Blaming the victim

September 18th, 2013 at 7:00 am by David Farrar

The Herald reports:

The Indian lawyer for two of the four Delhi gang rapists sentenced to hang last week has criticised the victim’s parents for allowing her to go out at night with a boy, and claimed he would have “burnt her alive” if she had been his daughter.

The victim, a 23-year-old physiotherapy student, was attacked by five men and a juvenile on a bus she boarded with her boyfriend. The couple were on their way home from a popular Delhi shopping mall on December 16 last year.

She was gang-raped and attacked with an iron rod. She died two weeks later in hospital.

AP Singh, a defence lawyer who represented two of the convicts, claimed she had had premarital sex and said: “If my daughter was having premarital sex and moving around at night with her boyfriend, I would have burnt her alive. All parents should adopt such an attitude.”

All should burn the defence lawyer alive for being an arsehole and see how he likes it.

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34 Responses to “Blaming the victim”

  1. Doctor Who (52 comments) says:

    DPF: … women should burn the defence lawyer alive for being an arsehole …

    It’s outrageous but no worse than the crap spouted by some such arseholes here.

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  2. Harriet (5,145 comments) says:

    “…..All women should burn the defence lawyer alive for being an arsehole and see how he likes it…..”

    Yes true.

    But what exactly are the NZ government legal eagles saying about Muslim girls being taken to Indonesia and having their ‘exciting bit’ cut off with a sharpe blade?

    [It was reported in The Australian last year that the Australian Federal Police knew EXACTLY where Aussie and Kiwi muslim girls where being taken to.]

    The girls are citizens arn’t they?

    Won’t they later be able to sue the government?

    Is it ethical and moral for NZ’s legal fraternity to turn a blind eye to the ‘holiday trips away’ ?

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  3. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    Harriet

    What of the media’s role. Can’t say I’d heard of that.Any links?

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  4. Chuck Bird (4,928 comments) says:

    I have heard the media about forced arranged marriages a while back. Cannot recall whether it was Sunday or 60 Minutes.

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  5. Odakyu-sen (754 comments) says:

    Government’s role, legal fraternity’s role, media’s role…

    When and to what extent should we* try to make immigrants more like us*.

    *: undefined construct.

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  6. Harriet (5,145 comments) says:

    What of the media’s role. Can’t say I’d heard of that.Any links?

    No I haven’t, but i did read it in the Australian around Christmas time.

    Recently though, there was an artical in the magazine which comes with the QLD Saturday or Sunday Mail which had a journo who went to indonesia and talked with the mothers and ‘nurses’ who do the ‘cuts’. She also talked to one of the government hospitals who are allowed to perform them.

    The government has changed some rules around it with regards to age and how big the cut can be, but as the journo found out, the size is just ignored by those who do it outside of hospitals. I think the governments position was more a matter of international image than real concern as that was how the journo portrayed it. Cheers.

    [in the QLD paper it didn’t make mention of kiwi girls – but I presume it also includes them as The Australian confirmed that the Feds knew of kiwi girls going to Indonesia for it]

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  7. wreck1080 (3,972 comments) says:

    This is view typical view of women in backward countries and certain religions.

    Look at Saudi Arabia, a woman gets raped and she is to blame!!!

    India has some particularly scary human rights abuses. It can be a bit like the wild west with a dodgy sheriff .

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  8. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/commentators/fisk/robert-fisk-the-crimewave-that-shames-the-world-2072201.html

    Not only rape but murder ,in the name of “honour”.

    The more immigrants from these “diverse” cultures that our elites are so happy to celebrate and import the worse the problem gets in the once ‘First World” too as Harriet has pointed out.

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  9. scrubone (3,105 comments) says:

    It’s outrageous but no worse than the crap spouted by some such arseholes here.

    I suspect that most of those cases are one of hyperbole, sarcasm or trolling.

    It would appear that this guy actually was expressing his genuine feelings.

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  10. Odakyu-sen (754 comments) says:

    [The Indian lawyer for two of the four Delhi gang rapists sentenced to hang last week has criticised the victim’s parents for allowing her to go out at night with a boy, and claimed he would have “burnt her alive” if she had been his daughter.]

    The phrase “burnt her alive” may be a literal translation of what the lawyer said. In the cultural context, this could mean “be really cross with her.” It’s not just the literal words, it’s the context and cultural setting. Maybe hyperbole is a big thing in the part of Indian where the lawyer comes from. Who knows.

    You have to be really careful with any translation because of the potential for the translator to distort the meaning. (Half the time, the poor translator doesn’t really know either…)

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  11. Albert_Ross (311 comments) says:

    My mother often said to me that she’d have my guts for garters; I dread to think what might have happened if a social worker had chosen to take that literally

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  12. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    The phrase “burnt her alive” may be a literal translation of what the lawyer said. In the cultural context, this could mean “be really cross with her.”

    Odakyu-sen, this argument is often presented by Christian apologists here on KB. The bible demands that a rape victim must marry her attacker (Deuteronomy 22:28-29 ) while in other circumstances God demands the rape victim must be stonned to death ! (Deuteronomy 22:23-24)

    I am unsure if these provisions apply when God has demanded the rapes, as he often does. Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Judges 5:30 Exodus 21:7-11 Zechariah 14:1-2 ….

    Of course apologists often say this is about “context” clearly implying that rape is ok in it’s self, it is the context that matters.

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  13. Odakyu-sen (754 comments) says:

    I am unsure if these provisions apply when God has demanded the rapes, as he often does. Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Judges 5:30 Exodus 21:7-11 Zechariah 14:1-2 ….

    The reader of an English-language Bible has to assume that the term “rape” has an equivalent meaning to whatever word (or words) were used to describe the act in the source text that was translated to produce that English version of the Bible. (And if there have been a series of source texts, one having been translated from the one before it, then the risk of an inaccurate translation increases.)

    It’s a real can of worms…

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  14. Alan Wilkinson (1,900 comments) says:

    @Odakyu-sen, I’m sure the lawyer is fluent in English and well able to correct any mis-interpretation or translation. How the revulsion at his comments is supposed to aid his clients I have no idea.

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  15. kowtow (8,784 comments) says:

    kea is trolling again.

    Tiresome woman.

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  16. Longknives (4,889 comments) says:

    “All women should burn the defence lawyer alive for being an arsehole and see how he likes it.”

    Interesting – How quickly people forget that Ablett Kerr and King tried to use the ‘She provoked him’ ‘She was asking for it’ angle in the Sophie Elliot murder case right here in ‘idyllic’ little Aotearoa…

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  17. Odakyu-sen (754 comments) says:

    @Odakyu-sen, I’m sure the lawyer is fluent in English

    How do you know that the lawyer was quoted in English? He may have uttered the quote in his native language. (This is an assumption that I am making.)

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  18. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    kea is trolling providing biblical references again.

    kowtow, if you are so distressed by the clear words of the christian bible then I suggest you have picked the wrong desert cult to follow. Ranting about Muslims is not going to change what is written in your book.

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  19. ciaron (1,441 comments) says:

    Kea, a little light reading for you.

    I know you are an open minded soul, in search of truth and knowledge so you will find this helpful.

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  20. tvb (4,518 comments) says:

    Maybe the prick thinks she should be sate for having sex with his client.

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  21. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    ciaron, seems like your god is a pretty shitty communicator (as well as a violent sadist). I understand what is written in the bible just fine. You do not have a “open minded soul, in search of truth and knowledge ” as you try and distort reality to fit your existing biblically informed bias. You see the world around you through the lens of what you want to be true, based on a Middle Eastern desert cult.

    Try reading Richard Dawkins book The God Delusion. I am not suggesting it will change your mind, but it will inform you of the arguments of the other side so you are better able to address them.

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  22. scrubone (3,105 comments) says:

    I am unsure if these provisions apply when God has demanded the rapes, as he often does. Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Judges 5:30 Exodus 21:7-11 Zechariah 14:1-2 ….

    .

    I understand what is written in the bible just fine.

    Problem is of course that not one of those reference actually have God *demanding* rape. So at the very least you’re over-stating your case. At best, you’re reading something into them from your own culture, ignoring the culture of the Hebrew people of the times.

    Oh, and Dawkins supports “mild” pedophilia. So probably not the best person to quote in this context!

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  23. ciaron (1,441 comments) says:

    Kea,
    Try reading William Lane Craig’s books On Guard and Reasonable Faith. I am not suggesting it will change your mind, but it will inform you of the arguments of the other side so you are better able to address them.

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  24. scrubone (3,105 comments) says:

    Interesting – How quickly people forget that Ablett Kerr and King tried to use the ‘She provoked him’ ‘She was asking for it’ angle in the Sophie Elliot murder case right here in ‘idyllic’ little Aotearoa…

    There’s a difference between acting on instructions from your client, and embracing his worldview.

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  25. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    ciaron, I have not read any of Lane’s books, though I have heard him in various debates. He is one of the better considered Christian apologists.

    scrubone, I am familiar with the point you are making. However that can also be applied to all the other demands and directions given by god. One could dismiss the Ten Commandments on the same basis, (for example). As for your silly suggestion Dawkins is soft on kiddy fiddlers, and therefore should not be listened to on religion, I remind you that would disqualify the entire Catholic Clergy, many of whom actually are kiddy fiddlers.

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  26. cha (4,084 comments) says:

    Better reading.

    First century: Christ and the apostles are alive. People who knew Christ and the apostles are alive.
    Second century: People who knew people who knew Christ and the apostles are alive.
    Third century: People who knew people who knew people who knew Christ and the apostles are alive.
    Fourth century: It’s anyone’s game.

    http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/014838.html#014838

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  27. scrubone (3,105 comments) says:

    scrubone, I am familiar with the point you are making. However that can also be applied to all the other demands and directions given by god.

    Actually your comment indicates you have not really grasped it at all. My point is that you made a claim that is demonstrably false.

    As for your silly suggestion Dawkins is soft on kiddy fiddlers, and therefore should not be listened to on religion,

    Again, you appear to have missed the point. Dawkins has lost all mass-media credibility – he on the one hand claims teaching children religion is child abuse, but then says child abuse is fine. (And I’m sure you’re aware that he is not a professional in the areas his religious books talk about so mass-media credibility is really all he ever had.)

    I remind you that would disqualify the entire Catholic Clergy, many of whom actually are kiddy fiddlers.

    I’m not Roman Catholic, not sure what your point is.

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  28. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    scrubone, what was my false claim ? I am keen to correct it :)

    Did you mean my references to scripture ? I only quoted the reference, not the text. It appears your argument is with the bible itself not with me.

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  29. GPT1 (2,123 comments) says:

    That’s what we call a “bold” submission. Pretty disgraceful, court doesn’t care about the lawyers opinion their job is to represent the client

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  30. Doctor Who (52 comments) says:

    I doubt Dawkins finds paedophilia acceptable, merely that in some cases making a huge fuss about it does more harm than good, to the child. A scoutmaster smacking boys on the bum as they run to the shower is not the same as a Catholic priest sodomising a boy year in year out.

    Interesting too, generally when women complain about their doctors screwing them, it’s always when the affair has ended, sometimes years after the first “encounter”. It’s not acceptable but it’s not the end of the world either.

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  31. LiberalismIsASin (290 comments) says:

    Kea, I have read Dawkins God Delusion. His “arguments” against the existence of God are the rantings of a fourth former.

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  32. Doctor Who (52 comments) says:

    I would like to believe in the Christian God, and as soon as He gives me the slightest faintest vaguest hint he might possibly exist I’ll devote the rest of my life to worshipping Him in exchange for as much sex as I want during the eternal afterlife, or even for a long weekend.

    Kea, you’re not really Marni, are you? I’m getting all excited…

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  33. Kea (13,359 comments) says:

    Kea, I have read Dawkins God Delusion. His “arguments” against the existence of God are the rantings of a fourth former. could not penetrate my fog of religious indoctrination

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  34. scrubone (3,105 comments) says:

    I doubt Dawkins finds paedophilia acceptable, merely that in some cases making a huge fuss about it does more harm than good, to the child.

    Go look at what he actually said.

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