The prank call tragedy

December 9th, 2012 at 7:19 am by David Farrar

news.com.au reports:

THE boss of the radio network at the centre of the hoax call tragedy has defended radio pranks as the government watchdog begins to investigate the incident.

A visibly shaken Rhys Holleran, CEO of Southern Cross Austereo that owns the radio station, has expressed the network’s “deep sorrow” at the death of nurse , 46, on Friday just days after she answered Sydney radio station 2DayFM’s hoax call.

I think there is a place for prank calls, but I don’t regard what that radio station did as a prank call. I think it was a nasty little lie. There is nothing clever or funny in ringing up a nurse and pretending to be someone else to access the private health records of a patient – no matter how famous.

If they had even an ounce of empathy, they should have realised in advance their call, if successful  would result in the employees concerned being massively distraught at their mistake in trusting them not to be lying. Also I don’t see what is funny about a young women having her first baby being in hospital due to complications.

No the suicide of Jacintha Saldanha was not predictable in advance, and I am sure they are genuinely upset by what has happened. However it was predictable that that nature of the call and the hoax they were enacting was going to cause great distress to the hospital staff they conned. The only thing unknown was the extent.

Now two children do not have a mother, and Kate and William’s first child will always be associated with the death of an innocent. Prince William already hated the press for what he saw as their role in the death of his mother. No doubt this addition to the death toll will only harden that hatred.

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137 Responses to “The prank call tragedy”

  1. smttc (708 comments) says:

    I disagree that prank calls by radio jocks have their place unless you are referring to the rubbish bin. They are just a means and way to humiliate or demean someone. Anyway, hopefully this incident will give some at least in radioland cause to think about the appropriateness of these types of pranks.

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  2. mikenmild (11,153 comments) says:

    If Prince William really hates the press, he would do more to stay out of it. Like other celebrities though, he only wants ‘good’ press.

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  3. Nookin (3,138 comments) says:

    This call had two possible outcomes. One was being rebuffed from the outset. The other involved someone being humiliated on an international scene. That isn’t a prank. That is just plain nasty. Of course, if they got thru, the further repercussion was the publicising of someone’s health — someone known to valued her privacy and who had already been poorly treated in the media. Nothing about this was funny or clever. Some pranks are funny and clever but you have to think thru the outcomes and these two either failed to do that or didn’t give a toss. My feeling is the latter.

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  4. Nookin (3,138 comments) says:

    mm
    This wasn’t “press”.

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  5. mikenmild (11,153 comments) says:

    Sorry, I was following DPF’s terminology. I should have said ‘news’ media.

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  6. Lindsay Addie (1,133 comments) says:

    This stupid and ill-conceived stunt which has had tragic consequences is to me symptomatic of the world we live in where people listen to these radio stations with their shallow and often childish attempts at what passes off as entertainment.

    But in this self-centered world we live in where people spend so much time on Twitter, Facebook posting a load of crap and sending inane text messages it isn’t the least bit surprising.

    Sunday morning rant over!!

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  7. tvb (4,229 comments) says:

    Desperate for ratings in a highly competitive market commercial radio and tabloid newspapers are driven to do outlandish things to get an audience. The media are here to stay. But William short of renouncing the throne has to live with them. Hatred is not a sensible media strategy. As for Diana she manipulated the media but got irritated when she could not always have it her way.

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  8. mikenmild (11,153 comments) says:

    Exactly tvb. Where would the monarchy be without the largely adoring news media?

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  9. Alan Johnstone (1,069 comments) says:

    If the “royals” value their privacy they could stop taking public money, get a job and renounce their public role.

    No one forces them to do it. Any one of them could walk away at any time.

    They want to have their cake and eat it.

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  10. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    All this from a media that rejects that is should be controlled by legislation, claiming that it does the job itself. John Roughan wrote in defence of a ‘free media’ in yesterday’s Herald. I think he has served on the Press Council where in one particular matter they decided ‘balance’ of an article of the basis of the writer’s experience. This from the same people who call for transparency and control of others. The two jocks in this case spoke about how they used not very good accents and were ‘surprised’ to be put through. It apparently never entered their pea brain minds that nurses and other public servants are not perpetually on guard for brainless hoaxers who will later ridicule them.

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  11. Viking2 (11,215 comments) says:

    Had the system, which should shelter employee’s from this stuff been in place or been in anyway robust, it would not have eventuated.

    To blame two pranksters for this lady committing hari kari is reprehensible and is slanderous.

    You don’t know the lady nor her mental condition. You don’t know that this is what caused her to end her life. You have no idea at all what her employers, yep that pouncy individual who managed to slim himself all over TV, and his henchmen and or the police/bodyguards/ anyone else in a position to harras the poor lady, said or did.

    Rather easy to blame a couple on the otherside of the world for doing what was indeed a fun thing. They were not rude, they were not devious in the conversation of their call.

    What is appalling is the apparent ease with which the callers were put through to a nurse whose job is about looking after sick people and not about combating the newsmedia per say.
    That’s where the focus should be given the institution invovled deals with high society people all the time.

    An remember it was a public telephoine number, which actually makes the encumbent authorities look even worse.

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  12. Redbaiter (7,836 comments) says:

    So here we go again- same old same old.

    Sure, what ever happened was tragic (assuming for the moment that the suicide was related to the prank) but we have to stop using government to enforce codes of behaviour that should be innate in a civilized society.

    I detest that kind of DJ. There are sometimes even three of four of them on a “show” at the same time, and the inane prattle is intolerable. The “pranks” they often pull are contemptible. I’d rather be tied naked on an anthill than listen to such insipid prattling dumbfucks.

    However, pulling the station’s broadcasting licence and imposing other legal remedies that all impact upon freedom of expression is not the way to deal with it. Especially as the apparent tragic outcome of the prank could never have been predicted.

    Once gentlemen opened doors for ladies. There was not a set of government regulations forcing them to do it. It was just the way a gentleman behaved. Socialists have attacked those standards of behaviour and customs for decades and this kind of mindless crap is the natural result.

    Just behave in a civil manner yourself and tune to another station.

    Attacking freedom of expression with massive over-reaching government controls is not the way to deal with this, and I detest the government agencies and politicians involved in these kind of actions as much as I detest the DJs who are the subject of their thuggish enforcement policies.

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  13. Viking2 (11,215 comments) says:

    Nostalga.
    You really miss the point don’t you.
    Try ringing the Queeen or Buckingham Palace and see how far you get.

    After all it could have been some nasties like oh I don’t know, Al queida.

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  14. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > Now two children do not have a mother

    Just as Greg King’s kids don’t have a father. Now, who can we blame for that? Oh yeah let’s blame the Dominion Post.

    Isn’t it funny (though funny isn’t the right word, obviously) how when something tragic happens, people who should know better play the blame game. First it was the New York photographer and now these DJs. Whatever happened to personal responsibility?

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  15. Viking2 (11,215 comments) says:

    Red’s gets it right again.
    Contemptible socialist controllers who blame everyone except their own ineptness and lack of awareness.

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  16. Redbaiter (7,836 comments) says:

    “After all it could have been some nasties like oh I don’t know, Al queida.”

    Or even one of the Kiwiblog mafia, currently known as Al Queerda.

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  17. slightlyrighty (2,499 comments) says:

    From the Radio Stations Privacy policy statement, as posted on their website.

    10. SENSITIVE INFORMATION

    Sensitive information includes information about your race or ethnic origins, political opinions, religious or philosophical beliefs, trade union membership, or details of health, disability or sexual activity or orientation. We rarely ask for sensitive information, but may do so occasionally, for example, as part of a competition, promotion or survey. We will not require you to provide sensitive information unless:

    (a) you have consented to providing such information (such consent will be deemed when you submit such information to us); or

    (b) the collection of the information is specifically authorised or required by law.

    pricks can’t even obey their own rules.

    As to Allan Johnstone, even a staunch republican must note that the woman who is now dead is not a member of the royal family. And remember the media circus the last time a royal family member renounced the throne? By the way, have you noticed that William actually has a job, like a normal person.

    As to the cost of the Royal Family

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  18. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    Viking2.

    Everybody is talking about the Royals who personally mean little to me. It’s the nurse.
    Then the obscurity begins, such as the difference between phone taping and this.

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  19. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    Here’s a transcript of the call:

    Receptionist: Hello, good morning, King Edward VII Hospital.

    Greig (Queen voice): Oh hello there, could I please speak to Kate please, my granddaughter.

    Receptionist: Oh yes, just hold on ma’am.

    Greig: Thank you.

    Christian: Are they putting us through?

    Greig: Yes.

    (Laughter)

    Christian: If this has worked, it’s the easiest prank call we have ever made. Your accent sucked, by the way, I just want you to know.

    (Laughter)

    Greig: I’m not used to playing 80-year-olds. (Phone connects) Kate, my darling, are you there?

    Nurse: Good morning, ma’am, this is the nurses station, how may I help you?

    Greig: Hello, I’m just after my granddaughter Kate. I wanted to see how her little tummy bug is going.

    Nurse: She’s sleeping at the moment and has had an uneventful night, and sleep is good for her, as we speak. She’s been given some fluids to re-hydrate her because she was quite dehydrated when she came in. But she’s stable at the moment.

    Greig: OK. Well, I’ll just feed my little corgis then (barking in the background). So when is a good time to come and visit her? Because I’m the Queen so I’ll need a lift down there. Charles! When can you take me to the hospital, Charles?

    Christian (pretending to be Prince Charles): When will it be all right to come down and see her? Maybe in the morning or something? If that’s OK?

    Nurse: I would suggest that any time after nine o’clock would be suitable, because the doctor will be in in the morning and we’ll just be getting her freshened up in the morning. I would think any time after nine.

    Christian: Wonderful. Is Wills still there or has he gone home? I haven’t spoken to him yet.

    Nurse: He went home at about half past nine last night. Actually, probably about nine o’ clock last night.

    Christian: OK, Lovely. But they’re all OK, everything’s all right?

    Nurse: Yes, she’s quite stable at the moment. She hasn’t had any retching with me since I’ve been on duty. And she has been sleeping on and off.

    Christian: Wonderful.

    Nurse: I think it’s difficult sleeping in a strange bed as well.

    Christian: Yes, of course, it’s hardly the palace, is it!

    Greig: It’s nothing like the palace is it, Charles? Oh, when are you going to walk those bloody corgis?

    Christian: Mumsy, I’ll go and take the dogs outside.

    Greig: I need to go and visit Kate in the morning. My dear, thank you so much.

    Nurse: You’re very welcome.

    Greig: Thank you, bye.

    Christian: Goodbye.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————————–

    The “receptionist” was Saldanha. The woman who had the conversation with the DJs wasn’t Saldanha. Saldanha simply put the call through to the nurse. If anyone was going to be distressed by what happened, wouldn’t it be the nurse for divulging private information?

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  20. redqueen (500 comments) says:

    The degree of harm they intended to cause is not the issue; the issue is that they cannot fall back on ‘We didn’t intend her to commit suicide’, instead, they merely intended to be jerks (apparently, as it’s all just a laugh). At the very least it appears they intended to commit a privacy breach and the fact of the matter is, they can be held liable at law for their actions independent of the direct intent (hence why assault can lead to manslaughter). Now, this doesn’t mean that they can be charged with manslaughter (as they were not directly connected to her death), but equally, their employer should sack the lot of them or face public disgust. In criminal terms, however, the privacy breach was intentional and it would be nice if fraud was brought up (resulting in malicious consequences).

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  21. dime (9,601 comments) says:

    not sure id call it a tragedy.. sad that someone has taken their own life.

    reading the transcript though, the nurse must have known the caller was full of shit.

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  22. Paulus (2,535 comments) says:

    Understand the Radio Station’s Lawyer approved it. FFS
    How would an Indian lady nurse of 7 years in UK know the difference between a gobshot Aussie and a Pommie accent ?
    Would I ?

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  23. andretti (127 comments) says:

    I find this whole thing a bit rediculous.I mean why would it be the radio stations fault that they picked up a major privicy issue at the hospital.The woman in question should never have put the call through.Seems to me the training was not up to scratch for both of these women.The DJs could not believe their luck that they got through so easily.There is something a bit wrong that someone would kill themself over this incident.

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  24. andretti (127 comments) says:

    the hospital’s chief executive said in a statement. “We take patient confidentiality extremely seriously and we are now reviewing our telephone protocols.”

    Ill call bulshit on that,any body can ring them up and they will just tell all.

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  25. Azeraph (603 comments) says:

    I would go after the Hospital administration and ask them questions on why their receptionist went sideways over a simple mistake? Were the staff briefed in security matters to do with their royals properly or were they put on the rack and vilified for the embarrassment it caused the hospital?

    Let’s see the spin put on this, it’s obvious from the posts above the direction it is headed, it’s now up to the couple to come out and commiserate because something that is usually a common and natural condition with expecting mums and yes! it is a private matter has been now tainted by something that was out of their control right from the start. Who the hell has the foresight to predict this kind outcome? Even the radio guys was just playing along, great joke that no one would have foreseen it’s consequences.

    So, who drove Saldanha to kill herself?

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  26. noskire (833 comments) says:

    Have to say I agree with Peter Fitzsimons http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/society-and-culture/a-tragedy-but-who-is-at-fault-20121208-2b29q.html

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  27. Chuck Bird (4,725 comments) says:

    Has anyone thought the over reaction against these young and clever DJs could drive one of them to suicide? Not likely – possible. They were meant to have considered that a couple of people would have been taken in by their script. I have heard of the nationality of the nurse who took the initial call but nothing of the second nurse.

    In the past I have tried to find out if someone I am visiting is up to having visitors. The staff at NZ public hospitals are trained not to give out much information. I would think that the private hospital in the UK would have other high profile people as patient and should have trained staff to properly check that calls are first genuine and if genuine to even then only let out appropriate information.

    Lord whats his name who is making such a fuss should accept a little responsibility himself but when do you hear Lords, MPs or Judges ever accept responsibility?

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  28. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    @ross69The “receptionist” was Saldanha.

    exactly, this woman that has taken her life sadly will have had some other shit going on and this might just have been the kicker, she actually did nothing but transfer a call.

    If you keep your listening to The Sound(NZ) and Classic Jazz(UK) you don’t have to put up with these knobs on the radio anyway.

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  29. Lance (2,527 comments) says:

    @Alan Johnstone 8:59

    Basic economics, ever been to London?, seen the fucking enormous crowds there to see the royals, palace etc?

    No, thought not. Just talking through your arse again.

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  30. muggins (3,077 comments) says:

    I agree with Peter FitzSimons.
    There was no malice in that call. It was just a prank and a bleedin’ obvious prank at that. However anyone was fooled by it I will never know. But then you get some people who still believe David Bain is innocent.
    Why on earth did that nurse that put that call through to the ward feel she needed to kill herself for doing that?. The ward nurse hasn’t committed suicide and she has been made to look a right plonker.
    Personally,I thought that prank call was quite funny when I heard it. And so apparently,did Prince Charles. And the jounalists he was speaking to thought what he said was funny.
    As FitzSimons says,all those DJ’s were doing was taking the piss.
    Will one or both of them commit suicide because of the bullets that are being fired at them.? I very much doubt it.

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  31. Longknives (4,620 comments) says:

    I still think phoning a Hospital and impersonating family of a patient in order to obtain personal information is fucking obscene.
    Maybe I just don’t have a sense of humour??

    Looks like a shitehouse radio station anyway, one of those ones that plays Nicki Minaj and Justin Beiber. Good riddance I say…
    http://www.2dayfm.com.au/

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  32. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Classic post-hoc reasoning by a hypocritically outraged public. I can’t help suspect that even those who acknowledge that the DJ’s shouldn’t be held responsible for this woman’s mental health issues still judge the prank in the context of it nonetheless. Seems to me that prior to her death the only people outraged were the Royals for having their privacy breached. But the public does not get to jump on that bandwagon. Not when they eagerly consume every titbit of gossip because they want to know every little detail about a life they can only fantasize about.

    A prank is inherently dishonest and it is inherently juvenile. There are limits to what may be regarded as acceptable but no reasonable person would expect death to ensue from tricking someone into thinking you were Queen Elizabeth. Indeed no respectable psychologist would attribute this woman’s mental health issues to a prank. The notion that these DJs should have expected the prank to cause “great distress” is also absurd and merely a round-a-bout way to try and attribute the death to these DJs because someone always has to be blamed.

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  33. Scott1 (478 comments) says:

    it is jsut speculation but it does sound like the nurse who put the call through was potentially put under a lot of pressure. the hospital says it was supporting her.. but that doesnt sound plausible as a ‘full story”.. i would think they would be running in circles trying to cover their asses and she probably got a dressing down whether she deserved it or not in the first instance.. maybe later some support. She may have got some hate mail etc considering how a lot of peopel seemed to blme her for putting them through. (personally i cant blame her as what are you going to do – tell the queen she cant talk to her family because you think her accent sounds unusual? fast track to the unemplyment line anyone?)

    As to changing the rules… maybe there is a civil breach of privacy issue here, and to willfully breach that might be an ethics issue. But as commenters above indicate one needs to be very careful about making laws that restrict peoples freedom here… especially as a knee jerk reaction

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  34. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Longknives (1,897) Says:
    December 9th, 2012 at 1:24 pm

    I still think phoning a Hospital and impersonating family of a patient in order to obtain personal information is fucking obscene.
    Maybe I just don’t have a sense of humour??

    Personal information? Such as retching and sleeping? Is there another type of morning sickness that doesn’t involve vomiting and rest?

    Seems to me the humour was found in their woeful attempts to impersonate the Queen and their shocking luck at being believed.

    BTW, while we are all concerned about her privacy maybe we could cease the 24/7 news coverage and analysis of what’s going on inside her tummy. Is it twins? What happens if one comes out before the other? What’s the implications of her slender frame? When did she start drinking water? Can we infer the time of conception? FFS. Privacy indeed!

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  35. Scott1 (478 comments) says:

    Weihana,
    not sure I entirely agree. sure peopel dont expect the prank to cause great distress but that is just because they havent thought about it. the situation the nurse was put in would have cuased great distress because blaming her is one of the default reactions, it is infact what the DJ’s did in the clip. they pretty much argued – “not our fault no reasonable person would have put us through…”
    it would distress any normal person to have that said about you as the main story of the day.. even worse that this is the sort of story where such a meme gets recycled at every watercooler and pub that you might go to.

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  36. Scott Chris (5,940 comments) says:

    Classic post-hoc reasoning by a hypocritically outraged public.

    Agreed.

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  37. Chuck Bird (4,725 comments) says:

    If there is any investigation I hope it focuses on the hospital. How did the media get her name for example?

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  38. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Scott1,

    Is some embarrassment not an inherent part of any prank? I don’t think I would also consider embarrassment as necessarily qualifying as “great distress”. I don’t believe the full story is being told and I would assume other factors are at play in this woman’s life.

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  39. Left Right and Centre (2,861 comments) says:

    It’s an interesting one.

    I would’ve assumed that when you’ve got the future queen in a hospital ward that they’d have thought about setting up some security protocols to screen out the muppets that you *expect* to try and ring through.

    I mean seriously… they just got *put through??* What the fuck?? How hard is it to set something up like… hey, it’s someone saying they’re the Queen…. let’s have ourselves a method of confirming whether it’s true or not. Codes… passwords… hello??

    I’m in disbelief that in 2012 something like that could happen with a royal family member. Yeah, I think I’ll just give John Key a ring and have a nice little chat Monday. I’m sure someone will be kind enough to just put me through no questions asked. He’s not answering but you can try him on his fucking cellphone mate. I DON’T fucking THINK SOOOOOOO!!!!!! hahahahaha

    I can’t believe the receptionist took her own life…. whoa!! Because of the call? Holy shit…. gobsmacked…

    I am thick. I only just got the name ‘Redbaiter’. Duh!! Sometimes it’s like staring at the dots trying to see the sailboat, isn’t it?

    Hey, Longknives… I’m with you on Bieber but I like ‘Starships’.. that’s good bubblegum.. and have you seen that chick’s figure? It’s screaming white hot mate. Curves that make Marilyn Monroe look like Kate Moss. Awful clashing trashy pink lipstick though…. yeegherugh.

    I want the music from radio stations… not the fuckhead DJs. As soon as I hear a speaking voice… flick it over or off. Shit they sound awful. They sound like someone has gone out hunting the fifty worst sounding kiwi accents from around the country… blended them all together… Hoi… haw’s yee doiy geoeeing? Reieing eiin naaa ond boie caawler nombuur noioine toe wine uur doble puss toe soi Thu Hobbutt. Holy twangy tang Batman… would you like to buy a vowel that aint some ass-rooted form of a ‘u’?

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  40. Azeraph (603 comments) says:

    Ever thought just how competitive the employment situation is in the UK? Especially with the Indian modern perspective towards their jobs and their potential towards advancement? whether she is a classic brit of many generations or a recently ethnitized indian the culture is still present. Saldanha made a mistake, most probably had her mind too far forward in time to comprehend the probability of a prank call and forgot her basic training when dealing with the mass amount of phone calls receptionists have to deal with in the public arena…….We’re human, we don’t carry instant ssd’s in our heads and can turn off the human mind and be totally 100% focused 100% of the time.

    But this plays havoc with our self image of “We should be focused 100% of the time otherwise why have employee’s” or “With the availability of the data and the HR dept training that hospital staff are put through there is no room for human error”

    The logically minded here will disagree but that only shows that we can only speculate on a system that is not our own. Human is Human, we don’t learn experience from our screens or can instantly transport across the planet in our delusional “Click now” universe. Were mostly monotaskers and perform by rote though some of us is slightly multitasking we can’t access instant data and instant coffee stimulation 24 hrs a day.

    The british have a deptartment that screens doctors requests for scans or tests, somewhat like how the ACC used to behave.

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  41. Azeraph (603 comments) says:

    Unfortunately Red the Brits don’t seem to be too overly serious about their privacy but boy when their mud hits the wall it splatters.

    Let’s hope that people here still adhere to contacting their reps through the offices they rent out for said purposes rather than take it upon themselves for a bit of europe style voyeurism.

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  42. wreck1080 (3,777 comments) says:

    Hardly the DJ’s fault.

    There are people with mental health issues that top themselves all the time due to something another person has done.

    This doesn’t mean it is the other persons fault necessarily.

    I’m amazed at the number of self righteous angry people out there wanting an old fashioned death by stoning. Maybe our western culture is not so civilised after all.

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  43. Rex Widerstrom (5,307 comments) says:

    I went to announcer training school with Danny Faye, whom some older readers might remember as the man who did the uncannily accurate Muldoon impersonation on radio in the late 70s and early 80s. He also did a range of other, equally good, impressions.

    Danny would, like any professional broadcaster, meticulously plan his prank calls. The aim was to build suspense as he gradually probed the edges of the subject’s credulity, with the audience wondering when and if he’d get caught out. Whether or not he was eventually caught out he’d always drop out of character at the end and admit it was a hoax, thank the person for participating and enjoy a laugh. That way the person called wasn’t left feeling like a dupe – they’d been taken in by a masterful impersonation and then let in on it at the end.

    He isn’t the only one, of course. There’ve been some very, very clever prank callers and nowadays Crank Yankers (Comedy Central) do some very clever stuff. They often take the other approach that works well – calling someone who’s prejudiced or rude and tripping them into revealing that side of themselves on the call. While the subject is more a victim in that sort of call, it wouldn’t work if they weren’t prejudiced or rude so some blame attaches.

    This call was not well executed; the two idiots admitted “we expected to be hung up on”. So think for a moment – the best they could come up with was to call a hospital, giggling like schoolchildren, ask to be put through to the ward, be told no, and no doubt collapse into a fit of even greater giggles about how daring they’d been. They had no plan of where it might go if they lucked out and got through, and weren’t clever enough to think on their feet when they did. It was never meant to be about the person called, only about them, as is their entire show.

    Mel Greig and Michael Christian deserve to be sacked not because their juvenile antics led to someone’s suicide, but because they’re shithouse broadcasters who don’t deserve the gig when any number of better, funnier young people are stuck in provincial radio in Australia and New Zealand.

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  44. calendar girl (1,193 comments) says:

    Azeraph @ 2.20pm: can you please explain all that to us ordinary people?

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  45. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > I mean why would it be the radio stations fault that they picked up a major privicy issue at the hospital.

    Well, quite. Keith Ng picked up a major privacy breach with the public kiosks at WINZ offices. I haven’t heard what effect (if any) it’s had on Paula Bennett’s mental health but judging by her sweetie comment to Jacinda Adern, it doesn’t seem to have affected her at all. :)

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  46. muggins (3,077 comments) says:

    calendar girl,
    Yeah ,I was wondering about that post myself. What does it mean?
    So far as that prank goes,well I thought it was funny,specially when I read the full transcript. Juvenile,but funny with it.
    I have to think that the nurse who committed suicide must have had some problems. I mean it was that other nurse that was made to look a right plonker and I am sure she won’t be committing suicide. Bet she is pretty embarrassed,though. But she will get over it.
    I remember about 60 odd years ago when I was the office junior and was given an order to take over to the store across the road. The order was for a long weight. The bloke I gave it to said he would be back in a minute,but he kept me waiting for about ten . Then he came back,but he didn’t have that long weight with him .I asked him where it was and he said I had had it.
    Another order was for a sky hook. I remember the storeman climbing up the ladder trying to find one for me.
    And then there was that striped paint. Fortunately they had given up on that one by the time I arrived. An earlier office junior realised what was going on so he asked the bloke at the paintshop to mix up two tins of paint. So that sort of put the kybosh on that one.
    I was so naive at the time. Only sixteen . But I got over it.

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  47. Viking2 (11,215 comments) says:

    So you don’tlike them Rex?
    You don’t have to listen to them and most of all you don’t pay them noor did yopu employ them.So Its for thier employers to decide what they want of them. Fortunately we all don’t have the same tastes as you and Red.

    Not that I’m saying I know what they are about and I really don’t give a knob of goat shit.

    They have certainly given their employers plenty of publicity and any publicity is better than none. Their target audience will grow and so will their revenue unless of course you limp wristed panty wastes get your way like you all did with Henry.

    But I guess like Henry, people like you will have beaten up the employers till they submit to your terrorism. (as they did with Hinch). People who didn’t even listen to his show disgraced themselves in the same way.

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  48. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    Yes, muggins, some people have a thin skin. Having said that, I hear that Wellington Zoo is thoroughly sick of people ringing for Mr Lyon. :) April Fools Day is apparently pretty bad.

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  49. Akaroa (552 comments) says:

    Rex W at 4.46 hit the nail on the head. Absolutely spot on!

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  50. chiz (1,124 comments) says:

    Pranks involving people with fake accents? I’m reminded here of ‘hone’ Carter.

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  51. mikenmild (11,153 comments) says:

    Yeah chiz, but that was funny coz it was good ole boy JC and his mate Banksie who always amused himself by mangling Maori pronunciation.

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  52. Lee C (4,516 comments) says:

    My guess is some tipot supervisor overdid the reprimand, and the poor low paid receptionist just felt miserable.

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  53. Scott1 (478 comments) says:

    i note they have the DJ’s on suicide watch now..

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  54. Dave Mann (1,183 comments) says:

    Childish though it might be, I don’t think that ringing up a hospital pretending to be the daft old queen and her idiotic son (and, incredibly, getting away with it!) is worthy of all the faux outrage.

    And, IF this woman’s suicide WAS connected in any way with the prank (which I somehow doubt), then it just goes to show what a brittle attention seeking borderline person she must have been. I mean.. honestly..?…. to KILL YOURSELF because you were tricked into putting a call through to a ward nurse about a patient….? Really…? Talk about going to extremes to make a point!

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  55. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    > Talk about going to extremes to make a point!

    Well, she might have been wanting attention and didn’t expect it to end this way. It’s worth noting that many victims of suicide make a number of unsuccessful suicide attempts before taking their life.

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  56. muggins (3,077 comments) says:

    I guess there won’t be any radio hacks making prank calls for a day or two.

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  57. Dave Mann (1,183 comments) says:

    It gets sicker and more onanistic with every passing hour! Now the bloody ‘fragile’ DJs are getting fucking COUNSELLING, FFS

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/8056460/Fragile-DJs-getting-intense-counselling

    Someone pass me a bucket. We have descended into some sort of vomit-inducing society where everybody competes to be the biggest and most pathetic victim. This is just simply disgusting.

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  58. Rex Widerstrom (5,307 comments) says:

    My “terrorism” Viking 2?

    You come here day in, day out, banging on about personal freedoms yet you’d deny me my opinion – as a radio professional and as a listener – on the pathetic antics of two people who don’t deserve their jobs. Note I’m not suggesting some government regulator have the power to sack them, just that their employer might like to reflect – as is his right – whether this level of juvenile onanism is what his station wants to be broadcasting. If he chooses to ignore me, and the many hundreds of thousands of people worldwide who share that opinion then that too is his right.

    Your extreme view of freedom applies, it seems, only to those behaving like dickheads, not those who are tired of it. If I receive poor service from a rude waiter am I a “terrorist” if I inform his employer I won’t be dining there again if he continues to employ someone so substandard? I see it as doing him a favour – maybe he had no idea how bad the the waiter was, and why his business was suffering. If I get a lousy haircut am I not within my rights to express the opinion that the hairdresser ought not to continue working there?

    Lest it’s not clear, I’m not suggesting assassination or bombing or other acts of terrorism – a term you cheapen by using it in an attempt to score points.

    In fact the kind of feedback I’m providing is merely the free market – which you claim to embrace – at work.

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  59. Random Punter (65 comments) says:

    “IF this woman’s suicide WAS connected in any way with the prank (which I somehow doubt), then it just goes to show what a brittle attention seeking borderline person she must have been.”

    Please show some respect for the dead, Mr Mann. If anyone in this sorry business is “a brittle attention seeking borderline person”, it’s the two who thought it was funny to perpetrate a puerile hoax designed to humiliate their victim.

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  60. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    a puerile hoax designed to humiliate their victim.

    No. It was designed to be humorous. Most normal people would have considered it a bit of a laugh. There was no “victim”.

    You come across as a vile and humorless little freak. Is that what your trying to portray in your self righteous post ?

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  61. Azeraph (603 comments) says:

    Sorry my ranty post was just about being just ordinary, I’ve worked in hospitals and have seen people driven to comply with some idiotic systems and the wolves that are put in place to make it work until it is proven that it was never going to work, it seems to happen when a conservative bunch gets in power.

    My first action plan would be to fry the HR head and then grill the administration, put the fear of God into them just like how Osh does to site managers when they have been derelict in their duties to ensure safety while they are in charge.

    I don’t know why the DJ’s are being slapped around for something that was just a joke, instead concentrate on why Saldanha killed herself and if it’s proven to be from undue pressure then go after the buggers because they will be trying their best to find the best cover they can get. If there are a lot of resignations then the rats are leaving the boat.

    It could of just been the trigger rather than the cause.

    A lot of retired people here.

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  62. Johnston (1 comment) says:

    Hello I’m from the UK and have family that have worked as paramedics. What people are missing is the time difference. what is early evening for you. Is the small hours of the morning for us. That means that most likely there are no reception staff on duty. Nurses who cover the wards also cover the phones. People are also forgetting that the population of Australia is three times smaller than that of the UK.
    My family member has had to work A&E and observation wards that are EXETREMELY busy, that includes dealing with phone call from worried relatives at all hours of the night. Sometimes patient work requires that calls are passed to other wards speedily and at 4:00 a.m. it should’ve have to be up to the nurse. to fanny about working out whose genuine and who is not.

    I keep reading that it was a “Harmless Prank” and an ‘Austrailian Tradition of the Prank Call” Well That ‘Tradition’ is bollocks Jerry Lewis was performing them in 60s and he’s from New Jersey. The arguement that its the Austrailian sense of humour is also trite ans fatuous. I’m no royalist, but where is the comedy in trying find someone’s medical records? Seriously perhaps my sense of humour isn’t as refined as the famous australian one but I just don’t see the gag? Then again, this is a station who forced a 14 year old to take a polygraph and admit she was raped. Maybe the owners, producers DJs and even Listeners should take a long hard look at themselves

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  63. Scott1 (478 comments) says:

    i dont think it is easy to understand the sort of pressure one comes under when one is hated (or thought incompetent) on a global scale and the story goes on and on.
    I suppose the DJ’s didn’t really understand that – and now they do.
    I think it isnt an insignificant number of people who would at least contemplate suicide under that sort of pressure, maybe most people.

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  64. Elaycee (4,318 comments) says:

    Human is Human, we don’t learn experience from our screens or can instantly transport across the planet in our delusional “Click now” universe. Were mostly monotaskers and perform by rote though some of us is slightly multitasking we can’t access instant data and instant coffee stimulation 24 hrs a day.

    Oh, oh… Sounds like a comment overheard at a Bob Marley concert.… :(

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  65. joana (1,983 comments) says:

    I would say that the nurse, being Indian felt a great sense of shame..Shame is a huge thing through out Asia. No one in NZ feels shame anymore..well maybe some elderly people still feel it.

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  66. RRM (9,582 comments) says:

    To call this a “harmless prank” is bollocks, and as dishonest as the prank call itself.

    It was not “harmless” – harm was done, a good person has killed herself, as a direct result of the actions of these stupid stupid fuckwits. Guess what kids: Actions have consequences.

    I hope they carry the guilt around with them for a long time.

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  67. muggins (3,077 comments) says:

    It was a harmless prank and would have always been a harmless prank had that nurse not committed suicide.
    There is no way those DJ’s could have anticipated that. I could hardly believe it when I heard that nurse had committed suicide and now it turns out she only put the call through to the ward.
    I know it was a pretty juvenile thing to do,but you never know what radio DJ’s are going to come up with.
    But I guess that will be the end of harmless pranks for some considerable time.

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  68. muggins (3,077 comments) says:

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/opinion/columnists/jane-bowron/8057436/Prank-call-will-blight-radio-DJs-careers
    This is what Jane Bowron has to say about that hoax call.

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  69. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    a good person has killed herself, as a direct result

    Utter rubbish. Where is the evidence to support that statement ?

    Any reasonable person would understand the poor woman had other issues. Your approach shows a profound lack of understanding about people. Your fake outrage lacks credibility.

    I hope they carry the guilt around with them for a long time.

    That statement gives readers a true insight into your real character. Your a miserable prick.

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  70. RRM (9,582 comments) says:

    That statement gives readers a true insight into your real character. Your a miserable prick.

    :lol:

    It’s you’re. You’re a miserable prick. Not your.

    You semi-educated little waste of oxygen. It’s astonishing to think your dad’s best and fastest-swimming sperm turned out to be you.

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  71. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    That petty little outburst only serves to reveal more of your bleak nature. They do say that a sense of humour is linked with intelligence, (rather than a persons ability to correct minor grammatical errors) :)

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  72. RightNow (6,773 comments) says:

    It seems the radio station’s lawyers may have some culpability:

    Southern Cross Austereo, owners of 2Day FM, has plenty of adults. Some of them are lawyers, who gave the all-clear for the hospital item to run. Significantly, they apparently did so without observing a rule that radio stations usually follow for prank calls: they didn’t seek permission for broadcast from the people who had been pranked.

    http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/timblair/index.php/dailytelegraph/comments/rules_for_fools/

    Since the witch hunt is already in full swing, I say throw the lawyers to the mob.

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  73. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    …a good person has killed herself, as a direct result of the actions of these stupid stupid fuckwits.

    …killed *herself*. That does not make these DJs responsible for her death.

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  74. RRM (9,582 comments) says:

    …killed *herself*. That does not make these DJs responsible for her death.

    They are more responsible than they would have been if they had never made the prank call in the first place.
    And I suspect they know it, judging by the amount of counselling they have been having.

    The poor maligned wee petals, and all they did was have a bit of fun at someone else’s expense.

    I am seeing a lot of interesting moral compasses on this thread though. Somehow, unless you’re convicted of something you’re squeaky clean and morally blameless. I think I understand better how thieves and fraudsters sleep at night now.

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  75. thedavincimode (6,573 comments) says:

    Jerry Lewis was performing them in 60s

    Well, there are no grounds for dispute here. Jerry Lewis was definitely not funny.

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  76. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    RRM, where is the EVIDENCE she killed herself as a direct result of a harmless prank?

    If you do find any EVIDENCE to support that theory, you still have not shown the radio station was to blame. For example; You make some harsh comments about me on KB. What would happen if I killed myself after reading those comments. Would you accept blame for my death ?

    If not, why ?

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  77. thedavincimode (6,573 comments) says:

    Let’s try it and find out.

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  78. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    RRM (5,926) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 11:35 am

    I am seeing a lot of interesting moral compasses on this thread though. Somehow, unless you’re convicted of something you’re squeaky clean and morally blameless. I think I understand better how thieves and fraudsters sleep at night now.

    It has nothing to do with a conviction. Even if she wrote a letter saying “I killed myself because I was pranked” that does not make them responsible. It makes her crazy and if she hadn’t managed to kill herself she would require some professional help. Her mental issues are not the responsibility of strangers.

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  79. KevinH (1,141 comments) says:

    Given the relative conservatism within some sections of the Asian community, it has come as no surprise that Ms Saldanha took drastic if somewhat tragic action over her perceived failure in not recognising the pranksters. The subsequent shame and humiliation that Ms Saldanha must have felt played a significant part in her decision to take her own life.
    Further to that the hospital in question,King Edward’s V11 must also shoulder some responsibilty for not having processes in place that deal with pranksters and also the distress pranksters have on staff.
    However in the final analysis, the radio station at the centre of this distressing story needs to be held accountable for the actions of it’s staff and also of it’s on air policy of permitting prank callls that can and in this case, backfire so tragically.
    The pranksters themselves,Mel Greig and Michael Christian, should come out of hiding and face the criticism that is due to them. The prank in the first instance was perverse, intruding on Prince William and his wife’s intimate privacy, and secondly fraudulent in that it was done for commercial reasons.

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  80. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    KevinH (839) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 1:29 pm

    Given the relative conservatism within some sections of the Asian community, it has come as no surprise that Ms Saldanha took drastic if somewhat tragic action over her perceived failure in not recognising the pranksters.

    No surprise? It is bonkers. If this is normal in “some sections of the Asian community” then the lot of them are bonkers.

    You seem to be peddling the same nonsense that was advanced in the “Innocence of Muslims” controversy. Muslims got violent in retaliation for the video therefore the video itself was to blame. Similarly you are trying to claim that, because of culture, her “shame and humiliation” for something so trivial and innocuous caused her to kill herself therefore the prank is to blame. Utter bullshit and if there really is a cultural explanation for such a ridiculous reaction then the culture itself is ridiculous.

    The prank in the first instance was perverse, intruding on Prince William and his wife’s intimate privacy

    How so? It was widely reported that she was having morning sickness. From the transcript provided on this page I see nothing further divulged other than what would have already been implied in news reports.

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  81. RRM (9,582 comments) says:

    Kea (1,026) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 11:55 am

    You make some harsh comments about me on KB. What would happen if I killed myself after reading those comments. Would you accept blame for my death ?

    If not, why?

    I like where you’re going with this Kea :-)

    In my culture we have a saying: The proof of the pudding is in the eating

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  82. Griff (6,965 comments) says:

    Well done RRM
    I could not think of a polite way to say it :lol:

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  83. lastmanstanding (1,220 comments) says:

    The2 DJs the radio station directors CEO and senior management are gonna be laughing on the other side of their faces when the charge of culpable manslaughter hits them

    Cause thats what the law says. The call was a deliberate fraudulent misrepresentation. The result was harm caused by the call. Connect up the dots. Its easy the Courts will be no difficulty in doing so.

    In these PC times this is a crime not a prank a crime. The Courts will say that those involved either knew or should have known the consquences of their actions. Thats how the law plays out these days. Saying we didnt know she was gotting to top herself aint an excuse anymore. Just as ognorance of the law aint an excuse.

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  84. chiz (1,124 comments) says:

    From an article in The Times:

    Britain’s most prestigious private hospital, a favourite with royalty and wealthy celebrities, does not employ trained telephone operators to work night shifts. Instead saldanha, 46, a mother of two, had been asked to take calls – a task she had done before and now considered routine.

    [...]

    Under the hospital’s protocol, it is forbidden to put people who call the publicly advertised number through to the ward – a rule that Saldanha, who had worked there for four years, would have known. In such cases a message should be passed instead.

    [...]

    For Saldanha, described by colleagues as a loyal, trusted and hard-working employee, it was no laughing matter. Sources at the hospital say she was “traumatised” when she learnt how she had been duped.

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  85. lastmanstanding (1,220 comments) says:

    BTW fraudulent misrepresentation is a untrue statement made with knowledge of its falsity or not caring whether it be true or false with the result that it is acted on a loss results.

    In this case the facts fit the definition to a T

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  86. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    lastmanstanding (922) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 2:49 pm

    The2 DJs the radio station directors CEO and senior management are gonna be laughing on the other side of their faces when the charge of culpable manslaughter hits them

    Cause thats what the law says. The call was a deliberate fraudulent misrepresentation. The result was harm caused by the call. Connect up the dots. Its easy the Courts will be no difficulty in doing so.

    What law?

    That Y occurs after X does not prove that X caused Y. Even if this woman wrote a suicide note indicating that she committed suicide because of the prank, that does not make the pranksters culpable for her actions. Their actions did not cause the death. Her actions are the cause. She is not an automaton and others are not responsible for what she chooses to do to herself.

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  87. RRM (9,582 comments) says:

    Weihana;

    Not meaning to be a dick but in continuing to apply the black / white standard of judicial proof it’s almost like you’ve absorbed nothing of what I said earlier:

    They are more responsible than they would have been if they had never made the prank call in the first place.

    And I suspect they know it, judging by the amount of counselling they have been having.

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  88. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    RRM & Griff.

    I feel really bad about you picking on me.

    I might go “kill myself”.

    Will you two hand yourselves into the cops and admit to the murder ?

    If not, why ?

    The logic behind your thinking is so messed up it is hard to know where to start. No wonder you have fallen for the AGW hoax Griff. :)

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  89. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Weihana, your wasting your time. They are full of shit. RRM has been implying I should kill myself !

    It shows the level of sincerity he has. What a self righteous wanker.

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  90. RRM (9,582 comments) says:

    I recognise this is your cry for help Kea.

    We’re here for you, buddy. Tell RRM what’s troubling you. Get it off your chest. :-)

    You’re a beautiful person Kea. Please don’t do anything hasty.

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  91. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Thanks for your expression of concern RRM. Maybe I was all wrong about you being full of shit :)

    Now how about answering my question… ?

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  92. RRM (9,582 comments) says:

    The radio idiots are not “murderers” Kea. Yet they should feel some responsibility.

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  93. lastmanstanding (1,220 comments) says:

    Weihana The MSM are reporting the UK police are in discussions with the Sydney Police. My bet is that charges will be laid at least involving the phone call. The DJs committed a fraudulent misrepresentation. Go look up the law Google it and you will find the DJs are guilty. The station directors and CEO may also be charged as they are held responsible for the actions of their staff.

    Its like the Elf and Safety laws. Harsh but the law. IF the UK DPS decide there is a link between the call and the suicide they may decide to lay other charges.
    Watch this space but dont be surprised given the back lash in the UK against the media ( Levenson Report and all that) Could just be that the Aussies DJs did it at the wrong time and will face the music big time as a result.

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  94. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    I wonder how many people have topped themselves after reading the bleak fatalistic predictions of climate alarmists?

    I wonder if the poor girl had been reading Griffs posts on KB?

    Oh btw… where is the EVIDENCE the prank call was what made her kill her self ? This thread has dragged on for some time now, and still not a single piece of evidence has been presented.

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  95. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    In March of this year, a couple in Argentina shot their two children before committing suicide over fears of global warming. On Wednesday, in Maryland, James Lee apparently committed ‘suicide by cop’ after taking three hostages in an attempt to force the Discovery Channel to alter its programming to suit his fears over the environment.

    I guess that stuff is ok with you guys ?

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  96. Random Punter (65 comments) says:

    Good afternoon RRM

    We seem to have incurred Kea’s wrath. He calls you “a miserable little prick”, and “a self-righteous wanker”. I’m apparently “a vile and humorless little freak”. We clearly can’t hope to compete with cogent arguments like that.

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  97. RightNow (6,773 comments) says:

    Who thinks that Target episode that had the carpet layer tossing off was potentially more likely to drive him to suicide than this prank call was likely to drive the nurse to suicide?

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  98. Rex Widerstrom (5,307 comments) says:

    @RightNow

    Excellent point. It is a pity that society can’t sit down and have a rational discussion about “naming and shaming” and other forms of public humiliation and decide where the boundaries lie. Should a bloke indulging a bit of onanistic activity in someone else’s house deserve not just the official response to his wrongdoing – whatever criminal charges may be appropriate, loss of his employment, loss of professional registration (if his trade is one that’s registered) and so on – but also the indelible stamp that comes with the publicity?

    Should someone shamed before their peers in this way receive less of an official penalty so as to try to achieve a degree of parity with those caught committing similar acts (say, by private CCTV) but not held up to national ridicule?

    And expanding from that, should someone arrested for an offence have their name splashed all over the media before even the weight of evidence against them is known, let alone a conviction recorded? And if someone thinks that’s okay, why should someone arrested for the exact same offence 20 or 30 years ago, before widespread internet use, avoid the shaming that someone arrested today undergoes?

    Should someone sentenced to six months, or six years in prison, or handed a fine, have to suffer the additional punbishment of having their wrongdoing recorded forever in Google? How is any person thus affected to make good their compact with society that they will rejoin it when released and become a productive member once more when any prospective employer can know of their background? And so on…

    The answer isn’t to attempt to regulate, as Leveson in the UK and Senator Conroy in Australia are so keen to do, but to debate these issues as they arise and, hopefully, educate the media as to what is acceptable to its viewers, listeners and readers and what is not.

    Which is why the virtriol from both sides of the argument – but particularly those claiming to uphold the DJs’ freedom of expression while not seeing the irony in opposing that of others – is so dismaying.

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  99. muggins (3,077 comments) says:

    Rightnow.
    Yeah,good point. I wonder where he is now. Wouldn’t be surprised if he gone overseas. I mean he would have to be helluva embarrassed about that. Should TV3 have shown that? Would they do the same thing now after what has just happened?

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  100. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Its amusing seeing humorless little freaks, like RRM & RP, trying to claim some sort of moral high ground on this non-issue.

    They are not content with one life destroyed, but want others to have their careers ended with no income for their family, publically shamed, criminally convicted, and so on.

    All because they pulled a harmless prank for the enjoyment of others. This speaks volumes about their character, or lack of it.

    Like I said, miserable pricks.

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  101. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    RRM (5,933) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 3:21 pm

    Weihana;

    Not meaning to be a dick but in continuing to apply the black / white standard of judicial proof it’s almost like you’ve absorbed nothing of what I said earlier:

    They are more responsible than they would have been if they had never made the prank call in the first place.

    I’m not employing a black and white standard of judicial proof: you are. You are using the argument that “but for X, Y wouldn’t have happened”. That is black and white and ridiculous. The fact that something came before one thing does not demonstrate culpability. This woman was an adult and responsible for her own actions. If she was mentally ill (highly probable it would seem) then that is also not the fault of perfect strangers.

    And I suspect they know it, judging by the amount of counselling they have been having.

    Irrelevant what they know or think they know. This is a simple question of whether the prank call can be blamed for her suicide. It cannot. She made the decision and the prank call in no way can reasonably be said to have compelled her to such action.

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  102. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Weihana, you have great patience, but they don’t care. They simply want to see someone punished and their lives destroyed. Weird little men that they are.

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  103. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    lastmanstanding (924) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 3:52 pm

    Weihana The MSM are reporting the UK police are in discussions with the Sydney Police. My bet is that charges will be laid at least involving the phone call. The DJs committed a fraudulent misrepresentation.

    I don’t think they did. Their call did not induce the lady into a contract nor did it cause her to suffer any damages as a consequence. Her subsequent actions were entirely of her own choosing (or a consequence of serious mental health issues for which the DJs are also not culpable).

    Moreover, fraudulent misrepresentation is a tort, not a criminal offense.

    Go look up the law Google it and you will find the DJs are guilty. The station directors and CEO may also be charged as they are held responsible for the actions of their staff.

    Its like the Elf and Safety laws. Harsh but the law. IF the UK DPS decide there is a link between the call and the suicide they may decide to lay other charges.

    Doesn’t matter what they decide. They don’t get to make up the law as they go along based on idiotic rationalizations and the need to blame someone for the actions of an individual who took her own life.

    Watch this space but dont be surprised given the back lash in the UK against the media ( Levenson Report and all that) Could just be that the Aussies DJs did it at the wrong time and will face the music big time as a result.

    The law isn’t decided by public opinion. If there has been a breach I imagine it’s a very minor breach. The woman’s death is irrelevant.

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  104. Scott1 (478 comments) says:

    There is a simple solutiopn to the debate that everyone seems to be arguing for without actually accepting it.
    that is that there is a scale of responsibility from
    1) the situation where you alone, corner a person you know is vulnerable, and harass them untill you know they kill themselves (surely a at least somewhat “naughty” thing to do),
    and
    2) the situation where you do somthing completely normal, and a person kills themself.

    In the middle might be where you and 100 other people each do 1% of the harassment that adds up to case (1)
    or where you do exactly the same thing as case (1) but are just way too stupid to connect the dots that you are making people kill themselves.

    Anyway whatever exact factors we think matter between the scenarios – the point is that there is not absolute dividing line between having moral responsibility and not having it…

    legally however I dont think they need to be charged – they have enough problems as it is.

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  105. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Kea,

    Well it is ironic that people who seem to think that embarrassment over a prank phone call can reasonably be expected to cause “great distress” are not also concerned for the welfare of two people who are accused of causing her death and have a mob of self-righteous hypocrites from around the world baying for their blood.

    Personally if I was tricked into thinking the Queen had called me I’d think it was pretty funny also. I try not to take myself too seriously that I can’t laugh at myself at all. If much of the world thought I was responsible for someone’s death that would be somewhat distressing.

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  106. Griff (6,965 comments) says:

    Actually Kea
    because you have informed me that due to your mental state there is a chance that causing you cognitive dissonance could result in your suicide. I shall hence forth simply state that due to you admitted mental state it would no longer be ethical of me to call you a climate denial nutbar. Elsewise It could be construed that I hastened your demise. :lol: :twisted:

    You do not have to worry about me laughter, especially at nutbars enhances your life expectancy. :grin:

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  107. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Scott1,

    I like the way you’ve framed it, but I disagree with your conclusion. The fact that the dividing line may be ill-defined in the general case and requires specific context to know which side of the line one is on, doesn’t change the fact that once the specific circumstances have been taken into account and enough facts are known then I think we can conclude whether or not moral culpability exists one way or another.

    Knowing the circumstances of this case I am as sure as I can be that the actions of the DJs can in no way be held responsible for this woman’s suicide. Their prank call cannot reasonably be regarded as harassment in such a manner as to be held responsible for this woman’s suicide.

    People are responsible for their actions, but that not only implies responsibility upon the DJs, it implies responsibility on the woman herself. She has to take responsibility for her own actions (insofar as they are not motivated by mental illness) and we can’t simply excuse her own actions by blaming someone else.

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  108. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    This post should be headed: The hilarious prank on the royals

    We could also have another post headed: A woman in England, we have never heard of, killed herself.

    I shall hence forth simply state that due to you admitted mental state it would no longer be ethical of me to call you a climate denial nutbar.

    Griff, friend. I am actually very worried about you too. It can not be easy believing the world will end horribly (any day now), due to man being evil. You doomsday cult people have a habit of suicide and I am very concerned. It is a bleak and fatalistic world that can not be penetrated with reason.

    Of course the worst thing that happen would be for someone to inject a bit of humor into your life. That is usually the trigger !

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  109. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    I think you missing the boat big time Weihana. You’re beginning the with an ‘ideal’ of the woman’s self responsibility. She well might have been understandably fragile in a number of ways, had cancer perhaps, having difficulty coping, a broken marriage any number of things. If therefore she was somewhat lesser than the ‘ideal’ person of responsibility are you arguing that is her own misfortune that she couldn’t readily cope with life anyway and that therefore mitigates what she may have felt ‘drove her over the edge.’ Let’s not also forget that the woman was apparently busy going about her very important job in what must be itself, a stressful situation. Do you expect that she should have been alert to an impending embarrassment, that she should have been of thicker skin, or had a sense of humour, put it into context for the benefit of the 2 djs?

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  110. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    or had a sense of humour, put it into context for the benefit of the 2 djs?

    Maybe she did all those things. She may have had a great sense of humor and thought the whole thing was big laugh.

    You have not provided evidence to link the two things. People like you make me sick to my stomach. Your using the unfortunate death of a woman as an excuse to attack and punish innocent people. What makes you tick, I shudder to think !

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  111. mikenmild (11,153 comments) says:

    I thought it was funny at the time. There is no way this kind of prank calling or hoaxing will ever be eliminated. Until the coroner’s enquiry in England is finished it would be unsafe to draw any conclusions about the reasons for the unfortunate woman’s death. It’s drawing a very long bow to suggest the hoaxers are responsible for the death. No reasonable person would foresee such a consequence.

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  112. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    Very funny Kea.
    The 2 accused in the current Wellington case will also use as mitigating circumstances that they ‘didn’t know’ that the deceased had a weak skull and bone constitution. I guess we are to presume that this woman should have toughened up, if for some reason she thought she would lose her job, or had embarrassed the hospital or your dear royals.

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  113. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Nostalgia-NZ (1,665) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 7:14 pm

    I think you missing the boat big time Weihana. You’re beginning the with an ‘ideal’ of the woman’s self responsibility. She well might have been understandably fragile in a number of ways, had cancer perhaps, having difficulty coping, a broken marriage any number of things.

    Which, if true, has nothing to do with the DJs.

    Do you expect that she should have been alert to an impending embarrassment, that she should have been of thicker skin, or had a sense of humour, put it into context for the benefit of the 2 djs?

    How about something short of killing herself for a start.

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  114. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Nostalgia-NZ (1,666) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 7:34 pm

    Very funny Kea.
    The 2 accused in the current Wellington case will also use as mitigating circumstances that they ‘didn’t know’ that the deceased had a weak skull and bone constitution.

    That’s got to be one of the dumbest analogies I’ve ever seen.

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  115. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    So they ‘innocently’ drew a long bow mikenmild. And the result if they hadn’t?

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  116. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    Both people are dead Weihana.

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  117. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Nostalgia-NZ,

    So?

    Are you going to seriously draw an equivalence between physical violence and impersonating the Queen? Are you going to draw an equivalence between getting the shit kicked out of you and being embarrassed? This is ridiculous.

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  118. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Nostalgia, we regularly see people make very harsh and unflattering comments here on KB. Often the person making those comments will refer to the targets mental fragility, and then go on to attack them and their ideas.

    Some of those people may indeed be fragile. What approach should we take to avoid them killing themselves ? ( I want a practical real world solution, thanks)

    Are you suggesting we should not say things, just in case someone is feeling fragile? No open debate and no humour, what a bleak miserable world that would be. You are suggesting that people have their lives & careers destroyed for playing a harmless prank. I just don’t get your thinking on this.

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  119. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    That’s got to be one of the dumbest analogies I’ve ever seen.

    Not now it’s not :)

    So they ‘innocently’ drew a long bow mikenmild

    A long bow ! Very dramatic. How about arming a nuclear bomb ? Get a grip.

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  120. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    It’s amazing how I can be criticized for expecting this woman to be responsible for her actions while the DJs are expected to be responsible for things another person does that can’t even be predicted.

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  121. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    The woman in England didn’t see her ‘work’ as a chat forum on KB obviously Kea, nor that she needed to be alert to incoming calls from down-under that would be seen to embarrass herself, your royals, or the place of her employment.

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  122. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    Weihana, 7.52. Because the djs didn’t know it’s fine, sure. The right to hoax and all that, fair game.

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  123. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Nostalgia-NZ,

    I see… free discussion is limited to Kiwiblog.

    Of course you’re making all sorts of assumptions about what she thought and why she apparently killed herself. But why do facts have to stand in the way of moral outrage?

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  124. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    Nostalgia-NZ (1,670) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 8:03 pm

    Weihana, 7.52. Because the djs didn’t know it’s fine, sure. The right to hoax and all that, fair game.

    At most it’s a breach of privacy as those recorded weren’t aware. But they are not responsible for a woman killing herself.

    Let’s say I go and rob the liquor store down the road. Outraged and upset, the owner goes home and murders his wife. I’m not responsible for those subsequent actions on the basis of ridiculous post-hoc reasoning as is being employed here. I may have done something wrong and should be held accountable but the craziness of the liquor store owner is not my fault.

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  125. joana (1,983 comments) says:

    The nurse’s brother has just confirmed what I wrote earlier, that the big issue would have been shame..Anyone who has ever lived in Asia would know this.

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  126. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    I think the word people need to keep in mind is “proportion”. The suicide was so outrageously out of proportion to the alleged offense that it is ridiculous to hold these DJs accountable for what could not have been predicted.

    If you think otherwise, I suggest you scour the internet and find just one post from the day before the suicide that predicted such a thing might happen. Bet you can’t because this took everyone by surprise.

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  127. Weihana (4,496 comments) says:

    joana (1,536) Says:
    December 10th, 2012 at 8:13 pm

    The nurse’s brother has just confirmed what I wrote earlier, that the big issue would have been shame..Anyone who has ever lived in Asia would know this.

    What a ridiculous culture. I wonder, is it the same culture where family members are murdered for shaming their family?

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  128. Nostalgia-NZ (4,981 comments) says:

    It must be something like that Weihana surely.
    I hope you don’t feel too hurt about it.

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  129. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Anyone who has ever lived in Asia would know this.

    Will someone please tell me what part of Asia, England is in ?

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  130. Random Punter (65 comments) says:

    Kea, every time you open your mouth, you diminish yourself further. I think I’ll just leave you to get on with it.

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  131. Rex Widerstrom (5,307 comments) says:

    The two now claim the “joke” was never meant to be on the person they called, but on themselves:

    Michael: “And I suppose, you know the joke was always on us, not anyone else. It wasn’t about trying to fool someone. I mean we just assumed that with the voices that we put on, you know, we were going to get told off and that was the gag – in us.”…

    Clare: But you are aware you were trying to get a medical condition and a medical condition on a Royal?

    Mel: “But we didn’t actually want that. We just wanted to be hung up on. We wanted to be hung up on with our silly voices and wanted a twenty second segment to air of us doing stupid voices.”

    As I surmised a day ago, it wasn’t meant to be about the person on the other end (as good prank calls are) but about them, as is everything they do. The Target carpet layer obviously isn’t the only tosser to appear in the media.

    That’s why they had no plan of action when they got put through, and no thought about the possible implications of their actions. Any why they weren’t funny.

    They really thought that putting on silly voices, sniggering and getting hung up on would count as entertainment? To a couple of ten year olds, perhaps…

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  132. RightNow (6,773 comments) says:

    10-17 year olds mostly Rex:

    In demographics: 2DAY won the 10-17 demo with a share of 32.2

    http://www.radioinfo.com.au/news/1092

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  133. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Random Munter, was my question a bit hard for you ?

    We are still waiting for you to provide some evidence linking the humorous prank with this suicide…

    The personal attacks are fun, but you need to give us a little bit more to keep it interesting :)

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  134. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Rex, considering you call a fun night sitting around talking about wine (booze), I suggest you are not qualified to comment on what is amusing to others.

    Just for the record, I mostly listen to radio commie or talk back and I do not generally find those pranks amusing. The difference between me and the self righteous posers infesting this thread, is that I do want to force my view onto others.

    Another difference is that I do not have the level of malice in me that makes me want to punish people for having fun.

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  135. Rex Widerstrom (5,307 comments) says:

    Kea, when have I ever said I’d consider a whole night sitting round talking about wine to be “fun”?

    I enjoy a tipple but I find wine snobs an absolute bore. If I ever did imply that’d be fun, it was probably after a night sitting round drinking wine and not talking about it!

    I don’t want to force my view on others either. I’m not calling for some regulator to step in and tell 2day what they can and cannot broadcast. But they deserve to hear what the wider audience, and potential audience, thinks of their employees. Then they can make a decision whether or not to continue their employment, or to hire people more capable of hosting a show.

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  136. big bruv (13,449 comments) says:

    “Will someone please tell me what part of Asia, England is in ?”

    Yes, Birmingham.

    :)

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  137. Scott (1,723 comments) says:

    I agree 100% with DPF.

    I would add-can’t the media leave the royal family alone? Are we run by children now? Juvenile prank that went badly wrong. One feels very sorry for the woman who died and her family. Remember they come from a shame based culture and what the DJ’s did shamed her in front of all the world.

    Seeing what the media did to Diana I think they should grow up and leave the royal family alone.

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