General Debate 18 December 2013

December 18th, 2013 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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135 Responses to “General Debate 18 December 2013”

  1. Keeping Stock (9,787 comments) says:

    The NZ Herald has lobbed a journalistic hand grenade into the Auckland Town Hall this morning with its front page editorial on Len Brown. Watching the fallout from this is going to be fascinating…

    http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2013/12/the-herald-on-brown.html

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  2. gravedodger (1,426 comments) says:

    That headline must be a finalist for flip flop of the year?

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  3. OneTrack (1,953 comments) says:

    Has the herald got a new editor or something. Just over the past few weeks they seem to have been a bit more …. balanced.

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  4. Keeping Stock (9,787 comments) says:

    It’s a smart piece of journalism Gravedodger. The leader writer acknowledges that the paper supported Brown initially, but can do no longer. It’s a pretty compelling piece of work, and it will be interesting to see what influence it has on councillors when they meet tomorrow. I think it is likely that the censure motion will become a vote of no confidence.

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  5. duggledog (1,102 comments) says:

    The Herald is not really the organ it was; if this headline had happened say 15 or 20 years ago Brown would have left the country, let alone resigned because of the power it had.

    However today the Herald is 50% advertising, 40% shit, and 10% readable. And Auckland Council is led by a philandering liar who spends OPMs like there’s no tomorrow

    F*** off Brown

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  6. s.russell (1,486 comments) says:

    National held theirMarlborough selection last night. Colin King has been dumped.

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  7. flipper (3,266 comments) says:

    Keeping Stock (9,373 comments) says:

    December 18th, 2013 at 8:02 am

    The NZ Herald has lobbed a journalistic hand grenade
    *****

    Wrong….
    In an Auckland context it is a nuclear tipped warhead…. AND EVEN IF IT FAILS to explode, it will become a neutron bomb that will forever destroy Brown – and his supporters.

    I can just see old reds like Lee and those dippy PI pollies from Manukau heading for the shelters.

    *************

    Paddling pool Maurice for Mayor. :-)

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  8. Azeraph (597 comments) says:

    Damn! It’s only local body politics that we can get ugly with otherwise in this era no one gets fired. Don’t you think this is a little weird?

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  9. doggone7 (487 comments) says:

    A feature of the whole affair is our reaction to it. The behaviour of Len Brown that draws the hysterical responses is characterised at the top of the Herald today as “lax accountability over grace, favour and entitlements.”

    Monstrous, fiendish, diabolical behaviour? Lucky he didn’t do something serious.

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  10. Paulus (2,291 comments) says:

    But as it now appears that Brown is mentally unhinged narcissistically, he will not resign.

    Like Nero he will carry on fiddling whilst Auckland burns.

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  11. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    The veteran Soper, a hack and unabashed fan of Helen Clark, writes:

    Incredible Luck will hit the bookshelves early next year. Its author is the dishevelled Doctor Don Brash who’s been down on it, luck that is, ever since ACT crashed at the last election, returning the hapless Banksie as the Epsom MP.
    .
    Perhaps the good doctor Brash should have titled his book Incredible Cheek, given the opportunistic nature of his politics. He’s spent the past couple of years cogitating, putting pen to paper, telling us about his incredible, lucky life.

    But no, he’s not planning a political comeback. Phew!

    http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/auckland/opinion/political-report-18dec-2013

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  12. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    Send the thug Hone in a one-way mission to sort these people out: http://news.msn.co.nz/worldnews/8772795/mandela-family-feud-during-funeral-report

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  13. Lance (2,309 comments) says:

    @gravedodger
    Exactly, I just about choked on my Cornflakes, wondering if it was 1st of April or something.
    The Hoorald… not pandering to a lefty?
    This doesn’t seem real.

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  14. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    For those who love to donate money to Africa: http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/12/16/republic-of-congos-president-who-never-wears-the-same-shirt-twice-spent-1-7-million-on-clothing/

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  15. doggone7 (487 comments) says:

    Paulus

    “… he will carry on fiddling whilst Auckland burns.” Is Auckland burning? What’s stopping ‘business as usual’?

    Is the real burning the seething of those who hate him now, and hated him before, didn’t want him elected in the first place and are incensed he won’t chuck it in and won’t be chucked out?

    Their true agenda is to get things done their way in Auckland and see Brown as an impediment to that. This is their big chance. The venom is not stopping them from seeing the big picture of progress for Auckland, the venom is giving them a chance for their vision to be realised. The obstruction to the progress is the one they are constructing. Councillors who don’t want to play on the team should resign.

    The venom of anti-Brown faction has moved from being about the deserved disdain and contempt for Brown’s behaviour to anger that they have not got their way, he remains in the job.

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  16. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    The Ruminator: Colin and Me

    Last Friday I spent an hour chatting to Mr Craig (and his press secretary Rachel) to try and get a glimpse beneath the hood.

    It became apparent over the course of the interview that we were seeing fewer and fewer unguarded moments, and Mr Craig is — with the help of his press-sec passing him notes — morphing into a more polished commenter who errs away from bizarre and into business.

    Although, one finds it hard to actually put your finger on exactly what business means.

    I’ll let Mr Craig’s answers speak for themselves.

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  17. James Stephenson (1,885 comments) says:

    The Hoorald… not pandering to a lefty?
    This doesn’t seem real.

    Probably been given the nod, that if they chase Len out, they’ll get Phil Goof.

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  18. flipper (3,266 comments) says:

    doggone7 (321 comments) says:

    December 18th, 2013 at 9:09 am

    *****

    Are you really as thick as you appear to be?
    Two short planks or Pig S?

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  19. doggone7 (487 comments) says:

    flipper

    The comments were probably about people throwing their toys out of the cot because they are not getting their own way.

    Thank you for being so obliging.

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  20. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    The Messiah’s on the wane. What a shame: http://www.businessinsider.com.au/obama-approval-rating-polls-nixon-2013-12

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  21. kowtow (6,685 comments) says:

    A corrupt cop gets community work.

    Judge says prison would be unsafe for him.

    So a clear message from the bench that the “Corrections” Dept don’t run their prisons ,clearly prisoners do (if they’re such unsafe places)

    and cops can break the law without fear of imprisonment . Oh dear ,what a mess.

    http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8772213/cop-to-be-sentenced-for-prison-smuggling

    ps There’s no corruption in New Zealand and let’s continue to celebrate and embrace “diversity”,as it’s so enriching.

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  22. kowtow (6,685 comments) says:

    doggone approves of corrupt practises by officials in high office?

    ps Embrace and celebrate diversity (Len clearly does) and there’s no corruption in New Zealand. Helen said so ,so it must be true.

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  23. Nookin (2,887 comments) says:

    “The venom of anti-Brown faction has moved from being about the deserved disdain and contempt for Brown’s behaviour to anger that they have not got their way, he remains in the job.”

    By all accounts, the anti-Brown faction is 96% of people polled. Counts for something.

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  24. doggone7 (487 comments) says:

    kowtow

    No.

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  25. lazza (296 comments) says:

    Credit … where it is due.

    Quote: WO today …

    Perhaps you should offer to teach a journalism course next year Cam, you seem to know what you’re doing :)

    And congratulations, you’ve won. Well done. I hope the people of Auckland recognise the service you’ve done for them because at the end of the day, this was never about Len’s party, it was all about his unsuitability for the high office he held. Some of us always recognised that, others may take a while longer, some never will. But know that some of us have always recognised that. Well done.

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  26. Ashley Schaeffer (336 comments) says:

    kowtow (5,929 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 9:21 am
    A corrupt cop gets community work.

    Judge says prison would be unsafe for him.

    Saw this on the news last night too Kowtow and was disgusted by the Judge’s comments. There’s nothing preventing the Prison authorities from putting him in isolation if they think he’s going to get the bash. Sounds to me like the cop has plenty of friends on the inside in any case. Corruption by officials should never be taken this lightly or it will only spread like a cancer.

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  27. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    P.G.’s sniping of Colin Craig continues under orders from his puppeteer in Ohariu. Good on you, loyal minion.

    Sign that the huge masses of UnitedFuture supporters are worried.

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  28. calendar girl (1,108 comments) says:

    Congratulations are due to Whale Oil for achieving this demoralising about-turn by the unprincipled “New Zealand Herald”.

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  29. kowtow (6,685 comments) says:

    doggone if you don’t approve of corruption in high office ,stop defending Brown.

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  30. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    It’s not a coincidence. It happens in Wellington, as well: http://www.bizjournals.com/washington/blog/2013/12/dc-far-outpaces-nation-in-personal.html

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  31. doggone7 (487 comments) says:

    kowtow, your inferential skills mean it is a delight to write stuff you will read.

    It means though I can’t say that two players didn’t handle the ball when the All Blacks scored their last try against the Irish because you might say I’m calling for Warren Gatland to replace Steve Hansen!

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  32. Ross12 (926 comments) says:

    Internal polling for the Greens must be getting bad, if this desperate rant by Norman is anything to go by:

    http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/20376619/norman-turns-financial-forecasts-against-government/

    or does he feel he is losing “column inches” lately.

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  33. Sofia (777 comments) says:

    So the Auckland City Council’s answer to Len Brown’s indiscretions is to not change the man but change the job – turn the Mayoralty into a glorified supervised position.

    Give the top job a sort of deputy status – the Council will supervise the Mayor, instead of the Mayor leading the Council.
    Fucking brilliant

    A vote of “No Confidence” would be a better option – instead of changing what is probably the third most important position in the country to accommodate a man whose continuing arrogance indicates he is incapable of change.

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  34. grumpyoldhori (2,410 comments) says:

    Does Craig want state sanctioned murder to be bought back ?
    There is only one small problem with state sanctioned murder, when a innocent person gets put to death.

    Still there are cops retired who still believe Thomas did it, and the planting of evidence was just to hurry things along to convict a guilty person.
    No doubt the cops involved in the Thomas case wish that the so called death penalty was still in force at the time, it would have saved the truth coming out.

    Why am I not surprised that some want a North Korean justice system.

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  35. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    You dork Moanolo, I posted to an interesting interview without comment, how can that be sniping? Craig wants attention, it’s giving him attention. You should stop and think sometimes before obsessing with dissing.

    And there’s more dorks too who have rushed to uptick Moanolo’s stupidity. Or don’t you want Craig to get any attention?

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  36. Harriet (4,002 comments) says:

    “….Judge says prison would be unsafe for him….”

    Then why don’t they just send him to Ardmore Military prison like they used to?

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  37. Nukuleka (77 comments) says:

    grumpuoldhori:

    We already have rampant state sanctioned murder of the innocent in NZ. It’s called abortion on demand. Thousands of innocent NZers get put to death each year.

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  38. Harriet (4,002 comments) says:

    PG #

    Thanks for that link to Colin Craig. He’s got the answers. He’ll come across very well to voters.

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  39. Weihana (4,475 comments) says:

    Nukuleka (38 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 10:16 am

    grumpuoldhori:

    We already have rampant state sanctioned murder of the innocent in NZ. It’s called abortion on demand.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring

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  40. Weihana (4,475 comments) says:

    grumpyoldhori (2,370 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 10:02 am

    There is only one small problem with state sanctioned murder, when a innocent person gets put to death.

    Agreed. But I think it’s also wrong even if the person is guilty just as severing the limbs of thieves is wrong, even if they did in fact steal.

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  41. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    P.G., I’m afraid your losing your cool, the aura of sensibility and common sense that characterises you all along.
    Relax and enjoy the ride. Christmas is upon us.

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  42. wreck1080 (3,522 comments) says:

    uhhh, perennial bore hosking to turn 7 sharp around.

    I guess thats how he rolls…..as self proclaimed so many times.

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  43. calendar girl (1,108 comments) says:

    PG@10:11 – “I posted to an interesting interview without comment, how can that be sniping?”

    Perhaps because you chose that particular interview to highlight?

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  44. hmmokrightitis (1,458 comments) says:

    doggone, I don’t doubt for a second that some are foaming at the mouth over the grubby little mayoral shit, but then you have to ask – who created the mess? Answer is quite simple, brown himself. The foamee’s have every right to foam, just as the left would if it were a right leaning mayor, he did it, no one else.

    The vast majority of us see him for what he is – a lying scumbag who is no more sorry than I am good looking, and who has no honour or decency whatsoever. There is a special place in some particular hell for pricks like this.

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  45. Harriet (4,002 comments) says:

    “…..We already have rampant state sanctioned murder of the innocent in NZ….’

    Yep……the government reckons it is better to have several innocent people killed in NZ each year from lack of detourance……..than risk the remotest unlikelyhood that they may kill one themselves……..shit……they won’t even lock the killers up for 50yrs to detour others from killing several innocent people each year……..which then validates YOUR opinion…..of ‘state sanctioned murder’!

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  46. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    calendar girl – so should interviews be passed by the Colin Craig Kiwiblog Committee before anyone links to them? FFS.

    Moanolo – you accused me of sniping when I linked without comment but with a quote that ended “I’ll let Mr Craig’s answers speak for themselves.” And you used that as an excuse to snipe at me – you’re a full of bull hypocrite. I know you like to try and protect your mate Colin but that’s just crap, and doesn’t help your Conservative cause at all.

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  47. mandk (682 comments) says:

    @ Weihana,
    So, you’re against capital punishment, but for killing pre-born babies.
    Logic fail.

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  48. Harriet (4,002 comments) says:

    “…..Agreed. But I think it’s also wrong even if the person is guilty just as severing the limbs of thieves is wrong, even if they did in fact steal….”

    Babies don’t steal but they get their limbs severed….why don’t they count in your world Weihana….they’re in our world…..inside a living women’s womb!

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  49. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    P.G., once again barking at the wrong tree.

    When have I said I’m a fan of Craig and the Conservative Party? All I did is to highlight your non-stop running down of the man, which started (by coincidence, of course) after your master labelled him “unreliable”.

    A libertarian Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

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  50. Weihana (4,475 comments) says:

    mandk (486 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 10:55 am

    @ Weihana,
    So, you’re against capital punishment, but for killing pre-born babies.
    Logic fail.

    Yes a spectacular logic fail on your part. I have made no comment on the ethics of “killing pre-born babies” I have merely observed that the subject is not relevant to the issue of capital punishment. I even provided a link to the Wikipedia article which explains the fallacy. I encourage you to read it.

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  51. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    You don’t need to say it Manolo. On Kiwiblog we can make up anything we want and accuse others of it, following your example. Complaining about “barking at the wrong tree” is very funny from you. As I said, Moaning hypocrite.

    All I did is to highlight your non-stop running down of the man…

    That’s more of your typical bull. It’s not all you did, you used it as an excuse to make up things to continue your serial sniping. And you’re wrong. In this case my link was neutral. Sometimes I’ve criticised your Colin. And sometimes I have been positive about him.

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  52. Tauhei Notts (1,508 comments) says:

    I think that Mike Hosking will be good at 7 p.m. television. His morning radio show is very good but for the all pervasive advertisements. One can use My Sky for Tv and erase all the annoying adverts. A pity there is no such tool to listen to radio.
    The sad alternative to his morning radio show is public service radio. Can anybody think of any Government agency that was seeking more funding, that was NOT given airtime on National Socialist radio?

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  53. Weihana (4,475 comments) says:

    Harriet (3,194 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 10:57 am

    “…..Agreed. But I think it’s also wrong even if the person is guilty just as severing the limbs of thieves is wrong, even if they did in fact steal….”

    Babies don’t steal but they get their limbs severed….why don’t they count in your world Weihana….they’re in our world…..inside a living women’s womb!

    Where did I say they don’t count? Whether or not one thinks they “count” does not inform the subject of capital punishment.

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  54. alloytoo (337 comments) says:

    @Ross12

    Luckily for us Wussel is an economic illiterate.

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  55. dime (8,746 comments) says:

    Manolo – you know PG thinks he is smart enough to snipe away at Colin Craig but do it in a way where he can weasel out of it. problem is, hes not. hes transparent as fuck.

    it is becoming an obsession (wait for him to accuse all of us of being obsessed with him blah blah).

    or maybe he will use the old – craig could decide the election shit.

    ya know who actually is batshit crazy PG? the greens. they could also be part of the govt. same with MANA, labour, nz first.

    course then there is dung. hes starting to switch sides. setting it up so he can go with labour next time and justify it to his 500 members. “im not a whore! i just have no principles and umm you can do more in govt than you can do out of it” as he goes straight back on the tit

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  56. mandk (682 comments) says:

    @ Weihana,

    OK then, what is your position on killing pre-born babies?

    “Whether or not one thinks they “count” does not inform the subject of capital punishment.”
    I rather think it does, since capital punishment and abortion are both about terminating lives.

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  57. Harriet (4,002 comments) says:

    “….Perhaps because you chose that particular interview to highlight?…”

    Probably. But all the right answers are there.

    It reminds of the Pauline Hanson situation – the more the media tried to ridicule her the more the public sympathised with her.

    And Colin Craig sure ain’t Pauline Hanson! Policy and support base is far far different. Votes will definately follow.

    The ‘Family’ groups and Christian groups -who are also ‘persecuted’ by the MSM- have been waiting for this for a long long time!

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  58. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    Wait for the supreme contortionist act from P.G. if, Heaven forbid, the whore from Ohariu strikes a post-election deal with Labour and “sacrifices” himself taking post as a Minister of the Crown.

    I can almost hear the perennial weasel-line: “Politics is the art of the possible.

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  59. Fletch (5,716 comments) says:

    I think that Mike Hosking will be good at 7 p.m. television.

    It’s not only Hosking, it’s Toni Street as well, according to a Seven Sharp facebook post last night (and linked to the TVNZ page)

    Two new hosts will join TV ONE’s Seven Sharp next year, with current presenter Ali Mau leaving the show at the end of this week.

    In 2014, Seven Sharp will be fronted by Mike Hosking, Toni Street and current presenter Jesse Mulligan.

    TVNZ’s Head of News and Current Affairs John Gillespie said he is very excited about the new team and thinks “viewers are in for a real treat”.

    Mr Gillespie described Toni Street – who is currently the host of TV ONE’s Breakfast – as a naturally gifted broadcaster and an outstanding journalist.

    “She’s ready to make the move into a primetime presenting role,” he said.

    Mr Gillespie said he was “delighted” to welcome Mike Hosking back to TVNZ.

    “He has a long history with TVNZ and we’re delighted to be welcoming him back. We think our new team will take Seven Sharp to the next level in 2014,” he said.

    Mau will leave the show this Friday, when the show wraps for the Christmas break.

    http://tvnz.co.nz/entertainment-news/new-hosts-join-seven-sharp-ali-mau-leave-5781149

    As for Mau leaving, good riddance I say.

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  60. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    ya know who actually is batshit crazy PG? the greens. they could also be part of the govt. same with MANA, labour, nz first.

    I know, I’ve commented often about those risks, which I agree are probably far greater the Conservatives.

    And I’ll repeat what has often been said, I don’t think there’s any way UF can side with Labour under Cunliffe unless Labour changes substantially, and if Dunne did switch sides (there’s no indication he will) I’d have even less to do with UF than I do now.

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  61. Harriet (4,002 comments) says:

    “….Whether or not one thinks they “count” does not inform the subject of capital punishment…”

    So you will now have to admit that deterrance of ‘whoever counts’ from being killed is really the subject matter of capital punishment!

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  62. Rowan (1,726 comments) says:

    England have been a joke and at this rate will lose the ashes 5-0, yes Australia have played well but I at least expected a reasonable challenge and not the feeble joke that the performances they have dished up so far.

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  63. dime (8,746 comments) says:

    Rowan – i think this england side has been on the decline for a while.

    We almost beat them in 2 out of 3 tests last summer (one saved by rain, one by an awesome prior innings).

    Warner, Mitchell, Harris and Clarke have been awesome for the aussies. In the last series only clarke featured for all tests!? and he was out of form..

    Warner is turning into a hell of a player. Criticized by many because he came from twenty20. The dude has 2 centuries and a couple of 50′s this series. averaging 90.

    Aussie go to South Africa for 3 tests in feb. Hope its on sky! will be awesome.

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  64. Weihana (4,475 comments) says:

    mandk (487 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 11:11 am

    @ Weihana,

    OK then, what is your position on killing pre-born babies?

    I certainly have a position on the subject but you have not established relevance so I choose not to discuss it.

    I rather think it does, since both capital punishment and abortion are both about terminating lives.

    As is a ribeye steak. Shall we discuss vegetarianism?

    Whether or not a convicted criminal has a right to live is not relevant to whether or not a “pre-born” baby has a right to live, just as it is not relevant to whether or not an animal has a right to live. To have an opinion about the rights of pre-born babies or animals does not imply a position on capital punishment. It is not logically invalid to hold that one has rights and the other doesn’t just as one can logically hold that convicted killers should be put to death but abortion should be illegal.

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  65. Weihana (4,475 comments) says:

    Harriet (3,196 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 11:17 am

    So you will now have to admit that deterrance of ‘whoever counts’ from being killed is really the subject matter of capital punishment!

    Yes I agree that is a relevant point to make. Disagreeable given that people still murder despite the threat of capital punishment, but a relevant point nonetheless.

    http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates

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  66. doggone7 (487 comments) says:

    Tauhei Notts
    “The sad alternative to his [Hosking's] morning radio show is public service radio.”

    There are dozens of other NZ radio shows. There are thousands of international radio stations on line. Do you mean there are no others which put forward the views you agree with?

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  67. Rowan (1,726 comments) says:

    Dime
    So much for everyone writing off Australia before the series started, Am not totally convinced by them as yet, to me the 3-0 scoreline is more about how bad England have been, The Aussies beat India 4-0 in 2012 summer in a similiar situation, and then were promptly flogged on their subsequent overseas tours and labelled the worst Aussie side in years so the jury is still out there.
    Yes David Warner is awesome, when he is on song he is great to watch.

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  68. burt (7,085 comments) says:

    OMG – Len Brown has resigned …

    Just kidding …

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  69. srylands (301 comments) says:

    “Am not totally convinced by them as yet, to me the 3-0 scoreline is more about how bad England have been,…”

    Well we will soon know. Australia are playing South Africa in 3 Tests in February.

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  70. dime (8,746 comments) says:

    I think they will lose to south africa 2-1.

    i think aussie would beat india at home

    i put them at 2 in the world and england at 4 (maybe 5, cant remember what pakistan have been up to lately)

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  71. burt (7,085 comments) says:

    kowtow

    doggone approves of corrupt practises by officials in high office?

    Only when it’s a lefty – It’s different when Labour do it ….

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  72. Fletch (5,716 comments) says:

    It’s looking like Edward Snowden stole literally everything, one of the reasons being, probably, as an insurance policy.

    Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden stole vastly more information than previously speculated, and is holding it at ransom for his own protection.

    “What’s floating is so dangerous, we’d be behind for twenty years in terms of access (if it were to be leaked),” a ranking Department of Defense official told the Daily Caller.

    “He stole everything — literally everything,” the official said.

    Last month British and U.S. intelligence officials speculated Snowden had in his possession a “doomsday cache” of intelligence information, including the names of undercover intelligence personnel stationed around the world.

    “Sources briefed on the matter” told Reuters that such a cache could be used as an insurance policy in the event Snowden was captured, and that, “the worst was yet to come.”

    The officials cited no hard evidence of such a cache, but indicated it was a possible worst-case-scenario. Some version of that scenario appears to have come true.

    http://dailycaller.com/2013/12/17/dod-official-snowden-stole-everything-literally-everything/

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  73. calendar girl (1,108 comments) says:

    PG@10:48 – there’s no need to become mildly abusive. You could help yourself by giving up the “FFS” style of aggrieved exasperation, and also by refraining from calling people “dorks” simply because they hold an opinion different from yours. Such outbursts raise doubts about a carefully-crafted image of reasonableness. Certain headings on your personal website (“Reason, Reasonableness, Robust”) seem recently to have been set aside as guiding principles of engagement.

    No, I’m not looking to have your links pre-vetted by any Committee. But I do question your linking to unflattering Colin Craig material, rather frequently and selectively in my personal judgment, and now claiming that:
    (a) you’re not “sniping”; and
    (b) you’re doing Craig a favour.

    And if you insist that, by questioning your comments, I’m “dissing” you (a predominately US term, I see, for “speaking disrespectfully” to you), then on this occasion so be it.

    (Disclosure statement: I am not linked in any way to Craig or his Party, and am not intending to vote for him.)

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  74. Rowan (1,726 comments) says:

    Dime
    The jury is still out on them, I don’t think they would justify a top 2 spot yet, would definitely be below India and South Africa for me, they are probably only on par with England overall given the nature of the onesided home victories to date. I think they will lose the away series in SA 2-0. Its a shame that India in 2012 and England this year haven’t put up at least a bit more resistance and the victories have been as one sided as they have, heck even we beat the Aussies in our last game over there.

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  75. Rowan (1,726 comments) says:

    The jury is out in the Helen Milner ‘Black widow’ poisoning trial, I think she is probably guilty and there is definite intent. Why would her own family testify against her if they didn’t think she’d done it? They would have nothing to gain by doing so. The only point that works in her favour is the amount of phenergen tablets suggested that it would take to kill, but there has to be a margin of error in this and she could have say laced his meal with it, and then prehaps slipped them into his coffee.
    Definitely guilty for me, although she may get of or get a hung jury, the way the standard of ‘BRD’ works

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  76. Yoza (1,343 comments) says:

    Fletch (5,261 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 11:57 am

    It’s looking like Edward Snowden stole literally everything, one of the reasons being, probably, as an insurance policy.

    From Fletch’s link:

    “Everything you don’t want the enemy to know, he has,” the official said. “Who we’re listening to, what we’re after — they’d shut us down.”.

    The very real fear of the NSA is the US public discovering they are ‘the enemy’ of whom the nameless official speaks. As with any state, including the US, the enemy is the general population and their subjugation is the primary goal.

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  77. dime (8,746 comments) says:

    “As with any state, including the US, the enemy is the general population and their subjugation is the primary goal.”

    but if we were communist, we would escape that! utopia!

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  78. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    A curious wee lecture calendar girl.

    by refraining from calling people “dorks” simply because they hold an opinion different from yours.

    That’s funny. Amongst all the “calling” here you focus on me calling a frequent liar and abuser a dork.

    Such outbursts raise doubts about a carefully-crafted image of reasonableness.

    An outburst, yeah, right. Your carefully crafted scolding raises doubts about your own motives. I don’t carefully create any image, I say what I think.

    But I do question your linking to unflattering Colin Craig material…

    Did you read the interview I linked to? Do you think it was unflattering?

    Craig willingly spoke knowing (and wanting) it would be circulated around social media.

    Manolo was being a dork. He jumped to a conclusion and rushed into an attack without bothering to check the link. Which you seem to have followed suit on.

    Are you trying to defend Manolo or is this just another of your occasional targetings of me?

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  79. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    … or is this just another of your occasional targetings of me?

    Cry me a river, Mother Teresa. :-)

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  80. Reid (15,505 comments) says:

    As with any state, including the US, the enemy is the general population and their subjugation is the primary goal.

    Along with the public of every other country in the world, Yoza. NSA could call up me, you, DPF, anyone. They could get a minute-by-minute breakdown of our every movement, every phone call, text, email, bank transaction, CCTV footage you name it. Their new data centre in Utah is so big it needs its own power station.

    Of course this is all fine, since you and I and DPF etc don’t commit any crimes. But the National Defence Authorisation Act permits the US to rendition anyone in the world including you and I and DPF etc and hold us forever without trial. And guess what “crimes” it includes? Graffiti. That’s right.

    So wake up those who still hallucinate it’s Morning in America. It’s 1984 and it has been for some time. All they need is an excuse to swing the apparatus into action.

    And sadly, when that excuse happens, those who hallucinate it’s Morning in America will be the very one’s sagely nodding their heads at the regrettable but necessary tactics required to combat the evil tewwowists, which is how they’ve sold all this to said useful idiots all along.

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  81. stigie (614 comments) says:

    OMG – Len Brown has resigned …

    Just kidding …

    Fuck…Burt, ive just coughed coffee all over my screen and keyboard !!~

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  82. wreck1080 (3,522 comments) says:

    children!

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  83. dime (8,746 comments) says:

    “Auckland mayor Len Brown has lamented his ‘annus horribilis’ ”

    so he laments being caught. He was fucking sluts on the side and jerking off all over himself in the mayors office last year and the year before as well.

    the dude is about as delusional as PG

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  84. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    The sisterhood strengthens across the Tasman: http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/selfinflicted-wounds-an-opening-for-enemies/story-fni0cwl5-1226785302335

    Exactly how much the Australian taxpayer is paying for its new ambassador has been difficult to ascertain. After two days of inquiries to the Department of Foreign Affairs, a spokeswoman divulged that Stott Despoja would be paid a daily rate “according to the Remuneration Tribunal Rates for a Category 3 Chairperson”. That appears to be $698 a day, with $493 a day accommodation and $170 a day for meals within Australia.

    No wonder Stott Despoja describes it as her “dream job”.

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  85. cha (3,524 comments) says:

    Oh dear, the old fucker didn’t live long enough…

    http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/doomsday-minister-harold-camping-dead-92-21248011

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  86. edhunter (434 comments) says:

    I don’t think you can under estimate the importance of winning the coin toss, well at least over the last 2 Ashes series, 8 coin tosses 6 wins to the coin toss winner & 2 draws. In saying that the poms have been poor they’ve certainly had their chances but failed to capitalize on them & their batting has been abysmal.
    I’m secretly hoping the aussies get smashed in SA.

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  87. Reid (15,505 comments) says:

    “Auckland mayor Len Brown has lamented his ‘annus horribilis’ ”

    He’s playing the sympathy card, which is entirely in keeping for someone with narcissistic personality disorder. For he hallucinates he hasn’t done anything particularly wrong, the blame lies with those who have ‘attacked him.’

    Further, by using that phrase, he associates himself with another high-status individual, just as he perceives himself to be.

    The thing he misses which everyone else gets, is that the Queen wasn’t responsible for her year, he is entirely responsible for his. But that goes right over his head.

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  88. Rowan (1,726 comments) says:

    Very true Edhunter
    I’m hoping to see a game won by the team who lost the toss and won batting second, neither of which have occured in any of the Ashes games to date.

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  89. cha (3,524 comments) says:

    The rehabilitation of Vladimir Putin – member of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union to conservative defender of moral clarity.

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  90. lilman (658 comments) says:

    LUC HANSEN ? What ever happened to luke?

    Was thinking of Brown,Hone and other wankers and was wondering what happpend to him?

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  91. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    He said he had been making a lot of apologies recently and was copping “a fair old whack around the ears”.

    Brown fails to understand that the whacking continues because he fails to make proper apologies, he keeps blaming ‘lack of clarity’, he says others do it, and he doesn’t see that digging away won’t make it go away.

    He laments that the “damage has been most profound” at home – because at home he can be given the sack. But he doesn’t see that the damage is escalating at work as well.

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  92. iMP (2,147 comments) says:

    National has effectively ousted Colin King as Nat MP for Kaikoura, being replaced with another farmer as the candidate a year out from the election.

    http://conzervative.wordpress.com/2013/12/18/nats-oust-kaikoura-mp/

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  93. RRM (8,988 comments) says:

    “Brown fails to understand that the whacking continues…”

    I don’t want to know whether or not Len Brown’s whacking continues, thank you very much.

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  94. Reid (15,505 comments) says:

    Councillors will attempt a no-confidence motion tomorrow. Note the photo. Pravda has turned against Len. Et tu, Pravda?

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11174578

    P.S. What’s the bet the photo was filed in Pravda’s library under keyword “supercilious, Brown, Len”

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  95. wreck1080 (3,522 comments) says:

    how on earth can len work as mayor when he has crowds of people chasing him down the street yelling out things like….

    “It’s not okay to root in the mayoral office,” and “Shame shame shame,” the group chanted.

    Imagine him hosting business people and other vip’s and maintain respect.

    He has lost both respect and integrity (although integrity was lost a long time ago). Surely that is a prereq to being an effective mayor? Now he just looks like a desperate man trying to pay his mortgage. This will be his last paying job for some time I would imagine.

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  96. grumpyoldhori (2,410 comments) says:

    Damn it seems Craig is confused, admires that dumb cow Palin for taking money from the oil companies and giving it to the peasants of
    Alaska.
    Does Craig believe in socialism ?

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  97. peterwn (2,932 comments) says:

    iMP – No, it is the National Party members in his electorate who decided they wanted a change. An electorate is like a garden, and as Maggie Barry will readily confirm, a garden needs regular tending and watering.

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  98. iMP (2,147 comments) says:

    Peterwn “National” in Kaikoura IS the “national party members.” Hell-o?

    David Cunliffe desperately needs some weeding gloves and a rake, and by that I don’t mean Trevor.

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  99. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    Patrick Gower makes his political awards.

    Politician of the Year – Bill English

    Key is 52, English is 51 – the prime of their lives in some senses. They are not going to hand over power lightly.
    The political reality is that to take down National, the Opposition will have to knock out English too. And that’s what makes Bill English Politician of the Year.

    RUNNER UP (OPPOSITION POLITICIAN): David Cunliffe

    Cunliffe went from unwanted backbencher hated by much of his own caucus, to Labour Party leader with a better than even chance of becoming Prime Minister.

    RUNNER UP (MINOR PARTY POLITICIAN): Colin Craig

    What to say about Colin Craig? Not much, because so much has been said already. But Craig is far and away the Minor Party politician of the year. That’s partly because he’s still standing as the others dropped like flies.

    RUNNER UP (BACKBENCH MP): Louisa Wall

    Louisa Wall did what many backbenchers or MPs never do – she changed a law. She got same-sex marriage introduced. Quite an achievement – and it deserves to be saluted.

    http://www.3news.co.nz/Opinion-Politician-of-the-Year—Bill-English/tabid/1382/articleID/325632/Default.aspx

    I think they are good calls.

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  100. MT_Tinman (2,790 comments) says:

    The NZ police state advanced one step further today.

    You can now receive an instant fine (with no genuine recourse) because some corrupt pig had an argument with his boyfriend before starting his shift.

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  101. redqueen (342 comments) says:

    @Reid

    Should be an interesting motion…at the very least, it will give a good idea who not to vote for in the next council election.

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  102. labrator (1,691 comments) says:

    Got more posts a day out of DPF when he was hiking.

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  103. Rowan (1,726 comments) says:

    15 years for cold blooded murder, whats a life really worth? I’d have given him at least 20
    http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/journalist-s-killer-jailed-5781741

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  104. Yoza (1,343 comments) says:

    Manolo (11,647 comments) says:
    December 18th, 2013 at 12:46 pm

    The sisterhood strengthens across the Tasman: http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/selfinflicted-wounds-an-opening-for-enemies/story-fni0cwl5-1226785302335

    Australia is a very corrupt country. The most obvious way, for those politicians in power, to maintain the free flow of backhanders, bribes and junkets without pesky opposition politicians drawing attention to the feeding frenzy is to let those opposition politicians in on a share of the spoils.


    “Government insiders claim they are striving to be bipartisan, following the “Rudd template”, if you can believe it.”

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  105. Gulag1917 (425 comments) says:

    Economic depression on the way?
    http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/dent-faber-celente-maloney-rogers-what-do-they-say-is-coming-in-2014

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  106. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    A nice chat between the two? http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/17/merkel-compares-nsa-stasi-obama

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  107. brucech (3 comments) says:

    The Chair for the Royal Commission on Auckland Governance said in 2010 about the then proposed Super City Mayoral function:
    “Auckland City can speak with one strong voice and have a clear identity”

    We need “one Mayor who can be the Auckland face to the world and to the rest of New Zealand and who can engage with all sectors of the Auckland Community. This provides a good basis for potential with the private sector and with central government”

    Mayors need to have Mana and statesman like qualities. Brown is unable to do this any more. He is seen as a clown.

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  108. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    Interesting column on The male friendship crisis

    Citing both her own and others’ research on the topic, sociologist Lisa Wade says that white heterosexual men have fewer friends than any other demographic. This, despite their yearning for closer, more intimate platonic connections with other men:

    “When I first began researching this topic I thought, surely this is too stereotypical to be true,” she writes. “Or, if it is true, I wondered, perhaps the research is biased in favor of female-type friendships. In other words, maybe we’re measuring male friendships with a female yardstick. It’s possible that men don’t want as many or the same kinds of friendships as women.

    “But they do. When asked about what they desire from their friendships, men are just as likely as women to say that they want intimacy. And, just like women, their satisfaction with their friendships is strongly correlated with the level of self-disclosure. Moreover, when asked to describe what they mean by intimacy, men say the same thing as women: emotional support, disclosure and having someone to take care of them.”

    Deep friendship, she says, requires empathy, vulnerability and warmth: qualities that equate with girly-ness. Which equates with being lesser. So straight men tend to develop what friendship scholar Geoffrey Greif calls “shoulder-to-shoulder” friendships (doing things) in contrast to the “face-to-face” friendships (discussing things) typical of women.

    As a result, “If a man does have a confidant, three-quarters of the time it’s a woman, and there’s a good chance she’s his wife or girlfriend.”

    The research was in the US but I wouldn’t be surprised it it applies here too.

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  109. cha (3,524 comments) says:

    See Pete, that’s why we need more drinking schools mens groups.

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  110. kowtow (6,685 comments) says:

    Sociology 101.

    “White middle class males are bad,sorry losers…..

    All others are not”

    Embrace and celebrate diversity,it enriches you and your boring white culture.

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  111. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    Deep friendship, she says, requires empathy, vulnerability and warmth: qualities that equate with girly-ness. Which equates with being lesser.

    I call that bullshit. An academic’s leap of thought gone completely wrong.

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  112. dime (8,746 comments) says:

    Rowan – id have him put down like a pitbull who attacks someone

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  113. Chuck Bird (4,401 comments) says:

    Brown faces no confidence motion

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9530273/Brown-faces-no-confidence-motion

    Does anyone know who the woman in the video is? I do not think it looks like his wife. Could it be his daughter?

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  114. Weihana (4,475 comments) says:

    http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/172859-google-acquires-boston-dynamics-and-seven-other-robotics-companies-next-stop-judgment-day


    Google, the search engine and advertising company, has acquired Boston Dynamics — the robotics and engineering company famous for the creation of some of the world’s most advanced robots, including BigDog, Cheetah, Petman, and Atlas. This brings Google’s total number of robot-related acquisitions to eight, and the company now has teams of robotics experts in California and Japan. As we’ve previously reported, Google’s robots efforts will be led by Andy Rubin, who was formerly in-charge of Android. It is clear that Google is seriously — and rather suddenly — interested in robots. What isn’t clear, though, is why. Is Google planning some kind of synergistic and masterful play to integrate its AI and machine learning software algorithms with humanoid helper robots? Is this the start of a story that ultimately leads to the technological singularity and Judgment Day?

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  115. RF (1,126 comments) says:

    I tuned into Newstalk ZB at 5am this morning and heard this women talking in a flat, boring voice. I thought she might have been the midnight host and feeling worn out after a hard night.

    No !!!! It was Rachel Smalley and she had just started her hour shift. What a hopeless person. No personality, just droned on being drowned out by background music.

    Useless !!!!

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  116. Manolo (12,614 comments) says:

    What a beast. White trash at its worst: http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8773203/blonde-bikini-woman-in-screwdriver-road-rage-attack

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  117. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    What a beast. White trash at its worst: http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8773203/blonde-bikini-woman-in-screwdriver-road-rage-attack

    Maybe so but the stereotypical fuckwit Asian driver exists for a good reason. It’s true.

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  118. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    Murder accused Helen Milner – where do these people come from ? What a fucking hideously ugly white bitch she is. If she was bald – you couldn’t tell what sex it was without flipping it.

    What decade is that fuck-awful hairstyle from ? The 40s? Green Village Hair Care ?

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  119. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    Her gorgeous looks are definitely wasted on the radio RF. Terrible, terrible waste.

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  120. nasska (9,475 comments) says:

    LR&C

    When I first saw a photo of Helen Milner in the dock the first similar image to mind was Dame Edna Everage. :)

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  121. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    Nazzie I’m reading bits of ‘Meatonomics’. It’s author is a lawyer, the book paints an ugly picture of the US animal products industry.

    Turning the issue locally, is NZ farming plundering and polluting the resources to oblivion ?

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  122. MH (558 comments) says:

    The Ashes – full credit to the cricket pitch,had more cracks in it than unearthed in Christchurch.

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  123. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    Why do women news presenters when standing and women reporters turn 45 degrees on to the camera to talk ?

    IT’S JUST FUCKING MENTAL !!

    Have you stood talking to anyone like that ? Facing one direction with your head fixed to the side ? No. It’s weird.

    I’m glad they shield me from the full horror of seeing the actual width of their gruesome size nothing hours of cardio invested body shapes.

    TV makes you look ‘fat’. So try to hide on a 45. Good one idiots.

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  124. calendar girl (1,108 comments) says:

    PG@12:33 – “Manolo was being a dork. He jumped to a conclusion and rushed into an attack without bothering to check the link. Which you seem to have followed suit on. Are you trying to defend Manolo or is this just another of your occasional targetings of me?”

    So the personal abuse continues. According to the Concise Oxford English Dictionary the word “dork” means (1) (informal) a socially inept person; or (2) (North American vulgar slang) a man’s penis. So to prevent us misinterpreting your comments again, you could indicate which insult you intended.

    Targeting you? Like the attention that you’ve trained on Colin Craig’s comments over recent months? You flatter yourself, Pete.

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  125. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    Small gripes about TV3 news reporting (you only watch TV news for the pretty pictures anyway)…..

    Such and such celebrity son was three times the drink drive limit. Sure, which one though ? The youth one where you could lick soap and blow a fail ? Or the adult one ? Makes a difference to me anyway.

    Someone stabbed in the neck. Yep – with what ? It doesn’t have to be a knife. If a knife, what kind ? Stabbed once in the neck ? Multiple times ? Where’s the detail ?

    Reporter Ashlee Turley (spelling?)- ‘boat ran out of gas’. Petrol, fuel, diesel ? Informality has its place – I don’t like it in news reporting. What next ? Boat ran out of go-go juice ? Is this just catering to viewers that are now so americanised that it might actually cost advertising dollars not to pander to the now more widely understood Ameranisms or the demographic that dominates the news ratings ? Trying to capture the demographic with the most cash to spend, which prefers AmeriEnglish ?

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  126. nasska (9,475 comments) says:

    ….”is NZ farming plundering and polluting the resources to oblivion”….

    It depends LR&C. Dairying is getting caned for its effects on the environment & there’s a basis of truth to the claims. Dairy cockies have perfected the art of turning mud into milk….the problem is that mud & crap flows downhill & when it enters waterways the effects are not nice. The Regional Councils via the RMA are making life difficult for those who ignore all responsibility in favour of an extra monetary return.

    The Greens want to decrease cow numbers by about 20% but as usual they are taking a simplistic approach. Some land that has undergone dairy conversion is simply not suitable for that purpose. Steep land farmed intensively erodes easily & the runoff contains unused fertiliser. Sheep & beef is relatively easy on the land & waterways.

    I doubt that we’ll ever get it totally pure & green but somewhere along the line some of the desktop experts should consider just how NZ would pay the bills without farming. NZ exports total around $50 billion pa…..agriculture contributes about a third of that.

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  127. Viking2 (10,695 comments) says:

    A psychiatrist visited a California mental institution and asked a patient, “How did you get here? What was the nature of your illness?” He got the following reply.

    “Well, it all started when I got married and I guess I should never have done it. I married a widow with a grown daughter who then became my stepdaughter.

    My dad came to visit us, fell in love with my lovely stepdaughter, then married her. And so my stepdaughter was now my stepmother. Soon, my wife had a son who was, of course, my daddy’s brother-in-law since he is the half-brother of my stepdaughter, who is now, of course, my daddy’s wife.

    So, as I told you, when my stepdaughter married my daddy, she was at once my stepmother! Now, since my new son is brother to my stepmother, he also became my uncle. As you know, my wife is my step-grandmother since she is my stepmother’s mother. Don’t forget that my stepmother is my stepdaughter. Remember, too, that I am my wife’s grandson.

    But hold on just a few minutes more. You see, since I’m married to my step-grandmother, I am not only the wife’s grandson and her hubby, but I am also my own grandfather. Now can you understand how I got put in this place?”

    After staring blankly with a dizzy look on his face, the psychiatrist replied: “Move over!”

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  128. nasska (9,475 comments) says:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/7c8e3tol6gfgf06/Xmas%20B.jpg

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  129. Scott Chris (5,675 comments) says:

    Giant rabbit:

    http://snopes.com/photos/animals/giantrabbit.asp

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  130. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    (1) Thanks Nazzareth of Eketahuna. The great farm NZ gets a mention in the book when describing the nonsense notion of ‘food miles’, using the example of NZ lamb having a much lower total life cycle carbon cost than British lamb, and the transport carbon cost being around 10% of the bottomline to think about. He uses milk powder as another example of the same thing. NZ efficiencies far exceed the ‘food miles’ cost.

    (2) Can anyone find me a link to a builder Damon father of five on One News this evening who lost his son to I think leukemia and blames the son’s iphone and wifi in the classroom ? And was that really the cause ? What modern invisible dangers lurk with waves and signals etc?

    (3) Herald website has one ‘ologist’ saying that when you take cats out of the equation, the birds are worse off because cats kill rats, and rats eat birds eggs from nests. Birds lose more without cats. Has anyone told Gareth about this ?

    (4) bikini white trash road rage youtube Upper Hutt girl – it really didn’t live up to the hype. I think the screw driver had more meat on it than she did.

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  131. Left Right and Centre (2,388 comments) says:

    This is what I REALLY want to type about…..

    If Seven Sharp is soooooooo incredibly shit, why why why why why why why why why oh why then is it still waaaaaaaaaay ahead of the Chipmonk Crusader in the ratings ??

    Can someone explain that mystery to everyone else ?? :) :)

    What do you reckon ? Old ‘It’s In The Bag’ episodes from 1975 could pull 300K at 7pm on TV1 ?

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  132. nasska (9,475 comments) says:

    Doug meets Bill at the bar for their usual after work drink.
    Bill is sitting there looking somewhat depressed.

    Doug asks, “What’s wrong pal?”

    Bill replies, “Well, I finally succeeded in talking my
    girlfriend in to a threesome.”

    “Wow, lucky you. But why the long face?” Doug remarks.

    Bill sighs and says, “Yeah, well, as the threesome
    entered into its second hour of hot and heavy action,
    it dawned on me that I really should have specified
    that I wanted to be one of the three.”

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  133. nasska (9,475 comments) says:

    LRC

    ….”the example of NZ lamb having a much lower total life cycle carbon cost than British lamb,”"…..

    Our relatively temperate climate allows us to graze livestock year round. In the USA & Canada as well as much of Europe the animals have to be housed & their forage fed out to them. This involves much mechanisation which contributes heavily to carbon outputs.

    Another huge advantage we have is in the utilisation of clovers in our pasture grasses. Clover fixes nitrogen which otherwise normally comes from urea which is petro based.

    What we do we do bloody well….the fact that we can easily compete in the free markets available in the Northern hemisphere is proof aplenty.

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  134. Pete George (21,796 comments) says:

    cg: “…you could indicate which insult you intended.”

    Thanks for the invitation and thanks for the definitions.

    There’s a degree of accuracy in both those. He does exhibit some social ineptness, most of his comments are griping at people he seems to disagree with or not like. When did you hear him talk about something positive or politics or politicians he agrees with other than Colin Craig and Sarah Palin?

    And he was certainly a bit of a man’s penis today, coming off half cocked. He made an assumption on the link, incorrect as usual, and launched into an unrelated dissy fit. And now he needs you to try and defend him? That would make him a socially inept soft cock. So dork wouldn’t be too far off the mark.

    How would you describe Manolo?

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  135. Andrei (2,428 comments) says:

    Viking2

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