Demented extremists

June 4th, 2013 at 11:00 am by David Farrar

Readers will recall the Nisbet cartoon of last week. A few people called for it to be banned as racist. The PM responded to the suggestion of a law change to allow this with the very mild statement that the Govt has no plans to change the law to ban racist , as is very subjective and hard to define.

The current law makes illegal statements or publications that vilify a racial group, which is a far tougher criteria.

Now I would have thought the statement that what is racist is very subjective was almost beyond argument. Almost every day I see people call other people racist. Some people say the Maori seats are racist. Some people say the Police are racist. I can’t think of something that is more subjective.

So the PM’s comments on not changing the law to ban cartoons that offend were hardly controversial I would have thought.

But to some demented extremists on the left, it seems actually it is akin to lynching blacks in the KKK. They’ve been facebooking the cartoon below.

kkk2

 

This just shows the demented extreme world view of those who promote this.

Incidentally National’s caucus has three Asian MPs, two Pacific MPs and eight MPs of Maori descent.

But this is how some people think. If you do not agree with them that the law should be changed to ban cartoons like Al Nisbet’s, then you are akin to a KKK member who lynches blacks.

 

Tags: , , ,

119 Responses to “Demented extremists”

  1. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    The irony is the KKK grew out of the left wing of US politics anyway.

    “the Klan quickly became a terrorist organization in service of the Democratic Party and white supremacy. Between 1869 and 1871 its goal was to destroy Congressional Reconstruction by murdering blacks — and some whites — who were either active in Republican politics or educating black children.”

    http://www.pbs.org/wnet/jimcrow/stories_org_kkk.html

    (PBS radio)

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 24 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  2. Ryan Sproull (7,288 comments) says:

    But this is how some people think. If you do not agree with them that the law should be changed to ban cartoons like Al Nisbet’s, then you are akin to a KKK member who lynches blacks.

    The message seems clearly to me: “Nisbet’s cartoon is so obviously racist that denying it is like denying that the KKK and lynching are racist.”

    A message with which you may or may not agree, of course.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 3 Thumb down 26 You need to be logged in to vote
  3. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    Boy,
    This will be splashed all over the outraged media…….

    Tui Ad

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  4. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    @Redbaiter
    Yes I was shocked to find (as portrayed in the movie Lincoln) that is was the Democrats to fought tooth and nail to keep slavery.

    WTF?

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  5. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Lance
    This is a hoary old story. Both the Republican and Deomcrat parties of today bear very little resemblance to their nineteenth century forbears. It’s about as relevant as saying the National Party’s forbears opposed women’s suffrage.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 14 You need to be logged in to vote
  6. Manolo (14,082 comments) says:

    Just remember Strom Thurmond, the late US Senator and former believer in white supremacy, which, of course, didn’t stop him from fathering a “mixed-race” child, and who was hailed as a saint by the Democratic Party.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  7. cha (4,084 comments) says:

    WTF?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  8. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    @mikenmild
    Fair enough, the only problem I have is that the past is used against the right but not the left.
    If we all need to deal with today issues only then so be it, but I’m doubting such logic will be forth coming from some the leftist commentators here.
    Hell some of them can’t even tell that National are not the British ‘Tory’ party.

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  9. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “This is a hoary old story.”

    So are the Crusades and the Spanish Inquisition, but it doesn’t stop the left referring to them every time there’s a discussion on religion. Apparently though when its the left and their historical butchery and in this case racism, its just a “hoary old story”.

    What it really is is just the same old arrant left wing hypocrisy.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 20 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  10. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    @mikenmild
    See,
    Cha couldn’t resist it!!!!!!

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  11. Manolo (14,082 comments) says:

    Not as old as you would like us believe, socialist mikenmild.

    In 1965, Thurmond said: “All the laws of Washington and all the bayonets of the Army cannot force the Negro into our homes, into our schools, our churches and our places of recreation and amusement.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  12. Harriet (5,145 comments) says:

    So is it racist if Nesbit draws a picture of white people feeding their children? :cool:

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  13. Kimble (4,443 comments) says:

    The message seems clearly to me: “Nisbet’s cartoon is so obviously racist that denying it is like denying that the KKK and lynching are racist.”

    It was obviously ageist too. Remember, there were to old WHITE people in the cartoon as well.

    Just like those in hysterics about a word a 13-year old girl used at a football match in Australia, you see racism because you WANT to see racism. You NEED to see racism. You may say you want to live in a world without racism, but you couldn’t stand it.

    A world without racism is a world that doesn’t need you pointing out everything that’s racist. Its a world that doesn’t bow before your bravery and righteousness. If racism was eliminated completely, you would invent it. That’s whats happening here.

    You seem to think that the defining characteristic of a racist is someone who tells you to fuck off when you call them a racist.

    I don’t like racism. Real racism.

    Vote: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  14. Chuck Bird (4,929 comments) says:

    DPF, it seems okay for many liberals on your blog to denigrate Maori as a group because they are overrepresented in a number of bad statistics. This is not just the cartoon but persistent references to stone agers and similar derogatory names.

    However, when any of us point out how homosexuals are overrepresented in other bad statistics the liberals rather than debating the issues resort to name calling with homophobic being a mild term.

    It is your blog and you can give demerits to who you like for whatever reason but you seem to ignore very derogatory name calling towards Maori as a group compared to references to homosexuals.

    Darrin Hughes was a serial sexual predator who definitely would have been charged if his victim had of been female yet you gave demerits for calling him Dirty Darrin.

    [DPF: And I’ll do so again. Comments defaming an individual are treated very differently to comments about groups of people]

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  15. jawnbc (93 comments) says:

    Jeez David,

    That’s like saying the cro-magnon, misanthropic knuckledraggers who populate about 70% of the comments on Kiwiblog are representative of the Nats.

    You’re almost as bad as they are…you *know* these are fringe elements. You’re usually more of a “high road” partisan. Why change now?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  16. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “Cha couldn’t resist it!!!!!!”

    Cha, apart from being as dumb as shit, is one of the most despicable racists and cowards on this forum, and for him to post a reference to Attwater’s view that a strategy Republicans could consider to get votes off the left in the south was to go racist is typical of his dislocated and mainstream leftist thinking.

    That the Republicans thought they might have to go racist to win votes off Democrats says more about the left than it does about the right.

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  17. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    So you don’t think there was a Southern Strategy, Reddy?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  18. Jack5 (5,167 comments) says:

    The people who would trim our rights to free speech with tighter “hate speech” rules are a far bigger threat to NZ than any racist. If you think NZ is racist check the link below, which I also posted a few days ago, and repeat because it contrasts so remarkably with the views of the far left..

    It would be madness to reduce our freedom of speech because Harawira talks of “white motherfuckers” or Labour activists urge apartheid-style separate governance. Similarly for insulting talk from whites.

    But in this case, you have leftists trying to brand our Prime Minister a racist, which he certainly is not, while other leftists have made racist smears against him because of his racial-ethical heritage. Those behind this poster are vile scum. They threaten our right to free speech. Let them migrate to North Korea, or Belarus or whatever rat-shit dictatorship would let them across the border.

    As for the Left being the home of racial tolerance: it was Australian Labor Party leader Arthur Calwell who made the infamous remark, “Two Wongs don’t make a White”.

    The Left is no stranger to racism. Think of Stalin’s deportation of whole “races” of people – the Chechens, the Volga Germans.

    Follow this link and see how NZ ranks in racial tolerance – very well!

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/05/15/a-fascinating-map-of-the-worlds-most-and-least-racially-tolerant-countries/

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  19. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    @kimble
    I remember being at a buffet function.
    There were a group of people, whom happened to be Maori, whom after eating 4 or 5 steaks each (fine, no problem with that) then proceeded to take more and throw them out the window for laughs.
    When asked politely to desist the entire bunch of them became angry and called the host a racist.

    Alas this is not an isolated incident, I have seen many other abuses along these lines over the years.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  20. RRM (10,034 comments) says:

    :shock: Wow.

    I think this sort of thing must be the reason why Clark & Cullen crushed dissent in the Labour Party, and hand picked ascendants.

    There are a lot of loose little cannons on the left. Few grown-ups…

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  21. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Keep it up lefties, keep it up :)

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  22. Jack5 (5,167 comments) says:

    Ryan Sproull posted at 11.04:

    ..The message seems clearly to me: “Nisbet’s cartoon is so obviously racist that denying it is like denying that the KKK and lynching are racist.

    Wrong! The message is clearly a despicable and false smear that morally John Key is on a par with the KKK. The cartoon question is just the peg to hang this on.

    What the trash behind this poster want is to limit our freedom of speech, like the Lefites of the Soviet Union, of China, of Belarus, of Vietnam. Fuck them.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  23. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Jack5
    The difference of opinion between you and Ryan goes, I think, to the difficulty of interpreting a cartoon rather than text in, er, black and white.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  24. Psycho Milt (2,419 comments) says:

    Gosh. If only these leftists could take an example from the polite discourse, scrupulously reasoned arguments and respect for opposing views that Kiwiblog demonstrates in its comments threads, perhaps outrages like this could be avoided.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  25. Fletch (6,497 comments) says:

    As always – it is the people calling for “tolerance” who are often the most intolerant people in the world.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  26. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    The KKK were not orginally established as an anti black organisation. They were a group of citizens who formed to remove some corrupt officials from a town.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  27. MT_Tinman (3,263 comments) says:

    The cartoon has convinced me National is the way forward.

    Well done.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  28. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    There ‘s a real danger in thinking that free speech is threatened by the looney ,extreme left and as such we are safe from them.

    This is erroneous complacency.

    Canada,Britain and Australia all have laws that fordid varying degrees of “offensiveness”.

    Our human rights laws are also open to interpretation and exploitation by the victim industry.Just a matter of time.

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  29. Jack5 (5,167 comments) says:

    Milkenmild posted at 11.43:

    …The difference of opinion between you and Ryan goes, I think, to the difficulty of interpreting a cartoon rather than text in, er, black and white…

    Yeah, well why is Key depicted in KKK clothes?

    My main objection is that this cartoon in effect argues for censorship of free speech. It would limit the right of Fairfucked Media to print Al Nisbet’s cartoons, or at least those which the offending “cartoonists” disagreed with. Their smear of Key is secondary.

    When did the Left ever stand for free speech?

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  30. Grizz (611 comments) says:

    I think this just reflects the people who create this political satire. It is like those fake election posters of the 1970s that came out last year with the n-word and the National slogan on the bottom. The extremists that put out such cartoons have this fantasy that the National party are that racist so it justifies all the bullshit and prejudice they have said about the National Party. It is convenient for these people to call them racist because they have not got much else to criticise them for at the moment.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  31. Rightandleft (670 comments) says:

    As Mikenmild has pointed out the KKK did not spring from the left of American politics. In the 1860s the Republicans were the left wing of American politics, led by a group known as the Radical Republicans. There wasn’t a policy much more progressive in its day than giving Black former slaves equal rights, the vote, free land redistributed from white Southerners and free education. The Democrats of that time were social conservatives.

    Now during the second rise of the Klan during the 20th Century the parties were more closely aligned to the left-right division of today. The Democrats, champions of the working man and populists tended to be more anti-immigrant and racist to protect white men’s labour jobs. Unions of that era were also notoriously racist in many parts of the US. Many Democrats of that era were KKK members or at least endorsed by the Klan. But Republicans were more pro-imperialism, calling for the expansion of US power overseas and the creation of colonies like the Phillipines. The Democrats charged the Republicans with murdering poor native peoples overseas while the Republicans attacked the Democrats for their treatment of minorities inside the US. Neither side had their hands clean.

    Right up until the 1964 elections the South remained solidly Democrat and the North Republican. That trend has since reversed almost completely.

    So it is fair to say the Klan was created by Southern Democrats in the late 1860s, but it is not fair to say it came from the leftists of the time. It came instead from reactionaries, ultra-conservatives trying to undo the changes following the US Civil War and end Reconstruction.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  32. Rightandleft (670 comments) says:

    Now on the subject of the cartoon I think Key was absolutely correct. Freedom of speech is the most important of rights and I think it is already too constrained as it is in current law. My feeling is that unless the cartoon or statement calls for immediate violence against a particular group it should be legal, even if it vilifies one group or another. People should boycott or write letters to the editor to any newspaper printing clearly racist cartoons, but the govt should not put people in jail or fine them for speech. Comparing Key to KKK members is absolutely over the top and unfair. In the classroom I have kids say I’m racist all the time, because they don’t understand what the word even means. Anything they think is unfair to them is ‘racist.’ What people perceive as racist is highly subjective.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  33. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Jack5
    I’m all for free speech, and some would call me leftist (left libertarian to be more accurate). I don’t find either of the cartoons offensive. I think it was a bit of a stretch to call the Nisbet cartoon racist, as a mix of people were shown, and the cartoon above was an over dramatic attempt to paint John Key as a racist, which he is not.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  34. Fletch (6,497 comments) says:

    ps, the Wall Street Journal provides a little history lesson in response to the “scrubbing” of the racist and segregationist history of the Democratic party from their website. The Left truly is the part of slavery – always has been.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121856786326834083.html

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  35. Fletch (6,497 comments) says:

    eg,

    the Democratic Convention of 1924, known to history as the “Klanbake.” The 103-ballot convention was held in Madison Square Garden. Hundreds of delegates were members of the Ku Klux Klan, the Klan so powerful that a plank condemning Klan violence was defeated outright. To celebrate, the Klan staged a rally with 10,000 hooded Klansmen in a field in New Jersey directly across the Hudson from the site of the convention. Attended by hundreds of cheering convention delegates, the rally featured burning crosses and calls for violence against African-Americans and Catholics.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  36. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Fletch
    Thanks for that link; it fits well with Rightandleft’s explanation above. A little thought experiment: if one were an American white supremacist today, would one vote Democrat or Republican?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  37. Harriet (5,145 comments) says:

    The Andrew Bolt case in Australia showed that if you refer to a minority group in any negative light at all – your being racist – and will be convicted for it.

    All Bolt did was question some ‘white’ aboriginals about their ‘aboriginality’ and if government grants were designed to be given to middle class academic ‘white looking’ abos like them.
    The academics took Bolt to court on the pretext that he had ‘vilified’ them.

    However the Liberals are going to change the law as the law was never designed to stop people from questioning and talking about matters around race.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  38. Fletch (6,497 comments) says:

    The Democrats:

    Democrats fought to expand slavery while Republicans fought to end it.
    Democrats passed those discriminatory Black Codes and Jim Crow laws.
    Democrats supported and passed the Missouri Compromise to protect slavery.
    Democrats supported and passed the Kansas Nebraska Act to expand slavery.
    Democrats supported and backed the Dred Scott Decision.
    Democrats opposed educating blacks and murdered our teachers.
    Democrats fought against anti-lynching laws.
    Democrat Senator Robert Byrd of West Virginia, is well known for having been a “Kleagle” in the Ku Klux Klan.
    Democrat Senator Robert Byrd of West Virginia, personally filibustered the Civil Rights Act of 1964 for 14 straight hours to keep it from passage.
    Democrats passed the Repeal Act of 1894 that overturned civil right laws enacted by Republicans.
    Democrats declared that they would rather vote for a “yellow dog” than vote for a Republican, because the Republican Party was known as the party for blacks.
    Democrat President Woodrow Wilson, reintroduced segregation throughout the federal government immediately upon taking office in 1913.
    Democrat President Franklin D. Roosevelt’s first appointment to the Supreme Court was a life member of the Ku Klux Klan, Sen. Hugo Black, Democrat of Alabama.
    Democrat President Franklin D. Roosevelt’s choice for vice president in 1944 was Harry Truman, who had joined the Ku Klux Klan in Kansas City in 1922.
    Democrat President Franklin D. Roosevelt resisted Republican efforts to pass a federal law against lynching.
    Democrat President Franklin D. Roosevelt opposed integration of the armed forces.
    Democrat Senators Sam Ervin, Albert Gore, Sr. and Robert Byrd were the chief opponents of the 1964 Civil Rights Act.
    Democrats supported and backed Judge John Ferguson in the case of Plessy v Ferguson.
    Democrats supported the School Board of Topeka Kansas in the case of Brown v The Board of Education of Topeka Kansas.
    Democrat public safety commissioner Eugene “Bull” Connor, in Birmingham, Ala., unleashed vicious dogs and turned fire hoses on black civil rights demonstrators.
    Democrats were who Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. and the other protesters were fighting.
    Democrat Georgia Governor Lester Maddox “brandished an ax hammer to prevent blacks from patronizing his restaurant.
    Democrat Governor George Wallace stood in front of the Alabama schoolhouse in 1963, declaring there would be segregation forever.
    Democrat Arkansas Governor Faubus tried to prevent desegregation of Little Rock public schools.
    Democrat Senator John F. Kennedy voted against the 1957 Civil rights Act.
    Democrat President John F. Kennedy opposed the 1963 March on Washington by Dr. King.
    Democrat President John F. Kennedy, had Dr. King wiretapped and investigated by the FBI.
    Democrat President Bill Clinton’s mentor was U.S. Senator J. William Fulbright, an Arkansas Democrat and a supporter of racial segregation.
    Democrat President Bill Clinton interned for J. William Fulbright in 1966-67.
    Democrat Senator J. William Fulbright signed the Southern Manifesto opposing the Supreme Court’s 1954 Brown vs. Board of Education decision.
    Democrat Senator J. William Fulbright joined with the Dixiecrats in filibustering the Civil Rights Acts of 1957 and 1964.
    Democrat Senator J. William Fulbright voted against the 1965 Voting Rights Act.
    Southern Democrats opposed desegregation and integration.

    Democrats opposed:

    The Emancipation Proclamation
    The 13th Amendment
    The 14th Amendment
    The 15th Amendment
    The Reconstruction Act of 1867
    The Civil Rights of 1866
    The Enforcement Act of 1870
    The Forced Act of 1871
    The Ku Klux Klan Act of 1871
    The Civil Rights Act of 1875
    The Freeman Bureau
    The Civil Rights Act of 1957
    The Civil Rights Act of 1960
    The United State Civil Rights Commission

    Republicans gave strong bi-partisan support and sponsorship for the following
    legislation:

    The Civil Rights Act of 1964
    The Voting Rights Act of 1965
    The 1968 Civil Rights Acts
    The Equal Opportunity Act of 1972
    Goals and Timetables for Affirmative Action Programs
    Comprehensive Employment Training Act of 1973
    Voting Rights Act of Amendment of 1982
    Civil Rights Act of 1983
    Federal Contract Compliance and Workforce Development Act of 1988

    The Republicans:

    Republicans enacted civil rights laws in the 1950’s and 1960’s, over the objection of Democrats.
    Republicans founded the HBCU’s (Historical Black College’s and Universities) and started the NAACP to counter the racist practices of the Democrats.
    Republicans pushed through much of the ground-breaking civil rights legislation in Congress.
    Republicans fought slavery and amended the Constitution to grant blacks freedom, citizenship and the right to vote.
    Republicans pushed through much of the groundbreaking civil rights legislation from the 1860s through the 1960s.
    Republican President Dwight Eisenhower sent troops into the South to desegregate the schools.
    Republican President Eisenhower appointed Chief Justice Earl Warren to the Supreme Court, which resulted in the 1954 Brown vs. Board of Education decision.
    Republican Senator Everett Dirksen from Illinois, not Democrat President Lyndon Johnson, was the one who pushed through the civil rights laws of the 1960’s.
    Republican Senator Everett Dirksen from Illinois wrote the language for the 1965 Voting Rights Act.
    Republican Senator Everett Dirksen from Illinois also crafted the language for the Civil Rights Act of 1968 which prohibited discrimination in housing.
    Republican and black American, A. Phillip Randolph, organized the 1963 March by Dr. King on Washington.

    http://realdemocrathistory.wordpress.com/category/kkk/

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  39. iMP (2,422 comments) says:

    DPF, I actually think you may be misunderstanding the cartoon. To me it’s critiquing JKey’s “subjective” statement (which I’ve been doing all week on my blog) and juxtaposing his vagarism with the very real and appalling evil of racism. I actually agree with the cartoon. You’re right that people’s use of the word is subjective, but that doesn’t make “racism” per se, subjective..

    I think it is silly to say that racism is “subjective” when its consequences and nature are appallingly real. Thats’ what I see in this cartoon.

    Insert another word and it becomes clearer: JK, “rape is subjective.”

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  40. James Stephenson (2,234 comments) says:

    A little thought experiment: if one were an American white supremacist today, would one vote Democrat or Republican?

    I think the answer to your question is probably “none of the above”, but then I’m not close to the US political climate. Move the consideration across the Atlantic, and it’s pretty clear that the BNP are deriving the vast majority of their support from disaffected Labour supporters.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  41. iMP (2,422 comments) says:

    But I agree it was racist and appallling to add the by-line at the bottom, whoever put this about.
    http://conzervative.wordpress.com/2013/06/04/demented-extremists-cartoon/

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  42. Right of way is Way of Right (1,122 comments) says:

    This is so very, very wrong.

    John Key has Jewish ancestry, and would never be accepted in to the Ku Klux Klan!

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  43. Rightandleft (670 comments) says:

    Yes Fletch, as I’ve said above the Democrats were for many decades the white working man’s party and the party of the segregationist South, so they did support racist policies up until the 1960s. Since then their policies have obviously reversed. It was the Republicans who enacted the anti-Trust acts and launched the progressive movement in the early 20th Century, but we wouldn’t accuse them of being socialists today. My point is that Republicans were once the party of the left and the Democrats the party of the right. You can condemn the Democrats actions in the past but you aren’t necessarily attacking the left. The democrats supported labour, but they were highly socially conservative.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  44. James Stephenson (2,234 comments) says:

    Insert another word and it becomes clearer: JK, “rape is subjective.”

    Actually a good analogy, some “racism” and some “rape” everyone will easily agree on, but there is obviously a disputed area of definition for both.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/10081842/Rape-is-not-always-rape-says-TV-presenter-Nick-Ross.html

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  45. Viking2 (11,576 comments) says:

    so there were plenty who ran off to Susie with a complaint and in this case I suggest the Nats. get some balls and officially complain about the above cartoon instead of sitting on their hands tut tutting as per normal.
    But they won’t, no balls.

    No balls, then stop complaining about others.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  46. RRM (10,034 comments) says:

    V2 – I think infantile shit like this cartoon is best treated with the contempt it deserves, and ignored.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  47. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Fletch
    As I said before, your links about the Deomcrats and rascism accord with Rightandleft’s account above. I think you are trying to hard to see the Democrats as a racist party in modern times. To take but one example, your excerpt above said that ‘Republicans gave strong bi-partisan support and sponsorship for the following legislation: The Civil Rights Act of 1964′. I’d invite you to look at this link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_1964#By_party and note that this act had strong support from both parties. This suggests to me that your source is a bit biased.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  48. b1gdaddynz (279 comments) says:

    Ironically the interpolation of such an extreme cartoon with such a mild statement does little to discredit John Key and in fact makes the perpetrators look even more idiotic.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  49. iMP (2,422 comments) says:

    I would agree b1daddy.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  50. b1gdaddynz (279 comments) says:

    I don’t think it would actually be worth complaining about as it will only give it more air than it deserves! It actually is so bad it almost scorns itself; I would be profoundly embarrassed to have anything to do with it’s creation!

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  51. ross69 (3,652 comments) says:

    So John Key and maybe other old weak guy manage to overpower 3 young fit blacks and hang them?

    Talk about suspending disbelief! :)

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  52. scrubone (3,105 comments) says:

    My point is that Republicans were once the party of the left and the Democrats the party of the right.

    Not really. You’re trying to fit every policy into a left/right straightjacket.

    The Democrats started adopting socialism back in the early 20th century. They’ve always been the leftmost.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  53. scrubone (3,105 comments) says:

    I’d invite you to look at this link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_1964#By_party and note that this act had strong support from both parties. This suggests to me that your source is a bit biased.

    The southern Democrats were at times almost a different party from their northern counterparts. If you look at many of the primary races back at the time, the southern states would vote for one guy, and the northern ones would vote another.

    Also, I’ve seen claims that many democrats who supported/voted for/signed such legislation did so grudgingly, or under pressure rather than because they believed in it.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  54. Komata (1,204 comments) says:

    I’ve probably missed it, but can anyone please tell me who issued this cartoon? The artist/author/issuing organisation, seems to be conspicuously absent.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  55. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    Radio NZ featured a rant against the Nisbet cartoons from one of their regular media commentators. He railed against polls (presumably TV 3 70/30) as “unscientific”… I recall similar relating to the anti smacking legislation (albeit unscientific).

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/2557390/media-with-gavin-ellis.asx

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  56. hj (7,067 comments) says:

    Interesting point Katherine Ryan raises about a journalistic elite being out of touch (no! no! no!) “those polls are absolutely unscientific…” (around 9′)

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/2557390/media-with-gavin-ellis.asx

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  57. iMP (2,422 comments) says:

    Komata, I think its an amalgam of an old vintage cartoon, with the words added and JK’s head. The head might be Minhinnick I think.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  58. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    Lincoln was a good guy…..maybe .But history is more complex than a movie and so much of what is presented as history is actually myth or propaganda.

    Lincoln wanted the blacks out of the US.As did many others.

    http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v13/v13n5p-4_Morgan.html

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  59. Ed Snack (1,927 comments) says:

    iMP, your analogy should strike a chord with many, in some people’s eyes ANY consensual heterosexual contact is rape. It is therefore true to say that in some respects, rape IS subjective. Another example would be if a person consents, and then regrets that decision, is it rape ? Again, there are those who argue that the answer to that is yes.

    On strict definitions applied equally, NZ is far more racist than is normally acknowledged, a significant proportion of the non-white population for example is prejudiced against whites, something not normally acknowledged as racism by much of the MSM. So racism, far more than rape, is intensely subjective, and worse, very politically subjective as well.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  60. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Racism is often difficult to define, and any definitions difficult to apply in practise. The example you give, of prejudice against whites, would not be deemed racism by some unless it involved an element of power.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  61. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “would not be deemed racism by some unless it involved an element of power.”

    Yeah of course. Notice how there’s absolutely no racism in South Africa now the blacks are in power?

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  62. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Just repeating what many commentators have said about racism. Re South Africa, I’m not sure one would say that “the blacks” are in power: how about there is a functioning democracy?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  63. Bob R (1,393 comments) says:

    ***would not be deemed r*cism by some unless it involved an element of power.”***

    This is the classic Cultural Marxist definition. Of course it means that a European person in Japan would not be able to be r8cist.

    A recent book in France looks at how the ‘anti-r8cists’ have actually become totalitarian and have violated their own stated values.

    “Pierre-André resolves this dilemma by arguing that antiracism has violated its own stated norms. It has abandoned its original values of doubt, debate, criticism, and free enquiry. It has moved out of the academy and into the police department. It has become the antithesis of what it once was…

    […] As the fight against racism becomes increasingly State-owned and professionalized, many antiracists have lost their status as freethinkers who oppose authority, and antiracism has taken on the face of repressive policing. Is there not a risk that the hyper-legalism of contemporary antiracism is leading it into hyper-conformism? Are antiracists forsaking the Sorbonne for the police department? Are they drifting away from the fight for justice and truth, preferring instead the dreary hunt for delinquents who say or write the wrong things? (Taguieff, 2013)”

    http://evoandproud.blogspot.co.nz/2013/05/thoughts-on-paris-spring.html

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  64. Bob R (1,393 comments) says:

    ***When did the Left ever stand for free speech?***

    @ Jack5,

    When it came to Communists being investigated for anti-american activities the Left were all in favour of free speech. Now that the Communists and their descendents (Progressive was a code word old members of the US Communist Party used) are in power, they are no longer in favour. Especially with the rise of the internet that bypasses their media propaganda. They’re all for criminalising speech that offends their sacred values and persecuting heretics.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  65. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    That’s quite thought-provoking Bob. Thank you. It points to the danger of a centralised bureacracy (Human Rights Commission) deciding what is and isn’t legiitimate freedom of expression. The best defence is the freedom of expression, and the freedom to condemn others’ expressions, as it were. I’d still maintain that at its worst, racism involves an element of power, from covert or overt discrimination against opthers to the use of state power as in Nazi Germany or apartheid South Africa.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  66. Bob R (1,393 comments) says:

    ***But this is how some people think. If you do not agree with them that the law should be changed to ban cartoons like Al Nisbet’s, then you are akin to a KKK member ***

    @ DPF,

    Another example of how the moralistic shaming device of “r8cism” is being used to demonise those who don’t role over for minority demands. Other examples would include those who don’t believe in race based laws who get called r8cist. It’s incredibly effective though, so who can blame the Left for using it when people bow so easily to it?

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  67. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    how about there is a functioning democracy?

    mikenmild. Democracy, maybe. Functioning, no way.

    It is violent brutal place and going from bad to worse. South Africa is well down the path to being another African shit hole dependant on hand outs… from the evil white man.Just like Zimababwe and its “functioning democracy” under black rule. Another example of going from a bread basket to a basket case. All so some comfortably off white people could feel good about themselves on the other side of the world.

    The blacks are far worse off than they were under the old regime. Western European “democracy” does not appear to work there.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  68. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Oh for the good old colonial days, then?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  69. Bob R (1,393 comments) says:

    ***I’d still maintain that at its worst, r*cism involves an element of power, from covert or overt discrimination against opthers to the use of state power as in N*zi Germany or apartheid South Africa.***

    @ mikenmild,

    Well, know doubt something is going to have more impact if it is done by someone/something more powerful than the recipient. Although, in terms of identifying it as a concept I think the Marxist definition is unworkable & unfair (eg not all members of a group are necessarily ‘in power’).

    btw. Frost had a couple of follow up posts in discussing that book. One of the things Taguieff notes is that more should be done to acknowledge it can go both ways:

    But “anti-White racism” has never really been recognized and condemned by organized antiracist activists as a full-fledged form of racism. Its importance continues to be minimized, and its dangerousness underestimated. The most common attitude is not to deny the existence of so-called “anti-White racism” but to consider it negligible. Professional antiracists—the heads and staff of antiracist associations—wish to preserve their monopoly over the definition of “racism” and the designation of “racists.” (Taguieff, 2013a)

    http://evoandproud.blogspot.co.nz/2013/05/can-antiracism-reform-itself.html

    http://evoandproud.blogspot.co.nz/2013/05/more-thoughts-evolution-of-word.html

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  70. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “The blacks are far worse off than they were under the old regime.”

    Not the point.

    The real point is that white farmers and citizens are getting murdered and/ or dispossed of their land every day by black gangs yet the protectors of racism (like Milky) have nothing to say about this at all. They don’t care.

    Proving that they were never really concerned about racism in South Africa in the first place. It was always about installing a Communist/ Marxist regime.

    As it always is.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  71. Bob R (1,393 comments) says:

    ***Oh for the good old colonial days, then?***

    @ mikenmild,

    You joke, but in terms of the wellbeing of the inhabitants it’s perhaps not the worst suggestion. In terms of infrastructure, jobs, governance etc. One idea suggested by Stanford economist Paul Romer is for ‘Charter Cities’. In terms of the living standards, Time Magazine notes:

    “Come Back, Colonialism, All Is Forgiven,

    Le Blanc and I are into our 500th kilometer on the river when he turns my view of modern African history on its head. “We should just give it all back to the whites,” the riverboat captain says. “Even if you go 1,000 kilometers down this river, you won’t see a single sign of development. When the whites left, we didn’t just stay where we were. We went backwards.”
    ..

    Le Blanc isn’t much concerned with that history; he lives in the present, in a country where education is a luxury and death is everywhere. Around 45,000 people die each month in the DRC as a result of the social collapse brought on by civil war, according to a study released in January by the International Rescue Committee. It estimated the total loss of life between 1998 and April 2007 at 5.4 million. For many Congolese like Le Blanc, the difficulties of today blot out the cruelties of the past. “On this river, all that you see — the buildings, the boats — only whites did that. After the whites left, the Congolese did not work. We did not know how to. For the past 50 years, we’ve just declined.” He pauses. “They took this country by force,” he says, with more than a touch of admiration. “If they came back, this time we’d give them the country for free.”

    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1713275,00.html

    http://www.nytimes.com/1991/11/15/world/kikwit-journal-once-a-colonial-jewel-a-city-hurtles-backward.html

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  72. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    What was unique about white-ruled South Africa was the extent to which an overtly racist regime entrenched itself in power and legislated for systematic racial discrimination. That was a situation that was repugnant to many people worldwide.
    Reddy knows nothing of my views on present-day South Africa or Zimbabwe. The murderous regime in Zimbabwe doesn’t somehow legitimise the earlier white minority rule, nor do problems in South Africa mean that it was wrong for democracy to arrive there.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  73. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Bob
    I’m not sure many people would seriously advocate recolonialism. There remain other more viable paths to development.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  74. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    I should have added that ideas driving the establishment of a Marxist government in South Africa were

    1) The strategic military advantage of controlling the base of the African continent and,

    2) Allowing the establishment of a regime that would allow Red China access to Africa’s resource riches.

    SA was just the start. The end game is an Africa completely controlled by Communist China. Unless the West wakes up, China will probably own Africa by the end of this century.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  75. Bob R (1,393 comments) says:

    ***I’m not sure many people would seriously advocate recolonialism. There remain other more viable paths to development.***

    Unfortunately, I suspect in 50 years they’ll still be saying that and people will still be starving :0

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  76. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    China is very entrenched in Africa. Whitey gives hand outs and China does business deals.

    It will be interesting to see what approach works in the long run. Generations of European do-gooders have acheived fuck all in Africa and the Chinese could hardly make things worse.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  77. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Frankly, I doubt that any current state has the ability to control even parts of Africa, let alone me entertaining some ‘Red China’ conspiracy theory.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  78. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    Of course Milky, you and every leftist who by your deceit enabled the communists to take Sth Africa would be just as anxious to play down the real intent re Red China.

    And its no “conspiracy”. I invite anyone silly enough to give credence to the words of our resident communist propagandist to check out any global geo/political strategy discussion site. Its common knowledge the Red Chinese want Africa.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  79. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Bob
    By development. I mean development models that are not so reliant on influxes of foreign cash. Sustainable development can only be driven from within a country and powered by trade and democracy.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  80. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    The Chinese are more likely to acquire the resources they desire from Africa through straightforward trade than through insidious plots. But cranks like to see things differently, I guess.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  81. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    We don’t like what someone has done, so dedicate a whole thread to giving them the attention they wanted by making the cartoon in the first place.

    Sigh!

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  82. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “European do-gooders have acheived fuck all in Africa and the Chinese could hardly make things worse.”

    The Chinese are not there to “do good”.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  83. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Red the Chinese are there to benefit the Chinese through trade and harvesting resources, in the best capitalist tradition. Africa is very rich but does not use its resources. The Chinese are helping Africans become part of civilisation. Good luck to them, they will need it !

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  84. nasska (11,822 comments) says:

    The Chinese will take over Africa, shithole by shithole, be they despotic or democratic. They will win because life under the rulers enabled by bleeding hearts like Geldof & endless Western aid will be so awful that Chinese authoritarianism will be vastly preferable to the African people.

    The only bright spot is that the wretched Islamists will be first against the wall.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  85. Komata (1,204 comments) says:

    Re: Communist Chinese activities in Africa: The Chinese govt. has studied European colonial activities in Africa very closely and come to its own conclusions; the chief one being that it can achieve the same end-result at a far lower cost. It’s methods are extremely simple and a variation on the old British ‘buy off the headman’ strategy which worked very well throughout the ‘Empire.

    Effectively China advances the local ruling despot enough money to get him into serious hock to the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). Having done so, it then calls in the debt and, if said despot declines the invitation he is ‘removed’. If however he is wise, the despot is then offered an interesting alternative. You stay as you are and control the locals. Do not let them have anything to do with us in any way. We (the CCP) will bring in our own workers, set up our own completely self-contained enclaves and commence mining / extracting operations. In return you are to ask no questions and treat said enclaves as if they were CCP sovereign territory. Anyone who decides to leave the ‘camps’ is to be returned and/or ‘eliminated’. Ask no questions and put nothing in our way and we will ‘reward’ you. We will continue to provide you with funds, support etc, etc. for as long as you choose. However, ‘cross’ us and you are gone, and o doubt another member of your family will be willing to take your place…..

    The result is that the CCP now controls most of the world’s rare-earth production (sourced in Africa) together with a high percentage of the ‘strategic’ ores necessary to sustain its growth. All without firing a shot and all done very quietly and very delibrately. Operations such as I have described are currently being undertaken in Mozambique, Angloa, Zaire, DRC (amongt others) and may well explain why the southern part of the African continent is relatively ‘quiet’ at the monment.

    The Chinese are not foolish and will continue to play this game as long as they deem it necessary.

    Finally, FWIW, a hypothesis. It is possible that something similar could occur in this country in connection with the Crafar Farms, now owned (by extension) by the CCP. The CCP has proven that the methods I have outlined work well, and as a result it could be considered feasible and logical to apply something similar to its NZ operations. To do so would make perfect sense to the CCP’s leaders, especially as the Chinese regard ‘Westerners’ as being more than a little ‘dim’. As part of such an operation Ag and Fish (or whatever they are now called) would be told only what they would want to hear and would probably not be inclined to look too closely at what was going-on on said farms, esepcially if they were subject to chinese sovereignty. Noticably, geogrphically the farms are also too far from anywhere to be too closely observed and the ‘imported inhabitants’ would have nowhere to go should they decide to ‘leave’ The prospect of freezing to death on the Central Plateau is not a particularly great incentive toward escape.

    As I said, a hypothesis, and yet a possibility…..

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  86. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “Red the Chinese are there to benefit the Chinese through trade and harvesting resources, in the best capitalist tradition.”

    Read Komata’s comment you superficial prog moron.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  87. Longknives (4,889 comments) says:

    I find it astounding that the Left, who can seemingly find ‘Offence’ in anything, aren’t at all fussed by a cartoon featuring our Prime Minister dressed in KKK garb….

    I freshly recall Ryan Sproull’s ‘horrified outrage’ at the Nisbet cartoon!

    Double standards anyone?

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  88. Bob R (1,393 comments) says:

    @ Komata,

    Interesting comment. Ironically, it tends to be those on the right playing the ‘r8cism’ card to silence opponents of Chinese ownership.

    @ Longknives,

    You need to follow the sacredness to understand what people get upset about in politics.

    “This is a heroic liberation narrative. For the American left, African-Americans, women and other victimized groups are the sacred objects at the center of the story. As liberals circle around these groups, they bond together and gain a sense of righteous common purpose….

    When sacred objects are threatened, we can expect a ferocious tribal response. The right perceives a “war on Christianity” and gears up for a holy war. The left perceives a “war on women” and gears up for, well, a holy war.”

    http://campaignstops.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/17/forget-the-money-follow-the-sacredness/

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  89. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Read Komata’s comment you superficial prog moron.

    Done… now what ?

    No surprises there. Are you worried about “human wights” all of a sudden Red ? :)

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  90. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “Done… now what ?”

    Don’t choke on the crow feathers.

    Your claim that the Chinese act in the “best capitalist tradition” is just completely untrue pro-Red China propaganda. Like so much of what you write.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  91. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Redbaiter you are more ridiculous than usual today. I hope you are ok ?

    The Chinese are the most ruthless unrestrained capitalists you could ever meet. Do not be fooled by all their power hungry leaders communist fantasies, which even they are abandoning. You are familiar with Chinese, if you have spent time in Singapore, so there is no excuse for being such a moron about this.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  92. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “You are familiar with Chinese, if you have spent time in Singapore, so there is no excuse for being such a moron about this.”

    To suggest the Singaporean Chinese who have for decades struggled to keep their country free of communism, have something in common politically with the murderers and criminals and totalitarian Army Generals who run China is something that might make me enquire as to your own health. Except that I recognise it as just another braindead attempt to move away from one of your frequent contradictory positions and to continue trolling.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  93. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Singapore lets in thousands of Chinese from the PRC. All over the world there are Chinese from the PRC who set up businesses and work their arses off.

    I guess in your simple wee mind you confuse democracy with capitalism ?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  94. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “Singapore lets in thousands of Chinese from the PRC.”

    As workers yes but not as permanent residents. Wrong one more time.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  95. F E Smith (3,307 comments) says:

    My point is that Republicans were once the party of the left and the Democrats the party of the right.

    and

    and launched the progressive movement in the early 20th Century

    Actually, Rightandleft appears to be confusing the left wing concept of ‘progressive’ politics with the idea of classic liberal politics, the latter being a concept to which the Republicans have been committed to from the very beginning. 

    Those opinions, which appear to be based upon a new interpretation of history that is trying to show that the modern Republican Party is in fact the current iteration of the historic Democratic Party and is historical revisionism at its worst. 

    The fact is that the modern Democratic Party is just as racist as its historic self, it just chooses to express it differently.  It is the party that wants to hold minorities back, to define them by their minority and keep them that way. 

    Powerlineblog spend a bit of time earlier this year picking apart arguments like Rightandleft’s, showing them to be in fact a left-wing revisionist argument.  It is pretty much the ultimate “it was you, not us” argument that the left likes to use whenever it is faced with its historic wrongs.  

    Nice try, mate, but it won’t fly.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  96. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    Well Said F E Smith.

    And appreciate that you made the effort to say it.

    These historical revisionists are so plentiful and so verbose it takes some energy to rebut their fabulous partisan bullshit.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  97. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Yeah there is not much Chinese influence present in Singapore Red. My bad.

    What about all those “communist” Chinese we have here in NZ slacking off, failing at school, living on the dole and committing heaps of crime !

    Dam communists expect the state to do everything for them don’t they ? :)

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  98. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Red when you have finished kissing Mr Smiths arse look up “classic liberal politics”.

    Hint: It is about keeping authoritarian pricks like you out of our lives.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  99. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    Chinese student’s political objections-

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10393697

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  100. Redbaiter (9,657 comments) says:

    “Hint: It is about keeping authoritarian pricks like you out of our lives.”

    Why don’t you give me an example of my “authoritarianism” rather than just continuing to falsely allege it.

    (But of course that is what trolls do)

    BTW, “classic liberal politics” has nothing in common with the intolerance and bigotry of Progressives like you.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  101. Komata (1,204 comments) says:

    FWIW:

    Chinese in Singapore (indeed, anywhere): It was put to me many years ago, that the Chinese who leave their country (PRC as opposed to ‘Taiwan/Nationalist China) are essentially a fifth-column, permitted by their (CCP) govt to leave, but with ‘conditions’ attached, and that their settlement in the ‘West’ is not an accident but deliberate and directed.

    It is intended to obtain the largest amount of information in the shortest possible time and to establish a cadre of ‘useful individuals’ in anticipation of as yet unspecified future activity by the PRC.

    While I cannot vouch for the veracity of the statement, my observations and personal experience as a result with contact with various ‘ex pats’ from Communist China would tend to support the ‘possibility’ of such an occurance.

    The Chinese are very, very patient. They will wait, then wait again, and then wait some more, but always have a game-plan and are never diverted from it. They operate quitely and unobtrusively, but the plan is still the same.

    Let’s just say that ‘the age of empires’ hasn’t yet passed, and that wars are not all about things that make rude noises and hurt people…….

    Those who are observant will know what I mean.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  102. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Chinese student’s political objections-

    Red, In my experience Chinese do not receive criticism of their country well. They will defend it, even if they agree with you.

    I think we all become a bit more nationalistic when in foreign lands and Chinese are no different. The only difference may be that they are proud of their culture and not ashamed of it as we often appear to be.

    I hope this has helped you understand the world a little better. I know it gets confusing sometimes.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  103. F E Smith (3,307 comments) says:

    Cheers, Red.

     BTW, “classic liberal politics” has nothing in common with the intolerance and bigotry of Progressives like you.

    Absolutely agree.  Progressive politics are a cancer on society. 

    EDIT: Or should that be “Progressive politics is a cancer on society.”? Either way, the sentiment stands.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  104. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Komata , sounds a bit out there, but entirely possible just the same.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  105. Johnboy (17,018 comments) says:

    It’s nice to see opposed chaps like Red and FES get together in comradeship! :)

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  106. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Condemning ‘progressive politics’ seems a bit broad brush. Reddy seems to equate progressivism with anything he personally dislikes (which is a lot). When I think of progressivism, I tend to equate it with the politics of Roosevelt and Wilson.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  107. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Speaking of comradeship Johnboy, how did this go ?

    “Johnboy (10,938) Says:
    June 3rd, 2013 at 5:27 pm
    Cunninglingus my arse Fletch”

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  108. Johnboy (17,018 comments) says:

    Fletch is playing for Wainui next season! :)

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  109. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Nice to see a Wainui supporter on a thread called ‘demented extremists’!

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  110. F E Smith (3,307 comments) says:

    When I think of progressivism, I tend to equate it with the politics of Roosevelt and Wilson.

    Exactly.  Regressionist, revisionistanti-democratic, divisive, stupid, politics of envy promoting, progressives.

    The Democrats have moved even more to the left since then, but it is still the same party.  It just says things differently.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  111. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    In that I don’t associate progressivism with any contemporary political thought…

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  112. Johnboy (17,018 comments) says:

    Sort of like National under JK then FES? :)

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  113. OneTrack (3,237 comments) says:

    Yes DPF, that is how some people think. If you don’t agree with them, you are the enemy.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  114. Nostalgia-NZ (5,282 comments) says:

    ‘A cartoon is a form of two-dimensional illustrated visual art. While the specific definition has changed over time, modern usage refers to a typically non-realistic or semi-realistic drawing or painting intended for satire, caricature, or humor, or to the artistic style of such works. An artist who creates cartoons is called a cartoonist’

    More…’Caricatures can be insulting or complimentary and can serve a political purpose or be drawn solely for entertainment. Caricatures of politicians are commonly used in editorial cartoons, while caricatures of movie stars are often found in entertainment magazines.’

    More…’sat·ire
    /ˈsaˌtī(ə)r/
    Noun
    The use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people’s stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of…
    A play, novel, film, or other work that uses satire’

    I don’t buy into the claim that the Nats are not racist because they have a multi racial membership base as dominated as it may be by ‘pakeha’ or ‘european’ NZers. Neither do I accept allegations that they are racist. This ‘cartoon’ is offensive, not foremost because of it’s petty and sick implications against the Prime Minister but because it in itself mocks and makes light of tragedy. JK doesn’t support ‘lynching.’ And few nzers do. The country is f…… if those that think lynching is some kind of joke or cartoon, satire or caricature of New Zealand life.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  115. F E Smith (3,307 comments) says:

    Mike, I have replied twice, but the comment has disappeared into the ether. They may turn up later.

    But, suffice to say that disagree!!!

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  116. mikenmild (11,777 comments) says:

    Suffice to say that I found Rightandleft’s account of the Democratic Party to be a cogent one. I’m not sure that much debate on the historical positions of political parties helps us too much today. I seem to recall that at one stage National and Labour were both keen to see themselves as the political heirs to the nineteenth century liberals.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  117. F E Smith (3,307 comments) says:

    I found Rightandleft’s account of the Democratic Party to be a cogent one

    Of course you did.  It allows you to believe the fiction that the left wing is always good, loving, and kind, and that the right wing is an evil, hating, dictatorial machine.  

    The fact that Rightandleft is wrong doesn’t really bother you, does it? 

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  118. LiberalismIsASin (290 comments) says:

    Heh. Then again fag marriage is the work of demented extremists, so you know…. what goes around etc.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  119. Scott1 (579 comments) says:

    The problem for China with letting Chinese go overseas is now the other countries are full of hundreds of thousands of your best people. That could be a pain if you decide to start causing them trouble since as much as they like China, because you can’t cause problems for their new country without causing trouble for them too.

    Spreading out ones people to the rest of the world seems like a more benign strategy pumping the other countries full of citizens that your citizens relate to culturally (and may well be closely related to) and don’t really want to be causing trouble for as well as forming interdependent economies via those relationships.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote