Advice on minimum wage

April 4th, 2013 at 12:00 pm by David Farrar

Kate Shuttleworth at NZ Herald reports on what Government agencies said on the . The summary is:

  • Treasury – $13.50
  • Cabinet decision – $13.75
  • Ministry of Business Innovation and Employment – $13.80
  • Ministry of Social Development – $13.80
  • Ministry of Women’s Affairs – $13.80
  •  Ministry of Pacific Island Affairs – $15.00
  • Te Puni Kokiri – $16.00

Te Puni Kokiri must think we need more unemployed people!

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75 Responses to “Advice on minimum wage”

  1. ex-golfer (161 comments) says:

    More crap MSM sub-editing.
    Headline reads: Minister of Labour ignored minimum wage advice.
    Then went on to list six government agencies – none of which Cabinet accepted – but they instead took a compromise position.
    Ministers don’t “ignore” agency advice – they take it on board when making their decisions.
    There will be thousands who are pleased he “ignored” the advice of Treasury?

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  2. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Maybe TPK think you’re better off on the dole til you get a job paying 16 an hour.

    So until minimum wage rises to that , it’s just not worth the time and effort .

    More incentive to work if you’re gonna get paid more :)

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  3. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    lmao @ the bottom 2.

    what did the ministry of straight white guys say?

    BWAV – the problem is the way people like you think. not worth the effort! like youll be on minimum wage forever. idiots.

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  4. tvb (4,421 comments) says:

    This is not science. At some point a high minimum wage that is not supported by productivity will cost jobs. But if it is low people will not bother to work and claim welfare if they can.

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  5. RRM (9,919 comments) says:

    Supporting yourself: It’s just not worth the time and effort.

    Doesn’t it make you proud to be a member of the human race?

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  6. david c (254 comments) says:

    To quote someone more erudite than me: “Heeeere we go”

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  7. Viking2 (11,470 comments) says:

    Clearly there are at least seven Govt and other taxpayer funded agencies that have far too many staff and far to much taxpayer money to waste.
    Personally I don’t need and neither do many of the other people in business need these over educated overpaid waste of space trough dwellers to tell us what we need to pay people to come to work.

    Fire the lot and remove a lot of taxpayer money from the vote that supports them.

    Start thinking of the tax payer.

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  8. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    People like me dime, think there’s no fucking way big whitey banker and business man will help poor dumb pasifikan into business unless said pasifikan is a total sellout brown nosing house nigga wanna be a cracka ass crack licka

    We been bred to only rise to a certain station in life and know our place in the general scheme of things. In these times, you get the natives you deserve :)

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  9. peterwn (3,271 comments) says:

    A major defeat for Treasury – Cabinet did not split the difference between Their figure and that of other ‘mainstream’ agencies.

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  10. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    BWAV what a piss poor attitude. “So until minimum wage rises to that , it’s just not worth the time and effort”. No wonder there are so many useless parasites on the dole if they have an attitude like yours. Lets not forget the children in those houses who grow up with the same attitude and the whole thing repeats. Maybe you can start on min wage and move up. Ever thought about that??

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  11. Longknives (4,744 comments) says:

    ” brown nosing house nigga wanna be a cracka ass crack licka..”

    Scribe.. is that you?

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  12. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    what a disgusting racist tirade BWAV.

    im starting to think youre a white guy trying to make brown peeps look bad.

    but, if you are from the islands and hate us that much.. you could go back to wherever it is your family came from

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  13. Kimble (4,438 comments) says:

    We been bred to only rise to a certain station in life and know our place in the general scheme of things.

    Your parents must be so proud.

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  14. wf (441 comments) says:

    ” brown nosing house nigga wanna be a cracka ass crack licka..”

    As long as we have people expressing opinions in this sort of language . . . .

    All I can say is I want a ‘disgusted’ button. Thumbs down doesn’t say it for me.

    And a ‘grin’ one – some posts really make me laugh.

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  15. earlyfknsettler (10 comments) says:

    New Zealand – Before the evil colonialists it used to be just like AVATAR (but with maoris). YEAH RIGHT!

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  16. flipper (4,060 comments) says:

    As I have said often before:

    Compare those bids with the current US Federal Minimum rate NZ$8.64 (US$7.95) and what Obama wants NZ $10.987 (US $9).

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  17. KiwiGreg (3,255 comments) says:

    Government outlawing the employment of people. Real smart.

    A bunch of agencies without a business bone in their body having an opinion on and advising on what level that outlawing should take place. Even smarter.

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  18. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    The amount of useless parasites on the dole is proportional to the amount of shit jobs there are paying useless wages.

    Cheaper to import some lean hungry foreigners to do them jobs like Filipinos in Christchurch or real fresh islanders from the Pacific to fruit pick. Ones who haven’t been tainted by the good life breeding for business on the dpb or faking a rugby injury on acc or being a crackhead on sickness.

    Fuck yeah, work hard as a cleaner mucking out the toilets and you might get to clean the big mans office one day for 14 bucks an hour.

    Now that’s ASPI-fucking-RATIONAL. or should that be aspi fucking racial national.

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  19. Harriet (4,969 comments) says:

    The minimum wage is an indicator to the aspirational classes! :cool:

    People don’t stay in the same income brackets their entire lives!

    Young people start out with student debt on $30k+ wage .Age about 20. 0 capital.

    After 8 years they[couple] have a house deposit[50K+] and next to no student debt. And an income of $120k+[couple]. $50k+ of capital. 400k+ asset. 350K+ debt. Age about 30.

    At age 40 they would have a 600k+ asset. Incomes of $160k+. 100k debt max if not freehold. + super.

    Trades people are the same.

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  20. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    BWAV – youre on sad dude. im sorry to hear you work a shitty job. maybe go back to study.

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  21. Elaycee (4,392 comments) says:

    BWAV / Pollywog / Pollywannacracka / whatever name you use this week:

    You actually need to get off your butt / sell some of your T shirts around Nelson and make a buck, rather than bleat and moan because the rest of the world has passed you by.

    But I agree you’re a victim – a total victim of the grip.

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  22. graham (2,335 comments) says:

    BWAV:

    People like me dime, think there’s no fucking way big whitey banker and business man will help poor dumb pasifikan into business …

    So why go to whitey then? Have you not heard of these guys?

    http://www.pacificbusiness.co.nz/

    Or maybe these guys:

    http://businessmentorspacific.org.nz/

    And there’s a few others around as well.

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  23. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Which young couples are you talking bout Harriet?…Fuck you’re a dreamer.I’d say most will stay in the same income brackets their entire lives and few manage to get ahead in life as they used to.

    Gone are the days when a kid living in a state house in Christchurch with a solo mum can get a free education and grow up to become a captain of industry. Gone are the days when you were guaranteed a job for life in your chosen profession. Unless you got a rich property developing sugar daddy or a decent inheritance, you’re pretty much fucked from day one.

    Even more so it’s all about cronyism and nepotism in capitalism…oh and let’s not forget those most unfunfrotunate of siamese twIns , sexism and racism.

    But hey, thank fuck you’re living in Godzone eh ?

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  24. Manolo (13,767 comments) says:

    People like the lamentable BWAV is exactly the reason why his ilk are in such a sorry state.
    Lazy beyond belief.

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  25. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    BWAV I think you are just trolling for the sake of it. Why even bother commenting on this blog? The only reason I can think is because you like to wind ppl up. You may be a complete fuckwit but you maike an outstanding troll!

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  26. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    lol @ BWAV.

    Please allow me to translate.

    “im lazy and i failed at life. that means everyone else in my situation will. if i thought any other way then it would make me feel bad. maybe i would have to stop and look at myself in the mirror. but this way its someone elses fault. i am a victim. you should all feel ashamed”

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  27. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    It’s not that the world has passed me by. I’m actually waiting for it catch up Elaycee…I’m the future.

    We are gonna be the ones cleaning up the mess and picking up the pieces to start over again once the banks fail and the fatcats realise they can’t eat money or protect their ill gotten gains with culturally biased laws anymore.

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  28. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Lazy?…yep that explains the unemployment rate for Pasifika peoples perfectly, and don’t forget dumb too…

    Reap what you sow.

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  29. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    ” culturally biased laws anymore”

    examples please

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  30. Elaycee (4,392 comments) says:

    …I’m the future.

    Bwahahaaaaaaa…. Brilliant! But now I have to wipe my coffee off my laptop.

    Just because you can’t sell enough merchandise or you were unable to make a buck from your radio gig, doesn’t mean to say the rest of us should somehow give a rats arse, Pollywog. Maybe you need to get off your butt and try something else. Its no coincidence – the harder people work, the luckier they seem to get.

    But do go on – we’re really interested. In fact, you have the entire office here in stitches. :D

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  31. Kimble (4,438 comments) says:

    examples please

    dime, those are the laws that hold everyone to the same standards.

    What Racist With Assumed Impunity is saying is that any laws that don’t treat certain people differently due to their different genetic traits (most commonly observed in appearance) are, by definition, racist.

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  32. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Oh c’mon dime….start with every law any colonial administration in the Pacific set up to advance the desires of their own culture, whether it be religious or ethnic and fast forward to now.

    Racism is institutionalized. Tokenism as a substitute isn’t going to work either. Only a level playing field that comes from re-evolution will do.

    What’s funny is watching everyone trying to compete and being all aspirational an shit but knowing deep down the system is fucked and only there to be gamed by the ‘elite’.

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  33. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    umm yeah. if you could just give me an example of a racist law in this country that would be great. thanks

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  34. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    The standards aren’t the same though are they Kimble?

    http://www.3news.co.nz/Racism-at-the-pre-pay-petrol-pump/tabid/817/articleID/292880/Default.aspx

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  35. Kimble (4,438 comments) says:

    Hey Dickhead with a Keyboard,

    dime asked for examples and you didn’t provide a single one. Is that due to laziness, incompetence, or shame?

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  36. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Umm yeah read what I wrote dime…thanks.

    And then use your discretion to interpret the law as you see fit, according to your preferred CULTURAL BIAS.It’s what the judiciary do.

    hell…even pump jockeys do it in this enlightened and egalitarian country of ours.

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  37. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    just tell me one law thats racist. you said there are lots of them. much easier to just say which one.

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  38. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    *sigh*…i didn’t say racist though did I?

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  39. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    Black with a Vengeance (1,031) please stop now before you make yourself look even more of a fool (if that is even possible). I agree that racism has existed in the past but that is the past. Dime has asked whether you have an example and you obviously have none. There is no excuse!

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  40. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    lmao ok

    “with culturally biased laws anymore.”

    please give me an example of a culturally biased law.

    many thanks

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  41. Kimble (4,438 comments) says:

    We are gonna be the ones cleaning up the mess and picking up the pieces to start over again once the banks fail and the fatcats realise they can’t eat money or protect their ill gotten gains with culturally biased laws anymore.

    Given everything else you have ever written, Shoulder with a Chip, pardon the Universe if every sentient creature residing within it assumed that when you said “culturally biased laws” you meant racist laws.

    So now, I guess, we are all waiting for you to provide examples of laws that are biased against the culture of any group of people comprised of Caucasians.

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  42. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    How about the law allocating Maori seats in parliament :)

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  43. graham (2,335 comments) says:

    What an excellent example, BWAV.

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  44. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    agree! lets get rid of it.

    anything else we need to do?

    Dime is anti-racism or “cultural bias”.

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  45. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    You’re a fool Cunningham to think that racism is a thing of the past.

    Just because laws dont exist in letter any more doesnt mean they dont exist in spirit and are acted upon.

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  46. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    “Just because laws dont exist in letter any more doesnt mean they dont exist in spirit and are acted upon.”

    can you highlight some cases?

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  47. Kimble (4,438 comments) says:

    Nice of Niggardly with Honesty to concede that the only culturally-biased laws that exist today are to the detriment of non-Maoris.

    I assume this means that the “fatcats” he railed against in a previous comment were actually Maori politicians. I suppose you could argue this is an accurate term considering girth and imported species status, but I don’t think Gareth Morgan would appreciate the tint it puts on his current crusade.

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  48. graham (2,335 comments) says:

    How about marae-based youth courts? Does anyone know if non-Maori are allowed to go through this process?

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  49. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    So we’re agreed that laws with a cultural bias exist and are interpreted to give favour to certain ethnicities.

    Swt…then we can say entire systems can be set up to favour the same and have been.

    So what happens to the favoured and the marginalised when these systems and laws break down after a few generations?

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  50. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    How is having Maori seats in parliament the detriment of non Maori, Kimble you stupid redneck hunt?

    And for an example of a non existent law that discriminates against Pasifika people’s dime, I suggest you watch that Campbell live piece.

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  51. graham (2,335 comments) says:

    Not sure you can say we are in agreement, BWAV. So far you’ve mentioned one law, and I’ve mentioned Marae-based youth courts which I think are only a recent innovation.

    It’s a bit of a step to then say that the “colonial administration” set up in New Zealand were aiming solely to “advance the desires of their own culture.”

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  52. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    maori will have to stop bludging?

    they may have to work like the white man does?

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  53. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    “And for an example of a non existent law that discriminates against Pasifika people’s dime, I suggest you watch that Campbell live piece.”

    seriously dude, can you just spit it out?

    I think PI’s get a shitty deal in this country. Not because “of capitalism and the white man” either. More or race based programs targeted at maori only. rather than to people of any race who need help

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  54. Kimble (4,438 comments) says:

    How is having Maori seats in parliament the detriment of non Maori, Kimble you stupid redneck hunt?

    Silly Back with a Venereal, how can something be biased towards a thing and not at the same time be biased away from the opposite of that thing?

    Or are you saying that the Maori seats are bad for Maori? Though this WOULD be consistent with your view that the Maori politicians are “fatcats”.

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  55. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    History proves you otherwise Graham. And not only here, but the colonial NZ govt set up last century in Samoa too.

    And how does the whiteman work dime?

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  56. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Seriously dime and Kimble.

    You guys need to wipe the spittle from your keyboards and start over cos you’re not making a hell of a lot of sense anymore.

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  57. dime (9,972 comments) says:

    lmao youre just batshit crazy aint ya BWAV.

    you speak in nonsensical riddles

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  58. Manolo (13,767 comments) says:

    Too much rhum, kava, beer and buckets of KFC have impaired BWAV’s brain long ago. Enough of this moron.

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  59. RRM (9,919 comments) says:

    People like me dime, think there’s no fucking way big whitey banker and business man will help poor dumb pasifikan into business unless said pasifikan is a total sellout brown nosing house nigga wanna be a cracka ass crack licka

    I saw an awesome T shirt today. It said:

    Some want it to happen.
    Some wish for it to happen.
    Some make it happen.

    The quote was attributed to Michael Jordan – wait, isn’t he black? Why, yes he is :-)

    I think anybody who’s waiting for the government to “help them into business” is going to be waiting a long time, no matter what colour his skin is! ;-)

    And that stuff about “ass crack licking niggas” says more about you than anything else.

    Far out, this thread about the minimum wage sure escalated quickly…

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  60. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Go fuck yourself manhole.

    How does the whiteman work dime?

    And nah…if youre some fatcat mofo, the govt will bend over backwards to help you and your business RRM. Just ask them Warner bros.

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  61. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    K. I’ll answer your question for you dime.

    A whiteman will only work what suits him. The rest of the time he’ll get someone else to do it. First with it costing him nothing in wages, slavery, then by indenture, costing a pittance, then by outsourcing, costing less than it would locally. All the while, changing laws to suit his cultural bias and ensuring he always has the upper hand in negotiations.

    Is that the model you wish Maori to follow ?

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  62. Cunningham (844 comments) says:

    Jesus christ Black with a Vengeance (1,045) you live on a different planet. I like how you spew fourth your point of racism by stereotyping white people like you do. What a fucking brilliant way to get your point across! Good luck doing anything with your life. With an attitude like yours you will certainly need all the luck you can get!

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  63. Kimble (4,438 comments) says:

    All the while, changing laws to suit his cultural bias and ensuring he always has the upper hand in negotiations.

    examples please

    (Isnt this where we started?)

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  64. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Blasphemy will get you nowhere Cunningham.

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  65. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Oh and I’m only stereotyping big white business man, not all white people in general :)

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  66. Abberant (2 comments) says:

    I am politically opposed to David and do not agree with almost all his posts. I get quite worked up by some of his posts, as they show no appreciation of what is really happening at the knife edge of the poverty trap…..

    HOWEVER…..

    He is thoughtful and works out what he has to say. He is unwise saying “Te Puni Kokiri must think we need more unemployed people!” as well as making an assumption here that I would say is, at best, an impossibly large leap, this does also start to head the issue towards race, but it is not about race. It is about minimum wage.

    I have myself blogged on this, and I believe in the Living Wage personally. However, the assumption is that my friends at Labour will simply come along one day and slap on a huge minimum wage that is the living wage. This cannot happen and would not happen. Whilst both parties have been fiscally unwise at times (and do not get me started on asset sales. Bloody crooks!) neither Labour or National are actually out to ruin the country. They may do dumb things, but a living wage simply imposed would clearly never work. However, David made no comment as to the other figures, allowing us, the blog readers, to draw our own conclusions.

    One thing I have to give Mr Farrah is that he uses his brain, and that is something I respect. This post is very clever, as you read into it whatever you will. I hope I can be as insightful as him with time, though I will use it for the good, not the right. :-)

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  67. nickb (3,687 comments) says:

    BWAV, it boggles the mind that out of 500,000 sperm, you were the fastest.

    The trouble with the minimum wage is that we have tens of thousands of illiterate, drug taking and lazy hicks like BWAV that they are unemployable even at $8 / hour. At $15 / hour you will have permanently priced them out of the labour market and condemned them (or blessed them, from BWAV’s point of view) to a parasitical and worthless life of bludging off the rest of us.

    I know some dairy farmers that have recently been trying to find new farmhands. They are willing to take a punt on young kids but their patience is being tested after a string of 20 something drunk, drugged entitled fucktards who feel the need to turn up to work only when they feel like it, and are off on ACC half the time after doing things like damaging their eyes when welding their turbo charged jap crap mobiles back together after crashing them without protective eyewear.

    These jobs pay well, start at about 40k plus almost free housing and free meat, which most people would agree is a great gig for mainly unskilled school dropouts.

    They used to get over 100 applications, but on the advice of their solicitor they recently started inserting paragraphs in their job ads raising the possibility of random drug tests. New number of applicants per ad? Less than 5.

    That sums it up IMO. BWAV probably thinks they deserve 80k / year plus a 20 hour week. Those oppressive capitalists and all.

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  68. duggledog (1,556 comments) says:

    Hey Black with a Vengeance, I’m not at all sure you are tangata whenua, but I’m pretty sure you have made a fool of yourself with the link to the Campbell Live story about racism at the petrol pumps.

    I know those gas stations well, and I also happen to know the ethnicities. None of those people rostered at the till were white. They are all Indian (not sure if they are Fijian or continental) or PI. Jesus man you can even hear the Indian accent at two of the visits.

    It’s entirely typical of Campbell Live to run a lazy piece like that, leaving the viewer to assume this is a white / brown thing but it’s not you see. I think Maori and Pacific Island folks have far more to worry about when it comes to discrimination from Indian and Asian people than what you quaintly call ‘whitey’, and as you may have noticed there are quite a few of them about these days. There will be many, many more coming to do the jobs and pay the nation’s bills, and I think their interest is not going to be the Principles of Te Tiritiri

    You’ll find a lot of landlords (a lot of whom are Indian and Chinese) won’t rent to Maori on principle, especially young male Maori with baseball caps like the gentleman Campbell Live interviewed. That is because they land in New Zealand, watch the TV, read the newspapers and put two and two together pretty quickly. Same goes for South Africans too obviously.

    Indian and Chinese people are the ones that run the gas stations and the dairies that are frequently robbed by you-know-who. They have very tight communities and you know what, they talk.

    It’s very sad but it’s not my fault. I grew up in a country where Maori and Pakeha got on much much better than they do now but those days are over my angry friend of indeterminate hue!

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  69. Elaycee (4,392 comments) says:

    nickb:

    BWAV, it boggles the mind that out of 500,000 sperm, you were the fastest.

    Haha – Brilliant! :D

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  70. Northland Wahine (667 comments) says:

    There is a inspiring piece on you tube called “Brown brother” J S Iosefo. Bwav, you could learn something from this young man.

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  71. OneTrack (3,092 comments) says:

    Aberrant @5:30

    “However, the assumption is that my friends at Labour will simply come along one day and slap on a huge minimum wage that is the living wage. This cannot happen and would not happen. ”

    Have a bit more of a think. This time around you have the Greens and Mana with David Shearer. It would go something like this “David, of course we can put the minimum wage up to $20. Any problems and I will fire up the printing press for a few more trillion dollar notes. What could go wrong?”

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  72. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    You’re the fucking idiot if you think whitey has a monopoly on racism duggledog.

    Nothing principled about being racist regardless of your ethnicity.

    And yep, I didn’t get to where I am by being slow on the uptake. Even as a sperm I was wayyyy ahead of the pack!

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  73. nickb (3,687 comments) says:

    Says a lot for the quality of your father’s ammo then

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  74. BlairM (2,339 comments) says:

    I have a recommendation: Zero. How about zero?

    No?

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  75. Black with a Vengeance (1,861 comments) says:

    Really nickb…is this where I get free license to call your mother a whore?

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