Chris, they decided to go this way in order to present the evidence in a time sequence designed to culminate in the mystery of the exploding dive boots.

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  87. dime (8,778 comments) says:

    Heres Dimes take on why some people are upset with asset sales:

    1) They are old enough to remember the 80′s. they were either on the gravy train and worked for the govt before getting the ass, they had a close friend or family member who was or just seem to think all the pain of that era was caused by selling telecom and the like. nothing to do with the crash and piggys socialist policies that preceded the labour govt.

    2) These people are just sad sad fucks who seem to equate the government owning power companies with national pride. weird.

    3) Being typical arrogant kiwis who look down on every other country, they cant handle the idea of an overseas investor owning shares in a kiwi company. its ok when we do it though.

    4) Its “not fair” because not all “kiwis” can buy shares. people who think this should be shot. maybe we should ban iphones cause not everyone can afford those either.

    5) Some really thick people actually believe they already own a piece of these power plants. They just get no say, dont get a dividend etc but it seems to bring them comfort. at least they own something in their sad little existence??

    have i left anything out?

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  88. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    ‘baiter old thing

    I’ve been reflecting on your generous promise to “be there for me” when it all hits the fan.

    Could you please just clarify that offer. Did you mean that you would “be there for me”, or “be there for me?

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  89. david@tokyo (262 comments) says:

    I tend to think Ewen MacDonald was the killer, but would be surprised if he is convicted.

    Ewen had been able to get away with various crimes over the years and was quoted in the trial evidence as saying he thought the police are clueless. He was after all able to cover up the evidence from and get away with his prior crimes until well after the murder. He had the ability to commit his crimes under the nose of his own wife without detection or even suspicion. I don’t know the full circumstances but it seems that if his mate Callum Boe hadn’t dobbed him in he may never have had to admit his guilt.

    As for the murder, if he did it, then he again was smart enough to do it all undetected, and has done a good job of hiding any forensic evidence linking him to the murder. With his vandalism job he ditched the paint used at Taupo, miles from the scene of the crime. Good luck to the police finding 3 puppies and a pair of boots matching those prints found at the crime scene. Bury it, burn it, dump it, it doesn’t seem like a big hurdle out in the countryside.

    His comments and behaviour at the scene of the police cordon are the only real highlight pertaining to the murder. It’s a telltale sign for the responsible party to let out giggles etc when discussing with others what had happened.

    But compared with David Bain, Ewen MacDonald seems like a criminal mastermind (if he isn’t indeed innocent). But the way the system is set up is that the likely / probable killer gets away with it if they are remotely smart or careful enough. And some people ardently support this system given that it is necessary in order to protect the freedom of those wrongly accused – not an unreasonable position, but scary to think about all the clever murderers who are living free lives as a result. No easy answers…

    The real story is the tragedy for the family. You’ve got kids who aren’t going to know their fathers, aunties and uncles, and grandparents probably, sisters and wives who’ve lost their brothers and husbands. I really just hope the best for the lot of them. If only the killer could be identified with certainty somehow in future. As for Ewen, if he is found guilty, then at worst he is getting a real tough prison sentence for his vandalism, arson and other crimes. At best he’s getting his freedom but probably losing his wife, kids and more.

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  90. graham (2,211 comments) says:

    @ dime:

    6) Labour and the Greens say “It’s bad”, so it must be.

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  91. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    dime

    Wrong on all counts. They are the people who have never been net tax contributors to the NZ economy and think that they are at risk of having something taken away from them that they didn’t ever pay for.

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  92. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    thedavincimode

    Regardless of where the emphasis should be placed within that statement I would still be quite concerned!

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  93. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    davidtokyo

    The real story is the tragedy for the family…

    All of that plus the unseemly and voyeuristic splattering of Court shots of family members in the press and on TV. Predictable bottom of the barrel stuff. Completely unnecessary and added nothing to the “story”.

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  94. mikenmild (8,894 comments) says:

    Fletch/Redbaiter
    We could talk about your Romanian if you wish. Where to start? His allegations that the KGB killed JFK and numerous other leaders? His allegations about marxism in America? His claim that the Russians hid the Iraqi weapons of mass destruction?

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  95. RightNow (6,348 comments) says:

    “assets owned by all New Zealanders” necessarily means that all New Zealanders collectively also owe $52 billion or so, excluding private debt. Some of us are even net taxpayers and contribute toward the interest payments.

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  96. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    david@tokyo,

    a good summary. I just note that suspicion should never be enough to convict someone of any offence. If the evidence is not there, and suspicion raised by other crimes is not enough, then he should not be convicted.

    But as to your point about clever criminals, I like to quote the late great Prof Gerry Orchard: “There is nothing dumber than a crim!”. Okay, it might be a generalisation, but it is, for the most part, very true.

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  97. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    nasska

    Well, I am concerned.

    There’s another potential glitch too. How is he going to mount that M60 on the front of his zimmer frame?

    Maybe he should splash out on a mobility scooter and then he could mount a .50 cal up top.

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  98. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    thedavincimode

    It could be the recoil that yet proves to be his undoing. One long burst at the commie hordes at the corner of Cameron Rd & 15th Ave & poor old Red’s mobility scooter is arse up with care in the harbour.

    As usual the Devil’s in the detail.

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  99. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    @thedavincimode @nasska

    Scoot by killings?

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  100. Scott Chris (5,682 comments) says:

    While it is bad reasoning (he lied about that, so he must be lying about this), it is human nature to assume such a thought as truth. It would be wrong, though, and should not be validated.

    All the more reason to dispense with juries Smith.

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  101. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    PG

    Leave us hope it doesn’t end up like this photo suggests: http://nourishingobscurity.blogspot.co.nz/2007/08/hells-grannies-rise-of-machines.html

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  102. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    nasska

    Here’s a joke that should make the old ‘baiter happy.

    Osama, curiously, wound up at the Pearly Gates after the ‘baiter-lead SEAL time interupted his porn video session. He met a chap at the gates who had a long beard and thought, shit, could it be Muhammad – it has always been my dream to meet him.

    “Are you Muhammad?” he enquired. “No”, was the reply, “my name is Matthew”. “Muhammad is higher in heaven than me. You need to ascend further” and he pointed to a nearby ladder.

    Osama shot up the ladder and at the top was met by another bearded gentleman. “Are you Mohammad?” he again enquired. “No”, the other replied, “my name is Peter”. “Muhammad is higher in heaven than me. You need to ascend further” and he pointed to another nearby ladder.

    Osama was impressed by this, for clearly the acursed infidels had been put in their place. He shot up the next ladder and encountered another bearded gentleman. “Are you Mohammad?” he again enquired. “No”, the other replied, “my name is Jesus”. “Muhammad is higher in heaven than even me. You need to ascend further” and again Osama was directed to another ladder.

    Overjoyed, Osama clambered up the ladder and arrived before another beared figure. Once again he enquired: “”Are you Mohammad?”. “No my son, I am God”, was the reply. “Would you care for some coffee?”

    Osama prostrated himself: “Only if it isn’t too much trouble oh mighty Allah”.

    “No trouble at all” said God, and he clapped his hands, and turned, calling over his shoulder: “Hoi, Mohammad, two coffees and make it snappy”.

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  103. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    “A boomerang statement.”

    That’s funny coming from one of the most odious commenters, and who is detested by left and right for his smarmy self absorption.

    Note the likes on your Whaleoil efforts Pete.

    Nasska and Davinci, the homosexual tag team who can’t get over their obsession with Redbaiter. If only you possessed enough self awareness to realise how infantile and boring you are, you’d probably not write another word anywhere.

    Kind of funny too when by his photos, their left flanker PG is clearly a hell of a lot older than I am.

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  104. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    Busy day over at Masterblogger Control old dear?

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  105. david@tokyo (262 comments) says:

    F E Smith,

    Totally agree that suspicion shouldn’t be enough, this is why I tend to think he’ll be acquitted. (But then I thought David Bain would be found guilty based similarly on reading media coverage, so I might be surprised again.)

    I’m not really buying the idea that crims are necessarily dumb for the most part though. Crims are humans like you, I and the police.

    thedavincimode,

    Fortunately I don’t have the opportunity to watch NZ TV much these days (except for rugby). On the other hand, I am subjected to Japanese TV…

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  106. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    thedavincimode

    The poor wretch certainly needs something to brighten up his miserable existence. How about we take it in turns to visit his blog site on a regular basis…..we could probably double the traffic it now receives.

    I’ll visit on the second Saturday of July, September & November…. can you spare the time for the other three clickons this year?

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  107. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    Wow, what’s going on at The Standard. There’s some touchy ‘moderators’.

    I knew I stood a high chance of Eddie banning me when I commented/linked on his post yesterday. And he did.

    But I thought Irish Bill was one of the more fair ones there. Until today. His post is a premature ‘analysis’ of the merits of investing in Mighty River.

    @Irishbill
    After reading your thoughts regarding the partial sell down of energy assets it is probably best that you don’t invest because you don’t exhibit a great deal of knowledge on the subject.

    For instance in capital markets shares in energy utilities are amongest the most highly prized of investments because they produce a consistent and regular income stream, an excellent return on investment.

    In a New Zealand context the energy utilities are still partially owned by the government which affords good protection from competitive activity, because governments are in a good position to regulate the market and reduce the extreme swings that occur in other markets such as rental housing or finance companies.
    Share values in utilities don’t experience the highs and lows of other markets, therefore it is a misnomer that trading in the shares alone is the quick route to wealth, it is not.

    Investors in this market are in for the long haul and the dividends and relative security of the investment.

    IrishBill: It is probably best you don’t comment on blogs as you seem to lack basic comprehension. Take a week off for starting a comment by insulting an author.

    An accurate first statement, but that could hardly be called an insult – more of a defensive over reaction in ignorance.

    And then:

    @irishbill
    As a regular reader of the standard but not a commenter, I am a bit shocked that you would ban someone for that? For those of us without strong leanings one way or another in the political spectrum it is interesting to see and hear both sides of an argument. Given some of the hysterical comments and insults that get thrown around Kevin’s barely registered.

    What prompted me to reply was the fact that instead of countering his argument you have a bit of a sulk and ban him for a week?! If his logic and conclusions are cobblers then have the courage in your argument, develop a bit of a thicker skin and demonstrate the flaws in his – not throw a wee tanty and silence his perspective. If all you want are fan boy like responses – ok, but tell people up front….Open dialogue whether you like the comment or not is healthy even if it is just to prove the soundness of your own position.

    Many of the bannings I have seen were fully deserved – but this just came across as shutting down a view you didn’t like because you thought it made yours look incorrect. Poor form

    IrishBill: For all your regular reading you’ve obviously not paid attention to my moderation style. If you come into my house and start by insulting me you’ll get slung out. I also dislike people attributing motives to me so you can take a week off for that and for your “tanty” remark.

    If that’s the sort of ‘insult’ you can expect to get ‘slung out’ for it makes the forum there farcical.

    I often comment there knowing the knife is hovering if I push the boundary a little, and sometimes they lose control and ban, despite much worse crap frequentlybeing ignored.

    But this is like nothing I’ve seen there – an extreme reaction from Irish Bill because, well, either his comments were financialy ignorant, or they were deliberate crap to try and muddy the investment waters.

    http://thestandard.org.nz/a-poor-investment/comment-page-1/#comment-488167

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  108. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    No, sorry. I’ll be busy watching concrete set for the rest of the year.

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  109. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    One wonders why RedBaiter is so want t o visit and comment on this vile mess of communists and marxists instead of finding somewhere closer to his own political leanings.

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  110. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    TheContrarian

    Alzheimer’s?

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  111. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    finding somewhere closer to his own political leanings.

    There’s nothing that comes close to his political leanings.

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  112. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    A lie. I always get far more likes on Whaleoil than you.

    If there is anyone with unpopular political beliefs it is you PG, mainly because you’re such a wishy washy all things to all men compromising coward.

    Example-

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2012/06/expensive-completely-subsidised-tv-show-bites-the-dust/

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  113. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    Ya see! The rancid old dear just wants to be liked (but not by homosexuals).

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  114. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    I like you Red. I like you a lot.

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  115. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    You go to Whaleoil to be liked? Wow. I guess you have to find somewhere.

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  116. RRM (8,994 comments) says:

    Redbaiter (321) Says:
    June 28th, 2012 at 3:39 pm

    I always get far more likes on Whaleoil than you.

    BAHAHAHA!!!

    That’s like saying the Bearded Lady gets a lot of ‘likes’ at the Freak Show.

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  117. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    PG

    Its tragic really. He’d hoped that Gordon Campbell would become his pen pal but that didn’t work out. Hasn’t left him with many options sadly.

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  118. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    Surely one of the church groups in Tauranga could get someone to visit occasionally.

    It’s very sad!

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  119. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    Why is it the far left (many at The Standard) and the Far Right (like old Red Baiter here) are always the bitterest people you could meet?

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  120. RRM (8,994 comments) says:

    I think that’s what a lifetime of taking politics far too seriously does to you…

    Maybe Dime knows some Tauranga Hookers he could recommend to baiter? A happy ending might be just what the poor guy needs…

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  121. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    RRM

    There’s some things that even hookers won’t do.

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  122. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    Why is it the far left (many at The Standard) and the Far Right (like old Red Baiter here) are always the bitterest people you could meet?

    Extreme fustration, because their needs and their ideals will never come close to being met. The more successful someone is in politics the more bitter they are about them.

    Peter Dunne gets dumped on so much – on blogs and by opposition MPs – because he’s in a position that they want to be, except that they think with the casting vote they could do anything they like.

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  123. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    nasska

    Unfortunately the only church group he wants to engage with is some White Knights crowd in Mississippi. I guess distance is a bit of a problem in the circs.

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  124. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    Why would he need a hooker when he’s got his helium inflated Sarah Palin doll to chase around the flat?

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  125. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    @Pete

    Yeah, on The Standard I notice you are Dunne by proxy. The swine are vicious towards you

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  126. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    thedavincimode

    Fussy old bugger isn’t he? Just when I was about to jack him up with a visit by the Mormons.

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  127. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    What, send a couple of fresh, clean-cut pious young lads to his door? Armed only with the bibles and bicycles? Would that be wise?

    They make movies about that sort of thing ya know.

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  128. Angus (536 comments) says:

    “Maybe Dime knows some Tauranga Hookers he could recommend to baiter? A happy ending might be just what the poor guy needs…”

    Maybe Jason Somerville can arrange some for you?

    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2009/11/oh_my_god-2.html#comment-629728

    Necro Freak

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  129. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    thedavincimode

    I never thought of that angle. Never mind, we’ll think of something.

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  130. RRM (8,994 comments) says:

    Angus – I think it’s AWESOME that you are still posting up links to that comment of mine. :-)

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  131. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    @TheContrarian

    I’ve raised the abuse issue sometimes but moderators always justify it, and usually blame me.

    It would be hilarious if they weren’t trying to pass as a serious political blog.

    One minute they try to say I am a totally ineffectual know nothing, say nothing RWNJ who lies about have any contact with Dunne, next thing they demand I make Dunne bring down the government. And I think they’re serious.

    Mostly I don’t care, but some of them are known to be in parties, Labour, Greens and Mana, some holding office, some as paid PR. That’s a worry for 2014.

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  132. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    @RRM
    You sir, are worse than Hitler (by Hitler I of course mean John key)

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  133. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    @Pete

    Some of them are extremely rude and speak nothing but abuse.
    But that’s alright – it’s a bit of a circle jerk over there.

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  134. Angus (536 comments) says:

    RRM – remember to write it in your final will & testament that you give your missus permission to ride your little monkeydick cowgirl at your funeral. But stipulate that she waits until rigor mortis sets in first.

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  135. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    Skip over it all you want Pete- you’re a liar.

    (and how many votes did you personally pick up again..???)

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  136. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    david@tokyo,

    never think that you get the full story from media reports. They don’t cover everything, and often don’t understand the process well enough (or at all) to have a good idea of what is important. That is if they even stay in the Courtroom for that long, which many don’t.

    There is the odd specialist court reporter who is decent, but not many. And none of them are with the television media, I think.

    And re the crims being dumb: let’s just say that in my experience few of them have been very bright.

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  137. Lance (2,311 comments) says:

    Like the line out of ‘Good morning Vietnam’

    “You are in more dire need of a blow job than any white man in history”

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  138. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    Angus-

    Good to see all the fake rightists so clearly identified. Nasska and Davinci teaming up with PG and RRM.

    Easy to see why NZ is a left wing swamp when these simpering political eunuchs have been the so called “opposition”.

    Surrender monkeys who couldn’t oppose a tray of lamingtons.

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  139. RRM (8,994 comments) says:

    LOL angus you poor underdeveloped wee fulla. If you had an ounce of faculty for reading comprehension you would have seen it’s not something I myself have any desire for whatsoever.

    But you are too intellectually feeble and too emotionally weak to even begin trying to think through the issue that was being discussed there, to figure out the relative wrongs for yourself. Pathetic.

    Say hi to the smiling god fearing fluffy bunnies in conservative la la land for me won’t you?

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  140. Lance (2,311 comments) says:

    Dot com searches illegal
    Breaking news

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  141. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    who couldn’t oppose a tray of lamingtons.

    I must admit I wouldn’t oppose lamingtons, I quite like them really, as long as the icing wasn’t too thin and soaked in too much. I prefer chocolate.

    Back to the mundane everyday news, wow, Dotcom search warrants. I wonder if they found any lamingtons.

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  142. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    Fuck lamingtons, I could oppose them. I couldn’t oppose a scotch a Cuban (socialist!) cigar.

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  143. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    Lance,

    that case is turning into one big screw-up by the Police and the Crown.

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  144. RRM (8,994 comments) says:

    Pete was it you complaining about a PhilU-centric General Debate a month or so ago? ;-)

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  145. alex Masterley (1,439 comments) says:

    The dotcom decision has just made my day.
    Watch the fur fly and the finger pointing begin.
    Could make the application to extradite Mr Dotcom to the US a bit difficult to prosecute!

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  146. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    yeah the dotcom decision is going to be hectic.
    right will blame left and the left will blame the right while Penny Bright will blame John Banks

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  147. publicwatchdog (1,840 comments) says:

    Here you go Kiwibloggers!

    Some of you will LOVE this news :)

    _____________________________________________________________________________________________

    VICTORY FOR OCCUPY AUCKLAND!

    “CIV 2011 004 2497, Auckland Council v The occupiers of Aotea Square

    ‘Contempt’ proceedings against Occupy Auckland by Auckland Council have been discontinued.

    Email received from Auckland District Registry Officer 26/6/2012

    “Dear All,

    Please note that the counsel for the plaintiff has filed a Notice of Discontinuance, hence fixture scheduled for 29th June 2012 is vacated.

    Regards

    ……………….
    Court Registry Officer
    Civil and Family Services – Case Management Team
    Auckland District Court
    Ministry of Justice | Tahu o te Ture ”
    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Penny Bright
    ‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

    Named Party in the above-mentioned (now discontinued) proceedings.

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  148. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    I shouldn’t have said her name…

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  149. RRM (8,994 comments) says:

    Great news!

    This leftie likes having rich pricks like dotcom around, he certainly adds bit of colour to public life in Auckland, I’m bored of reading about “scandals” that inevitably involve the lame antics of dumb-arse league players hooking up with C-list socialites / whores…

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  150. MikeMan (171 comments) says:

    I am so happy about the DOTCOM ruling :)

    Take that US Media industry.

    BTW Megabox is still coming despite your best efforts

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  151. Redbaiter (6,482 comments) says:

    Angus- is there any more evidence needed of how intellectually crippled these pathetic commies on GD really are? Trying so hard to be funny and exhibiting all the wit of a soggy crumpet. No self awareness. No intuition. Just dumb boring half educated uninformed socialist thugs. That’s what you get after thirty years of Marxism.

    http://pc.blogspot.com.au/2012/06/guest-post-by-lindsay-perigo-shock.html

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  152. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    The Dotcom decision can be found here.

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  153. Pete George (21,828 comments) says:

    RRM – I doubt it, I usually stay out of the PhilU episodes – only when something relevant catches my eye I might respond, but rarely. I mostly just scroll past the dot blights.

    But point taken, I was thinking I shouldn’t get drawn into that.

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  154. Angus (536 comments) says:

    “That’s what you get after thirty years of Marxism”

    Indeed. And isn’t Perigo good when he takes a break from droning on about drugs, religion and faggotry?

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  155. David Garrett (5,150 comments) says:

    Well what a jolly old time had here today! some serious and generally intelligent discussion about the unfolding drama in the McDonald trial; a bit about asset sales; an odd currant to liven up the bun by way of references to the religion of peace; a bit of a spat about the merits and bona fides or otherwise of various websites that I personally have no interest in; and a bit of largely friendly jousting between the usual combatants…Good gracious, even Redbaiter is in, what for him, passes as a good mood…

    (I am reminded of Samuel Beckett’s response when a friend remarked that it was such a nice day that it felt good to be alive…Becket supposedly replied “Oh, I wouldnt go that far…”)

    But best of all…NO WHITE NOISE! Hurrah, said the regular commenters, and the people all thought God was in his heaven, and the Lord Farrar’s creation was once again good, and the people did rejoice at their deliverance from the pestilience….and they sayeth unto each other “He does indeed move in mysterious ways, his wonders to behold!”

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  156. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    David Garrett

    Amen! :)

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  157. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    So,

    1. The Dotcom search warrant was invalid. It fell well short of the necessary detail required.
    2. Even if it was valid, the Police seized items that they were not authorised to seize. The categories of items authorised listed both relevant and irrelevant items and were too broad. It is generally not lawful to seize items not relevant to the investigation.
    3. The Police/Crown broke the law when they allowed the FBI to copy seized hard drives.
    4. No remedies ordered as yet pending further argument.

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  158. Pauleastbay (5,030 comments) says:

    Dotcom warrants illegal says the High Court – excellent news – FBI not looking so flash and so will a few of NZ’s finest who will have got abit carried away with the glamour.

    Bereal are you sober enough now to understand now what most here were talking about when the warrants were first executed.

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  159. Other_Andy (2,079 comments) says:

    “But best of all…NO WHITE NOISE! Hurrah, said the regular commenters, and the people all thought God was in his heaven, and the Lord Farrar’s creation was once again good, and the people did rejoice at their deliverance from the pestilience….and they sayeth unto each other “He does indeed move in mysterious ways, his wonders to behold!”

    Hallelujah to that…..

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  160. joana (1,983 comments) says:

    Great to see that woman from westpac get seven and a half years for fraud. Do the lawyers among us know if this is long sentence?

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  161. David Garrett (5,150 comments) says:

    Joana: I am not a criminal lawyer…but I believe seven years is pretty stiff for a white collar crime…I assume “the woman from Westpac” is Ms Hurring, she who thought her boyfriend had won Lotto?

    She will almost certainly be out in less than three, but thats the Labour govt for you…

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  162. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    DG,

    no, I think Joanna is referring to the $1.4 million fraud by an employee.

    Fraud is always a tough one, because so much of it depends on the circumstances. This one is pretty bad, so 7 and a half years sounds about right. Like David said, she will be eligible for parole at one third and will be a strong candidate for it.

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  163. Viking2 (10,737 comments) says:

    Justice Winkleman for Govenor General.

    Sha has just handed the police, the FBI, the Attourney general and all thoise other smug bastards their arses an on a plate.
    Yahoo.
    Justice being done.
    Now All that remains is to see if those same bastrds that acted illegally will be tried and forced to pay our legal bills and compensation.

    Great stuff.

    Dotcom search warrants ruled illegal
    CHARLES ANDERSON
    Last updated 17:29 28/06/2012

    A High Court judge has ruled that police search warrants used to seize property from Kim Dotcom were illegal.

    Justice Helen Winkelmann found that the warrants used did not properly describe the offences to which they were related.

    The FBI agents had been accused of underhanded behaviour by Dotcom’s lawyers in the High Court after they secretly copied data from his computers and took it overseas.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/7188234/Dotcom-search-warrants-ruled-illegal

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  164. Viking2 (10,737 comments) says:

    So now they have lost that argument perhaps they will lose tgis one.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/7187904/Drug-report-no-surprise-police

    The 2012 United Nations World Drug Report revealed the rate of annual drug use for New Zealanders was the highest in the world alongside Australians. Both countries were found to have the highest usage rate for nearly all drugs except heroin.

    Which is unmittigated dribble of course. Fired into cyberspace by the FBI no doubt.

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  165. Shunda barunda (2,964 comments) says:

    I am very pleased with the Dotcom ruling, the yanks may not give a shit about justice anymore but I am glad my country does.

    America can get stuffed as far as I am concerned, the FBI are clearly not representing Americans or justice, they are simply the bitch of corporate America.

    …………………./´¯/)
    ………………..,/¯../
    ………………./…./
    …………./´¯/’…’/´¯¯`•¸
    ………./’/…/…./……./¨¯\
    ……..(’(…´…´…. ¯~/’…’)
    ………\……………..’…../
    ……….”…\………. _.•´
    …………\…………..(

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  166. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    On the lighter side of internet debating….
    The Internet Contrarian

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  167. SGA (545 comments) says:

    Concerning the Dotcom ruling, just out of curiosity, whose butt needs to kicked about this? The head of the police? Some nameless bureaucrat in Foreign Affairs? It looks as if someone has bent over backwards/forwards/missionary position (whatever) to do the FBIs bidding. I’ve no idea how this process works or who takes reponsibility – anyone wiser?

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  168. Pauleastbay (5,030 comments) says:

    I’d start with the Crown,And I’d be interested to know which Judge signed off on the warrants.

    The police will have executed the warrants without query if they came from the FBI to the NZ Govt and then from the Crown. The cops are just the gun, the bullets will have been the points on the warrant application.

    Ms Toohy. hello, Simon did you check the warrants , you do hold the warrant .

    I wonder what cops and Crown staff got a trip to the States out of this?

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  169. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    SGA,

    nobody takes responsibility. The Police will blame the Crown for not winning the case. The Crown will blame the Police for not making their affidavits and warrant application watertight. Both Crown and Police will blame the Court and the Defence for being obstructive and loving criminals.

    Actual responsibility will belong to a few people, including Grant Wormald and Anne Toohey. There will be others, but those are mentioned in the decision. I am not sure if anybody at the Auckland Crown Solicitors office was involved in the applications, or anyone from the Police Legal Service (although they are often yes-men anyway). Basically this was a stuff-up on a number of levels.

    To be honest, the defence accusation of Crown/Police high-handedness appears to have some weight to it. There is more than a hint of arrogance about how the Crown and Police have gone about this case.

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  170. TheContrarian (1,043 comments) says:

    Link above broken, fixed link:

    We have probably all been there…

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  171. Pauleastbay (5,030 comments) says:

    FE

    A warrant like this would not have got anywhere near going before a Judge without the Crown going over it, if not dictating it.

    The cops will cop the flak as usual and probably deserve some but it rests on the Auckland Crown Solicitors Office squarely. Toohy will have known she was in the shit from the get go and performed accordingly

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  172. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    PEB,

    yeah, that is what I thought. My own view is that both sets of the higher ups involved should get blamed.

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  173. Viking2 (10,737 comments) says:

    Don’t forget the Attourney Generals grubby hands were all over this before the event and that both Crusher and Key were informed. Maybe even Foriegn Affairs minister.
    So Winklemans ruling is a kick up the arse for them as well. And rightly so.
    Appalling that our Govt. didn’t or wouldn’t defend the rights of a citizen of NZ. Not unusual though.

    And PEB, while you have always agreed with me on this case I note your antipathy to the young ladies dress sense yesterday and your emotive unsubsatntiated attacks on oneself.
    There is no difference between these cases. Its all about peoples individual rights and property ownership. You didn’t like her dress, so who are you to say anything and for that matter some old foggy in a courthouse. One which has no explicit rules about dresss and even if it did they would be stuffed in no time.

    I’m happy to accept your apology and acknowlegement that you still have a long way to go when it comes to indivduals rights.
    Yours Truly
    Viking ( defender of individual rights)

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  174. SGA (545 comments) says:

    @FES, PEB, V2

    Thanks – much appreciated.

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  175. Scott Chris (5,682 comments) says:

    ______________$$$$$$$
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    __________$$$_________________$$$$$

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  176. thedavincimode (6,131 comments) says:

    Scott

    Your graphic representation of your judicial expertise?

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  177. Viking2 (10,737 comments) says:

    Took you all afternoon while the baby slept did it?

    Rainy days. Bored people. Go get a job.
    Do some community Service.

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  178. Viking2 (10,737 comments) says:

    Parliament rejects legislation to allow Easter trading
    5:52 PM Thursday Jun 28, 2012

    Parliament has again rejected legislation to allow Easter trading.

    National MP for Waitaki Jacqui Dean’s bill allowing shops to open over Easter in Waitaki and Wanaka, was voted down by 49 votes to 70 last night.

    Once more the god Botherer’s and the National socialists have combined to retrict others freedom to trade.
    Whgen are the Nats really going to grow some balls and get the F—K out of peoples lives.?

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  179. mikenmild (8,894 comments) says:

    V2
    I may have said this before, but National are conservative, in the do nothing sense of the word.
    Theirs is a long history of coming into office and preserving the status quo while uttering a few platitudes and passing a few pandering changes (see car crushing or charter schools).

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  180. Nostalgia-NZ (4,697 comments) says:

    Don’t quite know how police get the blame for the dotcom fiasco because it presumes that the requests were at lower levels and not to the top of police or elsewhere. There might not have been enough sharp interest or control but that’s another matter. Whatever happened it looks like a bunch of dimwits breaking out of the asylum were running the operation, and that could be the real point of embarrassment: the FBI treating the NZ authorities like they were compliant dumbos while the US tore down dotcom’s business and filched his assets.

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  181. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    Nostalgia,

    are you saying that someone other than the Police carried out the raid and took more that they were entitled to take under the invalid warrant that was granted by a District Court judge on the application of a senior police officer, that application and its accompanying affidavit, most likely sworn by that senior police officer, being drafted either by or in close collaboration with either the Crown Solicitor for Auckland or the Crown Law Office in Wellington?

    Ok, so who was it?

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  182. Leaping Jimmy (15,594 comments) says:

    This is funny cos its true, on lotsa levels

    http://www.gilad.co.uk/writings/family-guy-offends-hollywood-jews.html

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  183. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    A cannibal was walking through the jungle and came upon a restaurant operated by a fellow cannibal. Feeling somewhat hungry, he sat down and looked over the menu…
    + Tourist: $5
    + Broiled Missionary: $10.00
    + Fried Explorer: $15.00
    + Baked Labour MP or Grilled Green: $100.00
    The cannibal called the waiter over and asked, ‘Why such a price difference for the Politicians?’
    The cook replied, “Have you ever tried to clean one? They’re so full of shit, it takes all morning.”

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  184. Steve (North Shore) (4,327 comments) says:

    I reckon this megaupload stuff is all political.
    Obama wants back in so he pulls strings to take down music/movie piracy. FBI, CIA and whoever bangs his drum. Down here in NZ we are so fucking incompetent we screw up big time. The Americans copy what is on the servers and shoot through.
    All of this copyright shit has been going on for years.
    This has Helen’s paw prints all over it, she wants Obama to stay so she can become the highest of high in UN and the New World Order. So Helen says ‘get this pirate and make an example’ But it has turned to shit.

    Come back Pirate Bay and BT Junkie

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  185. slijmbal (1,134 comments) says:

    Interesting that dotcom ran a business he knew a significant amount of his income came from illegal activities but is probably legal. Then that the US appear to have played NZ to put him out of business but frankly have not touched youtube who arguably did something similar.

    No wonder dotcom is getting so much support.

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  186. Steve (North Shore) (4,327 comments) says:

    Hone Harawira was in Noel Leeming.

    He was there to protest the fact that most of the washing machines
    were white.

    So the clerk called the store manager, who asked, “What’s the problem
    here, Hone?”

    Hone pointed at the machines and loudly bemoaned the fact That most of
    them were white.

    The manager replied, “Well, Hone, it’s true that most of the washing
    machines are white, but if you’ll open the lids, You’ll see that all
    the agitators are black.”

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  187. Steve (North Shore) (4,327 comments) says:

    Now that the ‘curse’ has gone the ‘god botherers’ may turn GD into Generallly Religious Debate.
    Before they do:

    Sister Mary Ann, who worked for a home health agency, was out making her rounds visiting homebound patients when she ran out of gas. As luck would have it, a Texaco Gasoline station was just a block away.

    She walked to the station to borrow a gas can and buy some gas. The attendant told her that the only gas can he owned had been loaned out, but she could wait until it was returned. Since Sister Mary Ann was on the way to see a patient, she decided not to wait and walked back to her car.

    She looked for something in her car that she could fill with gas and spotted the bedpan she was taking to the patient. Always resourceful, Sister Mary Ann carried the bedpan to the station, filled it with gasoline, and carried the full bedpan back to her car.

    As she was pouring the gas into her tank, two Baptists watched from across the street.. One of them turned to the other and said,

    ‘If it starts, I’m turning Catholic.’!!

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  188. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    Theory of Relativity: If you could fly twice the speed of light, you could land on Mars, get out of your spaceship and watch yourself come.
    Or, a cheaper way,……….. install mirrors on your bedroom ceiling.

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  189. Steve (North Shore) (4,327 comments) says:

    I’m on a roll. Something for the public v private sector debate seeing as civil servants go on holiday tomorrow:

    Bryan: So, John, what are you going to do when you leave school?

    John: Actually, Dad, I’m looking at organised crime.

    Bryan: Private or Public sector?

    John: Whaddya mean?

    Bryan: Private sector is like your garden variety Bikie gang member. Their job is to cause misery and harm to society through violence, extortion and drugs.

    John: And the Public sector?

    Bryan: Climate Science, mostly.

    John: What do climate scientists do?

    Bryan: Their job is to only cause misery and harm to society through extortion and fraud.

    John: Where’s the money come from?

    Bryan: Bikies beat up the people who owe them money, but Climate Scientists just get the government to do it for them.

    John: How?

    Bryan: With Renewable Energy Targets, Carbon Taxes, Electricity bills etc. That sort of thing.

    John: What’s the pay like?

    Bryan: Bikies get a lot of money, but most of it goes to the government when they get caught. Think of the “Proceeds of Crime” provisions as an industry super tax.

    John: What does a climate scientist get?

    Bryan: An indexed salary, paid fortnightly, with holidays, super and perks.

    John: Perks?

    Bryan: Junkets to exotic locations and the opportunity to lecture the Western world on the need for simpler, low intensity lifestyles.

    John: Where do they go?

    Bryan: Rio, Bali, Can-Cun…

    John: Copenhagen?

    Bryan: Not any more.

    John: And the Bikies?

    Bryan: They get to go to gaol. Also at taxpayer expense, but definitely not a junket. More an occupational hazard.

    John: What’s job security like?

    Bryan: In the Bikie world, if you stuff up, they beat you up and kill you.

    John: What happens to climate scientists?

    Bryan: No climate scientist has ever been sacked on grounds of incompetency.

    John: Sounds great – how do you get in?

    Bryan: It’s all about being seen and making an impression. Bikes only get their colours after a gruelling probation period, during which they must perform no less than three acts of conspicuous thuggery.

    John: How do you make a climate scientist?

    Bryan: Usually, it’s a high fibre diet.

    John: Don’t get it.

    Bryan: A small joke on my part. Again, it’s a case of making an impression. Wannabe climate scientists hang around academic institutions producing scary, convoluted and semi-plausible scientific papers. The more conspicuous ones get picked up by the peer review system and, after that, they’re in.

    John: Sounds great Dad. Thanks for your help.

    Bryan: So what are you going to do?

    John: I think I’ll be a Bikie. Climate science sounds dishonest.

    Bryan: I’m proud of you, Son.

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  190. nasska (9,549 comments) says:

    Steve (North Shore)

    Good one! Should fire up the whackos.

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  191. Leaping Jimmy (15,594 comments) says:

    Steve I’m afraid that’s a hopeless theory @ 8:02.

    I mean on many levels.

    What happened was, the big media companies who are huge multi-million backers of the US politicians both state and national and all levels: house, senate and President; told the politicians through their lobby groups what to do. The US just HAPPENED to be dealing with something called the TPP and one of the corporate media targets was hanging out in little ole NZ possibli because he knew a thing or two about what said media companies had been up to in recent past years, which wasn’t hard, since things like PirateBay kinda get around, ya know.

    So the US of A comes a swaggering along to the eeny weeny NZ govt who just wants to be weally weally nice re the TPP and then, history went from there.

    That’s what really happened. Coincidences don’t happen in politics Steve. If it happened, it was planned to happen that way. – Lyndon Johnson.

    The keys to unravelling it are looking at the sorts of people the govt appointed in the early days to handle all of the “details” before it all turned to shit. For those people will have reputations for being utter complete aholes of the finest variety who are well used to trampling over everybody and shouting people down until they get their way and I’m talking about people like the Crown Law counsel who was I believe a real bitch and whose name was mentioned above but I couldn’t possibly comment. Stuff like that, really actually did happen.

    Of course the govt will say nothing like it of the sort ever ever ever ever ever happened and anyone who says it ever did is a complete and utter liar not to mention: ta da – a conspiracy theorist – so there. That’s what the govt will say. And that’s the clue for everyone to switch off and to return to the view which is that Dotcom was all just a dream and it never happened because – ffftt, it was a “conspiracy theory man” – duh – don’t cha know those stuff eren’t real man? Chur. Who the fuck is dot-whatsiname anyhoo. Sounds made up to me man. So how about those ABs eh bro? That’s real, you bet that’s real.

    So hopefully from now on Steve you’ll get with the program and not be quite so annoying anymore. I mean FFS, how else do you expect people to live their peaceful happy lives and the govt the govern and all of that crap? What are ya? Some kinda commie?

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  192. Steve (North Shore) (4,327 comments) says:

    I know how you feel LJ

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  193. Steve (North Shore) (4,327 comments) says:

    150TB of data, that is so huge. There were 60 servers in Honk Kong – so I read in the media.

    Well seeing as I have 3 drives in my comp with a total of 2TB and then have external drives, the 150TB does not seem much for the FBI to copy – unless they use shit drives and units.
    Yeah I am some kind of commie lol :)

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  194. Nostalgia-NZ (4,697 comments) says:

    FE 7.50

    I’m saying that an international operation, co-operated on between at least two countries, one without authority other than as an observer in a foreign state, isn’t planned in the local cop shop or the Crown law office.

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  195. Leaping Jimmy (15,594 comments) says:

    Here’s a good article on the Turkey fighter shot down. A mile into international waters equates to 2 seconds at Phantom Wild Weasel speeds. Meaning the missile was launched when it was in Syrian territory. I imagine that will be well traversed in the learned and endless panel discussions in the western MSM, don’t you?
    http://www.activistpost.com/2012/06/nato-loses-plane-violating-syrian.html

    http://www.activistpost.com/2012/06/richard-branson-says-war-on-drugs-is.html
    broken and always has been… well duh.

    http://corporatemediaexposed.com/2012-london-olympics-undercover-journalist-reveals-that-200000-casket-linings-on-standby-american-and-foreign-troops-onsite-evacuation-plan-ready-for-all-of-london/
    Doesn’t the London Olympics want to be secure?

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  196. Fletch (5,726 comments) says:

    you might have to squint…


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  197. Scott Chris (5,682 comments) says:

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    _________ ▓▓___███❋█__▓▓_
    ________▒▒__ ♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒
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    ________♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒▒♥
    ______ ♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒▒♥▒▒
    _______________▓▓ ▓▓
    _(▒)(▒)_________▓▓_▓▓
    (▒)(▓)(▒)_______▓▓__▓▓
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    ______████████▓
    _______█☼█___██____(░)(░)
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  198. Nostalgia-NZ (4,697 comments) says:

    Self portrait – Scotty?

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  199. RRM (8,994 comments) says:

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  200. Nostalgia-NZ (4,697 comments) says:

    What will happen next?

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  201. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    DavidG,

    sorry, missed your 2.21pm. No, I don’t know why they did that. It does seem odd. It may be, as has been suggested, that they wanted to build a chronological picture. That said, it seems odd and I really don’t get why the judge would allow it. Unfortunately I am not acquainted well enough with the case to give any further opinion. I can just say that it seems like a bit of a waste of court time to me. If we were talking about a multi-defendant tiral with a lot of raids etc, then ok, that makes sense. But in this case I would have thought that a lot of it could be agreed on, although the multi-appearance idea would probably belong to the prosecutor rather than the defence, I would suggest.

    Nostalgia,

    actually, it will have been planned in the Auckland central police station (I am guessing, either there or Police National, PEB can give a better idea) with input either from Crown Law in Wellington or the Auckland Crown Solicitor. So, I suppose that I am disagreeing with you there. The legislation that enables this sort of thing sets out a process to be used when an application is made by a foreign government, but the key factor is that the local authorities oversee the process on home soil.

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  202. graham (2,211 comments) says:

    Hey … this story reminds me of someone a bit closer to home than Mexico.

    ‘Mexico’s worst loser lays the groundwork for another defeat’

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10816183

    Some choice quotes:

    Lopez Obrador drew hundreds of thousands back downtown yesterday for an end-of-campaign rally to hail what he called his imminent victory.

    The only problem is that final polls show Lopez Obrador well in second place, trailing the candidate of Mexico’s former ruling party, Enrique Pena Nieto by anything from 8 to 17 percentage points.

    .
    .
    .

    What remains in doubt for millions of Mexicans is whether Lopez Obrador will quietly accept defeat.

    In that (the 2006) election race, Lopez Obrador led until the final days and his backers could not believe the official result, which showed him less than 1 percentage point short of victor Felipe Calderon, though electoral courts upheld it.

    Lopez Obrador declared himself the “legitimate president of Mexico,” named a Cabinet and toured the country to rally backers against the alleged electoral fraud.

    He spoke for more than an hour describing his presidency as if he had already won.

    He described a Mexico where he would fund more social spending without new taxes by cutting government waste and corruption.

    Maria Antonia Bedolla … said … “He will win if they don’t steal [the election] from us like they did six years ago.” If he lost, “I will express my discontent about the fraud”.

    Luis Rubio, president of the Centre for Development Research, an independent think tank, said that Lopez Obrador has been “anticipating the alleged fraud for weeks.

    “The notion that there is fraud is alive and well in his rhetoric,” he said.

    “Lopez Obrador is Lopez Obrador and he will not recognise the result no matter what.”

    Mexico’s Federal Electoral Institute was pressuring the candidates to sign a “civility pact” committing them to respect the legitimacy and legality of the election results, a move that appeared aimed at Lopez Obrador.

    Has Penny got any relations in Mexico? :) Look at the similarities …

    Lopez: Considers himself a winner – check.
    Penny: Considers herself a winner – check.

    Lopez: Doesn’t accept having his ass handed to him on a plate – check.
    Penny: Doesn’t accept having her ass handed to her on a plate – check.

    Lopez: Doesn’t accept legitimate election results – check.
    Penny: Doesn’t accept legitimate election results – check.

    Lopez: Complains bitterly about fraud when things don’t go his way – check.
    Penny: Complains bitterly about fraud when things don’t go her way – check.

    Lopez: Accuses everybody of corruption – check.
    Penny: Accuses everybody of corruption – check.

    Lopez: Actually has support from a lot of people – check.
    Penny: Actually has support from a lot of people – oops …

    Ah well, 5 out of 6 is still pretty close.

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  203. Nostalgia-NZ (4,697 comments) says:

    F E Smith

    I agree that the raids were planned in the way you say. But I think there would have been communication at Ministerial level because of the involvement of foreign personnel. The PM said he was made aware of it, so my argument is that being ‘aware’ should involved being satisfied of the validity and legality from advice from his own office – so we don’t have a situation of an official or Minister saying they told me what they were going to do, but didn’t explain how or the legal justification for doing so. It was an rare event and therefore I think needed Minister responsibility. Compare this to what we know about the various Ministers and MPs involvement with dotcom’s immigration application.

    On the point about the ‘revolving door’ witnesses in the EM trial, purely for prejudicial effect in my opinion. The opportunity of having distressed, attractive women repeating what could have been given in evidence during one piece, many times over while the accused sat head down as though guilty for the witnesses being there, but not necessarily because of evidence proving his guilt.

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  204. F E Smith (3,275 comments) says:

    Nostalgia,

    Key might have been told about it, but he is not a lawyer, nor is his office the proper one to decide whether anything was legal. That is the job of Crown Law and the Police. The process is set out in legislation and their is no requirement at all for the PM to be involved in the process, nor any authority for him to exercise if he is involved. The blame for this in no way attaches to John Key, or his office. Unlike the immigration application, this is a law enforcement issue, at least at this end, and the politicians are informed out of courtesy only.

    It is possible that your theory re the revolving door witnesses is correct. I would just note that the usual repeat witness is a police officer, but beyond that I cannot say.

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