General Debate 20 June 2014

June 20th, 2014 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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204 Responses to “General Debate 20 June 2014”

  1. Harriet (4,794 comments) says:

    Charter schools and voucher systems:

    “…..The really radical concept is that government should have such a pervasive hand in public education in the first place. In all other examples of government-provided services, such as hospitals, public housing and food programs, much greater allowance is made for choice than what we find in education. “The government doesn’t tell the family how often they should go to the hospital, and on what schedule; it doesn’t require that food can be obtained only if the government establishes the menu and operates the kitchen; yet it has no hesitancy in directing a child about what school to attend, on what days, in what classes, with which teachers, and what books to read.”

    Indeed, says Kirkpatrick, “education is the last bastion of compulsory socialism providing social services to the general citizenry.” As John Stuart Mill warned over a century ago, “A general state education is a mere contrivance for moulding people to be exactly like one another; and as the mould in which it casts them is that which pleases the predominant power of the government, whether this be a monarch, a priesthood, an aristocrat, or the majority of the existing generation; in proportion as it is efficient and successful, it establishes a despotism over the mind, leading by natural tendency to one over the body.”

    Labour wants to mold the current 92% of kiwi children into mindless despots like themselves. And most of National. :cool:

    In Holland, one of the world’s most socialistic democracies, full educational choice came into effect in 1917. Article 23 of the Dutch Constitution not only guarantees the provision of education, public or private, but implicitly outlaws discrimination in funding. The results of this arrangement are revealing: in 1920 nearly 70 per cent of Dutch children attended public schools; today over 70 per cent attend private schools.

    It was of course people like B. A. Santamaria who decades ago fought for some equity here.[ in australia]

    He rightly argued that some people, such as Catholics, were facing double jeopardy in this: having to subsidise with their tax dollars secular government schools, while also having to dish out money to send their children to non-government schools.

    The debate can still be had as to whether and to what extent governments should be involved in school funding at all……”

    http://billmuehlenberg.com/1991/06/10/a-review-of-choice-in-schooling-by-david-kirkpatrick/

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  2. igm (1,413 comments) says:

    It has not taken long for radio and print media to start trying to give the lying leeching Labour leader a little help. Assumedly, Little has rallied his union thugs to threaten reprisals against anyone who dares upset the union clone (“Tojo”), as he is a key card for their disgusting ideals if elected. Come on, we don’t want to let this mongrel off the hook like Lecher and Slobcom.

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  3. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    Today let’s play *reasons why ‘left’ = ‘left out of lawmaking’* . . .

    (1) Labour: 280 000 NZ children live in ‘poverty’.

    (2) Internet-Mana: Want free education.

    Um . . . what constitutes poverty or relative poverty ? For me it’s a nonsense misuse of the word. And Labour are therefore probably a dumb misuse of a vote.

    Education is ‘free’ from primary to secondary age. Tertiary costs course fees / point fees – yes. Apparently the actual cost is four times the fee paid by the student. Who pays the other three-quarters ? Is the three-quarter part in fact . . . free ? Isn’t tertiary education mostly free as it stands ? The cost that racks up is the living costs, not so much the fees. Students with rent and bills to pay – that’s where the big debt mounts up. I suppose Internet-Mana want to cover everything ?

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  4. itstricky (1,772 comments) says:

    Labour wants to mold the current 92% of kiwi children into mindless despots like themselves. And most of National.

    What a stupid argument that quote was. “The Government doesn’t tell people when to go to hospital”. For God’s sake, stopped reading after that point. Hey Harry – The Church tells you when to go to its premises! That priest always trying to 92% of children into his cultist ways…

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  5. EAD (950 comments) says:

    Yet again this National government has passed more social engineering legislation for which they have no mandate for but appeases certain pressure groups and will end up taking away more of our liberties as they yesterday they passed the Orwellian sounding “Vulnerable Children Bill”, that changes to the law so that “abusive or neglectful” parents will have to prove they are safe if they wish to keep their children they have. Of course we already have laws that protect against violence (which are not properly enforced – some might say deliberately?) and of course it will be the State that decides what “neglectful” is.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11277579

    Following on from other numerous social engineering pieces of legislation passed over the past 15 years, this is yet another way in which our one party NatLab State is attempting to expand its power over every aspect of our lives. The reason given (of course) is that they are just trying to protect the vulnerable. To me it looks as though these left wing Do-gooders who have gained bureaucratic power wish to dictate how children should be raised by criminalising those parents who do not produce children to the government approved “healthy” format.

    We need to stop this erosion of our basic rights, parents need to be able to bring up kids how they want not, in a manner dicated by the State. If you don’t recognise this as 1984, there truly is no hope.

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  6. Colville (2,254 comments) says:

    With Labour looking like its vote will tank to 20% will we see the Greens start to spout slightly more rational centerist policy in a power play to move over and crush Labour from the left side?

    10 – 15% of the electorate is up for grabs, if half goes right to Nats where will the other half go?

    Must be very tempting for Russell “power at any cost” Norman.

    Greens could end up with 20 MPs ! if played right.

    It would nearly kill Labour, be very very hard to come back from, with large parties on both sides of them.

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  7. Harriet (4,794 comments) says:

    “…What a stupid argument that quote was. “The Government doesn’t tell people when to go to hospital”. For God’s sake, stopped reading after that point….”

    So why are they then so concerned about education – not kids being educated in general – but every fucken particular? Isn’t healthcare MORE important than education?

    Ironicly:

    They should just make it compulsary for -say um – pregnant women to go to hospitals, given that the government paid particular importance in educating women in every other important matter in their lives – like sex education – why would women complain about that compulsion – as it follows on from sex education?

    Why are people restrained from freedom with education? They arn’t with healthcare.

    “…..in proportion as it is efficient and successful, it establishes a despotism over the mind, leading by natural tendency to one over the body.”….”

    You are a case in point. :cool:

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  8. Harriet (4,794 comments) says:

    EAD#

    “Vulnerable Children Bill”

    I have the same concerns.

    But I have read before that it is immoral for a government to ‘return’ children to homes that will never provide a place where children ‘thrive’. Currently the government removes children from homes where the parents are ‘complex dysfunctionals’ – but is then forced to return the child when ‘some basic improvments have been made’ – they are then only removed again at a later date. Complex dysfuntionals ‘uneducated, drugged ect ect never make good parents because they can hhardly look after themselves.

    I also read that the government could maybe be later seud by the child.

    Which leads me to believe that ‘a child removed for the wrong reasons’ could in turn sue the government. – which then eases my mind a little with regards to the government expanding it’s powers.

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  9. Elaycee (4,356 comments) says:

    How’s the NZ cricket team doing against the West Indies? :oops:

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  10. twofish (86 comments) says:

    Cunliffe working 9 to 5 to save his job – Herald

    It’s really a bugger the long hours you have to work when you are trying to save your own arse :-)

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  11. Tauhei Notts (1,682 comments) says:

    Interesting piece in today’s Herald on how the “puffed up puffball’s” Tv ratings are going down compared with Mike Hosking at 7 p.m. Little attention is paid to the obvious fact that the puffball’s idea of fun is licking the haemorrhoids on left wing politicians. The general public, unlike the trendy lefties, find that sort of behaviour distasteful.

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  12. flipper (3,950 comments) says:

    It never ceases to amaze me .
    Quelle? The stupidity of political fools.
    How so? The fools believe that there s only one way – theirs.

    Compromise is seen and described as the betrayal of principle. Notwithstanding all the ultra right or left wing bullshit that sometimes appears in contributions to this esteemed blog, there have been no, not even one, denials of the National Party’s constitutional principles. Close, yes. But no cigar.

    As I have said here before, there is no possibility whatever of any government espousing extreme right or left wing views ever securing power in New Zealand by legitimate means. Any party wishing to govern and to both influence and implement policy must win and control the centre.

    As it is with diplomacy, western democratic politics are driven by the art of the possible. If you cannot accept that principle, go back to school. So, while I do NOT agree with everything the J Key Government says or does, I can support and live with their weaknesses because the alternative is too horrible to contemplate.

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  13. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Harriet (4,294 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 8:39 am

    I’m not quite sure it is possible to ‘sue’ the government over such things. I know of a case where a child placed through Closed Adoption, into a home where severe abuse occurred attempted to hold the Government responsible, however received a very unsatisfactory response due to the fact that such matters were deemed to be covered by ACC. (there was a large amount of factual evidence that supported the claims of abuse). The assistance received from ACC was next to useless, and the organisation they were referred to more interested in feminist issues than actually assisting the person in dealing with lifelong PTSD issues.

    Leaving children in a home in which they will suffer is negligent, and simple improvements may be deemed satisfactory, however as soon as the family is exposed to stress, the original dysfunction is likely to return. There has to be a system where the child is removed from such an environment, but where the biological relationship is allowed to continue under supervision. By that I mean the child is situated away from the harmful family environment, but that access is still encouraged so that the relationship is not completely severed.

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  14. twofish (86 comments) says:

    “After David’s had three or four terms as Prime Minister, it could be my turn.” – Grant Robertson

    Did Grant ask Labour Rainbow if he was allowed to say this?

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  15. Chris2 (761 comments) says:

    Former Labour Minister Rick Barker said he was in China on holiday when he met up with Liu. And he also visited a cement factory.

    When I travel overseas on my holidays, I always make a point of visiting local cement factories.

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  16. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Elaycee (4,213 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 8:40 am

    Our cricket team is in the West Indies? Bugga all coverage on that one, and judging from the ‘blushing’ one can presume its best not to say too much about it. Perhaps some things are best left unspoken?

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  17. Ross12 (1,388 comments) says:

    Can someone tell us what the current status of Greenpeace is –is it still a charity? I thought they successfully fought the loss of their charity status and in Court they told the Judge that if they got it back they would stop any political advocacy/lobbying. Have I got it wrong ?? The reason for asking is this

    https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/newshome/24278542/sack-simon-petition-gathers-signatures/

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  18. lilman (951 comments) says:

    Hell Judith youre back!!!!

    I thought you started early on our bet to stop posting for a month after the election as you had given up on the left winning the benches
    Good to see you are alive.Was starting to wonder if you had taken David Cunliffe stance and gone to the mattresses.

    Dose it not grind your gears that we all know that youre just dying inside a little every day.

    But still,welcome back!

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  19. igm (1,413 comments) says:

    Tauhei: You’re the man . . . well said. I would love to see the slimy little arsehole bundled up in the gutter with his left-wing filthy mates. Hope Mazda realise the damage being done to their product supporting this piece of excrement. Our company no longer use any of their products for reps or servicemen. Gone to Toyota.

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  20. Gulag1917 (857 comments) says:

    NZ’s defence is quite inadequate e.g. using Orions for bombing runs [although it does show the versatility of the Orions. Switzerland during in the 1930s poured money into defence rather than social welfare programs and it saved them during World War Two.

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  21. flipper (3,950 comments) says:

    Ross12 (1,075 comments) says:

    June 20th, 2014 at 8:54 am

    Can someone tell us what the current status of Greenpeace is
    ****

    Interesting point…and it is also interesting that their NZ leader is one of the least trusted in NZ. Pity that TVNZ and Tv3 continue to use her and that ultra left wing Hone/Jabba party member as “g peace’ spokes…..

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  22. EAD (950 comments) says:

    @ flipper,

    I want to agree with you but I can’t. I have Fabian friends who are open about their desire to reset society and all its social norms and structures back to year Zero but they realise they can’t do it all in one go – they have to be “progressive” about it.

    Back to my earlier post, if you asked the question “Should children be forcibly taken by state employees, backed by secret courts, from their parents and given for adoption by Homosexuals, Lesbians or Transgender people?” I would imagine 99% of the population would think this an extremely bad idea.

    But bit by bit, the one party NatLab Government are achieving a situation where this will be perfectly normal. First they normailse gay marriage, then they massivley publisice and celebrate “gay parents” when Prince George comes to visit, next we have Cabinet ministers telling us that “there is one remaining equality missing” and the campaign begins: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Make-Gay-Adoption-Legal-in-New-Zealand/128540560496055 then we yesterday passed a law so that the State can forcibly remove children if the State think the children is being “neglected”.

    All of a sudden the formally absurd will become the new normal and it’ll be normal to take children away for adoption to a state sanctioned “modern” couple…….

    It is just SO blatant now. I keep thinking there’s going to be a revolution to rout these Marxists but then I see National climbing to above 50% in the polls and you realise just how dumbed down and naive the general NZ public is.

    Watch this video if you want to understand the Fabian mindset

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  23. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Um . . . what constitutes poverty or relative poverty ? For me it’s a nonsense misuse of the word. And Labour are therefore probably a dumb misuse of a vote.

    Poverty is deemed to be circumstances in which some are unable to afford what is deemed to be the basic necessities of living in the particular society in which they inhabit. Therefore, as WINZ (a governmental agency) has deemed that certain things are ‘necessities’, those that do not have those things (by not being able to afford them) are considered to be in ‘poverty’ in New Zealand. As an example, it is deemed unsatisfactory for a child not to have television (my personal opinion is that they are probably a damn sight better off it they don’t). Therefore, WINZ will provide assistance for a family to have a television set. Those families that still cannot afford one, would meet one of the criteria of ‘living in poverty’.

    Of course one of the major determining factors is the quality and regularity of good nutritious food, and the ability of the family to provide this food. This determination is not judged by income alone, but by circumstance. So for example, if a person is earning a certain amount, but more than half their income is paying rent or whatever (example only), and that expense means they are unable to afford the right sort of food, then that is deemed to be ‘poverty’. There are of course other determining factors, but the gist is that if they are unable to provide the basic level of what is deemed to be necessary in our society, then they fall into the poverty situation. What other countries have or don’t have, has little to do with it.

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  24. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Ross12
    A quick search of thee Register shows The Greenpeace Educational Trust (oxymoron alert?)
    http://www.register.charities.govt.nz/CharitiesRegister/ViewCharity?accountId=1912df5c-0941-dd11-84f2-0015c5f3da29&searchId=6d801733-1f64-4d6b-ac28-21cbeabbee10

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  25. twofish (86 comments) says:

    Kiwi kids no better off than those in India’s slums – author
    The poorest Kiwi children are now no better off than some children in the slums of India, a leading author says.
    Professor Jonathan Boston, co-author of Child Poverty in New Zealand, said at the book’s launch in Auckland last night that he saw worse poverty in some Kiwi families than he saw when he spent a month late last year in Delhi slums where his wife, Dr Mary Hutchinson, worked as a volunteer doctor for a Christian charity.
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11276365

    Labour’s answer – the $60 baby bonus
    Over which there was such a furor – you get the paid time off or $60 a week, but not both – people totally missed the kick in date is April 1, 2016. Not 2015. But fucking 2016.

    Labour hung this about their claim of 50,000 children, under three years, in “poverty”
    So this policy does nothing for them, nor an extra 33,300 [this year and next] so 83,300 before parent[s] of a single new born baby gets $60 a week from April 1, 2016

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  26. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ lilman (802 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 8:57 am

    First of all, I never made any bets with you. Just because you suggest it, doesn’t mean I accepted it. I told you then and I’ll tell you again, I have no intention of not posting when I feel like it. If DPF decides he doesn’t want me posting here, then he will take the necessary action to prevent it, until then, nothing you say would affect me in the slightest.

    Secondly, I have never, and will never let what happens in Politics affect my over all enjoyment of life. It is very sad that your complete life experience is judged by what you read on blogs and politics, but for most people, they are merely a small fraction of their life experience, and I suspect the majority, although spending time on here, actually have a life in which they give this blog no more thought, and certainly do not let it dominate their existence.

    It is rather sad that you feel so obsessed by this election that you need to stalk, and gamble over it. But I guess if your life is somewhat empty, and politics is all you have, then its better to be so entertained, than simply playing with yourself all day.

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  27. Komata (1,161 comments) says:

    EAD

    Re: ‘…Adoption by a state sanctioned “modern” couple’

    It’as a funny thing, that absolutely NOTHING is EVER mentioned (least of all by the MSM), about the ‘possibility’ (gasp!) (and, indeed, regrettably, the very distinct likelihood), that the same gender ‘modern couple’ may eventually ‘Divorce’ and that this will inevitably have an effect on the child of said couple.

    Sadly ‘divorce’ does occur even in such supposedly ‘superior’ groups, and, if US studies are to be believed, the psychological damage to the by-now very confused child is horrendous.

    But, because it doesn’t fit the narrative, this aspect of the ‘oh so responsible / all sweetness and light’ rainbow groups is never, ever mentioned.

    Very odd, and, for the child caught in the middle, very sad.

    Would ‘State intervention’ be a good idea in such a situation, or would that be a ‘bridge too far’?

    One wonders.

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  28. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    Yesterday on Jim Mora’s the two panelists were making out the Liu letter is a National “smear” campaign.

    Dita de Boni said it was classic “crosby textor”

    David Slack made a statement about Jason Ede of the PM’s office whose role is liaison with and “to feed the bloggers” .Interesting.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/thepanel

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  29. Yvette (2,766 comments) says:

    They had done a manual search of hard copies, but only kept them for about 3 years. One computer hard drive from his office had been stolen, another was disabled in a power spike, and the letter was mis-filed under LUI rather than LIU in a retired staff member’s files.

    God is not happy with David either. You want these people to run the country for you?
    Merde

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  30. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Komata (1,056 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 9:13 am

    If the State was to intervene in such circumstances, then it would need to do the same to ALL couples who separate (including those not married).

    Children are affected by the separation of parents, and changes to the family dynamics, regardless of what sex their parents are. The negative effects can be really damaging, and leave life long ‘scars’.

    Personally I don’t think the State should be interfering, however, I do believe there needs to be much more emphasis put on the children in such cases, and the parents made aware that they are their combined responsibility. All too often children are used as pawns in the situation.

    I still maintain that human development 101 should be compulsory in the school curriculum, so that everyone knows what the basic requirements of leading a self sufficient and healthy life are. In the old days this was passed from parent to child, it seems somewhere along the way that knowledge has missed a couple of generations in some circumstances.

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  31. flipper (3,950 comments) says:

    EAD (431 comments) says:

    June 20th, 2014 at 8:59 am

    @ flipper,

    I want to agree with you but I can’t. I have Fabian friends
    ****
    Thanks for steer
    Interesting video clip, taken I notice from that most “progressive” of all TV outlets in the USA, MSNBC…..

    Hitler would have been proud of the silly woman. The mind-set that the state owns children is sick, but the MSM must accept that they promote such obscene views. It explains, in large part, why an intelligent woman like Elizabeth Rata, abandoned the Fabians, and why they and their disciples hate her. They really are luddites.

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  32. Ross12 (1,388 comments) says:

    Thanks All-in-Red. So it seems they did get their charity status back. I’m sure I’m correct in saying that they said they would stop political activities if they did —where is McCready when you need him ???

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  33. Harriet (4,794 comments) says:

    Flipper#

    “……As I have said here before, there is no possibility whatever of any government espousing extreme right or left wing views ever securing power in New Zealand by legitimate means. Any party wishing to govern and to both influence and implement policy must win and control the centre…….western democratic politics are driven by the art of the possible. If you cannot accept that principle, go back to school…..”

    What Sarah Palin is really known for is “Sell Baby Sell” – she sold the Republicans their own polices – the exact same policies that they allowed to be compromised by the left. She didn’t invent any new ones.

    Everyone is talking about the same things – but it’s who you compromise with that matters!
    And that’s all Mr Craig is really going to do – instead of Key compromising only with the left on every matter in the country via Select Committees – he’s now going to be hearing from Mr Craig. The public will probably be first though.

    Keating said you have to ‘take the public with you’ – well, all Key’s really done so far is taken the center itself! They never came to him! Where has he taken them to in 6 yrs? Nothing has changed from Helen.

    The poor arn’t the fucken center. But the poor is where all his policies have been. decile this blah blah… National have compromised themselves too much. They’ve simply done stuff for the far left’s rusted on. Or for people who don’t vote at all.

    It’s piss easy. Maintain the faith. Or as Redbaiter said : It’s a One Party Socialist State. :cool:

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  34. lilman (951 comments) says:

    OUCH!!!!!!

    Lol,seriously ,2 days of nothing then its back, all guns blazing.

    Heard this yesterday,

    Whats the difference between David Cunliffe and a processed freezer beast?

    Sometime in the future people maybe able to get the freezer beast back to life.

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  35. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    The UN is such bollox.

    Conference in Doha on preserving heritage sites in conflict zones such as Syria and Iraq.

    The fucking Qataris are funding the conflicts there.

    http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/insidestory/2014/06/saving-legacy-humanity-2014619162232848109.html

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  36. Maggy Wassilieff (325 comments) says:

    Greenpeace seems just as capable of mismanaging its money as any dodgy finance company…..
    still whats a loss of a few million quid when you have an annual budget of 300M euros to play with?
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/9fbd40b6-f567-11e3-91a8-00144feabdc0.html#axzz357lqJmU6

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  37. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    The arseholes in National who keep describing their own founding principles as “extreme” need to fuck off and join the Labour party.

    Traitors and compromisers and surrender monkeys who couldn’t fight their way out of a wet paper bag.

    And then they say oooh aaah, if we try and change we’ll loose the election.. blah blah blah..

    Well then you shouldn’t ever have let it get that bad in the first place should you you useless losers?

    Been surrendering for decades and with Key as leader its worse than its ever been. It has to stop you fuckwits, or the National Party might as well not exist.

    All it is now is a gang of punk left wing arse lickers.

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  38. Jack5 (5,014 comments) says:

    The PR-political machine has begun softening us up to open more doors to asylum seekers. A Hooerald article today implies we should be taking more because we haven’t increased our quota for years and because other countries are taking more.

    Because the big upheavals at the moment are in the Middle East, this is in effect a call for us to open the door to more Muslims.

    Why? This is likely connected to NZ pompous politicians and pampered MFAT diplomats’ vainglorious campaign to win NZ a seat on the Security Council. To get, then maintain this, there will have to be big-noting from our tiny country, and this will doubtless entail taking in thousands of refugees and asylum seekers. This is how we got the Somali incomers. It was about the last time we had a seat on the council.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11277493

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  39. David Garrett (6,995 comments) says:

    Red: Well you know what to do…Gather 500 like minded souls around you – that should be 30 minutes work, surely – and set up your own party…Select the party list (an authoritarian like you would only countenance you being the soul arbiter) and stand! Quick! Before the country goes any further to the Prog dogs…

    Jack5: I am firmly of the view that taking in one more Muslim into this country is one Muslim too many…

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  40. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Hey Jack5 we’re being betrayed by the very same people who profess to be in parliament looking after our interests. if you’re a white European, and a male especially you’re getting fucked over by these duplicitious slimebags who smirk behind your back at how easy you are to fool.

    There’s only one real answer to these pigs and that is to STOP VOTING FOR THEM. Who to vote for? look at who they hate the most. Its Colin Craig, because for all of his failings, he’s not one of them. he’s an outsider to the Wellington beltway gangsters.

    Vote Craig and Conservative Party even if its just a protest vote these Prog scum will eventually get the message. Voting for the same old same old means no change and the things you’re complaining of just go on happening.

    We simply must break the sclerotic orthodoxy of the Nat/ Labour one party state, and the CP represents the best opportunity to do that that has come along in a while.

    Jeez, at least the guy has got some fight. He’s not just some smirking twit gormlessly sucking up to communist criminals like Obama and the Clintons. His posters attacking the loser tweedle dee National Party show that.

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  41. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “All it is now is a gang of punk left wing arse lickers.”

    What color is the sky in your world Red?

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  42. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “Vote Craig and Conservative Party”

    I have said before that I would be happy for the CP to get into Parliament, but Red is contradicting himself here, massively.

    Supposedly the Nats are not Right wing enough, or at all, for Red, but the CP is.

    Yet, the CP opposes asset sales (left wing) and wants binding citizens initiated referenda (will be used by the Left to oppose free market reform).

    This makes zero sense.

    On a lot of issues National is to the right of the CP.

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  43. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    All cultures are equal?

    Show me the other culture that can produce something as beautiful and artistically complex and refined as this-

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  44. Ross12 (1,388 comments) says:

    A bit of a surprise here. Everyone had Cairns “hung, drawn and quartered” but now no charges by the cricket board in Britain.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/cricket/10181072/Chris-Cairns-won-t-face-charges-in-Britain

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  45. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    Reddy obviously hasn’t listened to much Chinese music.

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  46. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    “Show me the other culture that can produce something as beautiful and artistically complex and refined as this-”

    Show me the one culture that produces that utter crap and manages to sustain it without tax payer funded hand outs?

    Supporters of the arts are bludgers and parasites, nothing more than socialists in tuxedos.

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  47. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “Supposedly the Nats are not Right wing enough, or at all, for Red, but the CP is.”

    You stupid boring mungbean, how many times do I have to say it??

    How many times do I have to say it?

    How many times do I have to say it?

    Don’t you read a word that I write here or are your comprehension skills no better than those of a cockroach?

    It doesn’t matter what the CP is, the grip the Nats and Labour have HAS TO BE BROKEN.

    If you can’t get that simple strategic point then your a good example of the kind of useless dumbarse that has been handing our culture to the left for fifty years.

    Now FO and find someone else to bother with your whining wittering pointless shit.

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  48. RRM (9,784 comments) says:

    LOL at redbaiter 10:24am.

    Daniel Barenboim was big enough to conduct the music of the anti-semite Wagner in Jersalem, because the music transcends even its own composer’s racial hatred… but for you a Schubert song is just an endorsement of your master race.

    What are the words of the Schiller poem used in Beethoven’s 9th symphony? You should look them up.

    What a nasty sack of shit you are.

    Petty nasty little xenophobes like you aren’t good enough to comment on beauty in music.

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  49. ciaron (1,418 comments) says:

    Judith, have you resolved your email issues from yesterday?

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  50. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “You stupid boring mungbean, how many times do I have to say it??

    How many times do I have to say it?

    How many times do I have to say it?”

    Apparently several times to convince yourself. :)

    “Don’t you read a fucking word that I write”

    Yes, that’s why I respond when you write crap.

    “It doesn’t matter what the fucking CP is, the grip the Nats and Labour have HAS TO BE BROKEN.”

    Then your dumber than I thought. The Conservatives will not achieve this, and do not want to anyway. They want to be in coalition with National. Voting for them will help National, not break them.

    “It doesn’t matter what the fucking”

    You do realise that real Conservatives don’t use the F word every two seconds, right?

    “Now FO and find someone else to bother with your whining wittering pointless shit.”

    Make me! :)

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  51. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    ‘Your magic brings together
    what custom has sternly divided.
    All men shall become brothers,
    wherever your gentle wings hover.’

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  52. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “You do realise that real Conservatives don’t use the F word every two seconds, right?”

    Dealing with obtuse small minded thick as two planks fuckwits like you makes it pretty hard not to.

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  53. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “Reddy obviously hasn’t listened to much Chinese music.”

    From one of the only Kiwi groups I really like, and one of our only Neo-Folk bands, a traditional Chinese folk song. Cannot understand a word of it, but it’s still powerful. Red will hate it, because he’s NOT a real Conservative.

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  54. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Yeah, using European instruments .

    FO you time wasting petty minded dickhead.

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  55. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    Swearing and name calling every post is not a substitute for intelligent argument.

    A person who cannot defend their arguments with, well, an actual argument, but resorts to just telling people to “F-off” is likely not very well versed in the philosophy they claim to support.

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  56. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “NZ’s defence is quite inadequate e.g. using Orions for bombing runs [although it does show the versatility of the Orions. Switzerland during in the 1930s poured money into defence rather than social welfare programs and it saved them during World War Two.”

    If Hitler had wanted to conquer Switzerland he could have done it in no time flat.

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  57. Ryan Sproull (7,095 comments) says:

    Yeah, using European instruments .

    And what’s the music written down on?

    Also, plenty of Chinese orchestra with Chinese instruments.

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  58. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “FO you time wasting petty minded dickhead.”

    You do realise that repeating this is going to have no effect on me whatsoever, right?

    Sorry Red, but no. I’m going to continue challenging your claim to be a Conservative and continue to point out that your living in Marxist la la land with your progressive notions of ideological purity. :)

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  59. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    I’m telling you to FO because all you’re trying to do is point score against Redbaiter because I’ve offended you. To you the issues are secondary. I’m interested in the argument, not dealing with the obsessive nit picking pedantry of some revenge driven child like numpty who probably still lives with his mum and dad and has yet to learn basic comprehension and grammar. That’s grammar with an a you loser.

    And spare me the hypocritical smilies. That’s a dead giveaway to you having the mindset of a snivelling leftist dickwad.

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  60. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    The fucking Qataris are funding the conflicts there.

    Also Saudi Arabia is involved, releasing terrorist from jail to fight there.

    The overall strategy is aligned with the Yinon Plan.

    http://frictionfacts.org/?p=1351

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  61. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “A person who cannot defend their arguments with, well, an actual argument, but resorts to just telling people to “F-off” is likely not very well versed in the philosophy they claim to support.”

    Sometimes you get to a stage where “F-off” is the only avenue left. Take my dealings with the NZ Police for example: after years of trying to get them to do their duty without fear or favour I decided that instead of taking up arms against them I’d just tell them to “F-off”.

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  62. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ciaron (1,258 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 10:33 am

    As I said yesterday, I’m not worried about them. I’ve been aware for many years how personally some people take what they read on the internet, letting it flow into their private lives, and how desperate they are to try and silence anyone that doesn’t agree with them. I enjoy robust discussion and welcome alternative opinions, which is why I come here – a place where obviously few are going to agree with me, but its great exercise for the mind, and challenging, which I enjoy. I see no point in taking part in discussing topics where everyone agrees – might have been the done thing back in the 1800’s in gentlemen’s clubs, but it really is a sad practice in today’s society.

    What I found funny though was the stupid way in which people ignorantly use their email, thinking that what they say stays within the group and how unaware they are of how these things are passed on – to people they least want to see them.

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  63. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Ryan Sproull (6,974 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 10:53 am

    Surely beauty (be it in art, music or whatever) is in the eyes of the beholder. Performance of music that sounds wonderful to you or someone else, may sound god awful to me.

    The trick for governments who wish to finance and support such things, is to provide a balance that appeals to the majority, whilst not ignoring rising talent or genres.

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  64. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “I’m telling you to FO because all you’re trying to do is point score against Redbaiter because I’ve offended you.”

    No, I’m debating your arguments because I think on the issue of the Nats your wrong, and because your notions of ideological purity are not remotely Conservative.

    “To you the issues are secondary.”

    No, they are first and formost in my mind, but your not debating the real issues, just whining that the world is not the way you want it.

    ” I’m interested in the argument,”

    Then make one that contains a smidgen of actual thinking.

    “not dealing with the obsessive nit picking pedantry of some revenge driven child like numpty who probably still lives with his mum and dad”

    I’m 49 and married. Try again sunshine. :)

    “And spare me the hypocritical smilies. That’s a dead giveaway to you having the mindset of a snivelling leftist dickwad.”

    Silly child. The only person with a leftist mindset in this debate is you Red. :)

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  65. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “I’m 49 and married.”

    Poor girl, the proverbial mother substitute.

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  66. dime (9,796 comments) says:

    Neo folk? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    where do i buy tickets for that?

    and its in chinese? awesome!

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  67. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    So that’s a no to having an intelligent argument then Red.

    Thought so.

    Basically you just strike me as too dumb to defend your positions.

    And personal attacks are right out of the Marxist play book remember? You said that yourself, and here you are behaving like a typical Leftist, all piss and wind, no substance, and riddled with Lefty style personal attacks.

    Thinking of joining the Communist Party Red? You’ll fit right in! :)

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  68. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Dime-

    “Neo folk” means fresh from the farmyard.

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  69. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    I notice that TVNZ is stirring up the homosexual hornets nest again, in the form of Seven Sharp getting a couple of actors (of the same sex) to perform public displays of affection and then judging the public reaction. According to a companion story on the GayNZ website,

    Without giving too much away before the segment airs, the reporter says while there wasn’t any overt negative reaction, aside from a couple of shouted comments on the street, the conversations they had with passers-by afterwards were different. “There was still quite strong feeling and strong opinion against gay relationships, which I just, yeah – it does stun me that that’s still the case.”

    So, no overt negative reaction, therefore they had to poll passers-by to find some. According to the Seven Sharp blurb – “the results will surprise you!” You see, it doesn’t matter if gay marriage is legal, as long as homosexuality itself is not 100% publicly accepted (as the GayNZ headline reads – “Gay affection appears far from ‘100% OK'”). You and the whole nation MUST believe that it’s OK or it’s not good enough. Gay behaviour must be normalized.

    As Robert R. Reilly writes –

    The power of rationalization drives the culture war, gives it its particular revolutionary character, and makes its advocates indefatigable. It may draw its energy from desperation, but it is all the more powerful for that. Since failed rationalization means self-recrimination, it must be avoided at all cost. For this reason, the differences over which the culture war is being fought are not subject to reasoned discourse. Persons protecting themselves by rationalizing are interested not in finding the truth, but in maintaining the illusion that allows them to continue their behavior. For them to succeed in this, everyone must accede to their rationalization. This is why revolutionary change is required. The necessity for self-justification requires the complicity of the whole culture. Holdouts cannot be tolerated because they are potential rebukes. The self-hatred, anger, and guilt that a person possessed of a functioning conscience would normally feel from doing wrong are redirected by the rationalization and projected upon society as a whole (if the society is healthy), or upon those in society who do not accept the rationalization.

    The homosexual movement’s rationalization is far more widely advanced in its claims. According to Jeffrey Levi, former executive director for the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force, “We (homosexuals)_ are no longer seeking just a right to privacy and a right to protection from wrong. We have a right – as heterosexuals have already – to see government and society affirm our lives.”

    http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles/ReillyCultureVice.php

    What’s interesting is that the show had problems finding gay people to appear on camera. Eventually, the gay producer of Seven Sharp (surprise, surprise) and an actor had to join in.

    Even a widespread search through community contacts and social media was sluggish. “It took a very, very long time,” Higgins says. “We had two or three bites, but when it actually came down to it they all pulled out.”
    They eventually found two couples, including a lesbian pair in Dargaville and an Auckland gay duo. Gay Seven Sharp Supervising Producer Jonathan Williams and an actor made up the third couple – Williams took part after trying and failing to get coupled-up friends, and even singles ones, to take part. He says none were comfortable “being that gay on TV”.

    http://www.gaynz.com/articles/publish/2/article_15250.php

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  70. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Our local climate deniers end up with poached eggs spattered over their faces and court jester costumes . The NZ Climate Science Education Trust (CSET) virtually bankrupt and unlikely ever to meet its considerable liabilities . Yet that has not stopped its Chairman retired lawyer and National Party politician , whizzing “off to Las Vegas to speak at the latest climate crank networking event organized by far right US lobby group the Heartland Institute ,”

    http://hot-topic.co.nz/

    This has the dimension of a scandal and should warrant some of our local yokel climate deniers undivided attention.!

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  71. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    Lets see….

    Rabid factionalism: Check.

    Ideological purity tests: Check.

    Resorting to personal attacks at the drop of a hat: Check.

    Opposing the current center right government: Check.

    Yup, Red’s half a goose step away from being a good little Commie! :)

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  72. dime (9,796 comments) says:

    The great Steve Vai

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  73. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “Neofolk is a form of folk music-inspired experimental music that emerged from post-industrial music circles.[1] Neofolk can either be solely acoustic folk music or a blend of acoustic folk instrumentation aided by varieties of accompanying sounds such as pianos, strings and elements of industrial music and experimental music.[2] The genre encompasses a wide assortment of themes. Neofolk musicians often have ties to other genres such as neoclassical and martial industrial. A majority of artists within the neofolk genre focus on archaic, cultural and literary references. Local traditions and indigenous beliefs tend to be portrayed heavily as well as esoteric and historical topics.”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neofolk

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  74. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “it does stun me that that’s still the case”

    Well the silly little fag needs to get out a bit more.

    I was once fairly ambivalent towards queers and had no particular problem with their life style, but since they’ve become a political movement and in most cases (but not always) attached themselves quite firmly to the progressive faction, I’ve become far less detached.

    Their ugly public displays of profanity and bad taste, (“Hero” parade for example) always presented with layers of brash and smug self assurance are also particularly off putting.

    Then there are their public advocates, like Chardonnay Guy for example who writes here frequently. With his arrogant ill mannered snideness and his unashamed hatred of Christians he is a stark reminder of what nastiness some homosexuals are capable of.

    The GayNZ writer must be pretty thick if he’s only now coming to grips with the concept of backlash.

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  75. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    One for stephieboy –

    Patrick Moore, one of the founders of Greenpeace (who subsequently left because of all the arguments not based in science) says that greenies are now raging extremists and that there is NO scientific proof at all for climate change. Moore was pretty much the only member of Greenpeace who knew anything about science, and always tried to keep Greenpeace claims factual, until he left.

    Patrick Moore, a Canadian environmentalist who helped found Greenpeace in the Seventies but subsequently left in protest at its increasingly extreme, anti-scientific, anti-capitalist stance, argues that the green position on climate change fails the most basic principles of the scientific method.


    “The certainty among many scientists that humans are the main cause of climate change, including global warming, is not based on the replication of observable events. It is based on just two things, the theoretical effect of human-caused greenhouse gas emissions, predominantly carbon dioxide, and the predictions of computer models using those theoretical calculations. There is no scientific “proof” at all.”

    Moore goes on to list some key facts about “climate change” which are ignored by true believers.


    1. The concentration of CO2 in the global atmosphere is lower today, even including human emissions, than it has been during most of the existence of life on Earth.

    2. The global climate has been much warmer than it is today during most of the existence of life on Earth. Today we are in an interglacial period of the Pleistocene Ice Age that began 2.5 million years ago and has not ended.

    3. There was an Ice Age 450 million years ago when CO2 was about 10 times higher than it is today.

    4. Humans evolved in the tropics near the equator. We are a tropical species and can only survive in colder climates due to fire, clothing and shelter.

    5. CO2 is the most important food for all life on earth. All green plants use CO2 to produce the sugars that provide energy for their growth and our growth. Without CO2 in the atmosphere carbon-based life could never have evolved.

    6. The optimum CO2 level for most plants is about 1600 parts per million, four times higher than the level today. This is why greenhouse growers purposely inject the CO2-rich exhaust from their gas and wood-fired heaters into the greenhouse, resulting in a 40-80 per cent increase in growth.

    7. If human emissions of CO2 do end up causing significant warming (which is not certain) it may be possible to grow food crops in northern Canada and Russia, vast areas that are now too cold for agriculture.

    8. Whether increased CO2 levels cause significant warming or not, the increased CO2 levels themselves will result in considerable increases in the growth rate of plants, including our food crops and forests.

    9. There has been no further global warming for nearly 18 years during which time about 25 per cent of all the CO2 ever emitted by humans has been added to the atmosphere. How long will it remain flat and will it next go up or back down? Now we are out of the realm of facts and back into the game of predictions.


    Moore makes his remarks in the foreword to a new book by bestselling Australian geologist Dr Ian Plimer called Not For Greens. The book describes the various, complex industrial processes which go into the making of just a single teaspoon, starting with the mining of various metals.

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/06/19/CO2-is-good-for-us-climate-change-is-bunk-greens-are-raging-extremists-says-Greenpeace-co-founder

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  76. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “Dime-

    “Neo folk” means fresh from the farmyard.”

    And now we have hatred towards rural people who work the land from Reddy!

    Typical urban, progressive, liberal attitude.

    “True Blue” my ass!!! :)

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  77. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    One for Redbaiter .! Be sure to get your tissues at the ready,

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  78. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    This is interesting – there is a link between “that awful video” that the U.S Govt once claimed caused rioting that led to the Benghazi attack, and the Canadian makers of the Obamacare website. The same company is involved, and indeed, helped to push the video, before disappearing into the blue again.

    Walid Shoebat has uncovered ties that show the company who created the Obamacare website, CGI Federal, may have also helped push the “Innocence of Muslims” video:

    The evidence is well established that in 2010, CGI acquired Stanley Associates, which “provides services to the U.S. federal civilian, defense and intelligence agencies”. [1]

    When the crudely produced video “Innocence of Muslims” was posted to YouTube it needed a boost, especially since it was posted by someone no one had ever heard of and who had only uploaded two videos – that were basically the same.

    A short version of the video was uploaded to a Youtube Channel called NewsPoliticsNow3 (NPN3). This channel has been linked to Stanley Associates, the company purchased by CGI Federal, via their logo:

    Screenshot reveals NPN connection to Stanley as well as CGI merger with Stanley in 2010.

    Here is the screenshot of the Youtube Channel with the logo at the top:

    Note: Screen capture from 9/12/12
    Photo by: top right

    Here’s an interesting twist. The short version was uploaded on September 11, 2012 to NewsPoliticsNow3 (NPN3). The original version was posted to Sam Bacile’s Youtube Channel (alias for Nakoula Basseley Nakoula) a couple of months earlier.

    But it was in fact NPN3 which gave the video a new title called “Innocence of Muslims”. See the screenshot above. It wasn’t named that on Sam Bacile’s channel:

    According to Walid Shoebat:

    After NPN3 caused the video to gain more than four million views of its 1:32 long trailer, NewsPoliticsNow3 took down the video on or before 9/20/12. The skids of Sam Bacile’s YouTube channel had been sufficiently greased; his video was off and running. NPN3 had done its job of priming the pump; then it vanished.

    The linked website (below) shows screenshots showing the involvement of the company.
    http://therightscoop.com/walid-shoebat-company-that-created-obamacare-website-linked-to-benghazi-video/

    Could it be possible that the Obama Administration invented the video story from whole cloth? Or at least pushed it via a web company.

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  79. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Dime- that Steve Vai clip was pretty cool. There’s some nice restrained talent in this Gnarls Barkley clip with particularly inventive backing from the guitar and keyboards.

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  80. dime (9,796 comments) says:

    did someone say greatest & most versatile vocalist on the planet?

    Dime proudly presents MIKE PATTON

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  81. Northland Wahine (660 comments) says:

    Faith no more… I don’t drool often but for Mike Patton I’ll make an exception.

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  82. Lance (2,628 comments) says:

    Perfect gift for John Key to buy Sue Bradford for Christmas

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=11278135

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  83. ciaron (1,418 comments) says:

    Speaking of the versatile Mike Patton…

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o703ItRgOGw

    (Great call Dime)

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  84. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Fletch, Re Patrick Moore. Your account of his departure from Greenpeace does not present the full facts or picture . Here a different one emerges of one whose autocratic style got him offside with his former colleagues. On leaving it was not long before he established his on anti green PR firm that , among many things, provided advice and assistance for pulp, paper and Palm Oil interests (FPP ) in Indonesia noted for their clear felling and other associated environmental degradations in e.g Sumatra.

    http://www.monbiot.com/2010/12/02/the-great-ventriloquist/

    and,

    http://www.skepticalscience.com/moore-2012.html

    And you find it quite acceptable that The NZ Climate Science Education Trust (CSET) and its Chair barry Brill can apparently walk away from their financial liabilities over their failed court action against NIWA.?

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  85. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Fletch, your question.?

    “Could it be possible that the Obama Administration invented the video story from whole cloth? Or at least pushed it via a web company.”

    On the basis of your link, nope.!

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  86. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    As far as vocalists, check out Steve Balsamo doing a song live from show Poe (based on Edgar Allan Poe).

    Apparently, he made Andrew Lloyd Webber cry with his performance of Gethsemane from Jesus Christ Superstar (also available on youtube). Balsamo has this ability to get into a part so much that he actually cries while performing/singing.

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  87. Dom Knots (155 comments) says:

    Wonderful reference to Daniel Barenboim. He is indeed one of the many truly great and compassionate israeli thinkers. A real credit to his people.

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  88. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    Balsamo in Gethsemane –

    (Although I do not believe that Jesus actually had some of the thoughts in the song).

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  89. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “David Slack made a statement about Jason Ede of the PM’s office whose role is liaison with and “to feed the bloggers” .Interesting.”

    Especially so in light of TDVM’s frenetic support of the Key govt on here and his constantly vicious attempts to ridicule any unbelievers.

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  90. OneTrack (2,981 comments) says:

    flipper – “As I have said here before, there is no possibility whatever of any government espousing extreme right or left wing views ever securing power in New Zealand by legitimate means. Any party wishing to govern and to both influence and implement policy must win and control the centre.”

    I wish I was as confident. We are still very close to a coalition of the envious taking the treasury benches this year, with a dysfunctional Labour Party which would be easily rail-roaded by the hard-left Greens into doing virtually whatever they wanted. Nationalisation of all the power companies, etc. – even Labour wants to do that. Add hard-left Hone and Internet into the mix, and you have exactly the scenario you are talking about.

    Russel has already shown the power he had over Labour when he got Shearer kicked out. There are obviously a lot of Green supporter still in the Labour Party.

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  91. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    stephie, Patrick Moore talks about Greenpeace and why he left –

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  92. OneTrack (2,981 comments) says:

    “Surely beauty (be it in art, music or whatever) is in the eyes of the beholder”

    So let the beholder pay for it then.

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  93. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Don’t you dare to attack Greenpeace, Forest & Bird, Amnesty International or Women’s Refuge in front of the “sensitive” stephieboy.

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  94. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “Russel has already shown the power he had over Labour when he got Shearer kicked out.”

    And Shane Jones.

    http://truebluenz.com/2014/04/27/jones-quits-as-greens-take-over-the-labour-party/

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  95. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Meanwhile, his/her next hero disappoints: http://www.mediaite.com/tv/hillary-interview-ratings-underwhelm-on-cnn-and-fox/

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  96. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Where climate denial, creationism and Birthers meet.

    http://www.realsceptic.com/2014/05/05/climate-science-based-on-evidence-science-denial-based-on-faith/

    Weird.!

    Fletch, as I’ve posted Greenpeace give a very different view of why Patrick Moore left and Fox News naturally give him some very sympathetic airtime.
    Yes , Moore was quickly up and running with his PR firm recommending clear felling and extinction of Sumatran tigers etc, etc.
    My guess he’s getting paid a lot, lot more .!

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  97. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Patrick Moore, one of the founders of Greenpeace

    Start your post with a lie Fletch
    typical
    It has been pointed out that Patric Moore was not a founder of green piece many times to you yet you still keep Up the lie.
    James Delingpole
    The author of your crap is on record as saying he has absolutely no idea about science because he doesn’t actually read any
    He is just another anti science climate change denial religion nutter .

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  98. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    For Fletch , Manolo , Ed Snack etc, etc,

    The Lies of Sarah Palin: The Untold Story Behind Her Relentless Quest for Power,

    “…The Lies of Sarah Palin is a journalistic tour de force that vividly reveals the Queen of the Tea Party movement as a vengeful and manipulative empress without clothes. This is the definitive book on Sarah Palin.”

    http://www.amazon.com/The-Lies-Sarah-Palin-Relentless/dp/0312601867

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  99. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    The left’s stubborn refusal to deny their historical connections to Adolf Hitler is starkly illustrative of the delusions that underpin their worldview.

    Hitler lead the National Socialist Worker’s Party. He came to power after a vicious and murderous struggle with other far left groups. Once in power he solidified his position by exercising far more power than he was entitled to and made Germany a totalitarian one party state. Then he began killing off the people he didn’t like. In the end, the only way he could be made to relinquish his murderous hold on power was by force of arms.

    This is the pattern that has been repeated throughout history in Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia and Soviet Russia. Its a pattern that runs totally contrary to the Conservatives wish for a small weak govt that can never intimidate its citizens.

    Yet stupid ignorant of history half educated socialist mungbeans, in most cases the product of a corrupt and dysfunctional education system, still try to construct a connection between Conservatives and Hitler. Proving they’re hopelessly unable to reason and are in their mass delusions a plague on western civilisations just as grasshoppers are to grain growers.

    If we were ever free of the left and their insanity, this world could be such a beautiful and prosperous place. A place where no Hitler would ever rise to power ever again.

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  100. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Redtard tell us again how wonderful and free Singapore is.

    Tell us how you will make people like me go to church and worship imaginary gods.

    Tell us how you think our freedoms in this country can be changed back into your fantasy of a authoritarian conservative nirvana.

    You can not you will just resort to the crap you always spurt when challenged. prog Marxist etc etc etc the resort of someone who is to stupid to answer questions about their beliefs.

    Why do you come to a liberal blog to spout your rubbish?
    Because your brand of conservatism and your pathetic blog has no support at all.

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  101. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Strawmen constructed by an attention seeking and deranged lunatic.

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  102. RRM (9,784 comments) says:

    Fletch – so Seven Sharp had trouble finding gays willing to stick their heads up above the parapet in a public spectacle that would see them vilified by the likes of you?

    Fancy that.

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  103. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    The party emerged from the German nationalist, racist and populist Freikorps paramilitary culture, which fought against the communist uprisings in post-World War I Germany.[6] Advocacy of a form of socialism by right-wing figures and movements in Germany became common during and after World War I, influencing Nazism.[7] Arthur Moeller van den Bruck of the Conservative Revolutionary movement coined the term “Third Reich” and advocated an ideology combining the nationalism of the right and the socialism of the left.[9] Prominent Conservative Revolutionary member Oswald Spengler’s conception of a “Prussian Socialism” influenced the Nazis.[10] The party was created as a means to draw workers away from communism and into völkisch nationalism.[11] Initially, Nazi political strategy focused on anti-big business, anti-bourgeois, and anti-capitalist rhetoric, although such aspects were later downplayed in order to gain the support of industrial entities, and in 1930s the party’s focus shifted to antisemitic and anti-Marxist themes

    Your anti marxist politics and those of the nazis are alike in many ways redtard
    As I said you are an empty vessels making lots of meaningless noise yet when challenged has no answers to questions .

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  104. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Bloody funny how the left bitch and moan about Singapore but there’s no Singaporeans risking their lives on rubber tyre rafts heading for the mainland as there is in Cuba, which according to the same left wingers is a heaven on earth.

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  105. RRM (9,784 comments) says:

    There are plenty of young Singaporeans doing university degrees here with the intention of settling either in NZ or Aussie, and no intention of moving back to Singapore, though…

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  106. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    I know many who have gone back disgusted with the high taxes, crime, racism, drug and alcohol addiction and general profanity of life here. They say a lot of NZers are communists, and Singaporeans don’t like communists much.

    Lee Kuan Yew taught them about the commies, whereas in NZ, its the commies doing the teaching. Its why you RRM are such a boring commie twit.

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  107. dime (9,796 comments) says:

    “Tell us how you will make people like me go to church and worship imaginary gods.” – as opposed to griff who would make us follow his global warming cult ffs

    anyone who pushes for big govt deserves what they get.

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  108. tom hunter (4,704 comments) says:

    Unfortunately this article is behind the WSJ paywall, so some quotes will have to suffice. First up is a the usual establishment of bona fides before the farting in church begins:

    I’ve spent my life on the foreign-policy left. I opposed the Vietnam War, U.S. intervention in Central America in the 1980s and our invasion of Iraq. I have headed a group trying to block U.S. arms and training for “friendly” dictators, and I have written books about how U.S. policy in the developing world is neocolonial.

    That’s Caleb Rossiter, a left-leaning professor of media studies (chuckle) at American University and a fellow with the Institute for Policy Studies, which is about as left wing as it gets in the USA outside of Mother Jones and The Nation. The farting commences:

    But I oppose my allies’ well-meaning campaign for “climate justice.” More than 230 organizations, including Africa Action and Oxfam, want industrialized countries to pay “reparations” to African governments for droughts, rising sea levels and other alleged results of what Ugandan strongman Yoweri Museveni calls “climate aggression.” And I oppose the campaign even more for trying to deny to Africans the reliable electricity—and thus the economic development and extended years of life—that fossil fuels can bring.

    The left wants to stop industrialization—even if the hypothesis of catastrophic, man-made global warming is false.

    Heh, heh, heh. But it gets even better. A few days after writing this Rossiter got a letter from his beloved Institute for Policy Studies, an outfit he’d been with for 23 years:

    Dear Caleb,

    We would like to inform you that we are terminating your position as an Associate Fellow of the Institute for Policy Studies. As you know, Associate Fellows at IPS are sponsored by an IPS project director or by the director. In your case, both of us sponsored your Fellowship. Unfortunately, we now feel that your views on key issues, including climate science, climate justice, and many aspects of U.S. policy to Africa, diverge so significantly from ours that a productive working relationship is untenable. The other project directors of IPS feel the same. .

    Another leftist has the scales falling from his eyes:

    “When I countered a claim of ‘rapidly accelerating’ temperature change with the [UN] IPCC’s own data’, showing the nearly 20-year temperature pause — the best response I ever got was ‘Caleb, I don’t have time for this.’”

    Mr Rossiter probably well knows the whole “Are you now, or have you ever been a member of … routine but I think the following paraphrase applies better:

    Everything within the environment, nothing outside the environment, nothing against the environment.

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  109. RRM (9,784 comments) says:

    They probably don’t like racists like yourself much either weddy…?

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  110. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    tom hunter, yeh, good article. I read about the same thing in an interview he gave The College Fix website the other day.

    http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/18034/

    About a decade ago, Rossiter assigned his international statistics students a paper that asked them to analyze some topic of international affairs using statistics. When one female student turned in a paper on humans’ role in global warming, he gave her an F.

    “She came to see me and said, ‘But Doc, it’s not fair, I am just repeating exactly what they said,” he recalled. “And I said, ‘That’s impossible, because the evidence you cited here is just wishful thinking, there is no real data.’”

    “So I sat down with her and we looked over the article, which is one of the classic ones in climate change in which they developed a computer model that tries to say how much of the half a degree rise in temperature can you attribute to natural variation or the Arctic oscillation, or whatever the hell is going on up in the north there when the seas gets warmer and colder over long periods, things sort of like El Niño- or is it human [caused]?”

    “I had to raise her grade because she certainly had cited the evidence they had given, but I just couldn’t give her much of a grade because she should have been able to see – as most people should be able to see – that the computer models were just guessing and sort of notional, and just kind of playing around to get a good fit, but didn’t have much scientific basis.”

    “So I became quite interested in this phenomenon,” he added. “So many of my colleagues and so much of educated America and liberal newspapers and all just believe that mathematicians have set up models that should make us very certain that the recent half-degree uptick from 1980 to 2000 was human caused – when in fact they were just playing with the models. I use models a lot, and these were pretty weak.”

    From then on, Rossiter specifically assigned students papers to look at global warming and climate change issues, and over the years graded hundreds of papers on the topic. The results from this further solidified his belief that the global warming crisis is one that’s man-made.

    “So there is really two big statistical questions: what caused the little warming, and what effect did the warming have on these other climate variables?” he said. “I am a pretty decent statistician, I have taught for many, many years. The data that support the headlines are very, very weak, very, very notional, and simply not logical.”

    “You couldn’t have this many terrible effects from a half a degree rise in global temperature. It’s probable that there are some, but it gets a little boring because it’s always weak data, because that is the nature of a tremendously complex system.”

    Over the years, he’s broken a few students’ hearts when they learn of this truth.

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  111. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Redbaiter (7,125 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 1:11 pm

    “The left’s stubborn refusal to deny their historical connections to Adolf Hitler is starkly illustrative of the delusions that underpin their worldview…..”
    Your inflammatory and tedious bombast is more in tune with Hitler and the Nazis.

    You do not understand the historical facts. Hitler was plainly and hysterically anti Communist ( like You) and lumped the Jews and the Bolsheviks together as the real enemy,

    http://www.hitler.co.uk/hitler-quotes-about-communism.html

    One of his first actions was to turn against the left faction in his party the S A led by Eric Rohm and liquidated them in 1934 .Their anti capitalist rhetoric deeply concerned German Industrialists like Krupp and Farben and Hitler quickly saw their point,

    http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/timeline/roehm.htm

    The truth is that you’d live most comfortably with Nazi ideology of those times including naturally their loathing of Bolshevism and Communism.

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  112. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    global warming cult ffs

    yip as supported by the following churches dime

    Academia Chilena de Ciencias, Chile
    Academia das Ciencias de Lisboa, Portugal
    Academia de Ciencias de la República Dominicana
    Academia de Ciencias Físicas, Matemáticas y Naturales de Venezuela
    Academia de Ciencias Medicas, Fisicas y Naturales de Guatemala
    Academia Mexicana de Ciencias,Mexico
    Academia Nacional de Ciencias de Bolivia
    Academia Nacional de Ciencias del Peru
    Académie des Sciences et Techniques du Sénégal
    Académie des Sciences, France
    Academies of Arts, Humanities and Sciences of Canada
    Academy of Athens
    Academy of Science of Mozambique
    Academy of Science of South Africa
    Academy of Sciences for the Developing World (TWAS)
    Academy of Sciences Malaysia
    Academy of Sciences of Moldova
    Academy of Sciences of the Czech Republic
    Academy of Sciences of the Islamic Republic of Iran
    Academy of Scientific Research and Technology, Egypt
    Academy of the Royal Society of New Zealand
    Accademia Nazionale dei Lincei, Italy
    Africa Centre for Climate and Earth Systems Science
    African Academy of Sciences
    Albanian Academy of Sciences
    Amazon Environmental Research Institute
    American Academy of Pediatrics
    American Anthropological Association
    American Association for the Advancement of Science
    American Association of State Climatologists (AASC)
    American Association of Wildlife Veterinarians
    American Astronomical Society
    American Chemical Society
    American College of Preventive Medicine
    American Fisheries Society
    American Geophysical Union
    American Institute of Biological Sciences
    American Institute of Physics
    American Meteorological Society
    American Physical Society
    American Public Health Association
    American Quaternary Association
    American Society for Microbiology
    American Society of Agronomy
    American Society of Civil Engineers
    American Society of Plant Biologists
    American Statistical Association
    Association of Ecosystem Research Centers
    Australian Academy of Science
    Australian Bureau of Meteorology
    Australian Coral Reef Society
    Australian Institute of Marine Science
    Australian Institute of Physics
    Australian Marine Sciences Association
    Australian Medical Association
    Australian Meteorological and Oceanographic Society
    Bangladesh Academy of Sciences
    Botanical Society of America
    Brazilian Academy of Sciences
    British Antarctic Survey
    Bulgarian Academy of Sciences
    California Academy of Sciences
    Cameroon Academy of Sciences
    Canadian Association of Physicists
    Canadian Foundation for Climate and Atmospheric Sciences
    Canadian Geophysical Union
    Canadian Meteorological and Oceanographic Society
    Canadian Society of Soil Science
    Canadian Society of Zoologists
    Caribbean Academy of Sciences views
    Center for International Forestry Research
    Chinese Academy of Sciences
    Colombian Academy of Exact, Physical and Natural Sciences
    Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organization (CSIRO) (Australia)
    Consultative Group on International Agricultural Research
    Croatian Academy of Arts and Sciences
    Crop Science Society of America
    Cuban Academy of Sciences
    Delegation of the Finnish Academies of Science and Letters
    Ecological Society of America
    Ecological Society of Australia
    Environmental Protection Agency
    European Academy of Sciences and Arts
    European Federation of Geologists
    European Geosciences Union
    European Physical Society
    European Science Foundation
    Federation of American Scientists
    French Academy of Sciences
    Geological Society of America
    Geological Society of Australia
    Geological Society of London
    Georgian Academy of Sciences
    German Academy of Natural Scientists Leopoldina
    Ghana Academy of Arts and Sciences
    Indian National Science Academy
    Indonesian Academy of Sciences
    Institute of Ecology and Environmental Management
    Institute of Marine Engineering, Science and Technology
    Institute of Professional Engineers New Zealand
    Institution of Mechanical Engineers, UK
    InterAcademy Council
    International Alliance of Research Universities
    International Arctic Science Committee
    International Association for Great Lakes Research
    International Council for Science
    International Council of Academies of Engineering and Technological Sciences
    International Research Institute for Climate and Society
    International Union for Quaternary Research
    International Union of Geodesy and Geophysics
    International Union of Pure and Applied Physics
    Islamic World Academy of Sciences
    Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities
    Kenya National Academy of Sciences
    Korean Academy of Science and Technology
    Kosovo Academy of Sciences and Arts
    l’Académie des Sciences et Techniques du Sénégal
    Latin American Academy of Sciences
    Latvian Academy of Sciences
    Lithuanian Academy of Sciences
    Madagascar National Academy of Arts, Letters, and Sciences
    Mauritius Academy of Science and Technology
    Montenegrin Academy of Sciences and Arts
    National Academy of Exact, Physical and Natural Sciences, Argentina
    National Academy of Sciences of Armenia
    National Academy of Sciences of the Kyrgyz Republic
    National Academy of Sciences, Sri Lanka
    National Academy of Sciences, United States of America
    National Aeronautics and Space Administration
    National Association of Geoscience Teachers
    National Association of State Foresters
    National Center for Atmospheric Research
    National Council of Engineers Australia
    National Institute of Water & Atmospheric Research, New Zealand
    National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration
    National Research Council
    National Science Foundation
    Natural England
    Natural Environment Research Council, UK
    Natural Science Collections Alliance
    Network of African Science Academies
    New York Academy of Sciences
    Nicaraguan Academy of Sciences
    Nigerian Academy of Sciences
    Norwegian Academy of Sciences and Letters
    Oklahoma Climatological Survey
    Organization of Biological Field Stations
    Pakistan Academy of Sciences
    Palestine Academy for Science and Technology
    Pew Center on Global Climate Change
    Polish Academy of Sciences
    Romanian Academy
    Royal Academies for Science and the Arts of Belgium
    Royal Academy of Exact, Physical and Natural Sciences of Spain
    Royal Astronomical Society, UK
    Royal Danish Academy of Sciences and Letters
    Royal Irish Academy
    Royal Meteorological Society (UK)
    Royal Netherlands Academy of Arts and Sciences
    Royal Netherlands Institute for Sea Research
    Royal Scientific Society of Jordan
    Royal Society of Canada
    Royal Society of Chemistry, UK
    Royal Society of the United Kingdom
    Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences
    Russian Academy of Sciences
    Science and Technology, Australia
    Science Council of Japan
    Scientific Committee on Antarctic Research
    Scientific Committee on Solar-Terrestrial Physics
    Scripps Institution of Oceanography
    Serbian Academy of Sciences and Arts
    Slovak Academy of Sciences
    Slovenian Academy of Sciences and Arts
    Society for Ecological Restoration International
    Society for Industrial and Applied Mathematics
    Society of American Foresters
    Society of Biology (UK)
    Society of Systematic Biologists
    Soil Science Society of America
    Sudan Academy of Sciences
    Sudanese National Academy of Science
    Tanzania Academy of Sciences
    The Wildlife Society (international)
    Turkish Academy of Sciences
    Uganda National Academy of Sciences
    Union of German Academies of Sciences and Humanities
    United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
    University Corporation for Atmospheric Research
    Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution
    World Association of Zoos and Aquariums
    World Federation of Public Health Associations
    World Forestry Congress
    World Health Organization
    World Meteorological Organization
    Zambia Academy of Sciences
    Zimbabwe Academy of Sciences

    I would rather belong to the cult of science than the cult of ugly jerks who have to pay chicks to fuck them.

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  113. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Libertarian illusions. The Marxism of the Right,

    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/marxism-of-the-right/

    Illusions.? Or should it be delusions,?

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  114. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Griff, you forgot to mention the source of the list you published was the website of your idol Al Gore.

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  115. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    Another episode of the Kickstarter-sponsored continuation of the original Star Trek series, Star Trek Continues, is online. It follows directly after the episode Mirror, Mirror from the original TV series.

    https://vimeo.com/98076892

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  116. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Manolo. it would be useful if you could post a similar counter list.
    Make interesting reading

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  117. tom hunter (4,704 comments) says:

    Zimbabwe Academy of Sciences

    This.

    This is what will win the debate.

    On a different topic …

    Hitler was plainly and hysterically anti Communist

    I’ve read communists who’ve argued the same thing about Stalin on the basis of the numbers of communists he murdered and the damage he did to Communism. Funnily enough they’ve got a better argument.

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  118. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    Bedwetter

    “Hitler lead the National Socialist Worker’s Party.”

    That’s right. Hitler was also a staunch Catholic and heavily supported by the Vatican.

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  119. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    “Nazis were socialists”
    “No they weren’t”
    “Yes they were”
    etc, etc
    You’d be better off concentrating on what Nazis actually did rather than arguing about how they should be labelled. It seems important to some, however…

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  120. tom hunter (4,704 comments) says:

    You’d be better off concentrating on what Nazis actually did rather than arguing about how they should be labelled. It seems important to some, however…

    I agree, but I’ve watched several decades of arguments – in writing, on video, and in person – where it often seemed very, very important for left-wingers to label the right-winger in the debate as a Nazi, or a Neo-Nazi, or a best of all – a Crypto-Nazi.

    That’s all began to change since Goldberg published his bestseller – which was exactly his intention of course. Now we have increasing numbers of left-wingers explaining how they’ve tired of the epithets and how labelling is just awful and unhelpful to a debate.

    Funny that. ;)

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  121. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    Finally a good use for sky fairy assembly buildings.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/home-property/10178447/Open-homes-Converted-churches

    It is of course more proof that NZ is becoming a secular nation.

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  122. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    You take Goldberg’s trash seriously?

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  123. David Garrett (6,995 comments) says:

    I have made some pretty bad mistakes in my life and done some very unclassy things (that’s in addition to the obvious one) ..

    but take a look at the former Journal of Record (website) today…”Teacher admits assault on pregnant woman”…God, what a way to live you life…the lot of them!!

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  124. tom hunter (4,704 comments) says:

    Seems to have had the desired effect, despite being “trash”, milky.

    Besides, I’ve seen any amount of stuff praised to the skies by left-wing intellectuals that has turned out to be “trash”, starting with Das Kapital and most recently with Capital in the Twenty-First Century.

    I’d be willing to bet you’ll never refer to those as “trash” or their authors as “nutters”.

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  125. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “You take Goldberg’s trash seriously?”

    Have you read him?

    I can guess the answer.

    Which beggers the question: how do you know it’s trash, other than it violates Lefty political correctness?

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  126. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    tom hunter (4,252 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 2:46 pm

    Zimbabwe Academy of Sciences

    This….
    Is you picking one name out of many and focusing your argument and your beliefs about AGW on that
    A reflection of your mindset Tom
    Denial is sad in the stupid for someone like you its truly pathetic.

    For you Manolo it was linked by NASA here http://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus and comes from http://opr.ca.gov/s_listoforganizations.php

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  127. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    So do you equate liberalism with fascism?
    Shawn
    It’s not necessary to wade through all the bullshit in the world to know it’s bullshit.

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  128. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    Being a contrarian I will disagree with both sides of the Nazi debate.

    The Nazi’s were neither Left nor Right, Capitalist, nor Socialist.

    Fascism in general was a form of fusionism. It took ideas from both sides of the Left/Right divide and tried to fuse them into a single ideology, with dubious results.

    So the only serious answer to the argument concerning whether the Nazi’s were Left or Right is, both and neither.

    Strongly Right wing ideas can be found in Fascism, as well as strongly Left wing ideas.

    This does not make for easy sound bites on a blog though.

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  129. tom hunter (4,704 comments) says:

    Come on Griffy – say Nut, nut, nutter again.

    I love that shit!

    BTW, what are your predictions for dairy prices this season? The financial, economic and marketing experts at Fonterra have had their best crack at it, but before I finalise my budget this year I thought I’d get the word from my favourite AGW guru and his powerful forecasting theory.

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  130. Ross12 (1,388 comments) says:

    If I had any doubts about how stupid the Greens are , those doubts have now been pushed aside by this

    https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/24283230/a-storm-no-reason-to-change-our-conservation-law-greens/

    Nick Smith is going to change the law ( I assume the change will be quite specific ) to allow taking the native trees felled in the recent big storm to allow them to be milled and the wood utilised. Very sensible but the Greens say they should be left to rot !!!!

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  131. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    For Redbaiter particularly, and the general edification of the KB community.

    Ten general Conservative Principles, by Russell Kirk.

    “Being neither a religion nor an ideology, the body of opinion termed conservatism possesses no Holy Writ and no Das Kapital to provide dogmata. So far as it is possible to determine what conservatives believe, the first principles of the conservative persuasion are derived from what leading conservative writers and public men have professed during the past two centuries. After some introductory remarks on this general theme, I will proceed to list ten such conservative principles.

    Perhaps it would be well, most of the time, to use this word “conservative” as an adjective chiefly. For there exists no Model Conservative, and conservatism is the negation of ideology: it is a state of mind, a type of character, a way of looking at the civil social order.

    The attitude we call conservatism is sustained by a body of sentiments, rather than by a system of ideological dogmata. It is almost true that a conservative may be defined as a person who thinks himself such. The conservative movement or body of opinion can accommodate a considerable diversity of views on a good many subjects, there being no Test Act or Thirty-Nine Articles of the conservative creed.

    In essence, the conservative person is simply one who finds the permanent things more pleasing than Chaos and Old Night. (Yet conservatives know, with Burke, that healthy “change is the means of our preservation.”) A people’s historic continuity of experience, says the conservative, offers a guide to policy far better than the abstract designs of coffee-house philosophers.

    It is not possible to draw up a neat catalogue of conservatives’ convictions; nevertheless, I offer you, summarily, ten general principles; it seems safe to say that most conservatives would subscribe to most of these maxims. In various editions of my book The Conservative Mind I have listed certain canons of conservative thought—the list differing somewhat from edition to edition; in my anthology The Portable Conservative Reader I offer variations upon this theme. Now I present to you a summary of conservative assumptions differing somewhat from my canons in those two books of mine. In fine, the diversity of ways in which conservative views may find expression is itself proof that conservatism is no fixed ideology. What particular principles conservatives emphasize during any given time will vary with the circumstances and necessities of that era.

    First, the conservative believes that there exists an enduring moral order. That order is made for man, and man is made for it: human nature is a constant, and moral truths are permanent.

    Second, the conservative adheres to custom, convention, and continuity. It is old custom that enables people to live together peaceably; the destroyers of custom demolish more than they know or desire. It is through convention—a word much abused in our time—that we contrive to avoid perpetual disputes about rights and duties: law at base is a body of conventions. Continuity is the means of linking generation to generation; it matters as much for society as it does for the individual; without it, life is meaningless.

    Third, conservatives believe in what may be called the principle of prescription. Conservatives sense that modern people are dwarfs on the shoulders of giants, able to see farther than their ancestors only because of the great stature of those who have preceded us in time. Therefore conservatives very often emphasize the importance of prescription—that is, of things established by immemorial usage, so that the mind of man runneth not to the contrary. There exist rights of which the chief sanction is their antiquity—including rights to property, often. Similarly, our morals are prescriptive in great part. Conservatives argue that we are unlikely, we moderns, to make any brave new discoveries in morals or politics or taste. It is perilous to weigh every passing issue on the basis of private judgment and private rationality. The individual is foolish, but the species is wise, Burke declared. In politics we do well to abide by precedent and precept and even prejudice, for the great mysterious incorporation of the human race has acquired a prescriptive wisdom far greater than any man’s petty private rationality.

    Fourth, conservatives are guided by their principle of prudence. Burke agrees with Plato that in the statesman, prudence is chief among virtues. Any public measure ought to be judged by its probable long-run consequences, not merely by temporary advantage or popularity. Liberals and radicals, the conservative says, are imprudent: for they dash at their objectives without giving much heed to the risk of new abuses worse than the evils they hope to sweep away.

    Fifth, conservatives pay attention to the principle of variety. They feel affection for the proliferating intricacy of long-established social institutions and modes of life, as distinguished from the narrowing uniformity and deadening egalitarianism of radical systems. For the preservation of a healthy diversity in any civilization, there must survive orders and classes, differences in material condition, and many sorts of inequality. The only true forms of equality are equality at the Last Judgment and equality before a just court of law; all other attempts at levelling must lead, at best, to social stagnation.

    Sixth, conservatives are chastened by their principle of imperfectability. Human nature suffers irremediably from certain grave faults, the conservatives know. Man being imperfect, no perfect social order ever can be created. Because of human restlessness, mankind would grow rebellious under any utopian domination, and would break out once more in violent discontent—or else expire of boredom. To seek for utopia is to end in disaster, the conservative says: we are not made for perfect things. All that we reasonably can expect is a tolerably ordered, just, and free society, in which some evils, maladjustments, and suffering will continue to lurk. By proper attention to prudent reform, we may preserve and improve this tolerable order. But if the old institutional and moral safeguards of a nation are neglected, then the anarchic impulse in humankind breaks loose: “the ceremony of innocence is drowned.” The ideologues who promise the perfection of man and society have converted a great part of the twentieth-century world into a terrestrial hell.

    Seventh, conservatives are persuaded that freedom and property are closely linked. Separate property from private possession, and Leviathan becomes master of all. Upon the foundation of private property, great civilizations are built. The more widespread is the possession of private property, the more stable and productive is a commonwealth. Economic levelling, conservatives maintain, is not economic progress. Getting and spending are not the chief aims of human existence; but a sound economic basis for the person, the family, and the commonwealth is much to be desired.

    Eighth, conservatives uphold voluntary community, quite as they oppose involuntary collectivism. Although Americans have been attached strongly to privacy and private rights, they also have been a people conspicuous for a successful spirit of community. In a genuine community, the decisions most directly affecting the lives of citizens are made locally and voluntarily. Some of these functions are carried out by local political bodies, others by private associations: so long as they are kept local, and are marked by the general agreement of those affected, they constitute healthy community. But when these functions pass by default or usurpation to centralized authority, then community is in serious danger. Whatever is beneficent and prudent in modern democracy is made possible through cooperative volition. If, then, in the name of an abstract Democracy, the functions of community are transferred to distant political direction—why, real government by the consent of the governed gives way to a standardizing process hostile to freedom and human dignity.

    Ninth, the conservative perceives the need for prudent restraints upon power and upon human passions. Politically speaking, power is the ability to do as one likes, regardless of the wills of one’s fellows. A state in which an individual or a small group are able to dominate the wills of their fellows without check is a despotism, whether it is called monarchical or aristocratic or democratic. When every person claims to be a power unto himself, then society falls into anarchy. Anarchy never lasts long, being intolerable for everyone, and contrary to the ineluctable fact that some persons are more strong and more clever than their neighbors. To anarchy there succeeds tyranny or oligarchy, in which power is monopolized by a very few.

    The conservative endeavors to so limit and balance political power that anarchy or tyranny may not arise. In every age, nevertheless, men and women are tempted to overthrow the limitations upon power, for the sake of some fancied temporary advantage. It is characteristic of the radical that he thinks of power as a force for good—so long as the power falls into his hands. In the name of liberty, the French and Russian revolutionaries abolished the old restraints upon power; but power cannot be abolished; it always finds its way into someone’s hands. That power which the revolutionaries had thought oppressive in the hands of the old regime became many times as tyrannical in the hands of the radical new masters of the state.

    Tenth, the thinking conservative understands that permanence and change must be recognized and reconciled in a vigorous society. The conservative is not opposed to social improvement, although he doubts whether there is any such force as a mystical Progress, with a Roman P, at work in the world. When a society is progressing in some respects, usually it is declining in other respects. The conservative knows that any healthy society is influenced by two forces, which Samuel Taylor Coleridge called its Permanence and its Progression. The Permanence of a society is formed by those enduring interests and convictions that gives us stability and continuity; without that Permanence, the fountains of the great deep are broken up, society slipping into anarchy. The Progression in a society is that spirit and that body of talents which urge us on to prudent reform and improvement; without that Progression, a people stagnate.

    Therefore the intelligent conservative endeavors to reconcile the claims of Permanence and the claims of Progression. He thinks that the liberal and the radical, blind to the just claims of Permanence, would endanger the heritage bequeathed to us, in an endeavor to hurry us into some dubious Terrestrial Paradise. The conservative, in short, favors reasoned and temperate progress; he is opposed to the cult of Progress, whose votaries believe that everything new necessarily is superior to everything old.”

    http://www.kirkcenter.org/index.php/detail/ten-conservative-principles/

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  132. David Garrett (6,995 comments) says:

    Ross: Are you serious?? Of course you are, silly me…they will do much more for Gaia over the next 40 years (natives take a long time to rot) than is justified by people being able to get some lovely native timber…and of course – horror of horrors – the market will ensure that someone makes a handsome profit on them…

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  133. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    Al-Iraqiya anti ISIS propaganda.

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  134. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    R.I.P songwriter Gerry Goffin….

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  135. Longknives (4,686 comments) says:

    I used think Graham Henry was the most arrogant tosser involved in rugby but Steve Hansen…My fucking God!

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/10178231/Steve-Hansen-challenges-English-for-third-test

    ” they took us on in Dunedin playing a game at real pace and worked out they couldn’t”

    Jesus Christ Steve- Terrified referees are the ONLY thing keeping the All Blacks in the games at the moment (you were getting pumped until that yellow card..) By rights they should have lost their last three matches..
    I don’t know that arrogantly rubbishing the opposition when the whole rugby World is laughing at how lucky your recent victories have been is such a good idea ‘Champ’….

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  136. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    It turns out that not even the experts know exactly what fascism is.
    This excerpt from a new book by Jonah Goldberg.

    There is no word in the English language that gets thrown around more freely by people who don’t know what it means than “fascism.” Indeed, the more someone uses the word “fascist” in everyday conversation, the less likely it is that he knows what he’s talking about.

    You might think that the exception to this rule would be scholars of fascism. But what really distinguishes the scholarly community is its honesty. Not even the professionals have figured out what exactly fascism is. Countless scholarly investigations begin with this pro forma acknowledgment. “Such is the welter of divergent opinion surrounding the term,” writes Roger Griffin in his introduction to The Nature of Fascism, “that it is almost de rigueur to open contributions to the debate on fascism with some such observation.”

    The few scholars who have ventured their own definitions provide a glimmer of insight as to why consensus is so elusive. Griffin, a contemporary leading light in the field, defines fascism as “a genus of political ideology whose mythic core in its various permutations is a palingenetic form of populist ultra-nationalism.” Roger Eatwell claims that fascism’s “essence” is a “form of thought that preaches the need for social rebirth in order to forge a holistic-national radical Third Way.” Emilio Gentile suggests, “A mass movement, that combines different classes but is prevalently of the middle classes, which sees itself as having a mission of national regeneration, is in a state of war with its adversaries and seeks a monopoly of power by using terror, parliamentary tactics and compromise to create a new regime, destroying democracy.” 2

    While these are perfectly serviceable definitions, what most recommends them over others is that they are short enough to reprint here. For example, the social scientist Ernst Nolte, a key figure in the German “historians’ dispute” (Historikerstreit) of the 1980s, has a six-point definition called the “Fascist minimum” that tries to define fascism by what it opposes–that is, fascism is both “anti-liberalism” and “anti-conservatism.” Other definitional constructs are even more convoluted, requiring that contrary evidence be counted as exceptions that prove the rule.

    It’s an academic version of Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle: the more closely you study the subject, the less clearly defined it becomes. The historian R. A. H. Robinson wrote twenty years ago, “Although enormous amounts of research time and mental energy have been put into the study of it… fascism has remained the great conundrum for students of the twentieth century.” Meanwhile, the authors of the Dictionnaire historique des fascismes et du nazisme flatly assert, “No universally accepted definition of the fascist phenomenon exists, no consensus, however slight, as to its range, its ideological origins, or the modalities of action which characterize it.”

    Stanley G. Payne, considered by many to be the leading living scholar of fascism, wrote in 1995, “At the end of the twentieth century fascism remains probably the vaguest of the major political terms.” There are even serious scholars who argue that Nazism wasn’t fascist, that fascism doesn’t exist at all, or that it is primarily a secular religion (this is my own view). “[ P] ut simply,” writes Gilbert Allardyce, “we have agreed to use the word without agreeing on how to define it.”

    [...]

    The major flaw in all of this is that fascism, properly understood, is not a phenomenon of the right at all. Instead, it is, and always has been, a phenomenon of the left. This fact–an inconvenient truth if there ever was one–is obscured in our time by the equally mistaken belief that fascism and communism are opposites. In reality, they are closely related, historical competitors for the same constituents, seeking to dominate and control the same social space. The fact that they appear as polar opposites is a trick of intellectual history and (more to the point) the result of a concerted propaganda effort on the part of the “Reds” to make the “Browns” appear objectively evil and “other” (ironically, demonization of the “other” is counted as a definitional trait of fascism). But in terms of their theory and practice, the differences are minimal.

    Jonah Goldberg (2007-04-14T22:00:00+00:00). Liberal Fascism: The Secret History of the American Left, From Mussolini to the Politics of Meaning (Kindle Locations 95-121). Doubleday. Kindle Edition.

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  137. David Garrett (6,995 comments) says:

    Shawn: Far too long as a blog post with respect, but pretty well spot on…Most of it could be summed up in the last para. could it not??

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  138. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    ANd –

    Fascism always has been, and always will be a left-wing ideology—period. That means that the Nazis, being a subset of Fascism, are left-wing as well. I cannot stress enough the importance of understanding this truth.

    The oft repeated lie that Fascism and the Nazis are right-wing has effectively served three important purposes:

    It has enabled the political left to deny any culpability for the atrocities committed by Hitler.
    It has unfairly and incorrectly shifted the blame for the Holocaust, Nazi eugenics, and other Nazi programs onto the right-wing, i.e. conservatives.
    It has served to muddy the waters to such an extent that true conservative values are tainted by “guilt through association” right from the starting gate.

    I am not claiming that Communism and Fascism are the same thing—they are not. They are, however, variations on the same theme—the theme of collectivism. That is, they both promote Big Government at the expense of individual freedom. As such, they both belong on the left side of the political spectrum.

    The media has long promulgated the myth of a political spectrum that looks something like this: Far-Left (Communists)—————-Moderates—————Far-Right (Fascists).

    What is wrong with that picture? What is wrong with it is that the true political spectrum looks like this: At the far left of the political spectrum we have collectivist ideologies such as Communism and Fascism, then moving to the right we find Socialism, then the Moderates. On the right side of the spectrum we move from the Moderates to Conservatives (who favor a Constitutional, or limited, form of government), and finally at the far right we find the true anarchists, who favor no government at all (not to be confused with faux-anarchists, who wish to tear down existing governments so that they can replace them with other forms of government).

    In short, the political spectrum moves from Big Government on the far left, to no government on the far right, with the size and influence of government decreasing as one moves to the right, and vice versa. Fascism belongs squarely on the left side of the spectrum.

    Benito Mussolini (who was raised on Marxist philosophy) essentially brought Fascism onto the world stage—so perhaps if I rephrase Mussolini’s quote from above it will make how Fascism views the role of government clearer:

    “Everything within the federal government, nothing outside the federal government, nothing against the federal government.”

    http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/54772

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  139. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    Bigot bruv says

    “Hitler was also a staunch Catholic and heavily supported by the Vatican.”

    The usual utter bollox from the lying bigot.

    Why did the RAF use the pope’s encyclical as a propaganda drop over Germany?

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  140. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    The aging racist has lost her marbles: https://nz.news.yahoo.com/election/a/-/24275099/maori-party-endorses-nz-beverage-guidance-panel-policy-brief/

    The Māori Party has championed a campaign to keep our families strong, healthy and intact by protecting them against activities or substances which are known to be hazardous to people’s health. Excessive sugar intake is another barrier to our health, as much as tobacco use, alcohol abuse and problem gambling harm.”

    “I have talked to our families about sugar being the food of colonization – a product which takes away from our abilities to focus on living healthily,” says Mrs Turia.

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  141. Gulag1917 (857 comments) says:

    There is a tendency by Nazi sympathisers in NZ to be left wingers They hate anything conservative.

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  142. Jack5 (5,014 comments) says:

    The Hooerald is on about soldiers bitching about the Steyr assault rifles, the Government is preparing to sell.

    NZ took them up because Australia bought them, and Australia now makes its own version.

    Some soldiers always grizzle about their rifles. They bitched about the FN when it was introduced, and some reckoned they should have kept the old Lee-Enfield .303. Americans grizzled about their rifles in Vietnam, and bar talk was they were no good because they wouldn’t fire when full of mud (like the AK47 supposedly does). What soldier has a rifle with mechanism full of mud? Look at what the defence contractors carried in Iraq, and they could choose. AK47s? Of course not.

    The Hooerald says unnamed soldiers hated the Steyr, which is now more than 20 years old, so probably should be updated. But are they as bad as The Hooerald reports? It calls them “crap”.

    An unnamed soldier is quoted as saying he couldn’t hit the side of a barn with it. Another reckons he would rather rely on throwing stones.

    Is the Army recruiting blind folk and schoolboys these days?

    The Hooerald reports one guns-blog poster as saying: “NZDF have always destroyed old gear rather than sell to civilians.”

    What bullshit! Tens of thousands of New Zealanders have hunted deer and pigs with ex-Army .303’s.

    The Hooerald calls NZ soldiers “squaddies”. I’ve heard that description for UK soldiers, but not before for NZ troops.

    The newspaper says NZ is shopping for combat shotguns. So the Geneva Convention has gone out the barracks window.

    The basics of the Steyr:

    http://www.military-today.com/firearms/steyr_aug.htm

    The Hooerald article:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11278332

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  143. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Fletch and the ongoing fetish for far right wing nuttiness ,

    The Canada Free Press,

    “or a Canadian site, they seem to have an odd fetish for American nationalism. They peddle all the wingnuts’ usual pseudosciences, such as creationism, global warming denial, and abstinence and abortion-related nonsense. Two of their environment “reporters” are lobbyist Steve Milloy and general crank Alan Caruba, a promoter of Robert W. Felix’s brand of insanity as well his own. They also promote birtherism. CFP has also scrubbed a number of columns that apparently went too far even for them. After Tim Ball, one of their favorite sources for commentary on global warming, was sued for libel by two climatologists, they removed the offending material and took down a number of other columns he wrote. Judi McLeod, one of the founding editors, co-authored a brilliantly deranged column implicating a United Nations-backed global warming conspiracy, Harry Reid, and the mob as the perpetrators of 9/11, which was later scrubbed.[2]”

    http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Canada_Free_Press

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  144. Scott Chris (6,036 comments) says:

    The UK satellite company Inmarsat has told the BBC that the search for the missing Malaysia Airlines jet has yet to go to the area its scientists think is the plane’s most likely crash site.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-27870467

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  145. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “For Redbaiter particularly.”

    TLDNR

    You sad patronising idiot.

    This is the comment section of a blog.

    A link would have been sufficient. (for the others, I’ve read it long ago)

    What a maroon, and he presumes to lecture others on strategies to escape Progressive totalitarianism.

    FO you brain dead stalking jerkoff.

    If there were internet cops you’d be arrested for creepy behaviour.

    (You’re worse than TDVM and that’s saying something.)

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  146. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    Kowtow.

    The Vatican ordered that Hitlers birthday was to be celebrated every year right up to the wars conclusion. Not only that, but the infamous rat lines shipped out some of the very worst Nazi’s to safety well after the end of the war.

    You might not like it, but it is the truth.

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  147. nickb (3,686 comments) says:

    A bit of a surprise here. Everyone had Cairns “hung, drawn and quartered” but now no charges by the cricket board in Britain.

    The headline is a bit (very) misleading. It only says the ECB won’t charge him in relation to match-fixing in cricket he played in England (for Nottinghamshire) which I was not even aware was being investigated (and I have followed this quite closely). It has nothing to do with police charges.

    His two major issues have always seemed to be the ICC investigation into the ICL fixing, and the UK police investigation (both still outstanding).

    The coverage of the whole issue is a bit frustrating. It makes you wonder what kind of gag orders have been flying around the NZ and UK media.

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  148. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Gulag1917 (478 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 4:26 pm

    There is a tendency by Nazi sympathisers in NZ to be left wingers They hate anything conservative.

    Like here.?.

    http://www.google.co.nz/search?q=right+wing+resistance&client=safari&rls=en&tbm=isch&imgil=UxeqvsOmtBmPFM%253A%253Bhttp%253A%252F%252Ft2.gstatic.com%252Fimages%253Fq%253Dtbn%253AANd9GcT3KRvzWrbsc9uKyHBovhy-16xoqAhfYR_4A0zME6TwWyzeIrEo%253B220%253B206%253B3ROUcuiaz9lvIM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Frwrnz.blogspot.com%25252F&source=iu&usg=__CpQE7m26MBRNe4eLfzllh3IZLlI%3D&sa=X&ei=z8GjU8L0Ioa48gXhnIKQBQ&ved=0CDQQ9QEwAg&biw=1670&bih=853#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=76mxeRPA7A2gHM%253A%3B2AzPoJikXnfQfM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252F4.bp.blogspot.com%252F-w3y7Iyrbrls%252FUVdcoLEylxI%252FAAAAAAAABBQ%252FkQTTwxp8QO0%252Fs1600%252FIMG_4867.JPG%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Frwrnz.blogspot.com%252F2013%252F03%252Fpeter-kramer-visits-new-zealand.html%3B1600%3B1200

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  149. Scott Chris (6,036 comments) says:

    Tom, Caleb Rossiter isn’t a ‘left-winger’ by his own admission; from the WSJ article you referenced:

    The left wants to stop industrialization—even if the hypothesis of catastrophic, man-made global warming is false.

    http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303380004579521791400395288

    (no paywall btw)

    If he were a ‘left-winger’ I’d be less sceptical that his purported primary concern that the moral dilemma posed by supposedly inhibiting Africa’s economic development through preferment for non fossil fuelled energy technologies is genuine.

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  150. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    A True Conservative:

    A Christian who puts the Judaic values of bloodshed, revenge and hellfire over and above the virtues of compassion, empathy, poverty of spirit, rejection of material possessions and charity. One who loves to judge others but remains oblivious to their own faults. One who opposes the separation of Church and State. One who longs for the extermination of life on Earth in the name of a mythological event that will result in a large proportion of humanity being tortured for eternity by a vengeful God. A death cultist. A hypocrite. One who obsesses on the evils of sexual desire but ignores physical greed and gluttony. One who opposes the right of women to terminate pregnancy and artificial contraception but supports the death penalty.

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  151. Scott Chris (6,036 comments) says:

    The Nazis claimed that communism was dangerous to the well-being of nations because of its intention to dissolve private property, its support of class conflict, its aggression against the middle class, its hostility towards small businessmen, and its atheism. Nazism rejected class conflict-based socialism and economic egalitarianism, favouring instead a stratified economy with social classes based on merit and talent, retaining private property, and the creation of national solidarity that transcends class distinction.

    During the 1920s, Hitler urged disparate Nazi factions to unite in opposition to “Jewish Marxism”. Hitler asserted that the “three vices” of “Jewish Marxism” were democracy, pacifism and internationalism.

    In 1930, Hitler said: “Our adopted term ‘Socialist’ has nothing to do with Marxist Socialism. Marxism is anti-property; true Socialism is not.” In 1942, Hitler privately said: “I absolutely insist on protecting private property … we must encourage private initiative”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism#Anti-communism

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  152. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    nasska obsessing again.

    Relax ,Christians or conservatives aren’t forcing anything on anyone.

    That’s the province of progressives and Muslims.

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  153. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Dairy is all good will pretty much continue at present levels off its extreme high price in 1013as El Nino is expected to drop rain into the western states and corn belt later this year in .time for the corn crops peak demand
    Red wheat is going to rise in the medium term due to the ongoing drought in Ozzie and winter cropping areas already planted in the states.
    Meat prices should firm over the next six months as drought striken farmers have mostly sold down their herds in effected areas already

    Nut nut nutter is saved for the conspirowhacky spurting wingnuts not those whose libertarian views are to blame for their denial.
    you wanna spurt some global conspirowhackys and I will give you the nutwhacking nut nut nutter : :lol:

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  154. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    Red: Well you know what to do…Gather 500 like minded souls around you – that should be 30 minutes work, surely

    hahahaha – 500 fake identities – sweet as if you’ve got talent pissing out of every pore and orifice.

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  155. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    nasska – and that Life FM bullshit is their doing too the horrible bastards. Sometimes those recruitment tunes are catchy too the evil wankers.

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  156. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    kowtow – that ‘slumbro millionaire’ comment on the dickhead academic thread was funny as. But I have to take a shower after each time you make me laugh – only problem.

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  157. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    …..”Christians or conservatives aren’t forcing anything on anyone”….

    Then why are the wankers dead set on backing the CCCP? Anyone who wants to take the time to read their 2011 manifesto & candidate list will realise that it’s a vehicle to move the moral standards of NZ back to the 50’s.

    If the Godnutters get a chance to “stiffen the backbone” of National we can expect the franchise equivalent of the Magdalene laundries opening through the length of the country by year’s end.

    There raped pregnant women will have their babies removed then adopted out while doing penance for their sins by washing the cum stains out of the priest’s cassocks.

    Christian love…..coming to a workhouse near you soon!

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  158. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    LR&C takes the fight against Kilojoules to a new level. :)

    Ref: https://www.dropbox.com/s/pfxkn4zp9zc16n1/LRC%20Driveby.jpg

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  159. Gulag1917 (857 comments) says:

    nasska
    There is a difference between Catholic Eire and Protestant NZ.

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  160. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    Smoke nazis: The latest finding is that second hand smoke is just as bad no matter where you try to hide the puffers in a restaurant setting – so they’re not safe anywhere – hmmm. I’m a non-smoker – I feel sorry for smokers – they’re being squish-squashed. Secondhand vehicle emissions are probably worse now, aren’t they ? And a host of other heinous health risks.

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  161. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “Then why are the wankers dead set on backing the CCCP?”

    To get pathological communists like you and your dole bludging mate out of our lives.

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  162. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    hahahaha – that’s what you get when gangsters can’t read – it says ‘drive-thru’ not fuckin ‘drive-by’ ya clowns !!

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/pfxkn4zp9zc16n1/LRC%20Driveby.jpg

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  163. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    Mr Farrar give the rightwing idiot larry williams a guest post on your blog as this idiot seems to wet its nappie when he talks to you or Mr Slater on NewsTalkZB,with his droll voice and VAST knowledge of fuck all, hes your man for a guest post , williams the face of the right wing,dribble dribble

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  164. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    ….”To get pathological communists like you and your dole bludging mate out of our lives.”…..

    No doubt a veiled reference to the gas chambers. What was it above the gates of Auschwitz?

    Something along the lines of “work will set you free”.

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  165. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    What was it above the gates of Auschwitz?

    Well – I heard that McDonalds stole the ‘Big Macs served’ count sign idea from them.

    hahaha – you fuckin started it with the dropbox.

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  166. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    Naaska dribbles:

    “Then why are the wankers dead set on backing the CCCP?”

    Evidence? Do you have any actual figures about how many conservative Christians are backing the party? No? Thought not.

    “Anyone who wants to take the time to read their 2011 manifesto & candidate list will realise that it’s a vehicle to move the moral standards of NZ back to the 50′s.”

    So?

    “If the Godnutters”

    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz………

    “get a chance to “stiffen the backbone” of National we can expect the franchise equivalent of the Magdalene laundries opening through the length of the country by year’s end.”

    Bollocks. Telling lies for your atheist religion again Naaska.

    “There raped pregnant women will have their babies removed then adopted out while doing penance for their sins by washing the cum stains out of the priest’s cassocks.”

    Your ranting brain farts are hilarious, but have nothing to do with reality.

    Do you have a fact based, intelligent argument to make? Or just more Atheist dribbling?

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  167. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “A Christian who puts the Judaic values of bloodshed, revenge and hellfire over and above the virtues of compassion, empathy, poverty of spirit, rejection of material possessions and charity.”

    Not a description of any conservative Christian I have ever met. But then using reality to base your claims on is not your strong point Naaska.

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  168. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    What on Earth would be the point of making “a fact based, intelligent argument” to a group of people who haven’t grown out of the imaginary friend stage?

    Edit:

    ….”Not a description of any conservative Christian I have ever met.”…..

    Try reading GD on Kiwiblog any morning….that should bring you up to speed. :)

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  169. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    ” No doubt a veiled reference to the gas chambers. ”

    No doubt.

    And to think others on here actually rate you as someone who might recognise an appeal to reason.

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  170. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “You sad patronising idiot.”

    Back to using the Marxist play book Red? Perhaps you need to come out of the closet and just admit your edging ever closer to Marxism! :)

    “A link would have been sufficient.”

    Ya need some schooling boy, and I don’t trust you to click a link.

    “and he presumes to lecture others on strategies to escape Progressive totalitarianism.”

    Damn straight. Your strategy is a shambles, totally counter productive, and doomed to failure for the same reasons that Marxist ideological purity fails.

    “FO you brain dead stalking jerkoff.”

    Make me! :)

    “If there were internet cops you’d be arrested for creepy behaviour.”

    Don’t like it when someone uses your tactics against you do ya! :)

    Scratch that, I actually posted something worthwhile, while your posts can be summed up as a collection of “fuck off” statements.

    Your “strategy” is a joke.

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  171. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “your posts can be summed up as a collection of “fuck off” statements.”

    To you and most other wittering trolls yes.

    Pity you’re too thick to take the hint you irritating useless pedant.

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  172. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    Conservative Godgrovellers eating each other…..it doesn’t get much better than this! :)

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  173. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Enjoy it while you can hillbilly.

    Another clueless patronising idiot who thinks firing into his own ranks is the best way to win a war.

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  174. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Redtard still backing Colon Crag of the moon landing hoax for a place in government :lol:
    I see massive disappointment in the future for the god whacked conservonutters when they eventually realize that colon is just a nut whacked populist with the politics of whinny using their brand to suck in a few more idiots.

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  175. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Redbaiter (7,135 comments) says:
    June 20th, 2014 at 6:10 pm
    ” No doubt a veiled reference to the gas chambers. ”

    No doubt.

    “And to think others on here actually rate you as someone who might recognise an appeal to reason.”

    Oh dear, the sublime irony.! (11.35 am, 5.50 pm etc, etc )

    “When I here the word reason I reach for my Taizer.”

    Source Redbaiter.

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  176. dad4justice (8,097 comments) says:

    ShawnLH get a grip – our side don’t need back stabbers.

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  177. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    “When I here the word reason I reach for my Taizer.”

    Source Redbaiter………..

    He must have been off his tits when he typed that. Baity’s thinking processes are pretty much stuffed but his grammar & spelling are usually excellent. :)

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  178. EAD (950 comments) says:

    America – from Freedom to Fascism in 200 years:

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-06-09/across-america-police-departments-are-quietly-preparing-war

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  179. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    I get the feeling that even spawn is distancing himself from the sycophantic cohort of true blue reading conservonutters.
    May haps Shawn has a brain and realizes that flogging the redbaiting horse has no good purpose in 2014 in fact it was stupid back in the days of McCarthyism’s height.
    Silly old man leads a bunch of befuddled old men into the political wildness there to peregrinate aimlessly for ever lost and ignored except for baiting redbaiter time on KB.

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  180. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    EAD, utter piffle.

    “Zero Hedge[1] is a batshit insane Austrian economics-based finance blog run by a pseudonymous founder who posts articles under the name “Tyler Durden,” after the character from Fight Club by Chuck Palahniuk.
    Tyler claims to be a “believer in a sweeping conspiracy that casts the alumni of Goldman Sachs as a powerful cabal at the helm of U.S. policy, with the Treasury and the Federal Reserve colluding to preserve the status quo.” While this is not an entirely unreasonable statement of the problem, his solution actually mirrors the anatagonist in Fight Club in that Tyler wants, per Austrian school ideas, to lead a catastrophic market crash in order to destroy banking institutions and bring back “real” free market capitalism.[2]
    The site posts nearly indecipherable analyses of multiple seemingly unrelated subjects to point towards a consistent theme of economic collapse any day now, and has accurately predicted 200 of the last 2 recessions. Tyler seems to repeat The Economic Collapse Blog’s idea of posting blog articles many times a day and encouraging people to post it as far and wide as humanly possible. Tyler moves away from the format of long lists to write insanely dense volumes[3] filled with (often contradicting) jargon that makes one wonder if the writers even know what the words actually mean.[4] The site first appeared in early 2009, meaning that (given Tyler’s habit of taking a shit on each and every positive data point), anyone listening to him from the beginning missed the entire 2009-2013 rally in the equities market.
    The only writer conclusively identified is Dan Ivandjiiski, who conducts public interviews on behalf of Zero Hedge.[5] The blog came online several days after he lost his job at Wexford Capital, a Connecticut-based hedge fund (run by a former Goldman trader). And proceeded to choose his pen name from a nihilistic psychotic delusion.
    Zero Hedge is not quite the NaturalNews of economics, but not for want of trying…..”

    http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge

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  181. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    EAD

    I think the current administration, from top level to local, are shitting themselves over the prospect of many trained army personal coming home to unemployment & a general feeling of dissatisfaction.

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  182. Komata (1,161 comments) says:

    So, the Maori Party says that ‘Sugar is the food of colonisation’.

    OK, if that is her attitude, and to avoid a charge of hypocrisy, Mrs Turia must IMMEDIATELY stop her family and all maori fropm eating absolutely EVERYTHING that is ‘Post European’ and from now on eat only the foods that Maori were eating at the time of European ‘coloniosation’.

    From the top of my head only, this list would include the following (in no order ):

    Eels

    Bracken fern

    Wood Pigeon

    Fish

    Kumara (the ‘original, not the current ‘Kumara’ which is from North America)

    Yams

    Taro

    Cabbage Tree

    Karaka (berries only)

    Not much is there?

    And as well, if she was REALLY true to her convictions, then she would get rid of absolutely EVERYTHING that had a ‘European / Colonisation associations…

    She would of course be ‘far healthier. far ‘fitter’, and probably far colder as well…..

    For some strange reason, somehow, I can’t see her ever having ‘The courage of Her convictions’….

    Odd that….

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  183. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    The days before KFC were hard ones for the Tangata Whenua Komata.

    ….”Bracken fern root was an important staple for many iwi. Eating this increases the chance of cancer. The fibrous Māori diet meant people tended to wear their teeth out, which over time led to malnutrition, disease and death.”……

    Ref: http://www.teara.govt.nz/en/te-hauora-maori-i-mua-history-of-maori-health/page-1

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  184. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/not-hitlers-pope/

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  185. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “I think the current administration, from top level to local, are shitting themselves over the prospect of many trained army personal coming home to unemployment & a general feeling of dissatisfaction.”

    You know that’s bullshit Narsekissa.

    The police are being militarized to defend the pathological communist progs like you in the US who are trying to dismantle the Constitutional Republic and make it another basket case socialist democracy, and are fearful there might be some armed resistance to their plans.

    Just the same old same old. The left using armed force to take power.

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  186. stigie (1,066 comments) says:

    One angry man….One fucked philosophy !~

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  187. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    I take it that you’ll be throwing your resources in behind the Constitutionalists then Baity.

    Don’t forget to send word of how the hostilities pan out. :)

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  188. Colville (2,254 comments) says:

    Ok just back from freezing my tits off looking for bambi.

    What have I missed?

    Has Cun*liffe lied to us all again today?

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  189. goldnkiwi (1,264 comments) says:

    Seals, seagulls, whales (apparently), pig, dog, kiwi, each other. ;)

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  190. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    Even 150 years ago the truth was out. :)

    Ref: https://www.dropbox.com/s/fmrv6ubs2bymcb8/lobotomy.gif

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  191. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    “The police are being militarized to defend the pathological communist progs like you in the US who are trying to dismantle the Constitutional Republic and make it another basket case socialist democracy, and are fearful there might be some armed resistance to their plans.”

    MOONBAT ALERT!!!!

    Next thing you know old Bedwetter will be telling us he can see Russia from his house.

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  192. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    An international force is being sent to look for Boku Haram’s captives. The US is sending a group of CIA operatives, the UK is sending a company of SAS troops. Australia is sending Rolf Harris.

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  193. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    She would of course be ‘far healthier. far ‘fitter’, and probably far colder as well….

    . . . and no post-colonial sized ass either.

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  194. Left Right and Centre (2,950 comments) says:

    When my KB training pays off . . .

    Supermarket employee is outside scratching an instant ticket. I hold back from saying anything. I go in the shop – come out. She’s there again with more tickets – or is it her ? So now I’m asking her – ‘was that you before’? Yep. And now I’m trying to stop myself saying anything else – but being me – I just can’t help myself. ‘I always wonder why people who gamble don’t go for the big payout lotto tickets – because you can’t retire off a scratchie’.

    And her answer was quite something. ‘I won $50K and it’s now up to 85K’. Wow. Yeah, ok. That’s meant to stop you dead in your tracks. But that’s where the training took over – because without too big a delay I replied ‘well there you go then, you didn’t retire’. Hahaha – prick.

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  195. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    Funnily enough last night TVNZ ran a BBC puff piece on world wide paedophilia real time monitoring and busting thereof……..

    …….footage of heavily armed,helmetted squad of black clad cops go to house in LA. Bang bang bang, little woman opens door,then fat topless guy led away in hand cuffs. No dramas.

    Kowtow reckons that 15 -20 years ago two hairy arsed plain clothed detectives would have been sent to do the job or a couple of boys in a Z car.

    Militarised? Definitly.

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  196. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    So, the Maori Party says that ‘Sugar is the food of colonisation’.

    Actually, that is something they might want to keep quiet about. There is a school of thought, and some pretty strong evidence suggested by a guy called J. Robyt, that suggests the origins of sugar cultivation was most likely from North East India, and the South Pacific where evidence of sugarcane cultivation was found dating back to 6,000BC. In India it was dated back to 10,000 BC.

    SO … before it becomes a treaty claim, it might pay for them to do a bit more research!!! ;-)

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  197. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    They have to be because the gun culture in the usa means you don’t know if a simple crim will have heavy assault weapons or worse. cracks me up you can buy a barret 50 in the states no problems but you can not even make or own a silencer for a slug gun.

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  198. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    Militarised? Definitly.

    First they came for…

    http://crimethinc.com/movies/miamimodel.html

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  199. RF (1,370 comments) says:

    Has anyone notice that early photographs of Maori reveal that they do not have any teeth. Caused by them chewing stones trying to extract sugar.

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  200. Aussie Aussie Aussie (22 comments) says:

    You Forget that American Gun Culture
    is derived from your British Culture shooting
    unarmed American Civilians in Boston.

    They demand the right to bear arms to protect themselves from “our system”
    people do not want to end up in British Concentration Camps like the Boers?

    You also Forget that the Prime Minister who declared War on Germany for NZ
    and is New Zealander of the Century was Born in Victoria Australia

    The Birth place of Australian Democracy.

    The only places people or times where people are allowed to live in relative Peace and Freedom is when they
    have a Citizen Militia

    If you want to be the Switzerland of the South Pacific you may have to borrow a few of their Ideas?

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  201. Jack5 (5,014 comments) says:

    Re Griff at 9.18:

    … but you can not even make or own a silencer for a slug gun.

    I don’t understand the point of this comment. Whoever wanted a silencer for an air gun? I’ve never heard a noisy air gun.

    Silencers only count for firearms and then need subsonic ammunition.

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  202. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Read and laugh. Someone called Colonial Viper, a moron and Silent T arselicker, comments at The sub-Standard:
    National are reaching and desperate. Dredging up a standard, 11 year old form letter instead of engaging with the issues which are of concern to many NZers. And the electorate sees that quite clearly.

    I don’t care about the media polls. The tide is going out on National and it will be very obvious on E-Day. National have overplayed a weak, dirty hand.

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  203. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    :lol:
    ignorance of fact
    PCP air rifles are noisy
    Silencers in the states are illegal even if only built for air guns
    Airgun Silencers – A Hazard to Your Legal Health? by Robert D. Beeman, 2002, Airgun Illustrated October 2002: pg. 100-102.
    http://www.beemans.net/silencers_on_airguns.htm

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  204. Jack5 (5,014 comments) says:

    Re Griff fat 7.39:

    Well I’ll be damned. I’ve heard lots of CO2 powered rifles and pistols fired over the years, but never anything noisy.

    I hiope the PCP air rifles you refer to require firearms licence before purchase.

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