Scrubone: Yes I noticed your earlier comment…I heard of some Judge in Africa who ended up setencing some particularly stupid crim to 10,000 years (yes, that’s the right number of 000′s) because he kept on repeating his contempts….and got 10 years for each one!He was eventually released on appeal…

I’d have thought that judges would be keen to maintain respect for their position. Little short of amazed to hear they’re actually encouraging disrespect like that.

What is more relevant in this case is the Judges’ – including this particular Judge’s – reluctance to impose penalties for contempt. As far as I am aware (Graeme E will ride in in due course on his white charger and put me right if necessary) Judges have unlimited discretion to sentence offenders who show disrespect in their court. In my view this sort of crap would quickly stop if every time the third finger or an abusive remark was made to the Judge, the offender went down to the cells for a week, and was then brought back to apologise. Another third fingered salute instead of an apology? Back to the cells you go, and all of that “contempt time” is over and above the sentence.

I think the prisoner(s) would get sick of that long before the Judge did…

There used to be a Aussie joke “what do you call a New Zealander in a suit?” Answer: the defendant. Now only the lawyers wear suits in court. The Judges have allowed a steady “creep” of disrespect until now defendants can turn up wearing virtually anything they like, chewing gum, stand with their hands in their pockets making inane gestures to their moronic mates, and the Judges do nothing. They have it in their power to fix that.

“…..I’m thinking that if all the efforts at rehabilitation were focussed more strictly on people we can have a good expectation of rehabilitiating…”

You’ll find that about 50% of those are classed as ‘complex dysfunctionals’ who have 4 or more drug, alcohol, education, employability, relationship, socialability, violence, mental illness & a few other problems that can’t all be fixed so that they ‘fit into society productively’ so as to live adequately. To parent adequately also.

It’s just the way it is RMM after 40 years of liberal policy and 3rd rate education policy. The acceptance of ‘reliance’ and ‘blame’ etc haven’t helped. Their parents don’t know any better either RRM, which means that for most of them, they are on their own. Commonsense, ambition and other ‘necessities’ mostly gets handed down by parents in their behaviour and through parenting properly. Sadly, lots of kids miss out. Cheers.

Not 15 minutes after getting into it he got T-boned by a youth on a motorbike. Said youth
1) Did not have a licence
2) Was not insured (well couldn’t, without a licence)

He’s now been charged with failing to stop and driving without a licence. Meanwhile my neighbour has to wear the consequence of claiming on his own insurance to get 4 panels on his car repaired or replaced.

No doubt he’ll get an inconsequential fine (which he won’t pay) or community service (which he won’t serve)

Huh? How is throwing them in prison going to save money. It costs a over $50,000 a year to keep someone in prison?

Yes but surely we decide to throw people in prison based on their deeds, not on how the prison budget is tracking this year.

So, given that a certain number of people are going to opt to commit crime; I’m thinking that if all the efforts at rehabilitation were focussed more strictly on people we can have a good expectation of rehabilitiating, and those who are just nasty pieces of shit were simply thrown into a big plain concrete dungeon for what is effectively storage, then the cost per inmate for each of the latter should hopefully be a lot less than $50k

And if it really costs $50k to keep an irredeemable piece of shit stored in a plain concrete storage facility that suggests to me that there is room for cost cutting.
I earn a bit more than $50k (but nowhere near twice that) and that’s enough to:
feed four people;
house four people in a self-contained house on a section (which has got to be the most inefficient way of housing humans that a lavish comfortable society could dream up, but it is the way we prefer to live!)
Pay for a lot of commuting every day;
Feed a bunch of unproductive domestic animals;
Pay for trips to the beach and the like.

this statement really blows me away. are you under 25?

im just thinking if i was this guy what my reaction would be. i suspect unbearable shame rather than abusing a judge. hell, id be praising allah i wasnt being sentenced in somewhere like texas.

not only is this guy a problem to society, but people like you are.

its a shame the judge didnt tack on extra time or have this guy thrown in maxi or something nasty.

50k a year to keep him locked up probably does save us money.

whats the real cost of having him on the streets?

adele – whats cheaper to you personally? the tax payer handing over 50k to keep him in jail or this guy slapping your sister around and then killing her while drunk driving?

“…..I don’t think our justice system is “broken” but I do think there is room for improvement. What do you think?…”

The same as I once pointed out to David Garrett-

Open a jail for ’2nd offenders’ who are convicted in court of any ‘offence’ and lock them up for their annual work holidays[4 weeks], with one week off for good behaviour.

NSW has weekend detention in their jails and if you work in the jails on saturday and sunday you then get let out at 6pm sunday evening instead of 9pm – virtually all prisoners want out at 6pm.[BTW They have to appear at the jail gates at 6pm friday nights or they get immediatly arrested and returned to court]

Which brings us to several good points about jailing people for their annual holidays-

You don’t loose your job.
You don’t inconveiniance the wife and kids.
We can fit about 16 into jail each year for the cost of what it costs to lock up 1 now.
The prison costs are low as nutrition is irrelevant [3-4 weeks stay] rice, fruit,veges, bread, cereal & water only.
People are going to jail at the very start of what could instead lead to a ‘life of crime’ and court appearances.
People will never ever get ‘prison cred’ being jailed with the likes of …………

No one will ‘re-book’ their next year’s annual holiday via crime – This is due to-

The fact that the research has already been done by tourism NZ [The PM's portfolio] -as no one books a motel for 3 weeks and stays inside cleaning it, watching crap on tv, eating only rice,veges & water – and lastly – doing it with a complete stranger that they meet in a court room – and then does it again the very next year.

“….You have quite the talent for saying not very much…”

Sure about that?

A number of years ago our justice system was changed to give people a chance to reintergrate with society.

The problem is that there’s a group of people who aren’t interested in being part of a civil society. And that’s not being recognised.

As I was trying to say earlier 10 convictions isn’t the same as 10 times through the court system. A person can have 100 convictions from one incident.

RRM: “Because you really are just a POS and why should we waste any more of our money or time on you?”

Huh? How is throwing them in prison going to save money. It costs a over $50,000 a year to keep someone in prison?

And in that case they may then need more personal support – like being ‘spooned’.

You have quite the talent for saying not very much, whilst being a complete arse about it don’t you Harriet?

I don’t think our justice system is “broken” but I do think there is room for improvement. What do you think?

PS:

“……..The challenge with this kind of system probably lies in making sure the traffic lights controlling the fork in the road send everyone in the appropriate direction, particularly when it is a bit of a line call and the offending is “more than A” but “less than B”….”

Which is then clearly option ‘C’ of your ‘fork in the road’ thing RMM

And in that case they may then need more personal support – like being ‘spooned’.

Yea, he’s clearly about to go straight.

Frankly, if you have 10 convictions for pretty much anything (that is, through the court system 10 times) there should be serious questions about you being allowed free in society.

Were I the judge, I’d have thrown this guy in jail for contempt of court and only when he’d served his sentence for that sentenced him for his other crimes. Of course, his reappearance for his final sentencing might lead to another contempt conviction…