General Debate 18 February 2013

February 18th, 2013 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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153 Responses to “General Debate 18 February 2013”

  1. Viking2 (11,579 comments) says:

    Ah well work again. How exciting.

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  2. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    “Oil production technology is giving us ever more expensive oil with ever diminishing returns for the ever increasing effort that needs to be invested,” writes Raymond Pierrehumbert, basing his assessment on American Geophysical Union (AGU) data on the untapped shale oil reserves of the United States.

    According to the AGU, there are under 3 trillion barrels of shale oil in the U.S. with a 1-2% recoverability rate. Oil trapped in shale formations requires breaking up the substrate or heating it to high temperatures.

    While oil industry advocates predict endless oil abundance, geophysical data suggests the opposite scenario. Roughly 1/3 of U.S. shale oil reserves would meet consumption needs for only two years based on 2011 rates. Drilling frequency has increased five times since the year 2000, but the returns have remained static.

    The U.S. is also unlikely to surpass Saudi oil production, which exceeds U.S. production by 3.5 million barrels a day.
    http://mobile.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2013/02/u_s_shale_oil_are_we_headed_to_a_new_era_of_oil_abundance.html

    Following the first link Kea provided:

    “The technology for assessing oil reserves is pretty good,” Rusco said. “I don’t say there isn’t a wide margin of error, but you can have great confidence that there is a very, very large amount of oil trapped down there that could be recovered. It’s just that, so far, it can’t be recovered at a profit.”
    http://abcnews.go.com/Business/american-oil-find-holds-oil-opec/story?id=17536852&page=2

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  3. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    I used to think Griff was sincere but mistaken. Now I am not so sure. He will not answer my simple questions.

    1. Who pays the climate scientists ?

    2. Would they have that money if AGW theory was proven false ?

    3. What is the AGW industry estimated to be worth Globally ? (to the nearest few trillion dollars)

    I wonder what the problem is? It is especially puzzling given his frequent comments about “funding” and scary stories about BIG OIL and the fictional “Carbon Industry”.

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  4. Colville (2,300 comments) says:

    Interesting tossup who is better with a cricket bat…Martin Guptil or Oscar Pistorius…

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/africa/8316451/Pistorius-girlfriends-skull-crushed

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  5. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    China needs ‘full-scale’ reform to fight inequality

    Among policy observers, changing China’s “two-tier society of rich and poor” will require “fundamental” reforms. Economist Hu Xingdou argues that the country needs to address outdated tax structures by introducing inheritance tax and restructuring the current system of property rights. Currently, as the article explains, local governments generate a large portion of their revenues via land sales. This, in turn, leads local authorities to push many farmers and rural dwellers off their properties with compensation well below market rate. Creating a property tax and giving rural dwellers greater rights to their property would dis-incentivize the sale of land and limit the number of landless farmers, the article explains.
    http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2013-02-08/news/36993051_1_gini-coefficient-migrant-workers-research-centre

    and we get that money and those values thanks to harcourts

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  6. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    Kea your forbes story just for fun read the comments on it .

    heartland funded propaganda paid for with petrodollars and aimed at sheepies :lol:
    http://oss.sagepub.com/content/33/11/1477.full

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  7. Scott Chris (6,177 comments) says:

    Here’s one for the Obama haters:

    Baracula!

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  8. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    The Greens motion,that the rest of the parliamentary muppets got in behind, that Muslims in particular should have their rights and dignity upheld could be applied to this idea!

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/9875954/Muslim-preacher-urges-followers-to-claim-Jihad-Seekers-Allowance.html

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  9. hamnidaV2 (247 comments) says:

    Looks like a stellar list of speakers at this years ACT conference.

    No wonder they are polling 0.0%.

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  10. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    Looks like a stellar list of speakers at this years ACT conference.

    No wonder they are polling 0.0%.

    They jumped the shark with Don Brash, didn’t they?

    What other clowns made it under the big top? That Banks jerk?

    What a bunch of fuckwits!! The right wing equivalent of the melon party.

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  11. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    No talking points from Pete George this morning?

    This thread will be a shambles if we dont have PG here to “frame the debate”

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  12. joana (1,983 comments) says:

    During the weekend the Press printed a pathetic article titled..” Why I want to ban old , white men ,” by some old white woman who pretends to be a comedian..Why is it acceptable to make fun of certain groups and not others? Why are so many people and newspapers competing so aggressively for the latest hypocrisy awards? How many will be rushing off to the HRC in defence of old , white men?

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  13. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    Police were called to the scene about midnight….

    The officers at the scene stepped back and called for back up.

    More than a dozen police equipped with riot gear eventually waded into the crowd to gain control.

    Police remained at the scene until about 3am, he said.

    When the crowd dispersed, the hall and carpark was in total disarray and covered in rubbish, Stewart said.

    “There was blood on a curtain and windowsill and a curtain rod was pulled down where it looked like someone had tried to go out a window,” she said.

    Beaconsfield Rd was so littered with broken glass that cars could not drive through.

    A group of cyclists on a training run early yesterday suffered multiple tyre punctures.

    Party organisers had one adult there to keep an eye on the door, who did their best to control the situation, Sergeant Callon said, but the trouble apparently began when a group of uninvited people turned up.

    “When you’re inviting in excess of 50 or 100 people, there’s always going to be some antisocial element turning up to these events who seem to thrive on violent behaviour,” he said.

    “It’s a very small group of delinquents who drink too much alcohol and take satisfaction in trying to use violence against not only members of the public but also law enforcement.”

    Timaruuted.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/8316361/Crashed-party-like-World-War-3

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  14. James Stephenson (2,234 comments) says:

    Baracula? Looks like the cat from Red Dwarf to me…

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  15. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    joana – its because white men are the “majority”. everyone else is a minority. they are protected.

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  16. Keeping Stock (10,443 comments) says:

    Is it a good look for a presenter on the state-funded TV channel to be encouraging leaks of anti-Government information? Could it be career-limiting?

    http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2013/02/tweet-of-day-18-february-2013.html

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  17. Nookin (3,473 comments) says:

    So, SBW is thinking about lending his services to NZRU in a couple of years. Very nice of him.

    If NZRU had any principles it would thank him very much and point out that we have a number of No 12s who are available week in and week out and are busting a gut for that jersey and his services will not be required. They don’t even need to mention the business ethics of his manager.

    If they really want an SBW distraction then appoint Prosser as the negotiator. They can then fight tooth and nail while we happily go on with our lives ( sort of like what is happening on the Bain threads)

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/8316516/Sonny-Bill-keeps-door-open-for-World-Cup

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  18. graham (2,346 comments) says:

    dime: I think Pete George is probably far too busy helping other aspiring politicians who have eagerly taken up his latest offer.

    Of course it’s also riskier because the future of United is in question. But people who recognise opportunites and take risks are often those who succeed.

    I don’t think I’m the future of the party, it needs a new generation. But I can help anyone who’s interested.

    http://yournz.org/2013/02/18/poll-and-nationals-strength-and-weakness/

    There you go. Anybody wanting Pete the politician’s valuable guidance on how to reinvigorate United Future, fill ya boots.

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  19. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    During the weekend the Press printed a pathetic article titled..” Why I want to ban old , white men ,” by some old white woman who pretends to be a comedian..Why is it acceptable to make fun of certain groups and not others? Why are so many people and newspapers competing so aggressively for the latest hypocrisy awards? How many will be rushing off to the HRC in defence of old , white men?

    I had a quick squizz at it…

    I don’t have a big problem with it. It’s opinion piece.. so you don’t have to like it. Humour is subjective. Jerry Seinfeld wouldn’t be everyone’s cup of tea but there’s no disputing the fact that people pay to watch him speak and they laugh at what he says so… that’s conclusive enough that he can be fair;y described as a comedian.

    I didn’t laugh at anything in that piece. You do understand that she’s referring to Prosser in there eh? That seems to be the driving force behind the whole shibang.

    I actually agree with her. If you read it word for word… it’s quite soft and fluffy really. There’s nothing terribly controversial about it… ho hum…

    It’s a simplistic and unsophisticated viewpoint. More dumbed down rubbish that insults the intelligence of informed people. For example the inference that John Key is white, male, middle-aged and stupid based on his gay shirt comment is laughable. The context of the comment is missing totally. It’s a once over lightly bit of nonsense. It’s an overview. It would need to go indepth and explain some of these assertions. It’s not aimed at people with a brain…. don’t worry. Look at the author and say… I’m not worried what that person thinks… they’re not that bright.

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  20. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Griff (4,276) Says:

    February 18th, 2013 at 8:18 am
    Kea your forbes story just for fun read the comments on it .

    heartland funded propaganda paid for with petrodollars and aimed at sheepies

    Kea (2,148) Says:

    February 18th, 2013 at 8:08 am
    I used to think Griff was sincere but mistaken. Now I am not so sure. He will not answer my simple questions.

    1. Who pays the climate scientists ?

    2. Would they have that money if AGW theory was proven false ?

    3. What is the AGW industry estimated to be worth Globally ? (to the nearest few trillion dollars)

    I wonder what the problem is? It is especially puzzling given his frequent comments about “funding” and scary stories about BIG OIL and the fictional “Carbon Industry”.

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  21. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    Graham – awesome. Im off to Dunedin!

    Step 1 – get Dime a wind tunnel tested hair cut.
    Step 2 – Teach Dime to speak in a boring, monotonous tone
    Step 3 – practice trying to sound like “Mr Sensible”. Try and figure out the middle ground on every issue and stay there
    Step 4 – send Dime off to whore school where he will learn to sell himself to the highest political bidder.

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  22. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    Nookin – The NZRU should welcome SBW back. Hes the best 12 on the planet. He will only get better.

    Who cares if they have to play the game with that agent idiot.

    SBW is a 1%’er.

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  23. Pete George (23,688 comments) says:

    dime – It’s not always necessary to comment to frame the debate. Thanks.

    Obviously your political approach is far more successful at getting what you want. What is it?

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  24. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    From Nookin:

    So, SBW is thinking about lending his services to NZRU in a couple of years. Very nice of him.

    What a slut that dude is. I hope he never plays for the ABs again.

    I had a dream. There was a weird sounding fella called SBW. Took a fight against a top ten ranked boxer. Suffered brain damage. Flunkey management team sucked his assets clean. Now he’s sniffing glue in K road.

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  25. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    Hes the best 12 on the planet.

    He’s the best most over-rated 12 on the planet.

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  26. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    left right whatever – did he bang your wife or something?

    list of better 12’s please. current players.

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  27. RightNow (7,013 comments) says:

    Science or Science Fiction? AKA Engineers don’t believe in AGW:
    http://oss.sagepub.com/content/33/11/1477.full

    We agree with Hoffman (2011a, 2011b) that in order to understand this defense and resistance and to move forward with international policies, organizational researchers must gain more in-depth understanding of the subtleties of the contestation and unravel the whole spectrum of frames including those of climate change deniers and sceptics

    Ah – there’s that d-word. That makes the study authors unreliable and dishonest. They must have been really bummed the results didn’t match their preconceptions.

    the rise in disagreement may be a result of increased funding of sceptics by fossil fuel industries, conservative foundations and think tanks (McCright & Dunlap, 2010). Yet, apart from discussions among scientists, public concern over climate change is also waning in the US (Leiserowitz, Maibach & Roser-Renouf, 2008, 2010; Maibach, Leiserowitz, Roser-Renouf, & Mertz, 2011; Pew Research Center, 2009), the UK (Jowit, 2010), and Canada (Berry, Clarke, Pajot, Hutton, & Verret, 2009).

    Or it might be because the models have been falsified. And how ironic that all the papers they reference are outdated.

    Conclusion: sane people aren’t alarmed about global warming.

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  28. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    @ Joana
    Catherine Dealahunty [Voted #8 by the Green membership].

    It is not rocket science that Pakeha may be a minority by the late 21st century. It is to be hoped that tangata whenua will be the largest cultural grouping in their own country again. However all the demographic changes will be a change for the worst if Pakeha cannot come to terms with being a minority culture. Our attachment to Westminster democracy has been based on our majority status. Will we find to our horror that minorities in such a system are overruled and undermined? Will we react by supporting more truly equitable and culturally diverse methods of decisionmaking, based upon Te Tiriti, or will we build a fortress, clinging to wealth and power behind barbed wire and guard dogs?
    http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO0702/S00068.htm

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  29. RightNow (7,013 comments) says:

    GOVERNMENTS are squandering billions of dollars on “uneconomic” wind farms, according to a landmark study that undermines the case for Labor’s huge renewable energy subsidies.

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/billions-blown-away-on-wind-power-says-british-study/story-fn59niix-1226294168155

    It’s a rort – the taxpayer is funding the new crony clean energy industry billions. All it will lead to is massive increases in power prices and the carcasses of thousands of windmills and millions of birds littering the landscape.

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  30. Manolo (14,086 comments) says:

    Yes, more prohibitions,…yeah right: http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/8315829/Study-backs-ban-on-car-smoking

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  31. Manolo (14,086 comments) says:

    Maori wailing. Some koha from Lotto will go a long way to solve the “problem”: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10865953

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  32. Jack5 (5,167 comments) says:

    hj posted at 10.09:

    It is not rocket science that Pakeha may be a minority by the late 21st century. It is to be hoped that tangata whenua will be the largest cultural grouping in their own country again.

    It’s more complicated than that, HJ. Intermarriage means that Maori may be absorbed into a larger gene pool. Already Ngai Tahu is having to grant admission to the tribe’s blood book people with as little as one thirty-second Maori inheritance. (I think that’s one great-great-great grandparent).

    As for culture, Maori culture will find it increasingly hard to withstand a world culture with English the present lingua franca. TV, the Internet, tablets and smart phones, new communications systems to come, will make it difficult for all niche cultures to survive, let alone thrive.

    Our country may not be called New Zealand in 200 years, but it’s even more likely it won’t be called Aotearoa.

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  33. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    “Obviously your political approach is far more successful at getting what you want. What is it?”

    Bit busy making money to worry about trying to enforce my will on the great unwashed :D

    Maybe in 20 years when im cashed up and bored?

    The Rt Hon Dime?

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  34. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    February 7, 2013 – One of the more unique speeches delivered at this morning’s National Prayer Breakfast came from Dr. Benjamin S. Carson, a world-renowned pediatric neurosurgeon at Johns Hopkins Hospital. Taking the stage before President Barack Obama’s faith-filled address, Carson spoke for more than 25 minutes, tackling issues ranging from education to personal responsibility. His keynote, while predicated upon the theme of Jesus Christ as his ultimate role model, also took a starkly political tone, advocating against some of the very policies the president has implemented. At the beginning of his speech, Carson shared an intense disdain for political correctness. Without getting too specific on the issue front, he said that Americans should stop being afraid to speak up and defend their beliefs; he also encouraged people to respect the individuals they disagree with. Carson held little back, condemning political correctness as “a horrible thing” that is “dangerous,” as it hampers freedom of thought and expression.

    “We’ve reached a point where people are actually afraid to talk about what they want to say, because somebody might be offended,” Carson said, noting the example of people refraining from saying “Merry Christmas.” “We’ve got to get over this sensitivity and it keeps people from saying what they really believe.” Carson encouraged discussion about societal issues, also pointing out education as an essential conundrum the country needs to confront. He highlighted his own path from poverty to success, sharing very personal details about his parents and early family life and subsequently described the importance of helping students seeking to advance academically through his Carson Scholars Fund.

    The speech took an interesting turn when the doctor cautioned that moral decay and fiscal irresponsibility can have dire consequences — even for powerful countries like America. Here, he became even more pointed and impassioned.

    “I think particularly about ancient Rome. Very powerful — nobody could even challenge them militarily…they destroyed themselves from within,” Carson continued. “Moral decay. Fiscal irresponsibility.”

    http://www.brasschecktv.com/videos/health-and-medical-1/not-all-sermons-are-given-on-sunday.html

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  35. James Stephenson (2,234 comments) says:

    list of better 12′s please. current players.

    Anyone with a kicking game.

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  36. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    James – please list names of better number 12’s. Thanks

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  37. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    list of better 12′s please. current players.

    The overstayer playing for the poms for a kick-off.

    Is SBW straight?

    Every starting 12 in a NZ super rugby franchise.

    He’s probably over-rated in the sack too.

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  38. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    Like to see Mr Farrars reaction to this argument against GE food.

    Monsanto Corporation gets owned by 11 year old boy

    http://www.secretsofthefed.com/monsanto-corporation-gets-owned-by-11-year-old-boy-video/

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  39. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    Anyone with a kicking game.

    James… ve vont names and ve vont zem now now NOOOOOW!!!!

    Ziz does not end until zuch time aszuu geez uz za names!!

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  40. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    Jack5 (2,793) Says:
    February 18th, 2013 at 10:33 am
    hj posted at 10.09:
    ….

    hj not to be confused with Catherine Delahunty whose opinions are allowed on Frogblog

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  41. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    Intelligence and rugby fanaticism are inversely related.

    Just a theory.

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  42. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    Last year 547 people committed suicide in New Zealand.

    80 were in the 15/19 year old bracket.

    Predictably, the experts cite depression and bullying as major causes. (you may have been able to come
    up with depression as a cause yourself without the need for any major studies by academics.)

    i can’t see any referrence in the studies i looked at as to what percentage of the 80 teenagers were
    bullied because they were gay. i suspect that being bullied as a teenager and being gay may be linked
    in many of these cases.
    (maybe some study in the future may discover that. Maybe it’s not P.C. to mention for some reason)

    A couple of days ago i posted this song and for reasons beyond me it received thumbs down.

    Maybe it could be a good one to play in the odd high school assembly. Couldn’t do any harm.
    Might do some good.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP4clbHc4Xg

    There is also a version with lyrics.

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  43. Colville (2,300 comments) says:

    SBW will make a better 13 than a 12 when he comes back. A bit heavier and harder. Have the fast boys with the flash hair do’s running off his shoulder, not that he is exactly slow!

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  44. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    Glenn Beck now runs his own radio station and he has breaking news

    BREAKING OBAMA MAY GO TO PRISON AND BE IMPEACHED KILLING OUR OWN !
    Watch the rest here http://youtu.be/W196uHCVPQk
    or here http://youtu.be/zz5vc12EB-k

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  45. James Stephenson (2,234 comments) says:

    The overstayer playing for the poms for a kick-off.

    Brad Barritt, but the new kid Twelvetrees is better still.
    Jamie Roberts
    Gordon D’Arcy
    Robbie Fruen
    .
    .
    .

    SBW will make a better 13 than a 12 when he comes back.

    Meh. 13 is one position where the AB’s incumbent definitely is the best in the world.

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  46. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    “Every starting 12 in a NZ super rugby franchise.” – ok, so youre basically an idiot. noted.

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  47. backster (2,185 comments) says:

    H.J……….The problem can then be resolved by the Government establishing a highly paid Pakeha Tribunal consisting of a preponderance of Pakeha members and a number of token sympathetic Maori members who like baubles of office. Pakeha can then be defined as any person who has a person of European ancestry in the geneology dating back to Adam, and in certain circumstances can also include any person who has no such ancestral ties but feels Pakeha..The main historical matters to consider would be how many times Maori were paid for the same land and the rights of Pakeha to reclaim it.
    Mind youi the situation is unlikely to arise despite the incentive of the DPB. Muslims have a very high fertility rate but I foresee (and hope) that Asians are likely to be the majority race.

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  48. Lance (2,721 comments) says:

    @RightNow
    By all means attack the economic and real benefits of wind farms. But to repeat the horseshit on a stick drivel unloaded by the looney fringe of vast numbers of dead birds is a poor reinforcement to your argument.

    The ratio of wind turbine deaths of birds (new styles much less BTW) vs window strikes on buildings is 1:5820

    Leave the pathetic propaganda to the far left.

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  49. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_90eOj6iWXI

    here are the lyrics, might help the cretin who already gave it thumbs down.

    Now i give up.

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  50. Jack5 (5,167 comments) says:

    Joanna posted at 9.15:

    …During the weekend the Press printed a pathetic article titled..” Why I want to ban old , white men ,” by some old white woman who pretends to be a comedian…

    That damned ticking biological clock crazes some feminist journalists as they steam into Middle Age, Joanna.

    It’s surprising how some scribblers in the print media insult and ridicule this large section of their readership and potential readership, at the same time their bosses are worrying about their newspapers’ shrinking circulations.

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  51. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Just when you think there are not many chances for the human race – with the gene pool seemingly working against any hopes for the future of the race and the planet, someone like this beauty emerges…

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/8316713/Teen-thought-to-be-smarter-than-Einstein

    A false reading, proof that IQ testing is unreliable, or a reason not to discount taxi drivers?

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  52. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    ok, so youre basically an idiot. noted.

    and I’m also not some faggot fucktard lovely person that gives a shit about SBW. One of the most over-rated players in either code.

    Every other starting 12 in Super Rugby is better than him because they’re not deluded about wanting to be top pro boxers, they don’t play for a different team each year, and they concentrate on mastering their craft in their chosen code rather than a never-ending cycle of one year deals in multiple codes. I reckon he’ll try American Football soon. Why not?

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  53. Pete George (23,688 comments) says:

    I reckon he’ll try American Football soon. Why not?

    Who knows who will try and buy his services next, and who he would switch to.

    NZ First could be looking for a replacement MP but might not have deep enough pockets.

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  54. Jack5 (5,167 comments) says:

    hj – re your 11.23.

    My deep and sincere apologies for mistakenly attributing Delahunty’s ravings to you.

    If I had read your original 10.09 post on the topic correctly, I would have targeted Delahunty, and been far less polite.

    Thank you for reminding us what a dipstick Delahunty is.

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  55. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    CIA SPOOK: Anderson Cooper Confronted at CNN on Sandy Hook: ‘YOU WERE IN FRONT OF A GREEN SCREEN AND YOU ARE A LIAR’

    http://www.secretsofthefed.com/cia-spook-anderson-cooper-confronted-at-cnn-on-sandy-hook-you-were-in-front-of-a-green-screen-and-you-are-a-liar-video/

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  56. RightNow (7,013 comments) says:

    @ Lance, point taken, but it wasn’t an unrealistic statement. There’s over 200,000 wind turbines in operation around the world already (2011 figures – probably over 250,000 now), so at 4.something per turbine that’s a million per year.

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  57. Fletch (6,502 comments) says:

    hinamanu @11.37 –

    Another interview just come out saying that Ambassador Chris Stevens wasn’t aware of some of the stuff happening in Benghazu, re: gunrunning etc. Listen to the interview at link below –

    Here is Jack Murphy explaining:

    You have two major operations being run in Libya that were very compartmentalized and General Petraeus probably had very little if any visibility at all on [them]. One of them was the weapons transfer program, transferring weapons from Libyan stockpiles to Syria.

    But in a completely separate program from that, run by a different outfit, a different organization, was these direct action raids into Libya from a European airfield, flying – we’re talking boots on the ground, putting commandos on the ground who were hunting down one of the last big name Al-Qaeda personalities named Al-Suri, who was an Iranian facilitator, a money man for Al-Qaeda. They were definitely after him.

    And it was also about reclaiming some of these weapon stockpiles that the militias and the Al-Qaeda affiliated groups had claimed during the war. Now that the winds of politics have shifted we don’t want these groups to have access to large amounts of weapons, particularly dangerous surface-to-air missiles. So we’re going to go in and try and get those back.

    Now the problem was [Ambassador] Chris Stevens and the CIA did not know about that program, about those operations. So they had no ability, they had no situational awareness to go ahead and raise their security posture. They could not have anticipated that there would have been blowback from these operations because they had no idea they were happening.

    There’s much more in the interview below, including why Murphy says Stevens was kept in the dark on Brennan’s covert programs and the fact that the ‘consulate’ wasn’t even an official consulate, but rather ‘temporary mission facility’.

    http://www.therightscoop.com/ambassador-chris-stevens-didnt-have-to-die-in-benghazi-the-real-story-of-what-led-to-his-death/

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  58. Longknives (4,889 comments) says:

    Sonny Bill-
    Allegedly the “Greatest Cross Code Athlete of All Time” (according to Khoder Nasser).
    Allegedly the “Greatest Heavyweight since Ali” (according to Mundine)
    Allegedly the “Best 12 on the Planet” (According to Dime)

    Dime- You are in good company mate.

    SBW is the ‘Kardashian’ of the sports World. All hype but never actually does anything (remember the ‘World’s Greatest player’ sat on the bench looking pretty during the RWC finals)…

    Oh and Jamie Roberts would tear him to pieces….

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  59. Fletch (6,502 comments) says:

    Ps, you can buy Benghazi: The Definitive Report, for Kindle from Amazon for just $2.99 (it’s 75 pages).
    Most of the comments describe it as a real eye-opener.

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00AHCRRJS/ref=nosim/nationalreviewon

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  60. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    “Every other starting 12 in Super Rugby is better than him because they’re not deluded about wanting to be top pro boxers, they don’t play for a different team each year, and they concentrate on mastering their craft in their chosen code rather than a never-ending cycle of one year deals in multiple codes. I reckon he’ll try American Football soon. Why not?”

    not sure what his off field antics have to do with his on field achievements.

    but just so we are clear.

    Sir Graham Henry – wrong about SBW.
    Wayne Smith – wrong about SBW.
    Steve Hansen – wrong about SBW.
    Dave Rennie – wrong about SBW.
    Todd Blackadder – wrong about SBW.
    Aaron Mauger (another 12 Dime rated) – wrong about SBW.
    The French club who spent a ton of money – wrong about SBW.
    The Jap club that spent a ton of money – wrong about SBW.

    interesting theory you boys have.

    who cares if you dont like the guy. eg I think that Greg Bird is the biggest piece of shit in either code. cant deny he can play though.

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  61. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    “SBW is the ‘Kardashian’ of the sports World. All hype but never actually does anything (remember the ‘World’s Greatest player’ sat on the bench looking pretty during the RWC finals)…”

    and then in 2012 he was one of the keys to the chiefs winning the super rugby title and became our starting number 12…

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  62. Manolo (14,086 comments) says:

    Griffs in the US: http://thehill.com/blogs/e2-wire/e2-wire/283643-rally-of-35000-demands-obama-to-scrap-keystone-xl

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  63. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Manolo, Griff is our resident “climate justice” advocate (self appointed) and primitivist. Single handedly attempting to take us back to pre industrial times.

    I am unsure why this cult does not lead by example and refuse to use the products of the oil industry. They (BIG OIL) only make it because people like them use it.

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  64. Harriet (5,145 comments) says:

    …..A BEGINNERS GUIDE TO POSH ANTI-CAPITALISM.”

    “The next time you’re forced to attend a dinner party, keep an eye out for the global warmer. Then ask him what he thinks about supermarkets (wicked), ‘consumer society’ (soulless), world trade (cruel) and government regulation (more needed). Global warmers are, in short, anti-capitalist. But – and here’s the really important thing to understand – it’s a very specific form of anti-capitalism. We might call it posh anti-capitalism.

    “In the old days, when there was less swearing on TV and kids were scared of policemen, anti-capitalism was coloured Red. The Reds complained that capitalism would cause the ‘immiseration’ of the workers, and they dreamed of giant socialist factories, out-producing the West.

    “The tragedy (for the Reds) was that capitalism didn’t play ball. Instead of getting poorer, ordinary folk got richer – much, much richer. For the simple reason that capitalist mass production must necessarily go hand in hand with mass consumption. What the new-leftists call ‘consumer society’.

    “But these days, anti-capitalists are coloured Green. They campaign not in the name of the working class, but of ‘Earth’. Instead of giant factories, they dream of little handicraft workshops and organic peasant farms. They complain not that capitalism will impoverish the workers, but, on the contrary, that capitalism has made them too rich. It is the very success of capitalism that seems to upset them.”

    But the really annoying thing is this: these anti-capitalists are in fact fat cats who so very much enjoy the good life provided by capitalism. That they are not even aware of their own glaring hypocrisy in all this makes these guys even more pathetic. Says Durkin:

    “It is more than ironic that the anti-consumption rant comes from people who are, by global standards, rolling in the stuff and from a superior social class. Take a look at Al Gore and Prince Charles, at Jonathon Porritt, the old Etonian friend of Prince Charles, son of Lord Porritt; or the old Etonian Baron Lord Peter Melchett, former head of Greenpeace, or Ecologist editor Zac Goldsmith, another old Etonian, son of the billionaire James Goldsmith, and nephew of yet another old Etonian the Green guru Edward Goldsmith; or ‘eco-warrior’ Mark Brown, who was acquitted of leading the ‘Carnival Against Capitalism’, who is a member of the fabulously wealthy Vestey family; or the founder of the Soil Association Lady Eve Balfour, daughter of the Earl of Balfour; or the author of the Global Warming Survival Handbook, David de Rothschild, and so on, and on. Charles Secrett, former executive director of Friends of the Earth helpfully explains, ‘Among the aristocrats there is a sense of noblesse oblige … a feeling of stewardship towards the land.’

    “Brendan O’Neill says in The Guardian, ‘It is remarkable how many leading environmentalists come from wealthy or aristocratic backgrounds.’ And adds, ‘There is something irritating – actually, let’s not beat around the bush – there is something monumentally infuriating about rich people telling the masses that they should live more meekly.’ It seems that it is not any old consumption that upsets the Greens. It is mass consumption. The Green foodies don’t mind expensive organic free-range food, or hand-made cashmere sweaters, or costly Italian floor tiles. They don’t rail against posh cheese shops or vintners. The problem is not fine-art auction houses or Persian-rug sellers. The problem is mass production and consumption. Greens John Cavanagh and Jerry Mander deplore the vulgar bargain hunter for whom, ‘everyday low prices are the ultimate human conquest.’ The Green group Earth First went so far as to organise a ‘puke in’ in a shopping mall.

    “It is not exclusive, expensive delicatessens, but rather the wicked low-cost supermarkets frequented by everyday folk which they find repellent. It is a commonly heard complaint from Greens that things ‘aren’t expensive enough’. The ‘rebels’ down from Eton for the anti-globalisation rallies threw bricks through windows – but not the windows of high-class restaurants. Instead they smashed up and ransacked a working class MacDonalds when they marched down Piccadilly. It is not the luxurious Heals furniture shop that makes them angry, but the proletarian IKEA, with its affordable sofas and lamps.”

    Quite right. Durkin concludes this way: “The Green anti-consumption rant, though fashionable among the elite, does not go down big with the great unwashed. People who are experiencing wealth for the first time rarely think badly of it. The Greens always moan that the bulk of the population is unmoved by their silly warnings of impending catastrophe. Whether it’s global cooling or global warming or genetically modified ‘Frankenstein’ food, all the end-of-the-world stuff fails to grip the imagination of the masses. No surprise. They know that it’s all directed against them.

    “The Greens tell us that food should come from peasants rather than industrial farms. Chairs and tables should be produced, not in factories, but lovingly by skilled artisans. But as we all know, such antiquated, handicraft methods inevitably produce far fewer, more expensive goods. Handicraft production was what happened in that Green golden age before capitalist production, when the vast majority of people were grindingly poor – unable to afford such lovingly crafted, hand-made luxuries. These were the good old days, when everyone knew their place in the ‘natural order’.

    “Green anti-capitalism is Snob anti-capitalism. This is not mere name-calling. It goes to the very heart of what ‘Green’ is about.”

    Yea and amen. Between junk science and rank hypocrisy, these green elitists are doing a good job of showing us why the old socialism and the new environmentalism need to be avoided like the plague. These guys don’t really want to save the planet – they just want to save their well-heeled necks, and allow us plebs to go down the gurgler in the process.

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  65. Scott Chris (6,177 comments) says:

    Why the hell shouldn’t SBW to sell his services to the highest bidder? Isn’t that what most people do in a market economy? Why should the fact that he’s a sportsman (and an exceptionally gifted one at that) make him any different from, say, a CEO or even a teacher seeking to get paid what they’re worth? Lotta Tall Poppy cutters out there.

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  66. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Harriet, great post.

    I have asked, a couple of times, on KB what is the solution for AGW ?

    The only idea, was to tax rich countries and give the money to poorer ones. (though strangely this theory ONLY applies to rich predominately European countries being taxed). It was further suggested that this be enforced by a centralised global body. There is a name for this, Communism.

    The only solution I received for the issue of climate, was the enforced instillation of a political system. It is even more bizzare when you consider the appalling environmental history of socialist countries. It is almost as bad as their human rights records, and that is saying something.

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  67. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    bereal
    perhaps it might have more to do with you abusing the buggery out of everyone when your pissed rather than the current message you are putting up just perhaps

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  68. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Why the hell shouldn’t SBW to sell his services to the highest bidder

    I agree. The guy plays games for a living. Trivial games of no importance to anyone. Only a drooling idiot considers sport to be a serious matter.

    To test this theory, I suggest disbanding both the AB’s and rubbish collectors. Then measure the perceived importance among the surviving population in a years time. I think those that survived the plagues and diseases may have a better perspective on things.

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  69. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    i see my efforts @11.31 and @ 11.58 are harvesting plenty of thumbs down.
    oh well, i assume those cretins were the ones who lacked the stamina to sit
    through 10 secs of advt before the song and voted on the advert.

    Lets see if i can break my own record for thumbs down with this tip.

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  70. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    kea but theres not much relaxation on a friday night watching three garbos running up High Street. we need our bread and circus’ s

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  71. Stuart (41 comments) says:

    So disappointing, hearing a guy discussing with a woman in the supermarket how he would pay for her groceries with his card from WINZ, in exchange for a lesser amount of cash to go to the bottle store with.

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  72. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    O.K. Paul @ 2.28
    Thanks for the heads up.
    Maybe you have a point.
    i’ll try to refrain from posting after 9.30pm in future.

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  73. Pete George (23,688 comments) says:

    @PeterDunneMP

    Hosted function in Muscat (Oman) last night for local NZ community – Prosser a hot & angry topic of conversation

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  74. dime (10,137 comments) says:

    Stuart – what a piece of garbage eh

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  75. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    stuart
    seen the same with food stamps on a indian reservation rich dude in the corner of the shop paying fifty cents on the dollar so the seller could buy tobacco

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  76. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    Here is a detailed presentation on what is really in Agenda 21 and the sustainable development movement as defined by the UN. How it will ultimately compromise your property rights..

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  77. hinamanu (2,352 comments) says:

    Interesting….not one single budget has been passed in the US since Obama has been president according to Rand Paul

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=523004764409151&set=a.331477873561842.79943.330566470319649&type=1&theater

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  78. Fletch (6,502 comments) says:

    Great article, Harriet

    or the old Etonian Baron Lord Peter Melchett

    There’s really a Lord Melchett? :)

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  79. krazykiwi (9,186 comments) says:

    DOMINIC LAWSON: JUMPIN’ JACK FRACK – LET’S USE THAT GAS

    You would think that a bit of good news might come in handy right now and certainly for those whose job it is to keep the country from sliding deeper into insolvency — the government.

    Just over a week ago The Times reported that “Britain could have enough shale gas to heat every home for 1,500 years, according to new estimates that suggest reserves are 200 times greater than previously believed”.

    To be precise, the British Geological Survey is about to increase its official estimate of the amount lying untapped from the previous figure of 5.3 trillion cubic feet to between 1,300 and 1,700 trillion cubic feet. A lot.

    Yet the response of Ed Davey, the Liberal Democrat energy and climate change secretary, was to tell the newspaper: “It is not the golden goose. The experts are clear that they do not expect this to have a major impact on the gas price.”

    Which experts would these be?

    The ones at his department who had claimed we would be better off going flat out for wind and solar power because gas prices would only rise?

    And that billions spent by the taxpayer on subsidising renewables were therefore actually a way of saving money?

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  80. HB (328 comments) says:

    @Bereal

    they might like this one more as it is currently in the charts

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  81. Pete George (23,688 comments) says:

    Labour BBQ time today – Grant Robertson with some caucus colleagues: http://yournz.org/2013/02/18/labour-bbq/

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  82. HB (328 comments) says:

    the students I mean (not kiwiblog button pushers ;) )

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  83. Andrei (2,668 comments) says:

    Why are you posting slick propaganda HB?

    Only a fool would be taken in by that crap

    No baby has ever had two mommies -ever. That is a lie, L-I- E, lie!

    All babies have exactly one mother and one father and foolish liberals telling lies that say otherwie cannot make that otherwise.

    But fools who are suckers for propaganda might be able to convince themselves otherwise I suppose.

    No wonder this country is fucked – with a population of sheep so easily misled thay will go for any crap the elites want to sell them

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  84. HB (328 comments) says:

    it’s a song from the charts

    make your own band and sing a song yourself if you want

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  85. Andrei (2,668 comments) says:

    it’s a song from the charts

    don’t mean it aint crap, C-R-A-P – all that means is a lot of sheeple have been sucked in by its cheap sentiment and slick video editing

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  86. Pete George (23,688 comments) says:

    it’s a song from the hymn book

    don’t mean it aint crap, C-R-A-P – all that means is a lot of sheeple have been sucked in by its cheap sentiment

    (Crappiness is subjective, one person’s silk pursing of lips is another person’s sow’s earful).

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  87. HB (328 comments) says:

    Why are you posting sick propaganda Andrei?

    Only a fool would be taken in by that crap

    But fools who are suckers for propaganda might be able to convince themselves otherwise I suppose.

    No wonder this country is fucked – with a population of sheep so easily misled they will go for any crap the elites want to sell them

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  88. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    hinamanu (2,119) Says:

    oh shit! they want to save the planet and trample on my freedoms to fly my personal 747, build free ways to my private 10000 ton yacht!
    Scandalous!

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  89. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    “Whales were driven to the brink of extinction before petroleum replaced whale oil, and we may well fry our planet—and bankrupt ourselves while doing so—before we’re finally forced to kick the fossil fuel habit. It will be hard to muster the resources to develop replacements for fossil fuel energy if we wait until both the economy and climate are in ruins. We are in for a hard landing if we don’t use our current prosperity to pave the way for a secure energy and climate future.”
    http://mobile.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2013/02/u_s_shale_oil_are_we_headed_to_a_new_era_of_oil_abundance.html

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  90. Fletch (6,502 comments) says:

    (Crappiness is subjective, one person’s silk pursing of lips is another person’s sow’s earful)

    Even if every person believes something is good doesn’t mean it is the Truth.
    As Fulton Sheen once wrote –

    “Moral principles do not depend on a majority vote. Wrong is wrong, even if everybody is wrong. Right is right, even if nobody is right.”

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  91. graham (2,346 comments) says:

    Sounds like a discussion I had on Facebook. Someone posted one of those glib little sayings about “morality is doing what is right regardless of what you’re told …”. I asked, how do you define what is right? Your feelings about what is right concerning, say, capital punishment for murderers, or euthanasia, or assisted suicide, might be very different to someone else. Who is right, and who is wrong? The reply – “Society dictates right and wrong in this day and age.”

    I pointed out that, if society dictates what is right and wrong, does that make it automatically “moral”? As an example, the majority of the United States still have the Death Penalty. Many people consider it abhorrent to put someone to death, so who is right? “Society” – that is, those States that retain the Death Penalty – or an individual who considers it morally repugnant to put someone to death?

    Having to look beyond the glib little packaged saying was apparently too much, and the conversation ended there …

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  92. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    HB @ 4.07
    i appreciate that, as you point out this is a current song, but it’s a bit on the wishy washy side for
    me. No probleemo. Each to his own.

    i posted that Rise Again track because it was drawn to my attention by a long time friend of my son
    and she and that one track made me think.

    She is gay, i had no idea untill it cropped up in conversation recently and both of them were incredulous
    that i was unaware she is gay. Guess what, she doesn’t look gay. ( my son is straight for the record)
    they both just assumed that i knew she is because it was no secret. i didn’t know, i had never even thought about it.

    Among other things that she drew my attention to was how it can be very, very hard for kids who come to know
    that they are gay and that this band and this track was among others, one thing that had helped give her strength
    and hang on through some very dark times. She is now 20.

    Punk and heavy metal music appeal to plenty of kids.

    People can change, see the light maybe.
    i used to lean towards the Andrei type of view, but never as strident as he.
    It just was never such a big deal. ( i remember my late fathers one pronouncement on
    homosexual males, “They’re just weak”)
    i don’t think he ever gave the subject much thought because it wasn’t really an issue for him
    but of course he was wrong.

    Talking, to that girl in particular and listening to that song helped wake me up.
    i posted it because it may cause some other person to think.
    The predudices of a lifetime can be washed away in short order.

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  93. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    hj, here is some light reading:

    Unfortunately, the Cult of Warm doesn’t accept that there is a debate. As far as they are concerned, the debate never happened because it never needed to happen because they were always right. They can’t intelligently address dissent, because their science is not based on discovering the evidence needed to lead to a consensus, but on insisting that there is a consensus and that accordingly there is no need to debate the evidence.

    In an ordinary scientific debate, a professor leaving one side and joining another might occasion some recriminations and name calling, but it wouldn’t make him anathema. But like being gay or Muslim, hopping on board the Warm Train makes you a permanent member, and there is no room for changing your mind. Once a Warmist, always a Warmist. That’s not a rational position, but then the Cult of Warm is not a rational faith.

    The Warmists have pushed their agenda through with alarmist claims and hysteria. They have flown jets around the world to argue that everyone must be taxed for their carbon footprint. They have smeared and intimidated anyone who stood up to them. That is not the behavior of people arguing over numbers. It’s a battle of much larger ideas.

    If you believe that freedom is at the core of what it means to be human, then the Warmists and what they stand for are instinctively repulsive to you. On the other hand, if you believe that human society must be organized into a moral collective for the betterment of all, then the Warmist idea provides a wake up call compelling us to form into ranks and goose step in recycled rubber boots into the green future.

    It’s an exaggeration, but that’s what debates over the proper role of man tend to become. We don’t fight wars over temperature gradients. The passions on both sides are motivated by much larger issues. This isn’t science, it’s the continuing battle over industrialization, the modern society and the rights of the individual dressed up in the garb of theory. And just as a debate over the IQs of minorities will never be a dispassionate inquiry, neither will a debate over whether the world would be better off if we never existed– which is the theme of the environmentalist movement.

    http://www.siliconinvestor.com/readmsgs.aspx?subjectid=58317&msgnum=9933&batchsize=10&batchtype=Next

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  94. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    not sure what his off field antics have to do with his on field achievements.

    What on field achievements?

    All Blacks? Because he played such a pivotal role in their World Cup winning campaign, eh?

    round of 8 vs Argentina: 13-Conrad Smith, 12-Ma’a Nonu

    round of 4 vs Australia: 13-Conrad Smith, 12-Ma’a Nonu SBW comes on with 8 to play and runs around like a headless faggot before being yellow carded. Such limitless talent.

    final vs France: 13-Conrad Smith, 12-Ma’a Nonu

    And he’s played for… The Bulldogs, Toulon, Crusaders, Chiefs, Panasonic and now the Roosters. Aha. Even his fans will struggle to rattle off all the clubs soon. Have they paid out for all the different jerseys that the man has worn? That’s quite a wardrobe for his diehard fans that must have everything including SBW undies and socks.

    One of the keys to the Chiefs winning the title. Yes, well…. mmhmm… sure, ok. Great win for the Chiefs but let’s face it… they pipped a close NZ conference, what was that thrashing they gave the Crusaders *AT HOME* in the semi? Was that…. a three point hiding? Were there a lot of brown soiled seats in Hamilton at the final whistle? And then what? They were gifted a home final and what happened next? They smashed who? A fuckin visiting yarpie team. Because they’re about as tough as wet toilet tissue when they come to NZ eh. Cool.

    So… SBW helped the Chiefs win the annual 15-a-side touch footy. Could you say he helped the Crusaders lose in 2011?

    No player is bigger than the game man. And he’s not even that great. Yeah, I’ll just come back and take my rightful guaranteed place in the ABs world cup squad in 2015 that they keep warm for me. I don’t think so slut!!

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  95. wat dabney (3,814 comments) says:

    Sordid story of the EPA agreeing lawsuits from extreme activist groups, which it deliberately loses so they can go ahead with the draconian and expensive regulations they both want. And the taxpayer is left to pick up the legal bill for both parties.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/larrybell/2013/02/17/epas-secret-and-costly-sue-and-settle-collusion-with-environmental-organizations/

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  96. Colville (2,300 comments) says:

    LR and C
    Its amazing that he has managed to whore him self to sooo many teams for sooo much money and he is totally crap eh?
    That Nasser must be a great salesman!

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  97. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    From Keas linked rant

    Global Warming is not just a failure of a sizable chunk of the scientific establishment to put theory before ideology, it represents a failure of the entire process by which the West has been governed for a frightening number of years. It is a demonstration of how a handful of people in prominent positions can push through otherwise unacceptable measures by manufacturing a crisis and pipelining it through business and government. It’s a hack of our entire system of government.

    :lol:

    Global conspirorwhacky to rule the world- a manufactured crisis. Nut-job alert
    Who is the “handful of people in prominent positions? Obama the Un the national party University’s around the world are involved
    How have they sucked every one in?
    Other scientist have read the research and indorse it in every major scientific body in the world are all scientist that incompetent?
    All 33,690 of the writers of scientific papers that accept global warming are in on the hoax or just sucked in.
    24 of the 13,950 articles reject the view that we are experiencing human induced global warming.
    Is this your promised collapse in the myth?

    You are a fruitcake kea
    Conspiracy thinking :lol:

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  98. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    Beware of the post i reproduced @ 2.32 today. Unless i bought the wrong battery or Eveready already
    cottoned on to it its a con.
    The battery i bought (for $7) contained 4 large ones not 32 aa s as suggested.

    Sorry about that boss.

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  99. wat dabney (3,814 comments) says:

    24 of the 13,950 articles reject the view that we are experiencing human induced global warming.

    Oh dear Griff.

    You really are clueless aren’t you.

    The debate is about how much of the recent warming is due to anthropogenic CO2.

    Only someone lacking the first inkling about the issue would come out with such a howler.

    Isn’t that mummy calling? Tea’s ready.

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  100. Pete George (23,688 comments) says:

    Its amazing that he has managed to whore him self to sooo many teams for sooo much money and he is totally crap eh?
    That Nasser must be a great salesman!

    Especially as far as boxing goes, and there must be a lot of sucker customers.

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  101. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    I used to think Griff was sincere but mistaken. Now I am not so sure. He will not answer my simple questions.

    1. Who pays the climate scientists ?

    2. Would they have that money if AGW theory was proven false ?

    3. What is the AGW industry estimated to be worth Globally ? (to the nearest few trillion dollars)

    I wonder what the problem is? It is especially puzzling given his frequent comments about “funding” and scary stories about BIG OIL and the fictional “Carbon Industry”.

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  102. meh (165 comments) says:

    Ffs, now seven sharp are trying to spin the school closures as the beginning of a hidden agenda to close all intermediate schools. Long bow…

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  103. wat dabney (3,814 comments) says:

    Turns out that if you model the wrong thing you get the wrong answer. Garbage in, garbage out.

    According to our calculations, in the coming years, it should get warmer by leaps. But we do not trust that prognosis. Because the simulations should also have been able to predict the current standstill of the temperature increase – which did not happen.” That according to the climate researcher Jochen Marotzke of MPI-M in Hamburg…the Nobel Prize Laureate Paul J. Crutzen puts that to the point: “There is already so much CO2 in the atmosphere, that in many areas of the spectrum the absorption by CO2 is nearly complete, and additional CO2 does not play any role”…Computer models with freely variable parameters start with the premise that this [historical] small temperature increase is more the result of the greenhouse gas water vapor… This most important basis of all models can be shown as wrong….it is quite evident that there is no correlation between the atmospheric CO2 concentration and water evaporation. The latter does not depend on CO2 but on the water temperature. That, in turn, depends primarily on the screening by clouds which depends on the incoming cosmic radiation which varies with the rhythm of the solar magnetic field. This also explains why, without the action of IR-active trace gases there was both a Roman and Medieval climate optimum

    http://principia-scientific.org/supportnews/latest-news/128-the-climate-models-are-failing.html

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  104. UglyTruth (4,552 comments) says:

    Global conspirorwhacky to rule the world- a manufactured crisis. Nut-job alert

    Didn’t Operation Northwoods represent a manufactured crisis?
    Wouldn’t someone who ignored documented evidence of a planned conspiracy be described as a nut-job?

    http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/northwoods.html

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  105. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Wat, how much are you getting paid by BIG OIL ?

    Griff tells me every one who tells the truth about AGW is part of a global conspiracy and is bought off by BIG OIL. However I have yet to receive any payments. I was wondering if you had the number of the [chuckle] “Carbon Industry” head office. ? :)

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  106. nasska (11,823 comments) says:

    The good old days…..

    Ref: https://www.dropbox.com/s/pckj6nl4hzes1kv/The%20Old%20Days.jpg

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  107. wat dabney (3,814 comments) says:

    Kea,

    I’m still awaiting my first payment from big oil. It’s probably in the post.

    I wonder it if will be anything like the well-over one million bucks that arch-alarmist James Hansen has received for pedalling his shit?

    Nearer two million, actually.

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  108. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Of course Griff is lying about BIG OIL denying climate change.

    This is cut n’ pasted from ExxonMobile’s home page !

    “Managing climate change risks
    Our strategy to reduce greenhouse gas emissions is focused on increasing energy efficiency in the short term, implementing proven emission-reducing technologies in the near and medium term, and developing breakthrough, game-changing technologies for the long term. Technological innovation will play a central role in our ability to increase supply, improve efficiency, and reduce emissions. Approximately 90 percent of the greenhouse gas emissions generated by petroleum products are released when customers use our products, and the remaining 10 percent are generated by industry operations.1 Therefore, technology is also needed to reduce energy-related emissions by end users.”

    You see folks, there is no gain in them telling the truth about AGW. It will only hurt their public image and they will be portrayed as not caring for the environment. So they play along, because the world needs their product and demand is increasing all the time as more countries become richer. Wait until all those Chinese own cars ! Luckly there is more than enough oil for everyone, with some massive oil reserves found in the last 12 months.

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  109. Pete George (23,688 comments) says:

    Zac @95bFM: Is there room for MPs with homophobic views in the Labour Party?

    David Shearer: Oh look yes, absolutely, there are some…

    http://yournz.org/2013/02/18/shearer-absolutely-theres-room-for-mps-with-homophobic-views-in-labour/

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  110. Left Right and Centre (2,997 comments) says:

    from colville-

    LR and C
    Its amazing that he has managed to whore him self to sooo many teams for sooo much money and he is totally crap eh?
    That Nasser must be a great salesman!

    Can’t agree with totally crap. As converts go… he was just ok. Not brilliant. So-so. He’s got size and strength, height as his main selling points. Once you face a team like England or SA….. that’s nullified.

    Look at some of the other converts. Andrew Walker got my respect. He was awesome playing union. Some of them ‘get it’ straight away, and some of them have trouble adjusting. SBW always looked a bit of a fish out of water playing rugby. I expected the guy to be some kind of arse-whipping stromtrooping line-busting big D man mountain brutal unstoppable nose-snorting son-of-a-bitch. But…. he didn’t live up to that. He was kind of lame in the end. Storm in a teacup.

    Compare his skill level to say a Cory Jane. Really?

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  111. nasska (11,823 comments) says:

    Could this be air travel in the future?

    Attendant: Welcome aboard Jetstar, sir. May I see your ticket?

    Passenger: Sure.

    Attendant: You’re in seat 12B. That will be $5, please!

    Passenger: What for?

    Attendant: For telling you where to sit.

    Passenger: But I already knew where to sit.

    Attendant: Nevertheless, we are now charging a seat locator fee of $5. It’s the airline’s new policy.

    Passenger: That’s the craziest thing I ever heard. I won’t pay it.

    Attendant: Sir, do you want a seat on this flight, or not?

    Passenger: Yes, yes. All right, I’ll pay. But the airline is going to hear about this.

    Attendant: Thank you. My goodness, your carry-on bag looks heavy. Would you like me to stow it in the overhead compartment for you?

    Passenger: That would be great, thanks.

    Attendant: No problem. Up we go, and done! That will be $10, please.

    Passenger: What?

    Attendant: The airline now charges a $10 carry-on assistance fee.

    Passenger: This is extortion. I won’t stand for it.

    Attendant: Actually, you’re right, you can’t stand. You need to sit, and fasten your seat belt. We’re about to push back from the gate. But, first I need that $10.

    Passenger: No way!

    Attendant: Sir, if you don’t comply, I will be forced to call the air security officer. And you really don’t want me to do that.

    Passenger: Why not? Is he going to shoot me?

    Attendant: No, but there’s a $50 fee for calling security.

    Passenger: Oh, all right, here, take the $10. I can’t believe this.

    Attendant: Thank you for your cooperation, sir. Is there anything else I can do for you?

    Passenger: Yes. It’s stuffy in here, and my overhead fan doesn’t seem to work. Can you fix it?

    Attendant: Your overhead fan is not broken, sir. Just insert three twenty cent pieces into the overhead coin slot for the first five minutes.

    Passenger: The airline is charging me for cabin air?

    Attendant: Of course not, sir. Stagnant cabin air is provided free of charge. It’s the circulating air that costs 60 cents.

    Passenger: I don’t have any 20 cent pieces. Can you change a dollar?

    Attendant: Certainly, sir! Here you go!

    Passenger: But you’ve given me only four for my dollar.

    Attendant: Yes, there’s a change-making fee of 20 cents.

    Passenger: For cryin’ out loud. All I have left is a twenty cents? What the heck can I do with this?
    Attendant: Hang onto it. You’ll need it later for the lavatory.

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  112. chiz (1,164 comments) says:

    Judith:

    Just when you think there are not many chances for the human race – with the gene pool seemingly working against any hopes for the future of the race and the planet, someone like this beauty emerges…

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/8316713/Teen-thought-to-be-smarter-than-Einstein

    A false reading, proof that IQ testing is unreliable, or a reason not to discount taxi drivers?

    None of the above. This is sloppy journalism. IQ tests can sometimes give the wrong result but that isn’t the main problem with this story. Many people don’t realise that there are different IQ tests and that they all use different scales. Trying to compare an IQ obtained with one test to IQs obtained using another test is like comparing a temperature in Celsius to a temperature in Fahrenheit.

    The two main IQ tests are the Stanford-Binet and the WAIS. Scores on one are very similar to scores on the other and chances are that if you come across a claim that so-and-so has an IQ of X it was probably obtained using one of those two tests. However Mensa uses the Cattell test which gives quite different numbers. The girl in the article you linked to, Lauren Marbe, had a reported IQ of 161 on the Cattell test. This corresponds to 138 on the Stanford-Binet and 140 on the WAIS. So her IQ, using the scales that most people hear about, is actually about 138-140 which makes it lower than Bill Gates and Einstein etc.

    This story originated from the British media but they aren’t the only ones to make this mistake. Some time ago, TV3’s current affairs show had a story on a man who supposedly had the highest IQ in the country – except that it turned that they tested him with the Cattell test. When you converted it to the SB/WAIS it wasn’t so remarkable or rare. I tried pointing this out to TV3 but they never ran a correction.

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  113. Viking2 (11,579 comments) says:

    Monday, 18 February 2013

    Jihad seeker’s Allowance

    A controversial Muslim cleric who lives off benefits is urging his followers to also sponge off UK taxpayers by claiming their ‘Jihadseeker’s allowance’.

    Oh, the joy of living in multicultural Britain.

    But rest easy, it could never happen here.

    http://brendanslongblog.blogspot.co.nz/2013/02/jihad-seekers-allowance.html

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  114. Viking2 (11,579 comments) says:

    Europe by night.

    http://pc.blogspot.co.nz/2013/02/europe-by-night.html

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  115. Reid (16,638 comments) says:

    Chuck Hagel, President Obama’s Secretary of Defense nominee, is in trouble. Why? Because he famously said: “The Jewish lobby intimidates a lot of people up here… I’m not an Israeli senator. I’m a United States senator.”

    On Friday, forty allegedly American Senators blocked Hagel’s nomination with a filibuster. Their message was loud and clear: “We are not United States Senators. We are Israeli Senators.”

    Alan Hart, former lead BBC Mideast correspondent, expressed his disgust at the Israeli Senators’ vote on my radio show, Truth Jihad Radio, this Friday: “This is treason. Serving a foreign nation, rather than one’s own, is not just wrong – it is treasonous.”

    One of the traitors, Sen. Mike Lee (R-Israel), mentioned Israel sixteen times while grilling Hagel. Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Israel) mentioned Israel ten times. Altogether, Republican Senators mentioned Israel 64 times during their hostile cross-examination of Hagel. The war in Afghanistan – supposedly America’s most pressing military issue – was only mentioned four times.

    What would the world be like if the US wasn’t in the pockets of the Israelis?

    Who knows.

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  116. wat dabney (3,814 comments) says:

    “Truth Jihad Radio”

    Really, Reid?

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  117. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    “All 33,690 of the writers of scientific papers that accept global warming are in on the hoax or just sucked in”.

    Then the nut force start bleating about personality’s, what the fuck do they think science is? reality tv, a popularity contest ?

    33690 scientists Involved in the writing of 13950 articles in the scientific literature .

    Not Hansen Mann and Al fucking Gore.

    Just because denial revolves around a couple of dozen pr hacks , lawyers and the odd weirdo scientist does not mean climate science is as limited in the range of people involved. How can it be political do they think there is a test when you do your phd whether you vote left or right? scientist are the full range on the political spectrum.

    conspirwhacky :lol:

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  118. nasska (11,823 comments) says:

    Reid

    Biased views are certainly not the sole preserve of senators sympathetic to the Israeli cause. The interviewing host was part of Truth Jihad Radio whose mission statement is “exposing the 911 lies.

    Somehow I would find any opinions expressed via this medium to be a little sus.

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  119. chiz (1,164 comments) says:

    Obviously with a title like that Wat the show is promoting a jihad against truth and this is why Reid is citing it.

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  120. nasska (11,823 comments) says:

    Griff

    Universities throughout the Western world are hotbeds of liberal/socialist thinking. It wouldn’t be totally necessary to be a card carrying socialist to get a PhD but it would make it somewhat easier.

    For what it’s worth my bitch about the AGW scam is how it has been hijacked by ‘world government’ types who are using the fear that has been generated in order to further their cause.

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  121. Reid (16,638 comments) says:

    So….

    The US isn’t in Israel’s pocket?

    Really?

    Where have you guys been?

    Are you blind?

    Are you deaf?

    Can’t you read?

    Or is it because since it’s [apparently] the “land of the free and the home of the brave,” you just don’t want to believe what’s a very, extremely, drop-dead, self-evident, fact?

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  122. nasska (11,823 comments) says:

    chiz

    I don’t think there’d be much danger of balance or honesty being found close to media outfit that has “jihad” in its name. :)

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  123. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    Lay Off Real estate Agents!

    Last week, after select committee hearings on the new real estate agent legislation, he was up to his same old tricks. However, United Future leader, Peter (Smokey) Dunne, (who calls himself Mr Common Sense) played a card not many expected :snort: [o.k :snigger: } :roll:
    In a release which has probably gone unreported, he says the United Future party “will withdraw its support for the Real Estate Agents Bill…unless there are major changes to the legislation and the sponsoring minister, Clayton Cosgrove, adopts a more consultative attitude.”
    http://landlords1.wordpress.com/
    ……

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  124. chiz (1,164 comments) says:

    Hinamanu:

    Like to see Mr Farrars reaction to this argument against GE food.

    Monsanto Corporation gets owned by 11 year old boy

    http://www.secretsofthefed.com/monsanto-corporation-gets-owned-by-11-year-old-boy-video/

    In what way do Monsanto get owned? The boy is fairly gullible and is, obviously, repeating propaganda.

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  125. nasska (11,823 comments) says:

    Reid

    The USA will be influenced by politicians sympathetic to Israel but its not run by them. Israel is well represented but the same could be said for religious groups & unions.

    They are but one part of the various factions that govern the USA.

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  126. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    All bullshitting aside.

    We are all lucky to live in an age where we can see such a prime physical specimen and superb all round athlete
    as Sonny Bill Williams.

    Of course everyone has some flaws, you could argue that Mundine and islam didn’t t do him much good, but
    you could equally argue that that was the making of him. (Whatever it was, something made him, mentally and physically.)

    But you would have to go on a hard days ride to find
    any all round athlete from New Zealand in any age you could compare with him.
    Who would argue with that ?

    And guess what.
    His best may be still to come.

    You have to ask, why do so many of his countrymen go out of their way to put him down ?

    Next poster to put him down, ask yourself, “Why”

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  127. Reid (16,638 comments) says:

    They are but one part of the various factions that govern the USA.

    nasska that’s obviously what you believe but I’m afraid you’re not correct and you should look more closely into the reality. http://www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n06/john-mearsheimer/the-israel-lobby for example.

    This got those guys fired. I imagine if you googled “John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt” you’d probably get several million “debunker” hits. This should also tell you something, if you know what you’re looking at.

    On October 3, 2001, I.A.P. News reported that according to Israel Radio (in Hebrew) Kol Yisrael an acrimonious argument erupted during the Israeli cabinet weekly session last week between Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and his foreign Minister Shimon Peres. Peres warned Sharon that refusing to heed incessant American requests for a cease-fire with the Palestinians would endanger Israeli interests and “turn the US against us. “Sharon reportedly yelled at Peres, saying “don’t worry about American pressure, we the Jewish people control America.”

    Fact is, none of this should be “news” to anyone. It shouldn’t shock you, or even give you pause for thought. If you haven’t already realised and assimilated this as a fact of life which has been in existence for decades, then one is extremely ill-informed about basic global political reality.

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  128. nasska (11,823 comments) says:

    Reid

    I concede that Israel ii influence within the important financial sector is disproportionate to its size or the numbers of those USA citizens with Jewish backgrounds. They are still only one relatively small part of the jigsaw that is political America.

    It would seem that Sharon was having a “dinnerjacket” moment of madness.

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  129. Fletch (6,502 comments) says:

    What would the world be like if the US wasn’t in the pockets of the Israelis?

    Reid, Senator Lindsey Graham called Hagel on his Israel comments, asking him to name one person who has been intimidated by the so-called “Israeli lobby” or one thing the the U.S had been goaded or led into doing by the Jewish lobby.

    Hagel couldn’t come up with anything there, either, and was made to look incredibly stupid.

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  130. UglyTruth (4,552 comments) says:

    Obviously with a title like that Wat the show is promoting a jihad against truth and this is why Reid is citing it.

    You would have to expect prejudice against the site in any could with links to the Westminster system. Validation of the gospel of Barnabus as described on truthjihad means the end of Pauline Christianity.

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  131. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    I am not interested in the political solutions . Nor am I any friend of the whacky* side of the right wing conservative moment.

    We will need to acknowledge that it will have a significant effect to plan sensibly for the warmer future.
    If the right wing continues to allow the green party to dominate the debate over global warming they will continue to lose votes to the greens and other alternatives. If New Zealand is seen to do nothing on limiting carbon it will effect our trade

    The science is not the politics or the proposed national and global solutions.

    * Used to refer to those who unquestioningly accept and repeat right-wing propaganda no matter how outrageous or unbelievable.
    As opposed to normal conservatives who have relatively independent minds–those few that remain.

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  132. Reid (16,638 comments) says:

    Hagel couldn’t come up with anything there, either, and was made to look incredibly stupid.

    So on the strength of that Fletch you don’t think AIPAC exerts influence? BTW, did it occur to you that if Hagel did start listing them he opens himself up to strawmen attack? Which is to say the least unseemly during a confirmation hearing.

    I concede that Israel ii influence within the important financial sector is disproportionate to its size or the numbers of those USA citizens with Jewish backgrounds. They are still only one relatively small part of the jigsaw that is political America.

    nasska the bankers are but one tiny fragment and Sharon wasn’t having a senior moment. The real powerful players in the political field are the Israel-first Hollyweird people and the Israel-first US media owners. Because they influence. They decide which stories get run and the angles that are taken and more importantly, which stories don’t ever get a look in. Plus then you have the AIPAC PAC. I trust I don’t need to explicate them. Taken altogether, they distorts US politics beyond all recognition. They’re not the only malevolent influence in US politics, don’t get me wrong. But they’re there, they’re significant and they are malevolent.

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  133. UglyTruth (4,552 comments) says:

    Griff, what reason is there to think that your prediction of a warmer future is accurate, given that there has not been any statistically significant warming since the nineties?

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  134. Fletch (6,502 comments) says:

    Sorry, Reid. Hagel has his chance and he had nothing. Still doesn’t. Just another example of prejudicial liberal bluster, not to mention anti-Semitism. And you’re saying Hollywood is Israel-first??? Really?!

    Have you heard what these liberal Hollywood types have to say whenever there’s an Arab-Israeli conflict?
    They rarely stand behind Israel, if ever. They’re all for Palestine and talk about how Israel has to concede this, and Israel has to concede that.

    You’re living in Bizarro-world.

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  135. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    Do you understand the term statistically significant ?
    because 90% of the increase in temperature is in the oceans.
    http://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-maps/indicators/ocean-heat-content/assessment

    Also because of the warming signal that remains when you take out natural variability

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  136. Reid (16,638 comments) says:

    And you’re saying Hollywood is Israel-first??? Really?!

    I’m not a liberal Fletch, you should know that. And when was the last time you saw an Arab or a Muslim portrayed positively in a Hollyweird production?

    It’s also not anti-Semitic to criticise Israel. It’s a country Fletch. It does things. Why does the fact it’s populated with Jews make it invulnerable to criticism same as we criticise Iran, Syria, Indonesia, Somalia or any other country?

    Wake up. You’re living in a childish fantasy populated with good-guys and bad-guys that Hollyweird has painted for you. Start thinking.

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  137. chiz (1,164 comments) says:

    And when was the last time you saw an Arab or a Muslim portrayed positively in a Hollyweird production?

    Don’t watch many movies or TV shows do you? “Syriana” and “24” both come to mind, there have been many others.

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  138. UglyTruth (4,552 comments) says:

    Griff, I know what it means in terms of sigma levels.

    Your NASA/GISS data has been adjusted to show a warming trend.

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/01/18/hansens-nasa-giss-cooling-the-past-warming-the-present/

    Also, your ocean data shows suspiciously low error levels.

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/04/23/an-ocean-of-overconfidence/

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  139. RightNow (7,013 comments) says:

    You keep flushing but the turd still floats around in the bowl.

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  140. axeman (252 comments) says:

    OMG I see gwiff, the ALARMISTS’ useful idiot, is still a lying turd. His level of argument is still the one presented by the other CAGW cultists. The headcount fallacy and appeal to authority. They still haven’t worked out that, as Einstein said, it only takes one to prove them wrong. And there are many who are doing it, even this year.

    Here is a summary (AGAIN) of just a few of the 1100+ peer reviewed sceptical climate science papers listed at http://www.populartechnology.net/2009/10/peer-reviewed-papers-supporting.html?m=1 (AGAIN!)
    including how/why they are in agreement as to the so-called “settled” climate science.

    Lindzen and Choi in, “On the Observational Determination of Climate Sensitivity and Its Implications” (Asia-Pacific Journal of Atmospheric Sciences, Volume 47, Number 4, pp. 377-390, August 2011) conclude “the models are exaggerating climate sensitivity”.

    Fred Singer in, “Lack of Consistency Between Modeled and Observed Temperature Trends” (Energy & Environment, Volume 22, Number 4, pp. 375-406, June 2011) concludes that the models have failed in that their predictions do not accord with observed temperatures and also that this failure means that the theory of AGW is not supported by evidence.

    Large and Yeager in, “On the Observed Trends and Changes in Global Sea Surface Temperature and Air-Sea Heat Fluxes” (1984-2006) (Journal of Climate, 2012) conclude that “natural variability, rather than long-term climate change, dominates the SST and heat flux changes over” the period from 1984-2006.

    Kramm and Dlugi in, “Scrutinizing the atmospheric greenhouse effect and its climatic impact” (Natural Science, Volume 3, Number 12, pp. 971-998, December 2011) conclude that “atmospheric greenhouse effect and especially its climatic impact are based on meritless conjectures” (Particularly like the last two words).

    Zhaoa in, “Is Global Warming Mainly Due to Anthropogenic Greenhouse Gas Emissions?” (Energy Sources, Volume 33, Issue 21, pp. 1985-1992, August 2011) concludes that “we find little evidence in support of the notion that recent global warming is mainly due to CO2 emissions”.

    Paterson in, “Global Warming: A Critique of the Anthropogenic Model and its Consequences” (Geoscience Canada, Volume 38, Number 1, pp. 41-48, March 2011) concludes that “contrary arguments by a growing body of scientists are generally supported by better empirical data than those that favour the ‘anthropogenic warming’ hypothesis” and “the global warming models used by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) and others have in some cases been shown to be incorrect and contrary to current temperature statistics. For these and other reasons, the CO2-driven, anthropogenic warming hypothesis is regarded by many as suspect and lacking in empirical evidence”.

    Meyssignac, Salas y Melia, Becker, Llovel and Cazenave in “Tropical Pacific spatial trend patterns in observed sea level: internal variability and/or anthropogenic signature?” (Climate of the Past Discussions, Volume 8, Issue 1, pp.349-389, January 2012) conclude that “sea level trend fluctuations are dominated by the internal variability of the ocean–atmosphere coupled system” and “any influence of anthropogenic forcing is still hardly detectable”.

    Huston and Dean in “Sea-Level Acceleration Based on U.S. Tide Gauges and Extensions of Previous Global-Gauge Analyses” (Journal of Coastal Research, Volume 27, Issue 4, pp. 788–790, July 2011) ran sea level measurements for acceleration (given acceleration is such an important part of the dangerous sea level forecasts (current sea level trends would only produce a rise of 150mm over 100 years) and obtained not accelerations but rather “small sea-level decelerations”.

    Nils-Axel Mörner in “Sea Level Changes and Tsunamis, Environmental Stress and Migration Overseas. The Case of the Maldives and Sri Lanka” (Internationales Asienforum, Volume 38, Number 3-4, pp. 353–374, November 2007) found that, “The predominant view of a rapid rise in sea level seems no longer tenable, and no signs of any ongoing sea level rise were found in the Maldives”.

    Callaghan and Power in “Variability and decline in the number of severe tropical cyclones making land-fall over eastern Australia since the late nineteenth century” (Climate Dynamics, Volume 37, Numbers 3-4, pp. 647-662, August 2011) found that, rather than increase, as the alarmists would have us believe, the number of tropical cyclones (TCs) on the east cost of Aust has very significantly decreased over the past 100 yrs, e.g. “The linear trend in the number of severe TCs making land-fall over eastern Australia declined from about 0.45 TCs/year in the early 1870s to about 0.17 TCs/year in recent times—a 62% decline. The extent to which global warming might be also be partially responsible for the decline in land-falls—if it is at all—is unknown”.

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  141. axeman (252 comments) says:

    (AGAIN) This year already there are more (including GEOLOGISTS, EARTH SCIENTISTS, METEOROLISTS and CLIMATE SCIENTISTS) calling bullshit on the ALARMIST hoax
    From Germany and the contradictory reports of global warming are falling all over each other.
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/01/21/major-german-daily-front-page-headline-global-warming-keeps-us-waiting-co2-over-estimated/

    Even the German people are sick of the CAGW bullshit.
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/01/05/barometer-for-measuring-german-public-interest-in-climate-protection-sets-record-low/

    A veteran German meteorologist Dr. Wolfgang Thüne ‘s harsh criticism at alarmist science. Climate Science “A Fairy Tale That’s Rich In Fantasy…Spook Watching”
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/01/17/veteran-german-meteorologist-calls-climate-science-a-fairy-tale-thats-rich-in-fantasy-spook-watching/

    Professor Fritz Vahrenholt http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/9338939/Global-warming-second-thoughts-of-an-environmentalist.html tells us to prepare for a long phase of temperature stagnation
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/01/24/prof-fritz-vahrenholt-ohc-tells-us-to-prepare-for-a-long-period-of-temperature-stagnation/

    The UK Met Office – prominent cheerleader for global warming alarmism – has (very quietly) completely scrapped its prediction of warming and is now predicting flat temperatures for the next decade.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2259934/DAILY-MAIL-COMMENT-Global-warming-inconvenient-truth.html

    View the old and the new charts together (lower down the page someone has created a blink gif overlay.) The difference is staggering.
    http://tallbloke.wordpress.com/2013/01/05/major-change-in-uk-met-office-global-warming-forecast/

    The Met Office has tacitly conceded that the sceptics are correct.
    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100197657/the-met-office-defending-the-indefensible-as-per-usual/

    Climate watch: 2012 figures confirm global warming still stalled
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/01/16/2012_temperature_figures/

    The New York Times admits the global warming gig is up
    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100197832/now-even-pravda-admits-the-global-warming-jig-is-up/

    And back to Germany. No increasing in temperatures for 15 years
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/01/16/european-climate-institute-climate-in-germanys-has-been-cooling-for-15-years/

    MORE SIGNS THAT GLOBAL WARMING IS JUST HOT AIR
    http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/373396

    New estimates from a Norwegian research project shows Earth’s Global Warming less severe than feared
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-01-27/norway-data-shows-earth-s-global-warming-less-severe-than-feared.html

    A University of Oslo professor, Ole Humlum, recently remarked an odd phenomenon and revealed the newest climate scandal. Apparently, since 2008 some research institutions have been retrospectively correcting their global temperature graphs. Usually, this would not be strange at all, as scientific information tends to be built up piece-by-piece and may have to be rectified at a later stage. It is, however, extremely strange that data from 1915 has also been touched-up. Temperature data from the beginning of the 20th century has been systematically rounded down, while later data has been rounded up respectively. Data seems to have been forced to obey the greenhouse theory, and suddenly it seems like the graphs confirm the desired hypotheses.
    http://www.climate4you.com/

    Award-Winning Dr. Lennart Bengtsson, formerly of UN IPCC: “We Are Creating Great Anxiety Without It Being Justified…there are no indications that the warming is so severe that we need to panic.”
    http://www.climatedepot.com/a/19508/Top-Swedish-Climate-Scientist-Says-Warming-Not-Noticeable-The-warming-we-have-had-last-a-100-years-is-so-small-that-if-we-didnt-have-climatologists-to-measure-it-we-wouldnt-have-noticed-it-at-all

    The game is really up for them!
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/02/01/staggering-admission-by-james-annan-high-climate-sensitivity-increasingly-untenable/

    With no warming now for 17 years against all modelled predictions, alarmists all of a sudden realise they predicted a pause all along!
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/02/04/temperature-stagnation-suddenly-being-discovered-in-climate-models-erred-scientists-desperately-clinging/

    They just keep coming……
    http://notrickszone.com/2013/02/05/four-top-swedish-climate-scientists-publish-critical-letter-slamming-potsdam-institute-climate-alarmism/
    One more climate alarmist retracts

    2004: Warmist scientist Peter Cox says global warming will destroy Amazonian rainforests:
    DR PETER COX (Hadley Centre, Met Office): … If we don’t do anything by about twenty thirty we could have a global warming of exceeding two degrees… 2040 it could be four degrees warmer, the climate change could have led to big drying particularly in the Amazon Basin, that would make the forest unsustainable, we’d expect the forest to catch fire probably, turn into savannah and maybe ultimately even desert if it gets really really dry as our model suggests.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sn/tvradio/programmes/horizon/dimming_trans.shtml

    2013: Warmist scientist Peter Cox says global warming will help Amazonian rainforests:
    The Amazon rainforest is less vulnerable to die off because of global warming than widely believed because the greenhouse gas carbon dioxide also acts as an airborne fertilizer, a study showed on Wednesday.

    The boost to growth from CO2, the main gas from burning fossil fuels blamed for causing climate change, was likely to exceed damaging effects of rising temperatures this century such as drought, it said.

    “I am no longer so worried about a catastrophic die-back due to CO2-induced climate change,” Professor Peter Cox of the University of Exeter in England told Reuters of the study he led in the journal Nature. “In that sense it’s good news.”…

    “CO2 fertilization will beat the negative effect of climate change so that forests will continue to accumulate carbon throughout the 21st century,” Cox said of the findings with other British-based researchers.
    http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/06/us-climate-amazon-idUSBRE91510O20130206

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  142. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    Yesssss. More spin
    The temperature record has been adjusted . :lol:

    According to the denial sphere it is a giant con and they adjust the record to make it look warmer .

    Get a life mate.
    There is half a dozen temperature records using different methods and they correlate very well .
    A Watts has been claiming that the record is incorrect for years He said he would accept the result of the BEST temperature record. Surprise! surprise! it came out the same so now he claims that one is corrupt as well.
    Denial means not looking at all the evidence just that which backs you view. The adjustments are published with reference to the reasoning behind them

    If the record is incorrectly adjusted.

    Write a paper with your adjustments and reasoning get it published so other scientists can examine your work ..science..

    Publish your failed paper on a blog site along with loads of bullshit stories from the denial echo chamber. that’s called ..Whacky..

    And before you start about the conspirowhacky of peer review.
    A Watts paper failed because he did not account for changes in the time the readings are taken.
    This effect has been known about for years and must be accounted for when compiling temperature records.
    As do movements in stations and different methods of recording temperatures.

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  143. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    Yesssss. More spin
    The temperature record has been adjusted . :lol:
    My ocean heat graph is wrong the error bars are to small. Beeep I did not use the data set you linked to on WUWT FAIL

    According to the denial sphere it is a giant con and they adjust the record to make it look warmer .

    Get a life mate.
    There is half a dozen temperature records using different methods and they correlate very well .
    A Watts has been claiming that the record is incorrect for years He said he would accept the result of the BEST temperature record. Surprise! surprise! it came out the same so now he claims that one is corrupt as well.
    Denial means not looking at all the evidence just that which backs you view. The adjustments are published with reference to the reasoning behind them

    If the record is incorrectly adjusted.

    Write a paper with your adjustments and reasoning get it published so other scientists can examine your work ..science..

    Publish your failed paper on a blog site along with loads of bullshit stories from the denial echo chamber. that’s called ..Whacky..

    And before you start about the conspirowhacky of peer review.
    A Watts paper failed because he did not account for changes in the time the readings are taken.
    This effect has been known about for years and must be accounted for when compiling temperature records.
    As do movements in stations and different methods of recording temperatures.

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  144. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    OMG I see gwiff, the ALARMISTS’ useful idiot, is still a lying turd. His level of argument is still the one presented by the other CAGW cultists. The headcount fallacy and appeal to authority. They still haven’t worked out that, as Einstein said, it only takes one to prove them wrong. And there are many who are doing it, even this year.

    Lets examine axenuckles little rant

    “The alarmist”
    If you support the consensus of science you are called an alarmist.
    Alarm would be if I posted fringe views and bleated on about tipping points.
    Not telling the same story as the notoriously conservative IPCC.

    “useful idiot”
    try to place the main stream view of climate science as manipulated .Conspiracy thinking

    other CAGW cultists
    The cult is the one supported by the the scientific community governments and ngo’s worldwide.
    His view is supported by a small group of very vocal dissenters in political and media forums.

    “The headcount fallacy and appeal to authority”
    You are perverting the logic
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority
    “either the authority is not a subject-matter expert, or there is no consensus among experts in the subject matter,”
    The experts in climate science are the climate scientists.
    What level of consensus do you require. over 75% 80% 97%? —97 percent—-As for published climate scientists?
    Experts on science in general such as the royal academy Or the national institute?

    ” They still haven’t worked out that, as Einstein said, it only takes one to prove them wrong”
    This is an appeal to authority logic fail The fact is the overwhelming number of papers that support global warming totally dominate the pitiful echos on the denial sphere.

    And there are many who are doing it, even this year.
    Are there ? I have not seen any over riding research that does anything to overwhelm the consensus view.
    Seems that The ipcc report will have the consensus view of climate for the coming years.

    :lol: the dreaded IPCC whoooo bogie man.

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  145. axeman (252 comments) says:

    So if it is peer-reviewed it must be true gwiffucknuckle? You being the ALARMISTS’ useful idiot you always claim that their science is better than anyone else’s because they have had peer-reviewed papers published.
    So what about the latest peer reviewed paper (as RightNow posted earlier on) http://oss.sagepub.com/content/33/11/1477.full

    It is becoming clear that not only do many scientists dispute the asserted global warming crisis, but these skeptical scientists may indeed form a scientific consensus.

    Don’t look now, but maybe a scientific consensus exists concerning global warming after all. Only 36 percent of geoscientists and engineers believe that humans are creating a global warming crisis, according to a survey reported in the peer-reviewed Organization Studies. By contrast, a strong majority of the 1,077 respondents believe that nature is the primary cause of recent global warming and/or that future global warming will not be a very serious problem.

    The survey results show geoscientists (also known as earth scientists) and engineers hold similar views as meteorologists. Two recent surveys of meteorologists (summarized here and here) revealed similar skepticism of alarmist global warming claims.

    According to the newly published survey of geoscientists and engineers, merely 36 percent of respondents fit the “Comply with Kyoto” model. The scientists in this group “express the strong belief that climate change is happening, that it is not a normal cycle of nature, and humans are the main or central cause.”

    The authors of the survey report, however, note that the overwhelming majority of scientists fall within four other models, each of which is skeptical of alarmist global warming claims.

    The survey finds that 24 percent of the scientist respondents fit the “Nature Is Overwhelming” model. “In their diagnostic framing, they believe that changes to the climate are natural, normal cycles of the Earth.” Moreover, “they strongly disagree that climate change poses any significant public risk and see no impact on their personal lives.”

    Another group of scientists fit the “Fatalists” model. These scientists, comprising 17 percent of the respondents, “diagnose climate change as both human- and naturally caused. ‘Fatalists’ consider climate change to be a smaller public risk with little impact on their personal life. They are skeptical that the scientific debate is settled regarding the IPCC modeling.” These scientists are likely to ask, “How can anyone take action if research is biased?”

    One interesting aspect of this new survey is the unmistakably alarmist bent of the survey takers. They frequently use terms such as “denier” to describe scientists who are skeptical of an asserted global warming crisis, and they refer to skeptical scientists as “speaking against climate science” rather than “speaking against asserted climate projections.” Accordingly, alarmists will have a hard time arguing the survey is biased or somehow connected to the ‘vast right-wing climate denial machine.’

    Another interesting aspect of this new survey is that it reports on the beliefs of scientists themselves rather than bureaucrats who often publish alarmist statements without polling their member scientists. We now have meteorologists, geoscientists and engineers all reporting that they are skeptics of an ASSERTED GLOBAL WARMING CRISIS, yet the bureaucrats of these organizations frequently suck up to the media and suck up to government grant providers by trying to tell us the opposite of what their scientist members actually believe.

    People who look behind the self-serving statements by global warming alarmists about an alleged “consensus” have always known that no such alarmist consensus exists among scientists. Now that we have access to hard surveys of scientists themselves, it is becoming clear that not only do many scientists dispute the asserted global warming crisis, but these skeptical scientists may indeed form a scientific consensus.

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  146. bereal (3,137 comments) says:

    Once upon a time this GD blog became to be known as the philu forum

    Now it seems to have become the Griff forum.

    come back philu. All is forgiven.

    at least philu had a semblance of a brain.
    And had the ability to discourse on more than one single subject,

    Hey Griff, fuck off for a while. Do yourself a favour.

    You must be the most boring drong ever to post on this blog.

    Take a rest. A well earned rest
    Please.
    Make it a long while.

    You made me break my resolution to not post after 9.30
    But one can only take so much mindless drivel.

    Please.

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  147. axeman (252 comments) says:

    ” They still haven’t worked out that, as Einstein said, it only takes one to prove them wrong”
    This is an appeal to authority logic fail The fact is the overwhelming number of papers that support global warming totally dominate the pitiful echos on the denial sphere.

    No you have the logic fail. From one of the all time greatest scientists, Albert Einstein: “It matters not how many experiments prove me right, it only takes one to prove me wrong.”

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  148. Griff (8,203 comments) says:

    Yes bereal I have how many arguing with me
    I react check it out go to the start of the day and see were people have summoned their own personal demon :twisted:
    then apologize for blaming me for the climate posts when I run about a quarter of the posts.

    Or is it be-real you dont like my message
    so dont actually read or understand my arguments.

    Axe nuckle
    the engineers you refer to are working for the oil industry
    You have posted James Taylor from heartland.
    do go to the source of you story http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2013/02/13/peer-reviewed-survey-finds-majority-of-scientists-skeptical-of-global-warming-crisis/?commentId=comment_blogAndPostId/blog/comment/1363-1219-5279 and read the comments.
    the writer of the paper replies to james bullshit :lol:

    http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2013/02/15/denialism-from-forbes-courtesy-of-heartland-hack-james-taylor/

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  149. big bruv (14,165 comments) says:

    I cannot believe some of the crap written here about SBW. One moron even went as far as to suggest “But you would have to go on a hard days ride to find any all round athlete from New Zealand in any age you could compare with him.”

    Now before the likes of Beral wet their pants it should be pointed out that there are plenty of examples of Rugby players becoming top League players, what the highly over rated (and as thick as pig shit) SBW has done is nothing special. I do hope that the SBW lovers are not suggesting that SBW is special just because he has won a few fixed boxing bouts.

    As for better all round athlete’s, well Jeff Wilson springs to mind, as does the late Eric Tindall. In fact if you go back one generation it was not uncommon for our top sportspeople to play first division rugby and first class cricket in the same year.

    Yes SBW might be a reasonable bullrush (league) player (not hard given the game is devoid of real skills) but he was an average rugby player at best and a piss poor boxer.

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  150. Manolo (14,086 comments) says:

    Griff & Miss Dim, are you listening? http://naturalsociety.com/leading-geneticist-human-intelligence-slowly-declining/

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  151. UglyTruth (4,552 comments) says:

    There is half a dozen temperature records using different methods and they correlate very well .

    So, Griff, why then did you use the dataset which was least supportive of my position that there hasn’t been any statistically significant warming since the nineties, if not for bias towards the alarmist position?

    As far as I’m concerned the issue is simply one of faith in the system – you have already refused to comment on the history of conspiracy re Operation Northwoods, and you smear people with words like “conspirowhacky”.

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  152. UglyTruth (4,552 comments) says:

    @hinamanu

    Re Glen Beck on Benghazi, Turkey is central to the larger issue of US sponsorship of terrorist organizations. James Corbett’s recent interviews of Sibel Edmonds provide a lot of context on this. Also the early gospel of Barnabus held at Ankara is important in terms of the religious aspect of terrorism.

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  153. F E Smith (3,307 comments) says:

    Another day, another example of leftys trying to re-write history.  Now, apparently, via these Aussie socialists we find out that the Soviet Union and Mao’s China were in fact capitalist entities, therefore they don’t count as an example of socialism in action…

    The authoritarian states like the USSR/Russia and China were not socialist but a form of state capitalism where workers had no control over society and were denied even basic rights.

    It becomes more and more clear that the leftys engage in doublethink as an integral part of their daily lives.

    H/T Andrew Bolt for the link.

     

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