No Right Turn on Maori Party

July 19th, 2012 at 4:00 pm by David Farrar

Idiot/Savant blogs at NRT:

The Māori Party finally met with John Key last night to discuss his stupidity over water rights, and walked away with an assurance that the government will not legislate to overturn any court decision. In some quarters, this is being portrayed as another sell-out. It’s not. Instead, its a pretty useful victory, which resolves one of the primary fears around the Tribunal / court process: that the government will ignore the outcome, and simply confiscate the water on terms favourable to itself and its cronies if they don’t like how things are going. Now, if they keep their word, they won’t be able to do that, and will have to negotiate like a proper Treaty partner should. And that I think is exactly what the Māori Party is there to do.

While I don’t think National would ever have been stupid enough to repeat Labour’s folly of overturning court upheld property rights by legislation, it is indeed a useful thing for the to have had it explicitly ruled out.

It doesn’t mean that the Government has to follow the recommendations of the Waitangi Tribunal. It does mean though if an actual court makes a finding about property rights in water, then the Government won’t confiscate those property rights legislatively.

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30 Responses to “No Right Turn on Maori Party”

  1. kowtow (8,487 comments) says:

    I have no doubts that a court will find in favour of some special Maori rights.

    Judicial activism is in fashion.

    We need referenda.

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  2. simonway (387 comments) says:

    (Cue non-sequitur complaints about how I/S is a New Zealand-hating communist in 3, 2, 1…)

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  3. Pete George (23,567 comments) says:

    It doesn’t mean that the Government has to follow the recommendations of the Waitangi Tribunal.

    And the taniwha proves ownrship approach of the Maori Coucil today makes not following the tribunal easier for National. In fact it may make a (National) favourable outcome of the Tribunal hearing more of a possibility.

    On taniwha it’s it’s it’s…difficult to comment diplomatically.

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  4. Mr_Blobby (173 comments) says:

    So basically a non answer, from MonKey. Is that really what the people of New Zealand want? I don’t think so.
    So where do, the other parties stand, nothing from Labour or the Greens I see. Nobody wants to upset there Maori MP’s.
    The Clark Government did make a stand, an example NonKey and his clapping surrender Monkeys could take note of.
    You can’t say nobody owns it. It is real and tangible. Most people would say assets like the foreshore and seabed, mineral resources, water etc are owned by the Government on behalf of and for the benefit of all New Zealanders.

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  5. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    Maori will win this issue in the end. They always do in this country. You do have to wonder where it will end. Sadly this will be yet another reason for the talented to up sticks and go to Australia. People have had a gutsful.

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  6. KH (695 comments) says:

    Time to draw a halt to this Maori domination.
    Citizenship, and equality, and government is what they signed up for with the T of W.
    Time they stood by that bargain.
    Parliament needs to halt it.
    The system needs to grow up.
    The claims rort needs to cease.
    New Zealand will be better if we stopped treating Maori as superior.

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  7. Pete George (23,567 comments) says:

    People have had a gutsful.

    I hear that a lot. But I’m not giving in and flying west – we shouldn’t get spirited out of our own country.

    You do have to wonder where it will end.

    Where we allow it to end. That means being prepared to speak up against Maori Correctness. We can respect the good of Maori (and there’s plenty of that) but it doesn’t mean we should be afraid to stand up to the nonsense.

    Those Maori who want to are welcome to keep believing in Taniwha, but that doesn’t mean we should allow them to use them to extort deals.

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  8. virtualmark (1,528 comments) says:

    I truly hope it’s more a case that …

    and walked away with an assurance that the government will not legislate to overturn any court decision unless or until that is one of their clear policy commitments in an election they subsequently win.

    Frankly, if an activist Judge decided that Maori did own water then I’d expect any political party promising to re-legislate that back to public ownership would win an election in a landslide.

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  9. Mr_Blobby (173 comments) says:

    “New Zealand will be better if we stopped treating Maori as superior.”
    Did I miss something Superior in what way. Lying, cheating, stealing, graft, bad personal choices, physical health, mental health, education, ability to rob thy neighbor, produce children they can’t look after, bash said children, kill said children, eat to much, drink to much, smoke to much, bad attitude to everything, begging mentality, ………
    What’s proud and noble about that let alone superior?

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  10. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    Virtualmark,

    This has got nothing to do with ownership. John Key opened his mouth without thinking when he talked about ownership. Now, it seems, he understands that Maori do have rights and interests regarding water. Why he couldn’t have said that at the beginning of this issue is unclear.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/politics/7306462/Key-gives-Maori-Party-assurance-over-water-rights

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  11. Bevan (3,924 comments) says:

    Now, it seems, he understands that Maori do have rights and interests regarding water.

    I have rights and interests regarding water – can I get some koha too?

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  12. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    You can only laugh at the Stone Age people’s belief in the taniwha and assorted myths.
    No wonder their achievements are what they are.

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  13. Bevan (3,924 comments) says:

    Time to draw a halt to this Maori domination.

    Move to Australia. I even know Maori who moved there to get away from Maoridom

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  14. liarbors a joke (1,069 comments) says:

    Lets have the race war Titiwhai H so desperately wants..lets really show them we have had enough.

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  15. James Stephenson (2,180 comments) says:

    difficult to comment diplomatically.

    See Pete, that’s your problem, always trying to be diplomatic. Sometimes you have to call a spade a spade, or in this case, an opportunistic bullshit artist.

    John Key opened his mouth without thinking when he talked about ownership

    No, I think he chose his words well, even if the meedja chose to focus on the “nobody owns water” bit and ignore the “rights and interests are not the same thing as ownership” bit.

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  16. wiseowl (895 comments) says:

    So wrong.
    The decision by Key (and it looks like English), is wrong.
    The Government should be able to legislate if necessary.
    This decision has played into the hands of the race based party and will prove to be another nail in the coffin .
    We are fast becoming second rate citizens in our own country and many cannot see it.
    English more or less said that the meeting last night reaffirmed the commitment to carry on the co-governance path.This perpetuates the aparthied system we now have.

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  17. CharlieBrown (1,012 comments) says:

    John Key is giving into the racist slag and her co-hort in the maori party once again. This racist women who actually thinks the treatment of maori was as bad as the attempted extermination of Jews is nothing more than a festering disease for New Zealand. The possibility that the courts will hand over ownership of something such as the water is abhorent. This is a possibility considering the fact that the court will make it decision based on a 150 year old document that would be considered racist, contradicting and morally repugnant if written today, in fact, such a document would never be considered legally binding due to its flaws. John key is nothing more than a power obsessed brown-nose that cares nothing about the country but is more interested in the thrill of being in power. He is the Sonny Bill of politics.

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  18. lilman (959 comments) says:

    Key fecked this one.
    The decision will be taken to court and the wowsers in the judicial system will fall all over themselves fawning dribbling on about Maori and their conection to their land and water.
    Well played Tutia we just got screwed and Maori are going to be alot richer and more Pontificating than ever.

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  19. wiseowl (895 comments) says:

    And now we have maori seeking an injunction to stop selling Mighty River power because the river is theirs and once again quoting the treaty.
    Proof the decision was wrong.
    And the taniwha has appeared again.

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  20. Adolf Fiinkensein (2,903 comments) says:

    Charlie Brown

    If you must rant, please learn the language:-

    “…….obsessed brown-nose who cares nothing about……”

    if you don’t mind.

    While you’re at it, you might ponder the difference between a Court and the Tribunal.

    BTW, if you think John Key is such a terrible leader, who do you suggest is better?

    Harawira, Norman, Shearer, Peters?……………………..Minto, Cunliffe, John Wright?

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  21. wiseowl (895 comments) says:

    Adolf.
    We have no leader.
    Along with MMP we have a country that is being quietly taken apart.
    A true leader would step up and make the tough decisions.Learn to say NO!
    There is no leader apparent at the present time.

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  22. Caleb (479 comments) says:

    This will cause a lot of anger among the majority of Kiwis.

    Will it be the tipping point to a referendum or the emergence of a new political force? I doubt it.

    These people must know this and I’m picking some kind of undemocratic, back door deal or a very low key settlement. The media will play their part, limiting opposing views and failing to do any analysis of the consequences.

    Harding working people, people who want to get ahead on the back of their own hard work, will continue to leave for Australia. The optimism of the people, who remain, will erode a little more.

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  23. CharlieBrown (1,012 comments) says:

    Adolf – thats the beauty of the internet, you can rant.

    The man key replaced was far freaking better than that C U next Tuesday. And I know there is a difference between a tribunal and a court, I am pissed off because John Key promised that the “Government would not legislate against any court decision upholding Maori rights and interests in water”. To quote the herald:

    Mrs Turia was asked whether that meant that should a court decision subsequent to the tribunal find that Maori did have proprietary type right over water, the Government would not legislate against that.

    She said: “That was what they told us tonight”.

    So either John Key is a liar, or he is a brown nosed sell out.

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  24. James Stephenson (2,180 comments) says:

    So either John Key is a liar, or he is a brown nosed sell out.

    Or, the third option, he’s really really confident that no such legislation will be needed.

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  25. Manolo (13,780 comments) says:

    If only this piss-weak government had the balls and cojones to act decisively and legislate. If only.
    What a pathetic entity today’s National Party has become.

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  26. hj (7,023 comments) says:

    “Green MP Catherine Delahunty ["Witchy-poo"] questioned why iwi have the option to buy back land at today’s price, as part of the Crown’s redress – when it should be the price of the whenua when it was taken.

    She says tribes shouldn’t have to purchase land at market price.
    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/111157/greens-face-backlash-over-treaty-claims-questioning

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  27. hj (7,023 comments) says:

    Witchy poo

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  28. hj (7,023 comments) says:

    Steven Franks was brilliant on the Panel

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/afternoons/audio/2525584/the-panel-with-chris-trotter-and-andrew-clay-part-1.asx

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  29. KH (695 comments) says:

    I don’t mind that we have some Taniwha about the place.
    Some of them you could get quite fond of. And they add to the rich tapestry of life.
    But it beats me how that leads to some of us having to write big fat cheques to others of us.

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  30. Paulus (2,627 comments) says:

    Show the Taniwha the money – that’s what it is all about (or free SOE shares preferably).

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