General Debate 19 February 2014

February 19th, 2014 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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214 Responses to “General Debate 19 February 2014”

  1. Bovver (173 comments) says:

    An extraordinary and laughable statement by Mike Williams on the Stuff website this morning:

    “Former Labour Party president Mike Williams said he found the result inexplicable (National have a 63% rating for being the party with the safest pair of hands with the economy).

    There are two things in my life which I absolutely cannot understand. One is what happened to the crew of the Marie Celeste and the other is why people think National manages the economy better than Labour. The evidence is entirely the reverse. Have people forgotten Rob Muldoon?””

    How about Mike the little thing called the GFC which started just as the losing Labour Government saddled us all with a structural deficit which NZ has managed to weather thanks to National and who also have the books in order so there will be a surplus this year. The other things I haven’t forgotten was how much pleasure the 5th Labour Government took in spending my tax dollars on their own social engineering pet projects and refusing to make tax cuts at the height of their surplus’s.
    I’m of an age when I haven’t forgotten Rob Muldoon and his full on socialist agenda but exactly what does his legacy have in the way of influence on Nationals current centre right policies? I bet most people under 30 have little idea who RM is, I was talking to my wife this morning who has zero interest in politics like a great many New Zealanders, she can’t even name the current Labour Party leader.

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  2. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Some interesting claims yesterday that there are possibly three more TVNZ employees being pursued by Labour as potential candidates.

    @MorganGodfery

    Reckless. Leakers everywhere. Carrot -we’ll offer you a place – and stick – take it or we’ll reveal and ruin you

    The same tactic was used against JW. The carrot – the offer of a place – and the stick – we will reveal our offer if you refuse and ruin you.

    (Julian Wilcox)

    Very questionable practices if that’s true.

    More Labour aspirants in TVNZ?

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  3. kowtow (8,524 comments) says:

    Bovver

    I hope your missus votes the way you tell her to!

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  4. redqueen (567 comments) says:

    Will Cuntliffe admit that he is about as ‘middle range’ any other member of the elite? Will he admit that people should aspire to be wealthy, or wealthier, and that such arrogance (‘I’m not rich on 500k, but John Key is!’) is not going to do him any favours?

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  5. Bovver (173 comments) says:

    @ Kowotow, she thinks John Key is a very nice man and I’m currently coaching her to make sure that she ticks National for the party vote.

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  6. Elaycee (4,393 comments) says:

    I wonder how long it will take today for some moron to try and turn the Police computer cock up (the lack of updating that resulted in fines being sent to the wrong person / address), into another personal bleat about Minister Judith Collins. A whinge (if true to form) that will probably contain sentences of bold font and even worse… CAPS!

    I suspect these same morons would even try to pin it on Judith Collins if the pies were cold at the Basin Reserve yesterday.

    3, 2, 1……

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  7. Harriet (4,979 comments) says:

    What did they keep saying about Tony Abbott before the election……..oh yeah, I remember………”He thinks women should be in the kitchen and gays in the closet.”

    Wussle is now going to say about Mr Craig and Mr Key:

    “…moi fellow kiwios…….done boi men who wear bluue tois…….”

    Wussle is imposing Australia’s low standards onto NZ’s political system and by extension it’s economy.

    Mr Craig should point out to him that the Australian economy is struggling because of the Greens behaviour in government.

    Tony Abbott said that. :cool:

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  8. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    more bad news for silent T , wussel, et al

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9736600/Key-most-liked-trusted

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  9. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    Bovver

    Mike who..?

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  10. peterwn (3,276 comments) says:

    Bovver – agreed. Tracey Watkins cannot have that many people on her speed-dial. If she got a comment off Mike, why did she not try and get John Slater or Michelle Boag for comment as well.

    If Mike (Melbourne butterfly chaser) wants to go back in history, he should have remembered Rogernomics and Nordie’s Black Budget 1958.

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  11. flipper (4,084 comments) says:

    So, thanks to silly tax lawyer Collins and Chester Borrows, Police are going to stop people leaving NZ because of unpaid fines.

    Police are going to suspend driving licences because of unpaid fines.

    Police issued 20,000 false claims (ranging from $39 to $635) for breeches of mostly risible traffic regulations.

    Police, wittingly or unwittingly, committed 20,000 cases fraud.

    Police always argue that ignorance is no defence (just ask Doug Graham et al over Lombard!)

    Police now say they will spend hours going through each fraudulent claim, one by one, before deciding whether to proceed with their fraudulent claims.

    Police should charge their fraudster colleagues, and seek imprisonment as their corporate ==’s did with Graham et al.

    But it seems that there is one rule for the Molesworth Street gang in blue….ANOTHER FOR YOU KNOW WHO (and elaycee).

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  12. mandk (998 comments) says:

    @Bovver,
    That comment by Mike Williams is a bit of a joke, isn’t it?
    Apart from opposing the mixed ownership model, I don’t think I’ve heard Labour say anything at all about the economy.
    The man is deluded.

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  13. BeaB (2,125 comments) says:

    I may be missing something here but I cannot for the life of me see why we are spending so much time and money ruining perfectly good roads when our footpaths are mainly deserted. As I drive round I rarely see a pedestrian except for a few around shopping centres or the very occasional walking group or a lone runner.
    If we made our extensive footpath network into a shared place for walkers and cyclists surely that will be safer for everyone by separating foot and cycle traffic from cars and trucks.

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  14. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Key is also well ahead of his opponents as preferred prime minister on 51.2 per cent.

    Labour leader David Cunliffe appears to be more polarising, with those who like and trust him, and those who don’t, falling into roughly equal camps. His rating as preferred prime minister is just 18.2 per cent.

    The bad news for Cunliffe is that only Conservative Party leader Colin Craig, Mana Party leader Hone Harawira and Internet Party leader Kim Dotcom are more disliked. Harawira and Dotcom are also the least trusted.

    Not great for Craig’s or Dotcom’s political ambitions either. Harawira can survive on one electorate support with about 1% of the vote but the other two have to target 5%. It would be hard enough for someone who is liked and trusted.

    National was seen as the safest pair of hands with the economy, at 63 per cent to Labour’s 27.7 per cent.

    Apart from Labour’s ongoing cock-ups and their abysmal leadership and management and their dysfunctional caucus that is their biggest hurdle.

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  15. Tauhei Notts (1,724 comments) says:

    As one who has spent tens and tens of thousands dollars of my OWN money on information technology, I came to the conclusion that God invented the Information Technology industry in an attempt to make real estate agents look honest.
    This latest stuff up by the police’s computer system is inexcusable. What chance some Labour Party lackey comes out on National Socialist Radio bleats about a lack of resources.

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  16. Elaycee (4,393 comments) says:

    Just had an article in the Hoorald shown to me…. apparently, some Council staff are miffed the ‘Inquiry” into the Len Brown mess, meant that emails were accessed and read – and some staff are claiming this to be a breach of privacy.

    Really?

    In a statement to RNZ the council said it had a “robust and best practice IT policy” which had been agreed to by the users.

    Surely, this means staff know the IT system is Council owned and meant for Council business, so how can staff in the office of the Mayor now suggest someone reading emails as part of the Inquiry, constitutes a breach of privacy?

    Something is not quite right….

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11205374

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  17. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    And these two pictures, circulated by lefties, highlights a major image problem for Cunliffe:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bgx_tGTCIAAGdrw.jpg

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  18. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    The weight of public opinion on Kim Dotcom is shifting quickly, and is likely to shift even more after the lead story in the Herald today.

    Dotcom has an allowance of $20,000 per month for his living expenses, but it seems that he also has a trail of creditors all over town while he swans off here and there by helicopter, has weekends at Huka Lodge, records dreadful “music”, tries to influence the political process and override the courts and puts on fireworks displays. The REAL Dotcom is starting to emerge, not the carefully crafted media facade.

    Here’s hoping that his lawyers demanded cash upfront, or they too might be doing a large amount of unexpected pro bono work…

    http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2014/02/pay-your-bills-kim.html

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  19. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    @ Elaycee – perhaps the Tamaki Makarau Labour Party LEC also has a branch situated at and operating from the Auckland Town Hall :D

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  20. igm (1,413 comments) says:

    Mike Williams typifies the Labourite of envy . . . after all, his track record (even after spending thousands trying to dig shit on JK) , is like the rest of them, failure.
    See media are out to exonerate Lecher Len, he is star of radio and print in some quarters again today. Come on people arise, this dirty old lying pervert must go.

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  21. david (2,557 comments) says:

    We are seeing an election year co-ordinated attack (again) on John Key. key plank – his wealth.
    Shane Jones has used his campaign against Countdown as a thinly disguised cover to say it about Key this morning on ZB saying that if he was wealthy like John Key he would not need to hide behind the skirts of Parliamentary Privilege like a schoolboy caught feeling up a classmate behind the bikeshed, Cunnliffe has cocked up his lines about John Key’s house and scored an own goal in the process, Greens have had a go, and there have been others I have heard either on radio or in the House.

    The fact that these are all happening in such a short time and are so consistent indicates that it is scripted and planned and we will see it a lot more in coming months.

    You would have thought that anyone with two active brain cells to rub together would have realised by now that personal attacks on John key earn them no respect and certainly no electoral brownie points. Instead it shows absolutely that the Labour Party and Greens are hypocritical, mostly negative relics from a (thankfully) bygone time, led by backward looking time servers who are bereft of initiative and vision.

    Sure looks like Trevor Mallard and Mike Williams have been re-appointed as joint “Strategic Genii” for election year.

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  22. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    @ David – Shane Jones let slip in Parliament yesterday that his speech in today’s General debate will attempt to link Key to the bosses of the Australian supermarket companies. It’s clear now that a story that Jones was widely praised for last week, sticking up for NZ suppliers, is just an excuse to launch another concerted Labour Party attack on Key. Good luck with that Shane.

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  23. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Sure looks like Trevor Mallard and Mike Williams have been re-appointed as joint “Strategic Genii” for election year.

    While still in a back bench corner it looks like Mallard has effectively taken over as Labour’s leader in the House. He keeps slotting himself at question 11, four times now, always trying to maneuvre the Speaker into allowing the same repetitive question to be allowed.

    And Cunliffe set himself up again asking Key about employment – Key jumped at the chance to highlight the vacancies in the Labour leader’s office and the Labour campaign office at TVNZ.

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  24. Elaycee (4,393 comments) says:

    Question at 8.33am:

    I wonder how long it will take today for some moron to try and turn the Police computer cock up…. …. into another personal bleat about Minister Judith Collins.

    Answer: 12 minutes! 8O

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  25. igm (1,413 comments) says:

    What with this obese German criminal owing half a million bucks . . . surely that makes him even less deserving of a bed in NZ. Get him on a plane JK, send him to the States to face his charges, he will make a good gang members’ bitch in the pen, and may then learn he is not above the law, because his money will be frozen, and he will need to work for acceptance, not buy it, like he has been doing here!

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  26. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    It’s not surprising Dotcom is having problems paying creditors, most of his funds were seized.

    What is really annoying people is him flaunting his wealth bragging about his holidays, promotion of his vanity album, and the contradiction of him laying off staff he says he can’t afford to pay while employing people and paying for advisers for his political party.

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  27. wikiriwhis business (4,019 comments) says:

    America’s Five Criminals: In the U.S. the Gestapo Has Replaced the Rule of Law
    “Concentration camps are a likely future reality for Americans”, according to Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia

    All five of these Gestapo wannabes are in violation of their oath of office to protect the Constitution of the United States. They have relentlessly violated the Constitution, which makes these five, who are in charge of US intelligence and black operations, traitors to the United States. Yet, they have not been arrested and put on trial. Congress is content to sit there and listen to their ongoing lies time after time after time, despite the fact that these 5 have committed more and worse crimes against our country than the “terrorists” that serve as an excuse for the crimes committed by the intelligence agencies.

    National Counterterrorism Center Director Matthew Olsen, FBI Director James Comey, Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, CIA Director John Brennan, Defense Intelligence Agency Director Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn testify during a hearing before Senate (Select) Intelligence Committee January 29, 2014

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/americas-five-criminals-in-the-u-s-the-gestapo-has-replaced-the-rule-of-law/5369145

    So there you have it. A Supreme Court Justice has warned Americans they are being readied for internment . The process has been pushed far ahead and internment camps are the near reality.

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  28. EAD (1,128 comments) says:

    Woke up this morning to some great news. No sooner had that the brilliant defender of Liberty, James Delingpole announced that he was leaving the Telegraph, I have found out that he is now taking up the fight for freedom right in the belly of the beast, heading up a 10 strong team on the newly launched Breitbart London website.

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/02/16/Delingpole-Why-Breitbart

    The battle for Liberty and the hearts and minds of the electorate has taken a turn for the better.

    Educate and inform the whole mass of the people… They are the only sure reliance for the preservation of our liberty – Thomas Jefferson

    The only sure bulwark of continuing liberty is a government strong enough to protect the interests of the people, and a people strong enough and well enough informed to maintain its sovereign control over the goverment. – Franklin D. Roosevelt

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  29. EAD (1,128 comments) says:

    Re on Liberty:
    as I’ve gotten older I’ve realised politics. despite what the politicians tell you, basically all comes down to Liberty, and whether the State has all or most power (the political Left) compared to whether the individual has most or all power (the political Right). What has always amazed me (and what I refer to as the world’s biggest lie) is that the National Socialist German Workers Party is so often referred to as being “far-right”. One can only imagine the cognitive dissonance or the extreme blindness to describe someone on the far left of this excellent chart (i.e. the side of total government) as being from the “far right”….. or perhaps that is the purpose of state education?

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_TI8bO8GurcI/TMGUCecRxYI/AAAAAAAACWw/i_E8qshErRA/s400/Political+Spectrum+Diagram+-+Domestic+Relations.jpg

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  30. thedavincimode (6,800 comments) says:

    KS

    You are right on the money. Jones had a great opportunity to sell himself as the decent bloke and leader-in-waiting. Now he is about to completely fuck it up and trot out the same weary bullshit that nobody listens to apart from the 32% who either don’t like Key or hate him.

    This carry on can’t be a plus for his hopes of attracting or retaining votes in the 10% of the population who like Key but won’t vote National. They’ve tried this tactic for 8 1/2 years and still can’t figure out that it doesn’t work. That can only mean that people just aren’t interested in this bullshit and /or are sick of hearing it. Their response is just to turn up the volume. It just becomes more meaningless noise. They manufacture issues (eg the exporting manufacturing crisis). It turns out to be bullshit. They lie – then they get sprung. They announce policies that are already implemented or are a fuck up. Key says he’s proud to live in Parnell. Cunners says he would rather live in New Lynn ( I would still love to know how old his breast-fed children are and if they are school age, whether he is shipping them off to New Lynn for their education – oh yes, that would really happen. :roll: )

    They are employing the same tactics that got them kicked out of office. They are incapable of learning and the message must just have become white noise to most of the voting public – those who don’t find as much amusement in it all that some here do, me included.

    Even if they had some policies that made any sense, the media no longer seems interested because they have dragged their political strategy down to: “Key dodgy arsehole, Cunners good guy”. In other words, the same basic strategy as for the last 8 1/2 years. There isn’t anything else to report and being in the game they are in, they aren’t particularly interested in reporting anything else.

    Cunners can’t ever win that. He’s an arse and is looking increasingly slippery as time goes on after what has been an appalling few weeks. This latest business about their houses and wealth and preferring New Lynn has done him no good at all. He is the political equivalent of the suicide bomb instructor who blew himself. Media aren’t interested in policy; they are in it for the sport. We all knew Keys’ kids went to an expensive private school. Nobody cared. I expect that most people thought that if they had they money they would have done the same with their kids. If Cunners was asked which school his kids went to, he would either 1) lie, 2) refuse to answer 3) if it was private, respond that he had no choice because this Government has ruined the education system.

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  31. Weihana (4,557 comments) says:

    EAD (169 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 10:02 am

    …the State has all or most power (the political Left) compared to whether the individual has most or all power (the political Right). What has always amazed me (and what I refer to as the world’s biggest lie) is that the National Socialist German Workers Party is so often referred to as being “far-right”

    You start from a different definition so reach a different conclusion. What amazes me is how much time people waste arguing about what is “right” or “left” without first agreeing to a common definition of “right” and “left”. Of course the motivation is always to besmirch the reputation of the opposing side, not by arguing against their specific ideas, but by linking them to something highly objectionable (like the Nazi’s or North Korea) by reference to an ambiguous classification.

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  32. wikiriwhis business (4,019 comments) says:

    George Soros Bets $1.3 Billion on Stock Market Crash

    In today’s video, Christopher Greene of AMTV reports on George Soros and his massive put on the stock market.

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  33. Harriet (4,979 comments) says:

    “…….It’s clear now that a story that Jones was widely praised for last week, sticking up for NZ suppliers, is just an excuse to launch another concerted Labour Party attack on Key. Good luck with that Shane….”

    Jones is getting into something that came up in the Australian media last night.

    The media in Australia are looking into the supermarkets, as the public have been complaining strongly about the product labels not saying where the ingredients are coming from – only where the completed product is coming from.

    The public are being told on one hand that ‘Australia makes good food’ by the food industry, but on the other hand the food industry won’t label their products as such – as they contain ONLY the words ‘made from australian and imported ingrediants’. They won’t say which ingrediants or of what percentage.

    Nuritionists, green food promoters, the ‘obesity police’ and other health advocates have all been telling the Australian public that they should pay more attention to what they eat as not all food is of good QUALITY. The Australian public want to buy what they percieve/believe is of good quality -australian GROWN food- but it appears the supermarkets won’t let them – or government regulations won’t. They also have the money to buy the more expensive Australian products – the supermarkets say otherwise!!!

    A journo said on Nation wide talkback last night that Australian suppliers were getting their ingredients shipped in ‘through’ NZ as NZ’s regulations[what ever that is, food/import?] are lower. They are then shipped on to Australia.

    Jones may well want to rethink ‘what NZ suppliers’ he stands up for.

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  34. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Instead of buying gas guzzlers to replace the BMWs why doesn’t Key show his true green colours by getting a fleet of Tesla Model S fully electric luxury limos? 275 mile range, recharge in two hours from solar panels.

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  35. flipper (4,084 comments) says:

    Elaycee (3,817 comments) says:

    February 19th, 2014 at 9:17 am

    Question at 8.33am:

    I wonder how long it will take today for some moron…..

    ****

    Well, as one moron (your view) to another (my view), you clearly believe that a $600,000 rip off, with 20,000 fraudulent claims ranging from $30 to $635, from “innocent” folk is excusable . ….and no apology for bold type, from a driver who has never received anything other than a risible parking fine..

    If any agency charged with policing laws/regulations enacted by the Parliament/Executive is going to rely upon false computer generated reports as a basis for law enforcement, then Mr O is alive and , unfortunately prospering, in NZ 2014.

    Only apologist fools cannot see that they are what they claim others to be :-)

    Dear oh dear.

    En oassdasnmt, buty is your sobfrieuquet

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  36. jp_1983 (213 comments) says:

    Whale Oil down again?

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  37. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Brevik threatening hunger strike or else.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/9737840/Norways-mass-killer-wants-new-PlayStation

    If someone who did what he did threatens to take themselves out of the equation, my view is, let him.

    Whale Oil down again?

    Yeah same result for me. Was ist los? Donner und Blitzen. Schraubenschlüssel in der Arbeit…

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  38. Bovver (173 comments) says:

    Looks like WO has had another DoS attack

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  39. dime (9,980 comments) says:

    Wiki – I think the US are in for a big one. The fundamentals dont hold up. They never took their medicine in 08. They just prolonged suffering for a lot of people over there. Its fucking scary how poor some yanks are.

    As for Dime, i welcome our new overlords china :)

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  40. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    Good..watching the yanks go down the gurgler is like watching a slow motion train wreck..best they hurry up so we can convert everything over to the yuan and get on with things.

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  41. EAD (1,128 comments) says:

    Ho Lee Sh*t

    The situation in Ukraine is out of control;
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ukraine/10647512/Ukraine-crisis-flames-and-stun-grenades-as-police-launch-all-out-assault-on-protesters-in-Kiev.html

    Interesting take on the events in the Ukraine from the excellent Paul Craig Roberts, former US Assistant Secretary of the Treasury for Economic Policy and associate editor of the Wall Street Journal

    http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2014/02/17/us-eu-paying-ukrainian-rioters-protesters-paul-craig-roberts/

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  42. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Re: Ukraine, somewhat ironic wiki has a post above on Soros put on the stock market, given Ukraine is another Soros special.

    Must be a Soros ‘What’s my line’ special on KB today :)

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  43. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    wikiriwhis business (2,937 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 9:39 am

    When will you detest posting conspiracy based info with wildly speculative and hypothetical ideas full of maybes and could bes with utterly silly nonsense like * America’s Five Criminals: In the U.S. the Gestapo Has Replaced the Rule of Law.” etc.?

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  44. Fletch (6,408 comments) says:

    Woke up this morning to some great news. No sooner had that the brilliant defender of Liberty, James Delingpole announced that he was leaving the Telegraph, I have found out that he is now taking up the fight for freedom right in the belly of the beast, heading up a 10 strong team on the newly launched Breitbart London website.

    I alerted you to that in yesterday’s GD, but I think you must have stopped reading for the day. Is good news tho :)

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  45. Longknives (4,766 comments) says:

    Not often I agree with the Herald but we touched on this yesterday-

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11204998

    The NZ Winter Olympic team is a fucking disgrace!
    One of our beaten snowboarders said something like ‘It’s all about the partying’ after he was soundly thrashed the other day, and don’t get me started on the bimbo who openly wants to bang the entire Jamaican Bobsled team..

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  46. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    Bovver (83 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 8:05 am

    The other things I haven’t forgotten was how much pleasure the 5th Labour Government took in spending my tax dollars on their own social engineering pet projects and refusing to make tax cuts at the height of their surplus’s.

    =====================
    Stuff the Labour Lite have continued and indeed increased to continue to suck money from taxpayers. Worse they are making noises about increasing some of these.

    They are about to increase paid parental leave and then top that up by giving 20 hours free baby sitting. Our streets are clogged with these women wasting their days and our taxpayers money.

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  47. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    flipper (3,118 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 8:45 am

    So, thanks to silly tax lawyer Collins and Chester Borrows, Police are going to stop people leaving NZ because of unpaid fines.

    Police are going to suspend driving licences because of unpaid fines.

    Police issued 20,000 false claims (ranging from $39 to $635) for breeches of mostly risible traffic regulations.

    Police, wittingly or unwittingly, committed 20,000 cases fraud.

    Police always argue that ignorance is no defence (just ask Doug Graham et al over Lombard!)

    Police now say they will spend hours going through each fraudulent claim, one by one, before deciding whether to proceed with their fraudulent claims.

    Police should charge their fraudster colleagues, and seek imprisonment as their corporate ==’s did with Graham et al.

    But it seems that there is one rule for the Molesworth Street gang in blue….ANOTHER FOR YOU KNOW WHO (and elaycee).

    ========================

    and guess who is going to pay for this fuck up. Yup the taxcpayer as usual and the motorist by more finning.

    Dock all their pays would be a better idea.

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  48. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    EAD (170 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 11:07 am

    Whats so excellent about that conspiracy monger Paul Craig Roberts.?
    BTW Your wrong about the Nazi NSDAP. It was only ” socialist” in name only.
    One of Hitler’s fitst acts was to eliminate the Left SA socialist faction within his party .
    Ever heard of the Night of the long knives 1934.?

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  49. Weihana (4,557 comments) says:

    dime (8,398 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 10:48 am

    Wiki – I think the US are in for a big one. The fundamentals dont hold up. They never took their medicine in 08. They just prolonged suffering for a lot of people over there. Its fucking scary how poor some yanks are.

    The poverty (and the level of inequality) is the ultimate reason they are in the situation they are in. In order to sustain middle-class living standards with stagnating wages America has been requiring more two-income households and increasing levels of personal debt for too long, while the top 0.1% continue to scoop up a larger and larger share of the rewards from increased productivity. Workers are more productive and the economy continues to grow. The problem is more and more people in the middle class can’t afford to participate in the economy without going bust and no economy can survive without the middle class. The middle class does not need more “medicine” or more punishment they need more opportunity, especially in an age where technological advancement is accelerating and killing jobs faster than ever while creating opportunities that many are not qualified to take advantage of and who are too poor to afford the ever rising costs of obtaining the education that is necessary.

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  50. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    Weihana, and what does that “more opportunity ” actually consist of.??

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  51. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Key on governing with Winston Peters:

    Mr Key says if New Zealand First does get back into Parliament and National requires its support to govern he is not sure its leader, Winston Peters, would do a deal to be part of the Government.

    “Whether he in the final analysis would ever come with us is very uncertain,” he says. “My own personal view, and it’s not necessarily supported by all of my senior ministers, is he’s only at best likely to abstain.”

    The Prime Minister says if Mr Peters did agree to support the Government it is more likely he would become a minister outside the Cabinet.

    Radio NZ

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  52. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Key on governing with Colin Craig:

    So would National do an electorate deal with Colin Craig’s Conservative Party if it appeared it could win enough party votes to bring two or three other MPs into Parliament?

    “Obviousy he would bring in some but that wouldn’t be the only test. It would be could we work with him; what would his conditions look like?”

    Mr Key says he’s had no discussions with Mr Craig about those matters.

    Radio NZ

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  53. Weihana (4,557 comments) says:

    stephieboy,

    Well it doesn’t consist of praying to the God of the invisible hand. :)

    Fundamentally the population needs to be equipped to take advantage of the opportunities modern technology is providing. Increasingly you can no longer rely on simple hard work to earn a decent living. You need to work smarter and if the middle class can take advantage of the opportunities that exist, they earn more, they spend more, the government receives more tax, the government can then invest more in further training and education and other infrastructure, further allowing people to earn more, spend more etc. etc. But that’s not what the US has now. What it has now is stagnating wages which have been stagnating for decades. The middle class is being hollowed out, the cost of education is rising.

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  54. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    “The Prime Minister says if Mr Peters did agree to support the Government it is more likely he would become a minister outside the Cabinet.”

    More slippery deals from our employees..I don’t want Peters anywhere near the wheels of power.

    Colin Craig and the Conservatives for me.

    Vote Conservative.

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  55. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    Peter George , the fundamental issue is for Craig to sort out is what does his party actually stand for,- is it Conservative or Progressive. or what.?

    Well, dirty harry tell us what does the Conservative party actually stand for.?

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  56. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    Here you go

    “A united New Zealand that encompasses the individuality that continues to create it, a prosperous nation, truly free and always manifestly democratic.

    A government for the people and by the people, protecting life, freedom and property, while recognising equal rights, privileges and responsibilities of the individual.

    A nation with strong leadership reflecting the values New Zealand has lived and breathed for generations, keeping precious the uniqueness that defines this great country.

    For individuals and families across this land the nurturing of our young, the honouring of our old, maximum opportunity and the pride of achievement.

    This is the New Zealand we believe in.

    This is the New Zealand we passionately live for.”

    VOTE CONSERVATIVE

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  57. Colville (2,272 comments) says:

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/9739447/Dotcom-raid-legal-FBI-taking-evidence-not

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  58. Albert_Ross (298 comments) says:

    Credit where it’s due – this is a much more thoughtful and researched piece from the DomPost than usual. Pity it’s so obscurely hidden on their website

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/business/9737883/Playing-with-the-income-levers

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  59. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    dirty harry, that is almost copied word to word from National’s Vision and Values ,

    http://www.national.org.nz/About/vision.aspx

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  60. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    stephieboy – it’s pretty much what Craig stands for or against:
    – wants S59 (smacking law) repealed
    – wants binding referenda (but I don’t think he has detailed how that would work)
    – anti-asset sales but that won’t matter this election

    More here: http://www.conservativeparty.org.nz/index.php?page=Issues

    It’s pretty light on policy but it’s early days – Labour similarly have still not published their election policies and most other parties still have mostly last election policies online.

    It’s also going to be important to see who is in the first few spots on their list, if Craig wins an electorate he will bring a few others in and how they look like they might vote could be important.

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  61. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    Peter George , wants s59 repealed with binding referenda , anti asset sales. Well that is not nearly enough on the details.
    What about e.g traditional family values etc as am taking it many are attracted ,like those who post here, because they’re anti gay , feminist and anti TOW.
    Again I’d like to know what the Craig and the Conservative party stands for on these kind of social and related issues.

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  62. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Unless you sift through “Colin Asks’ all they have is a few very brief points on a few things except they do have detail on the Treaty.

    “To build unity.” By sticking it to Maori.

    “No new claims shall be considered by the Tribunal”. Tough if you deserve it to be considered as much as those who have settled.

    “To respect, regard, and deal with all citizens of New Zealand fairly and equally.” Except for gays and kids.

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  63. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    well stephieboy..why don’t you go onto the Conservatives website and ask Colin yourself? Well you are there join up , its only 10 bucks.

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  64. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    I wouldn’t pickup what Pete says about Craig if were you, stephie. Pete’s just a shill for Dunne you see, and he’s vigorously doing his best to paint Craig in a bad light on behalf of his master.

    I don’t think he liked me pointing that out yesterday so expect him in future to be more subtle, but that’s his agenda and expect it to continue right up till election night.

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  65. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    “Except for gays and kids.? “Extraordinary comment. ! Your must be joking.? Colin Craig’s most recent comments suggest a shift and a moderation in his views about gays as well as feminists .
    How does that sit with you and other Conservative party supporters.?

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  66. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    “To build unity.” By sticking it to Maori.”

    Great. About time. Whitey has had it stuck up him for too long now.

    “No new claims shall be considered by the Tribunal”.

    Has to end sometime PG…me and my taxpaying co-horts don’t have bottomless pockets.

    ” Except for gays and kids”

    What do you mean exactly PG ?

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  67. publicwatchdog (2,615 comments) says:

    FYI

    Please be advised that I will be a speaker at the upcoming ‘LEN BROWN – STAND DOWN’ march:

    WHEN: Saturday 22 February 2014
    TIME: Assemble 11.30am Britomart
    March starts 12 noon
    March will proceed to Airedale Street

    As an anti-corruption campaigner, who polled fourth in the 2013 Auckland Mayoral campaign, I am fully in support of this march, which was initiated by Stephen Berry (third polling Mayoral candidate) and Will Ryan of Affordable Auckland.

    Although on most issues, I would arguably be on a different galaxy to Stephen Berry and Affordable Auckland, on this issue, calling for Auckland Mayor Len Brown to stand down, we are on the same page.

    In my considered opinion, the Ernst and Young Report did not follow the proper process for investigating alleged lack of compliance with the Auckland Council ‘Code of Conduct’ – which is why I have made a formal complaint to Auckland Police against (former) Auckland Council CEO Doug Mckay for alleged ‘contravention of statute’.

    In my considered opinion, it is Mayor Len Brown’s acceptance of undisclosed gifts from Sky City, at a time the Sky City convention deal was an ‘item of business’ before Auckland Council, that ‘crossed the line’.

    What really concerns me is that there has been no ‘due diligence’ on the increased risk of money-laundering arising from the New Zealand International Convention Centre Act 2013, by Auckland Council, on Mayor Len Brown’s ‘watch’.

    When neither the Prime Minister John Key, Minister for Economic Development Stephen Joyce, OFCANZ (Organised and Financial Crime Agency of New Zealand), or Auckland Central Police, have carried out any ‘due diligence’ on the increased risk of money-laundering arising from the New Zealand International Convention Centre Act 2013, then, in my considered opinion, the people of New Zealand, particularly Auckland, are arguably at greater risk from organised crime and organised criminals.

    When the Auditor-General Lyn Provost admits to having shares in Sky City, and fails to disclose this at a time I ask her to conduct an inquiry into the lack of ‘due diligence’ by OFCANZ, into the increased risk of money-laundering arising from the New Zealand International Convention Centre (Bill) – then – I believe that New Zealand’s perceived status as the ‘least corrupt country in the world’ is nothing more than a sick joke.

    Penny Bright
    ___________________________________________________________________________________________________

    (For more background information on these and related matters – http://www.pennybright4mayor.org.nz

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  68. dirty harry (502 comments) says:

    your’re one sexy broad Penny Bright

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  69. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Reid – are the many people critical or wary of Craig all shilling for Dunne? Your own shilling is showing.

    Like and Trust for Craig is similar to Harawira and Dotcom – http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/02/one-trusts-fat-german/ – but you probably thing that’s just a shilly poll.

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  70. Elaycee (4,393 comments) says:

    @dirty harry: Have you been drinking? :)

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  71. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    dirty harry , if the Conservatives have you as a supporter then they a welcome to you .
    But tell me your support Collin Craig’s given his more recent moderate stand on gays and feminists.
    Reid if thats what Peter thinks about Craig then thats fine by me.
    I do note also a lot of conspiracy thgeorist like yourself are attracted to the Conservatives. Why.?
    Are you a Moon hoaxer like Craig apparently is .?

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  72. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    The cultural cringe leading to Maori kowtowing in the health system has reached epic proportions. Everything’s allowed because “they’re special.” I had one report where the rellys of someone being wheeled into surgery did a haka at the door of the operating theatre. Forget about whether or not that’s intimidating for professionals who do nothing but care. That doesn’t matter, in the health system, where Maorification is uber alles.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11205616

    Reid if thats what Peter thinks about Craig then thats fine by me.

    Yes I didn’t think it would make any difference stephie. After all, you seem incapable of understanding the significance of most things, why should that one be any different, as far as you’re concerned?

    Reid – are the many people critical or wary of Craig all shilling for Dunne? Your own shilling is showing.

    As far as I can recall Pete I’ve never said a word in support of Craig and this is because I haven’t yet made up my mind about him.

    You should lookup the definition of shill because despite me giving it to you yesterday you’re clearly confused over what it means, but newsflash: it doesn’t mean you’re a shill if you point out a shill when you see one.

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  73. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    “Except for gays and kids.? “Extraordinary comment. !

    He opposed homosexuals having the same legal right to marry as heteros.
    He opposed giving kids the same level of legal protection from assault as adults.

    And FMH.

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  74. Manolo (13,837 comments) says:

    A future Labour government will make this compulsory. A subsequent Labour Lite government will keep it:
    http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8801721/wofs-for-state-houses

    The government has launched a trial Warrant of Fitness scheme for state houses.

    Housing Minister Nick Smith says 500 homes will go through the test between now and July, and when the regime is in full force every state house will be assessed on a three-yearly basis.

    “The government has not made any decisions about the wider application of the Warrant of Fitness to other social housing providers or the private rental market,” Dr Smith said when he launched the scheme in Porirua on Wednesday.

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  75. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    Pete,

    you criticized me yesterday for focusing on you over Colin Craig, yet here you are today focusing on him again. Seems suspect to me…..

    “He opposed homosexuals having the same legal right to marry as heteros.”

    Marriage is not a right.

    “He opposed giving kids the same level of legal protection from assault as adults.”

    A light smack on the bottom to ensure kids don’t run into traffic, beat up their brothers or sisters, or many other things, is “assault” only in the hysteria driven minds of social liberals.

    He opposed turning thousands of perfectly good parents into criminals, and children have never had the same rights as adults. That would be insane.

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  76. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    He opposed homosexuals having the same legal right to marry as heteros.

    No he didn’t. Because they already have all the legal rights that heteros do. I’ve never heard him say he wanted to remove any of those. What he is saying therefore is precisely what I’ve always said – they simply can’t use the word. They can have a civil union. And they can have all the legal rights that conveys.

    He opposed giving kids the same level of legal protection from assault as adults.

    No he didn’t. You’re not doing very well are you Pete. Perhaps you need to make a call to your master and get some urgent training in how to shill. Using a smack to discipline a child is not assaulting a child, it’s good parenting, because children aren’t hurt when it happens in that context, they’re shocked, not hurt, and that’s the idea of it, because you can’t sit a 5 year old down and use logic with them, because they don’t understand it.

    Liars and idiot shills call it assault because it suits their anti-parenting agenda. Sometimes idiot shills who don’t understand human behaviour and are attempting in their own weak way to shill, call it assault, and sometimes evil lefty liars who wish to undermine parental rights over their children whom they bought into the world and love unconditionally, call it assault.

    But no parent who knows what they’re doing as a parent would ever call it assault, because they’re not idiots and they’re not evil lefties.

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  77. Manolo (13,837 comments) says:

    When Peter Dunne farts, Peter George inhales. Nice summation.

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  78. Fletch (6,408 comments) says:

    Russell Norman pissed me off with his statement on One News this afternoon –

    “[Colin Craig] says he’s Christian, well, Jesus Christ – if he believed in anything, he believed in love, tolerance and inclusion, not the politics of hatred that Colin Craig is promoting [...] Colin Craig should apologize to all new Zealanders for his disgusting and offensive comments. Let’s live in a society of tolerance and inclusion – and love. That, surely, is what the Christian message, interpreted the best way, is all about”

    See video – http://tvnz.co.nz/politics-news/craig-norman-continue-battle-over-gays-in-closet-comments-5840777

    A lefty socialist spouting off about what he thinks Jesus believed, when the Bible – God’s own word – clearly points to homosexual conduct being wrong, in both the Old and New Testaments. When Norman talks about the Christian message, “interpreted the best way”, he means interpreted the progressive, liberal way – Norman’s way.

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  79. iMP (2,387 comments) says:

    So NORMAN has upped the ante, with this unnecessary but aggravating statement. I think we have a genuine court slap around the Green nethers on our hands…

    “[Colin Craig] says he’s Christian, well, Jesus Christ – if he believed in anything, he believed in love, tolerance and inclusion, not the politics of hatred that Colin Craig is promoting [...] Colin Craig should apologize to all new Zealanders for his disgusting and offensive comments. Let’s live in a society of tolerance and inclusion – and love. That, surely, is what the Christian message, interpreted the best way, is all about.”

    As a Christian, I find Norman’s statement here ignorant, offensive and belittling.

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  80. Ryan Sproull (7,205 comments) says:

    A lefty socialist spouting off about what he thinks Jesus believed, when the Bible – God’s own word – clearly points to homosexual conduct being wrong, in both the Old and New Testaments. When Norman talks about the Christian message, “interpreted the best way”, he means interpreted the progressive, liberal way – Norman’s way.

    Do you interpret the Bible in anything less than the best way, Fletch?

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  81. dime (9,980 comments) says:

    Latest Test Rankings:

    Batsmen:

    5 Ross Taylor
    12 McCullum
    21 Kane Williamson

    Bowling:

    8 Boult
    9 Southee
    28 Wagner

    That has to be our best showing for a long time. Ross, Boult & Southee all in the top 10.

    Aussie bowlers v South Africa

    3 Harris
    4 Johnson
    6 Siddle
    19 Lyon

    SA:

    1 Steyn
    2 Philander
    15 Morkel
    47 Abbot

    Hard call. Steyn has been awesome for so long, I think Johnson is the best bowler in the world at the moment though. Id take the aussie pack. (philander being the 3rd best bowler on the planet though)

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  82. Ryan Sproull (7,205 comments) says:

    Using a smack to discipline a child is not assaulting a child, it’s good parenting,

    Technically, if you’re a fan of smacking, it’s both.

    because children aren’t hurt when it happens in that context, they’re shocked, not hurt, and that’s the idea of it, because you can’t sit a 5 year old down and use logic with them, because they don’t understand it.

    If I hit you in a way that shocks without hurting, that’s cool? Don’t worry, I’m sitting you down and using logic with you, so I’m not likely to have to smack you. Not that you’d have a problem with it if I did, obviously.

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  83. Manolo (13,837 comments) says:

    Stephieboy and other feminists rejoice!
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2562355/Two-petite-police-firearms-officers-set-receive-35-000-guns-big-hands.html

    Two ‘petite’ firearms officers set to receive payouts of £35,000 each after complaining their guns were too big for their small hands.

    Victoria Wheatley and Rachael Giles won a sex discrimination case on the grounds they could not reach the trigger. Now the Mail can reveal the full extent of their claims, including how Miss Giles said she was ‘bullied, victimised and isolated’.

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  84. Carlos (683 comments) says:

    Hell, I wish more Muslims would interpret the Koran in a liberal way.

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  85. iMP (2,387 comments) says:

    This is rapidly denigrating in to an ex-Aussie NZ parliamentarian bullying a private Kiwi citizen for his perceived opinions.

    Regardless of what Colin Craig does, or does not think, he is entitled to his opinion. Norman is now interpreting that, giving it labels, and setting fire to those anti-Craig Green organic straw men.

    NZers do not like this kind of bullying. I’d say its Craig 302 not out and Norman staring down a series loss on a queer pitch.

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  86. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Do you interpret the Bible in anything less than the best way, Fletch?

    Even some Christians don’t understand Ryan that while God is love, God is also sinless, therefore any sin whatsoever is anathema to him, which is why Christians if they truly believe, do their best not to sin.

    This is not done out of some self-righteous ‘we are better than you’ perspective, but is entirely private, between ourself and God.

    And sin covers the whole gamut, including thoughts as well as deeds.

    When you purify yourself completely, love fills your whole being. St Francis of Assisi for example was so pure birds used to come and perch on his shoulders. That’s the ideal. Few of us achieve it, but that’s what we aim at.

    But it’s obtained only through long hard graft of eschewing sin of all kinds, and if you know the Bible even in passing, you’ll be aware that sins of various kinds are prominent, all the way through.

    But love does not overcome sin, purity does. And purity generates love. But while love is all forgiving and unconditional in respect of the sinner, it is the opposite in respect of the sin, and tolerance of sin, is zero.

    If I hit you in a way that shocks without hurting, that’s cool? Don’t worry, I’m sitting you down and using logic with you, so I’m not likely to have to smack you. Not that you’d have a problem with it if I did, obviously.

    You’re not a five year old Ryan. Read what I said again. And try not to be disingenuous. It doesn’t suit you.

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  87. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Media is very strongly against Craig taking legal action. Norman has taken him on publicly over it. Craig risks a real hiding if he pursues it.

    Duncan Garner:

    I have a simple message for Colin Craig: harden up mate.

    Seriously, this defamation action against Russel Norman won’t work and nor should it.

    If I was a lawyer, I’d want to be on Russel Norman’s side here. Craig has a shit show of winning this silly little side-show and, worst of all, he’s given his opponent all this oxygen.

    He’ll need a tougher hide if he makes it to Parliament later this year. It may not be right, but it’s a brutal place where the vulnerable and weak are crushed, and the tough survive. He is now a player; he may help get National back – the Greens and Labour sense that – and they are going to play tough with him from here on in.

    He needs to toughen up, harden up and get ready for battle. Rushing off to court is not the way to do it.

    http://www.radiolive.co.nz/Duncan-Garner-Colin-Craig-needs-to-harden-up/tabid/721/articleID/40708/Default.aspx

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  88. Ryan Sproull (7,205 comments) says:

    This is rapidly denigrating in to an ex-Aussie NZ parliamentarian bullying a private Kiwi citizen for his perceived opinions.

    That word – I do not think it means what you think it does.

    Regardless of what Colin Craig does, or does not think, he is entitled to his opinion. Norman is now interpreting that, giving it labels, and setting fire to those anti-Craig Green organic straw men.

    I agree. Norman should have kept to what Craig has actually said, which is ammo enough without inventing things by stereotyping him.

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  89. kowtow (8,524 comments) says:

    The state has dictated that parents not discipline their children…….fine.

    When those children grow up ,refuse to acknowledge right from wrong and break the states’ rules can we agree that the state simply sit them down and use logic to make them see the error of their ways?

    Great ,we don’t need prisons anymore.

    When the state gives up its rights to correct and punish wrong doers ,perhaps then parents can legitimately be deprived of their rights to correct and punish their own children.But not till then.

    Put another way ,better a smack than gaol.

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  90. Camryn (543 comments) says:

    Ripe for subversion: https://twitter.com/search?q=%23EnoughToLive&src=hash&f=realtime

    Don’t forget to reply to the @nzlabour tweet and include the #enoughtolive hashtag if you do!

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  91. Ryan Sproull (7,205 comments) says:

    Do you interpret the Bible in anything less than the best way, Fletch?

    Even some Christians don’t understand Ryan that while God is love, God is also sinless, therefore any sin whatsoever is anathema to him, which is why Christians if they truly believe, do their best not to sin

    This is not done out of some self-righteous ‘we are better than you’ perspective, but is entirely private, between ourself and God.

    And sin covers the whole gamut, including thoughts as well as deeds.

    When you purify yourself completely, love fills your whole being. St Francis of Assisi for example was so pure birds used to come and perch on his shoulders. That’s the ideal. Few of us achieve it, but that’s what we aim at.

    But it’s obtained only through long hard graft of eschewing sin of all kinds, and if you know the Bible even in passing, you’ll be aware that sins of various kinds are prominent, all the way through.

    But love does not overcome sin, purity does. And purity generates love. But while love is all forgiving and unconditional in respect of the sinner, it is the opposite in respect of the sin, and tolerance of sin, is zero.

    My point was that Russel Norman’s claim to interpret the Bible “in the best way” is no different from almost anyone else’s claims to interpreting the Bible. Possibly including Fletch, depending on his answer.

    If I hit you in a way that shocks without hurting, that’s cool? Don’t worry, I’m sitting you down and using logic with you, so I’m not likely to have to smack you. Not that you’d have a problem with it if I did, obviously.

    You’re not a five year old Ryan. Read what I said again. And try not to be disingenuous. It doesn’t suit you.

    Don’t mistake highlighting your inconsistency for disingenuousness, Reid. I read what you said. Someone said the law change was about giving the same level of legal protection from assault to children as adults enjoy. You responded by saying it wasn’t that at all, and then proceeded to describe assaulting children and saying it’s okay. Which is fine, but own your position: you believe that assaulting children is or can be part of good parenting. If I assaulted you in the way you describe assaulting children as part of good parenting, I could be arrested – for assault.

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  92. stephieboy (3,163 comments) says:

    At least one thing we can all agree on , Craigie shows a willingness to compromise and develop a more moderate approach to gay and feminist issues.
    Its safe to assume that sits well with Fletch, Manolo, dirty harry etc.?

    kpwtow “,the state has dictated that parents not discipline their children…….fine …….”
    Blatantly untrue.!
    Your hysterically trying to overstate your case
    What evidence is there that parents who choose not to smack their children don’t discipline them and those children end up in goal.?
    What utter drivel.!

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  93. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Put another way ,better a smack than gaol.

    And put another way, the greater the smacking, the more chance they will end up in gaol.

    Some parents believe they are good parents by lightly smacking their kids – effectiveness is debatable, harm is negligible or nil.

    Some parents think that smacking the crap out of their kids is their right and for the good of their kids – effectiveness is negligible or nil, harm can be massive and the chance of the kids growing up to be criminals is much higher.

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  94. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    I’ve just received an email from a Green Party member. He is more than disappointed in Norman’s attack on Craig and said “to see them resort to this sort of mud slinging is pretty awful”.

    I suspected there would be very mixed feelings inside the Green camp on their leadership joining the general unprincipled behaviour of many other MPs and parties.

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  95. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Some parents think that smacking the crap out of their kids is their right and for the good of their kids –

    Actually Pete I don’t know any parent who thinks that. Occasionally I read in the media about parents who probably think that based on the fact they’re being prosecuted for child abuse, but of course, only morons, fools, mentals and shills would think a normal parent would think anything like that. Such people probably also think there’s a rape culture lurking in the male Kiwi psyche, but of course that would just be outrageous confusion bordering on commitible insanity lest they hurt themselves.

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  96. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    then proceeded to describe assaulting children and saying it’s okay

    It’s not me that says that Ryan it’s thousands of years of human civilisation. Only in the last several have disingenuous social engineers labelled this well accepted and established practice as being assault, and people who don’t understand human behaviour immediately leapt on the bandwagon in vigorous agreement, at this new-found social outrage which had hitherto been regarded as nothing of the sort, by thousands of preceding generations.

    Given that these generations included all the greats of history, as well as all the rest of us, the numbers are stacked against the social engineers miraculously pinpointing something real and indeed, one would have to conclude they’re just making it up for their own reasons, and all the slack-jawed yokels who know nothing about anything, bray like the useful idiots they can be depended on to be.

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  97. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Some parents think that smacking the crap out of their kids is their right and for the good of their kids

    Occasionally I read in the media about parents who probably think that based on the fact they’re being prosecuted for child abuse, but of course, only morons, fools, mentals and shills would think a normal parent would think anything like that.

    Only a moron would think that assault laws target what normal people do.

    If I’m put at a very slight amount extra risk (on the very unlikely chance that I harm a kid) by a law that gets the message across to violent parents that it’s not ok to harm their kids then I’m happy with that.

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  98. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    …a law that gets the message across to violent parents that it’s not ok to harm their kids then I’m happy with that.

    There was already a law in existence that dealt with those types of parents Pete, you idiot. The anti-smacking law wasn’t aimed at those, at all, in any way.

    Morons like you who think it was, are why we need a voting licence, because you’re not fit to analyse anything, let alone complicated things like politics.

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  99. Keeping Stock (10,342 comments) says:

    @ Fletch – don’t you love it when atheists try to use Jesus to lay a guilt trip on you? If it was possible for my opinion of Norman to drop any further it would have, but you can’t get any lower than rock-bottom.

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  100. Ed Snack (1,883 comments) says:

    Ryan,if I locked you in your room for a few hours, I’d be guilty of a range of potential charges from kidnapping to assault, but somehow you think it’s OK to do that to a child ? You horrible child abuser you.

    And don’t “mistake highlighting your inconsistency for disingenuousness”, I’m merely reflecting what you are implying.

    Just sometimes Ryan, you’re not quite as wonderfully intelligent and consistent as you seem to believe.

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  101. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    I don’t expect you to get it Reid. You’re obviously not a Conservative Party sort of person, Craig wouldn’t like the way you make things up and attack people with fibs.

    And he wants more people to have more votes so I doubt he would go with your idea of banning anyone you disagree with from voting.

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  102. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Craig wouldn’t like the way you make things up and attack people with fibs.

    What, you mean like calling Dunne a liar and a philanderer? He is. What else have I “fibbed” about Pete? Calling you mental? Sorry mate, but…

    I doubt he would go with your idea of banning anyone you disagree with from voting.

    I’m not suggesting that because I disagree with you Pete, I’m suggesting it because you can’t analyse anything without making obvious logical errors that a child wouldn’t make, so you’re clearly not qualified to participate reliably in the democratic process. You just did it again by mistaking my suggestion for being motivated by disagreement. You do it all the time, 24/7/365. It’s part of who you are. That’s why. And I’m not suggesting it should apply to “anyone,” just you, and maybe stephie, and probably philu.

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  103. kowtow (8,524 comments) says:

    steffie acuses me of over stating my case ,and then on cue comes PG tips with his “smacking the crap out of kids” rubbish.

    I recall the anti parent camp telling us that because we had (not we ,but the criminal underclass) had a problem with murdering their children that the problem would be solved by criminalsing good parents! Now murdering your child and seriously assaulting them was always a criminal offence so introducing the new measure was never about preventing that abuse.

    It was always about destroying the rights of good parents to bring up their children as we have always done.

    Have the murders stopped?No .

    But the Marxists got their way. Congratulations.And the Nats colluded.

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  104. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    You’ve proven you make things up again Reid, exactly what Craig detests in politics.

    I’m suggesting it because you can’t analyse anything without making obvious logical errors that a child wouldn’t make, so you’re clearly not qualified to participate reliably in the democratic process.

    There’s a redbaiter degree of irony in that. I guess someone had to fill his gap here.

    But you may be on Colin’s planet when it comes to analysing conspiracy theories. He might get your vote after all.

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  105. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    What’s made up about that Pete? Your quoted comment of mine is perfectly true, everyone knows it, except for you and probably Dunne, although I suspect Dunne does know it too but he doesn’t want to say anything, lest he need to locate someone else to do his shill-ing.

    So sorry Pete, I’m not making it up, and the true irony really lies in the fact you think I am, because the fact you think I am, proves that you really are doing exactly what I said you always do, 24/7/365.

    exactly what Craig detests in politics.

    Why should I care what Craig thinks? I’ve told you I’m neutral on Craig, so who cares what he detests?

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  106. chiz (1,145 comments) says:

    Fletch:

    when the Bible – God’s own word – clearly points to homosexual conduct being wrong, in both the Old and New
    Testaments.

    The Bible isn’t God’s word. It was written and modified by humans over several centuries. And it isn’t as clear on homosexuality as you think. Leviticus, as has been pointed out ad nauseum on this blog, isn’t relevant any more. The bit in Romans is a reference to a pagan festival. The story about Sodom and Gomorrah is about rape and inhospitality. The only time Jesus spoke it about it he didn’t condemn it and, using the coded language of the time, claimed that people were born that way. The only other references to it in the NT come from Paul but he never met Jesus and Jesus never delegated any authority to him. The only reason his writings have any kind of special status, compared to all the other people who had visions of him, is because of an historical artefact – in the first century the only writings that christians had were his ( and Matthews collected sayings of Jesus).

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  107. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    I don’t really care what you’ve told me Reid. A lot of what you say sounds like nonsense, and some of what you say would be legally actionable by Craig’s litigious standards. You choose to keep making accusations about politicians and journalists and me and others here that are blatant lies or unsupported by anything other than your imagination.

    I’ve told you a number of things that you choose to keep ignoring. As do others here. So if you can make things up about me and about others then it’s fair and reasonable to reciprocate isn’t it?

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  108. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Talking of journalists, some of them have a sense of humour.

    ‏@malosilima

    I suspect if Conservatives got 40% of the vote, NZ might have it’s first Nat/UF/Maori/NZ First/Labour/Green/Mana coalition.

    Harsh but hilarious.

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  109. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    Forty eight hours since Colin Craig last threatened to sue someone.

    Has the man mellowed out or perhaps he’s unwell?

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  110. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    A lot of what you say sounds like nonsense

    Pete this is possibly because when you take things in something happens in your mind which turns perfect sense into something strange which only your psychiatrist has a hope of ever getting to grips with.

    The fact you don’t seem to notice that process occurring isn’t surprising, but it happens and others notice it too, which explains why your batting average on the karma points here is so extraordinarily abysmal.

    I know you hallucinate that your batting average is because you make powerful, astute and insightful points that hit hard and take names and upset people, but it’s actually because you talk complete and utter bollocks, most of the time. Sometimes you don’t, most times you do.

    …some of what you say would be legally actionable by Craig’s litigious standards.

    I’d love the opportunity to see Dunne in court and use the defence of fair comment if he took suit for me calling him a liar and a philanderer. That’d be great. Why don’t you mention it at your next shill progress update session?

    I’ve told you a number of things that you choose to keep ignoring.

    Has it occurred to you this is because of the issue I just described?

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  111. Manolo (13,837 comments) says:

    I award you the title of Dunne’s Supreme Cheerleader & Arselicker.
    Will the recipient, who knows who he is, crawl all the way to the podium to receive his award?

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  112. Fletch (6,408 comments) says:

    Perhaps Craig is smart in suing Norman as it brings the issue to the fore, and it made Norman play his hand quite clearly on a contentious issue.

    Many New Zealanders do not agree with gay marriage; in fact, in the 3 News poll on the evening of the vote, Kiwis disagreed with the new law 78% to 22% (17,000 votes). That’s quite a lot of people who could potentially be Conservative party supporters.

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  113. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Perhaps Craig is smart in suing Norman as it brings the issue to the fore, and it made Norman play his hand quite clearly on a contentious issue.

    It also means win or lose, he gets to hold to account one of the most widely derided, vicious and nasty politicians in the land and expose him for what he always has been, an arrogant pompous sanctimonious fool.

    Where’s the downside?

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  114. Manolo (13,837 comments) says:

    The living wage fight US-style: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/02/18/hill-budget-office-wage-hike-would-lift-pay-but-cost-jobs/

    A plan by President Obama and fellow Democrats to increase the minimum wage to $10.10 an hour would cost roughly 500,000 jobs but increase wages for roughly 16.5 million Americans, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office said Tuesday.

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  115. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    ‘Americans speaking out about “Israelification” of the USA’

    http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/02/17/351047/zionists-celebrate-occupation-of-usa-americans-protest/

    There is a difference between Judaism and Zionism, but it often gets lost in the fog of the cognitive dissonance hysteria.

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  116. wat dabney (3,775 comments) says:

    It also means win or lose, he gets to hold to account one of the most widely derided, vicious and nasty politicians in the land and expose him for what he always has been, an arrogant pompous sanctimonious fool.

    I’m genuinely confused about which one you’re talking about.

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  117. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    You’re a gutless dick Manolo.

    Something that’s been mentioned over the years is political fact checking. Does anyone know of any plans to set anything like this up or has it just been ideas of it being floated?

    Overseas versions include:
    http://www.politifact.com/
    http://www.factcheck.org/

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  118. big bruv (13,930 comments) says:

    Winter Olympics…………why do we bother?

    Nearly $500,000 of my money into each competitor and the best we can come up with is fourth.

    And, what the hell is it with the number of them suffering from SFNS?

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  119. Longknives (4,766 comments) says:

    They’re having a hell of a piss-up by all accounts Big Bruv! So our money didn’t go completely to waste….

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  120. big bruv (13,930 comments) says:

    Longknives

    That may be the case, however all I have seen on the news is a chap with a stupid first name making gangster hand signals desperately trying to look cool.

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  121. Longknives (4,766 comments) says:

    I think we can safely say that throwing money at ‘Party animal’ snowboarders is a waste of the taxpayer dollar..

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  122. Longknives (4,766 comments) says:

    “all I have seen on the news is a chap with a stupid first name making gangster hand signals desperately trying to look cool”

    Bruv I thought you were talking about the All Blacks for a moment there…

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  123. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    If you’ve studied what this guy did, you’ll know for a fact his work is being suppressed, and that should give everyone with a 3 digit IQ much pause for thought.

    http://21stcenturywire.com/2014/02/17/the-mystery-of-teslas-missing-papers/

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  124. big bruv (13,930 comments) says:

    While I am on the subject of sport……

    What the hell ever happened to the Chappell Hadlee Series?

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  125. Colville (2,272 comments) says:

    Nearly $500,000 of my money into each competitor

    Big Bruv ! you shouted each and every competitor a cool half mil ! good man!

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  126. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    Reid

    My best guess is that the papers would have been destroyed to prevent them being used to a rival inventor’s disadvantage.

    Since no clues have emerged as to what happened & noting that it’s 71 years since Tesla’s death I doubt that much is due to be revealed.

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  127. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    Pete,

    you bring all this on yourself with your obsession with Craig to begin with. As to fact checking, I have seen you misrepresent Christian teaching and social conservatives so many times that your really not in a position to complain.

    If your going to dish it………

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  128. Pauleastbay (5,035 comments) says:

    http://t.co/GylFhVu2Ad

    And cock of the day is Mark Reason for the above article. Sad little man

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  129. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    Chiz,

    “The Bible isn’t God’s word. It was written and modified by humans over several centuries.”

    So? Written yes, but not modified. But your assumption is that God was not or could not be involved in that process, which is a belief that does not in any way prove that God did not use the human authors to reveal His word, which is what the Church has always taught.

    I won’t bother at this point with a rebuttal to the rest of your post except to say it was amusing, but very, very wrong. Your confusing gay propaganda about the Bible with serious theology.

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  130. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Shawn/Lee – I comment on many issues and politicians and parties, as is obvious on this thread. It’s others who seem to make Craig into an obsession.

    I wasn’t the first to mention Craig today and when I did it was along with mentioning a number of other parties, and I subsequently discussed a wide range of things and people. It was others who chose to raise Craig specifically.

    As to fact checking, I have seen you misrepresent Christian teaching and social conservatives so many times…

    I think that needs fact checking, without any supporting evidence I don’t accept it as anything other than a general line of attack.

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  131. wikiriwhis business (4,019 comments) says:

    Ex-Barclays’ bankers charged

    Britain’s fraud agency started criminal proceedings against three former bankers at Britain’s Barclays on Monday for the alleged manipulation of Libor interest rates.

    The Serious Fraud Office (SFO) said it has charged Peter Charles Johnson, Jonathan James Mathew and Stylianos Contogoulas with conspiracy to defraud between June 2005 and August 2007.

    The SFO last year brought charges against three former employees of Swiss bank UBS and UK brokerage RP Martin, the first people to face trial in connection with a global investigation into a rate-rigging scandal that sparked intense criticism of standards across the industry.

    Barclays paid US$450 million ($538 million) in July 2012 to settle allegations from US and UK regulators that it had manipulated Libor interest rates, prompting the resignations of its chairman and chief executive and a barrage of criticism about standards and culture.

    Libor rates, designed to reflect the wholesale cost of loans, are used to help price hundreds of trillions of dollars worth of financial products worldwide, ranging from derivatives to mortgages.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/world/9734219/Ex-Barclays-bankers-charged

    This was a huge conspiracy no one could deny as a conspiracy and it continues in JP Morgan, Goldman Sachs, Bank of America, Bank of Scotland MSBC because bankers are utter criminals that own nations. The US is owned by the corprate world and Federal Reserve. Britain is owned by the City of London financial district.

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  132. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Written yes, but not modified.

    Apart from other things any translation is a significant modification. And the fact that there are varying versions and many debates over meaning and interpretation it’s obvious there has been modifications.

    Right through the history of the bible there have been modifications and variations. For example:

    The Septuagint Vorlage (the presumed underlying Hebrew text) differs from the Masoretic Text [the received Hebrew text, the Authorized Text, the Jewish Bible, abbreviated MT] in many aspects, several of them of great significance.

    We cannot determine the exact Vorlage of the Septuagint, but it appears to have contained thousands of differences from the received text, some minor (conjunctions, prepositions, etc.) and some quite significant, including words, sentences, and even whole sections.

    An outstanding example is The Book of Jeremiah, which in the Septuagint is almost one eighth shorter than in the Masoretic Text.

    http://www.mediahistory.umn.edu/archive/biblewriting.html

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  133. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    “Shawn/Lee – I comment on many issues and politicians and parties, as is obvious on this thread. It’s others who seem to make Craig into an obsession.”

    Yeah..no. I have followed your posts on Craig for months. You sound like a stuck record, constantly repeating the same tired claims about how badly he is failing and how clear it is he is not going to get into Parliament. That’s called propaganda, and the polls show your wrong. Yet your still spinning that claim. It is clear your not giving an opinion, but campaigning for your chosen political party. People might respect you more of you were honest about that rather than laughably claiming your making neutral comments.

    “I think that needs fact checking, without any supporting evidence I don’t accept it as anything other than a general line of attack.”

    Two comments you have made repeatedly are that the Church taught people to repress a natural act, which is factually wrong and ignorant of real psychology, and the claim that social conservatives want to turn the clock back to a time that never was, which is both historically ignorant and a deliberately superficial way of dismissing a view you disagree with.

    Don’t play the innocent. Nobody here is fooled by that.

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  134. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    Saw someone spend ten minutes trying to parallel park a car today.

    I didn’t see the person so I’m not going to assume what gender she was.

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  135. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    “Apart from other things any translation is a significant modification.”

    Not true. Good translations are word for word translations which do not change the meaning. Also, Protestant translators use the Masoretic text for good reason.

    https://bible.org/seriespage/defense-faith-are-biblical-documents-reliable

    Textual reliability:

    http://www.tektonics.org/lp/nttextcrit.php

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  136. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Shawn – my comment today on Craig (and Peters) was on something of current interest that John Key said on Radio NZ this morning.

    I haven’t said he is failing badly. I haven’t said it’s clear he is not going to get into Parliament – the quote from Key that I posted actually makes it quite clear that’s still very uncertain. It’s widely believed that Craig probably needs help from Key to get in and Key is not indicating if he will do it.

    I have promoted having a much lower threshold which would make it far easier for Craig to get in which I support.

    I have also said a number of times that if Craig does get in then his constituency deserves his representation.

    I don’t currently have a “chosen political party”.

    So you haven’t followed my posts for months. You are making things up or missing many important facts.

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  137. Andrei (2,664 comments) says:

    LOL

    Professorial Pete George pontificating at his best

    The Septuagint Vorlage (the presumed underlying Hebrew text) differs from the Masoretic Text [the received Hebrew text, the Authorized Text, the Jewish Bible, abbreviated MT] in many aspects, several of them of great significance.

    We cannot determine the exact Vorlage of the Septuagint, but it appears to have contained thousands of differences from the received text, some minor (conjunctions, prepositions, etc.) and some quite significant, including words, sentences, and even whole sections.

    An outstanding example is The Book of Jeremiah, which in the Septuagint is almost one eighth shorter than in the Masoretic Text.

    D’ya know what all those big words like vorlage, Masoretic and Septuagint mean Petey boy?

    Pete George scurries away googles them up then proceeds to post a long winded comment on the origin of the Masoretic text and its oldest known complete manuscript – the Leningrad Codex to show us how erudite he is

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  138. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Two comments you have made repeatedly are that the Church taught people to repress a natural act, which is factually wrong and ignorant of real psychology,

    I haven’t said this repeatedly, but yes, teaching people not to have sex until they are married is repressing a natural act.

    …and the claim that social conservatives want to turn the clock back to a time that never was, which is both historically ignorant and a deliberately superficial way of dismissing a view you disagree with.

    I don’t think I’ve ever referred to social conservatives.

    I have commented on some individuals who want to return to ‘the good old days” sort of thing. I have at times been more specific, like when Redbaiter suggested we should go back to education as it was early last century (about 1905 he said). And those wishing for far more patriarchal times like the 1950s when wome were far more often viewed as the pr

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  139. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Two comments you have made repeatedly are that the Church taught people to repress a natural act, which is factually wrong and ignorant of real psychology,

    I haven’t said this repeatedly, but yes, teaching people not to have sex until they are married is repressing a natural act.

    …and the claim that social conservatives want to turn the clock back to a time that never was, which is both historically ignorant and a deliberately superficial way of dismissing a view you disagree with.

    I don’t think I’ve ever referred to social conservatives.

    I have commented on some individuals who want to return to ‘the good old days” sort of thing. I have at times been more specific, like when Redbaiter suggested we should go back to education as it was early last century (about 1905 he said).

    And those wishing for far more patriarchal times like the 1950s when wome were far more often viewed as the property of their husbands and when a blind eye was turned to family violence as only the business of those beating and getting beaten, there’s nothing superficial about bruises and split lips and broken bones and brain damage.

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  140. Steve (North Shore) (4,564 comments) says:

    And it starts!
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/npppj8sdaxptra9/corby.jpg

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  141. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Since no clues have emerged as to what happened & noting that it’s 71 years since Tesla’s death I doubt that much is due to be revealed.

    nasska that wasn’t why I posted it. You’ve heard of Curious George? Tesla called his assistant that. The same one who was around when he died a pauper in a NY apartment, and all his papers “disappeared.” You wouldn’t believe who he was.

    He’s a fascinating historical figure, and interesting all the kids learn about Edison, but not a thing about that man, who was ten times as brilliant. Ask yourself why that is, is why I posted it.

    Apart from other things any translation is a significant modification.

    That’s right Pete. I use the Geneva Bible myself. I used to use the KJ because that was supposed to be the most accurate English version, but the KJ was taken from the Geneva, and it has political considerations that makes the Geneva Bible the most accurate.

    http://www.genevabible.org/

    And those wishing for far more patriarchal times like the 1950s when wome were far more often viewed as the property of their husbands and when a blind eye was turned to family violence as only the business of those beating and getting beaten, there’s nothing superficial about bruises and split lips and broken bones and brain damage.

    Pete your confusion is showing itself yet again. Firstly that wasn’t the state of every single relationship in the fifties, as you imply. Secondly, that wasn’t the state of even the majority of relationships in the fifties, as you imply. Thirdly, I wouldn’t be surprised if close to precisely the same proportion of relationships such as you speak of, are occurring today. Not vewy pwogwessive, is it. Perhaps it’s something else, disguised as pwogwessivism. Luckily, not all of us are useful idiots jumping on the bandwagon. Although some clearly are.

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  142. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    …..”You wouldn’t believe who he was.”…..

    Can you point me to a link Reid?

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  143. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Good translations are word for word translations which do not change the meaning.

    How many languages are you fluent in?

    Virtually no translations are word for word.
    Similar words mean quite different things in different languages.
    Words used in some languages don’t exist in other languages.
    The same word often means different things so a translation has to pick one.

    To test the theory that translations are always perfect here’s a simple test.

    If I speak in human or angelic tongues, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. – 1 Corinthians 13:1

    To Spanish (Google translate):
    Si yo hablase lenguas humanas y angélicas, pero no tengo amor, vengo a ser como metal que resuena, o címbalo que retiñe. – 1 Corintios 13:01

    Back to Englisg (Google translate)
    If I speak in human and angelic tongues but do not have love, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. – 1 Corinthians 13:01

    ‘And’ changed to ‘or’ is significant, brass-gong, clanging-tinkling

    Back to English (Bing translate):
    If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. -1 Corinthians 13:01

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  144. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Pete your confusion is showing itself yet again. Firstly that wasn’t the state of every single relationship in the fifties, as you imply. Secondly, that wasn’t the state of even the majority of relationships in the fifties, as you imply.

    More irony from Reid, who is either confused or being mischievous – I didn’t imply it was in every single relationship nor the majority of relationships. Not at all.

    You would have to be a moron to think something would apply to everyone.

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  145. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    ShawnLH

    This is a political blog. As such the leaders of political parties get their beans on these forums on a regular basis. Banks, Key, Whoever is the current Labour Leader, Turea, Sharples, Norman, Turei, Harawira……all come up for criticism, mocking & anything that can be thrown at them, here as well as on other blogs.

    But for some reason no one is supposed to say an unkind word about Colin Craig. The mention of his name is sufficient for the numerous Godnutters who frequent this blog to lose all objectivity & wrap themselves protectively around their Messiah.

    Why the expectation for preferential treatment?

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  146. Left Right and Centre (2,986 comments) says:

    (1) Diabesity – Diabetes + obesity. A meme a day keeps the boredom away.

    (2) Longknives and NZ winter Olympians. Who pays for them to go ? I’m not cynical enough to think that they do what they do – how many hours a week ? Just so they can party after competing. Whatever you can use for motivation – if someone won gold because they were motivated by partying rather than the medal itself – by medal chance criteria they are ‘worthy’ of going even if the motive is not exactly ‘nobel’. Anyway – that’s part of snowboarding culture, isn’t it ? If you weren’t a ‘party animal’ you would be a non-conformist and therefore have to toe the line in order to fit in with the social group. That’s life – it’s always going to rot people a bit when you send also-rans off to make up the numbers. There’s something about watching losers living it up like winners having a great time – hahahaha. They should just sit in a corner reeking of the rank stench of failure thinking about how they shamed and disgraced their fellow countrymen by daring to think they were any good. :)

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  147. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    I didn’t imply it was in every single relationship nor the majority of relationships. Not at all.

    Pete’s own words as quoted below give the lie to his hallucination. Perhaps you need to learn English Pete. I’ve bolded words that you should have inserted but didn’t and struck out words that you did use, if you really didn’t want to imply what you did.

    And those wishing for far more patriarchal times like the 1950s when some wome were far more often sometimes viewed as the property of their husbands and when sometimes a blind eye was turned to family violence as only the business of those beating and getting beaten, there’s nothing superficial about bruises and split lips and broken bones and brain damage.

    But even those additions are weak, given your emotive hysteria in painting the picture you wished to paint, so if I wanted to do a proper job Pete and say what you allege you really meant, I’d have to completely re-write especially the last few lines, which I can’t be arsed doing, since the point is proven, and a grown man should know what he’s saying and stand by it, without obfuscation or prevarication, when someone calls him on its natural meaning.

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  148. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    It’s curious nasska. A common theme seems to be “I haven’t decided if I will vote for Colin but don’t be mean to him!”

    I’m not sure how pointing out simple facts can be seen as mean.

    It’s not just Craig who needs to toughen up if he wants to be involved in politics, his fan club needs to as well. And they could do with taking some tolerance pills. Saying things like Colin Craig’s Conservative Party seems to be as bad as saying The Vatican is Grossly Rich (fortunately the current head has far more modest and appropriate groundings than some predecessors).

    And some of them seem to forget (or don’t know) the Kiwiblog motto.

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  149. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    Lest we forget (the parasites who gorge themselves by manufacturing alarm)
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/copenhagen-climate-change-confe/6736517/Copenhagen-climate-summit-1200-limos-140-private-planes-and-caviar-wedges.html

    Copenhagen is preparing for the climate change summit that will produce as much carbon dioxide as a town the size of Middlesbrough.

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  150. Andrei (2,664 comments) says:

    LOL Professor of linguistics Pete George and just exactly how many languages are you conversational in?

    Do you know what your machine translations prove? Nothing

    Of course Bible translations do not rely on one translator but teams of translators to try and overcome the issues you point out and good translations of literary works often have two translators, one a native speaker of the original language and fluent in the new language and vice versa.

    When I was a kid a cantor was chanting a psalm and he messed up a phrase, whereupon a little old lady, dressed in black who stood at the back of the Church and who I had never heard speak before corrected him because she knew the words by heart, by heart Pete George, and that is how they have been transmitted from generation to generation, books are a backup copy

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  151. Southern Raider (1,831 comments) says:

    Must be election year. TV3 is replaying that bullshit socialist documentary called Mind The Gap.

    First time I saw it I wanted to punch the guy through the TV. Just saw it when switching the channel and still want to do the same.

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  152. Tauhei Notts (1,724 comments) says:

    Reid at 6.27 p.m
    Thank you for providing the link in your post.
    It is thoughtful comments like that, that make this the best blog site on the web.
    But, Reid, don’t take yourself too seriously when Nasska takes the piss. His humour is irreverent and delightful.

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  153. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    PG

    I’m fiscally conservative & socially liberal so the policies of the CCCP are a total anathema to me. Naturally I’m going to point out any & every little little fault or inconsistency displayed by their Mr Craig as leader.

    A concrete pill every morning might help him to dry his eyes & face the reality of political life.

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  154. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Andrei – thanks, now try and explain that to Shawn.

    Reid, your first modification is unnecessary. Your second modification is barely necessary and “usually” or “most of the time” would be more appropriate than “sometimes”.

    The Roper Report in 1987 was instrumental in changing attitudes significantly. It refers to “The Traditional Approach”:

    The ‘Traditional Approach’ is described as ‘non-involvement’ or ‘reluctant intervention’ by police, and was the prevalent approach prior to 1970 in the majority of police departments both here and overseas (Buzawa & Buzawa 2003; Ford 1986). Many authors trace the origins of non-intervention to views about marriage and the family which are rooted in cultural and religious traditions.

    These traditions perpetuated ideas about family relationships; significantly the subordinate position of the wife to her husband and the private nature of the family (O’Donnell & Craney 1982, Pilott & Good 1991). Feminist and some non-feminist authors such as violence researchers described the disadvantages women faced within traditional marriages and the difficulties many women experienced in trying to get help to stop family violence.

    A perception of separation between public and private spheres was further supported by economic structures. Hence a domestic incident was not regarded as the responsibility of the state; rather it was a private matter to be resolved between a husband and wife.

    http://www.justice.govt.nz/publications/global-publications/f/family-violence-and-the-pro-arrest-policy-a-literature-review-december-2006/2-historical-development-of-the-pro-arrest-policy-in-new-zealand

    That’s all very commonly know stuff.

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  155. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    A common theme seems to be “I haven’t decided if I will vote for Colin but don’t be mean to him!” I’m not sure how pointing out simple facts can be seen as mean.

    I’m tempted to call you a broken pencil misfire from now on Pete. It’s just your statements are always pointless and you always miss the target anyway.

    I don’t care if you’re mean to Craig, I really don’t. But I hate shills. They’re like trolls, in my book. It’s rude, obnoxious, behaviour that has no place in a political blog, IMO. Your Craig posts aren’t insightful, they’re not clever, they’re not witty and they’re not effective, because you are not effective in your political analysis.

    I don’t know if you notice your downticks whenever you make a Craig post but they significantly outweigh the upticks all the time. But you see Pete, I don’t think this is because people particularly like or support Craig as you hallucinate, I think it’s to register their opinion that in doing your shill work, you’re being a complete and utter dick.

    I may be wrong of course, how do I know why people give you downticks, but I’m guessing the above is the reason.

    I wish you’d stop it, quite frankly. As Shawn pointed out above, your shill work is quite obvious, it always has been and it always will be. All of we regulars, I am fairly sure, spotted it immediately you started, which was when Craig started making headlines during your master’s wilderness months as he licked his wounds following his disgraceful lying and philandering.

    I realise you can’t see that because you hallucinate that the only way someone operates in politics is like one does when one is in love with someone, because that’s how you operate and it’s quite obvious that you just want to scratch the big meany Cwaig’s eyes out, don’t you, because he can hurt your master. Yes Pete. All of us see this. All of us. We always have.

    But get it through your skull mate, that the rest of us don’t operate like you, and the fact we don’t like your schill work, does not equate either to approval or disapproval of Craig, it’s just we don’t like what you’ve been doing, in my case, mostly because you’re totally useless at it and it’s pathetic watching you.

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  156. kowtow (8,524 comments) says:

    No surprises there

    PG quoting feminist studies……and the others are probably sociologists deeply immersed in cultural marxism…….zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

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  157. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    I don’t know if you notice your downticks whenever you make a Craig post but they significantly outweigh the upticks all the time.

    Reid – the first comment I mentioned Craig (amongst others – 6 up ticks, 2 down.
    My next mention simply quoted Key, 3 up, 3 down.
    At 3.05 I quoted Garner, 3 up, 5 down.

    You’re making things up as usual.

    Not that a few ticks matter, the Colin squad just jump on anything regardless. And I don’t comment here to please a few nutters, most people don’t tick. Hundreds of people read Kiwiblog, I’m not going to run to my lawyer over five down ticks.

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  158. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    Reid

    ….”I don’t know if you notice your downticks whenever you make a Craig post but they significantly outweigh the upticks all the time.”….

    Whatever you think of PG’s views, anyone who makes a critical comment about Colin Craig needs only to stand back & watch the Godwhacks go for the red tick. They can’t help themselves…..the CCCP has given them tunnel vision & robbed them of what little objectivity they ever possessed.

    The “karma” system is valueless since Baity was caught wanking upticks but it does serve to illustrate the petty minded attitude of the religious conservatives amongst us.

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  159. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Kowotow, that isn’t a feminist study, it’s a report that comments on feminist and non-feminist research.

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  160. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    It also has to be said Pete gets downticks just for being Pete. Seems there’s a lot of people who care more about who says something than about what they say.

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  161. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    nasska, I’m a religious conservative, but I downtick Pete’s Craig posts because Pete’s an idiot and a shill.

    But you obviously know better so tell us, how did you come across this insight?

    Because you “know” how religious conservatives think and you “know” we all think the same?

    You should volunteer your brain for research, I’m sure Winston, Craig or maybe even Wussel would generate a bidding frenzy for such a valuable piece of equipment.

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  162. Nostalgia-NZ (5,221 comments) says:

    ‘But for some reason no one is supposed to say an unkind word about Colin Craig. The mention of his name is sufficient for the numerous Godnutters who frequent this blog to lose all objectivity & wrap themselves protectively around their Messiah’

    Some irony from nasska which escapes him. Each day he froths at the mouth about Colin Craig, or the Church, god ‘whacks’ and other small things which comfort him or her, but that doesn’t amount to ‘lose all objectivity.’ Check that one out nasska – subtle as, to the blindingly stupid. Why not cheer yourself up with a little ‘report’ to your various correspondents.

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  163. kowtow (8,524 comments) says:

    Talking of sad fucks……..

    Pete G has made 2 references today concerning the redoubtable Redbaiter and true to his obsessive from narsekisser has just done it now.

    Red sadly is not here but these two dick heads just can’t stop talking about him…..strange bods .

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  164. Left Right and Centre (2,986 comments) says:

    Red the sadistsadly is not here but these two dick heads just can’t stop talking about him…..strange bods .

    stockholm syndrome

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  165. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Reid – the first comment I mentioned Craig (amongst others – 6 up ticks, 2 down.
    My next mention simply quoted Key, 3 up, 3 down.
    At 3.05 I quoted Garner, 3 up, 5 down.

    You’re making things up as usual.

    I counted them up Pete, all your posts today which mentioned Craig, guess what? 35 for, 81 against. Over 2:1 against. And I think this was a good day for you. Check yesterday and it would run close to 3:1 or even 4:1 against, I bet.

    Why BTW did you mention your other posts? I wasn’t talking about those in my 9.08, but as usual, you get all confused about the point being made…

    BTW, your 1st post on Craig with 6/2 in favour, was the only post you made on Craig which was.

    Talk about selective Pete. Out of 17 posts, you chose the ONLY one which was positive, 2 others were balanced, all the rest were negative balance. What does that say about your integrity?

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  166. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    True RightNow, there’re some that do that. Because most comments don’t get many ticks you can often tell who has done it, someone comments and then a downtick arrives about the same time. And sometimes I comment and get downticked, someone else says the same thing and gets upticked.

    It’s mostly quite meaningless, but if Reid gets a buzz out of downticking then fair enough.

    Funny games some people play here. I suppose they enjoy themselves, but by the sound of their comments they often don’t sound very happy about things.

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  167. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    Reid

    ….”Because you “know” how religious conservatives think and you “know” we all think the same?”…..

    I reckon that you’d differ greatly in the flavour of ice cream you’d each prefer but when it comes to the instructions you receive from your imaginary friend I’ve noticed that you all sing fairly much from the same page. The indoctrination you received was probably very similar to that of anyone else with a subsequent religious bent & therefore you will make your decisions using the same set of values to weigh them against.

    So yes….when it comes to the nuts & bolts of reglioconservatism you do think alike….

    and you all throw your toys out of cot when anyone calls out Colin Craig on his waffling. :)

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  168. Left Right and Centre (2,986 comments) says:

    Southern Raider – could be. But I doubt it.

    How many programmes and films are repeated on TV ? All of them. I saw one on the Chch shakes – Aftermath I think. Repeat. Well – because I’d seen it I gave up on it half way through or something.

    It reached a point where a first-run programme was such an exciting novelty – they clearly required being marketed as ‘All New’, as I’m sure you’ve noticed. Of course I hate the phrase ‘all new’ to best describe a first-run yet to be broadcast episode.

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  169. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    ….”Red sadly is not here”…..

    kowtow’s missing his bum buddy! :)

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  170. Lucia Maria (2,467 comments) says:

    Nasska,

    So yes….when it comes to the nuts & bolts of reglioconservatism you do think alike….

    and you all throw your toys out of cot when anyone calls out Colin Craig on his waffling.

    You ought to get out more and maybe read some of the conservative blogs.

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  171. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    sometimes I comment and get downticked, someone else says the same thing and gets upticked.

    Really? Give us an example Pete. Just one. Sounds like there must be hundreds so shouldn’t be too hard for you to find just one of them.

    and you all throw your toys out of cot when anyone calls out Colin Craig on his waffling,

    No I throw my toys out of the cot when someone falsely represents themselves as a shill. That’s why I do it. So wrong again nasska. I’ve noticed you’ve become close to Pete lately, I do hope he hasn’t been giving you his “wisdom.”

    if Reid gets a buzz out of downticking then fair enough.,

    I only started downticking when you started shilling Pete, and you’re the only one I do it to. And when you don’t shill, I don’t downtick. And when you stop shilling, I won’t be downticking you anymore.

    Funny Reid. Lose the argument so you try and make out tick counts matter.

    Pete, you’re the one who made the argument, so I’m not losing it, all I asked you was to provide a single example of your allegation. Clearly that’s too difficult to do. Were you lying?

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  172. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Funny Reid. Lose the argument so you try and make out tick counts matter. I really don’t care about ticks, that’s not why I comment here, to win a wee mythical pissing contest.

    BTW I downticked you there because someone had already done it and I didn’t want you to presume it was me. otherwise I’d have given you an uptick for the entertainment.

    kowtow – FFS, Red is not here by his own choice. Same for Craig presumably, unless that’s Shawn or Manolo. I presume Key doesn’t comment here either. Does that mean no one should mention them?

    Red would be flattered, he was always an attention seeker.

    But if you think Kiwiblog should ban talking about anyone who isn’t commenting here I guess you could try putting it to everyone – I suggest asking early tomorrow and see how many upticks you get.

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  173. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    A semi-rural recluse like you nasska should take Lucia’s advice. You may get to meet a big tall religious gal that likes long leather boots and suchlike! :)

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  174. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    It’s just that PG & I are destined to be late converts to Colin Craig’s personality hugfest Inc Reid. :)

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  175. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    Pete and Reid. I luv both you guys and upticked you both accordingly! :)

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  176. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    Pass thanks JB. :)

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  177. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    Catholic girls were always the best roots when I was a randy young bastard nasska! :)

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  178. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    BTW I downticked you there because someone had already done it and I didn’t want you to presume it was me. otherwise I’d have given you an uptick for the entertainment.

    Pete, there’s only one downtick in my 9.49. You can’t even lie properly can you. I bet you were the kid holding the broken vase when your mum walked in pointing to your little brother, weren’t you.

    I luv both you guys and upticked you both accordingly!

    I used to feel the same about you Johnboy but now you’ve told me you luv Pete as well I’m re-assessing.

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  179. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    Counsellors tell legal high users to smoke real thing

    Counsellors tell legal high users to smoke real thing

    By Amy McGillivray
    4:50 PM Wednesday Feb 19, 2014

    Some synthetic cannabis users have been told to smoke the real thing. Photo/Thinkstock
    Some synthetic cannabis users have been told to smoke the real thing. Photo/Thinkstock

    Counsellors are encouraging some synthetic cannabis addicts to smoke the real thing after seeing teens becoming a “total mess” by climbing out of moving cars, suffering hallucinations and seizures.

    They also say they are anecdotally aware someone has died as a result of consuming psychoactive substances.

    The revelations are contained in Western Bay of Plenty District Council psychoactive substances policy stakeholders meeting report.

    BOP Addiction Services, which comes under the district health board, and Te Puna Hauora, a community mental health service, said in the report the number of people seeking help was small but their problems were “significant” and included hallucinations, seizures and impulsivity, including climbing out of moving cars.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/bay-of-plenty-times/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503343&objectid=11205417
    -=============================

    Shows what happens when you put shit brains in charge of the Laws.
    sooner that pounsy arsed Dunne and the likes are booted to touch the better. nothing short of an out of touch fucking idiot.

    Labour should leave Key alone and attack that pounce for being out of touch.

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  180. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    I think it was because the Nun’s put the fear of God up them so much about fucking that they thought their first one was going to be their last one! :)

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  181. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    Johnboy (12,859 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 9:56 pm

    Catholic girls were always the best roots when I was a randy young bastard nasska! :)
    ==================

    Oh well you did live in the metropolis of Wainuiomata JB. Probably explains Trev as well.

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  182. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Reid – you’ve counted ticks on one thread. Compare that to the next thread.

    Start here: http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/02/edwards_on_labours_chances.html#comment-1278182
    23 up, 1 down
    9 up, 1 down
    17 up, 1 down
    15 up, 1 down
    7 up, 1 down
    7 up, 1 down
    6 up, 0 down – you missed one
    8 up, 1 down

    That was about Labour and Cunliffe, so the Colin squad weren’t swarming, and it shows there’s a lot more interest in Labour/Cunliffe than Craig.

    Funny thing is DPF quoted an exact same quote that I did that mentioned Craig. He doesn’t comment so you can’t downtick, maybe you should boycott his blog to teach him a lesson.

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  183. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    Hell ten minutes and no minus! He/She must be off masturbating elsewhere! :)

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  184. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    Fuck off V2. I’m a Naenae boy by birth! :)

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  185. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    Johnboy (12,860 comments) says:
    February 19th, 2014 at 9:59 pm

    I think it was because the Nun’s put the fear of God up them so much about fucking that they thought their first one was going to be their last one! :)
    ==============================

    And I’ll bet you helped them break gods law as well JB. You know the one about not using a frenchie or did you just do the quickie withdrawal before squirting your seed? 8O

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  186. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    I’m off, apparently there’s a great aurora tonight, I’m off to the south coast.

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  187. SPC (5,643 comments) says:

    To walk in Norman’s shoes for a moment.

    There are people who believe they know what wrongdoing is (because they have read what humans of the past regarded as wrong in their word about God book, thus their version of right and wrong is very traditional or conservative), and they call wrongdoing sin.

    Then there was some guy who talked about sin on some mount, where anything less than being perfect was falling short of the way of God. Instead of just avoiding the wrongdoing described by the law, there was the higher way of simply being a good sort – someone who was a peacemaker, slow to anger and judge, but quick to help and provide for others – even the sinners and those of different cultures.

    Damn socialist and their stupid global village … .

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  188. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    Reid – you’ve counted ticks on one thread. Compare that to the next thread.

    Pete I’ve capitalised in the hope you’ll get the message. But I doubt it’ll help.

    I WASN’T TALKING ABOUT ANY COMMENTS OTHER THAN THOSE ABOUT CRAIG, GET IT?

    CRIKEY.

    I told you earlier today you had problems with comprehension Pete, thanks for proving it, yet again, with yet more irrelevant crap.

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  189. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    Stop being so obsessed with downticks PG. You have to expect them in your capacity as an up and coming politician.

    I can get depressed about them cause I’m just a happy, lovable joker who never says a bad word about anybody! :)

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  190. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    Oh well that explains it then.
    Sadly had to go to a house today that belongs to an ex Taita lady. Now in hospice care. Met up with her sister for the first time in about 50 years. They all went to Waiwhetu girls college (which just happened to be outside my front gate.) and were friends of my sisters.
    Catholic as well and while they were dated by some of my mates were true to form and shagged their little hearts out.

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  191. SPC (5,643 comments) says:

    Johnboy, stop posing as a disciple of the good sort (and please remember to get the consent of sheep while they are still sober).

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  192. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    In Naenae we used to shake up a bottle of coke and use it as a douche V2. We were too young to go the chemist in those days! :)

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  193. OneTrack (3,114 comments) says:

    “Regardless of what Colin Craig does, or does not think, he is entitled to his opinion. ”

    Not in Norman’s pwogwessive land he isn’t. It’ll be the gulag for Craig.

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  194. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    Know what you mean. Plastic bags had just been invented about then.

    http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100208050545AAQpWHt

    It was a tough town back then. Home of the bodgies and wodgies.

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  195. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    The aspiring psychiatrists were attending their first class on emotional extremes. “Just to establish some parameters,” said the professor to the student from Arkansas, “What is the opposite of joy?”

    “Sadness,” said the student.

    And the opposite of depression?” he asked of the young lady from Oklahoma.

    “Elation,” said she.

    “And you sir,” he said to the young man from Texas, “how about the opposite of woe?”

    The Texan replied, “Sir, I believe that would be giddy-up.”

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  196. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    And Gladwrap was but a distant future invention V2. I used to hate going to the Chemist to ask for some Durex in the plain brown bag produced from under the counter. The old pervert used to stare at you like you were a serial rapist or something! :)

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  197. kowtow (8,524 comments) says:

    …….not as much as narsekisser is missing his circle jerker kea .

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  198. Viking2 (11,488 comments) says:

    you might call that the bad old days eh.
    funny thing was that the Armed forces were given them by the hand full during and after the war. Problem was that they forgot to do the same for us teenagers.

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  199. nasska (11,580 comments) says:

    Just do what the rest of us did JB. Clean up a sheep’s intestine & tie a knot in one end of a length of them

    The odd bloke a couple of hundred yards up the road used to leave them in the sheep. :)

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  200. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    Did you here the one about lend-lease V2. Stalin asked Churchill to send 5 million condoms for the glorious Red Army to use on the final push into Germany but to only send the largest he had as Russian soldiers were all hung. Churchill complied but had them all marked “British Army Condoms-Small”

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  201. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    I’m a bit worried about minus. I hope he/she is alright! :)

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  202. Johnboy (16,651 comments) says:

    What was odd about him nasska?

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  203. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    Naaska,

    “But for some reason no one is supposed to say an unkind word about Colin Craig. The mention of his name is sufficient for the numerous Godnutters who frequent this blog to lose all objectivity & wrap themselves protectively around their Messiah.”

    My issue is not about “unkind” words but about Pete’s campaigning for Dunne while claiming to be neutral in his comments on Craig. Unfortunately this blog is often inundated by liberal nutters who despise social conservatism of any sort, and anti-Christian nutters who cannot resist ranting irrationally about their fantasies about the Christian Faith.

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  204. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    SPC:

    To walk in Norman’s shoes for a moment.

    I’m torn between whether to say “Gimme back my shoes” or “Norman’s an ambulance”

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  205. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    Pete,

    “It’s curious nasska. A common theme seems to be “I haven’t decided if I will vote for Colin but don’t be mean to him!”

    I’m not sure how pointing out simple facts can be seen as mean.”

    What facts? You never give any facts, just the same tiresome repetitions that have proven to be false. “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament!”

    Except the party is growing and he’s up in the polls.

    Facts clearly are not your strong point. Shilling for the useless and empty vessel called Dunne is.

    And by the way, IF i vote at all it will be for the Libertarianz or ACT. I stand up for Craig, even though I think his economic policies are wrong, because I always stand up for social conservatives. Your the only one lying about this and hiding your real reasons behind laughable claims to objective and neutral commentary.

    There is a name for that. It’s COWARD.

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  206. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Except the party is growing and he’s up in the polls.

    Apart from all your other factless assetions that are wrong this claim deserves attention. What polls and over how long? Polls for the Conservative Party hardly deviate from the margin of error outside a 1-2.5% range which is less than he got in the election.

    “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament! “Craig is failing, he won’t enter Parliament!”

    That’s hysterical. I’ve never said that, and it can’t be proven false until the election.

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  207. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    “That’s hysterical. I’ve never said that”

    What a wonderful convenient memory hole you have. You have in fact been repeating some variation of the assertion for months.

    From the Craig vs Norman thread: “Craig can’t go crying to his lawyer over anything that is said in Parliament. It’s looking increasingly unlikely it will be put to the pest anyway.”

    Note that second sentence. And you have been repeating that view for months. Gee, I wonder why? Might it be something to do with being a UF supporter? I don’t like people lying about their motivations.

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  208. Reid (16,509 comments) says:

    That’s hysterical. I’ve never said that, and it can’t be proven false until the election.

    “That’s hysterical”

    Says Pete who gets hysterical whenever Craig hits the headlines.

    “I’ve never said that”

    Says confused Pete failing to understand Shawn was summarising the gist of all Pete’s comments about Craig, which was obvious to all of us except for Pete, who took it literally, just like a village idiot would.

    “…it cant be proven false until the election”

    Says still confused Pete, but this time throwing in a worthless observation about the completely obvious which everyone already knew, but which Pete seems to think throws extra light on the situation, just in case none of we who comment on a political blog didn’t already know about how elections work in the democracy we live in, during an election year.

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  209. SPC (5,643 comments) says:

    ShawnLH, clearly the language of “peace” is calling liberals and non Christians “nutters”. It was the unkind thing to do so … .

    As Anglicanism declines into a small sect, the rise of libertarian monarchists divided against the world amongst the white race of the colonies.

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  210. Ryan Sproull (7,205 comments) says:

    It’s not me that says that Ryan it’s thousands of years of human civilisation. Only in the last several have disingenuous social engineers labelled this well accepted and established practice as being assault, and people who don’t understand human behaviour immediately leapt on the bandwagon in vigorous agreement, at this new-found social outrage which had hitherto been regarded as nothing of the sort, by thousands of preceding generations.

    Given that these generations included all the greats of history, as well as all the rest of us, the numbers are stacked against the social engineers miraculously pinpointing something real and indeed, one would have to conclude they’re just making it up for their own reasons, and all the slack-jawed yokels who know nothing about anything, bray like the useful idiots they can be depended on to be.

    That’s fine. That’s your belief, your claim, your position. My point was only that, in response to someone saying that the repeal of S59 was giving the same protection against assault to children that adults enjoy, you said that smacking a child was not assault. Now you agree that it is assault, but claim that it is a righteous assault grounded in the human race’s proud history of parenting.

    You agree that if I treated you the way that you advocate treating children, I could be arrested for assault. That’s all that is necessary for… It was Pete George who made the claim to which you responded. That’s all that’s necessary for Pete George to be right (well, accurate) and you to be unfair in your response to him.

    As I said, you are free to believe that assaulting children is part of good parenting, but you are not free to avoid the meaning of the term “assault” just because you feel it brings negative connotations to your advocacy of assaulting children as part of good parenting.

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  211. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    SPC,

    “ShawnLH, clearly the language of “peace” is calling liberals and non Christians “nutters”.

    I said ANTI-CHRISTIANS not non-Christians, and even then I was reffering only to a few hysteria driven individuals on this blog.

    Liberalism is certainly a form of intellectual insanity.

    It was, by the way, a response to the use of the term “Godnutters”, quid pro quo if you like.

    “As Anglicanism declines into a small sect”

    In Africa and Asia Anglicanism is thriving and growing.

    Oh, and I’m not white, I’m Métis. You can look that up.

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  212. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    I don’t like people lying about their motivations.

    Irony of the day.
    You go overboard defending Craig, only Craig amongst all politicians, you mainly or only comment in threads where Craig is promonent, you make many assertions without facts (you haven’t backed up your “increasing in the polls” claim which happens to be a common Craig fan line) and you particularly target me, making things up (lying) about things like me campaigning for Dunne (no evidence of that here). So your motivation is highly questionable.

    But whatever. It’s not as if others don’t see through your bull.

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  213. ShawnLH (5,285 comments) says:

    Except Pete, unlike you I have been open about my motivation. I’m defending him because he is a social conservative. I have told you that three times now. Try being that open and honest Pete.

    “Conservatives on rise”

    “Colin Craig’s Conservatives are at 2.8 percent, well over double the last poll. It’s the highest ever result for the party, and crucially, it is taking votes off National”

    http://www.3news.co.nz/OPINION-Beware-Colin-Craig—Conservatives-on-rise/tabid/1382/articleID/321016/Default.aspx

    2011-2013: 3 News Reid Research polling – Conservatives consistently above 1 percent, as high as 2.8 percent now.

    Try again Pete, your losing this one.

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  214. Pete George (23,600 comments) says:

    Ah, Conservatives got 2.65% in the 2011 election. And you’re quoting an article from last year.

    The latest 3 News/Reid Research poll: Conservative – 2.1 percent, down 0.7 percent
    http://www.3news.co.nz/3-News-Reid-Research-poll-shows-Peters-as-kingmaker/tabid/1607/articleID/330698/Default.aspx

    The latest Roy Morgan: Conservative Party 2.5% (down 1%)
    http://www.roymorgan.com/~/media/Files/Findings%20PDF/2014/February/5418-NZ-National-Voting-Intention.pdf

    The Conservatives are not on the rise at the moment, they are on the fall (albeit within the margin of error).

    Facts can be pesky.

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