Shearer makes it up

October 12th, 2012 at 1:00 pm by David Farrar

is sadly descending into the Trevor Mallard rulebook, and making things up. Andrea Vance at Stuff reports:

Earlier today Labour claimed a tape existed of Key giving speech to staff in cafeteria at the Government Communications Security Bureau’s Wellington headquarters in which he made a quip about Dotcom.

The prudent thing to do if you hear a claim like this, is to substantiate it. You file an Official Information Act request for the tape (or at least confirming the existence of it) or as an MP you can file a written question. Then when you get the answer, you trumpet it.

But just making stuff up, and trumpeting it in a press release, is risking being the Boy who cried wold.

Fletcher said “exhaustive enquries” at the have revealed no video tape.

And Shearer doesn’t even realise

Labour leader David Shearer had called on the GCSB or Key to confirm if the recording existed.

“There is one way to clear this up. The Prime Minister should give the green light to the agency to release any and all unclassified material about the visit and ’s comments to staff,” he said.

Does Shearer not even know the law? The PM is not needed to give a green light. The Official Information Act applies to the GCSB. They are listed in Schedule 1. Unless the material is classified, or otherwise meets a criteria for non-release, the GCSB is required by law to release the material. Also the Ombudsman can investigate and request and decision.

Newstalk ZB also has an interesting story on where Labour may be getting their information from.

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76 Responses to “Shearer makes it up”

  1. kino flo (81 comments) says:

    DPF, where did Soper get his information from? He seems extremely certain that it was Mold’s partner that leaked. Who would have told him with such certainty? The same person who was quoted further down in the article, or merely a staffer from Key’s office? Do you think it’s appropriate to out a current or former member of the GCSB?

    [DPF: GCSB staff identities are not protected. That is the SIS. I understand the former job of Mold's partner is common knowledge]

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  2. Lloyd (125 comments) says:

    David who?

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  3. markblackham (13 comments) says:

    Yes, Labour’s approach has been politically rabid, but any decent political strategist would calculate that you’ll get as much agenda-setting news NOW just from the accusation than you would from the GCSB refusal to supply the tape in over a month’s time.

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  4. metcalph (1,396 comments) says:

    The work history of Mold’s partner is common knowledge among the Press Gallery. Which makes the ineptness of this alleged leak rather startling. Shearer would have been far better off to have not passed himself off as an intermediary of the leak so that he looks more credible when he criticizes Key after a leak from GCSB that appeared on Campbell Live.

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  5. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    John Key’s been making it up since day one. But that’s different…it’s OK when the PM does it.

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  6. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > Fletcher said “exhaustive enquries” at the GCSB have revealed no video tape.

    The same exhaustive enquiries found that the GCSB thought it was OK to spy on Dotcom…you’d have to take anything Fletcher says with a large dose of salt. His credibility is on a par with Key’s.

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  7. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    Shearer is not helping himself. The Herald reports:

    He said he was not concerned about leaks from the spy agency because the subject matter did not relate to national security.

    “The level they are leaking is simply information about them being in more or less a public meeting with John Key. The only thing that is sensitive about this is whether John Key knew about Kim Dotcom before he said he did in September.”

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10840105

    If he became Prime Minister would any information he got from GCSB he deemed not to “relate to national security” be fair game for using as political ammunition?

    He’s left himself wide open here.

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  8. Keeping Stock (10,161 comments) says:

    And now it’s arguable that both David Shearer and Francesca Mold are parties to a breach of Section 11 of the Government Communications Security Bureau Act 2003, with regard to having made public information that was conveyed to them by a person or persons who is/are or was/were employed by the Bureau.

    Without doubt, by the time the sun sets tonight Russel Norman will have written to the Police Commissioner demanding that the NZ Police investigate this serious allegation.

    But the biggest question of all is this one; who set David Shearer up to take the fall?

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  9. Keeping Stock (10,161 comments) says:

    Irony comment of the day – ross69 banging on about credibility :P

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  10. Grizz (529 comments) says:

    Labour full of shit again. No surprises there. Just goes to show you cannot believe anything they say. In fact I do not even listen to them any more.

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  11. Cunningham (828 comments) says:

    Ross69 ‘John Key’s been making it up since day one. But that’s different…it’s OK when the PM does it.’ According to who? David Shearer? unless you have some evidence that he has been purposely covering up his knowledge then you should STFU. Your attitude is typical of the left who like to make stuff up and smear as much shit as possible without any evidence.

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  12. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    It seems that John Key knew of Dotcom’s permanent residency status since at least 24 January 2012. That of course is before he met with the GCSB and made a joke about Dotcom. Wouldn’t a moderately competent PM, and head of GCSB, have realised that Dotcom wasn’t permitted to be spied on by the GCSB? Or did the fact of Dotcom’s residency status completely slip the PM’s mind?

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/video.cfm?c_id=1&gal_objectid=10781209&gallery_id=123534

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  13. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > But the biggest question of all is this one; who set David Shearer up to take the fall?

    The biggest question is: how many more lies is the PM going to tell before even dyed-in-the-wool Nat supporters see the writing on the wall?

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  14. metcalph (1,396 comments) says:

    Ross69, Kim Dotcom didn’t have permanent residency, he had a residency visa.

    The difference between the two is explained here:

    http://www.dol.govt.nz/immigration/knowledgebase/item/3704

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  15. RightNow (6,794 comments) says:

    That video says nothing of the sort ross69. Next.

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  16. Rick Rowling (823 comments) says:

    ross69 – “trolling by slogan”. 912 posts all saying “John Key lies”, none with any pretence of evidence. I know that approach gets you lots of loving over at the standard, but it doesn’t really work here, does it?

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  17. flipper (3,765 comments) says:

    ISSUES:

    1. Where is the computer power point presentation made when JK visited GCHQ on Feb 29? (Please do not tell us that it is no longer on any GCSB computer hard drives and cannot be (forensic) recovered.)
    2. The power point presentation will either prove or disprove alternate assertions that it was a.) an inconsequential[sic] mention in passing, or b.) a briefing.
    3. The date on which JK became aware that there had been an illegal act by GCSB – September 17?
    4. How did the illegality really occur?
    5. Who said what (if anything) to Shearer’s office, or was it fiction?
    6. What confidence can we have in JK/GCSB et al after this Laurel and Hardy Act? :)

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  18. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    Good questions flipper. I’d add:
    7. What confidence can we have in David Shearer/GCSB now, and especially if he becomes PM.

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  19. flipper (3,765 comments) says:

    PG
    Yep a terrible oversight!

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  20. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    Could anyone or should anyone be able to take a non-official video of visitors anywhere in the GCSB? I’m surprised this hasn’t been looked at more – in what situation could the alleged video have been filmed and stored?

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  21. Whaleoil (766 comments) says:

    PG…it isn’t possible….and Shearer and his staff should know that.

    Anyone who has ever been in those offices would know this. It is simply impossible.

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  22. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    I thought that was the case.

    So according to Shearer a video was taken and was stored on possibly multiple ‘hard drives’ which were this week taken away and the video must have been deleted.

    If that’s the case (and there’s a lot of doubt about that) it was an unauthorised video that shouldn’t have been taken in the first place.

    And at worst the video shows Key quipping about something that it’s not unreasonabel to expect he could have forgotten about by the next day, let alone eight months later.

    And Shearer is going out on a limb to try and build a little bit more on a long term strategy of painting Key as a liar the same as Labour MPs, Labour blog authors and Labour hacks like Ross69 have been trying to do for yonks.

    And Shearer loses political credibility and loses trust with GCSB as a result. And I suspect takes a hit on media credibility.

    Shearer seems to have been entirely taken over (he’s certainly not what he said he would be) by the dumbest of strategies and strategists.

    And he either dumps Mold and her partner and friends in the shit as collateral (as if it wasn’t obvious that would be the outcome), unless Mold is a key strategist who has dumped herself in it.

    I can’t believe that all of the Labour caucus and Labour Party think this is good.

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  23. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    And the nonsense continues.

    Wiped GCSB files could easily be retrieved, says computer expert

    If any organisation can retrieve a deleted video file from a hard drive, the Government Communications Security Bureau should be able to do so.

    The latest development in the political storm surrounding Prime Minister John Key and the GCSB involves a mystery video recording which may or may not exist, or may or may not have existed, but which the Labour leader David Shearer says was stored on a number of computers in the bureau but which has been deleted recently.

    …if a file was created in – hypothetically – February this year, and was then – hypothetically – deleted in the last seven days, it would be highly likely to be able to be retrieved.”

    http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/wiped-gcsb-files-could-easily-be-retrieved-says-computer-expert-rh-130615

    So the people who are supposed to have deleted the files are going to turn round and undelete them? Why would they do that?

    And if any organisation can properly deleted a video file from a hard drive so it can’t be retrieved the Government Communications Security Bureau should be able to do so.

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  24. Keeping Stock (10,161 comments) says:

    Have a listen to the Rodney Hide-David Shearer interview at WO’s place:

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2012/10/shearer-adds-to-labour-legal-problems/

    At 3:07 Hide asks “Are you 100% certain that your source is correct?”

    Shearer’s reply: “No um, but Rodney; what we’re doing here is asking the question. We have got…how else are we going to do this?”

    David Shearer has broken one of the golden rules of politics; don’t ask the question unless you know what the answer is. He is now grabbing at straws, obfuscating and trying frantically to dig himself out of the hole the he has fallen into; or was pushed.

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  25. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > Could anyone or should anyone be able to take a non-official video of visitors anywhere in the GCSB?

    It’s entirely possible. Photos were taken of the PM at the GCSB, photos which are not being released. What would be the purpose of those photos? The PM isn’t any visitor.

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  26. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > Ross69, Kim Dotcom didn’t have permanent residency

    He did indeed have permanent residency. It appears you haven’t read the Neazor report.

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  27. slightlyrighty (2,499 comments) says:

    This issue of public servants “leaking” information with the intent of embarrassing the government is one that bears much closer inspection. This is one public example of a public servant actively working against the current National government. Given that the public service seems to be closely aligned with the Labour Party, I am sure there are a number of less public examples of similar actions.

    Given what has occurred at MFAT, and what had occurred within the Education Sector, one wonders how many government initiatives are being sabotaged by the very public servants tasked with implementation?

    Iain Rennie needs to get involved here.

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  28. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > This is one public example of a public servant actively working against the current National government.

    Well, you’re assuming that’s the case. But given this government has treated public servants with contempt, and inflicted severe job cuts on the public service, I guess I wouldn’t be too surprised if a public servant has had enough, especially if they know the PM is telling porkies.

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  29. RightNow (6,794 comments) says:

    Visitors to GCSB have to leave all electronic devices at the security checkpoint. I imagine staff either do the same and/or have to sign an acceptable use policy. While it is possible someone could take ‘non-official’ recordings/images, they certainly shouldn’t be able to.

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  30. flipper (3,765 comments) says:

    So if all of the spook conspiracy creeps are correct, the GCSB secretly videoed JK and then erased the tapes.

    Lord save me / us all from idiots.
    1. All CCTV/similar video tapes are time coded and cannot be amended without the most sophisticated expertise/gear – which would be discernable thru tell-tale signals.
    2. Do I believe we know the whole story? No. There are too many gaps.
    3. Is there a “watergate-type” smoking gun in this? No.
    4. Has Shearer been stupid? Yes.
    5. Is private secret video taping possible ? In an environmrnt where all electronic devices are/required to be in “external” lockers ? Pull the other one. Those suggestions are just crap.
    6. I have a new name for this whole affair (with acknowledgments to the late Eric Heath of The Dominion) :

    “The spy who came in for the mold”. :)

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  31. RightNow (6,794 comments) says:

    “Wiped GCSB files could easily be retrieved, says computer expert”

    Except as you rightly point out Pete, GCSB are exactly the sort of people who know to overwrite the actual data with zeroes, rather than just “remove it from the computer’s table of contents”.

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  32. flipper (3,765 comments) says:

    Yes RN
    But this would be obvious because of the in-bred codings
    They cannot be removed without a complete remake.
    What we talking about here are tapes that are 8 months old. They will have been ARCHIVED.

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  33. Raphael (75 comments) says:

    @PG Re:”Computer Expert”

    Add to that I would expect an organisation like the GCSB to not simply be using the Windows Recycle bin when they delete files but something that does a proper job of it (heck there are plenty of free apps out there that do a good job of permanently wiping data off of a disk….like this one chosen entirely at random http://eraser.heidi.ie/ from a link on PortableApps).

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  34. Cunningham (828 comments) says:

    Ross 69 But ‘given this government has treated public servants with contempt’ have you actually see the performance levels of the public service after these cuts? And the sector still has more staff then when the last Labour government took over. Do you think the public sector is some god like entity that should never be touched regardless of cost or lack of efficiency? Give me a fucking break. You and the other lefties just don’t give a shit about taxpayer dollars do you? It makes me sick.

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  35. labrator (1,820 comments) says:

    Neazor report

    However, before he arrived in New Zealand the new Immigration Act 2009 came into force on 29 November 2010 and deemed him to hold a residence class visa from that point in time. He met the definition of ‘permanent resident’ for the purposes of the GCSB Act accordingly.

    Although Dotcom’s status is subject to monetary and residential conditions for a period of three years short of actually being deported Mr Dotcom retains his immigration residence status and remains a permanent resident for the purposes of the GCSB Act.

    Kim Dotcom does not have a permanent resident visa. Under the Immigration Act 2009 his “Investor Plus” visa (ie a Rich Prick TM) means he should’ve been treated like one by the GCSB. That’s the crux of the whole thing, he’s not a permanent resident but should be treated like one.

    And if the GCSB knew that their spying was illegal in February do you really think they’d have put it in a powerpoint to show how awesome they are to the PM?

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  36. Bevan (3,965 comments) says:


    1. Where is the computer power point presentation made when JK visited GCHQ on Feb 29? (Please do not tell us that it is no longer on any GCSB computer hard drives and cannot be (forensic) recovered.)
    2. The power point presentation will either prove or disprove alternate assertions that it was a.) an inconsequential[sic] mention in passing, or b.) a briefing.

    Who says its been deleted? As far as I can tell, only Shearer so far talks about files being deleted and in that he is talking about the video – therefore it is an assumption made by him.

    The reason for not releasing the PP pres though is probably far more simple – it could be just classified as the presentation or even the slide itself could contain other highly classified information. Imagine if they released it with all but the mention of KDC blacked out – every left wing nut job will still scream that they are hiding something (well, no shit they are the GCSB afterall), but who says what they are hiding is to cover up the KDC dramarama.

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  37. wally (63 comments) says:

    Who gives a fuck?

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  38. flipper (3,765 comments) says:

    Bevan

    The point is that it (the PP) will prove or disprove much of what is being said – or not said.

    The IG will probably look at that if it still available. So will Ms Kitteridge.
    I am not suggesting that it be released. Simply that any IG (or other) inquiry will be able to establish whether it still exists (or can be recovered) and whether the dottiecom mention was incidental or a “briefing”.

    Clear enough?

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  39. BeaB (2,074 comments) says:

    Am I alone in thinking this is utterly trivial? But if all Labour is trying to do is smear Key, they should have found something with a real smoking gun.
    I for one want to see Dot Com kicked out of NZ and I amazed so many on the Left seem to worship him.

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  40. Keeping Stock (10,161 comments) says:

    @ BeaB – it’s all starting to resemble Helen Clark and Mike Williams’ H-Fee smear against Key just before the 2008 General Election. That one didn’t work out too well for Labour either

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  41. smttc (710 comments) says:

    BeaB, the left are only interested in Dotcom as a means of trying to bash and smear the Prime Minister.

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  42. smttc (710 comments) says:

    And I agree with wally. WGAF. It is a beltway issue largely beyond the comprehension or attention scan of the average voter.

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  43. Yvette (2,736 comments) says:

    Shearer would be better to ask Key

    The New Zealand Herald on Thursday October 4 published a Dotcom timeline which in part says
    Jan 20: GCSB tells Roy Ferguson, director of the intelligence co-ordination group in the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet, of its role in monitoring Dotcom for the police.
    Is this reference correct and who in the Prime Minister’s Office did Roy Fergusson relay this information to, or did he not pass it on?

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  44. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    Shearer has now accepted the word of GCSB that there is no video (RadioNZ). So now he is left saying that Key should deny saying anything about Dotcom in the cafetaria.

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  45. Bevan (3,965 comments) says:


    The IG will probably look at that if it still available. So will Ms Kitteridge.

    They probably already have and concluded that as the slides discuss operational issues, they are considered highly classified. Point is we will never know and anything else is just plain old assumption.

    I am not suggesting that it be released. Simply that any IG (or other) inquiry will be able to establish whether it still exists (or can be recovered) and whether the dottiecom mention was incidental or a “briefing”.

    There is no discussion by the politicians about releasing the PP pres, only the video which now even Shearer accepts does not exist.

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  46. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    I’ve just listened right through the RadioNZ items that were on after 5pm :
    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint

    It seems that hard drive searches have been going on for several days at GCSB (camera and other device drives). GCSB say no video has been found.

    My best guess is that sources told Labour/Shearer that they were searching for a video, and they and/or Shearer took that as meaning there was a video. And he jumped the gun instead of wating to find out the result of the search.

    Now Shearer is left saying that Key should categorically deny saying anything about an off the cuff speach made eight months ago. Key is sticking to ‘can’t recall’. He said he makes 25+ off the cuff speeches a week and doesn’t remember everything he has said.

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  47. Keeping Stock (10,161 comments) says:

    @ Pete – I know I’m not the PM, but FFS; I can’t remember what I said to the missus at breakfast time this morning!

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  48. Nostalgia-NZ (4,989 comments) says:

    How refreshing that Shearer makes that acknowledgement. If he’d followed the form of JK and Banks he would have said he didn’t remember saying there was a tape, that he often makes comments and doesn’t recall all his interviews, or indeed it might have been a mere quip because that is often is manner of speaking. Just when it appeared JK might have had a way out – questioning the credibility of Shearer to somehow reinforce his own, Shearer slipped the hook, and apparently did so honestly.

    Meanwhile JK’s memory is improving because he can recall the name of another infamous adversary Mike Tyson who he continues to spar with from a very safe distance of 12,000 miles.

    Flipper makes an excellent point again about that power point presentation. A more discreet disclosure, taken that everything is hush hush, would be an inquiry as to whether of any of Dotcom’s co-accused were included in the photo montage. If they were that shifts the presentation to something more specific that a single photo of one offender whom the FBI had an interest in to two NZ residents and other non residents – even more to forget, not one, but several offenders of interest to the FBI, mundane?

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  49. Nostalgia-NZ (4,989 comments) says:

    You rate a breakfast conversation with a departmental briefing KS?

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  50. jakejakejake (140 comments) says:

    Do we trust the politicians or spies??

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  51. Viking2 (11,220 comments) says:

    BeaB (1,339) Says:
    October 12th, 2012 at 4:49 pm

    Am I alone in thinking this is utterly trivial? But if all Labour is trying to do is smear Key, they should have found something with a real smoking gun.
    I for one want to see Dot Com kicked out of NZ and I amazed so many on the Left seem to worship him.

    ———————————————————————————————————————————–
    The left are using Dotcom for their own interests which is totally normal for the slime bags that infest the left.

    The right welcome him because. He will have his new site up and running shortly. He will make millions and millions which pisses of people like you because of your broken arsed attitude to people being successful and making lots and lots of money.
    You should actually be welcoming that and the thought that much of it will end up in NZ and have tax paid upon it and that Dotcom may still feel well disposed to the country and might be as generous as he has been in the past. You should welcome it because you useless lefties only ever take from the income bucket of taxation and earning export dollars and never even consider earning your way in the world.
    That it will piss of the yanks goes without saying but even their judicary are now waking up to the fraud that the film boozo’s and the FBI are over this.

    Better still it looks like the FBI & co will be stuck with some big bills to repatriate stored information that had no illegal content. Thank goodness someone has enough money to cahllange these corrupt bastards.

    Jennifer Granick, the director of civil liberties at the Stanford University law school’s Center for Internet and Society, said Dotcom’s case marks the first time the US has attempted to hold somebody criminally liable for copyright infringement committed by others. She said prosecutors are pushing at the boundaries of the law.
    —————————————————————————————————————————————-
    In recent tweets, Dotcom says his new version of Megaupload is nearly complete. “Quick update on the new Mega: Code 90% done. Servers on the way. Lawyers, Partners & Investors ready. Be patient. It’s coming,” he wrote. He said the new version will feature a one-click encryption option for data transfers and that the service would be hosted on servers outside the US.

    Asked by one Twitter user if he was nervous that “what happened to Megaupload could happen to New Mega?” Dotcom replied: “That will be IMPOSSIBLE. Trust me!”

    Dotcom says his planned music service Megabox will enable users to download music for free in exchange for accepting some advertisements. He says 90 percent of the revenue will go to the artists and that the service will be a legitimate way of “unchaining artists and fans” to do business with each other with a minimal need for middlemen.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/technology/digital-living/7807460/Dotcom-speaks-of-Megaupload-relaunch
    ————————————————————————————————————————————-
    And to make your day:

    Kim Dotcom wants those inside NZ spy agencies to share the information they have on his case with the media. Photo / Sarah Ivey

    Kim Dotcom has issued a call for whistleblowers to leak information about his case to the media in the wake of spy and police blunders.

    “I urge those who know the truth to leak your information to the media. Please help us.”

    The call comes after a series of blunders and the extraordinary revelation that the GCSB spy agency had illegally snooped on Dotcom.

    Mr Dotcom said he was concerned about meetings between Mr Key and ministers in his cabinet with US government officials involved in copyright discussions and a prominent Hollywood lobbyist.

    “The recent memory lapses and attempts of obfuscation are disturbing. I think it would benefit all New Zealanders to have an independent inquiry for full transparency.”

    Mr Dotcom said Megaupload – which pulled in 4 per cent of internet traffic at one stage – was “legitimate … just like Youtube or Dropbox”.

    “The case against us is without merit and we will prevail. But in the meantime our lives and businesses are destroyed.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10840075

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  52. Michael (898 comments) says:

    Shearer has more stories than a library. As we have seen by Mallard and Little, making shit up must be the new Labour strategy.

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  53. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    The Mallard, Little and now Shearer strategy seems to be to say whatever it takes to get attention and to put pressure on their target and then to hope to score hits off the aftermath. Facts and accuracy strictly optional.

    Trevor Mallard ‏@TrevorMallard

    yep “@KimDotcom: It’s not the original scandal that gets people into the biggest trouble – it’s the attempted cover-up. Be honest. Be fair.”

    They are trying to force a coverup or misteps on the response. But ignoring the honest and fair bits obviously.

    Labour’s problem here is they have fast tracked Shearer into their modus operandi and like everything else in public Shearer isn’t up the act – he’s poor at hiding his discomfort.

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  54. David Garrett (6,660 comments) says:

    Listening to him stumbling through that interview with Hide is cringe making…like listening to your little brother blow his part in the school play…in front of all his mates and your parents…He will surely go down as the nicest but most incompetent person to have lead the Labour Party since…who….Palmer?

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  55. Pete George (23,165 comments) says:

    Since no one.

    He is not leading at all, he’s been installed, schooled and acting under instructions. He has started to use the same phrases Goff looked uncomfortable repeating.

    Shearer promised to be something different, but he’s most like a weaker, far less experienced Goff unable and/or unwilling to put his own mark on the leadership.

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  56. Yvette (2,736 comments) says:

    JANUARY 20 –
    GCSB tells Roy Ferguson, director of the intelligence co-ordination group in the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet, of its role in monitoring Dotcom for the police.
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10838272

    Why is Labour so fucked up over who said what to whom on FEBRUARY 29?

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  57. Reid (16,062 comments) says:

    Everyone knows the NSA have remote viewers. Genetically enhanced psychically powerful people trained from birth through extreme abuse to become capable of dialing into any conversation in the world anytime anywhere even on another planet even (with Looking Glass equipment) if it occurred years ago, and sitting in on the meeting in the spirit realm trained to remember and play back every single thing that was said. This is common knowledge and I’m surprised none of the idiot useless ignorant MSM has raised it.

    Therefore it’s all quite obvious isn’t it.

    An NSA remote viewer was assigned to “do the Kiwis a favour,” since we’d done so well in Afghanistan, to cover Key’s speech so it could be relayed throughout the Echelon community on a “who cares to know” basis just as a brotherly, friendship gesture. It happens all the time and I wouldn’t be surprised at all if Shearer via Fran has already downloaded a copy, it’s just he doesn’t want to appear on Campbell or Walrus and prove it because if he did, then the silly old electorate might get a bit concerned at seeing a hologram projection appearing directly out of the next PM’s head third eye.

    Honestly. Catch up, people. Don’t you guys know anything?

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  58. Zapper (949 comments) says:

    Completely agree Pete. The scary thing is based on polls, he is the next PM. Can you imagine that???

    Sure National has been disappointing in many ways (WFF, student loans) but Key has brought a level of integrity certainly not seen under the last PM and for all the disappointment, there is consolation in knowing it’s far far better than the alternative.

    If Key had won the 1999 election it would be interesting to see how he went in times of prosperity – 2008 GFC (which hasn’t done to NZ what it did to the USA, but it’s certainly changed the climate in NZ) and Christchurch, the most expensive disaster of our times, have surely made it a very hard time to be a leader.

    No doubt Labour will get the chance to again kill our Balance of Payments when times are good, but thank god they don’t have control in times of trouble. France has that problem now, tough economic climate, idiot socialist who thinks taxing the rich is the answer, and the rich all heading for the UK. Good news for the UK though.

    A rambling post, my apologies, but it is Friday afternoon…

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  59. Zapper (949 comments) says:

    Memo to ross69 (if that was your year of birth, then I’m very sad that a man of your years is so stupid): if you quote me saying Key has integrity followed by your usual substance free comment, how about backing it up for a change?

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  60. Reid (16,062 comments) says:

    My best guess is that sources told Labour/Shearer that they were searching for a video, and they and/or Shearer took that as meaning there was a video. And he jumped the gun instead of wating to find out the result of the search.

    Seriously? My best guess is GCSB grilled the fuck out of all their staff present at Key’s presso as to whether or not anyone had done anything at all remotely connected with recording or telling anyone about it and threatened every single one of them with the relevant measures lest they mention a single alphabet letter let alone a word, about it.

    Then the GCSB head called Key and said, deny away, with impunity.

    Seriously seriously. For someone in the GCSB ever to breach security is a grave matter. While many are NZer’s and a lot of “security” is boring routine crap, that principle is inviolable. And has to be that way. Always. No matter what. No. Matter. What. If someone like Mold’s partner has breached that confidence, s/he has to pay. They have to. And all things being equal, I’d expect them to, in due course. But they won’t. Because to do so would incite the lefties to rise up in furious self-righteous anger, pwoclaiming it’s a “political” pwosecution. And that’s the worst. Mold’s partner will get away with this, publicly if not privately. He’ll never get another govt job for example. And he shouldn’t. Anything which compromises free and frank exchanges in private in security settings, needs to be dealt with on a “seen to be done” basis. That’s the tragedy of this issue. It has compromised, through precedent, the ability to frankly share and exchange any and all information between vetted and cleared individuals and such inhibitions, inevitably, compromises capability.

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  61. Johnboy (15,390 comments) says:

    “He will surely go down as the nicest but most incompetent person…”

    Sir Wallace Edward made Sir Geoffrey Winston Russell look like a bloody genius David!! :)

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  62. Nostalgia-NZ (4,989 comments) says:

    Ha reid. Nice puppetry. You think this is about who leaked the information, not about the situation that sees the PM unaware of illegal activity. Somehow not informed by his own department or his own deputy. Then when more emerges he admits that he can’t remember but he might have made a quip because he is a fun guy.

    Rather than a full disclosure, JK has only reacted to what has entered the public forum. He still hasn’t given the complete picture. We don’t know if he’s lying or not. He wants the public to believe that the GCSB are incompetent, or were on this occasion a number of times. The only way to prove that is for him to give the complete dialogue dates and all. The GCSB are not going to roll over and die for JK and few will be comforted by the fact that the PM claims not to know what was going on. Show and tell, leave out sensitive matters but an explanation of how GCSB spied on those it was forbidden to, and who co-operated even in the raid such was their involvement.

    All of this provides a gold mine for Dotcom. He should be entitled to know if the PM was involved with full knowledge of what his own department were doing. Of course that would prove or disprove the incompetence claim, it would also show who was willing to break the law and on whose authority. Dotcom is entitled to know the machinations against them, how they were started and to what level they reached.

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  63. RightNow (6,794 comments) says:

    Amen to that Reid. Key had the high ground and knows it. Labour are going to be very bruised soon.

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  64. MH (671 comments) says:

    Our allies at Huawei are doing their v best to retrieve the video. Perhaps Shearer has already seen the video?

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  65. RightNow (6,794 comments) says:

    Sorry ross69 no win for you this time. Pin your hopes on a cabinet minister buying too many bottles of wine on his credit card eh?

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  66. AJC (14 comments) says:

    Boring. Sick to death about Kim. Com and anything to do with the GSB or whatever the fuck its called. Some people may enjoy the media wetting their pa ts about the whole “scandal”. Personally I would rather the government and media was focused on stuff that is important. John Campbell could always get a job as a jester in Kim.Coms court if TV3 gave him the flick. Kim.Com I am sure is just pissing himself laughing about how stupid the NZ media are.

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  67. Reid (16,062 comments) says:

    All of this provides a gold mine for Dotcom. He should be entitled to know if the PM was involved with full knowledge of what his own department were doing.

    Why?

    Let’s take an equal example. A real group was involved in a real plan to really truly actually blow up a massive truck bomb in Queen Street at lunch time which actually happened and killed let’s say, 150 Aucklanders and maimed for life let’s say, 100 others.

    The reason that real actual person wasn’t identified was because there was this peculiar case a decade or so ago involving some Dotcom person which changed all the laws cos everyone thought it was weally weally tewwible what happened to him and when the 6th Liarbore govt/NZF/Gween colaition was elected, they eviscerated the surveillance laws through the: “It has never happened here before never ever so therefore it could never ever happen and if anyone thought otherwise, they’re not thinking straight because they don’t have a heart and they’re not humane Act, 2015″

    Dotcom is entitled to know the machinations against them, how they were started and to what level they reached.

    Have you read the indictment against him Nostalgia? http://legaltimes.typepad.com/files/mega-indictment.pdf

    Lest you make a mistake and think it’s all a bunch of hooey for no reason…

    Some people may enjoy the media wetting their pa ts about the whole “scandal”.

    I don.t enjoy that at the mo AJC, but it sounds to me as if it’s something I might enjoy, if I knew what you meant.

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  68. Hamnida (905 comments) says:

    You Neolibs have very short memories. Key has already lied in the House about Kim Dotcom and GSB matters. To the extent Hansard has to be corrected to reflect the truth.

    It’s all over for Key – New Zealanders have stopped believing what he says.

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  69. Keeping Stock (10,161 comments) says:

    So who is going to lead Labour when David Shearer does the honourable thing and stands down next week Hamnida? Cunliffe? Robertson? Goff? Sheesh; they haven’t got much to choose from :D

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  70. Luc Hansen (4,573 comments) says:

    Dotcom to Key is what Big Bird is to Mitt Romney, the gift that won’t stop giving to their opponents.

    Mitt’s shine is dissipating in the harsh glare of scrutiny and he is off to the knackers yard soon while Shonkey will hang on like the good currency dealer that he is, until the time comes when he knows the game is up.

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  71. Zapper (949 comments) says:

    Luc, your example is perfect, but not why you think it is. Gift indeed, the gift their opponents will try to exploit and will end up being exposed by

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  72. Zapper (949 comments) says:

    Hamnida, you are a pathetic communist that cannot be taken seriously. Why haven’t you moved to your paradise, North Korea, yet?

    You keep throwing out the term neo-libs, when it’s clear you don’t know what the fuck it means

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  73. hannity (152 comments) says:

    Ross69
    Why cant you turn a blind eye ,when John Key trips over the lowest rung of crediblity when he says he, cant

    remember, not able to comment,cant recall, its an operational matter, wasn’t there/ok I was there, I crack jokes all the time about matters Im not aware of, and anyway you cant prove it.

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  74. Nostalgia-NZ (4,989 comments) says:

    Reid

    Nice story telling.

    Just a tip for you when a group readily breaks the law to bring a prosecution or application for extradition, when people forget and turn a blind eye to things – then you have abuses of process at work. The unfortunate thing about being partisan is that you have to swallow crap and convince yourself that it’s ice cream.

    As I said last night, Shearer had the instinct and honesty to put things back in perspective with his statements earlier in the day, but Key continues to push it uphill with applause from yourself or others that say they don’t care, or they hate dotcom, or say about this ‘fact’ or other.

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  75. BeaB (2,074 comments) says:

    Show us the tape, Shearer, or shut up.

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  76. hannity (152 comments) says:

    Alledged goat fucker demands to see evidence, before issuing unequivocal denial.

    sounds like a rock solid defence,to me.

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