Who did the bishop do?
August 25th, 2012 at 7:21 am by David FarrarBlair Ensor at Stuff reports:
In a rare move the former head of the Anglican Church in Wellington has surrendered his licence as a priest.
Bishop Tom Brown told The Dominion Post yesterday he voluntarily gave up his right to officiate earlier this month “to be loyal to the church and maintain the church’s integrity”.
The announcement comes amid speculation surrounding the 69-year-old’s split with wife Dwyllis Brown.
You don’t give up being a priest because you separate. You give up, because you were having an affair, I’d say. I have no first hand knowledge – but what else could it be?
“I have a private life and I’m endeavouring to get on with that to deal with the difficulty of separating from my wife.
I think it is the private life which as been the problem!
Retired priest Sir Des Britten said church members were struggling to come to terms with Dr Brown’s decision to surrender his licence.
“It’s deeply shocked a lot of people and we feel a bit let down,” Sir Des said.
“There’s lots of gossip circulating and this will go on for a while, I suppose.”
What will be interesting is what period of overlap there was, with his role as Bishop.
August 25th, 2012 at 7:33 am
infantile
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 7:35 am
You are incorrect in your hypothesis that don’t you give up being a priest just because you separate. If he is being true to 1 Timothy chapter 3 where it lists out what an overseer (traditionally Bishop) must be, one of those is husband of but one wife and be able to manage his own family (for if you cannot manage your family how can you manage the family of God)?
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 7:42 am
Aren’t there times when a person’s private life ought to be just that; private? I’ve met Tom Brown, and he was a dedicated servant of the church. If he has fallen from grace, that ought to be a matter between him and God, and him and his wife, not the subject of scuttlebut and innuendo from the tabloids.
[DPF: Private life is private - except when it involves gross hypocrisy]
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:02 am
Lol…more Religious hypocrisy.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:08 am
A divorce is not a private matter.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:10 am
@ big bruv – as long as there are humans, there will be hypocrisy; with or without religion.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:24 am
…”as long as there are humans, there will be hypocrisy; with or without religion.”…..
But religion is to hypocrisy what good wine is to food…..it teases the taste buds, adds piquancy & gives flavour to otherwise boring bonking.
Forbidden fruit & all that……
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:24 am
Given that DPF is posting on this, perhaps the Bishop thinks he is actually gay and wants a gay marriage.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:32 am
Thank goodness this didn’t appear on General Debate or the complete day would be wasted by so many. Get alife. Who the fuck cares. Seems Wgtn glitatazee is getting to be more like Outrageous Fortune everyday.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:39 am
re Keeping Stock.
I’m with you.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 10:38 am
who cares…would be more interesting if you did a post about whale cheating on his wife who supported him through his mental issues
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 11:32 am
Isn’t Whale also a Christian? BlairM as well – who talks about opposing gay marriage in other threads yet has committed the sin of divorce. Didn’t Jesus say something like divorce is only allowed if there’s adultery. Now whether or not there was adultery is none of my business but it’s ridiculous seeing Christians posting in gay marriage threads when they are equally guilty of sins but I don’t see them advocating that divorce should be illegal.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 12:43 pm
So, we discover a Bishop is human and capable of stuffing up, just like anybody else.
And he has effectively said, “I stuffed up, and as such I feel I should resign.”
It would have been hypocritical if he had not resigned, maybe, but in this case he has done the right thing – taken responsibility.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 1:03 pm
Quite so Graham; he has put the integrity of the church ahead of himself, and the damage to his own reputation. And from what I know of the man, that comes as no surprise.
And to jakejakejake and Jimmy Smits; keep clear of glasshouses fellas…
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 2:09 pm
What is worrying here is this has ‘tainted’ the various duties of that Bishop over the years – which could be upsetting for the priests he consecrated, the parishioners he confirmed and the people involved with the parishes and Anglican schools where he consecrated their churches and chapels including Wellington Cathedral.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 2:14 pm
Bloody hell, EWS! You read my mind and stole my thunder.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 4:41 pm
I’m not in a glasshouse ‘cos I don’t go around telling people they need to repent or they will go to Hell. So you’re saying Graham Capill also put the integrity of the Church ahead of himself when he resigned as leader of Christian Heritage? So what, that’s no credit to him. If a businessman resigns from a company because he has committed fraud, that does not make him resigning an honourable act.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm
cos I don’t go around telling people they need to repent or they will go to Hell
Why do you think Bishop Tom or any other priest said that either Jimmy? Or do you just think that’s what every priest says because, you know, that’s what priest’s say because, you know, er, that’s what you’ve read the bible says about it, on some page or other, at some point when you’ve picked it up.
I only ask because all of your comments on religion to date that I’ve read, every single one of them, have reflected appalling ignorance of the real situation so I’m just wondering really if that trend continues to unfold, or whether some corner’s been turned and this time, you actually do have some actual reasoning behind what you say.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 5:19 pm
You’re assuming he had an affair.
The thing is, the world has got so far away from the concepts of right and wrong that you forget the separation from one’s wife is a no-no (as is sleeping with someone with whom you are not married. Truly! Even if you are both single. It’s called the sin of fornication).
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 6:01 pm
Reid
I couldn’t presume to know what messages Anglican priests pass on to their flocks. I’ve met a couple of them socially & attended funerals they have officiated at & they have seemed to be quite well balanced, affable people. If they do engage in predictions of hellfire & brimstone then mercifully they have done it out of my earshot. Similarly I have seen little to indicate that fornication (thanks Fletch) or ceremonies involving goats form a major part of their lives.
Any resentment, or for that matter expressions of shits & giggles following their supposed fall from grace probably has more to do with evangelical church politics. I hypothesise that many others feel as I do & that while we wish you well in your personal lives both at church & in the bedroom we would rather you kept the details to yourselves.
In other words please stop pushing governments to adopt your moral standards let us go to Hell in our own way & at our own pace!
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 6:15 pm
In other words please stop pushing governments to adopt your moral standards let us go to Hell in our own way & at our own pace!
If you’re referring to my opposition to gay marriage nasska let me reassure you I’m not doing it because of my Christian views. In fact let me make a prediction.
The Anglican Church of Aotearoa will come out officially in favour of gay marriage, following the consultation they are commencing within the Church. I personally don’t believe that’s the correct view but that I believe will be the view the denomination I belong to will come out with.
My own personal reason for objecting is because I have an actute understanding of social engineering and propaganda sciences and I can tell you that gay marriage as a global and local campaign is ticking all the boxes it would have to tick, were it in fact a social engineering campaign run with sophisticated and designed global propaganda and organised activist movements. So it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, waddles just like a – guess what – that’s right… So that’s why I’m objecting nasska.
Of course my position happily coincides with the Bible as written however bear in mind my dear brother is gay and I love him dearly and would never want to hurt him and if my dear mother who was the spirit who taught me about and guided me into the arms of the Lord was alive, I’m fairly sure she herself would be in favour of gay marriage. So it’s not a simple question nasska for we Christians, is all I’m saying.
But I digress.
Back to pushing governments to adopt our moral standards lest the heathen go to Hell. Onward Christian soldiers!
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 6:24 pm
Reid
Well, back to the grind….ankle tapping God’s soldiers on crusade is exhausting if satisfying work.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 6:28 pm
Reid,
Perhaps Brzezinski is behind it all
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 6:50 pm
Perhaps Brzezinski is behind it all
No, he eats gays like Fat Bastard eats babies bhudson, but I understand your thinking.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 8:26 pm
David Farrar: “You don’t give up being a priest because you separate.”
Yes, you do.
You know nothing.
Vote:August 25th, 2012 at 9:39 pm
My own personal reason for objecting is because I have an actute understanding of social engineering and propaganda sciences and I can tell you that black civil rights as a global and local campaign is ticking all the boxes it would have to tick, were it in fact a social engineering campaign run with sophisticated and designed global propaganda and organised activist movements. So it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, waddles just like a – guess what – that’s right… So that’s why I’m objecting nasska.
My own personal reason for objecting is because I have an actute understanding of social engineering and propaganda sciences and I can tell you that womens’ rights as a global and local campaign is ticking all the boxes it would have to tick, were it in fact a social engineering campaign run with sophisticated and designed global propaganda and organised activist movements. So it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, waddles just like a – guess what – that’s right… So that’s why I’m objecting nasska.
Vote:August 26th, 2012 at 5:13 am
So Fletch says anybody that is single and has consensual sex with another single person is a sinner. As is all sex between two unmarried people. Would this dastardly sin be punished as heavily as two celibate homosexuals who choose to marry?
Don’t answer that, the phone is ringing, the 1920′s are calling.
Vote:August 26th, 2012 at 8:05 am
BlairM as well – who talks about opposing gay marriage in other threads yet has committed the sin of divorce. Didn’t Jesus say something like divorce is only allowed if there’s adultery. Now whether or not there was adultery is none of my business but it’s ridiculous seeing Christians posting in gay marriage threads when they are equally guilty of sins but I don’t see them advocating that divorce should be illegal.
Don’t drag me into this. It is not hypocrisy if one is a sinner to correctly define sin. Besides, you misrepresent my position. I don’t think gay marriage should be illegal (which it currently is not), and I don’t think divorce should be illegal. No hypocrisy there. What I am opposed to is the government redefining marriage through the certificates it issues to couples.
In talking about Christians divorcing, you also have to bear in mind 1 Corinthians 7:12-15. I did not want to be divorced and was separated against my will. I’ve committed many sins in my life, but my divorce is not one of them.
Vote:August 26th, 2012 at 10:19 am
graham (1,105) Says:
August 25th, 2012 at 12:43 pm
Well just looking at Christian orthodoxy, I wish all the homosexual priests would do the same!
That is resign and no longer occupy a leadership position until they have properly dealt with their sin and deliberate defiance both individually and corporately as they are setting the wrong example living a lifestyle that makes says God is a liar in the fullness of their scripture.
What that must do to the young and weaker members of their flocks?
I’m sure Jesus had something to say about that
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