Cunliffe and bloggers

August 19th, 2014 at 11:00 am by David Farrar

Stuff reports:

Labour leader tried to score a point over John Key yesterday by saying he rarely talks to bloggers, but that seems a stretch.

One of his closest advisers (priming him for the televised debates) is Polity blogger Rob Salmond.

Greg Presland, a lawyer friend involved in setting up his leadership fund trust, blogs as MickeySavage at The Standard.

Labour MPs and candidates often write for TheDailyBlog, and Cunliffe gave an early interview to Martin ”Bomber” Bradbury.

Plus at least three staff hand picked by David Cunliffe to write for him are (presumably) former bloggers at The Standard.

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61 Responses to “Cunliffe and bloggers”

  1. Pete George (23,830 comments) says:

    Compilation of known Labour links with The Standard – Is The Standard “a mouthpiece for Labour”?

    That’s after Lynn Prentice claimed on Radio NZ:

    Espiner: Well, you heard Bill Ralston saying there that this has been happening for years and this is just the new form of it with websites. Is he right?

    Prentice: Ah not for the left. Basically we don’t take material particularly from the parliamentary wing. We never have. other blogs might be we don’t.

    Espiner: So the Standard has never received any information from the Labour Party.

    Prentice: We have but a long time back. If you go back you have to go back to the H-Fee back in 2008.

    Espiner: So for the last, what, six years you’ve not received any information from anyone at all in the Parliamentary Labour Party.

    Prentice: We will often get stuff pointing at stuff that is already in public.

    Espiner: Right. So you have received material but just not fresh material.

    Prentice. Nah, That’s right.

    http://yournz.org/2014/08/15/prentice-versus-pagani/

    This is before Cunliffe’s time as leader but Mike Smith was General Secretary of the Labour Party until August 2009, became Prentice’s co-trustee at The Standard in 2010 and became an author. He was an adviser to David Shearer in the Labour leader’s office (in Parliament) up until last year. He is still authoring posts.

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  2. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    Just about every time the guy opens his mouth ,he sticks his foot in it.

    I’d like to see the partisan MSM call Cunners on these as much as they seem to go after Collins for example.

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  3. Bovver (173 comments) says:

    Pots always look stupid when trying to call the kettle black.

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  4. Rich Prick (1,750 comments) says:

    Liar.

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  5. Keeping Stock (9,381 comments) says:

    About halfway through this segment of last week’s Friday Forum on Newstalk ZB in Wellington, for Labour candidate Josie Pagani names three senior Labour Party staffers as Standard bloggers. That makes Lynn Prentice’s denials on Radio New Zealand and Mr Cunliffe’s distancing of himself from bloggers seem rather hollow.

    http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/Wellington/listen-on-demand/audio/tf-friday-forum-pt1-15thAug2014

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  6. Jack5 (5,281 comments) says:

    Cunliffe’s has apologised for being a man.

    Perhaps he would talk to Cactus Kate.

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  7. redqueen (597 comments) says:

    No, no, it’s different when the Left does it. Cunliffe is merely communicating with media source about already public information. By comparison, National is conspiring when it discusses public information or ‘hacking’ when someone accesses a public system!

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  8. YesWeDid (1,056 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  9. Pete George (23,830 comments) says:

    YesWeDid makes one of the key points in this.

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  10. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  11. MT_Tinman (3,322 comments) says:

    YesWeDid (1,039 comments) says:
    August 19th, 2014 at 11:15 am

    If you don’t get that then you have missed what this whole damn thing is about.

    You are correct, it went completely over my head.

    Perhaps you can further explain to me why WO is bad and biased, thieving liars from the left are good.

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  12. Rich Prick (1,750 comments) says:

    Oh OK YesWeDid, who gets to decide which bloggers are “nasty and vindictive”? The Left would love to regulate the media based on who they like and don’t like. If you don’t like the author you are very free not to read the blog. It isn’t compulsory you know.

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  13. redqueen (597 comments) says:

    @Pete George and YesWeDid

    That’s right, all the bloggers on the Left are charming, nice, people who never say anything nasty or vindictive. I am hearing a Tui advert coming along…

    But seriously, you’re expressing personal opinion, which is fine, but not everyone agrees with you. I am still left with a single sticking point: all we are really talking about is the fruits of criminal actions. That is what disgusts me, not that someone talks to someone ‘nasty’ or ‘vindictive’.

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  14. Batman (103 comments) says:

    This is David Cunliffe who did a Q+A session with the Standard just this past June (June 29, 2014)
    http://thestandard.org.nz/david-cunliffe-qa/

    & has written several posts on the standard!
    http://thestandard.org.nz/david-cunliffe-on-the-state-of-the-nation/

    http://thestandard.org.nz/seasons-greetings-from-david-cunliffe/

    so when he says he doesn’t deal much with blogs, does he mean right-wing blogs only? the man is a charlatan!

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  15. mikenmild (12,402 comments) says:

    Batman
    I think I heard Cunliffe on the radio this morning acknowledging those connections.

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  16. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Whats your definition of ‘rarely’ Batman ?

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  17. Razorlight (28 comments) says:

    Yeswedid

    You miss the point of the stuff article.

    Cunliffe lied by saying he has little contact with bloggers. That is cludes nice and nasty bloggers.

    In fact he has daily contact with bloggers.

    Cunliffe lied.

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  18. MT_Tinman (3,322 comments) says:

    Razorlight (48 comments) says:
    August 19th, 2014 at 11:31 am

    Cunliffe lied.

    Surely that’s like saying the sun came up this morning.

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  19. tom hunter (5,134 comments) says:

    I applaud the NZ Herald covering The Standard, but what is needed is for the Herald to publish a sample thread of their blog comments.

    It’s important that non-political people see these debates in all their glory, so that they can truly feel confident in voting for a Labour-Green-NZFirst-Dotcom/Mana government, knowing that while John Key deals with the lowest of the low, Mr Cunliffe deals with only the virtuous of the blogging community.

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  20. Alan (1,087 comments) says:

    I’m not aware of the standard, daily blog or polity seeking information of the sexual habits of politicians or jurnos (I’ll leave you to draw the obvious purpose of such data) or these sites setting out to ratfu*k people.

    To suggest a equivalence is fatuous

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  21. Pete George (23,830 comments) says:

    That Cunliffe lied or Prentice lied is one issue.

    That Key and Collins have associations with Slater and don’t sound like they want to change that or make a clear stand against at least the nasty side of Whale Oil (it has also been a ground-breaking blog) is a separate and serious issue.

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  22. tom hunter (5,134 comments) says:

    I’m not aware of….

    Key point that. Until Whaleoil’s emails were hacked by Hager we weren’t aware of him doing these things either, though it was suspected.

    Maybe you should have a chat with Madeleine Setchell. You may become more aware, even more so if Mr Presland’s emails are ever hacked.

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  23. BeaB (2,164 comments) says:

    I love the Wild West of the blogs and Whaleoil’s over-stepping the boundaries but always giving us food for thought and, usually, information we wouldn’t otherwise see for lots of self-interested (from others) reasons.
    But what an ethical muddle we now have – the media stomping all over free speech, privacy and the public right to know.
    Who would have thought the defenders of a free press would become the instrument to shut themselves down?
    We will see our freedoms curtailed because our media cannot resist snooping in people’s private lives and correspondence and supporting a money-making dirty little book.
    You just wait. If, God forbid, Labour and its socialist cronies, ever become the government, we will see draconian controls on free speech, starting with Whaleoil whom few will dare to defend (because the media complicitly will slap them about) and gradually eroding the freedoms of us all.
    This has been a frightening few days – not because of so-called dirty (perhaps a little grubby but so what, we are grown-ups and can think for ourselves, surely, as John Key keeps saying – giving us a bit of credit for having minds of our own, thank you John) politics, but because we have learned nothing is private, nothing is safe and the dark forces will grab the chance to clamp down on us.
    I say defend Whaeoil to the death. They’ll come for him first and. after him, it’s a slippery slope to a Pravda world.

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  24. burt (7,428 comments) says:

    But it’s different when Labour do it !

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  25. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    I say defend Whaeoil to the death. They’ll come for him first and. after him, it’s a slippery slope to a Pravda world.

    Oooh love the drama and empty rhetoric…bravo!!!

    How’s the weather on Planet Key?

    Cloudy with a chance of beef hooked I’d say.

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  26. Lance (2,718 comments) says:

    So no danger of this connection ever being aired on TVone news!

    Oh, that’s right, only right wing bloggers are guilty.

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  27. oldpark (412 comments) says:

    Yes in Newstalk ZB Friday 15 August between 10.15 am -11.00am On Tim Fookes show. Josie Pagani a dyed in the wool Labour Party candidate in a bye election in the Mana area a few years ago.Pagani named Three bloggers operating out of David Cunliffe’s office.Yet I watched and heard Cunliffe on TVNZ news last night say his contact with bloggers was minimal.The MSM to suit their cloth cap union infested Journalists,are loath to broadcast or print the truth that the “Standard blog site” is virtually the right hand of the Labour Party .If they are not part of Labour Party,why are they there.

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  28. Batman (103 comments) says:

    Mikenmild: did he? if that is the case, he should forthwith cease lecturing others and saying he feels the need to “take a shower”.

    BWAV: my definition of “rarely” would be something like: they don’t work in his office, they aren’t advising him or prepping him for debates. Keeping it in context of the discussion around briefing bloggers, I would hope that his direct contact would be no more than yearly

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  29. Yvette (2,763 comments) says:

    What has been stolen contains legally, politically, medically and journalistically privileged material. [For example –] now a database of unconfirmed sexual charges and convictions as it relates to teachers is out there in the control of someone that may not have the same boundaries that I do.
    – Cameron Slater

    Can Cameron Slater not seek a court injunction against publication of material referenced as being his stolen property?

    Should something untoward result from the continuing publications – say,someone fearing revelation, commit suicide, a teacher or perhaps a lawyer, politician, or mayor in further liaisons – who is legally responsible, the thief/hacker or The Herald, or media actually releasing such information.

    Also, and any possible legal action, are these emails acceptable as evidence.
    Just wondering :-)

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  30. Yvette (2,763 comments) says:

    Sorry – wrong thread – meant to be “General Debate”

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  31. Mark (1,502 comments) says:

    The problem now for National is that the political agenda that the media is currently feasting on has been wrested from National who can point to a pretty damned good track record over the last six years, have come into the election campaign quite rightly riding a wave of unprecedented support. Instead of driving the final nail into the Labour/Greens coalition nightmare Key is having to defend and fend off these allegations that are now hanging around for far longer than is comfortable.

    Putting the lies v truth argument and the fact that Hagar appears to be using illegally obtained information, to the side for the moment, we all know that the longer this hangs around the mainstream media the more damaging it becomes. The story about Hagar using stolen information, hacked from Slater is largely being ignored by the mainstream media.

    The focus now seems to the Collins – Slater relationship and the fact that Jason Ede was snooping around in the Labour website while he worked in the PM’s office. If it is true that Collins gave a public servants name to Slater then she is becoming a political liability for Key. Ede snooping around the Labour website while working in the PM’s office, fuck me what was he thinking? I have little doubt Key would have known nothing of it but surely Ede is not that naive not to expect that at some time it was going to come back and kick his arse.

    Hopefully next week will see a change in the agenda and the election campaign shifts to policies & track record as Labour and the Greens simply cannot compete in that space.

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  32. RRM (10,099 comments) says:

    It’s amazing how easily lying comes to some people. :neutral:

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  33. ShawnLH (6,693 comments) says:

    “Politicians talking to bloggers is not the issue, politicians talking to nasty vindictive bloggers like Whaleoil that is the problem.”

    What a load of ass covering crap. If you’re so blind not to see the nasty and vindictive behavior of the people who run the Standard then you have allowed blind loyalty to melt your brain.

    Moreover, one of the bloggers there, a key figure in the Labour party who blogs under a pseudonym, was instrumental in setting up Cunliffe’s secret trust!

    Wake up and smell the hypocrisy.

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  34. ShawnLH (6,693 comments) says:

    National needs to go after Cunliffe on this, and keep up the questions about his lying, Presland, and the connection to his secret trust.

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  35. ross411 (906 comments) says:

    YesWeDid (1,039 comments) says:
    August 19th, 2014 at 11:15 am
    Politicians talking to bloggers is not the issue, politicians talking to nasty vindictive bloggers like Whaleoil that is the problem.

    Whaleoil sets out to destroy people, Judith Collins is friends with him, John Key has some contact with him.

    If you don’t get that then you have missed what this whole damn thing is about.

    You know this is provably dishonest.

    However vile Whaleoil is, The Standard is just as bad. Cunliffe sanctions it, and employs and communicates with it. This is not just public knowledge, it’s above in the main text blogged.

    I’ve linked to it. Anyone doubtful can go there and read the posts, and comments. It’s filled with horrible nasty comments, and anyone who goes there can see it. Unless they approve of it, when targeted towards people they do not like.

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  36. flash2846 (289 comments) says:

    I am no longer a fan of Cameron Slater but I can see the MSM bending over backwards to damage him as well as the government. It shows me that blogs are gaining popularity at MSM’s expense and they know it.

    Also, if Cunliffe makes any statement we can safely assume it is a lie. Nothing new there.

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  37. rangitoto (264 comments) says:

    Cunliffe had a golden opportunity to shut his gob and sit back and gain some credit. Instead he is a complete doofus.

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  38. Pete George (23,830 comments) says:

    However vile Whaleoil is, The Standard is just as bad.

    I don’t agree with that. I’ve had quite a bit of experience with both. Different types of bad.

    As far as commenters go, The Standard is far worse. If deemed not one of the left sect one is deemed an enemy and as a result you can be hounded and harassed by a mob until they drive you away of engineer a ban. Repetitively lying is one of a number of tactics (used by some here too).

    But at the blog/author level Slater is significantly worse as car as lashing out and trying to damage people. A rant and lecture from lprent is pale in comparison.

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  39. David Garrett (7,701 comments) says:

    Anyone who thinks Slater is any worse than the Standard clearly hasn’t been there enough…I know, it’s not pleasant, but you cant make valid comparisons otherwise.

    Another key point for me is that – aside perhaps from Prentice and Presland – NONE of the contributors to The Standard use their own names. I know I am in a minority on this point, but in general I believe anonymous contributions are about as valid as anonymous letters to the editor, and no newspaper worthy of the name has used those for more than 20 years.

    Both on Whaleoil and here, every knows who the contributors – if not those commenting – are…DPF may allow anonymous guest posters occasionally, I can’t recall right now. Wasn’t there some anonymous Australian whose posts were so badly received he quietly disappeared?

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  40. ross411 (906 comments) says:

    To whit, the point of badness of both parties The Standard and Whaleoil. Whereby references to badness will not be taken to mean the same kind of badness, or to an exact comparable measurable extent, but rather the presence of badness of an undesirable kind to a minimum extent. It is asserted that both parties aforementioned are bad in ways not necessarily directly related, to that minimum extent, so far as to summarise that:

    They’re both unethical and either delusional, or misleading intentionally.

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  41. Lance (2,718 comments) says:

    @David Garrett

    Did you shower afterwards :-)

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  42. Lucia Maria (2,654 comments) says:

    BeaB

    I say defend Whaeoil to the death. They’ll come for him first and. after him, it’s a slippery slope to a Pravda world.

    I think you are right.

    Laila Harré did say to Sean Plunkett the other day in an interview that it would be a good outcome if the WhaleOil blog was shutdown as a result of all of this.

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  43. Inthisdress (324 comments) says:

    But isn’t it time to start joining the dots?
    We know that Hager had illegally-accessed material whihc he published a la Da Vinci Code as a plausible but baseless suppostion.
    We know that Bomber Bradbury had prior knowledge of the publication of Dirty Politics.
    We know that a policy-light Labour Party has gone with ‘Vote Positive’
    We know that Cunliffe denies links to Bloggers.
    We know that The Standard is poulated by people close to Cunliffe.
    We know that the Whale-dump is part of an organised strategy to leak information and influence the election-result.

    So we have an established team of internet-savvy people with links to Labour colluding with Hager and getting traction in the media from a series of carefully ‘leaked’ illegally-gained information sources, and a major politician making a big deal about his plausible deniability.

    As Karl Marx always asked: ‘Who benefits from this?”

    And yet, for some reason, no one in the media is interested, perhaps becasue it isn’t being pointed out to them. Surely some kind of public enquiry into both the Nats and Labour is in order, and Key should call one right now.

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  44. David Garrett (7,701 comments) says:

    Black: If you were brave enough to use your own name perhaps your comments would be less than worthless than they are now…As it is you’re just a waste space…both here and probably also in your real world life.

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  45. RRM (10,099 comments) says:

    It just goes from bad to worse on the left.

    DPF, apparently you’re a rapist and borderline pedo now:

    http://thestandard.org.nz/no-changes-for-kiwiblog/#comment-869553

    I can see that Nicky Hager is being very careful not to name names, knowing the severity of the potential criminal charges that could arise. Unless I’m misreading this, Farrar’s use of alcohol to make young women (has he checked their ages?) sexually compliant by stupefying them makes Farrar himself a potential suspect in a conspiracy to commit rape.

    A couple of questions for the Penguin: what are the ages of the young women at your “Princess Parties”? Since you know that sexual predators were conspiring to get these women drunk with the aim of having non-consensual sex, i.e., to rape them, why did you not shut down your sickeningly-euphemised “Princess Parties” and alert the police to their declared intentions?

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  46. burt (7,428 comments) says:

    In the new socialist world order The Standard will be our only news source. Just like the good old days when socialist government completely controlled the MSM and people loved all the good news about how socialism was serving them.

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  47. mikenmild (12,402 comments) says:

    Back again on the pseudonyms, David?

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  48. Pete George (23,830 comments) says:

    Another key point for me is that – aside perhaps from Prentice and Presland – NONE of the contributors to The Standard use their own names.

    That’s not correct. Mike Smith and Stephanie Rodgers use their own names – and both happen to have connections to Labour, the former as general secretary of the party and adviser to Shearer in his leader’s office last year, and the latter as a former staffer and now works for EPMU. Stephanie is the only one who in a round about way (via her own blog) has a disclosure (except for some hidden in historical comment).

    I know I am in a minority on this point, but in general I believe anonymous contributions are about as valid as anonymous letters to the editor, and no newspaper worthy of the name has used those for more than 20 years.

    Many people with pseudonyms make very good contributions to blogs they wouldn’t otherwise do under their own names. There are good reasons for remaining anonymous. Commenting under your own name opens you to a lot more personal abuse and accusations and lies – and risks.

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  49. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    burt (7,938 comments) says:

    August 19th, 2014 at 1:42 pm

    In the new socialist world order The Standard will be our only news source. Just like the good old days when socialism completely controlled the MSM and people loved all the good news about how socialism was serving them.

    ****

    A good point Burt….and it was not too long ago that Departments controlled what went out on radio news.

    As posted on Kiwiblog changes today:

    **** As The Outside the Beltway Group said in January 2012:
    “The Press Council could do with an overhaul, as could the Broadcasting Standards Authority (which in its present form is simply a throwback to the days following the New Zealand Broadcasting Service) so that they better reflect 2011-2012 . Tinkering may be in order, but we detect no voting-public demand for State intervention. There was a time in New Zealand when all radio news bulletins were subject to Government scrutiny (and editing). Once on that slippery slope (again) it is devilishly hard to stop.

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  50. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Oh thats just it Garrett and the difference between us.

    I know my comments here are less than worthless, you’ve somehow deluded yourself into thinking yours aren’t.

    but really…

    bet you think your life is worth shit too.

    but really…

    You’re just killing time and wasting space as much as any other fool on here does thinking they’re making a difference.

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  51. burt (7,428 comments) says:

    Black with a Vengeance

    However you could be replaced by a robot commenting three comments;

    It’s different when Labour do it.
    Others do it to.
    It’s time to move on.

    Occasionally you get lost in the noise from the “Judith” robot posting “I hate John Key” – so you might need to consider having more to say than your 3 staples.

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  52. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    RRM (9,575 comments) says:

    August 19th, 2014 at 1:41 pm

    It just goes from bad to worse on the left.

    DPF, apparently you’re a rapist and borderline pedo now
    ****

    But RRM, surely that is just the sort of thing that is never said, or implied, by the good ship CminusT, and his lolly pops.

    Because it is on the Standard, CminusT cannot run away… but watch the MSM give him a free pass.

    Bastards, all.

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  53. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Close to 8000 comments Burt and i bet pretty much all espousing the same irrational anti Labour rhetoric.

    zzzz…what are you really scared of Burt ?

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  54. ross411 (906 comments) says:

    Black with a Vengeance (1,599 comments) says:
    August 19th, 2014 at 2:12 pm
    Close to 8000 comments Burt and i bet pretty much all espousing the same irrational anti Labour rhetoric.

    zzzz…what are you really scared of Burt ?

    I don’t know Burt, but I can imagine that he like me is likely scared of people who can only see criticism constructive or not of Labour, as irrational anti Labour rhetoric. The fundamentalist advocates, like yourself.

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  55. Pdubyah (23 comments) says:

    ….. and Boom!!

    own goal !!!

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  56. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    It is interesting that Pundit has not updated their “poll of polls” since July 21, notwithstanding a raft of published polls since then.

    But their poll of polls, has been crafted by none other than, according to Pundit :

    “….This poll of polls was adapted for the New Zealand context by Rob Salmond, then of the University of Michigan….”

    Now would it surprise folks to know that the very same Salmond was in evidence at every turn when then the CminusT party held its “congress” a few ago ? (let’s ignore the fact that they have no democratic annual meeting.)

    And would it surprise that the same Salmond is a known associate of CminusT.

    But CminusT, and his left wing colleagues (are they colleagues or fellow roaches?) never have anything to do with blogs, do they???

    Yeaah, right.

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  57. AJP (21 comments) says:

    I don’t care about the Left1
    I could not give it a hooter about the Standard or any of the other leftwing blogs / bloggers!
    What I care about is that Slater, Collins and Ede have inflicted serious damage to the National Party.

    The only honourable thing Collins should have done is to resign immediately from all her positions to prevent the whole saga to be played out in the media right up to election day.
    People need to remember that a lot of people make up their minds whom to vote for only on election day.

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  58. Jinky (190 comments) says:

    This is childish BS. “But they started it” or “they’re doing it as well”. It’s crap whoever is doing it. For some of our senior politicians to state quite openly that “this is normal politics, all the parties do this kind of thing” is an indictment on all of them. No wonder so many people don’t bother voting. How do we change it? Any constructive ideas?

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  59. thedavincimode (6,890 comments) says:

    I believe anonymous contributions are about as valid as anonymous letters to the editor

    I disagree entirely DG; anonymously of course :P

    Edit: In fact, apropos of a subsequent thread on being offended, I HEREBY TAKE OFFENCE AT YOUR COMMENT!!!

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  60. dog_eat_dog (787 comments) says:

    Jesus Christ, that thread at The Standard has some of the most borderline defamatory comments I think I’ve ever seen.

    High grounds be damned, etc.

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  61. Mark (1,502 comments) says:

    DED the Standard has never been high ground.

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