I’d prefer a voluntary scheme. The work should be something that provides some value for society but generally stuff that it’s not cost effective to actually pay someone minimum wage+ for. EG- Clearing gorse or other noxious weeds, graffiti removal, rubbish collection, tree planting, basic property maintenance for community groups – perhaps the local hospice needs their fence fixed or painted or DOC needing some manhours to upgrade a walking track. There should be both a carrot & stick approach, perhaps the work time spent should be considered to reduce prison sentences, or at minimum be taken into account for parole applications. Make it possible for inmates to smoke if outdoors while on breaks (but not in prisons). Incentivise inmates to be classed as ‘lower risk’ to be eligible for more interesting/rewarding tasks.

Tried one on Whitetail on Stewart Island once. Went back to a rifle. Deer are obviously at least as smart as crim’s!

This goes for the business sector as well. They have no understanding or enlightenment of how to benefit the consumer and encouragement to them. Just rape, rape rape pockets

If prisons become places where they are forced to work, I believe some, possibly quite a lot might not repeat their ‘mistakes’.

http://tinyurl.com/akr9y62

The URL you asked for.

JC

Benefits: Active prisoners, contributing to society, gaining new skills and experience, preparation for the outside World, earning a little money.

Negatives: Interferes with wider-labour market, minimum wage not paid, slight risk around the interface between extra freedoms and prison security.

Despite being a Tory, some of Tolley’s reforms have been quite good – banning smoking in prisons and literacy programmes are two of the more successful ideas. Expensive PPPs is her only failure I can think of.

They are possibly the lowest value for money rag in the country and they are going towards the shock/horror segment of the market.

I once saw a story in the National Enquirer in the US. The headline was “World War II planes found on far side of moon”

I expect to see something similar in the Herald any time soon.

JC: What exactly are those UN protocols you quote from? I was always told that one of the reasons more prisoners werent working was that “UN conventions” we had signed meant it couldn’t be compulsory. Clearly I was misinformed.

Backster: Unfortunately, much as we would all like it to be otherwise, the recidivism among former inmates of jails in Maricopa county is no better than elsewhere in the State. That doesn’t mean that Sheriff Joe’s methods are not worth copying (prisons cost significantly less to build and run in Arizona than here) but we shouldn’t see chain gangs or tent jails as the answer to recidivism.

I remember going out with the chain gangs (the members are there voluntarily; they like getting out of the hot boring jail) and talking to the guards, one of whom carried a pump action shotgun. I asked him if he had ever had to use it..his laconic answer – in a dry southern drawl – was classic: “Ah had to to cock it once…” Anyone who has ever heard a pump action being cocked knows there is no sound like it.

It is NOT the inmates.

They know they are there (in prison) for crimes they have acknowledged or been found guilty thereof……well apart from one or two notable exceptions, on which no further comment in this thread.

There are two problems here:

1. The prison officers union which wants risible hours of work, rates of pay, and other bennies, for a job no more dangerous than teaching school..

2. Their intractable position has stifled action on work in prison for more than 25 years (Tolley has been snowed DPF because she has insular advice, so have you DPF!)

3. The present head of Corrections, Ray Smith failed at WINZ and he failed at CYPS. So the dinosaur SSC said: “Lordy…let’s appoint him to Corrections. He will introduce a real work policy”. And Tolley, absent independent advice, bought it. As Tui would say: Yeah, right.

David, you and others need re-education.
Go back to W S Churchill, or for a more recent figure, try Judge (aka Sir)Anand Satayanand. No? I thought not.
So the proposed programme will splutter on, cough and splutter to a stop, and then be re-invented, by some dumb fool at some time in the future.

In the meantime the only beneficiaries will be the legal/judicial industrial complex……. and of couyrse, the ;ollies.
The victims? Taxpayers.

The Herald editorial should have been by-lined ‘EPMU shop steward’.

This is a significant opportunity to better the lives of prisoners, help pay their way, and help condition them for a return to society. We’re not short of work that needs to be done, so I think the “taking jobs” argument is pretty weak.

The challenge is making sure the work done has minimal impact on other jobs.

I disagree. The purpose of prisons is to keep prisoners away from the public, to rehabilitate where possible and to make society safer in the long run. It isn’t a jobs scheme and I would argue the need to make society safer from crime outweighs any concern over someone’s job. Rehabilitative work should be focused on getting prisoners back into normal jobs as a pathway to integration into normal society. This will inevitably lead to competition with regular society. The real concern is that such a scheme will by used merely as a punitive measure with limited rehabilitative potential.

Prisoners should also be paid for their work (albeit at a low rate to compensate for their imprisonment). Payment should go into a fund for their release and part of it should be given to them as credits in prison. Reward for work is the best way to teach a person the value of work and the best way for a person to appreciate that reward is for it to materialize before them in a tangible way.

Ie, over 50% of convicted crims. Here’s the first four UN minimum standards for prisoner employment.. note No 2:

71. (1) Prison labour must not be of an afflictive nature.

(2) All prisoners under sentence shall be required to work, subject to their physical and mental fitness as determined by the medical officer.

(3) Sufficient work of a useful nature shall be provided to keep prisoners actively employed for a normal working day.

(4) So far as possible the work provided shall be such as will maintain or increase the prisoners, ability to earn an honest living after release.

JC

They do do some work here in NZ, but according to the Corrections site it is voluntary.

What work do prisoners do?

Over 4,700 prisoners participate in employment or industry training.

Prisoners who undertake employment and training do so on a voluntary basis and are generally enthusiastic about being provided with the opportunity and responsibility of learning new skills.

Prisoners are trained in a number of industries including farming, nurseries, organics, forestry, timber processing, furniture making, textiles, catering, engineering, concrete product manufacturing, printing and laundries. Training occurs through a variety of methods including business-like industries, industry training, work parties and unit-based activities within the prison (see descriptions below). In most employment activities, prisoners are trained by qualified instructors to NZQF standards. Eligible prisoners have the opportunity to participate in Release to Work (see description below).

http://www.corrections.govt.nz/about-us/fact-sheets/managing-offenders/education,_training_and_employment/cie-information-booklet/what-work-do-prisoners-do.html

In the U.S they used to have them cracking rocks, and in many States they still make license plates for cars.
Shouldn’t they be doing some kind of work?

Otherwise, what do they do, just sit around all day?