Greens against fair NZ dairy access to Canada

August 20th, 2012 at 4:00 pm by David Farrar

A stark reminder of how the out global solidarity ahead of NZ’s interests.

Audrey Young reports:

Meanwhile, the Green Parties of New Zealand, Australia and Canada are joining forces to campaign against the Trans-Pacific Partnership.

They issued a joint statement yesterday after Metiria Turei, co-leader of the NZ Greens, held a press conference in Canada with her counterpart from there.

Among the Greens’ concerns is the prospect of the heavily protected Canadian dairy industry being de-regulated, removing safeguards which they say aim to preserve farmers’ livelihoods.

So the NZ Green Party is against NZ dairy farmers being able to have fair access into Canada!!! Their concern is to protect inefficient subsidized Canadian farmers, not to help NZ farmers export more milk.

The Financial Post point out how the Canadian system works:

Canadians must hope New Zealand and Australia force Canada to scrap its protectionist supply management system for dairy, poultry and eggs before being allowed to join the coveted Trans-Pacific Partnership ().

The Aussies and Kiwis have been upset with Canada over these agricultural subsidies for decades and are doing consumers in Canada, and the economy as a whole, a favor by opposing them.

Canada’s dairy, poultry and egg farmers belong to government-sanctioned cartels that keep out foreign competition with the help of tariffs as high as 300%. The government guarantees their success by setting a floor price. The result is monopoly profits and an estimate, by the OECD, that Canadians overpay $3 billion annually for these foodstuffs.

The Greens basically don’t like trade. They voted against the FTA with China which has seen us export an extra $12 billion to China since it was signed. They want Canada to keep up its tariffs of up to 300%.

As the most remote developed country in the world, trade is vital to our future. Yet, the Greens want to kill it off.

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46 Responses to “Greens against fair NZ dairy access to Canada”

  1. PaulL (5,987 comments) says:

    GO visit Eric Crampton at OffsettingBehaviour if you want to know about this Canadian monopoly.

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  2. Longknives (4,764 comments) says:

    “The Greens basically don’t like trade”

    I honestly don’t think the Greens understand basic economics. It appears to me that they think the taxpayers money they are so fond of spending/smoking up grows on trees…

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  3. bhudson (4,740 comments) says:

    So not only do they want to spend more, but they also want to cap earning potential to pay for that spending through an increased tax take resulting from economic growth.

    That leaves borrowing and increasing the tax rate (in a stagnating economy).

    So, let’s borrow and spend while stripping away wealth and constraining the economy. Yep, Russel would make one hell of a finance minister.

    If you like the idea of hell that is…

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  4. anonymouse (716 comments) says:

    To be Honest I don’t think that the Greens actually object to this deal because the US are involved,

    I have not heard them complain about CER (which was presumably the way wussel arrived here….) and if we had a similar deal with Canada I think the Greens would support it, BUT because the TPP has the US in it, it must be evil…. even if it is the Democrats turn to warm the seat on Pennsylvania avenue,

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  5. Manolo (13,833 comments) says:

    The traitorous Luddites at their worst. The watermelons are always ready to sabotage NZ’s economy and progress.

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  6. david c (254 comments) says:

    “The Greens basically don’t like trade”

    Erhhh wut?

    Didn’t the Greens protest against the Chinese FTA because they had issues with Human Rights in China, not because they “don’t like trade”?

    That’s a touch strawmanish don’t ya think?

    [DPF: No. They have voted against almost every trade agreement we have]

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  7. emmess (1,428 comments) says:

    Not that I give a fuck about greenhouse emissions, but wouldn’t us selling dairy products to Canada mean that less Canada cattle would required to be kept warm inside sheds during the winter months?

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  8. Jimbo (43 comments) says:

    There’s a contradiction at the heart of the Green philosophy. They’re as keen as mustard to import the worst ideas from other countries; sign NZ up to onerous international treaties that impose costs on our economy; participate in international conventions at the drop of a hat; let as many economic migrants into our country as want to come here. Yet when it comes to goods (and even services e.g. outsourcing call centres) suddenly the barriers go up. What’s with that?

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  9. tas (625 comments) says:

    David c: what does a FTA have to do with human right? The point is that the greens, for whatever reasonas, consistently oppose policies that help grow our economy and improve the incomes of NZers. What is shocking is that russel Norman may be finance minister one day. He doesn’t seem to be able to distinguish reason from bullshit and just follows his emotions when making policy.

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  10. Sofia (858 comments) says:

    They also claim that free internet could be in jeopardy, that intellectual property provisions could inflate the costs of books, that parallel importing could be banned and that state drug-buying agencies such as Pharmac could be threatened by the agreement.
    They also called for greater transparency of the process.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=10828046

    Less we throw a few babies out with the bathwater

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  11. calendar girl (1,242 comments) says:

    “They voted against the FTA with China which has seen us import an extra $12 billion to China since it was signed.”

    “Export” I presume.

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  12. david c (254 comments) says:

    tas: “what does a FTA have to do with human right?”

    If you believe that a government is committing human rights abuses, then you would be less inclined to opening up your trade borders with them, I guess in the eyes of the Green Party, it’s tantamount to supporting that regime.

    “The greens, for whatever reasonas, consistently oppose policies that help grow our economy and improve the incomes of NZers”

    Well you sure as heck can’t be a National supporter then, because they haven’t grown the economy and they’ve certainly not improved the incomes of NZers, well that isn’t fair. They’ve improved for the top earners.

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  13. wat dabney (3,774 comments) says:

    Didn’t the Greens protest against the Chinese FTA because they had issues with Human Rights in China, not because they “don’t like trade”?

    If that were true then you would see the Greens still individually continue to boycott Chinese imports.

    Do you think they do that?

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  14. tvb (4,430 comments) says:

    The Greens long for a simple agrarian economy where people sit around in dull brown clothing spinning wool all day, where everyone has a small plot of land and they grow a few veges and have a couple of cows in the paddock. There are no cars, electricity is rationed as we cannot have dams or coal burning and heaven forbid no nuclear. There are no cars, there are trains. It is a simple life but a harsh one. Of course there is widespread starvation and poverty everywhere are this ideal can only be for the few.

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  15. tas (625 comments) says:

    David c: economic sanctions hurt innocent people a hundred times more than those in power. The FTA does not affect human rights in china. There is absolutely no logic behind the greens opposing the FTA. Give me one example of economic sanctions improving human rights somewhere?

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  16. thor42 (971 comments) says:

    Typical utterly insane Greens stance.
    They want us to have renewable energy up to our eyeballs, yet they don’t want NZ to be able to trade in order to pay for it.
    Stupid, stupid, stupid………

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  17. wat dabney (3,774 comments) says:

    tvb,

    You forgot to mention that the Greens – like everyone with authoritarian fantasies – always imagine themselves as the rulers of their perfect coercive society.

    The Greens have plans for all of us to forcibly live on their Animal Farm.

    At least they have come clean about their policy of screwing taxpayers and consumers in favour of special-interest groups. The polite word for it is cronyism. The less polite word is corruption.

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  18. Michael (910 comments) says:

    Are the Greens saying they support agricultural subsidies? Worst outcome for the environment is subsidising farmers – all that unprofitable bush can be converted to farmland now the economics have been pushed it in favour of developing it.

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  19. Peter (1,712 comments) says:

    I used to think the greens had a grand, unifying theory driving their economic stance.

    I’ve come to realise most are just pig ignorant.

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  20. alex (304 comments) says:

    Oh for gods sake, the TPPA will cause NZ to lose economic sovereignty. If you want a picture of what will happen to us after the TPPA goes through, look at Mexico after NAFTA. The Greens are the only ones standing up for the country.

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  21. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    Do you Neolibs trust Tim Groser with New Zealand’s sovereignty? I don’t.

    I understand most negotiations take place behind closed doors, but I think whether we sign the final document or not should be the subject of public scrutiny.

    Sources tell me the negotiations are about to fall over as Singapore and Malaysia look to pull the plug.

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  22. duggledog (1,559 comments) says:

    I actually don’t mind how the Greens sometimes stick it to the Chinese, like Rod McDonald used to, on the steps of Parliament ha ha, good on him. Or the Americans. But really we are just a very tiny, vulnerable economy, and at a certain point one needs to know what side of one’s bread has butter on it.

    If the Green party ever got into a position of power NZ Inc would be in a power of shit. Absolutely. Like with the Hobbit, the Greens would keep their principles intact while a whole bunch of people either have no work or just go overseas to find it.

    I know a hell of a lot of otherwise ordinary people who are Green voters. I think I wouldn’t mind seeing them in Government with Labour and whoever else – I mean let’s just get it over with. It’ll take a while to fix but at least there’d be a good lesson learnt

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  23. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    “Rod McDonald” – a little more respect for the dead please.

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  24. Sofia (858 comments) says:

    The governments of Australia, Canada and New Zealand traditionally have the right to set down their own laws for the good of public health, consumers, workers and the environment.
    Leaked details of the TPPA reveal that, foreign investors and firms could sue Canada or New Zealand in a private international tribunal if their parliaments or local councils pass laws that reduce their profits or adversely affect their businesses.

    http://business.scoop.co.nz/2012/08/19/joint-statement-on-trans-pacific-partnership-agreement/

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  25. jims_whare (403 comments) says:

    DD it would only be ok if you could let them be government for a couple of years and then hit rewind so that the damage they wouldn’t be permanent.

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  26. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    What’s the bet Tim Groser’s the last man at the table? Trying to salvage a shonky deal long after those with IQs above a 100 have gone home.

    [DPF: 20 demerits]

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  27. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    If it’s good for the economy, you can guarantee that the Greens will oppose it. They are absolute economic illiterates. I cannot imagine anything worse for New Zealand than the Greens occupying the Treasury Benches.

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  28. OneTrack (3,112 comments) says:

    hamnida @ 6:57 – is there any need for the personal attacks or is that just your default (lefty) setting?

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  29. OneTrack (3,112 comments) says:

    But, but, how are we supposed to get rich if we arent allowed to trade our “green-tech”? ALL we have to do is take 0.1% of the global market. How hard could that be?

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  30. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    You Neolibs should be scared, there is probably a 80% chance Norman will be finance minister from 2014.

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  31. bhudson (4,740 comments) says:

    @Hamnida,

    That would require the left being able to cobble together more than 50% of seats in the House AND being able to do so without the support of Winston First.

    100% chance of you doing your dough I think

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  32. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    Labour/Greens/Mana/Maori get 50% and Labour have to chose if they give the Greens finance or Deputy PM. The Greens have co-leaders, so the Deputy PM idea is hard.

    I think they’ll give Norman Finance.

    Could look something like this:

    Shearer – PM
    Robertson – Deputy PM
    Norman – Minister of Finance
    Parker – Minister of Health
    Ardern – Minister for Social Development
    Cunliffe – Minister for Economic Development
    Turei – Minister for the Environment
    Hipkins – Minister of Education
    Mahuta – Minister of Maori Affairs
    Cosgrove – Minister of Foreign Affairs and Trade
    G Hughes – Minister of Climate Change
    Little – Minister of Labour, Minister for ACC
    Nash – Minister of Transport
    ………………………………………………………………

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  33. bhudson (4,740 comments) says:

    @Hamnida,

    The numbers are not even close. And given (on the Public Polls thread) you only claim on 1 or 2 seats from Maori Party and Mana, Labour and Greens will need nigh on 50% between them.

    The Left would need Winston to have a hope of even getting close and Winston won’t allow Russel to be Minister of Finance.

    I feel Darryl Kerrigan advising me to tell you you’re dreamin’

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  34. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    Labour 35%, Green 14% is very realistic. So is Maori/Mana siding with the Left in 2014.

    I don’t think Labour/Greens/NZ First will work at all.

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  35. bhudson (4,740 comments) says:

    @Hamnida,

    Prior to 2011, the Greens best party vote was 7%. The reason they achieved 11% in 2011 was because Labour tanked – they grew thanks to Labour’s demise.

    If Labour regains support, that will come from the votes they shed to the Greens in 2011. The more resurgent [unlikely] Labour becomes, the greater the fall for the Greens. A strong Labour could see them back to 7%, or lower, again.

    The results just do not back up your assertion. National will not shed votes to the Greens. And a Labour Party that sheds more votes to the Greens cannot be strong enough to win back support from National.

    Darryl was right on the money…

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  36. Liberty (267 comments) says:

    Hamnida you forgot NZF and Mana in your gaggle of has-beans.
    The odds of such a coalition lasting 6 months is unlikely.
    The reason is simple.
    Too many factions, Winston can’t work with anyone, Mana will go on some tangent
    It will all end in tears.

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  37. gander (91 comments) says:

    @PaulL at 4:11 pm:

    “GO visit Eric Crampton at OffsettingBehaviour if you want to know about this Canadian monopoly.”

    Never mind the economics of Canadian dairy and egg supply management. The quality is awful too.

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  38. UpandComer (537 comments) says:

    god, they opposed the China FTA. Didn’t realise. Well that settles that. They should never be near power.

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  39. Monique Watson (1,062 comments) says:

    Hamnida. One of the legacies that Helen Clark bequeathed New Zealand was the cessation of easy relations between the Maori party and Labour. Remember how Tariana walked? Clark and Cullen thumbed their noses at her and legislated the Seabed and Foreshore act. They did this because Peters threatened to walk. The public domain option acceptable to Maori was on the table but WP poked the arrangement at the last minute.
    Also, Jim Bolger did a great lot for relations between the National party and Maori in his time and Maori will over the next decade be more aligned with business than a left wing party that might throw a few welfare bones to Maori. You’ll have to keep Maori from your numbers.

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  40. Bogusnews (474 comments) says:

    What’s beginning to peeve me off is why the hell isn’t the media over this like a rash?

    I’m fed up with the really easy time the greens get from the media (I hate to think if it’s because the media are so economically illiterate they wouldn’t know how to write the story). There’s no tough questions, no analysis of the watermelons crazy policies.

    It’s about time that changed.

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  41. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    Liberty – Read what I said – I don’t see Labour/Greens/NZ First working at all.

    I believe Labour/Greens/Mana/Maori v National/NZ First/Conservatives more likely.

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  42. Paulus (2,632 comments) says:

    The GAA (GreensAgainstAnything) Party have not changed their spots.
    They are a collection of Communist/McGillicuddy led, white, middle class, well educated, liberals, financially secure, who know that they are always right, so no matter any objections.
    Given any politicall power – God Defend New Zealand.

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  43. Monique Watson (1,062 comments) says:

    So, just to recap. Maori won’t work with Labour within the next decade. Mana and NZF are too unstable. It’s gotta be a marriage of Lab/Green and Green is pilfering the current Lab vote while Lab is in it’s current incarnation as sop to minority interest groups. And the unions are a minority interest group Ham.

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  44. scrubone (3,099 comments) says:

    I disagree – the green party like trade, they just want it subject to numerous contradictory restrictions.

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  45. scrubone (3,099 comments) says:

    “It’s about time that changed.”

    I for one would get very uncomfortable if the media started attacking the opposition instead of holding the goverment to account.

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  46. backster (2,174 comments) says:

    HNNIDA……..I think you are selling the Greens short…add Delahunty minister womens affairs…Genter Minister of Transport…Perhaps there will be co-Ministers for some portfolios. Not enough homosexuals in your cabinet either.

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