With respect butt out your Majesty
June 7th, 2012 at 12:00 pm by David FarrarWith all respect, the decisions made around the Christchurch Cathedral are not an issue that should need to be justified to someone living in London. The decisions are a matter for the Anglican Church in Christchurch and New Zealand.
June 7th, 2012 at 12:04 pm
And who is head of the church?
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:07 pm
Apparently the Queen is not the head of the Anglican Church in NZ [if you choose to trust the reporter.]
Apparently (also) she was seeking an update on what was happening with the Cathedral and the reasons behind the decision, not to have the decisions overturned. I.e. she wanted information, not a chance to issue a directive.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:08 pm
Another distraction. Yawn, yawn.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:15 pm
If she comes out here, dons boots and a hard hat, and spends a day with some engineers looking at the cathedral and the rest of the devastation, then she will have earned the right to have an opinion. Until then yes – butt out.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:32 pm
The Queen had only one way of settling all difficulties, great or small. ‘Off with his head!’ she said, without even looking round.
(Hat tip to Lewis Carroll)
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:33 pm
She’s making perfectly legitimate enquiries based on requests from the people she is supposed to represent.
Vote:So, with respect, butt out David.
June 7th, 2012 at 12:33 pm
that’s like saying the pope has no say in what happens to catholic owned properties.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:34 pm
Sounds like the proverbial media beat-up to me.
Such as we know them, they facts are:
1. Key visits Elizabeth Mounbatten (aka QE 2) at Buckingham Palace
2. EM says she has received lots of letters re busted cath’l.
3. Key tells her something of the work done and likely the future of the broken cathedral & rubble pile.
4. Key departs, noting that EM did not ATTEMPT TO SECOND GUESS ENGINEERS.
5. Media says EM intervenes.
6. Crap
Incidentally, having met EM twice at official events, I can say she is a very nice and polite lady!
Vote:Monarchist or Repub? Ambivalent.
June 7th, 2012 at 12:35 pm
The Queen is nominally Head of the Church of England but not the Anglican Church.
Vote:‘The Anglican Communion has no official legal existence nor any governing structure which might exercise authority over the member churches. There is an Anglican Communion Office in London, under the aegis of the Archbishop of Canterbury, but it only serves a supporting and organisational role. The Communion is held together by a shared history, expressed in its ecclesiology, polity and ethos and also by participation in international consultative bodies.’ (from Wikipedia.) The Church of england is seen as the ‘Mother’ church.
June 7th, 2012 at 12:35 pm
Still
If HRH comes up with the dosh to cover the HUGE bill to completely rebuild the Cathedral block by block such that it looks just like the original. All power to her elbow I say.
Otherwise its only going to end up a big taxpayer burden.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:36 pm
With all due respect DPF, butt out. Head of state can talk to her PM any time about anything she likes.
Till you and your three friends in the Republican movement get your fantasy to pass thats the way it is.
Nyah nyah nyah.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:41 pm
The English Monarch is the Supreme Governor of the Church of England.
The Anglican Church in Aotearoa/New Zealand is a Branch of the Church of England.
ChristChurch Cathedral is a Cathedral of the Anglican Church in Aotearoa/New Zealand.
Therefore, presumably HM Elizabeth II DOES have a say in what happens to ChristChurch Cathedral…?
Who knows, maybe she’ll stump up some cash for it?
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:43 pm
She’s the head of the church, of course she should be involved. Defensor Fidei and all that. I’d expect the pope to have an opinion about the mick church too.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 12:52 pm
She’s not head nor governor of the church in NZ. There is no single “Anglican Church” with universal juridical authority as each national or regional church has full autonomy.
She is however head of state in NZ.
But that’s our own fault.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 1:22 pm
The Arch Bishop of Canterbury is the spiritual head of the Anglican Church, the monarch appoints the Arch Bishop.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 1:25 pm
I loved Key’s comment the other day about Queen Lizzie not being an engineer………
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 1:35 pm
She is head of the anglican church. Many many NZers have written to her about it. She has every right to enquire. So butt out David. Your concept of a Head of State is to treat her as a kind of performing seal, doing nothing of substance.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 1:42 pm
Our host has already commented on Phils’ gong (the Greek,not the bludger) unfavourably and now this.
HM has received shit stirring letters from her subjects in her far away kingdom( or in progressive language queendom), she meets her PM, leader of her govt in said kingdom ,brings up topic. Says she can’t do shit about it anyway!
What’s the problem? Republicanism I suspect.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 2:35 pm
Mrs Queen: The Lianne Dalziel of the North.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 2:50 pm
tvb, completely apt description, that’s exactly what she is.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 3:10 pm
The Queen of New Zealand wants to know something about New Zealand? How dare she.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 3:18 pm
Also, why do people preface insults using “with respect”?
Or is “butt out” a respectful way to tell someone that something is not their concern?
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 4:30 pm
The person at fault is J Key.
The first rule of the meeting of the Queen and the PM is that what is said in the room stays in the room, unless both agree that it is ok for that issue to be discussed in Public. By releasing the information he is weakening the role of an impartial constitutional Monarch.
The Queen is the confessional for the PM as she out ranks him she is outside the power structures around the PM and all the politics which come with this, how can she do this job if the meeting confidentiality is compromised.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 5:50 pm
DPF
Sorry, HM is fully entitled to ask questions.
Tradtion has it that conversations are not discussed, JK broke convention not HM.
Real issue is bunch of Christchurch bludgers who were not worshippers seeking yet more handouts, Really we are all paying through the nose for Christchurch, interest rates, insurance and still the buggers want more.
Oliver Twist would learn much from Christchurch.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 6:15 pm
The presumption that it had not been agreed to release the fact that she reported to the PM that people had written her letters is questionable. She has only a consultative role to our PM, and what else was discussed was not revealed.
Vote:HM the Queen is the Supreme Governor of the Church of England; she has no role in the Anglican Church in Aotearoa, New Zealand and Polynesia [Te Hahi Mihinare ki Aotearoa ki Niu Tireni, ki Nga Moutere o Te Moana Nui a Kiwa].
Telling the PM that people have written to her was her duty.
June 7th, 2012 at 6:31 pm
The Queen is our head of state, it is her duty to ask about things like this.
I wish the bloody republicans would stop pretending that they speak for all Kiwis.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 7:05 pm
Totally out of order. The nzherald website reports:
“Mr Key said the Queen is clearly not an engineer so is not offering advice on whether it is the right move, but is interested in what is driving the issue.”
So what is the problem with the Queen of New Zealand seeking to understand the issue — an issue that resulted in people writing to her?
The Republican movement in this country will never grow until such time as it stops these churlish, spiteful and misinformed attacks on the Queen, and starts showing us why we should embrace republicanism.
Like with Sir Edmund Hillary’s death, everytime the Queen obeys her constitutional role — ie acting on the advice of the PM — the Republicans attack her.
I’m lukewarm on the issue. But as long as the Queen lives, she provides all the reason why we should remain a monarchy — a woman who has never put a foot wrong (and no, she did not err with the Diana death circus) and has remained steadfast in her duty. Tell me what more could we want in our Head of State.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 7:25 pm
JK is a pillock, he spoke out of turn, should’ve kept his lips shut.
Vote:Of course she’s concerned about her people all over the globe, that’s why she’s been a good queen.
Though perhaps not a mother based on her children’s lives to date.
June 7th, 2012 at 7:54 pm
> “I wish the bloody republicans would stop pretending that they speak for all Kiwis.”
Republicans do speak for Kiwis who don’t want a church/religious leader as head of state.
Vote:June 7th, 2012 at 9:41 pm
What a load of rat shit. The fucking thing is stuffed. Anyhow since when did ones belief in God require a huge structure? I see god every morning when I look at the nature that surrounds me. If God is the boss and head arse kicker why would your knock down your own temple? Shit get over it.
Vote:June 8th, 2012 at 1:51 am
If only this media beat up supported by Dave could blow back to the British Tabloids. Nothing like some negative British press to hit British tourist numbers coming to New Zealand. Who needs who the most?
Vote:June 8th, 2012 at 6:50 am
The only possible reply: With respect butt out DPF.
Vote:June 8th, 2012 at 8:34 am
adamsmith,
Hey bud before you start blaming Chch as the sole reason for insurance premiums rising do some proper research first (from the Wall Street Journal):
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20120328-701906.html
Re the Chch Cathedral, don’t believe all you read in the MSM. Much of their hand-wringing coverage of events down here is pathetic. And whatever you do don’t pay any attention to the Wizard and that fool Keown. Its clearly doing ya head in.
Vote:June 8th, 2012 at 8:41 am
cows4me,
Your right the Cathedral is stuffed. I was at a presentation the other day by Peter Townshend from the Canty Chamber of Commerce who is of the same opinion. The video of the building on the CERA website tells the full story.
Vote: