Green List Quotas

March 27th, 2013 at 9:00 am by David Farrar

The Green Party already have the most prescriptive set of rules for their . It runs to 44 pages!

As you all know their rules already require one of their co-leaders to have a penis, and one not to have a penis.

With list ranking they already have quotas for everything – at least 40% must be female, at least 10% must be Maori, at least 20% from the Mainland and at least 10% must be under 35.

However this quota purity does not go enough for some Green Party members. Whale has leaked e-mails with a remit calling for:

The Party List at each election shall comprise all odd ranked places filled by one gender, and even numbered places filled by the other gender.

The gender filling odd numbered places at any one election shall fill even numbered places at the following election.  The gender filling odd numbered places at the first election after this remit is adopted shall be determined by a coin toss.”  

Total gender equality. And you work out who is ranked number one by a coin toss so the patriarchy can’t keep oppressing. Just delightful. It seems the motivation is that some activists are upset that Russel Norman keeps getting ranked No 1 and Metiria Turei No 2, despite being nominally equal co-leaders.

Now with the Green Party love for quotas, I’ve decided to help them out. I’ve calculated in Excel the idea demographic composition for each list position for them.

Green List Quotas

 

So their No 1 list place must be a straight female European with black hair. No 2 must be a straight male European with brown hair.

No 4 has to be a straight male Maori with black hair. No 5 a gay female European with black hair.

At No 15, you have a bisexual European female with brown hair. And you even have a ginga quota with No 12 being a straight male European with red hair.

This tables makes it very easy for the with all their quotas. They don’t have to worry about competence, experience, skills. Or they need to do is recruit someone for each list place that meets their demographic quotas. People could apply for a specific list place, such as “I’m a straight blonde female European and would like to be considered for List spot No 9″.

Now you could argue having hair colour as a demographic quota is over the top, but look at the discrimination gingas suffer and the jokes blondes suffer from. Also you could complain people can change their hair colour. Now you could insist on a do the drapes match the curtains test, but in the end it is a human right to be whatever hair colour you feel you are. So if people wish to change hair colour to get a higher list ranking, who are we to doubt the validity of their personal choices?

Now I have not added in the age quota and regional quota their rules also insist on. I may do that in a further version.

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57 Responses to “Green List Quotas”

  1. Rick Rowling (815 comments) says:

    The Party List at each election shall comprise all odd ranked places filled by one gender, and even numbered places filled by the other gender. The gender filling odd numbered places at any one election shall fill even numbered places at the following election. The gender filling odd numbered places at the first election after this remit is adopted shall be determined by a coin toss.”

    Wait, so they’re discriminating against anyone who doesn’t identify as either male or female? (It happens – look it up).

    This remit would ban them completely from any place in the list!

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  2. Andrew M (51 comments) says:

    What about the Vietnamese wheelchair-bound deaf-mute hermaphrodite contingent, where is their representation?

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  3. Peter (1,723 comments) says:

    There needs to be an inquiry.

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  4. Manolo (14,082 comments) says:

    All communists are social engineers, too.

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  5. RRM (10,034 comments) says:

    :shock: Wot, no place for a straight, male, red-headed Maori candidate?

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  6. Dave Stringer (188 comments) says:

    Yep, there must also be proprtional representation for all ethnicities! Why should Sri Lankans, Indians, Malays, Cook-Islanders, Germans, Chinese, etc., etc., have their culture and perspective recognised?

    So David, YES P L E A SE add in the age quota and regional quota their rules insist on, and also a representation for ethnicities other than Maori and Pakiha – otherwise how would the Aussie co-leader qualify anywhere!

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  7. davidp (3,588 comments) says:

    When I look at people the qualities that I value the most are their ideas, their experiences, and their abilities. Gender doesn’t really come in to the equation. I wonder why gender is the most important quality for Greens and why they select their leaders on that basis. How can they discriminate against people with lots of ability and great ideas, solely on the basis that they are of the wrong gender? Isn’t that illegal? I’m sure it would be illegal if I hired staff on that basis.

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  8. Lloyd (125 comments) says:

    Oh, for feck’s sake! What about us bald types? I demand a place.
    ’tis discrimination writ large!
    A travesty!

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  9. Komata (1,204 comments) says:

    Dave Stringer

    Re: ‘….would the Aussie co-leader qualify’

    Well, you CAN’T have the Australians left out and not be ‘inclusived’, although I do wonder if Norman’s position on the top of the list is in fact dscriminating against NEW ZEALANDERS!!!

    Perhaps Toad can clarify the matter for us?

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  10. toad (3,674 comments) says:

    The Green Party already have the most prescriptive set of rules for their list ranking. It runs to 44 pages!

    Actually, only pages 10-14 and 27,28 of the document you linked to are the rules for list ranking, DPF.

    It seems the motivation is that some activists are upset that Russel Norman keeps getting ranked No 1 and Metiria Turei No 2, despite being nominally equal co-leaders.

    Metiria was ranked No 1 for the 2011 election.

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  11. Manolo (14,082 comments) says:

    Being half-Afghani myself, I request, I demand, a place in the marvelous quota system devised by the Luddites.

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  12. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    Sorry, but when you are an advocate for “womens’ rights”,equality etc (which results in abominations such as abortion and so called same sex marriage) you simply can’t make fun of the Greens for doing the same thing!

    The Greens policies are all on the same continuum,just a little bit further down towards the looney end,just a little bit.

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  13. Whaleoil (767 comments) says:

    You’ve forgotten trans-gender people…this chart is irrelevant unless trans-gender people are catered for.

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  14. Grendel (1,005 comments) says:

    whats great is that they have at least acknowledged they have no need for rankings based on ability or real life experience, as that would leave none of them on the list.

    wait till they have to tell one of their longer serving mps they have to be dropped as they have gone over the 35 year age bracket and now they no longer fit the quota, and have to be dropped.

    would that be agist against that person or providing diversity when you replace them?

    oh the conundrums they must go through making sure everything is ‘right’. no wonder the greens seem to attract people who like to have committee meetings where process rather than results are whats important.

    gareth hughes should be worried, he is a straight white male, whos only green credentials are that he is useless and has not life experience, so the same as every other green. there must be a remit somewhere to do away with the patriarchical promoting of him over a 1 legged, half chinese, deaf, bisexual, transgender with dreads.

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  15. davidp (3,588 comments) says:

    Toad>Actually, only pages 10-14 and 27,28 of the document you linked to are the rules for list ranking, DPF.

    I’m reading it now, and am shocked to see “Maori – a maximum of 10% of candidates shall be of Maori descent”. The Greens have been blatantly pandering to the anti-Asian demographic in NZ over the last couple of years, competing with NZ First for votes. Now they’re selecting candidates on the basis of race. This isn’t apartheid era South Africa. I invite the Greens to drop their anti-Chinese rhetoric and their race-based candidate selection, since neither of these have a place in modern NZ.

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  16. flipper (4,232 comments) says:

    Andrew M says….
    ” What about the Vietnamese wheelchair-bound deaf-mute hermaphrodite contingent, where is their representation?”

    So, building on Whale….,we now have a “deaf”:…but no blind, no trade unionist, no paraplegic…gween.

    BUT…,,no Einstein since there is no comparable female, maori, homsexual equiv ?

    For God’s sake… where will their PC crap go next?

    Say, wouldn’t it be fun to listen to a speech by whining wussell red melon….. ” bad word, good word, female word, male word, non word, good dollars, Zimbabwe dollars, gween/labour CIR, real CIR ……”

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  17. labrator (1,850 comments) says:

    I can’t believe you’d be so discriminatory as to leave eye colour off the list. Hyperchromic people would make that interesting. Height would also be worthwhile. I know a lot of dwarves feel underrepresented in parliament.

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  18. SHG (319 comments) says:

    all odd ranked places filled by one gender, and even numbered places filled by the other gender.

    You’re either one or the other, according to the Greens. Charming.

    I also note that the Greens seem to be using the word “gender” as interchangeable with the word “sex”. It’s not.

    So if you are transgender your sexual identity is ignored, the Greens just want to know if you have a penis. And if you have an intersex condition then you don’t count at all – remember, for the Greens it’s just one or the other.

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  19. Shunda barunda (2,985 comments) says:

    I also note that the Greens seem to be using the word “gender” as interchangeable with the word “sex”. It’s not.

    Only in the imaginary world of social progressives it’s not, in the real world, male and female actually still counts.

    Medically proven hermaphrodites aside of course, but there are next to none of them anyway.

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  20. Yvette (2,852 comments) says:

    With list ranking they already have quotas for everything – at least 40% must be female, at least 10% must be Maori, at least 20% from the Mainland and at least 10% must be under 35.

    But females are 50.8% not 40
    Maori are around 15% not 10
    Who would bother checking any further …

    But, I guess they don’t call these people ‘green’ for nothing

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  21. Colville (2,300 comments) says:

    Do they have a minimum quota for something as boring as a white straight male?

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  22. David Garrett (7,565 comments) says:

    I have recently been retained by a Sri Lankan born transgender who has been cruelly mistreated by the Greens, and wishes to challenge the dreadful treatment visited upon him/her by the Greens. S/he is so traumatised that s/he has retained me (Me!) on his/her behalf to challenge his/her list placing. I expect to file proceedings for judicial review on his/her behalf any day now….Well the actual day of filing the proceedings will depend on advice from his/her astrologer, and the relative positions of the moon and Gaia/papatuanuku.

    Any further updates will be dependant on my client giving her/his consent and that of his/her whanau to sharing the progress of his/her trials with the good folk here.

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  23. Colville (2,300 comments) says:

    What about left handers? how can they discriminate against those fucken weirdos? :-)

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  24. david (2,564 comments) says:

    “As you all know their rules already require one of their co-leaders to have a penis, and one not to have a penis.”

    Wow dpf, are you suggesting that there is actually no guarantee that the “female co-leader” does not necessarily have a functioning vagina by very carefully allowing for a Georgina Beyer return to parliament as co-leader of the Greens? Time for the membership of the Green party to insist on a sex-testing regime I would say. I look forward to seeing the remit at next annual conference.

    If it is good enough for the Olympic games, it should be fair enough for the Greens dontchathink?

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  25. kiwi in america (2,511 comments) says:

    3 major criteria also missed:
    1 – Vegen/vegetarians – the Greens are blatantly favouring meat eaters and that would offend some members
    2 – Anti vivisection – the Greens cannot be so stupid as to not mandate representation from those who oppose testing on animals
    3 – Whales – the Greens list is deficient in not ensuring that a bona fide pro whale person is not on the list

    These things must not be left to chance.

    Which system of government do the Greens fit into http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Xd_zkMEgkI

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  26. Shunda barunda (2,985 comments) says:

    If the discrimination is based on a penis to vagina ratio, does the shape/size of said organs have anything to do with it? what if the first two men on the list are “little Timmy thimbles” and their combined ‘manlyness’ barely equals the average trouser snake?

    What if it bends to the right? does the equivalent left bending pecker need to be enlisted to balance the left/right divide?

    And we haven’t even got started on variations in female anatomy, even the current list must have been a nightmare!

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  27. cnomorerates (6 comments) says:

    Will there be a question in the House on this matter?

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  28. DingleyDell (7 comments) says:

    I was going to vote for the Greens, but as I see there is no place for the wheelchair bound, these fascists can go jump. I can’t.

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  29. Richard29 (377 comments) says:

    @Yvette
    But females are 50.8% not 40
    Maori are around 15% not 10
    Who would bother checking any further …

    By my understanding the purpose of the quotas is to prevent under-representation of groups, not to guarantee exact statistical representation of the population. i.e. If the female population is 50.8% then something is amiss if less than 40% of candidates are female, likewise, in a country that is about 15% Maori there may be something unusual at play if less than 10% of representatives are Maori.

    The reality is that in all Westminster Parliaments worldwide the majority of parliamentarians ate older white males (great news for Colville!).
    So A) We can explain this by ‘Merit’ and assume that older white males are just intrinsically better than other groups. Or B) we might assume that there are some kind of social, institutional or discrimination based barriers that are stopping other groups being represented in anything near the kind of numbers that you might expect from their share of the population.
    The Green party have opted with explanation B and decided to use minimum representation quotas as a tool for correcting these institutional barriers.

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  30. toad (3,674 comments) says:

    @SHG 9:53 am

    You’re either one or the other, according to the Greens. Charming.

    This is not according to the Greens. It is according to those Green members who proposed the remit. The feedback I have received is that the remit has little support from the wider party – the transgender issue you raise being one reason for this.

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  31. Graeme Edgeler (3,290 comments) says:

    I’m reading it now, and am shocked to see “Maori – a maximum of 10% of candidates shall be of Maori descent”.

    Well, I’ve just read it, and it says “minimum” and not “maximum”.

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  32. Mlec (13 comments) says:

    Well at least we will be able to determine their gender by their place on the list

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  33. gump (1,662 comments) says:

    @Whaleoil, @David Garrett

    Trans people generally identify themselves as the gender to which they have transitioned. They don’t need to be categorised as a separate gender identity.

    Having said that, the Greens have an exceptionally silly list ranking system.

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  34. Paulus (2,672 comments) says:

    Are you saying that part Maori are European because they have more non Maori blood in them than part Maori.

    Where does part Maori woman Turei fit in your scenario, unless you class her race as European.

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  35. Kleva Kiwi (289 comments) says:

    This is pathetic. And people actually vote for these lunatics?
    What happened to competency in the list. I see nothing there asking for the representatives to actually be competent…

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  36. David Garrett (7,565 comments) says:

    gump: Many thanks for that clarification, which will potentially save me from committing some dreadful faux pas with my new client.

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  37. Graeme Edgeler (3,290 comments) says:

    What happened to competency in the list. I see nothing there asking for the representatives to actually be competent…

    Then read it again.

    Appendix C: Ideal Candidate Description has clear descriptions of a range of markers of competence across the multitude of skills a successful member of Parliament needs.

    With the Greens, as with all parties, the list ranking systems (and other candidate selections) should be between competent people. No-one who is incompetent should be on the list at all. The question is, given the 30 competent people we have decided to rank from 1-30, how should we determine which competent person should fill which slot?

    Your implicit suggestion that competent people should be ranked higher than incompetent people is stupid. Incompetent people shouldn’t be ranked at all.

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  38. davidp (3,588 comments) says:

    Graeme E>Well, I’ve just read it, and it says “minimum” and not “maximum”.

    Oops. My typo. I would have cut and paste, except the document was a scan of a printed page for some bizarre reason. I’m still shocked that anyone should have a racial quota of any sort. Surely it would be illegal for me to deny a job to a well qualified Maori candidate on the basis that my business had a minimum quota of Asian people that wasn’t filled? It is 2013 in NZ, not 1970 in South Africa and we should be selecting people on merit rather than race and gender.

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  39. Urban Redneck (234 comments) says:

    God help us all when the day arises that these flat-earth no-growth enviro-Marxist nutcases are in a governing coalition with Labour.

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  40. davidp (3,588 comments) says:

    Graeme E>No-one who is incompetent should be on the list at all.

    A Green candidate contributed briefly to Kiwiblog comments at the last election, or possibly the one before that. He was a secondary school student who was preparing to go to university. I think I worked out that he was 17 when selected, and was going to turn 18 just before the election. According to the Greens web site, his biggest accomplishment was school debating or something similar. Like most teenagers, he didn’t seem to have much of a detailed grasp of issues and certainly wasn’t able to hold his own in the comments. Is this competent? Maybe he’d surprise us and turn out to be some sort of teenage prodigy. But I think a reasonable view is that you wouldn’t trust him to run a shift at Dominos pizza, and therefore he almost certainly wasn’t competent to sit on a select committee.

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  41. brucehoult (201 comments) says:

    I note that all the pacific islander and asian slots are for males, none for females. You really should leave this to the professionals.

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  42. mandk (1,020 comments) says:

    I’m middle aged, male, heterosexual, left handed, colour blind, German born of Irish descent.
    That’s got to give me at least a top 5 place on the listing.

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  43. Changeiscoming (199 comments) says:

    As it has already been pointed out by missing catagories, also missing is religious faith and disabilities.

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  44. rangitoto (251 comments) says:

    @ Graeme Edgeler

    “Appendix C: Ideal Candidate Description has clear descriptions of a range of markers of competence across the multitude of skills a successful member of Parliament needs.”

    The gweens are discriminating against the incompetent. This will require a formal complaint to the UN at least.

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  45. bringbackdemocracy (428 comments) says:

    Why don’t they have a quota for normal people as they are under represented in the gween party.

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  46. Dave Stringer (188 comments) says:

    Richard

    You make a great point

    in all Westminster Parliaments worldwide the majority of parliamentarians ate older white males

    Clearly the greens have failed to include cannibals in their quota system too!

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  47. Hiro Protagonist (17 comments) says:

    DPF sez: “Now you could insist on a do the drapes match the curtains test”

    Ho ho – maybe you mean a “does the carpet match the drapes test”?

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  48. David Garrett (7,565 comments) says:

    Gump: I am really new at this…clients were all just clients, all to be treated the same, when I graduated law school back in the day. I would appreciate any help I can get in the interpersonal aspects of dealing with this client…I guess because s/he dresses as a woman, that means I should talk to and about her as if she were female, yes? e.g. “My client feels that her….” and “Ms X is outraged that she was…”??

    Are there any, like, publications of guidelines I might obtain to assist me on how to tread in this minefield of a situation? Well, it IS a minefield for a middle aged heterosexual white guy who lives in the country, let me tell ya! The level of my client’s trauma can be judged by the fact that she (got that right!) chose ME as her lawyer!

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  49. Graeme Edgeler (3,290 comments) says:

    A Green candidate contributed briefly to Kiwiblog comments at the last election, or possibly the one before that. He was a secondary school student who was preparing to go to university. I think I worked out that he was 17 when selected, and was going to turn 18 just before the election. According to the Greens web site, his biggest accomplishment was school debating or something similar. Like most teenagers, he didn’t seem to have much of a detailed grasp of issues and certainly wasn’t able to hold his own in the comments. Is this competent?

    It will differ for other parties, but the Greens only seriously ranked their – I think – top 30 candidates. After that, it was in alphabetical order, and everyone accepted that such people were not going to be MPs.

    Given these strictures, competent may simply mean: able to speak coherently at a meet the candidates meeting to plump for votes for other people on the green list to be elected.

    Note also, however, that I am not saying the Greens were right to reach the conclusion that everyone on their list was actually competent, just making the general point, that the Green selection criteria clearly raise issues of competence.

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  50. RightNow (7,013 comments) says:

    Larpers are currently over-represented on the green list.
    I think there should be a maximum of one Larper in the top ranked 1,000 (or thereabouts).

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  51. SPC (5,787 comments) says:

    The lack of place for older people losing their hair colour is blatant discrimination – and Grey Power should be informed.

    Will John Key be using hair dye before visiting China? Apparently its the party requirement and not to do so would be a sign of disrespect – either flaunting youth or going au natural.

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  52. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    change is coming

    Funny you mention religion and the Greens.

    Not one of them swore on the Bible (or Koran for that matter)etc at the opening of parliament,they all affirmed.

    Now I don’t have a problem with that(really,religion is a matter of personal conscience) but what are the chances?
    Was it a party line?

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  53. Steve (North Shore) (4,592 comments) says:

    What about the blondes? Blondes got a hammering.
    The blonde thing must be true especialy waka blondes

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  54. Reid (16,634 comments) says:

    Notice there is no criteria there for ability.

    Like say, I dunno, educashun? Or is that just neo-liberal elitism wunning wampant over their pwecious dweam team list?

    But seriously, how come they don’t have mentalism on their cwitewia wating? Is it because that just goes without saying, or is there say, a PR reason why they haven’t revealed that aspect?

    If so, can I say I suggest some vewy weasonable cwitewia that would sound incredibly impressive at any MSM sub-editor’s desk as they tried to figure out what the fuck it all meant, thus generating much needed useful publicity?

    – Black-belt in Subjectivity-Intersubjectivity-Objectivity
    – Extreme brain plasticity
    – Able instantaneously to decompose into one’s molecular components
    – And so on. (I have more but they’ll have to pay me lots of cash if they want them. Get in touch with DPF if so.)

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  55. Richard29 (377 comments) says:

    @Dave Stringer
    Ahahahahah – well spotted :)

    Well I guess that might even up the gender and race balance if the white males were eaten :P

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  56. JohnM (7 comments) says:

    The gay ginga girls miss out again. Curse you, demography!

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  57. UpandComer (537 comments) says:

    This is too good. DPF you the man.

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