As I understand it, Catholics aren’t supposed to engage in oral sex for the same reasons Lucia gave for contraceptive sex.

The Most Offensive Song Ever – South Park

(Duet – Kenny & Mr Hankey the Christmas Poo)

Howdy Ho.
the Virgin Mary was sleepin’
When Angel Gabriel appeared
He said, “You are to be the virgin mother.”
and Mary thought that was weird.
Mary said, “I’m not a virgin.
I blew a guy last year.”
But then Gabriel said to Mary,
“My child, have no fear.”

[slowing] ‘Cause sucking dick brings peace on Earth and joy.

As I understand it, Catholics aren’t supposed to engage in oral sex for the same reasons Lucia gave for contraceptive sex.

Is your problem with those who agreed with shunda on biological influence identity and support same sex marriage or those who agreed with Colin Craig but still support same sex marriage? Or just with people supporting same sex marriage – in oppostion to both shunda and Colin Craig?

1. I support gay marriage.
2. “It’s not a choice” is one of the worst possible reasons to use in support of gay marriage.

You could argue pedophilia is “not a choice” either (please be aware I am not equating homosexuality to pedophilia in any other way), but there is thankfully never going to be a campaign to allow them to legitimize their abnormal desires with legal protection. Also, if nature provides situations where there is “not a choice”, why not allow that society is also going to throw up situations where you will also have no choice: you must pay tax, you can’t walk around outside naked, you can’t get married etc. Suck it up, welcome to the world.

There are a million better arguments than “It’s not a choice”

Beheading? Stoning? Burning at the stake?

What about borderline homosexual behavior such as whistling show tunes or wearing properly fitted clothes?

Should such people be jailed? Fined? Have their picture published in the paper as a corrupter of morals?

There is not equality if civil unions do not allow partners to become step-parents of the children each of them has.

Are those claiming civil unions “could” (they do not yet) provide an independent equality to marriage, then proposing that step-parenting become automatic when civil unions occur – saying that they should?

Are those opposed to same sex couples being able to marry prepared to offer civil unions that include automatic step-parenting as marriage does as an alternative?

Given much of the opposition to same sex marriage comes from those that opposed and still oppose civil unions that is some forlorn hope.

I suppose the other problem of same sex partnership is that there is not the traditional role playing of provider and stay at home parent as occurs in traditional marriages …. Oh wait most women now have careers.

Or that same sex partners do not practice chastiy and marry as virgins as hetero couples do …. Oh wait, used to do.

As for HIV most people with it are heterosexual. In the USA there is the prevalence of gay men with it, but simply a consequence of where it first emerged in USA society.

Who knows how patterns of behaviour in homosexual relationships will be affected by being able to marry? A few decades ago the sterotype of where men met other men to engage in what was then “criminal activity” was what exactly. And if caught they somehow deserved to go to prison and be raped by heterosexual men. Things change.

Colin Craig is not right, we both know that. The problem here is that you let your religious bigotry get in the way of common sense.

No, the problem here is that Colin Craig is a conservative Christian, meaning that haters around here feel duty-bound to attack him (and anyone who won’t join them), and would declare him wrong if he was quoted saying that 1+1 equalled 2.

Shunda – kudos to you for an extremely well reasoned case.

Another study of 156 male couples found that after 5 years all of the couples “had incorporated some provision for outside sexual activity in their relationship. Even a study conducted by the NZ Aids Foundation revealed that a whopping 77% of male homosexuals were gorging themselves on other partners within six month of the “committed” relationship beginning. This explains why 60% of all new syphilis and gonorrhea cases are male homosexuals, and if you removed bisexual males and intravenous drug users out of the equation, HIV would be pretty much solely a homosexual problem.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/29/us/29sfmetro.html?_r=0
http://www.nzaf.org.nz/voices/view/latest-gapps-report

These people have no intention of honouring any of the traditional marriage covenants – namely monogamy. So now, genuine marriages need to be debased to include GLBT or any veritable alphabet soup of sexual deviancy so that a small clique of perverts can exercise their so-called “rights” rendering the institution of marriage to be about as worthless as an NCEA qualification in the process.

Yes, Blair, but do you have a choice is not liking Led Zeppelin? You admittedly said you don’t. You have a choice not to listen to them but you don’t have a choice in not liking them?

So attraction to the same sex, homosexuality, is not choice by your own example. You can choose not to act on it – but that doesn’t change what you are…

To say that same sex attraction is any different is ridiculous

Are you for real?

It’s still nonsense. I like Led Zeppelin. Is that a choice? Of course it is. It feels very natural to like Led Zeppelin, and you couldn’t force me not to like them. You couldn’t make me go to a Celine Dion camp to get rid of my predilection to headbang to Kashmir or Whole Lotta Love. But I could certainly choose not to listen to them, ignore them, not make them a part of my life. That might be hard for me. But it’s still a choice. To say that same sex attraction is any different is ridiculous.

One is a choice, the other is attraction. Sexual feelings towards one’s own sex isn’t something you choose. Homosexuality is not a choice.