Will the Mondayisation bill pass?

July 25th, 2012 at 11:00 am by David Farrar

The Herald reports:

Dunedin North MP David Clark remains confident his bill to Monday-ise Waitangi and Anzac Days should they fall at a weekend will pass its first vote tomorrow.

Recent reports had written off the chances of the Holidays (Full Recognition of Waitangi Day and Anzac Day) Amendment Bill but Mr Clark said he had received pledges of support from United Future and the Maori Party – Government allies – along with all Opposition parties.

He told the Otago Daily Times yesterday he expected the bill to pass 61 votes to 60, meaning the legislation would go through to a select committee.

The bill corrected an anomaly that happened roughly twice every seven years. When this glitch happened New Zealanders missed out on the usual full complement of 11 , he said.

I expect it to pass, and actually think National should be backing it. The impact on employers is minimal (around 0.11% of the wages bill on average), and it provides greater certainty.

Since having his bill drawn from the ballot, Mr Clark had received feedback.

“For the folk who work Tuesday to Saturday, or Wednesday to Sunday, they miss out on the Monday holidays. This bill won’t solve that problem. But we will get a chance to hear from people on a wide range of issues.

Well if you do not normally work on a day which is a public holiday, of course you do not get paid for it. That is not a problem, but a feature. Public holidays are not a way to get to earn extra money. They are a way to give people a day off, without it affecting their pay.

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33 Responses to “Will the Mondayisation bill pass?”

  1. Positan (390 comments) says:

    Of all the things to which a parliamentary representative might have been expected to devote or apply his/her talents – surely such as this would fall pretty far down the list?

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  2. krazykiwi (9,186 comments) says:

    Positan, completely agree. A collection of hobbie-horse junkies busying themselves with things that stretch their intellectual capacity. Never mind growth, arresting our slide into sleepy pacific economy status, finding ways to not borrow $250m more every week. No, all too difficult.

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  3. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    You can hardly blame a backbench MP for putting forward this bill, which fill fix an issue that governments could have resolved easily, rather than a bill to promote growth, which is arguably what the government is supposed to be doing.

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  4. KH (695 comments) says:

    Poor Mr David Clark has limited understanding with New Zealand culture on this one. You do mostly get a holiday on Anzac day. But it not what the day is about. It’s a solemn day of remembrance. And New Zealanders increasingly have been taking it seriously. Certainly people do use it as a holiday, but you will find that anybody who wants to schedule some large scale sports event, for example, will be viewed as being a little out of touch.
    Mondayising. Takes the importance of the day away. And reinforces it as a holiday first. Pity.

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  5. s.russell (1,642 comments) says:

    I’m with KH on this. Mondayisation demeans Anzac and Waitangi Days and will make them holidays rather than days of remembrance. I hope the bill fails.

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  6. thor42 (971 comments) says:

    Sorry KH, but I beg to differ.
    Australia Mondayises Anzac Day (and has done for years). They take it seriously – I very much doubt that they would say “the importance of the day” has been taken away.
    We seem to be one of the very few countries in the world that does not Mondayise days like this. The US basically Mondayises their Veterans Day –
    Quote (from Wikipedia) – “When Veterans Day falls on a Saturday then either Saturday or the preceding Friday may be designated as the holiday, whereas if it falls on a Sunday it is typically observed on the following Monday.”
    I support this bill, and I think National should too. If it is good enough for the Aussies to Mondayise, then it is good enough for us.

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  7. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    I can recall playing sport on Anzac Day many times.
    Mondayising these holidays is a no-brainer really.

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  8. thor42 (971 comments) says:

    Btw – this bill is also about Waitangi Day, of course.
    Given that we can’t celebrate it (because of all the Maori moaning), then we might as well have the day off. Not Mondayising that day means we get the worst of both worlds when it falls on a weekend. We get the moaning but no day off.

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  9. gump (1,649 comments) says:

    More theft from employers.

    This bill is disgraceful.

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  10. Pete George (23,575 comments) says:

    Government opposes ‘Monday-ising’ holidays bill

    Deputy Prime Minister Bill English said the Government would veto the legislation.

    Can government veto a bill like this? Seems arrogant of English. And, I believe, a bad decision.

    There’s been an interesting side story – Peter Dunne is a crucial vote for Labour on this, but he’s made the point that he’l be using the same principle of following his party policies and his word as he did with the MOM Bill – and Labour vilified him for that, including David Clark who wouldn’t retract false accusations he repeated (made by Clayton Cosgrove).

    Dunne sounds like he was tempted to tell Clark and Labour to get stuffed, but has committed to following greater principles.

    Peter Dunne votes with Labour and a barb.

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  11. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    I thought the government could only veto a bill where it stated that it would have more than a minor effect on the fiscal aggregates, i.e. cost the government lots of money.

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  12. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    I agree with thor42, Waitangi day means as much to me as Australia day! It is really sad to think that but I have had such a gutsful of those fuckwits who hijack the day that the only thing I see it as is a day off. Rather then a day of celebration, it is a day of shame and embarassment for most kiwis.

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  13. tas (625 comments) says:

    National should compromise: Mondayise Waitangi day, but not ANZAC day, because ANZAC day is a day of commemoration, not a holiday.

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  14. Grizz (605 comments) says:

    “For the folk who work Tuesday to Saturday, or Wednesday to Sunday, they miss out on the Monday holidays. This bill won’t solve that problem. But we will get a chance to hear from people on a wide range of issues.

    This is why I do not like this bill. As a shift worker I get sweet fuck all from it. I get public holidays off if it falls on a day I would normally be rostered off. I do not get an additional day off and this bill will do nothing to address it. It just gives your ordinary Monday to Friday workers a holiday and discriminates against those who do not work such Gentleman’s hours.

    I have long come to the conclusion that it is better for me to work public holidays and take a day in lieu at a time of my choosing. If I am not rostered on for a public holiday, it is like they did not exist.

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  15. wikiriwhis business (4,016 comments) says:

    Socialist anti-business govts will Mondayise.

    We are also moving closer to being Americanised with Jay walking fines.

    Don’t really know what’s holding National back from allowing the nuclear ships back really….oh ya, they would bring billions of dollars in revenue from Sailors we have already lost after decades. Which resulted in persecution on the roads from revenuers.

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  16. rolla_fxgt (311 comments) says:

    I think someone might of misquoted Bill English, or he got confused about what bill they were asking him about, he can and will veto the Parental leave bill, but not quite sure how he would propose to veto the mondayisation bill.
    Unless he’s going to get Gerry to do it under the CERA legislation, which would be a slippery slope. But I don’t think that’d happen.

    As DPF says all it does is bring all years into line, instead of having someone work out which years it falls in a weekend. Makes budgeting business costs a lot easier, its the same each year. And lets be honnest most businesses budget this way anyway, and its just a bonus to the bottom line when ANZAC and Waitangi days don’t fall on weekdays.

    So Gump, its not more theft from employers, its standardising the yearly leave calculations. Unless you think paying all employees, or setting any minimum employment laws is theft from employers. In which case you really are a gump.

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  17. Pete George (23,575 comments) says:

    I thought the government could only veto a bill where it stated that it would have more than a minor effect on the fiscal aggregates, i.e. cost the government lots of money.

    Maybe rolla-fxgt is right and English has been misquoted or was confused between bills, it would be a major mistake if he tried to veto the Monday bill.

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  18. thor42 (971 comments) says:

    Cunningham is right, IMO.
    If you polled pakeha New Zealanders about Waitangi Day, I reckon you would get 95% of them saying that the **only useful thing** about it is having the day off, and when it falls on a weekend, you don’t even get that.
    How many other countries do not have a Mondayised public holiday for their so-called “national day”? Very few, I suggest.

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  19. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    More for nothing.

    Doesnt’ the blog host see any irony in suppoorting this and then banging onhow serious the “EU crisis is.?

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  20. Viking2 (11,471 comments) says:

    So Gump, its not more theft from employers, its standardising the yearly leave calculations. Unless you think paying all employees, or setting any minimum employment laws is theft from employers. In which case you really are a gump.

    Theft it is. Taking money for nothing is theft.

    Cunningham is right, IMO.
    If you polled pakeha New Zealanders about Waitangi Day, I reckon you would get 95% of them saying that the **only useful thing** about it is having the day off, and when it falls on a weekend, you don’t even get that.
    How many other countries do not have a Mondayised public holiday for their so-called “national day”? Very few, I suggest.
    Except that its not our National Day. Its actually our National Disgrace.

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  21. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    Waitangi Day serves as an important symbol of the founding principle of our nation: a partnership between two peoples. We’ve got a lot to celebrate in NZ – plenty enough to have a holiday to do so! But don’t be surprised if many also continue to see the day as an occasion to remind everyone that we still have some way to go.

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  22. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    mikenmild (5,227) we have alot to celebrate yet we have no day to celebrate. I don’t give a fuck if there is a long way to go, they can bitch and moan about how hard done by they are on the other 364 days of the year (which they do as well). It is a completely meaningless day to me. I wish they would just shitcan it to be honest.

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  23. Archer (210 comments) says:

    David, why do you support transferring a public holiday from, for instance, Sunday to Monday (for people that work Monday to Friday), but you are against moving the public holiday for people that work Tuesday to Saturday? You’ve said “if you do not normally work on a day which is a public holiday, of course you do not get paid for it” in relation to an employee who works Tuesday to Saturday, well surely you should apply that same argument to shifting a public holidays to a Monday.

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  24. Mark (1,488 comments) says:

    ANZAC Day should not be changed from the Actual date. It has too much significance. not keen on the change for Waitangi day either.

    Dont we have enough holidays already. Those of us who own businesses it is just another potential cost we dont need frankly.

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  25. KiwiGreg (3,255 comments) says:

    One more step on the road to Greece. New Zealand’s problems are certainly not a lack of holidays.

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  26. KiwiGreg (3,255 comments) says:

    This is what a death of a thousand cuts looks like. Let’s add a week of holidays that won’t cost much. Hey let’s increase public holidays that won’t cost much.

    The road to hell, good intentions, paved with

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  27. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    David Clark moaned when the government ignored submissions (encouraged by the Labour and Green parties, no doubt) on the Mixed Ownership Model Bill. Perhaps it’s time to flood the select committee that hears submissions on HIS Bill calling on Parliament NOT to Mondayise Anzac Day. Then we will see whether Mr Clark is genuinely interested in the will of the people, of just another in a long line of political grand-standers who say one thing and do another.

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  28. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    Good luck organizing a flood of submissions against this bill. I should have thought it will have overwhelming public support.

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  29. Pete George (23,575 comments) says:

    Mark – Anzac Day would still be honoured on 25th April. When it’s on a Saturday or Sunday that’s when the services will be held, except that on the folowing Monday there’s a public holiday.

    Waitangi Day protests will still be on 6 February as well.

    KS – so far indications from Mr Clark are the latter, but I’m still hoping he might grow out of it, with a bit of encouragement and a few reminders.

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  30. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > New Zealand’s problems are certainly not a lack of holidays

    If you live in Melbourne, you get the day off the first Tuesday of each November because of some horse race. I guess Aussie must be about to go down the gurgler.

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  31. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    I have yet to hear a cogent or coherent argument as to why Xmas Day and Boxing Day should be treated differently from Anzac Day and Waitangi Day.

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  32. KH (695 comments) says:

    What does it matter that some years you miss out on a day off. Unless you are like the person I ‘worked’ with in the Civil service years ago who spent a full (yes full) day and a half, including consultations with the union, and HR about his wage was worked out. The difference at issue was 4 cents !!
    A little variance helps bring home the realities of life. What’s next for Mr Clark? If it rains on the weekend, we should get Monday and Tuesday off ??

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  33. Paulus (2,628 comments) says:

    It is no real consequence as it occurs only every 15 years or so.
    If that is the best that LabourLite can do it is a pity.

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