General Debate 2 January 2013

January 2nd, 2013 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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133 Responses to “General Debate 2 January 2013”

  1. Keeping Stock (10,120 comments) says:

    First?

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  2. Right of way is Way of Right (1,129 comments) says:

    Yes, you are.

    (Basta**d!)

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  3. Keeping Stock (10,120 comments) says:

    You snooze; you lose :P

    Had to be up early this morning anyway; the final of the World Darts Championship is on at 9am, and it’ll be brilliant. If ever a sport was made for TV, this is it.

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  4. wreck1080 (3,735 comments) says:

    Why don’t they name the 2nd of Jan holiday after something significant? Day after New years day holiday sounds strange.

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  5. Keeping Stock (10,120 comments) says:

    Call it whatever you like Wreck; just the fact that it’s a day off is good enough for me. It’s going to be a struggle dragging my sorry butt into work tomorrow…

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  6. calendar girl (1,177 comments) says:

    Don’t even contemplate it, Wreck. It will only lead retailers into attacking us with Xxxxx Day Sales.

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  7. Left Right and Centre (2,825 comments) says:

    Kiwi culture: Things that are uniquely NZ

    As a distraction today I thought Kiwibloggers might like to share their collective wisdom to come up with a few cultural items or customs etc that are uniquely kiwi.

    An example for me would be hokey pokey ice cream. Around the world the most popular flavours are chocolate, vanilla and strawberry *except* for NZ where hokey pokey regulary comes in second…..

    Your turn…

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  8. Manolo (13,401 comments) says:

    Once the state is hooked on the spending vice, it’s difficult, almost impossible, to leave it:
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2013/jan/1/deficit-fiscal-cliff-bill-actually-spends-330-bill/

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  9. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    The Darts Championship can be viewed here:

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  10. mikenmild (10,766 comments) says:

    Thanks Rodders. Perhaps the 2nd of January could be called ‘Kiwi Kulcha Day’. Communities could organise suitable commemorations in their local pubs, not just darts and binge drinking, but also drunken group sing-a-longs, marathon pokie machine sessions, non-stop re-screenings of the 1987 and 2001 RWC finals and special kiddies events in the car parks.

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  11. Left Right and Centre (2,825 comments) says:

    Split Enz- History Never Repeats was the 12th ever music video played on MTV.

    How cool is **that**??

    And they got their music played at least six times that day…. nice.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_music_videos_aired_on_MTV

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  12. Fletch (6,032 comments) says:

    MONEY – A Chart Of (almost) All Of It, Where It Is, and What It Can Do

    If you’ve ever been curious about where all the money in the world is well, someone has made a HUGE chart showing where all the money is and what it can do (mostly all cited).

    Forbes explains –

    Randall Munroe, the XKCD.com physicist cartoonist turned essayist & artist does some amazing work.  His cartoons started out with stick figures telling science jokes, but now he works large – physically and in concept. One of his cartoons scrolls so much that it would take 46 feet of paper to print it out.

    He doesn’t just do science now, and his epic chart: “Money: A chart of (almost) all of it, where it is, can what it can do” is a true gem.

    If you have a big enough printer and need wallpaper, you find the whole enchilada here. It comes up in a window that lets you zoom in to the details, and can fill up much of your holiday web time.

    You can find the actual scrollable chart LINK

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  13. Mary Rose (393 comments) says:

    >As a distraction today I thought Kiwibloggers might like to share their collective wisdom to come up with a few cultural items or customs etc that are uniquely kiwi.

    chocolate fish

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  14. Komata (1,114 comments) says:

    Re: ‘As a distraction today I thought Kiwibloggers might like to share their collective wisdom to come up with a few cultural items or customs etc that are uniquely kiwi’.

    Jandals’ (as opposed to ‘Thongs’)

    The ‘Buzzy Bee’

    Paua Fritters

    Hokey Pokey itself – the rectangular blocks. Sticky as anything but oh so delicious. (AFAIK it isn’t made anywhere else)

    Pavlova (now THAT will get the Oz’s going)

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  15. Fletch (6,032 comments) says:

    ps, on my money post above, it should say “money in America” not, the World.

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  16. Twinkletoes (53 comments) says:

    Komata – Jandals was how we referred to them in U.K., the Med and Singapore. Hokey Pokey was known as “Yellow Man” and was sold at all the fairs during my childhood in Ulster. First mentioned in “The Oul Lammas Fair” an Ulster folk song

    At the Oul Lammas fair,boys
    Were you ever there?
    Were you ever at the fair in Ballycastle oh.
    Did you treat your Mary Anne
    To dulce and yellowman
    At the Oul Lammas fair at Ballycastle oh.

    We also used to make blocks of it at home, when allowed! That particular fair was focused on the selling and buying of donkeys but like all fairs, anywhere in Ireland, the whole world and his master turned up.

    P.S.. You are lucky that I only wrote the song, my singing is deplorable! Still ,small world, isn’t it?

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  17. Reid (15,981 comments) says:

    Another series of useful observations from Paul Roberts.

    Many on the left-wing are immune to evidence that is contrary to the official 9/11 story, because for them 9/11 is refreshing blowback from the oppressed. That the oppressed struck back is more important to the left-wing than the facts.

    The right-wing can’t let go of the fantasy either. America in all its purity and wonderfulness was attacked because evil Muslims cannot stand our goodness. “They hate us for our freedom and democracy.” The right-wing vision of a great and good America wronged is essential to the right-wing’s sustaining ideology, an ideology that is prepared to commit violence in order to prove its righteousness….

    …Consider the Sandy Hook school shooting. This shooting serves as an excuse for “progressives” to express their hatred of guns and the NRA and to advance their gun control agenda. Few if any of those hyperventilating over the tragedy know any of the parents of the murdered children. They have shown no similar response to the US government’s murder of countless thousands of Muslim children. The Clinton regime alone killed 500,000 Iraqi children with illegal sanctions, and Clinton’s immoral secretary of state, a feminist hero, said that she thought the sanctions were worth the cost of one half million dead Iraqi children.

    Suddenly, 20 US children become of massive importance to “progressives.” Why? Because the deaths foster their agenda–gun control in the US…

    …The Colorado movie theater shooting has its own unresolved discrepancies…

    …A shooting incident occurs. The government puts out a story. Agendas form and take the place of the story. Unresolved issues disappear in heated dispute over agendas. Gun control advocates blame guns, and Second Amendment defenders blame other factors.

    When the media permit agenda to take precedence over news, people lose confidence in the media and distrust spreads deeper into society. If the media and the government are opposed to conspiracy theories, they should not foster the theories by mishandling the news.

    Neither the right-wing nor the left-wing has an interest in getting to the bottom of things. The right-wing is aligned with the police state in order to make us safe from “terrorism”– Muslim terrorism, not the terrorism of the unaccountable police state.

    The American left is so feeble that it essentially doesn’t exist. Its issues are gun control, homosexual marriage, abortion, and taxing “the rich.” Such misfocus cannot slow the onrushing militarized police state. American liberals have such an abiding faith in government that they are incapable of believing that beloved government would be culpable in crimes–unless, of course, it was Ronald Reagan’s government.

    As tyranny envelops the land, the main goal of the “left-wing” is to disarm the population.

    The American “left” is the enabler of the police state, and the American “right” is its progenitor.

    Americans began their descent into deception and tyranny in the final years of the 20th century with the Clinton regime’s aggression against Serbia and murderous sanctions on Iraq. These war crimes were portrayed by the US media and foreign policy community as great achievements of Western democracy and humanitarianism.

    In the first decade of the 21st century Americans lost their constitutional protections and had their pocketbooks opened to indefinite wars…

    And all because people can’t see past their stupid hallucination that left-right politics doesn’t exist, it’s not left and right, it’s us against them. And them is winning. People seem to imagine 2013 will be a good year. Gerald Celentes predicts WWIII, currency wars, unemployment, depression. He also says he’s a political atheist, so he looks at things the way they are, not as how he would like to see them.

    The evidence is all around you, but you’ll never see it unless and until you see things as they are, not as how you would like to see them. Some people don’t do that because they think it’s “being negative” which is so mind-bogglingly stupid it’s a wonder such people can even go to the toilet by themselves. If a train is coming towards you, you can either chose to be realistic and take action, or you can be “positive” and pretend it’s not coming towards you. The latter of which is precisely the same fallacy people commit when they refuse to recognise politics is not about us and them, rather it’s about left vs right.

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  18. Peter (1,578 comments) says:

    Or you’ve simply chosen to believe someones guesses over someone else’s guesses. May as well toss a coin.
    In any case, your man Celentes has a less than stellar track record: http://www.edrants.com/gerald-celente-futurist-fraud/

    I’d back the coin….

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  19. Dean Papa (743 comments) says:

    Darts Championship update:

    Convicted sex offender Phil “The Philth” Taylor wins World Championship, defeating Michael “Mighty Mike” van Gerwen 7-4 in final. Coverage to be posted as soon as it is up on youtube.

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  20. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Well my life is now complete- just heard via the radio that the Kauri has been voted New Zealands plant of the year. Awesome.
    Congratulations, well done, its been along time coming

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  21. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    by Mike B | 31 Dec 12, 2:18pm

    As far as Dot com is concerned it would be good if you could do a proper story on patents and copyright

    Looking at intellectual property, such as patents and copyright, we see they are also manipulated by greed and stifling innovation and productivity

    Some good reading:

    Boldrin & Levine: Against Intellectual Monopoly, Here is a very small piece from the free book off the internet

    The wasteful effort to suppress competition and obtain special privileges is referred to by economists as rent-seeking behaviour. History and common sense show it to be a poisoned fruit of legal monopoly.

    In most histories, James Watt is a heroic inventor, responsible for the beginning of the industrial revolution. The facts suggest an alternative interpretation. Watt is one of many clever inventors working to improve steam power in the second half of the eighteenth century. After getting one step ahead of the pack, he remained ahead not by superior innovation, but by superior exploitation of the legal system. The fact that his business partner was a wealthy man with strong connections in Parliament, was not a minor help.
    Was Watt’s patent a crucial incentive needed to trigger his inventive genius, as the traditional history suggests? Or did his use of the legal system to inhibit competition set back the industrial revolution by a decade or two? More broadly, are the two essential components of our current system of intellectual property – patents and copyrights – with all of their many faults, a necessary evil we must put up with to enjoy the fruits of invention and creativity? Or are they just unnecessary evils, the relics of an earlier time when governments routinely granted monopolies to favoured courtiers? That is the question we seek to answer.

    AND another very small piece from the free book off the internet

    Patents and Copyrights: Do The Benefits Exceed The Costs? – Journal of Libertarian Studies – Volume 15, no. 4 (Fall 2001), pp. 79–105 2001 Ludwig von Mises Institute

    What implications do patents have for efficiency in the allocation of resources?
    Why would society want to award privileges of this sort to some of its members?
    How does society benefit from the existence of patents?
    Why should society grant special protection over the production and sale of certain products beyond what is implied in the protection of trademarks?

    AND, another free book off the internet

    Tom G. Palmer – Are Patents & Copyrights Morally Justified? The Philosophy Of Property Rights & Ideal Objects.

    by Mike B | 31 Dec 12, 2:23pm

    The Intellectual property myth and the lack of productivity

    In the twentieth century new products were coming out all the time. Washing machines, TV’s, vacuum cleaners, dishwashers, telephones, radios, jet engines and on and on.
    Just imagine had it not been like that, but just like things are today. What if they had only invented say, the Hoover vacuum cleaner. Every year the vacuum cleaner comes out with fancy new features. Other companies are struggling to get a share of this vacuum cleaner market. People cue up all night to be first to get their hands on the latest new release of the Hoover vacuum cleaner. Hoover are making billions and everyone hails them as the greatest. Just imagine if the twentieth century had been as daft as that, but that is exactly what we have today with Apple and there is a reason for this. A reason why we don’t invent things anymore. As I will explain later.

    James Watt invented the steam engine, which started the industrial revolution, that led to a big improvement in many peoples lives. James Watt and the capitalists who invested their capital in new factories and the steam engine were handsomely rewarded. They had earned and deserved that reward (apart from playing the legal sytem)

    Now consider that reward system with the reward system used today.

    A CEO who has a five year university degree, does not invent anything, nor owns a company, and contributes nothing to improving society, yet gets paid hundreds of times the average wage and gets to control large corporations without owning them. Why? because society says their intellectual property, which is their claimed knowledge and skill is extremely valuable.

    Just think how that would have worked in James Watt’s time. A CEO would have received tens, if not hundreds, of times the income of James Watt and the capitalists who built the factories. I can only conclude that had they tried that trick back then they would have been hung, drawn and quartered. My god, how did we let this happen?

    We now live in a society in which ones own intellectual property is the thing to strive for. Even if this intellectual property is useless or even destructive to the society we live in. We have been invaded by, and taken over by business and finance academia. Like a cancerous monster engulfing and destroying us. That has to change if we want a return to a decent and productive society.

    by Ivan | 31 Dec 12, 4:11pm

    Dead right. What you have said is the best thing I have ever read on here, and we as a Society should strive to make the changes you advocate.

    http://www.interest.co.nz/opinion/62608/mondays-top-10-nz-mint-crystal-ball-olly-newland-lockwood-smith-pacific-fibre-rate-cut

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  22. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    PEB. Only any good to those that live North of Waihi. Only any good for timber.
    Lives forever, and you ain’t allowed to cut them down. (even if ya did plant them). Bloody ornament.

    Worse our stupid council Green Park nutters planted them on traffic roundabouts. You know, the Small sort about 4 meters across.
    Given that they don’t like being walked around as they grow bigger because of the root system and that a decent stump can be 3 mtrs across they grow to be a pest. Somewhat like that other blasted weed the pohutukawa. Another useless tree and bothersome apart from feeding Tui’s. Try even cutting a limb off and the weirdo’s turn up from every corner of the earth.

    Still, big Kauri are great in the bush where they belong.

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  23. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    Dean – I guess you are familiar with http://www.youtube.com/user/DartLoupeTV

    Oh, for the good old days when they televised the matches from an old english pub.

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  24. krazykiwi (9,189 comments) says:

    Rodder 8:55am – Thanks. One of my favs… and I do like Mel & Gifff’s comedy (still!)

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  25. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    Cheers kk. I remember watching darts matches on the telly in the 80′s and the players really did look like Dai Fatbelly Gutbucket and Tommy Evenfatterbelly Belcher :)

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  26. trout (904 comments) says:

    re kiwiana – the thermette – great memories of making up a brew on a road trip. Can still smell the burning manuka chips, Still have, and use, one – the all copper Rolls Royce model.

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  27. Redbaiter (7,645 comments) says:

    Where Milky and his commie mates will take us-

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2255693/Last-pictures-life-iron-curtain-collapse-USSR.html

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  28. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    A rift in the Republican majority in the US House of Representatives appears to have derailed attempts by Congress to avoid the sweeping tax increases and spending cuts known as the fiscal cliff.

    Hours after the midnight New Year deadline the Senators voted overwhelming to back a deal struck with the White House that would have seen taxes increase on the wealthiest Americans and extended federal unemployment benefits for two million Americans.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/world-business/republican-rift-threatens-to-sink-fiscal-cliff-deal-20130102-2c4qp.html#ixzz2Gm8jozMN

    So its not going to fly.

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  29. Rex Widerstrom (5,278 comments) says:

    wreck1080 asks:

    Why don’t they name the 2nd of Jan holiday after something significant?

    I suggest “Another reason we’re better than Australia day”.

    Didn’t realise it till this year, when I had responsibility for approving people’s leave, but Australia doesn’t have a holiday on January 2. I had been fooled in the past by the fact that when it fell on a Saturday or Sunday they got the Monday off, but this year, unless they’ve taken annual leave, people are back to work today.

    [Because I'd made an error I let the people I'd misinformed have today off without reducing their leave entitlement, because I'm good like that :-) ]

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  30. James Stephenson (2,040 comments) says:

    Hokey Pokey itself – the rectangular blocks. Sticky as anything but oh so delicious. (AFAIK it isn’t made anywhere else)

    Sorry, google “cinder toffee” (what we call it oop North) or “honeycomb toffee” which is the yank terminology, even the Japs have a version. You might have a claim to putting small bits in ice cream though.

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  31. slijmbal (1,216 comments) says:

    “Komata – Jandals was how we referred to them in U.K”

    Nope – flip flops in the UK

    never heard of jandals until I came to NZ

    I have had Hokey Pokey outside of NZ – but it’s very rare – had it once in the US and once in the UK- names like toffee ice cream. There was briefly a type of ice cream made with bits of crunchie bar in the UK that was a bit similar

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  32. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    Prison labor booms in US as low-cost inmates bring billions

    Apparently this is the key to private prisons……

    robinhoodd173 4 days ago

    What a lot of people don’t know is at least 20% of those in prison did nothing wrong to get there. They were in the area and were grabbed by association or false charges were put on them. It’s easier to prove guilt than it is innocence. You have to show proof of innocence but no real proof of guilt really needs to be shown. The government will take people and have them testify against you to get you in prison because they have a quota. Even the federal judge has a quota.

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  33. Komata (1,114 comments) says:

    Jandals and Hokey Pokey – the things we learn.

    However, I’d still claim ‘Jandals’ as a NZ icon, as they were created by Yock’s (although some say Skellerup’s) in Auckland during the 50′s and gained their name by combining JApanese sanDALS to produce JANDALS. In NZ at the time, the idea of using soles cut out of rubber to make a very low-cost foot wear (cheaper than Roman Sandles BTW) was revolutionary, and they sold well.

    Hokey Pokey: Under that specific name, IMHO, it’s Uniquely Kiwi, while the idea of adding it to icecream was a definite world first.

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  34. axeman (251 comments) says:

    Dangerous Global warming
    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ca1_1356981200

    Wow that December sure was WARM
    http://iceagenow.info/2012/12/150-inches-381-cm-snow-december/

    http://sphotos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/531989_10151357967017660_307219637_n.jpg

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  35. Reid (15,981 comments) says:

    Good if brief rundown on a few facts behind the Bushmaster, the rifle used in various shooting incidents in the US:

    http://copycateffect.blogspot.co.nz/2012/12/bushmaster.html

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  36. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    Gun confiscation in the US was treated as a conspiracy theory.

    One name: Diane Feinstein

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  37. Rich Prick (1,557 comments) says:

    Good grief! Bert Potter and Ben Hanna were two of the “notable” New Zealanders to pass away this year, according to One News. Notable? Perhaps, but they were included with great New Zealanders, what was TVNZ thinking putting a kiddie fiddler and a Wellington vagrant and general pest, together with truly great people? Jesus wept.

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  38. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    @richprick

    Guess we infatuated with any kind of celebrity. And lets face it NZ television and film making is akin to being incestuous. Different shows with same faces. I surmise a reason for the success of Boy the movie was the fresh talent.

    I also surmise Taika Waititi is going to have a problem fobbing off all the old tv hacks in future projects. haha.

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  39. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    ‘Good if brief rundown on a few facts behind the Bushmaster, the rifle used in various shooting incidents in the US:’

    Anothe common thread is all shooters are full of meds. A real culprit in shootings aer the pharmaceuticals

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  40. krazykiwi (9,189 comments) says:

    From stuff -

    A 9-month-old Rotorua baby is in a serious condition at Starship Hospital after suffering head injuries. Child Youth and Family are investigating how the child suffered serious injuries, including head injuries, police say.

    Perhaps CYF could step aside while the police investigate
    (a) the incident, and;
    (b) CYF involvement with the family prior to the incident

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  41. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    An Australian tour guide was showing a group of American tourists the Top End. On their way to Kakadu he was describing the abilities of the Australian Aborigine to track man or beast over land, through the air, under the sea. The Americans were incredulous.

    Then later in the day, the tour rounded a bend on the highway and discovered, lying in the middle of the road, an Aborigine. He had one ear pressed to the white line whilst his left leg was held high in the air. The tour stopped and the guide and the tourists gathered around the prostrate Aborigine.

    “Jacky,” said the tour guide, “what are you tracking and what are you listening for?”

    The aborigine replied, “Down the road about 25 miles is a 1971 Valiant ute. It’s red. The left front tyre is bald. The front end is out of whack and it has dents in every panel. There are 9 fellows in the back, all drinking warm sherry. There are 3 kangaroos on the roof rack and 6 dogs on the front seat.”

    The American tourists moved forward, astounded by this precise and detailed knowledge.

    “Goddammit man, how do you know all that?” asked one.

    The Aborigine replied, ”I fell out of the bloody thing about half an hour ago.”

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  42. Fletch (6,032 comments) says:

    Just starting to watch this film now: AGENDA: Grinding America Down (whole movie).

    http://vimeo.com/52009124

    Very interesting so far.
    A guy attended a Communist meeting at the University of California for an older friend of his and taped their agenda.
    It’s all there: supporting feminism, homosexuality (to destroy the family), the Green movement (in order to dissuade new business from starting). He says they weren’t what he expected – not young college protestors, but old guys in their 50s and 60s with suits and suitcases.

    Still watching..
    See it now while it’s free (for the moment) up on Vimeo.

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  43. Fletch (6,032 comments) says:

    ps, the meeting was in 1992.

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  44. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    @Fletch

    Don’t forget UN agenda 21. That’s whee all the info on your vid comes from.

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  45. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    A guy attended a Communist meeting at the University of California for an older friend of his and taped their agenda.
    It’s all there: supporting feminism, homosexuality (to destroy the family), the Green movement (in order to dissuade new business from starting)

    Feminists have done the most to undermine our society socially. The Greens are working on the economy. Bitter man hating harpies have been the greatest promoters of socialism in NZ. This is something even Redbaiter overlooks. They are also the ones behind gay movement. Gays themselves are not that worried about marriage.

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  46. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    A conversation on Monday 7 January 2013 at several work places about the country , well I hope they work.:

    Q What did you get up to over the break mate? a bit of beach, a bit of sun, bit of work around the house, a relax with the family?

    A (Nostalgia, Judith et al) Well no , actually I made 83,000 comments on a blog about David Bain and how I believe my comments will alter the way that that Judith Collins and her collegues will consider payment to David Bain. I believe my comments between 60,000 and 83,000 brought total focus to matter and the government will no option but to shell out.

    Q Did you actually attend the crime scene, the Post mortems or either of the trials, because he was found guilty at one and not guilty at the second you know?

    A I didn’t need to do any of that, I feel it in my water, , I know these things because I’ve read the notes mate, I have no legal or investigative background but I know what happened better than anyone don’t you worry.

    Q Well its sounds like you had a pretty “interesting break” my walking the Milford Track with 12 Penthouse Pets on my own just pales in insignifigance with what you’ve achieved, no ones going to give a fuck about my trip with the tale you’ve got to tell, good on you.

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  47. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Fletch, I do not like the video much. God is not THE source of morality. If you take moral guidance from the bible, you are on thin ice indeed.

    ( Unless you really think rape victims should be forced to marry their attackers, un virginal brides stoned to death on their fathers door step, people who work on Sunday killed, naughty kids killed….)

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  48. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    They’ll spend the rest of summer acquiring a Vitamin D deficiency & banging on about crap. Reminds me very much of the hysteria over the Arthur Alan Thomas case……I know the poor bugger didn’t do it but I quite often found myself wishing that he’d been hanged, if only to break the tedium.

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  49. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Kea

    Fletch & the Fundies believe in traditional Biblical Marriage:

    One man and his sister,
    One man and his dead brother’s wife,
    One man and one woman and her servants,
    One man and his rape victim,
    One man and many women,
    One man and 700 women and 300 concubines,
    One man and one woman and her slaves,
    One soldier and his virgin prisoners,

    Just not one man and one man. That would be immoral.

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  50. Steve (North Shore) (4,500 comments) says:

    PEB @ 8.18.

    All I can do is smile. That shit never happened. Love it :)

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  51. Steve (North Shore) (4,500 comments) says:

    Still trapped on the Milford track?

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  52. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    No, painting, putting up spouting, garage sale, trying to sell house and moving back to Auckland, nearly as good but not quite.

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  53. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    nasska, yes we are lucky they wrote this all down for us. Otherwise we would think infanticide, genocide, gang rape, torture and murder, were all worse than a couple of poofters shacking up together. ;)

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  54. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    Don’t forget that if Johnboy was here, he might add “One man and his flock.”

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  55. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    I must say a quick perusal of that thread shows there are some nasty bastards out there, ones I wouldn’t want to play golf with, I’d term them club throwers, I believe there was even a suggestion of legal action between two of them.

    The host must be laughing his cock off, all he has to do is put up a Bain post every two days and he’ll take over from The Daily Post

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  56. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    How could we do without them Kea? So often we neglect to express our gratitude for their selfless efforts to keep us up to speed on what is good, Holy & righteous.

    We could sin & not even know it,,,,,,what would be the fun in that? :)

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  57. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    nasska, do you know that “laying with man as with women” is an abomination but so is eating shellfish and lobster ?

    http://www.godhatesshrimp.com/

    Let us pray…..:)

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  58. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    It will certainly prove to be peachy for our host’s traffic ratings Paul. It may also set Web records for the greatest number of electrons ever disturbed for the miniscule amount of sense made. :)

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  59. Fletch (6,032 comments) says:

    Am still watching it. He interviews a lot of writers including Trevor Loudon from NZ.
    I’ll let you know what I think as I watch more.

    Kea, if God is not the source of morality, then we humans simply make it for ourselves and it changes through the years according to public whim. Do you believe the truth is the Truth and always stays the truth, or do you believe it is fluid and changes (together with morality) through the years?

    I’ve used this example before, but what if Hitler had won the war and imposed his own Aryan brand of morality on the whole world? That blacks and Jews should be killed and only blonde, blue-eyed children left to survive etc? And that initially the world protested, but those who disagreed were killed or jailed and that eventually the whole world subscribed to his brand of morality. Would you say this was Moral (with a capital M)?

    I believe that the Truth is the Truth – and that the truth cannot change. How can it?

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  60. Steve (North Shore) (4,500 comments) says:


    those electrons naaska?

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  61. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Fletch, check out my link for more moral guidance. It is important you know this stuff.

    It is listed under abominations, same as sodomy.

    Leviticus 11:9-12 says:
    9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat.
    10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:
    11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination.
    12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.

    Deuteronomy 14:9-10 says:
    9 These ye shall eat of all that are in the waters: all that have fins and scales shall ye eat:
    10 And whatsoever hath not fins and scales ye may not eat; it is unclean unto you.

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  62. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Kea

    Leviticus is a rich lode to mine if you’re after a load of old cobblers. I enjoy seeing those who have been blessed with the Holy Spirit writhe like worms on a hook arguing that although no parts of the Good Book can be discounted as historical crap that it is not relevant when you quote a passage or two to them.

    But od loves them. :)

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  63. chiz (1,119 comments) says:

    Good thing the Mayan Doomsday didn’t happened, otherwise it would have affected clinical drug trials:

    Here, we discuss how the outcomes of clinical trials may be affected by the extinction of all mankind and recommend appropriate changes to their conduct. In addition, we use computer modelling to show the effect of the apocalypse on a sample clinical trial.

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  64. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Steve

    Those are the ones…. they’ve been fair hopping for a week or two!

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  65. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    nasska, it is clear that those who have eaten Crayfish/Paua/Mussels, may as well have rented their arse out in the back of some sleazy gay bar. They shall not enter heaven.

    Why do we allow Crayfish and Mussel eaters to marry. The sick perverts !

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  66. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    ‘shellfish and lobster ?’

    Probably because they didn’t exist in Israel at the time

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  67. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Fletch, to give me some sort of context, which of the hundreds of Gods are you talking about ? My Hindu mate wants to know too….

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  68. Steve (North Shore) (4,500 comments) says:

    Keas having a fetish about budgies would be strange. Pick on seafood and not birds? balance please

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  69. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    hinamanu, you depraved sinner, read this before you split hell wide open !

    http://www.godhatesshrimp.com/

    Your probably eating Pipis and taking it up the bum even as we speak ;)

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  70. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Kea

    And they probably wear raiment of cotton/polyester while they’re tucking into scallops mornay. :)

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  71. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    “But all in the seas or in the rivers that do not have fins and scales, all that move in the water or any living thing which is in the water, they are an abomination to you.” (Leviticus 11:10)

    “They (shellfish) shall be an abomination to you; you shall not eat their flesh, but you shall regard their carcasses as an abomination.” (Leviticus 11:11)

    “If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them.” (Leviticus 20:13)

    “You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination.” (Leviticus 18:22)

    I guess all you progressive communists are busy eating mussels and undermining civilisation. I will not sit by and watch these eaters of shellfish marry.

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  72. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    nasska, I want to start up a gay bar, called Chairman Mao, with an extensive shellfish & pork menu. I think think there is money to be made in that idea. It will only open on Sundays. I will save a table for Redbaiter :)

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  73. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Kea

    You’re on to it…..scrape away that brusque exterior & under all the obscenities & abuse will lie a gentler, gayer more reasonable Reddy.

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  74. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    nasska – have look at this :)

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  75. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Rodders

    Ye Gods! I always wondered what he looked like in real life. :)

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  76. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Rodders, I agree with the gentlemans views on communism.

    I have never met a communist from a communist country, in spite of dating an East German, Chinese and recently a real “card carrying” party member of a communist state. Not one of them believed in communism. Same deal in the former commie countries I have visited.

    The biggest collection of commies I have met have been white liberals here in NZ.

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  77. Fletch (6,032 comments) says:

    Kea, I’m afraid you don’t understand.
    Some of these laws are specifically for the Israelites for a specific time and some of these laws are for all time.

    Look to the New Testament. Jesus was asked about eating clean or unclean food and He said –

     After He called the crowd to Him again, He began saying to them, “Listen to Me, all of you, and understand: there is nothing outside the man which can defile him if it goes into him; but the things which proceed out of the man are what defile the man. [“If anyone has ears to hear, let him hear.”]

        17When he had left the crowd and entered the house, His disciples questioned Him about the parable. And He said to them, “Are you so lacking in understanding also? Do you not understand that whatever goes into the man from outside cannot defile him, because it does not go into his heart, but into his stomach, and is eliminated?” (Thus He declared all foods clean.) And He was saying, “That which proceeds out of the man, that is what defiles the man. “For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed the evil thoughts, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries, deeds of coveting and wickedness, as well as deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride and foolishness. “All these evil things proceed from within and defile the man.”

    Paul, in Romans was also asked about eating food that was unclean. he said –

    Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this—not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother’s way. I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean

    However, as regards homosexuality, both the OT and the NT condemn it. Romans again –

       For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.

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  78. bhudson (4,734 comments) says:

    I believe there was even a suggestion of legal action between two of them.

    They can be hard to follow, but I think the reference to legal action was a result of one naming the other as a convicted murderer. What isn’t clear is whether the legal action would be for defamation or some other reason.

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  79. Azeraph (603 comments) says:

    Rodders (1,544) Says:
    January 2nd, 2013 at 9:25 pm

    Didn’t they have a government health system before Nixon?

    That guy in that vid reminds me of my gay uncle.

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  80. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    nasska, I guess, to be fair, I should show a clip of mikenmild:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpZW4CkabNQ

    Warning: Contains socialists.

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  81. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    Kea – that guy reminds me a bit of when Keanu Reeves tries to do a dramatic role. I was waiting for him to say “there’s a bomb on the bus!”

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  82. Fletch (6,032 comments) says:

    I think you’ll find violent Tea Party members a very, very rare thing, as opposed to the violent and crime-ridden Occupy crowd.
    A list of their crimes would fill several pages, not to mention the Occupy bomb making couple that were just arrested today.

    The privileged daughter of a prominent city doctor, and her boyfriend — a Harvard grad and Occupy Wall Street activist — have been busted for allegedly having a cache of weapons and a bombmaking explosive in their Greenwich Village apartment.

    Morgan Gliedman — who is nine-months pregnant — and her baby daddy, Aaron Greene, 31, also had instructions on making bombs, including a stack of papers with a cover sheet titled, “The Terrorist Encyclopedia,’’ sources told The Post yesterday.

    People who know Greene say his political views are “extreme,” the sources said.

    Cops found the stash in the couple’s West Ninth Street home Saturday when they went there to look for Gliedman, 27, who was wanted for alleged credit-card theft.

    A detective discovered a plastic container with seven grams of a white chemical powder called HMTD, which is so powerful, cops evacuated several nearby buildings.

    Police also found a flare launcher, which is a commercial replica of a grenade launcher; a modified 12 gauge Mossberg 500 shotgun; ammo; and nine high-capacity rifle magazines, the sources said.

    Cops also allegedly uncovered papers about creating homemade booby traps, improvised submachine guns, and various handwritten notebooks containing chemical formulas.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/bombmaking_in_the_village_LoRDqNzP02SDZyfC1pLVXN

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  83. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Fletch, thanks for that. I guess on that basis we can throw out the ten commandments and the creation yarn.

    The new testament brought in the concept of eternal torture for finite sin. Because god loves us.

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  84. chiz (1,119 comments) says:

    Fletch – Romans is a reference to a pagan festival that was well known to romans at the time but which is unknown to most modern readers. Some of those other references to homosexual behaviour don’t quite mean what you think either. On the other hand, using the coded language of the time, Jesus at one point claims that gay people are born that way (“some people are made eunuchs and some are born eunuchs”).

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  85. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Kea

    Nice well balanced young citizen that one. :)

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  86. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    that guy reminds me a bit of when Keanu Reeves tries to do a dramatic role.

    Good call. I wish I could do my job as badly as Reeves and still get paid millions :)

    mikenmild clearly had some bad weed in that clip, but still managed to explain the essential message of the left.

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  87. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    Here’s one for Johnboy (god rest his soul)

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  88. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    @kea

    It is not what goes into a man’s mouth that defiles him; … What proceeds from the man himself, from his heart, would defile him. Matthew 15:11

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  89. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    The Greens New Party Drink.

    http://screencast.com/t/5T7awpW9SJD

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  90. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    And here is the way to cure the hangover.

    Much nicer.

    http://screencast.com/t/8Tlxu0wdwlX

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  91. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Here’s one for Johnboy (god rest his soul)

    That clip shows the husband of Johnboy’s lover, after he caught them.

    Johnboy is recovering well and should be ok again by next tupping season.

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  92. Rodders (1,790 comments) says:

    Kea :)

    I was wondering what Johnboy does if he can’t get to sleep – count women?

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  93. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    Hi Naaska, breezy down your way this evening?

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  94. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Bain and god bothering oh dear – the sex with a goat thing has reared its ugly head again and again I hope it was a nanny otherwise that would be simply disgusting.
    Mind you that ‘Judith” over there who would appear to be Bains’s girlfriend or cell mate makes Lucia look all well balance and normal. But I suppose when you are immersed in total insanity the deranged just become quirky and quaint

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  95. Kea (11,878 comments) says:

    Johnboy is a romantic and sent me this.

    Warning: Contains love scenes.

    Ram-cam set to become ewe-tube sensation

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  96. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    Rodders

    Only about eight months ago we were loading out & one of the wethers somehow turned on the ramp & decided that the quickest way back to the paddock was through me. The bugger hit me at chest height & broke a couple of my ribs.

    Instead of getting a ride to the works on the big truck he eventually made it into the home freezer. A nice bit of lamb he was too. :)

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  97. nasska (10,696 comments) says:

    V2

    She’s pumping through at the moment.

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  98. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    What happened to Santa?

    http://screencast.com/t/CnwIdYQ2bm6

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  99. big bruv (13,331 comments) says:

    Things are going well for the Brendan McCullum let NZ team.

    NZ batting first and we are 22-3.

    Gotta be honest and say that I think I want the Saffa’s to hammer us in this test series, the sooner Mike Hesson is sacked the better.

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  100. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    I see benfit changes are due in today.

    http://screencast.com/t/7vKMvEGp

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  101. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    Naaska. Cold shit arriving overnight as well by the look of the pics from the satelite.

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  102. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    That Philander is quite good isn’t he? 3 for none

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  103. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    The Balck Caps winning is about as relaistic as this.

    http://screencast.com/t/ktXqHHOHv2N1

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  104. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    4 down and then Morkel comes on to replace Steyn excellent

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  105. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Chris Martin will halt any batting collapse should NZ suffer one

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  106. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Fucking 5 down

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  107. noskire (832 comments) says:

    31/6. Good grief.

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  108. noskire (832 comments) says:

    Make that 31/7.

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  109. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Not very often an entire test innings lasts as long as it takes to drink a cup of tea and eat a piece of fruit cake aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

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  110. nickb (3,662 comments) says:

    …..

    5 for for philander in around 40 minutes of play… unbelievable

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  111. thedavincimode (6,539 comments) says:

    Don’t panick. Just a couple of things that didn’t quite go our way.

    CORRECTION: 7 things. Justin Vaughan, John Buchanan, the hockey coach (whoever the fuck he is), David White, Chris Moller, Mike Hesson and finally, the appointment as captain of a man who has a brain that is almost as big as an undersized peanut that is the smallest peanut at the school for undersized peanuts.

    Buggar, why didn’t I type quicker. 8 things.

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  112. thedavincimode (6,539 comments) says:

    Oh yes, the 8th thing. Now even the bloody jappee commentators are feeling sorry for us.

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  113. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    New Zealand may look like its on the back foot on the first day of the first test , first session, first innings but Mike from Otago will have plan, I’m sure of this

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  114. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    one more and extras will second highest score

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  115. nickb (3,662 comments) says:

    the appointment as captain of a man who has a brain that is almost as big as an undersized peanut that is the smallest peanut at the school for undersized peanuts.

    Lol. I like how McCullum’s positive brand of cricket is going

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  116. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Positivey shite

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  117. F E Smith (3,302 comments) says:

    At least it wasn’t 25

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  118. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    Now there are some of you negative bastards who’ll say 45 isn’t that flash and I will admit it leaves us with a bit of work to do but take the positives Chris Martin was not out and after some sleep I’m sure I’ll think of some more.

    FFS , this is test series White and Moller and the rest of you wankers, not senior fucking B. New Zealand cricket is disgrace, its run disgracefully and the players are playing bloody disgracefully. And there will be some fuckwit in the paper in the morning saying,,”well we did win one of the 20/20′s

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  119. bhudson (4,734 comments) says:

    Oh the shame to be stripped of Test playing status

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  120. Viking2 (11,147 comments) says:

    So the move to Aickland must ne to take up the Balck Caps coach position then? :roll:

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  121. Dean Papa (743 comments) says:

    oh look, the fanbois have turned feral. No suprises there!!

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  122. Tauhei Notts (1,613 comments) says:

    That cricket is so bad that I chose to watch some feminist crap on BBC, rather than the torture of Newlands.

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  123. Griff (6,842 comments) says:

    NZ Cricket
    :lol:

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  124. Dean Papa (743 comments) says:

    what beautiful bowling by Philander. That was a privilege to watch.

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  125. SPC (5,397 comments) says:

    It just goes to show that it was the South Africans who bought tickets for the 3rd day who were the optimists.

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  126. SPC (5,397 comments) says:

    The lowest Test score since 1974 by any team.

    The real story is that we won the toss and chose to bat first. A bit like a boxer starting a fight with his hands down and asking what sort of punch the world chanmpion had.

    Before the game the story was that the South African administrators insisted the grass be cut so that the contest might go to the later days/rounds – ticket sales for the 4th day were non existent let alone the fifth.

    It’s always a bit interesting on a first day at Newlands, so they must have been pleased that we won the toss and thus could bat later when the pitch had tamed down. But no one counted on a novice test match captain who wanted to show how decisive he was (compared to Taylor) and take the game to the South Africans – by leading with his chin. This is why even the Hesson regime wanted to keep Taylor as test match captain.

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  127. SPC (5,397 comments) says:

    Newlands has a bit of a reputation.

    November 2011.

    First Test, Cape Town (day two):

    Australia 284 & 47 v South Africa 96 & 81-1.

    23 wickets fell on the second day.

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  128. Longknives (4,472 comments) says:

    But wait- Wasn’t this the same team that were talking up an absolute storm after one rather flukey T20 ‘Hit and Giggle’ victory over South Africa last week?? Hadn’t the Black Caps ‘turned the corner’?

    As a cricket purist watching these clowns laughing,smiling and attempting to slog the ball out of the park when you are 6 for 36 on Day 1 of a Test match makes my fucking skin crawl.
    McCullum (the self-professed ‘Master Blaster’) and his trash talking mate Bracewell can fuck off back to NZ club cricket. Their arrogant,cocky, trash talking attitudes (and lack of actual ability) has once again blown up in their faces..

    It sickens me to see New Zealand players using a Test match as a bloody T20 ‘trial’….RIP New Zealand Cricket.

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  129. mikenmild (10,766 comments) says:

    With SA 252/3, I guess that a good NZ bowling performance on the second day will only hasten the end of the match.

    Much as I love test cricket, I am very glad this is only a two-match series, something to get out of the way before the ODIs. Unfortunately, that’s how some of the players seem to view it.

    NZ Cricket has 11 weeks to have a team ready to face England three home tests. By then, we should select a test batting order based on performance in our first class competition. Only the merest handful of our players have shown that they can play first-class cricket as well as the one-day formats. I believe that only Guptill, Williamson, Brownlie and Flynn warrant consideration for the home tests. To be considered for the England tests, batsmen players should have appeared in at least three of the final four rounds of the Plunket Shield. Hopefully Taytlor and Ryder will be available for selection. Here are the top run scorers so far in the Plunket Shield:
    1 Aaron Redmond 640
    2 Colin Munro 623
    3 Carl Cachopa 611
    4 Jesse Ryder 558
    5 Michael Papps 548
    6 Peter Fulton 504
    7 Joseph Yovich 464
    8 Luke Ronchi 441
    9 Dean Brownlie 415
    I haven’t got the averages handy. But pick the six batsmen with the best records in February and March, add Ronchi as wicket keeper and Bracewell, Boult, Southee, and the only selection decision is Wagner or a spinner (Patel or Vettori).

    Fire the Australian lawn bowls selector – I’ve just done his job for him.

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  130. Dean Papa (743 comments) says:

    “23 wickets fell on the second day.”

    better hope that doesn’t happen this time!!

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  131. Dean Papa (743 comments) says:

    Mike, as Drooly correctly pointed, the best available players are there. The ones not availiable are Taylor, Ryder, Southee and Vettori. Don’t blame the selectors!

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  132. big bruv (13,331 comments) says:

    The fact that we were dismissed for 45 is embarrassing enough, however what made it all the more worse was the gutless way we went about it.
    At least three of our batsmen backed away from the bowlers, when the top order has failed the very least you expect from your middle and lower order is to show some guts.

    As bad as that display was the thing that really gets me is that as far as NZC (and the majority of the players) are concerned it does not really matter, to them test cricket is nothing more than a pain in the arse. Yes NZC will make all the right noises about test cricket being the highest level of the game but their (NZC) actions show this to be a lie. The the simple truth is that as far as NZC and most of the players are concerned if NZ did not play test cricket they would not lose a wink of sleep.

    One wonders just how long the ICC will continue to allow NZ to play the elite level of the game. The prospect of a tour by NZ is not something that other countries want, to them it means huge financial losses. Test cricket in NZ is doomed….and NZC could not care less.

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  133. SPC (5,397 comments) says:

    Aaraon Redmond has played test cricket, as I recall he scored 50 before lunch in a test in Australia – then was dropped for not taking test cricket seriously. And they would not pick him even for one day cricket either.

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