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	<title>Comments on: Could we get a CDU/Green Government in Germany?</title>
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	<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html</link>
	<description>DPF&#039;s Kiwiblog - Fomenting Happy Mischief since 2003</description>
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		<title>By: pq</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1090332</link>
		<dc:creator>pq</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Feb 2013 01:39:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1090332</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Question to people, not Green Europe but NZ, following from Eszett above February 1st, 2013 at 10:28 
Would a Green Labour Government NZ  introduce a Capital gains tax,or even a version of Capital  tax,  It seems to come and go from the agenda. Also devaluation of $NZ.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Question to people, not Green Europe but NZ, following from Eszett above February 1st, 2013 at 10:28<br />
Would a Green Labour Government NZ  introduce a Capital gains tax,or even a version of Capital  tax,  It seems to come and go from the agenda. Also devaluation of $NZ.</p>
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		<title>By: ChardonnayGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1090154</link>
		<dc:creator>ChardonnayGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 20:55:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1090154</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Much depends on whether the Alliancoid &quot;Left&quot; bloc is represented in the Bundestag after September. As well as Germany&#039;s cyberlibertarian Pirate Party, it crashed out of the Lower Saxony state parliament after their recent state election, but it&#039;s still strong in the former East Germany, so it may make it. In which case, will it support an SPD/Green coalition over a lone CDU/CSU centre-right party in the Bundestag? Still, I acknowledge that a grand coalition is another possibility.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Much depends on whether the Alliancoid &#8220;Left&#8221; bloc is represented in the Bundestag after September. As well as Germany&#8217;s cyberlibertarian Pirate Party, it crashed out of the Lower Saxony state parliament after their recent state election, but it&#8217;s still strong in the former East Germany, so it may make it. In which case, will it support an SPD/Green coalition over a lone CDU/CSU centre-right party in the Bundestag? Still, I acknowledge that a grand coalition is another possibility.</p>
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		<title>By: AJP</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089736</link>
		<dc:creator>AJP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 23:18:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089736</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Merkel will never go with the Greens as the Bavarian CSU will never allow this to happen. 

So my prediction is a Grand Coalition between CDU/CSU and SPD.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Merkel will never go with the Greens as the Bavarian CSU will never allow this to happen. </p>
<p>So my prediction is a Grand Coalition between CDU/CSU and SPD.</p>
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		<title>By: eszett</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089697</link>
		<dc:creator>eszett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 22:16:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089697</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;barry (1,145) Says: 
February 1st, 2013 at 10:08 am
A green government in germany – or any where overseas – would be good – it would show the stupidity of their crazy ideas to tax us back into the caves.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Very funny, given that the tax regime in Germany that CDU/FDP have would make a Greenie here blush.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>barry (1,145) Says:<br />
February 1st, 2013 at 10:08 am<br />
A green government in germany – or any where overseas – would be good – it would show the stupidity of their crazy ideas to tax us back into the caves.</p></blockquote>
<p>Very funny, given that the tax regime in Germany that CDU/FDP have would make a Greenie here blush.</p>
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		<title>By: ChardonnayGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089679</link>
		<dc:creator>ChardonnayGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:57:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089679</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A quick check reveals that you&#039;re correct, Eszett. Well spotted. Here&#039;s a backgrounder link on that coalition... http://www.thelocal.de/politics/20101128-31465.html]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A quick check reveals that you&#8217;re correct, Eszett. Well spotted. Here&#8217;s a backgrounder link on that coalition&#8230; <a href="http://www.thelocal.de/politics/20101128-31465.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.thelocal.de/politics/20101128-31465.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Naturesong</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089672</link>
		<dc:creator>Naturesong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:48:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089672</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt; ... So far, she has governed and campaigned with a style that German boffins call “asymmetric demobilisation,” meaning that she has tactically stolen issues from the centre-left opposition by enacting them pre-emptively or signalling that she might.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
This is not how the National party are governing though. They have dusted off Labours policies ... from 1984.
The results of which we are seeing with 
 - record numbers of people fleeing New Zealand (180,000, the main reason for working is lack of work)
 - record unemployment (7.3% - and you can add most of the folks that have led to that number)
 - public debt approaching 40% of GDP (was low 20&#039;s when the reins were handed over in 2008)
 - stagnating or falling wages.
 - increase of GST, to give a real kick in the knees to those who are now earning less, or have lost their jobs and are relying on the dole to keep afloat while they look for jobs (or pack up their stuff to leave for Australia)
 - Causing serious damage to our 100% pure brand, upon which our entire tourism industry relies.

This is in stark contrast to Angela Merkel who has governed with intelligence and prudence leading to positive outcomes; falling unemployment, reduction of public debt, rising wages and standard of living.

Credit should be given however to National for implemeting the Greens Heatsmart policy, the success of which Phil Heatley waxes lyrical about here: http://www.parliament.nz/en-NZ/PB/Business/QOA/8/2/2/50HansQ_20121129_00000007-7-Warm-Up-New-Zealand-Heat-Smart-Number.htm

If the National party loses the next election it is because of the following reasons; 
 - slavish adherence to ideological policies (and willfully ignoring, or suppressing evidence which shows the flaws in said policies)
 - gross incompetence across a number of ministries
 - Epsom have finally had enough of John Banks. When I returned to New Zealand a few years ago, I was shocked that my fellow Aucklanders had voted this incompetent in again, after the vandalism he had inflicted on Auckland CBD in his first term as Mayor.
 - The Maori Party losing its base - largely because of their support for this government
 - United Future finally past its used by date - Though I wouldn&#039;t be surprised if Peter Dunne somehow survives

The only thing standing in the way of a National Party defeat in the next election ...is Labour]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p> &#8230; So far, she has governed and campaigned with a style that German boffins call “asymmetric demobilisation,” meaning that she has tactically stolen issues from the centre-left opposition by enacting them pre-emptively or signalling that she might.</p></blockquote>
<p>This is not how the National party are governing though. They have dusted off Labours policies &#8230; from 1984.<br />
The results of which we are seeing with<br />
 &#8211; record numbers of people fleeing New Zealand (180,000, the main reason for working is lack of work)<br />
 &#8211; record unemployment (7.3% &#8211; and you can add most of the folks that have led to that number)<br />
 &#8211; public debt approaching 40% of GDP (was low 20&#8242;s when the reins were handed over in 2008)<br />
 &#8211; stagnating or falling wages.<br />
 &#8211; increase of GST, to give a real kick in the knees to those who are now earning less, or have lost their jobs and are relying on the dole to keep afloat while they look for jobs (or pack up their stuff to leave for Australia)<br />
 &#8211; Causing serious damage to our 100% pure brand, upon which our entire tourism industry relies.</p>
<p>This is in stark contrast to Angela Merkel who has governed with intelligence and prudence leading to positive outcomes; falling unemployment, reduction of public debt, rising wages and standard of living.</p>
<p>Credit should be given however to National for implemeting the Greens Heatsmart policy, the success of which Phil Heatley waxes lyrical about here: <a href="http://www.parliament.nz/en-NZ/PB/Business/QOA/8/2/2/50HansQ_20121129_00000007-7-Warm-Up-New-Zealand-Heat-Smart-Number.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.parliament.nz/en-NZ/PB/Business/QOA/8/2/2/50HansQ_20121129_00000007-7-Warm-Up-New-Zealand-Heat-Smart-Number.htm</a></p>
<p>If the National party loses the next election it is because of the following reasons;<br />
 &#8211; slavish adherence to ideological policies (and willfully ignoring, or suppressing evidence which shows the flaws in said policies)<br />
 &#8211; gross incompetence across a number of ministries<br />
 &#8211; Epsom have finally had enough of John Banks. When I returned to New Zealand a few years ago, I was shocked that my fellow Aucklanders had voted this incompetent in again, after the vandalism he had inflicted on Auckland CBD in his first term as Mayor.<br />
 &#8211; The Maori Party losing its base &#8211; largely because of their support for this government<br />
 &#8211; United Future finally past its used by date &#8211; Though I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if Peter Dunne somehow survives</p>
<p>The only thing standing in the way of a National Party defeat in the next election &#8230;is Labour</p>
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		<title>By: eszett</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089660</link>
		<dc:creator>eszett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:28:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089660</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;Possibly, as there have been German state governments that have consisted of CDU/Green coalitions&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I believe only one was on state level, in Hamburg 2008-10 until the Greens left.
Everything else was only on council level.

It is quite possible that it may happen on federal elvel, but it probably would be the &quot;last cab of the rank&quot;


The major differnce between the Greens in Germany and the Greens in NZ is that the Greens had the opportunity to grow and learn what being in government means in the councils and more importantly in the state governments.

They had to shed a lot of their more radical positions, a process which nearly tore the party apart.

If the Greens ever make it into a government here, it will be a very hard lesson to learn. In order to get some of your policies  through you have to be able to compromise and swallow a few dead rats.

It will be interesting to see what happens here in NZ when green idealism meets realpolitik head-on.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Possibly, as there have been German state governments that have consisted of CDU/Green coalitions</p></blockquote>
<p>I believe only one was on state level, in Hamburg 2008-10 until the Greens left.<br />
Everything else was only on council level.</p>
<p>It is quite possible that it may happen on federal elvel, but it probably would be the &#8220;last cab of the rank&#8221;</p>
<p>The major differnce between the Greens in Germany and the Greens in NZ is that the Greens had the opportunity to grow and learn what being in government means in the councils and more importantly in the state governments.</p>
<p>They had to shed a lot of their more radical positions, a process which nearly tore the party apart.</p>
<p>If the Greens ever make it into a government here, it will be a very hard lesson to learn. In order to get some of your policies  through you have to be able to compromise and swallow a few dead rats.</p>
<p>It will be interesting to see what happens here in NZ when green idealism meets realpolitik head-on.</p>
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		<title>By: ChardonnayGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089645</link>
		<dc:creator>ChardonnayGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:10:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089645</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[So Merkel&#039;s a pragmatist. It&#039;s done her well in the past.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So Merkel&#8217;s a pragmatist. It&#8217;s done her well in the past.</p>
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		<title>By: barry</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089642</link>
		<dc:creator>barry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:08:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089642</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A green government in germany - or any where overseas - would be good - it would show the stupidity of their crazy ideas to tax us back into the caves.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A green government in germany &#8211; or any where overseas &#8211; would be good &#8211; it would show the stupidity of their crazy ideas to tax us back into the caves.</p>
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		<title>By: krazykiwi</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089639</link>
		<dc:creator>krazykiwi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:04:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089639</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;So far, she has governed and campaigned with a style that German boffins call “asymmetric demobilisation,” meaning that she has tactically stolen issues from the centre-left opposition by enacting them pre-emptively or signalling that she might. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

In other words, hoodwinking the public just long enough to secure a few extra votes. No principles, just platitudes guided by focus groups. No wonder politicians are so distrusted.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>So far, she has governed and campaigned with a style that German boffins call “asymmetric demobilisation,” meaning that she has tactically stolen issues from the centre-left opposition by enacting them pre-emptively or signalling that she might. </p></blockquote>
<p>In other words, hoodwinking the public just long enough to secure a few extra votes. No principles, just platitudes guided by focus groups. No wonder politicians are so distrusted.</p>
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		<title>By: ChardonnayGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089637</link>
		<dc:creator>ChardonnayGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:04:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089637</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And one assumes that New Zealand First might lose its parliamentary foothold as Labour recovers its voter share.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And one assumes that New Zealand First might lose its parliamentary foothold as Labour recovers its voter share.</p>
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		<title>By: ChardonnayGuy</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089636</link>
		<dc:creator>ChardonnayGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 21:03:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089636</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Possibly, as there have been German state governments that have consisted of CDU/Green coalitions. However, it does seem certain that Germany&#039;s former classical liberal centre-right satellite party, the Free Democrats, are going to fall out of the Bundestag in September&#039;s federal German elections, or else survive but cannibalise the CDU vote.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Possibly, as there have been German state governments that have consisted of CDU/Green coalitions. However, it does seem certain that Germany&#8217;s former classical liberal centre-right satellite party, the Free Democrats, are going to fall out of the Bundestag in September&#8217;s federal German elections, or else survive but cannibalise the CDU vote.</p>
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		<title>By: pq</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089630</link>
		<dc:creator>pq</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 20:48:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089630</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[no green Government NZ, secret for you Mr Farrar, just out today, Winston he will never go with Green. more later]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>no green Government NZ, secret for you Mr Farrar, just out today, Winston he will never go with Green. more later</p>
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		<title>By: tvb</title>
		<link>http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/could_we_get_a_cdugreen_government_in_germany.html/comment-page-1#comment-1089617</link>
		<dc:creator>tvb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jan 2013 20:29:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/?p=71073#comment-1089617</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think the greens will dangle the prospect they may do a deal with national to put pressure on Labour. But i think labour will call their bluff.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the greens will dangle the prospect they may do a deal with national to put pressure on Labour. But i think labour will call their bluff.</p>
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