A lie
February 15th, 2013 at 4:00 pm by David FarrarAdam Bennett at the NZ Herald reports:
But he [Prosser] hit out at leaders of other political parties who said he shouldn’t be in Parliament.
“Anyone can throw that mud and frankly many of the people throwing it shouldn’t be. You look at the likes of Peter Dunne. He’s a man who campaigned on the basis of not supporting asset sales and now he’s supporting them and he’s not only in his own mind fit to be an MP but fit to be a Cabinet minister.
This is a lie. Peter Dunne explicitly said before the 2011 election:
In principle, UnitedFuture does not advocate selling state assets, but in the event National puts up its mixed ownership model for the electricity companies and Air New Zealand we would be prepared to support that, provided the maximum was 49%, with a cap of 15% on any indivudual’s holdings. We would never support the sale of Kiwibank, Radio New Zealand or control of water assets.
The unions and Labour campaigned against Peter Dunne on the basis that he was going to vote for asset sales. Everyone knew this. People just like to repeat a lie, to try and make it stick.
A desperate attempt to deflect.
Related posts:
- A great own goal
- United Future and asset sales
- Labour on Dunne and Nazis
- UK Labour to do asset sales
February 15th, 2013 at 4:14 pm
It’s possible that Prosser hasn’t deliberately lied, he may have just picked up on Labour lying about it, they’ve done that often enough.
But it’s still attempting to deflect.
And it’s ironic that Prosser is accusing other party leaders of lying, his own party leader is not exactly squeaky clean there.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 4:16 pm
Peter Dunne was the first person to propose 49% sale of public assets – it was back around 2005. His later policy tries to suggest that his party would moderate National Party plans to sell public assets to this 49% maximum, but the concept of selling this much was first proposed by himself.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 4:25 pm
A minor correction – Peter Dunne proposed 40% (not 49) sale of SOE’s in the 2005 campaign – National led by Don Brash made no commitment to sell anything.
http://gordoncampbell.scoop.co.nz/2011/12/15/gordon-campbell-on-peter-dunnes-casting-vote-on-asset-sales/
Roger Kerr states United support for part-sale of SOE’s in the 2005 election and compares this National’s lack of any such programme.
http://m.nbr.co.nz/article/privatisation-a-third-rail
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 4:26 pm
“Brain explosion”, my ass it was a poorly written and ill conceived op ed
He’s starting to grovel now – if he carries on like this within the week he will be getting circumcised.
Wont do him any good though he’s toast
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 4:55 pm
Someone else has been perpetuating this same lie – Penny Bright:
She posted that here on GD two days ago (where she was puklled up on it) and at The Standard, where Penny was supported by a moderator versus a commenter:
That’s ironic accusing someone else of “deliberate distortion” when that’s exactly what Penny was doing.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:02 pm
So why no widespread polling support for perspicacious Peter?
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:03 pm
Whenever Penny comments here, we must remember to provide a link to this
http://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/EN/ratesbuildingproperty/ratesvaluations/billingpayment/payingyourrates/Pages/home.aspx
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:10 pm
So Dunne had principles, but if offered power had a different set of principles lined up ready to go. Efficient, if nothing else.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:11 pm
Winston is teaching Prosser well.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:12 pm
Disappointing that Herald journalists will outright lie in their articles. That is beyond sloppy. I think my list of hack Herald journalists to avoid would actually be shorter if I made a list of Herald journalists who write honest, well researched articles. In fact my list may even be blank.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:22 pm
No, he and UF were consistent from before the election to coalition negotiations to voting on the MOM bill, and he held National to account when they tried to sneak around the 51% minimum ownership clause (I know because I was involved in that).
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:25 pm
No fan of the Herald but they aint lying, they are quoting a flailing and sinking politician
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 5:45 pm
not sure if you can read obvious Farrar, NZ First 7%
Vote:can you add
February 15th, 2013 at 6:42 pm
Is that intended to be an English sentence?
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 7:20 pm
Archer, to be fair the Herald is quoting Prosser. In this instance he is the one lying, the Herald is merely reporting his quote.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 8:42 pm
David Garrett (3,209) Says:
February 15th, 2013 at 6:42 pm
Is that intended to be an English sentence?
You can see clearly Garrett that the idea of “read ‘ means here in this context “understand”,…. you do do you comprehend do, maybe not, thank God most of us do not think like you do, single handedly fucked the party you dog
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 8:59 pm
pq , you are a nasty little ignorant fucker arnt you, calling anyone a dog is really really not a good thing to do
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 9:00 pm
Here you go Kiwibloggers – United Future 2011 election policy – straight from the mouth of man himself – Peter Dunne:
http://www.unitedfuture.org.nz/asset-sales-policy-announcement/
Asset Sales Policy Announcement
10 October 2011
Kiwibank, Radio New Zealand and the water supply should be ruled out of any future asset sales programmes, UnitedFuture Leader Peter Dunne said today.
Speaking to the Auckland Rotary Club, he said that given that National has a manifesto that includes asset sales, New Zealanders need to start a proper debate on the future limits of those sales.
“To this point there has not been a proper national debate beyond National saying yes and Labour saying no.
“We need a conversation that is more detailed and drills down into what New Zealanders really think are acceptable bottom lines,” he said.
“New Zealanders, I believe, are not definitively pro-asset sales, but under certain conditions, it is no longer the bogeyman issue that Labour would have you believe.”
Mr Dunne said UnitedFuture’s role as a support partner is not just to contribute its own policies, but to help keep a government to a reasonable, centrist path.
“UnitedFuture says let’s start with three no-go areas where there would be no asset sales, not now, not ever:
“They are Kiwibank, Radio New Zealand and the supply of water.
“Kiwibank is in every sense now a national institution, whether you bank with it or not. And in a market full of Australian-owned banks, and an increasingly fraught and troubled globe, it is both a symbolic and practical statement of our economic sovereignty.
“Collectively, it is ours pure and simple. It must stay that way.
“Secondly, Radio New Zealand exists in an increasingly commercial media marketplace, and it is more important than ever to have a voice that does not bend to the dollar, to ratings, to external forces.
“Every nation needs its own voice and we need to afford that voice our collective protection.
“Thirdly, and one that I feel particularly deeply about, is water. I do not intend to wait until it is on the asset sales agenda.
“I do not believe New Zealanders would ever – or should ever – accept a sell-off of the supply of the water, or any of the aspects around it.
“Let no one claim for any price what is ours as of right. There needs to be a blanket and clear undertaking that this will never be on the agenda,” Mr Dunne said.
________________________________________________________________________________________________
That’s where I got my FACTS from.
United Future’s “Asset Sales Policy Announcement”
10 October 2011
Anyone want to argue with THAT?
This MINORITY National Government – which DID campaign on asset sales – has only 59 out of 121 MPs.
I put it to you – that if the voting public of Ohariu relied on United Future’s above-mentioned “Asset Sales Policy Announcement” in order to cast an informed vote – they could have been led to believe that Peter Dunne was NOT campaigning for the ‘mixed ownership model for the electricity companies and Air New Zealand’?
It gets a bit deceptive and misleading, in my considered opinion, for politicians not to be upfront and consistent in their stated policies?
Kind regards,
Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption campaigner’
Vote:Auckland Mayoral Candidate 2013
February 15th, 2013 at 9:20 pm
pq – been on the turps again?
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 9:22 pm
Can we make an exception in Penny’s case PEB?
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 9:42 pm
Penny, that’s consistent with UF policy and with what ended up happening, there is nothing in there that contradicts Dunne’s position and action before and after the election.
Some have tried to quibble about the water aspect but supply of water is not being sold off and UF policy and statements clearly differentiated between partial sale of power generators and water supply. It’s all detailed here:
Vote:http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2012/05/a_great_own_goal.html
February 15th, 2013 at 10:07 pm
That is BULLSHIT Pete George.
You can dance around on the head of a pin as long as you like – but if I were a member of the voting public in Ohariu and I wanted to know what Peter Dunne / United Future policy was on asset sales – I would head for the United Future ‘Asset Sales Policy Announcement’.
Not some random debate on Kiwiblog…..
Whereabouts on the above-mentioned ‘Asset Sales Policy Announcement’ does it state clearly for members of the voting public who want to cast an informed vote – that United Future and Peter Dunne were campaigning for the ‘mixed ownership model for the electricity companies and Air New Zealand’?
“Pete George (16,286) Says:
February 15th, 2013 at 4:55 pm
Someone else has been perpetuating this same lie – Penny Bright:”
You had the temerity to effectively call ME a LIAR Pete George?
I suggest you take a long, hard look in the mirror……………….
Not impressed.
Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption campaigner’
Auckland Mayoral Candidate 2013
http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 10:20 pm
Penny – I suggest you pay your rates……….
Even less impressed.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 10:28 pm
That would only tell you what UF policy was. Not National policy, nor what National policy UF acknowledged they would support as a major coalition partner.
UF did not specifically campaign for the ‘mixed ownership model for the electricity companies and Air New Zealand’ because it was not UF policy, it was National policy. But Dunne and other UF candidates, including myself, campaigned supporting National’s right as a major coalition partner to progress their number one policy.
And UF did not campaign against National’s MOM policy either, because they didn’t oppose it.
So you are incorrect saying “let alone a Minister, and Peter Dunne – who DID NOT campaign on supporting State Asset sales.” He did campaign on supporting National’s MOM policy, as did I.
I didn’t say you lied, I said you were “perpetuating this same lie”. Some have deliberately lied about it, others have repeated the lie.
Vote:February 15th, 2013 at 10:32 pm
Penny, if you are repeating the lie through ignorance, check this out:
http://yournz.org/2012/06/23/is-peter-dunne-breaking-a-promise-on-water-assets/
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 12:10 am
we must have NZ Nat , and NZ Fist Government ,do you wish to win or not,
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 12:58 am
Just a pity United Future doesn’t support the sale of Kiwibank. That’s the only asset that should be sold – given that the government has no business whatsoever running a bank. Electricity – well, that’s an essential service. But banking? Nope – the private sector do that better than Kiwibank ever will.
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 6:18 am
landoftime – National don’t support the sale of Kiwibank, neither do Labour or Greens, so United Future’s view on it is largely irrelevant.
I’m happy for Kiwibank ownership to stay as it is, it is an effective competitive alternative to foreign owned banks.
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 6:40 am
“I’m happy for Kiwibank ownership to stay as it is, it is an effective competitive alternative to foreign owned banks.”
Kiwibank is for left wing losers.
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 7:36 am
That’s not a quote from Prosser in the story.
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 8:01 am
The rantings of Richard Prosser , backed up by the ramblings of PQ confirm the sad truth.
Parties of the left struggle to find intelligent people , who share their views.
Hence the dearth of talent on the lefts party lists , miud you a Reiki master probably has skills of value to the economic future and well being of this country
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 8:18 am
A freudian slip?
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 10:00 am
” UF did not specifically campaign for the ‘mixed ownership model for the electricity companies and Air New Zealand’ because it was not UF policy”
[ Pete George (16,292) Says: February 15th, 2013 at 10:28 pm]
Thank you Pete George, for confirming my point.
In my considered opinion – the voting public of Ohariu were thus effectively misled by United Future and Peter Dunne on the issue of support for the ‘Mixed Ownership Model’ for State-Owned electricity assets and Air New Zealand.
In my considered opinion, United Future and Peter Dunne SOLD OUT the voting public of Ohariu by voting in support of the Public Finance (Mixed Ownership) Amendment Act 2012.
The final vote on the Public Finance (Mixed Ownership Model) Amendment Act 2012, was 61 – 60
http://www.parliament.nz/en-NZ/PB/Debates/Debates/e/8/e/50HansD_20120626_00000012-State-Owned-Enterprises-Amendment-Bill-Public.htm
A party vote was called for on the question, That the Public Finance (Mixed Ownership Model) Amendment Bill be now read a third time.
Ayes 61
New Zealand National 59; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.
Noes 60
New Zealand Labour 34; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 8; Māori Party 3; Mana 1.
_____________________________________________________________________________
I thus believe that I am absolutely correct in my statement that THERE IS NO MANDATE FOR ASSET SALES – given that this minority National Government (which DID campaign on asset sales) has only 59 out of 121 MPs.
NO MAJORITY – NO MANDATE.
In my considered opinion, Pete George, the one who is effectively LYING – is YOU.
Even less impressed.
When you’re in a hole, Pete George, turn off the keys to the ditchdigger?
Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption campaigner’
Auckland Mayoral Candidate 2013
http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com
Vote:February 16th, 2013 at 10:43 am
The (large) hole seems to be in your understanding.
UF and UF candidates did not specifically campaign for National policy, that’s right, but they did specifically acknowledge in campaigning that they would support National’s MOM policy. I’ve backed this up with evidence. The link DPF provides backs it up, including:
Your’e about then only one still perpetuating this lie against Dunne, selecting information to support your campaign that doesn’t prove anything, and ignoring evidence that proves you are wrong.
You may not be wilfully lying, but you appear to be wilfully ignoring evidence in perpetuating a lie.
Vote: