General Debate 18 August 2014

August 18th, 2014 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
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351 Responses to “General Debate 18 August 2014”

  1. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  2. Souvlaki (48 comments) says:

    Remember folks….a vote for Labour is essentially a vote for Dotcom!

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  3. redqueen (597 comments) says:

    @Souvlaki

    So true :(

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  4. hj (7,184 comments) says:

    1)This election: what a cock up. The Greens positive campaign reminds me of the raucus Helen Clark : “I what a New Zealand where…” We know what happened next. The Greens propose free fertiliser to the Pacific Island population.
    2) Anti racism means you aren’t allowed to exercise your imagination in a way that attributes any negative outcomes to yourself (or your group) from another group. If race is a component the idea must be rejected, yet this is how we survived. Holding a negative thought doesn’t mean you are capable of balance. I was thinking of this post

    Cactus Kate proving very quotable. “Those Chinese can be very vicious when they lose face … Chop chop for Nicky.”
    “Like a lot of the rest of the book that email was just private chatter and banter between various people on emails where absolutely nothing else happened as a consequence,”

    Nothing happened except put your sad, vile truths on display, CK. Racism doesn’t stop being disgusting just because it’s private.

    http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11309750

    and this:

    http://thestandard.org.nz/farrar-shills-for-nzs-most-racist-academic/

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  5. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “Remember folks….a vote for Labour is essentially a vote for Dotcom!”

    They don’t like it up `em.

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  6. holysheet (475 comments) says:

    I did the vote compass last night.
    According to it I should be voting for ACT, but no way after Whytes stupid outburst last week.

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  7. mister nui (1,030 comments) says:

    When will the disgusting communists, Norman and Turei, realise that earning 140k is not wealthy. FFS, on a global level NZD600k is about a “wealthy” income.

    Would it be cynical to note that their new hatred of the rich tax kicks in just above what they will earn?

    We owe it to this great country to make sure this pack of bastards gets below 5% and they are therefore starved of oxygen.

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  8. 2clever4U (20 comments) says:

    Blue, Red, Green, Yellow and Brown, what a silly lot. They stand, run, try to climb, sink and swim and get caught on the hop, when all they really want to do is sit.

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  9. Tauhei Notts (1,688 comments) says:

    Pete George; I disagree with your comment that the interview was compelling.
    John Key was disappointing. He should have stopped the interview for ten seconds to allow Guyon Espiner time to wipe the froth from his mouth.

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  10. mister nui (1,030 comments) says:

    I did the compass too, holysheet, and surprise surprise, I also got ACT…

    What was the outburst from Whyte that has turned you off them?

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  11. 2clever4U (20 comments) says:

    Tax capital gain from house inflation, not earned income.

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  12. mjw (401 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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  13. Nukuleka (405 comments) says:

    A deliberate campaign of anti Semitism, the burning of effigies, an ongoing smear campaign. the object of alcohol-fuelled obscenities and the illegal hacking of emails- John Key has been subjected to an ongoing nasty campaign of the sort we have not seen before in the country. And the media buy into the left’s message that John Key is somehow the perpetrator of all that is wrong with our political malaise!

    It is time for National to seize the initiative and to start running the narrative. Hopefully this will begin with the campaign opening in the Labour stronghold of Manukau this coming weekend. A strong positive message and policies that resonate with middle New Zealand. Sideline the Hagers and Dotcoms and take control.

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  14. duggledog (1,628 comments) says:

    Life imitates art on Radio Live this morning –

    Marcus Lush interviews Tem Morrison about the documentary on Once Were Warriors, who’s where now:

    ‘My screen daughter Grace, she’s a solo mum with four kids in Cairns now…’

    Looking forward to the doc, should be good.

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  15. macdee (47 comments) says:

    Brilliant interview by John Key PG, held his ground, calm and rational in the face of an ever increasing high pitched irrational ‘attack’ from Espiner, much as he did with Campbell, JK really is Mr Cool and in a league of his own, TN he did suggest that Espiner take a deep breath

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  16. Brian Smaller (3,966 comments) says:

    The flaw in the Greens policy to ‘solve’ child poverty is that no matter how much money is thrown at the ‘problem’, the way poverty is calculated means that the impoverished will still be impoverished. Not one MSM ‘analyst’ or commentator has noted that having poverty defined as a percentage of average income will forever ensure that a certain number will be poor, even if they do have all the food they need, a roof, warmth, big screen TV, playstation, free education, dentists for their kids etc etc etc.

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  17. oldpark (412 comments) says:

    The Green/Labour sychophants parties and MSM infested with cloth capped unionists,demanding a payback for their massive donations,have gotten themselves into a Schizofrantic mind set.

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  18. mjw (401 comments) says:

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  19. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    “Solving child poverty” will create an even bigger underclass that will need even more taxes to keep it in the lifestyle to which it has become accustomed. Welfare and a lack of personal responsiblity is the problem. There is only relative poverty and that being the case ,the relatively poor will always be with us.

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  20. hj (7,184 comments) says:

    I think about the best commentator on important issues in NZ is Gareth Morgan. He pays researchers and he is completely independent; you can’t say that bout (NZIER, NZ Initiative, etc, etc).

    Having said that everyone has an ideology (world view). Maybe we should start with an explanation of the basic ideology and attribute the views to each ideology?

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  21. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    Nukuleka says at 8:26 am

    “And the media buy into the left’s message that John Key is somehow the perpetrator of all that is wrong with our political malaise!”
    (Don’t forget the theft and break-ins a National Party office, Judith Collins office and the stolen emails from Slater and Farrar)

    The MSM is not buying into it, it is part of the campaign.
    They have to shut down the bloggers!

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  22. Simon (785 comments) says:

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  23. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    kowtow says at 8:36 am

    The answer of the ‘Greens’ is always MORE taxes and MORE regulations.
    The question doesn’t really matter.

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  24. flash2846 (289 comments) says:

    So a couple work hard and study hard most of their life. They decide they want a big family and produce eight children. They need all the money they can earn and therefore work even harder missing out on quality time with their children.

    Now along come the Green/Labour mess and Wammo! our lovely family have more of their money taken from them to give to drop kicks who are frankly incapable of raising decent human beings.
    Our lovely couple must work harder missing out more time with their kids while their money provides for dropkicks to spend more time with their children influencing them in all things “dropkick”

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  25. mister nui (1,030 comments) says:

    The reason not one MSM “analyst” or commentator has noted the flaws in the commies policies Brian Smaller, is that many of them aren’t smart enough to do so. They will, for the most part, support it as for most of them 140k is a dreamy salary that they have no chance of ever obtaining. Well, they might do under a Green Finance Minister, as he will print so much money, a loaf of bread will cost 140k…..

    It would be interesting to know what the commie sympathiser, John Campbell’s salary is, then we could work out his new amount of tax under his golden children – I do wonder if he would then still support them as much as he does?

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  26. Steve (North Shore) (4,538 comments) says:

    Squeal you lefties, your rollercoaster is about to start again – dropping shit all over the place

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  27. Scott Chris (6,178 comments) says:

    Key is avoiding responsibility, he is complicit at least by association.

    No Key is doing what he does well – using his poker face and conceding nothing.

    I suspect most National inclined voters will feel reassured by this and dismiss Hagar’s dot joining as being much ado about nothing.

    Personally I’d like to see Key publicly distance himself from Slater and his vindictively narcissistic cronies and publicly tell Judith Collins to pull her stupid head in (I mean, why the fuck would she deal personally with Slater rather than have some functionary dish out the dirt?) but I’m guessing he’s already done this – albeit discreetly.

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  28. mjw (401 comments) says:

    Other_Andy – party vote Labour then!

    Today the PM made it crystal clear he is more interested in power than he is in standards or ethics. He can’t take action because it might hurt him in the polls. So the line is clear – vote National and that is what you get.

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  29. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Earning 140k is not wealthy.

    hahahaha…GTFOH!!!

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  30. smttc (767 comments) says:

    mjw, don’t talk rubbish. Key was reasonably restrained and composed in the face of Espiner ranting and raving.

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  31. Simon (785 comments) says:

    Another reason not to vote National is rid of that useless clown Peter Dunne. Fuck he is worse than useless. Complete tool.

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  32. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    My take on the current Whaleoil soap opera.

    A case study on what happens when a useful idiot outlives their usefulness.

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  33. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    mjw
    Pete George
    So after hearing the interview on RNZ (the Radiolive one was very similar) you will be expecting to see Andrea Vance’s column on here. Vance is one regularly quoted as if her opinion were important. Is it? Like today’s lot?

    “There comes a point when a politician’s over-reliance on plausible deniability becomes simply implausible.
    John Key is well past that point with his absolute refusal to accept accountability for the allegations made in Nicky Hager’s Dirty Politics book.
    He moved into the farcical yesterday, on many counts. The first was his apparent ignorance that spin doctor Jason Ede still roams the corridors of Parliament, using a staff swipe card…”

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  34. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    No Key is doing what he does well – using his poker face and conceding nothing.

    I suspect most National inclined voters will feel reassured by this and dismiss Hagar’s dot joining as being much ado about nothing.

    I think Hager’s dot joining is disgraceful but how Key handles it could easily be the deciding factor in the election. It will only take two or three percent to switch their vote left to defeat Key, or a percent or two more to give up in disgust and not vote.

    Key misread the cup of tea crap last election and nearly paid dearly. He’s taking a huge risk on this.

    Besides, we badly need strong leadership against escalating dirty politics. We’re not getting it.

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  35. Dave Mann (1,246 comments) says:

    @Pete: Thanks for the RNZ link. I have been very rude about John Key in the past on this blog and I have got demerits for calling him a cunt….. but in the last few months I have begun to change my opinion of the man. He performed well in this interview and, for all LabourLite’s faults, I think the alternatives are too horrible to contemplate. Maybe if LabourLite can govern alone this time they won’t have to water everything down to cater for the lowest common denominator.

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  36. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

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  37. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    Greens aren’t lily-clean in this either. They have strongly condemned the accessing of unsecured data – and laid a police complaint – but have been silent on the illegal political hacking of Slater’s (and possibly others) data.

    They are in effect condoning political hacking as long as it suits their agenda.

    Green Farm: Data privacy is paramount unless it helps us score political hits.

    Greens condone dirty political hacking

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  38. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    doggone7 says:

    “John Key is well past that point with his absolute refusal to accept accountability for the allegations made in Nicky Hager’s Dirty Politics book.”

    OK, allegations, I get it…

    Now you tell me doggone7, have you stopped beating your wife yet?

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  39. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Flip a coin PG…

    One man’s dirty political hacker is another man’s righteous whistleblower.

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  40. IGM (622 comments) says:

    Why is the doctrine of snivelling lefties to bring decent hardworking and successful people down to their leeching and lazy level. One would have thought it everyone’s goal to work hard, succeed, and have some self esteem, but watching Labour/Greens, I am once again wrong. I had reason to travel to Naenae on Sunday, and was astounded at the condition of our state houses: unmown lawns, wrecks on the grounds, kids all over the place, and the person I was after (repossessed his car for the 3rd and final time), standing outside a rough looking pub smoking. These overbreeding losers will never work, have no intention of working, but will vote for anything that may penalise the successful . . . the ones who are now keeping them in privileged positions for no effort. I am awaiting the uproar if their mates get into power, have our credit rating dropped, drive off investors, have businesses leave, and unemployment in the 20-30% region. When they can’t pay benefits, supporting these vermin, there will be a riot, and there will be no one interested in doing anything to help them. I can’t wait.

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  41. Scott Chris (6,178 comments) says:

    Besides, we badly need strong leadership against escalating dirty politics. We’re not getting it.

    Don’t you mean we should put the dirty politics back in the closet where it’s always been?

    I don’t really think there’s been an escalation, just that the garbologists and muck-rakers are operating more overtly these days.

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  42. Neil (577 comments) says:

    People are getting involved too much in the minutae, what is happening is the full scale attempted destruction of John Key. Break that concept, National are extremely vulnerable.
    Remember to ask a question that Ronald Reagan asked people in the 1980 election against Jimmy Carter. “Are you better off than four years ago?” The Left don’t want a positive discussion about NZ today and 2008. They want the campaign submkerged in dirt, trying to give the impression that they are not involved. This has the fingers of Matt McCarten,the Greens,Dot Com all over it. This plan has been on the burner for the last three months- hence the Votew Positive claim by the Labour party.
    Key and National have to get the discussion back to economic recovery,welfare reform(Paula Bennett was marvellous yesterday on Q&A) lower unemployment and other positives.
    This is the only way the left can win. Their policies are recipies for inflation,higher unemployment and reduced economic growth.

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  43. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    Other_Andy

    She’ll stop beating me when you acknowledge you’ve not read the Vance column from today. Funny how the suggestion about reading a newspaper column could get someone to allege violence.

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  44. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

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  45. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Why is the doctrine of snivelling lefties to bring decent hardworking and successful people down to their leeching and lazy level…

    These overbreeding losers will never work, have no intention of working, but will vote for anything that may penalise the successful

    Did some random on the spot polling did you ?

    …or are you just making shit up ?

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  46. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    The fallout from Hagars book will be felt right up to the election and bury them. Greenwald and 2 mystery guest’s revelations on the 15th will be the epitaph. There will be no resurrection.

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  47. jcuk (760 comments) says:

    I am glad I didn’t switch on the radio and only heard the replays of that objectionable man on Morning Report acting childishly when he was supposed to be interviewing the PM …. I may be a socialist but I know what is best for the country … and early on after my arrival I learnt what a small country this is with quite a few small minds.

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  48. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    I don’t really think there’s been an escalation.

    Slater and DPF have claimed the political hacking, burglaries and employee leaking is an unacceptable escalation. I think what Slater has been doing was already often unacceptable – and Key is tainted by that by an association he won’t break or denounce.

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  49. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    This is the only way the left can win. Their policies are recipies for inflation,higher unemployment and reduced economic growth.

    inflation, higher unemployment and reduced economic growth are indicative of a failing consumer capitalist system.

    It’s got fuck all to do with the left winning.

    but hey, dont let me interrupt your morning rant. You’re on a fucking roll!!!

    ride it cowboy….yeeeehawww

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  50. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    Irony of the day:

    Needless to say, we don’t do obscene illegal, undemocratic and arrogant crap like this on the left, especially on this site. But it is what we have come to expect from National and it’s sockpuppets.

    http://thestandard.org.nz/cameron-slater-dirties-john-key-or-vice-versa

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  51. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    jcuk

    I heard the interview. Those situations are like the tv experience. The interviewer ostensibly wants to find out what the truth is, the interviewee wants to tell people what he/she wants them to believe the truth is.

    So we end up in the limited time slot of people talking over each other.

    The example this morning was brilliant. (As a example.) The PM did not want to answer the questions the interviewer asked but wanted to say other stuff. Make a speech? If the person being interviewed wants to make a speech they should take out paid time slots on the radio (tv) stations. If they don’t want to answer the questions and won’t answer the questions, the radio station should not invite them on. Then there’ll be the lament about lack of accountability. The views of what is happening, the ‘truth’, will be through bloggers. And of course people like Hager who write books.

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  52. Razorlight (28 comments) says:

    I think we all have a fairly good indication of what Kim Dotcom will reveal one week from election.

    He obviously has further stolen emails that are more damaging than the ones Hager has used.

    Who knows what the German crook may have found. His liberty is on the line so he will do anything to stay.

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  53. Paulus (2,712 comments) says:

    How sad for RNZ who obviously support this mornings interview by Guyon Espiner with the Prime Minister.
    To say the least the utter rudeness and bad manners is appalling irrespective of the subject matter.
    If he had dared to subject Helen Clark in such a manner he would be toast.
    I find it sad that this is a major Radio national station that obviously allows such a disgusting manner.
    Guyon – It is not clever – your screaming did you no good – I think you should go on a Anger Management programme to learn to control your attitude.
    Had I allowed my children to speak in such a manner they would soon learn that there are consequences.
    You file is probably marked – so you can try for a Labour list seat in 2017.

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  54. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    Paulus

    All that upset you would have been avoided if the Prime Minister had simply answered the questions.

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  55. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    Oh you lefties are so funny.

    “Nat’s finished, Nat’s doomed, Nat’s will get no votes at all, Nat’s are scum”.. blaa blaa blaa.

    Do you seriously believe the swing voters will get into the polling booth, think about the alternative of a coalition with Hone-Harawera and Dotcom and not throw up in their mouths?

    Do you also realize that a supposed Labour govt would have something like 22% support.
    If that is not the death of MMP I don’t know what is and to say the tail would wag the dog would be an understatement.
    All the Nat’s have to do is point this horror story out during the debates.
    Try as the lefties might, there is no escaping this.

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  56. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    To say the least the utter rudeness and bad manners is appalling irrespective of the subject matter.

    oh righto old chap toodle pip eh whut whut ?

    GTFOH…its about time they started holding the slippery, smilng, waving, no account, lying sack of spittle to some measure of accountability for his selective amnesia.

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  57. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    doggone7 says at 9:23 am

    “The interviewer ostensibly wants to find out what the truth is…..”

    You are either very gullible or plain silly.

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  58. iMP (2,457 comments) says:

    the FERGUSON SHOOTING in St Louis has just taken an interesting turn after all the race-based activisits (incl. Obama) have jumped over this without all the facts. This video -following the CCTV of the guy robbing the store – is going viral. It’s from an eye witness, which says the victim had a gun, ran from police, then turned and ran back at them before being shot.

    http://youngcons.com/a-witness-was-unknowingly-recorded-at-ferguson-shooting-scene-changes-everything/

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  59. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    doggone7 says:

    “All that upset you would have been avoided if the Prime Minister had simply answered the questions.”

    That reminds me doggone7, answer the question, have you stopped beating your wife yet?

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  60. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    I wonder why BWAV is back again, more profane and intense than ever?

    Something must be going wrong, or about to go wrong with the far lefts agenda.
    Do tell us BWAV, maybe we can help fix it.

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  61. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    Other_Andy

    Most interviewers want to find the truth. If you don’t believe that you are gullible, silly or have a level of cynicism which would suggest that no re-programming of your mind could offer hope.

    (Except for Mike Hosking!)

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  62. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    When is PM John Key going to stop defending the indefensible actions of his Minister of Justice Judith Collins and stand her down for not ‘exhibiting the highest ethical standards’ as required in the Cabinet Manual – to which he as Prime Minister is supposed to hold her accountable?

    What sort of Prime Minister is John Key?

    Oh – that’s right – one who learned his ‘ethics’ from Wall Street, as the former Head of (dodgy) derivatives at Merrill Lynch?

    Penny Bright

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  63. Tom Barker (150 comments) says:

    “Are you better off than four years ago?”

    No – significantly worse off, by a variety of measures.

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  64. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    Other_Andy

    That proves it – I knew I’d get you into reading Vance!

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  65. hj (7,184 comments) says:

    These overbreeding losers will never work, have no intention of working, but will vote for anything that may penalise the successful

    It is the year 2014. The Government claims NZ needs a bigger population, so they are part of the problem. Really, manufacturing requires fewer and fewer, farming requires fewer people, the sector that needs people is construction (building roads schools and houses for migrants. The Greens who are supposed to represent the sciences say one thing and do another on population (being a chimera party).

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  66. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Lance (2,506 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 9:40 am
    Oh you lefties are so funny.

    “Nat’s finished, Nat’s doomed, Nat’s will get no votes at all, Nat’s are scum”.. blaa blaa blaa.

    Do you seriously believe the swing voters will get into the polling booth,

    Well that just depends doesn’t it – because one of the main assertions in Hager’s book is that the campaign of dirty politics makes left and swinging voters not vote in general elections. That is exactly why Slater has been leading the charge (under orders).

    However, now that has been exposed – how do you think those people who have been used as pawns in the game are going to feel? Especially if enough of them are made aware of the ultimate agenda to influence them not to vote, so that the right wins? I have a feeling that it might very well work against ‘the dirty politics’ gang, especially if enough get to read Hager’s book.

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  67. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    I wonder why BWAV is back again, more profane and intense than ever?

    I wouldn’t say more.

    If anything, i’d say i’m slightly more restrained.

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  68. minus (233 comments) says:

    High Court judge, Justice Helen Winkelmann, has ruled that the book “The Secret Life of Kim Dotcom: Spies, Lies and the War” written by a New Zealand Herald journalist about internet tycoon Kim Dotcom is not “news activity” and does not get special legal protections of journalists to protect their source.

    DPF, Cameron Slater, Justice Minister Judith Collins and others mentioned in “Dirty Politics” should ask the Courts to similarly require Hager to reveal how he had emails stolen from these people.

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  69. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    I wonder why BWAV is back again, more profane and intense than ever?

    Blood in the water.

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  70. Ross12 (1,488 comments) says:

    PG

    In your view what should JK have said, about the Hager book, to Espiner ??

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  71. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    DPF, Cameron Slater, Justice Minister Judith Collins and others mentioned in “Dirty Politics” should ask the Courts to similarly require Hager to reveal how he had emails stolen from these people.

    Slater has already suggested this may be done. In the meantime Hager says he has given all data back to his source so he can’t be required to hand any over.

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  72. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    Ross
    Perhaps he could have answered the questions about Judith Collins’s involvement, rather than saying he didn’t know the details about that and then going on to imply that he was too busy with the election campaign to ask about it.

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  73. Don the Kiwi (1,821 comments) says:

    I see all the useful idiots are breathless and salivating over the theif Nicky Hager and his pack of totally underwhelming “relevations”.

    If anything is dirty politics, its this book. Hager is a thief and should be prosecuted. He is a left wing nut job who sees a conspiracy in every action of those on the political right, while covering up and being in denial of any misdeeds by the left.

    Anyone who takes this book seriously really needs to see a psychologist/psychiatrist.

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  74. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    In your view what should JK have said, about the Hager book, to Espiner ??

    That dirty politics – whether by National, Labour, Slater, Hager or whoever – is not acceptable in modern politics and he will do what he can to distance himself from it and promote honour and decency to our democracy.

    If he made a stand against dirty politics I think it would do far more to improve his election chances than his shrugging denials and fobbing off disgraceful political behaviour that turns off and disgusts many voters – and many MPs.

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  75. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    ‘Anyone who takes this book seriously really needs to see a psychologist/psychiatrist’
    Talking about the Bible again, Don?

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  76. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    He is a left wing nut job who sees a conspiracy in every action of those on the political right, while covering up and being in denial of any misdeeds by the left.

    Fuck , you’re a good little muppet aren’t you, Don the Kiwi ?

    Toeing the party line, regurgitating the faithful spin…

    …keep calm and carry on.

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  77. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    Pete George says at 10:04 am

    “That dirty politics – If he made a stand against dirty politicsdisgraceful political behavior that turns off and disgusts many voters – and many MPs.”

    What is the ‘dirty politics’ you keep on mentioning PG?

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  78. ross411 (906 comments) says:

    Judith (8,160 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 9:51 am
    I have a feeling that it might very well work against ‘the dirty politics’ gang, especially if enough get to read Hager’s book.

    Your posts are an exercise in dirty politics. Always claiming some fact, which is not as solid as you pretend, and you never back it up with detail.

    Here you wave around the book as more factual than the bible, never questioning it’s undeniable truths. Care to comment on that for a change?

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  79. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Don the Kiwi (1,628 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 10:02 am

    So if Hager stole the material, it must therefore exist – and therefore it is true — which kind of makes your argument at little invalid in the bigger picture, doesn’t it?

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  80. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    Anyone who takes this book seriously really needs to see a psychologist/psychiatrist

    Says someone who fingers his beads and mumbles to himself.

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  81. ross411 (906 comments) says:

    Pete George (23,079 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 10:04 am
    If he made a stand against dirty politics I think it would do far more to improve his election chances than his shrugging denials and fobbing off disgraceful political behaviour that turns off and disgusts many voters – and many MPs.

    Yes, Pete George thinks… therefore.. It’s settled. From your lips to John Key’s ear, you’re guaranteeing everything you claim will work out the way you say it will. You and Judith should run off into the sunset holding hands singing kumbaya.

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  82. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ ross411 (263 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 10:11 am

    So what you are saying is that you feel challenged and a little bit vulnerable by people that have different opinions to you, and this makes you really angry?

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  83. muggins (3,832 comments) says:

    Just thought I would post this letter that appeared in the Dompost this morning.

    ” I’m hacked off with Hager, hacked off with hackers, hacked off with the cold weather,hacked off with my hacking cough, hacked off with politicians. I think I will hike off and look for some warmer weather and return after the elections”.

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  84. Don the Kiwi (1,821 comments) says:

    You really are a useless POS aren’t you MM.

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  85. hj (7,184 comments) says:

    hj (6,568 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 8:40 am

    I think about the best commentator on important issues in NZ is Gareth Morgan. He pays researchers and he is completely independent; you can’t say that bout (NZIER, NZ Initiative, etc, etc).

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 13
    ….
    Congratulations to the person who got that right!

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  86. adc (558 comments) says:

    Other_Andy I don’t think doggone gets what you’re trying to do there by calling him to answer to allegations.

    doggone, do you think a prime minister should spend time and effort answering to any and all allegations, or spend time and effort running the country. Thjere must be a decision made somewhere on where to draw the line, and what allegations have something to answer to or not.

    I agree he could handle some of the things a lot better, like better refuting of the ridiculous claims about hacking / infiltrating the labour website. As much infiltration went on then as I am doing now posting this comment.

    I dream of a land where journos have more than 3 brain cells, and can call politicians to task over outrageous statements, instead of regurgitating them verbatim, or being partisans. The Herald is about as low as it gets at the moment.

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  87. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    Don the Kiwi: “Anyone who takes this book seriously really needs to see a psychologist/psychiatrist.”

    They could possibly take with them the apologists for John Key. Drop them off at the olfactologist. It’s like he’s done something in his pants and they can’t smell it.

    Worse than that are those that can smell it but they don’t want to recognise it. They can’t be dropped off at the Delusionist because they are actually delutionist themselves. They can carry on to the psychologist to get sorted.

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  88. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    Well, PG, on the Espinder-Key match, having one to the link, I have to say it was compelling for only one reason – it confirmed a view that I have long held that Red Radio, and other MSM circa 2014, are simply left wing labour/red melon shills.

    I remind you PG, that when Espinder tried that same technique on K Ruud (Q+A), Rudd slapped him down.

    Key deserves the “Medal of jurno/pollie Honour”, for giving Espinder just one kick – “take a deep breath…..”

    Had it been me, and I have been subjected to hard-nosed media interviews, I would have told Espinder to take his microphone and shove it up his bright red arse.

    A bloody disgraceful performance. But then that is why I do not bother to listen to Red Radio – ever.

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  89. Don the Kiwi (1,821 comments) says:

    It didn’t take long for the usual useful idiots to appear, did it. :-)

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  90. Fletch (6,532 comments) says:

    A breaking story today on Brendan Malone’s The Leading Edge blog. A new website was launched yesterday called ‘My Decision’ aimed at naming and shaming doctors in NZ, “who exercise their legal right to freedom of conscience by not participating in abortion referrals, or not prescribing chemical contraceptives like The Pill.” The only problem is that it is a front for Abortion Law Reform Association of NZ (ALRANZ) , so not as impartial as they would have you believe.

    Yesterday a group calling themselves My Decision launched a new website aimed at naming and shaming any NZ doctors (and crisis pregnancy centres) who exercise their legal right to freedom of conscience by not participating in abortion referrals, or not prescribing chemical contraceptives like The Pill.

    There’s just one problem – when I did a background check into this website I discovered that mydecision.org.nz is actually nothing more than a front website that is being deceptively operated by the Abortion Law Reform Association of NZ (ALRANZ) to target NZ doctors who don’t share their political and ideological views.

    A simple domain registration check revealed that the website is officially owned by ALRANZ and registered to their post office box.

    Yet nowhere on mydecision.org.nz is this stated, and neither is it included in yesterday’s official press release announcing the launch of this new website.

    Instead, the press release contained the blatantly misleading claim that My Decision is a “new grassroots project” – clearly implying that this is some new and independent group that has sprung up when in actual fact it is the ideological equivalent of a shell corporation that has been created by ALRANZ to attack medical professionals and crisis pregnancy centres who offer women alternatives to abortion.

    I wonder if Family Planning NZ approves of, or is also participating in this calculated deception of the NZ public? I ask because they are specifically named and linked to on the ‘Resources’ page of this new ALRANZ website.

    http://nblo.gs/Zftiq

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  91. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    You don’t think Key should have answered the questions either, flipper?

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  92. Ross12 (1,488 comments) says:

    Pete — ” That dirty politics – whether by National, Labour, Slater, Hager or whoever – is not acceptable in modern politics and he will do what he can to distance himself from it and promote honour and decency to our democracy. ”

    If he had said that his opponents would have just said that a ” wishy , washy statement ” like that means nothing.So JK would not have achieved anything. ( NB. I don’t disagree with what you are trying to express here)

    I think ” dirty politics” will become a new catch phrase which is already losing any meaning.

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  93. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    Police thank Wayne Tempero for his criticism of Kim Dot Com by dropping their firearms charges against him.

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  94. Dennis Horne (2,403 comments) says:

    hj (6,569 comments) says: August 18th, 2014 at 10:21 am

    I think about the best commentator on important issues in NZ is Gareth Morgan. He pays researchers and he is completely independent; you can’t say that bout … Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 13
    ….
    Congratulations to the person who got that right!

    Thanks for a good laugh. Brilliant.

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  95. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    It didn’t take long for the usual useful idiots to appear, did it.

    But you useless muppets never actually disappeared.

    Right on cue, you trot out Key’s bullshit lines du jour in some bizarre echo repeating chamber, day after day, year after year.

    It’s like fucking groundhog day or Dr Bob’s muppet surgery…

    Tune in next week when you’ll hear Don the kiwi say…”uhhh fuck lefty scum will be the death of Noo Zilund and yeah so what i f i swallow cum for the national party. I like guzzling key’s jizz”

    Big fucking yawn…zzzzz!!!

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  96. lilman (974 comments) says:

    Penny you lying thieving person,pay your rates.

    Get off your lazy arse ,waddle over to the counter get out your wallet out of your purse and pay your rates.

    Dont come on here exposing to be a public watchdog when in reality all you are is a public leech.

    Wipe you body at both ends,mouth and arse as both are completely full of excrement.

    You deluded narcissist,look in the mirror and be honest,if you can find one that hasn’t broken.

    Pay your bloody rates.

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  97. G152 (422 comments) says:

    doggone7 (738 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 9:39 am

    Paulus

    All that upset you would have been avoided if the Prime Minister had simply answered the questions.

    ………………………………………………….

    He couldn’t get a word in edgewise

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  98. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    They were talking across each other: Espiner kept repeating the question he wanted answered; Key kept launching into a speech about something else. Stalemate.

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  99. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    G152: “He couldn’t get a word in edgewise.”

    If he’d wanted to get the answers to the questions in he wouldn’t have needed to worry about ‘edgewise’ – he could’ve gone full frontal. He didn’t want to answer the questions.

    mikenmild: “…Espiner kept repeating the question he wanted answered; Key kept launching into a speech about something else…”

    Yes.

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  100. SGA (1,276 comments) says:

    Scott Chris at 9:03 am

    Besides, we badly need strong leadership against escalating dirty politics. We’re not getting it.

    Don’t you mean we should put the dirty politics back in the closet where it’s always been?
    I don’t really think there’s been an escalation, just that the garbologists and muck-rakers are operating more overtly these days.

    I’m also left wondering about the “clean” politics of yore.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Prince :-)

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  101. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    Very macchiavellian of you.

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  102. david (2,194 comments) says:

    See Labour are promising to re-introduce compulsory Student Union membership if they get back in.

    Just can’t help themselves with the Totalitarian Dream

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  103. Ross12 (1,488 comments) says:

    Minto just cannot help himself ( and his fellow hard lefties) . Why would you bother putting this on your Facebook page when you are criticising your political opponents for what is in Hager’s book ??

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/08/john-minto-shares-an-act-of-effigy-burning-with-his-closest-friends/

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  104. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    Not unexpectedly, after claiming the the level of political dirt had crossed a line, Whale Oil hints of jumping the line himself. The next few weeks mightn’t be pretty.

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/08/nicky-hager-leave-good-bits/

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  105. Fletch (6,532 comments) says:

    A new stupid radio station competition here in NZ …

    A radio station is coming under fire for running a competition to see how far Kiwi men will go to win tickets to the Rugby World Cup.

    The Edge is asking two heterosexual male friends to get married in order to win the tickets to the showdown in the UK next year.

    “We’ve done stranger weddings, naked weddings, same sex weddings but this is the first one that we know will end in divorce,” The Edge says of its Love You Man competition.

    http://tvnz.co.nz/entertainment-news/radio-station-under-fire-same-sex-marriage-rugby-world-cup-competition-6059382

    Pathetic. That is what marriage is becoming. A trivial thing, like a club membership, that can be cancelled at any time.

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  106. Yvette (2,763 comments) says:

    Pete George – In the meantime Hager says he has given all data back to his source so he can’t be required to hand any over.

    This echoes Cunliffe giving back a secret trust donation, thus it became a secret six month loan :-) because he wouldn’t embarrass the donor by his or her name being made public.

    However, just as with Cunliffe, Hager still knows the source and should be forced to reveal that – just as Fisher, author of the Kim Dotcom book, may not by judicial decision now claim protection for his sources.

    By making the point he has returned the material [so he knew where to send it, and to re-access the stolen emails to possibly release more. as he claims] so he would not be compromised if Police called on him, Hager indicates that he knew he was doing something of probable interest to the police.

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  107. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    @ Judith

    “So if Hager stole the material, it must therefore exist”

    Criminal behavior like this, including theft, is the real dirty politics.

    “– and therefore it is true — which kind of makes your argument at little invalid in the bigger picture, doesn’t it?”

    No, not to critical thinkers. It is easy to take emails and conversations out of context, then apply the conspiracy theorists formula of 2+2=9, or as I put it, weave the material into the story you want to tell, and abracadabra, instant conspiracy.

    Being gullible is not an excuse Judith.

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  108. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “GTFOH…its about time they started holding the slippery, smilng, waving, no account, lying sack of spittle to some measure of accountability for his selective amnesia.”

    Forget to take your meds the morning BWAV?

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  109. wreck1080 (4,001 comments) says:

    Anti smacking law not working too well in Tauranga, in not the way you might expect.

    Father slams his childs head into the floor/walls causing brain injuries. The cops water down the charges at first and father is discharged without conviction because he does ‘charity’ work. Mum complains, serious charges are laid and the man gets off again because the police prosecutor fails to turn up to the hearing!!!!

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/bay-of-plenty-times/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503343&objectid=11309339

    For some reason (could it be that this man was so important the press have been protecting him too?), some of the nastier details do not appear in the online version of the case. eg, how the father slammed his childs head repeatedly against a concrete wall or floor , and how the Tauranga prosecutor brushes off how they didn’t appear then goes on to say they take child abuse cases seriously. What a joke!!

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  110. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “So what you are saying is that you feel challenged and a little bit vulnerable by people that have different opinions to you, and this makes you really angry?”

    So what you are saying Judith is that you feel challenged and a little bit vulnerable by people that apply critical thinking to Hager’s conspiracy theory, and this makes you really angry?

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  111. Fletch (6,532 comments) says:

    This might be useful to some, after the goings-on of the last week. An actual hacker has written a column on passwords – which are the safest and will take the longest for a hacker to break etc.

    http://null-byte.wonderhowto.com/how-to/advice-from-real-hacker-create-stronger-passwords-0156907/

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  112. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    Who’s side is Hooton on?

    Matthew Hooton on Nine to @ninetonoon: I think David Cunliffe will be PM before the end of this year

    “What the Prime Minister is saying is preposterous”

    Who’s side is Slater on?

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  113. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    If Cam Slater doesn’t already have a press pass for the Beehive I think he should be given one.

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  114. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Hager still knows the source and should be forced to reveal that…

    yeah…let’s get Dunkin Donut Garner to waterboard the cunt on The Nation.

    fucking great sunday morning fodder for the redneck blueblood majority.

    and then maybe we’ll stone some adultereses as well before forcing some muslims to convert to christianity or we’ll starve them to death.

    I like your thinking yvette. Stay classy!

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  115. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    Milky…..

    Take that Helen Clark (or is it Simpson) photo from your desk top and put it in your bottom drawer – and leave it there.

    I think that this whole thing…as I have previously said on KB …. is much ado about nothing – criminality by Hager et al excepted.

    If you leave your confidential government documents (remember the OSA?) on a public counter so that they can be read by all and sundry, whose fault is it when they read?

    And if I were to read them, and I have read dozens in past years, I would have no hesitation in telling other folks with similar interests where and how to find them.

    Shock, horror probe….

    To answer your question milky: I would answer in my own way in my own time.
    If you sought to dictate how I should answer I would tell you, in words of one syllable, to shove it up your gunga.
    But now it is considered by the MSM children (Ok, some are older types, but still children) clever to talk over the top of those being interviewed, because Espinder , like that thick head Christie on TVNZ, think they are “the story”. Self aggrandisement is the real name of their game.

    I think you should go back and examine the record of 2011. For all their bluster, Flett and Labour never did anything more than write to Greg Hamilton at NP HO. Hamilton replied confirming that a NP staffer had examined a wide-open net site, down loaded files that were publicly on display, and gave Flett an assurance that the information would not be used. And this is to be equated with criminality?

    You really are as thick as pig shit milky one :-)

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  116. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Forget to take your meds the morning BWAV?

    Ahh the old forgotten meds putdown.

    That’s a classic for sure. Never get tired of that one… no seriously, I’m not lying !!!

    You win teh internetz ShawnLH.

    On a side note, just curious as to when exactly you got bitten by the douche bug ?

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  117. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    There could be an avalanche of dirt. Certainly more building.

    This looks like a spoof Twitter account but seems to know what’s going down: https://twitter.com/whaledump

    In the meantime:

    Tim Murphy ‏@tmurphyNZH

    Whaleoil hacker contacts Herald. Now things will get interesting again. Soon on http://nzherald.co.nz . #hagerbook

    Cunliffe is trying to milk this but he’s got something hanging over his head too.

    The free ice-cream party might do ok.

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  118. oldpark (412 comments) says:

    Anyone hear the Lardo Heifer lady ,and Israel hater Rachel Smalley on Newstalk ZB programme sponsored by KPMG the accountancy company.Smalley a TV3 reject was putting the boot into Cam Slater ,and flying a flag for the criminal Schmidz/Dotcon.Seems Newstalk ZB IS JUST ANOTHER RADIO STATION,in the mould of Radio Live.Difference is Radio Live dosn’t hide its lefty colours, Newstalk ZB doing the same thing more and more.Especially the Labour/Green party sycophants embedded in their newsroom,as they spin out one sided stories from their puppet secondary employment paymasters.

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  119. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    More from Hooton:

    John Key “not remotely credible in what he was saying”.
    “The worst interview the PM’s given in six years as PM”.

    Hooton – Jason Ede not sufficiently important, Eagleson should go.

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  120. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    @PG

    After your feigned indignation of John Key (rightly) refusing to answer a loaded question you are a bit slow answering simple straightforward questions yourself.

    Is this the ‘dirty politics’ you speak of?

    Hacking computers and stealing private emails of journalists
    Stealing laptops and cell phones
    Destroying and defacing billboards
    burning effigies of members of parliament.
    Anti -Semitism
    Hacking computers and stealing private emails of members of parliament.
    Hacking computers and stealing private emails of spouses of members of parliament.
    Using proxies to attack policies and members of parliament.
    Encouraging mob behaviour and drunken louts shouting “F*ck John Key”
    Hacking computers and stealing private emails of members of parliament and journalists and then publishing them out of context and without right of reply.

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  121. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    Surprise Surprise David Fisher is handling the hacking source at the Herald.

    Hacker comes forward: I’ll publish more material on Twitter @whaledump

    Documents described as detailed email transcripts of conversations between Whaleoil blogger Cameron Slater and his anonymous sources have been provided to the Herald by an individual claiming to have hacked the website.

    The person who provided the information says they are Nicky Hager’s source for his Dirty Politics book and further information will be made public today through the Twitter handle @whaledump.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11310429

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  122. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Anyone hear the Lardo Heifer lady ,and Israel hater Rachel Smalley on Newstalk ZB?

    Nah… missed it.

    Sounds like a hoot. Did the Lardo heifer lady get her udders out ?

    umm…you dont like teh ladies much eh ?

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  123. Lance (2,719 comments) says:

    Seriously BWAV

    You are mocking Christianity because you think they want to force Muslims to convert.

    That is the most perverted spin I have ever seen.
    I don’t know if you have been keeping up with current events

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/timstanley/100280803/iraqi-christians-are-raped-murdered-and-driven-from-their-homes-and-the-west-is-silent/
    http://rt.com/news/180712-isis-massacre-village-iraq/
    http://rt.com/news/168916-isis-iraq-war-crimes/
    http://shariaunveiled.wordpress.com/2014/08/10/isis-murders-a-family-of-8-christians-including-children-by-shooting-them-in-the-face/

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  124. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    But something else is fishy about this – @Whaledump profile:

    Whaledump
    @whaledump

    A wholly pnwed subsidary of C&M Ltd. 9284C4A9EB9268918E03313DCDAD5C12EFF3D467
    Flat 3b, 3 Hans Crescent
    mega.co.nz

    Mega? Really?

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  125. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Ahh the old forgotten meds putdown.”

    Well, given your tendency towards incoherent ranting, it was a good assumption.

    You could try to string a few more sentences together and form an actual argument, and try being a little less insulting to others, then people might take you slightly more seriously.

    Or you could just keep on making yourself look like a ranting nutjob.

    I’m good either way! :)

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  126. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “You are mocking Christianity because you think they want to force Muslims to convert.”

    I get the impression BWAV is not exactly playing with a full deck.

    “That is the most perverted spin I have ever seen.
    I don’t know if you have been keeping up with current events”

    Don’t be silly. Facts get in the way of mindless ranting! :)

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  127. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    You are mocking Christianity because you think they want to force Muslims to convert.

    Gee that’s a long bow you’re drawing there Lance.

    oh the ironing…

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  128. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    You could try to string a few more sentences together and form an actual argument, and try being a little less insulting to others, then people might take you slightly more seriously.

    Whatever makes you think i want to be taken seriously or that this is a place where serious commentary is valued ?

    hahaha..you’re a cunny funt alright!

    I feel quite at home with the ranting nutjobs here in spite of their misguided political leanings.

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  129. Griff (8,419 comments) says:

    Shawn
    Polly black wog with utu
    Is a pointless troll
    Ignore him.

    In less you want to give the poor little Polly black Wog something to wank over.

    Disgusting ….EH…

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  130. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Whatever makes you think i want to be taken seriously”

    Nothing so far.

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  131. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    Griff, yep, looks like a big fat troll to me! :)

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  132. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    And @Whaledump is following a school of reef journos plus @TheCivilianNZ – very fishy.

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  133. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    Aww Griff don’t be like that, you ignorant cracka ass hypocrite.

    I mean jeez, giving people advice you dont even follow ?

    There is always a point to what i say. Its not my fault you’re too stupid to recognize it.

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  134. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    You got something against big fat people Shawn ?

    Not that i am either…jus sayin.

    Dont let your prejudices get in the way of a decent putdown.

    At least try to give it some thought…be original. I dare ya!

    Shits and giggles, light and fluffy.

    Now run along, there’s a good lad. I think i just heard the school bell.

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  135. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “There is always a point to what i say.”

    There is? What would that be? To prove you can call people names?

    It’s not much of a point.

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  136. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “You got something against big fat people Shawn ?”

    Only if their trolls. :)

    “Shits and giggles, light and fluffy.”

    ya really should consider taking those meds. :)

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  137. adc (558 comments) says:

    Judith.

    So if I stole a bible, that makes everything in it true?

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  138. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    Mega? Really?

    Here’s a clue.

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  139. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    There is? What would that be?

    Its not my fault you’re too stupid to recognize it.

    fuck i hate having to repeat myself…repeat myself.

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  140. oldpark (412 comments) says:

    Anyone know who the senior politician who has or had a secret high powered female Lawyer girlfriend,not his spouse.Seems the scandal is well known by most people in Parliamentary circles,and recently known by someone who hacked into personal emails.

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  141. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “fuck i hate having to repeat myself”

    It’s what happens when you’re not entirely sane. Sane people can’t decipher your ranting.

    Consider it an occupational hazard. :)

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  142. Black with a Vengeance (1,868 comments) says:

    uhhh yeah, goodnight Shawn

    That’s good night from me and good night from him.

    You really need to work on your material eh, maybe even use a ghost writer.

    Like Slater does when he has to use some bigger words ?

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  143. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “uhhh yeah, goodnight Shawn”

    It’s the afternoon. An inability to know what time it is is another sign of insanity. :)

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  144. Pete George (23,833 comments) says:

    Everyone’s being played by @Megadump – so much for democracy. Anyone remember Winston? He might find it hard to keep up this election, but there might still be a place for “pox on you all” votes.

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  145. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    The culture wars have turned nasty in the UK. The pro Gaza and BDS types score a big win through intimidation and criminal behaviour .

    Culture wars; halal yes, kosher no!

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2727266/Sainsbury-s-strips-kosher-food-shelves-fear-attacks-anti-Israeli-protesters.html

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  146. IGM (622 comments) says:

    I get arsed off here for eff all yet that old boiler Bright pisses everyone off daily with vile rants, bordering on sedition..

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  147. IGM (622 comments) says:

    Have a celebration: Manawatu Standard’s communist editor has resigned, must be joining The Standard or Labour Party. Wherever he has gone, good riddance, and I hope they get a decent replacement, which will not need to be very good to be an improvement.

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  148. dime (10,222 comments) says:

    What’s with the thinking that there is no place for dirty politics?

    Without people leaking, we would hardly ever get to hear the truth.

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  149. m@tt (637 comments) says:

    “Everyone’s being played by @Megadump”
    No Pete, just you.

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  150. stephieboy (3,535 comments) says:

    kowtow and everyone , the latest from Pat Condell posted 5th August 2014

    HYPOCRISY OVER GAZA,

    Hope to post the transcript later.!

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  151. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    Anyone know what the Labour/Greens position would be on David Bain’s compensation bid?

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  152. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    IGM

    Follow that editor and let us know what shore he washes up on.

    Down here in sunny Dunny a deputy editor of the ODT ,left to join his cousin to try and take over the govt.

    Cunliffe appoints Cunliffe.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11159093

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  153. muggins (3,832 comments) says:

    C’mon goldnkiwi, you are drawing a pretty long bow if you expect to see a Labour/Green coalition in power given the state of the polls at the moment. I can’t see Hager’s book making much difference seeing as he must had moles obtaining that info for him which doesn’t make him any better than the politicians he is complaining about.
    However there may be a new Minister of Justice and you can rest assured that he/she will be just as well informed on Binnie/ Bain as Judith Collins is.

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  154. James Stephenson (2,268 comments) says:

    Anyone know who the senior politician who has or had a secret high powered female Lawyer girlfriend,not his spouse.Seems the scandal is well known by most people in Parliamentary circles,and recently known by someone who hacked into personal emails.

    I thought that was already a known subject around the watercooler, or if you prefer, in the smoko room.

    Who’s the politician with no apparent chin?
    Now, change the vowel.

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  155. stephieboy (3,535 comments) says:

    Hamas would sacrifice the Palestinians in order to get at Israel
    IT NOW seems the entire British media are referring to the terrible casualties in Gaza as “Palestinian civilians”.

    Frederick Forsyth has some masterly analysis of Hamas, Gaza and Israel.

    Excellent Stuff . Highly recommended. !

    http://www.express.co.uk/comment/columnists/frederick-forsyth/496860/Frederick-Forsyth-on-Vlad

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  156. Nookin (3,573 comments) says:

    goldnkiwi
    As a matter of principle and not necessarily merit
    1. Labour has a position diametrically opposite to that of the Government.
    2. The Greens want a full public inquiry.
    3. The Conservatives want a binding referendum.
    4 Act, Jamie Whyte in particular, wants to know if he slept with his sister
    5. Internet Party will announce its position at a party –just before the fireworks display.
    6. Mana will string his grievance out for another 25 years.
    7. The Civilian party will give him two llama and an apartment in Hamilton.

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  157. adc (558 comments) says:

    I think the point many are missing is that Hager doesn’t need to be better than the people he is complaining about. The question is whether the people he is complaining about should be better, and whether they have any questions to answer or not.

    So Hager playing dirty policitics isn’t going to be the deciding factor for voters, they just need to believe him for it to be a problem, and they’d also need to believe any other party was any better (which IMO they are not).

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  158. billr (21 comments) says:

    I saw the Nation on Sunday morning.

    They had a nice little echo chamber with Hager, Goff and Turei all being very poh faced and disgusted.

    Apart from the blatant hypocrisy of it all, Goff actually said the JK was lying. That’s a hard statement to make and should be challenged. He seems to think that because OIAs take about 20 days + to get out of the door, and that they are usually signed off by the Minister responsible that JK must be lying. Well if i read the runes carefully enough i think that the narrative probably goes like this.

    The then head of the SIS, Warren Tucker, probably got so utterly pissed off with Phil Goff calling him a liar over being informed/not being informed, that he went ahead and released the memo/notes where it showed that Goff had been informed.

    if you go back and look at Stuff, you can see that the DOm also made an OIA at the same time, but they didn’t ask for the same information, so it was declined.

    I now see that the information that was hacked from Slater’s PC is now residing on a Megaupload server somewhere. Maybe Slater should ask that KRIM takes it down as it has been put there through a blatently illegal act.

    Interesting to see if this is going to happed, and what KDCs response will be.

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  159. Southern Raider (1,777 comments) says:

    Now the hacker for Hager has come forward where the hell are the police or is it okay to steal personal property in NZ as long as it supports the left?

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  160. Ryan Sproull (7,361 comments) says:

    The first dump of revealed emails seem to show Jason Ede getting Slater to track down personal details of some people by their vehicle descriptions.

    EDIT: Green Party activists, someone on Twitter has alleged.

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  161. RightNow (7,015 comments) says:

    James Stephenson:
    “Who’s the politician with no apparent chin?
    Now, change the vowel.”

    Oh shit, what was that rule I learned in school, was it I before E, except after C?

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  162. Ryan Sproull (7,361 comments) says:

    Mega? Really?

    Which server-level encryption secure-storage service would you recommend instead, Pete?

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  163. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Oh diddums – some of the comments made by the anonymous, gutless Kiwibloggers leave me with such a big grin on my face :)

    How ill-disciplined of you to bother reading my considered opinions, if they so upset you?

    You can’t handle the TRUTH?

    Harden up.

    Or just ignore my posts if you can’t ‘handle the jandal’.

    (Meant of course in a caring way :)

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

    Who at least puts her name to her posts :)

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  164. James Stephenson (2,268 comments) says:

    EDIT: Green Party activists, someone on Twitter has alleged.

    Motorcycles of people spotted vandalising billboards.

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  165. James Stephenson (2,268 comments) says:

    Oh shit, what was that rule I learned in school, was it I before E, except after C?

    It’s a funny thing, but now you ask the question, Mai memory has gone all unreliable too.

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  166. Ryan Sproull (7,361 comments) says:

    Motorcycles of people spotted vandalising billboards.

    Criminals!

    So Ede had the licence plate numbers of the motorcycles of the people committing crimes. Why go to Slater to get the owners’ details?

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  167. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Has Prime Minister John Key yet read ‘Dirty Politics’?

    Just concerned at how severe is his on-going condition of ‘wilful blindness’?

    Penny Bright

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  168. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Oh diddums – some of the comments made by the anonymous, gutless Kiwibloggers leave me with such a big grin on my face”

    Penny, for myself I post under my name. So stop pretending that you are the only one that does.

    “How ill-disciplined of you to bother reading my considered opinions, if they so upset you?”

    You never post considered opinions, that’s lying again. Your “opinions” are always biased against the Right, poorly considered, and display a significant level of hypocrisy and dishonesty.

    “Harden up.

    Or just ignore my posts if you can’t ‘handle the jandal’.”

    What jandal? You have nothing. Your posts are just thin propaganda, tied up with lies, half-truths and your over-inflated ego.

    You’re a nobody Penny. Most of the country could care less about you or what you think, and many of those that do think your a joke and a drain on the taxpayer.

    Get over yourself. We don’t care what you think. We only care that you stop stealing from the council and other ratepayers and pay your rates.

    Your so-called “protest” is a lie. You want a free ride, so you steal and bludge off others to get that, and then lie that it’s about some protest.. That’s all it is Penny. A bullshit excuse because you are too lazy, too stupid, or both, to go out and get a real job, pay your way, and make a real contribution New Zealand.

    By the way. The scene on TV a few months back when you got your worthless ass hauled into a police van for being a screeching nutjob and a public nuisance, that was great entertainment. Screaming about corporate control of the police was all the proof the public needed that you’re a certifiable nutcase.

    Could you arrange to have that happen again?

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  169. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Seen this Kiwibloggers?

    http://psa.org.nz/newsroom/mediareleases/14-08-18/Collins_must_resign_for_leaking_public_servants%E2%80%99_details.aspx

    Collins must resign for leaking public servants’ details

    18 Aug 2014

    The Public Service Association (PSA) says Ministers should not be leaking neutral public servants’ details so they can be attacked for partisan politics, as Judith Collins has admitted following allegations in Dirty Politics by Nicky Hager.

    Glenn Barclay, PSA acting National Secretary, said “Public servants must be able to do their jobs without fear of being dragged into partisan politics,”

    “Minister Collins has admitted giving the name of a Ministerial Services staffer to blogger Cameron Slater.

    “After his name was released, the staff member and his family were subject to abuse and threats from commenters on the Whale Oil blog.

    “Minister Collins must take responsibility for her actions and resign, her behaviour falls well below what is expected of our leaders.

    “Public servants work hard every day to make New Zealand better, they aren’t political playthings for Ministers and partisan bloggers,” said Glenn Barclay.
    __________________________________________________________________________________________________

    Dead damn right.

    I agree.

    Remember – this highest ranking ‘woman’ in the National Government, who has been named as a future Prime Minister of New Zealand is currently the MINISTER OF JUSTICE and was the former MINISTER OF POLICE???

    Heaven help us …….

    Looking forward to decent New Zealand women (and men) supporting this call for Judith Collins immediate resignation as Minister.

    Penny Bright

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  170. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Has Prime Minister John Key yet read ‘Dirty Politics’?”

    Why would he? He can see through bullshit propaganda and conspiracy theories. That you’re too stupid to do so is your problem, not John Key’s.

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  171. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    What’s the ‘L H’ part attached to ‘Shawn’ – anonymous, gutless one?

    Still reading my posts!

    Good on you!

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

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  172. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    “Has Prime Minister John Key yet read ‘Dirty Politics’?”

    Why would he?
    _______________________________________________________________________________________________

    errr…. so he knows (directly) what he’s talking about?

    DUH?

    (Meant of course in a caring, if slightly exasperated way :)

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

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  173. Nostradamus (2,439 comments) says:

    ShawnLH:

    I, for one, will have a drink when Penny Not-So gets thumped by John Key (electorally speaking) on 20 September!

    The only question is what the beverage should be. What would you suggest – Deutz Marlborough Cuvee or something more celebratory?

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  174. Nookin (3,573 comments) says:

    “..errr…. so he knows (directly) what he’s talking about?”

    Good to see you acknowledge that Key has no knowledge of the alleged facts, Penelope.

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  175. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “errr…. so he knows (directly) what he’s talking about?”

    Who cares? It’s Nicky Hager. Most people don’t take him seriously anymore than they take you seriously. Colmar’s snap poll on the issue showed less than thirty percent believed his conspiracy theory.

    He’s not relevant. Neither are you.

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  176. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    Here’s one for those serious about religious freedom:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/weird-news/pastafarian-fights-for-his-right-to-wear-a-colander-on-his-head-in-driving-licence-photo-9673376.html

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  177. Ryan Sproull (7,361 comments) says:

    Key doesn’t need to read the book for that one. Judith Collins has come out and said she did it. What Key needs to do now is, apparently…

    1. Talk to Judith Collins about it (he says he’ll wait until after the election)
    2. Then decide if he has an opinion on the Minister of Justice leaking a public servant’s name to a blog

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  178. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Here’s one for those serious about religious freedom”

    They should let him wear what he wants. I for one would be very happy for him to be the poster boy for atheism. ;)

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  179. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    The then head of the SIS, Warren Tucker, probably got so utterly pissed off with Phil Goff calling him a liar over being informed/not being informed, that he went ahead and released the memo/notes where it showed that Goff had been informed.

    Let’s not forget where this all started: payback (double by Collins’ standards?) for Goff’s criticism of Key’s handling of foreign affairs.

    “It came after Mr Goff and John Key had clashed about suspicions of spying by Israeli backpackers caught up in the February 2011 earthquake in Christchurch. One of them died and the others hurriedly left the country.”
    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/252162/sis-allegations-under-deep-scrutiny

    “Mossad spy ring ‘unearthed because of Christchurch earthquake’
    The Israeli secret service Mossad has been accused of conducting an intelligence-gathering operation in New Zealand which was unearthed because of February’s Christchurch earthquake.”
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/australiaandthepacific/newzealand/8649223/Mossad-spy-ring-unearthed-because-of-Christchurch-earthquake.html

    “While defending his actions concerning the Israeli backpackers, Key said that Goff had also been briefed by the Security Intelligence Service (SIS) director on the case, but Goff denied this” ~ Dirty Politics p37-38

    “The SIS papers noted that Goff and Tucker and discussed ‘Investigation into Israeli Nationals in Christchurch’ and a briefing paper on the subject had been read by/discussed with Mr Goff” ~ Ibid, p39

    “Goff is a conservative on foreign policy and intelligence issues … Documents like the SIS briefing notes are not usually released to the public” ~ Ibid, p40

    What we have is Slater targeting Goff for his conservative values, when Slater supposedly represents the far right, with the core issue being Mossad operations in NZ. And now Slater returns from Tel Aviv, reporting on how superior the Israelis are for having segregated beaches.

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  180. stigie (1,458 comments) says:

    Penny, what are you doing here on Kiwiblog…shouldnt you be out somewhere defacing billboards ?

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  181. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    Oh my god!!

    The emails looked at the New Zealand Hamas show that in 2008 Key’s press secretary, Kevin Taylor, says that “Jason Ede asked me to mention he will be giving you (Cameron Slater) a call in the next few days”.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11310429

    They actually want to talk to bloggers instead of us, the bipartisan, one-eyed MSM!
    They want to bypass us, how dare they!
    This is a scandal!
    Dirty politics!

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  182. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    They actually want to talk to bloggers instead of us, the bipartisan, one-eyed MSM!

    The point made by Hager was that by going to WheelOil/VRWC they can get the desired spin without having to deal with the usual journalistic standards of the MSM.

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  183. Ryan Sproull (7,361 comments) says:

    Oh my god!!

    The emails looked at the New Zealand Hamas show that in 2008 Key’s press secretary, Kevin Taylor, says that “Jason Ede asked me to mention he will be giving you (Cameron Slater) a call in the next few days”.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11310429

    They actually want to talk to bloggers instead of us, the bipartisan, one-eyed MSM!
    They want to bypass us, how dare they!
    This is a scandal!
    Dirty politics!

    Read a bit closer, Other Andy. The idea there is that Kevin Taylor said that the office will not be talking to any bloggers, but notes that Ede will be calling Slater a little later.

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  184. ManuT (56 comments) says:

    @ UglyTruth

    Cameron Slater doesn’t represent anyone but himself. He has not been elected to office and claims he is not a member of any political party. He is a Zero who should pull his woolly head in. Nice blog but what a stupid man.

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  185. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    It has now clearly been established that no one is allowed to talk to anyone about politics anymore without Nicky Hager’s say so.
    Is there a petition I can sign to get my democracy back please?

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  186. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Cameron Slater doesn’t represent anyone but himself.

    So why the sudden trip to Israel when the manure hit the air conditioner, and then Slater apparently gets NSA-level data on who hacked his site?

    Sounds to me a little like the standard lone gunman explanation. No vast right wing conspiracy here, nothing to see, move along now.

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  187. mjw (401 comments) says:

    These emails, if accurate, show that people working on the 9th floor of the Beehive worked as a team with Whaleoil. This included sending anti-Labour attack ads to Whaleoil, and commissioning research for use by Whaleoil.

    The attack ad in these emails was published on Whaleoil within 24 hours. You can see it at: http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2013/09/cunliffe-two-face/

    This isn’t out of order for Cam, who I think is upfront about his Rush Limbaugh style of politics. But it is another matter for the PM, who has consistently denied that National uses Whaleoil as a political attack blog. This evidence appears to contradict that stance.

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  188. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    Here’s one for those who are serious about religious freedom;

    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/08/islamic-state-jihadis-kidnap-more-than-3000-women-and-girls-in-2-week-rampage

    While genocide rages in the Middle East ,man insists on “right ” to wear colonder in Canada.Great to have so little to worry about,innit?

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  189. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    Collins and Key ,two rotten peas in a pod. Sorry judith you WILL NEVER BE PM as you are a nasty pasty faced piece of shit,a lardball bully, and into increasing your chinese/islander husbands wealth. You are gone after the election, Brand John Key is SHAKY, buy popcorn as SHONkey sacks his staff,popcorn bring the bloodletting on

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  190. Longknives (4,968 comments) says:

    Each to his own Lurcher- I personally can’t wait until Judith Collins is PM! Best thing going in New Zealand Politics right now…

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  191. stigie (1,458 comments) says:

    Leecher, you must be from the extreme left spouting all that hatred ?

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  192. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    While genocide rages in the Middle East ,man insists on “right ” to wear colonder in Canada.Great to have so little to worry about,innit?

    So what do you think should be done about the Middle East, kowtow?

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  193. Nostradamus (2,439 comments) says:

    Lurcher1948:

    bring the bloodletting on

    Do you have a licence to hold (let alone use) a pitchfork?

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  194. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Here you go ‘Sheepish Shorn’ – you’ll LOVE this! :)

    It’s called ‘seeking truth from FACTS’ – perhaps you should try it just once for the novelty factor ?

    (Meant of course in a caring way :)
    __________________________________________________________________________________________________

    18 August 2014

    ‘Open Letter’/ OIA to Prime Minister John Key – please confirm that the following email addresses are/were used by Jason Ede:

    Dear Prime Minister,

    Given that you are the Minister in charge of the SIS – this should arguably not be a difficult request.

    ‘Nothing to hide – nothing to fear’?

    Please provide the information which confirms that the following email addresses were/are being used by Jason Ede, a current (?) / former member of staff attached, as I understand it, to YOUR Office of the Prime Minister?

    nzedjed@hotmail.com

    political.animal101@gmail.com

    Yours sincerely,

    Penny Bright

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  195. Left Right and Centre (3,014 comments) says:

    Relative poverty = bros, aunties, and cuzzies and other rellies living twenty to a state house.

    Relative poverty; funny how they’re always seen eating a relatively high amount of KFC and McDorks.

    Other popular terms: ‘Destinytute’ relatively poor after the weekly AP to King Tamaki. Deprivation. There’s another alternative word – don’t hear it around much (ever).

    Brian Smaller – exactly. Another similar one is – lift the minimum wage and hello – now there’s more people on the minimum wage. Better increase it again. Hang on. Exactly.

    Well – they aint starving if Porirua Winz is anything to go by. Fat super sumo s.o.b.s have to grunt and groan like an Olympic weightlifter setting records just to stand up or waddle in slow motion half a metre . . . disgusting greedy lazy slobs.

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  196. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    publicwatchdog (2,173 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 3:41 pm

    You might like to send this link in your next email to the PM.

    I believe Mr Ede may have breached the code of conduct whilst in the Governments service.

    http://www.ssc.govt.nz/upload/downloadable_files/Code-of-conduct-StateServices.pdf

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  197. Longknives (4,968 comments) says:

    John Key must be cowering in terror with the Political Heavyweight Penny Bright coming for him…

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  198. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Longknives (4,613 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 3:47 pm

    You could be right, I suspect John Key wouldn’t be too familiar with making any female come.

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  199. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    Do you have a licence to hold (let alone use) a pitchfork?

    Lynch mobs are popular.

    Don’t know if anyone else has suggested it as haven’t all the comments but I suggest a small Committee of Concerned Citizens get hold of the moron Hagar and ask him to reveal who gave him the material in his book using shall we say questioning techniques designed to illicit the correct answers. He and his cronies deserve no better.

    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/08/ive_either_been_hacked_or_spied_on.html#comment-1381406

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  200. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Isn’t this excellent. Key must be very proud to see this business doing so well. I wonder if he’ll skite about their increased production whilst on his campaign tour?

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/books/10395853/Demand-for-Dirty-Politics-stays-strong

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  201. Left Right and Centre (3,014 comments) says:

    Do you have a licence to hold (let alone use) a pitchfork?

    Not yet – but they’d need one if the socialists got in.

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  202. freemark (676 comments) says:

    6 (7,8??) years of dirty, lying, envious, loser hate, politics & tactics against primarily John Key, secondarily against anyone smart enough to realise that his & our political philosophy is the only (if not perfect) way to improve the lot of the vast majority of NZers.
    IF (a big IF) JK & others have taken a bit of licence to return fire (for the greater good) that is fine by me and decent people who actually care about kids, and the environment etc (without having to screech it everyday).
    For the Left the (self – serving) end justifies the means, every time..woe betide that anyone else should act like that.
    The stolen emails (& even Slater’s over the top rhetoric) are absolutely nothing compared to what we see, every fucking day, on other Social Media by Left Wing MP’s, Party Officials, & supporters.
    Socialism is desperate in it’s fight for survival & relevance, everything needs to be viewed through that framework.
    This is no longer even opinion, it’s categorical fact.

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  203. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Gosh – don’t Crosby Textor have this ‘oldie but goodie’ in their ‘SPIN DOCTORS 101′ Manual?

    “WHEN YOU’RE IN A HOLE – STOP DIGGING?”

    Or is NZ Prime Minister John Key now suffering from ‘wilful deafness’ to match his ‘wilful blindness’?

    I suppose it’s all a bit different from his previous ‘work experience’ – where – as a Wall Street banker and the Head of derivatives for Merrill Lynch, there was basically ZIP transparency and accountability?

    No laws, no rules, no regulations, no ethics, no morals (if the ‘Wolf of Wall Street has any truth to it) – just unbridled free-market casino capitalism – at its most debauched?

    So John Key effectively comes straight from Wall Street to begin his political future in New Zealand.

    Where does he do that ‘transmogrification’ into an honest and competent ‘public servant’ – working for the public in the public interest?

    Oh – that’s right.

    He doesn’t – John Key’s effective ‘insider trading’ over TranzRail helped to prove that – in my considered opinion.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFTYZVQo-A8

    Penny Bright

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  204. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    absolutely nothing compared to what we see, every fucking day, on other Social Media by Left Wing MP’s, Party Officials, & supporters.

    Cite or you’re pulling things out of your arse.

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  205. Komata (1,220 comments) says:

    Judith

    Re: ‘…I suspect John Key wouldn’t be too familiar with making any female come.’

    In the military there is a saying ‘Conduct unbecoming’, that is used when referring to the actions of an officer that is liable to bring the service into disrepute.

    Regrettably IMHO, your statement quoted above falls into that category, and, coming from YOU Judith especially, I am very surprised.

    A low, and IMHO VERY unnecessary, personal attack.

    You may not like the guy (a fact you have certainly made no secret of) but to stoop to that level was totally uncalled for!!

    I expected MUCH better from you.

    As I said, ‘Conduct unbecoming’. . .

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  206. stephieboy (3,535 comments) says:

    Ugly truth ,

    “What we have is Slater targeting Goff for his conservative values, when Slater supposedly represents the far right, with the core issue being Mossad operations in NZ. And now Slater returns from Tel Aviv, reporting on how superior the Israelis are for having segregated beaches.”

    Your evidence for both Mossad operations in NZ and segregated beaches in Israel other than your more usual connecting the dots with your more bizarre conspiracy theories .?

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  207. aquataur (59 comments) says:

    If I mai offer a bit of advice to the pollie shagging a senior lawyer – I’d palm’er off to someone else before she starts squeaking

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  208. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Komata (1,131 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 4:29 pm

    I can’t be held responsible for how you decide to determine something Komata. I suggest the problem is entirely yours. I frequently tell my dog to come – which she does because she loves me – one can only just imagine what on earth you see wrong with that. The fact I can’t see any female following similar instruction from Key, is hardly conduct unbecoming.

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  209. Komata (1,220 comments) says:

    Judith

    A very clever response m’dear (’nuff said).

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  210. freemark (676 comments) says:

    cha (3,809 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 4:27 pm

    Fuck off, I don’t take demands from Socialists, go back to the Standard.

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  211. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    Did you know that it’s illegal to set off A-bombs in New Zealand? From the Nuclear Test Ban Act 1999:
    No person may—
    (a) carry out any nuclear weapon test explosion or any other nuclear explosion; or
    (b) cause, encourage, or in any way participate in, the carrying out of any nuclear weapon test explosion or any other nuclear explosion.
    (2) Every person who engages in conduct prohibited by subsection (1) commits an offence.
    (3) Every person who commits an offence against subsection (2) is liable on conviction to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 10 years or a fine not exceeding $1,000,000.

    So don’t go round letting off A-bombs unless you’ve got a spare $1 million for the fine. Sorted.

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  212. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ mikenmild (11,130 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 4:52 pm

    Thank you for that. I’ll have to find something else to do tomorrow now.

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  213. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    komata

    Her comment was low, I’d say she meant it as read, below the belt as it were.

    acqutaur; mai I contratulate you on that. Very good.

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  214. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    kowtow (7,824 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 4:57 pm

    So you think you can read my mind do you? Wow – guess what I’m thinking right now?

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  215. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    Fuck off, I don’t take demands from Socialists, go back to the Standard.

    So marmite jars it is.

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  216. Griff (8,419 comments) says:

    Freeskidmarks but you do get science from conservopiedia
    :lol:

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  217. Jack5 (5,286 comments) says:

    Anyone hear Hager the Horrible (HH) saying on Radio Labour’s Sunday morning show that he lectures journalism students on ethics?

    How’s that for irony?

    One thing that we would all like to know: would HH regard lying about one’s source to be ethical behaviour?

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  218. freemark (676 comments) says:

    So Judith, do you make your dog come, or does she make you come?

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  219. dad4justice (6,595 comments) says:

    Woof woof haha needed a laugh thanks freemark. Woof, woof ……….. :-)

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  220. Don the Kiwi (1,821 comments) says:

    Mikenmild (11,130 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 4:52 pm
    Did you know that it’s illegal to set off A-bombs in New Zealand? From the Nuclear Test Ban Act 1999:

    Well done MM. We can all see that your commitment to your work provides us with more useless information to store up for posterity.

    Keep up the good work…………..my,my….you are a concientious useful idiot aren’t you? :-)

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  221. Longknives (4,968 comments) says:

    This St Louis shooting is interesting. The lefty media are determined to convey that the guy shot was an ‘Angel’ who was minding his own business when an evil racist Copper shot him for no reason..

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/10395283/Ferguson-shooting-A-clash-of-different-lives

    “When they met at 12.01pm on August 9, the two were coming from different places, different mind-sets — Brown filling free hours with a friend, Wilson coming off an emergency call ”

    Trouble is- He wasn’t just “filling free hours with a friend”- He had just committed a vicious and violent robbery of a nearby store!
    I’m picking there will be more eye opening revelations about this alleged ‘Angelic victim’ as the FBI Investigation continues…

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  222. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    longie

    It’s always the same with the media when a black “kid” gets shot. As you pointed out the prick was a robber.

    Now apparently the “protesters” are shooting each other!

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  223. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    So Judith, do you make your dog come, or does she make you come?

    Ask ya mum, she’ll know all there is to know….

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  224. kowtow (8,945 comments) says:

    What do you do if a chiwawa is giving your leg the hump? Kick it away.

    And a rottweiller? let it finish.

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  225. cha (4,144 comments) says:

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  226. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    DPF Quotes Stuff this afternoon:

    *** Prime Minister John Key and Transport Minister Gerry Brownlee visited the Petone foreshore for the announcement this afternoon.

    They attracted a journalistic throng but questions about cycling were over in a flash, then the attention turned to the continuing fallout from the publication of Nicky Hager’s book Dirty Politics.

    Key’s repeated suggestions that the rest of the country would be more interested in cycleways or other initiatives fell on unresponsive ears ….. ”

    I had an interesting experience this afternoon. I was invited to speak to four Level 12 classes at the college attended by a granddaughter. In the question and answer session, I posed the question: “Who has heard of Nicky Harder, and what does he do.?” There were 70 odd students present.
    Only three (3) had heard “something” about him on TV.

    So I asked:“What about dirty politics?”

    Most had heard nothing, but nine (9) students thought that referred to the “The House of Cards”. They all thought it was “fun”. Not one mentioned New Zealand and Hager.

    It seems to me that the left and their MSM embedded-line pushers are simply out of touch. It is the economy, stupid!

    Now if anyone wants to talk about really dirty politics, try the unsolved bombing of Wellington’s Trades Hall …… that was dirty politics. But typical of the left and their policy of breaking eggs……. as Lenin, Trotsky and Stalin once opined.

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  227. Ross12 (1,488 comments) says:

    This is an interesting read on how politics can work in the US ( maybe KDC got a few lessons from them !)

    http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/08/17/gov-perry-indicted-everything-big-in-texas-even-this-bs/

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  228. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “What’s the ‘L H’ part attached to ‘Shawn’ – anonymous, gutless one?”

    My middle and last names. So, no Penny, I’m not anonymous. Lying again I see. So much for facts eh! :)

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  229. freemark (676 comments) says:

    Griff (6,955 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 5:05 pm
    Freeskidmarks but you do get science from conservopiedia
    :lol:

    Hey Gwiff, I think any real Science is more valid than your political science.

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  230. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    Bet the Labour Party site has had heaps of hits lol. I hope they had beefed up their security and that National took note!!!

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  231. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    It appears that Prime Minister John Key’s ‘moral compass’ hasn’t moved from Wall Street.

    After the election on 20 September 2014 – perhaps he can move back there.

    Then again – for the public majority around the world – given how the collapse of the derivatives market ( which John Key helped to set up as Head of derivatives for Merrill Lynch) it’s probably better if he just retires in Hawaii?

    (Meant of course in a caring way).

    Looking on the ‘Bright side’ – when I take his Helensville electorate seat off him – at least there won’t need to be an unnecessary by-election?

    Kind regards

    Penny Bright

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  232. stephieboy (3,535 comments) says:

    Ross12 (1,203 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 5:24 pm

    Ah Ross 12 from the redoubtable Queen Sarah and Fox News …. Sigh….!

    Another more sober assessment on the Governor,

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jim-moore/why-rick-perry-will-be-co_b_5686664.html

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  233. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “It appears that Prime Minister John Key’s ‘moral compass’ hasn’t moved from Wall Street.”

    Moral people don’t go on Jew hating protest marches in support of terrorism.

    Moral people don’t steal off rate payers for a free ride then lie that it’s a protest.

    You don’t have a moral compass in the first place.

    “After the election on 20 September 2014 – perhaps he can move back there.”

    He will still be PM and you will still be a thieving liar bludging off ratepayers for a fee ride.

    “Looking on the ‘Bright side’ – when I take his Helensville electorate seat off him”

    You can get professional help for delusional thinking Penny.

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  234. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Ah Ross 12 from the redoubtable Queen Sarah and Fox News …. Sigh….!”

    Better that than Hillary and MSNBC.

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  235. freemark (676 comments) says:

    publicwatchdog (2,176 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 5:45 pm

    “(Meant of course in a caring way)”

    I think it’s great that you are able to get “care in the Community” now Dear Penny. Imagine the old days when you would have been kept locked up in somewhere like Carrington, with Hone’s mum looking after you. Now, thanks to the kind and benevolent tax & ratepayers, and generous Mr Key, you get to play politics & pretend that you are a contributing member of Society.

    There there, it’s dinner time, Nursey will wipe your chin, and we’ll all clap & smile…

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  236. stephieboy (3,535 comments) says:

    Shawn LH, but the facts are Fox News takes lying and propaganda to a whole l new level ,

    http://www.forwardprogressives.com/fox-news-host-made-look-like-fool-caught-blatantly-lying-fac

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News_Channel_controversies

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  237. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    I was thinking(scary) i was reading the SST and saw the breathing living god Key surrounded by chinese COMMUNISTS and rich once were COMMUNIST throwing money at lapdog opps THE COMMUNIST LOVER our pm shonkey opps Key. NZ is for sale John Key the HON PM and i thought for all those LARGE donations and the way the chinese communists were smiling and smirking ,i would think key said 2015 the south island is up for sale my minister judith collins best friends,chinese earn,her future family fortune.

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  238. mikenmild (12,446 comments) says:

    It’s nice that they let you access a computer at your institution, lurcher.

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  239. OneTrack (3,376 comments) says:

    Ugly – “The point made by Hager was that by going to WheelOil/VRWC they can get the desired spin without having to deal with the usual journalistic standards of the MSM.”

    ROFLMFAO.

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  240. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    “……. the usual journalistic standards of the MSM.”

    Talking about journalistic standards.
    Anybody know when Corin Dann will announce his candidacy for the Labour Party?

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  241. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    mikenmild (11,132 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 6:15 pm
    It’s nice that they let you access a computer at your institution, lurcher.

    what makes me laugh at you wankers as you hate labour and the poor NZs
    but fuck you wank yourself at the speed you sell the country to the COMMUNIST CHINESE, farrar a right winger selling NZ to the COMMUNIST ARMY idiots

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  242. dad4justice (6,595 comments) says:

    lurcher, Key will sell the South Island to the Chinese before Christmas. Crushers mates want it. Key couldn’t give a toss. The Yanks will not be happy to lose the base at the airport.

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  243. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Shawn LH, but the facts are Fox News takes lying and propaganda to a whole l new level ”

    Not even close Stephie. That prize goes to liberal MSNBC.

    MSNBC’s Rachel Maddow Caught Lying About Koch Brothers; Refuses to Retract:

    http://www.tpnn.com/2014/01/08/msnbcs-rachel-maddow-caught-lying-about-koch-brothers-refuses-to-retract/

    Rachel Maddow of MSNBC Caught Lying About Ohio Pro-Life Bill:

    http://www.lifenews.com/2013/07/10/rachel-maddow-of-msnbc-caught-lying-about-ohio-pro-life-bill/

    25 Examples of MSNBC Race-Baiting, Lies & Left-Wing Nonsense :

    http://www.ijreview.com/2014/01/111924-25-examples-msnbc-race-baiting-lies-left-wing-nonsense-show-rnc-banning-network/

    Liberal lies documented, MSNBC lies more than FOX:

    http://www.scam.com/showthread.php?t=138269

    CAN THIS BE RIGHT? A NEW SURVEY SAYS MSNBC IS THE LEAST TRUSTED TV NEWS SOURCE:

    http://madamenoire.com/437218/can-this-be-right-a-new-survey-says-msnbc-is-the-least-trusted-tv-news-source/

    Pew Study Finds MSNBC the Most Opinionated Cable News Channel By Far:

    “A full 85% of the Comcast-owned network’s coverage can be classified as opinion or commentary rather than straight news, according to the authors of the Pew Research Center’s annual State of the News Media report.

    CNN and Fox News Channel, meanwhile, fall much closer to a 50/50 distribution, with Fox News skewing somewhat more heavily toward opinion. ”

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffbercovici/2013/03/18/pew-study-finds-msnbc-the-most-opinionated-cable-news-channel-by-far/

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  244. nasska (12,111 comments) says:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/4ne9lsg2mewn5z0/jesus_hippie.jpg

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  245. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Here you go wee toothless Kiwiblogger goldfish – sink your gums into THIS one! :)

    The more apoplectic and semi-hysterical your responses – the more effective I know that I’m being.

    Some of you are just SO dumb.

    (Meant of course in a caring way :)
    _____________________________________________________________________________________________

    http://www.medialawjournal.co.nz/?p=635

    Did Nicky Hager “make stuff up”?

    By Steven | August 18, 2014

    As many of you know, I act for Nicky Hager. I vetted his book, Dirty Politics, and the three before that.

    It is a surreal experience watching what happens to Nicky’s books in the days after their publication. It often seems as if the book that’s being discussed by politicians and in the media is entirely different from the one I’ve just spent weeks vetting.

    What’s more amazing is that politicians who admit they haven’t read the book and don’t intend to are given free rein to speak authoritatively about its content. Often they say things that are completely contradicted by evidence that’s set out in the book, but aren’t even challenged about it. Nicky is often accused of being a “conspiracy theorist” as if this is an answer to the evidence he sets out in the book.

    This time around, though, my sense is that things are different. The government’s denials are such blatant flannel that they are being seen as beyond the pale, even by our most grizzled political journalists, who have seen plenty of spin in their time.

    I want to go through some of the spin. I want to do that because the Prime Minister is claiming repeatedly that Nicky has “made stuff up”, that he’s in cahoots with the “Fuck John Key” mob and the “Planet Key” song-writer and the effigy burners, and that he’s done it to distract attention from the real issues.

    Let’s just pause on that last one. Anyone with even a nodding acquaintance with Nicky or his writing, whether they agree with him or not, surely cannot escape one conclusion: Nicky’s goal is to get us talking about the real issues, and to expose and critique the tactics that are used to derail genuine political engagement. In fact, Dirty Politics is about exactly that.

    I have to say, I really wish Mr Key had displayed this same affection for debating the issues when Nicky put out Other People’s Wars, a book about New Zealand’s hidden foreign policy during conflicts in Afghanistan and Iraq, based on hundreds of leaked defence documents and interviews with insiders, written over the course of ten years. Key’s response? It’s a “conspiracy theory”.

    Then there’s the insistence that Nicky makes stuff up and that the allegations are “unravelling”. So what has he got wrong?

    National’s involvement in the ”hacking” of the Labour Party database?Nicky doesn’t call it a hack. He exposes and criticises the collaboration between the PM’s office and Cameron Slater. He says they accessed the database, dug around, and downloaded information.

    John Key on Thursday said repeatedly that “National had nothing to do with it.” Yet in almost the same breath, he admitted that his staffer Jason Ede might well have gone in and had a look. But that had “nothing to do with National”.

    In fact, National has also acknowledged that “it appears” a staffer downloaded files. Dirty Politics sets out correspondence between Ede and Slater discussing the information. While Nicky makes it clear that the site was insecure, it’s an open question, as a matter of law, whether this means it was not a crime to go digging around in it.

    The PM’s involvement in the extraordinary early release of SIS briefing notes to Slater under the OIA? Nicky says that given the PM was minister for the SIS, the briefing notes were a hot potato, and they got declassified and released to a partisan blogger within days of a request, it looks like the PM knew about it. “The head of the SIS would surely never have done anything so unusual, so public, and so political without their minister’s knowledge and approval,” he suggests. He quotes Cameron Slater emailing friends about it, boasting about the fact that the information was on the way, would be “catastrophic”, and that he had been “sworn to secrecy”.

    The PM told journalists last Thursday, ”it was nothing to do with me.” Phil Goff disagrees. The Dominion Post notes that they put in a request for almost the same information at the time and were turned down. This really doesn’t look to me like something that’s been disproved, or can be dismissed as “baseless”.

    It raises serious questions about the PM’s involvement. I see that blogger The Ruminator says that in 2009 someone in (Corrections Minister at the time) Judith Collins’ office called up to expedite an OIA request to Cameron Slater, pressing for it to be processed within half an hour. And we should remember that Dirty Politics cites other instances of Ede drafting OIA requests for Slater (though the evidence Nicky received doesn’t show him drafting this one).

    The alleged attempted blackmail of Rodney Hide? Nicky claimed that Cameron Slater and Simon Lusk conspired to get hold of some compromising text messages sent by (then ACT leader) Rodney Hide, to try to pressure him into resigning. (Let’s not mince words here: Lusk writes they should tell Hide someone has the texts “and will leak them if he doesn’t resign by friday.”)

    Nicky quotes Slater’s subsequent blog post, which contains hints about Hide so broad you could land a plane on them. Hide resigned shortly afterward. DimPost outlines Hide’s adamant refusal to resign until that point. Dirty Politics says there’s no evidence of any direct threat made to Hide, and there may well have been other reasons for Hide’s resignation.

    Hide has laughed off the suggestions that he was blackmailed or that this had anything to do with his resignation. But that doesn’t really answer the point, does it? Was there a plan to blackmail him? It seems there was. It can’t be said, anyway, that this suggestion is a “wild allegation” or ”made up” or ”a conspiracy theory” or “baseless”.
    Judith Collins passing on the name of a civil servant so he could be excoriated by Slater? Judith Collins admits she passed on the name to Slater. The PM was asked repeatedly whether this was acceptable behaviour on Morning Report this morning and kept trying to change the subject.
    Judith Collins passing on information to Cameron Slater about ACC client Bronwen Pullar? Steven Joyce says this is “completely false”. But Cameron Slater’s messages to a friend at the time say he’s spoken to Collins about it, that he knows the information is in a spreadsheet not a database, that he knows Pullar’s identity (though he doesn’t name her), that she “tried to get money for it” and that she is about to get “rat-fucked”.

    This all happens shortly before the Pullar/Boag email was leaked to the press. Dirty Politics notes it could have been leaked by ACC or the email’s author Michelle Boag. But Nicky suggests that Judith Collins’ office had more incentive to leak it. Of course, Collins denies this. But again, it can hardly be said that this allegation is fabricated or groundless or wild, or that it’s been proved wrong.

    All Nicky’s books contain “left-wing conspiracy theories and don’t stack up”, particularly Seeds of Distrust? The allegations in Seeds of Distrust were submitted to exhaustive scrutiny in the Select Committee’s inquiry into Corngate. That inquiry was controversial and the committee was divided. But half of the members thought Nicky basically got it right – including all the National Party members.

    Anything else? As far as I can tell, there is not a jot of evidence that Nicky has “made stuff up.” Nor is there any that his reporting is “baseless”, or that he “doesn’t want facts” as the PM puts it. Judith Collins has called the bits about her mostly lies. But she’s admitted the passing-on-of-the-name allegation, admitted that she has been in frequent contact with Cameron Slater, and said that she wouldn’t be able to sue because the book was full of speculation and might-bes. That doesn’t sound like lies to me. Let’s just treat that as praise for the careful and honest way that Nicky has separated out what he knows from what he’s not sure about, so readers can make up their own minds about the evidence he presents.
    I note there has been a roaring silence from others criticised in the book, such as PR agent Carrick Graham and political consultant Simon Lusk. These do not strike me as men who are incapable of putting out their side.
    Nicky’s allegations are based on a 150-page book with 500 footnoted sources, most of them from emails that Cameron Slater has admitted were taken from him.

    What are your allegations that he “made stuff up” based on, Mr Key?

    …………………
    _______________________________________________________________________________________________

    Posted in the interests of informed, intelligent debate.

    Yep – I know this is Kiwiblog – but what the hell!

    Here goes ……..

    Penny Bright

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  246. nasska (12,111 comments) says:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/yg0m4s5p4orczon/Cuckoo%2020.gif

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  247. Griff (8,419 comments) says:

    Yip go to conservative sites to prove faux news tells it like it is. Well done Shawn
    Next you will be posting the collected wisdom of Glenn Beck.

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  248. freemark (676 comments) says:

    Hey D4J
    I’m part of another site where you reasonably have issues with the FC in NZ.
    I do notice however that you have been outed for posting under multiple identities & agreeing with yourself.
    Are you the Lurcher here as well?
    Credibility on the line IMVHO…

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  249. stigie (1,458 comments) says:

    What was all that about Penny ?

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  250. dad4justice (6,595 comments) says:

    freemark ask Farrar he will tell you.

    What “other” site you talking about you sly lying freak?

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  251. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    Ugly – “The point made by Hager was that by going to WheelOil/VRWC they can get the desired spin without having to deal with the usual journalistic standards of the MSM.”

    ROFLMFAO.

    So easy to pretend that you know what you are talking about.

    Are you saying that Hager didn’t make that point, or that the point isn’t true?

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  252. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    hat “other” site you talking about you sly lying freak?

    The Pete Sinclair marmite jar appreciation society.

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  253. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    stigie! You should have asked penny: What was al………………………………………….l that about! :)

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  254. Nostradamus (2,439 comments) says:

    Nasska:

    I’m asking a lot, I know, but could you put your cuckoo links before Penny Not-So’s comments (together with an embedded hyperlink to the next comment after hers)?

    Most of the Kiwiblog community (at least those of us with mouse scroll-wheels) will be eternally grateful!

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  255. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    stigie says:

    “What was all that about Penny ?”

    Beats me.
    You didn’t read it either?

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  256. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    publicwatchdog (2,177 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 6:57 pm

    http://www.medialawjournal.co.nz/?p=635

    Did Nicky Hager “make stuff up”?

    By Steven | August 18, 2014

    As many of you know, I act for Nicky Hager. I vetted his book, Dirty Politics, and the three before that.

    Thanks, Penny, very informative.

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  257. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Yip go to conservative sites to prove faux news tells it like it is. Well done Shawn”

    Two are conservative. One is neutral. One is liberal. And a Pew study.

    And be fair Griff, Stephie did start out with Forward Progressives. And pretty much stopped there. :)

    According the the rules of internet debate, which I have just now invented, my flush beats Stephie’s one of a kind! ;)

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  258. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Hager and the Horrible!

    You folks can decide who’s who! :)

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  259. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    stigie (957 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:05 pm

    What was all that about Penny ?

    Which part would you like help with, stigie?

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  260. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Next you will be posting the collected wisdom of Glenn Beck.”

    While I admire his values, I think Beck is a bit of a loon. Kinda reminds me of Red. :)

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  261. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    Speaking of loons….. :)

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  262. Griff (8,419 comments) says:

    Yoza
    The part when penny posts screeds of crap no one reads.

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  263. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Rule two Shawn. Sidetracking dedicated nutters by talking sheepfucking gets them on the back foot! :)

    I can see you’re onto it! :)

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  264. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Has dad landed yet?

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  265. stigie (1,458 comments) says:

    For the life of me, i just cant work it out Yoza ole chap!~

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  266. freemark (676 comments) says:

    dad4justice (7,892 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:07 pm
    freemark ask Farrar he will tell you.

    What “other” site you talking about you sly lying freak?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    Dad, the site is menz.org.
    If I have it wrong I apologise, but I don’t think I do.
    If I have it right you have just made a real fuckwit of yourself.

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  267. UglyTruth (4,554 comments) says:

    @stigie

    Did Nicky Hager “make stuff up”?

    Short answer: no

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  268. Nostradamus (2,439 comments) says:

    Johnboy:

    Ssshhh – he’s trying to concentrate with a laptop on his knee!

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  269. dad4justice (6,595 comments) says:

    Wrong freemark never been there in my life. Got more malicious lies to throw at me, or is that it for today?

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  270. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    It’s easy stigie.

    Satrt with a cry for attention.

    Follow with “facts”, or at least Penny’s version of them. Take with a grain of salt.

    Follow “facts” with vitrioloic and hysterically over the top demands for various people to resign.

    End with a screed about how terribly, terribly important and famous she is.

    Repeat process.

    And that’s Penny’s rants in a nutshell. :)

    The actual content is irrelevant.

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  271. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    He’s just an amateur Nostra. Look at what erudite stuff I’ve posted tonight with a well-fleeced Merino ewe in suspenders and a garter belt (what’s gasping for it) on my knee! :)

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  272. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Evening Dad. Did Richie give you soft landing that you could walk away from (if a tad bandy) then ! :)

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  273. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    Dad, the site is menz.org.

    Kid fucker Potter’s site, charming.

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  274. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    “Did Nicky Hager “make stuff up”?”

    Correct answer. Yes.

    The evidence content is thin. The majority of the book is his opinion, his narrative about what the content supposedly means. And that is from a deeply partisan Left wing opinion. So that part of the book is, rightly speaking, made up.

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  275. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    Griff (6,957 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:26 pm

    Yoza
    The part when penny posts screeds of crap no one reads.

    Steve Price seems to have covered all the bases Key and the associated Nat. party apparatchiks have been whining about since the release of Dirty Politics. I thought it was a succinct overview of how close Nicky Hager has cut to the bone. Although,
    I think Penny is asking a little too much when requesting intelligent debate on a subject that makes Key look like a dirty conniving little shit.

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  276. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    So Collins ‘barely knew’ Bhatnagar – that was yesterday. Today – it is revealed she had given him a top job

    http://www.3news.co.nz/Collins-gave-job-to-Whale-Oil-tipster/tabid/1607/articleID/357323/Default.aspx

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  277. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    ShawnLH (4,302 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:39 pm
    “Did Nicky Hager “make stuff up”?”

    Correct answer. Yes.

    The evidence content is thin. The majority of the book is his opinion, his narrative about what the content supposedly means. And that is from a deeply partisan Left wing opinion. So that part of the book is, rightly speaking, made up.

    Specifics, Shawn. What exactly did Hager ‘make up’. Or is being a parrot your only trick?

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  278. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    freemark (491 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:04 pm
    Hey D4J
    I’m part of another site where you reasonably have issues with the FC in NZ.
    I do notice however that you have been outed for posting under multiple identities & agreeing with yourself.
    Are you the Lurcher here as well?
    Credibility on the line IMVHO

    Dont post like a fuckwit freemark and im not sloboil or DAD im lurcher, thief in latin(,to lurch)…me myself

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  279. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Shit happens Judith H1 gave H2 a job on the taxpayers tit!

    How big is your arse? :)

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  280. ShawnLH (6,707 comments) says:

    Well the loons are out in force. :)

    Bye all.

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  281. freemark (676 comments) says:

    D4J
    If I’m mistaken, like I said I apologise. I have empathy with your issues if it is you.
    If however you are slandering me, I hope you have an Iron Dome or something…

    “Family Court Changes, Unhappy lawyers at MENZ Issues
    Aug 2, 2012 … dad4justice says: Sat 4th August 2012 at 6:03 pm. FALSE ALLEGATIONS MADE TO FAMILY COURT 2001 = PROTECTION ORDERS.
    menz.org.nz/2012/family-court-changes-unhappy-lawyers/”

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  282. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    ShawnLH (4,303 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:43 pm

    Well the loons are out in force. :)

    Bye all.

    And Mr ‘nothingtoseehere’ scurries back under his rock.

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  283. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Here you go Kiwibloggers!

    Seen this petition calling on Prime Minister John Key to sack Judith Collins?

    http://www.change.org/en-AU/petitions/john-key-sack-judith-collins?utm_medium=email&utm_source=notification&utm_campaign=new_petition_recruit#share

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

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  284. Reid (16,740 comments) says:

    Steve Price seems to have covered all the bases

    Yoza everyone knows lefties are pretending they don’t engage in dirty politics while flinging as much of it as fast as your girly hands can and sadly, for you, you’ve chosen to fling it at a guy who specialises in it.

    It’s going to be very very bad for you girly men and the screeching harridans you’ve been unfortunate enough to partner up with because Whale’s going to strip you all naked so the public can see you as you really truly are: scrawny, petulant, girly whiners with no ethics whatsoever.

    So go ahead, have your day in the sun while your compliant media (I thought you said they were tewwibly biased against you, BTW: how does that work?) attempts vainly to spread the memes you’re attempting to spread, for it will end, very soon indeed.

    And won’t that be sad. For you.

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  285. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Soon as I find grandads old pencil sharpener I’ll sharpen my pencil and sign it Penny.

    Now where did that silly old bastard hide it again? :)

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  286. freemark (676 comments) says:

    cha (3,818 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:38 pm
    Dad, the site is menz.org.

    Kid fucker Potter’s site, charming.

    Hey Cha
    I’m thinking you are the same Cha as on the Waiheke Branch of The Standard.
    Did you miss the bit in the news recently about politically aligned/paid people on blogs?
    You might want to be careful about where you throw your filth in case it boomerangs.
    Just saying…

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  287. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    Have you actually READ ‘Dirty Politics’ yet Sheepish Shorn – or are you just doing a John Key and talking through your nether regions?

    (Meant of course in a caring way :)

    Do feel free to respond in your customary intelligent and reasoned way ………..

    Come on!

    I know you can’t help yourself.

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

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  288. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    Judith (8,171 comments) says:

    August 18th, 2014 at 7:40 pm

    So Collins ‘barely knew’ Bhatnagar
    ******

    Is this shit for real ???????????????????????

    Is someone trying to say that Bhatnagar “needed” a job so Slater/Collins organised one for him?

    You mean just like all the job that Clark got for Mike Fat Tony Williams.

    Anyone who treats this as important is just plain desperate …. and silly.

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  289. dad4justice (6,595 comments) says:

    “Aug 2, 2012 … dad4justice says: Sat 4th August 2012 at 6:03 pm”

    Sorry to disappoint you freemark but I did not make that comment. As you seem to be relatively new here, I think if you go back and check over the past years that dad4justice impostors have caused considerable anxiety for myself. I suppose I should have expected such tactics from the feminazi’s in the Family Court.

    “If however you are slandering me, I hope you have an Iron Dome or something…”

    Is that a threat freemark?

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  290. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    Reid (16,056 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 7:52 pm

    [Yoza]Steve Price seems to have covered all the bases

    Yoza everyone knows lefties are pretending they don’t engage in dirty politics while flinging as much of it as fast as your girly hands can and sadly, for you, you’ve chosen to fling it at a guy who specialises in it.

    Slater and his little band of National party apparatchiks have been comprehensively exposed as a bunch of nasty little creeps and John Key appears to be ‘up to his nuts in guts’ in the whole sordid affair.

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  291. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    So Steven Price has no problem with hacked emails, surely legal ethics(not an oxymoron) comes into that somewhere?

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  292. Reid (16,740 comments) says:

    Have you actually READ ‘Dirty Politics’ yet Sheepish Shorn…?

    Penny if you’ve read it, who gave you the money to buy it, or who paid for it so the library could give it to you?

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  293. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    You might want to be careful about where you throw your filth in case it boomerangs.

    Woohoo! – my first ever….

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  294. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Pleased to see that you appreciate my sensible and reasoned commentary on the lefty things that get you high Penny! :)

    In answer to your question.

    I took one look at that cadaverous, scrawny, little turd Hager when he first appeared on TV having a go at Helen and realised straight away he was just another attention-seeker that probably got badly treated as a child by his mummy.

    Since then I have ignored him. I suggest all other sensible folk do the same! :)

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  295. nasska (12,111 comments) says:

    I was talking to a mate of mine about work and he said, “I have a tremendous amount of job satisfaction in my employment.”

    “Why what do you do?”

    “I am an undertaker in South Auckland.”

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  296. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    Heh Penny Shithead…..

    Imagine that you took a world view 180 degrees opposite to your every day meanderings. Can you do that for all us tolerant folk here at Kiwiblog?

    Ok. You will?

    Now go to the Standard and see how much of your “crap” (that is how they would describe sensible comment) is allowed on their democratic, and clean political blog.

    Care to guess??? Answer: Zip!

    You are a dumbass. But perhaps, on your death bed, you will recant… and pay your rates.

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  297. Lucia Maria (2,660 comments) says:

    Seen this petition calling on Prime Minister John Key to sack Judith Collins?

    Maybe a petition to disband the Green Party (and Labour, while we are at it) is in order.

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  298. freemark (676 comments) says:

    Dad.
    Give it up while you still have a small shred of cred.
    I understand how you can get your head fucked up by family issues, like I said I empathise.
    Your target should be the Socialists however, not the right thinking people here.
    You’ll do your cause & fight to be with your kids no good nutting off while being so easily identifiable, & implausible.
    Good luck, don’t fuck me or other decent people around.

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  299. dad4justice (6,595 comments) says:

    So freemark we on the same page, however don’t start a flame war by saying you think I am lurcher.

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  300. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    goldnkiwi (1,087 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 8:08 pm

    So Steven Price has no problem with hacked emails, surely legal ethics(not an oxymoron) comes into that somewhere?

    This is in the public good. The Pentagon Papers, Snowden’s NSA exposure, Assange/Manning’s collateral murder exposé. This form of subterfuge is acceptable if it is exposing malevolence that threatens the public’s well being. This is a legitimate form of whistle-blowing, these cockroaches needed to be exposed to the light.

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  301. Lucia Maria (2,660 comments) says:

    Or better yet, a petition to send DotCom to the US. I’d sign it.

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  302. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    Yoza (1,630 comments) says:

    August 18th, 2014 at 8:23 pm

    How peculiar, I take the opposite view, the sunlight needs to be shone on those that are complicit in the theft of private property. Let alone profiting from it.

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  303. Reid (16,740 comments) says:

    Slater and his little band of National party apparatchiks have been comprehensively exposed as a bunch of nasty little creeps and John Key appears to be ‘up to his nuts in guts’ in the whole sordid affair.

    No Yoza the fact is they’ve been subject to smears by a bunch of nasty little creeps frustrated that for six years they’ve been unable to gain any traction whatsoever so they decided to orchestrate a litany of lies.

    I’m not worried at all. In fact I’m surprised it’s taken you guys this long to get around to doing it. One assumes your carefully calculated timing is because you hallucinate the public will operate like the particularly stupid sheep you lefties hallucinate them to be, easily manipulated by your cynical, evil machinations which show nothing of the ethical stance you constantly bray drives you but which you and I and all the beltway knows actually does nothing but mask your lizard-like cold, dark hearts.

    We know who you are, Yoza and we know you’re 180 degrees from your public presentation of yourselves.

    You’ve made a mistake though, you’ve crossed a line. In the past your shenanigans have been tolerated but now you, by your evil actions have forced our hand, and now you can expect no mercy in the public destruction of your reputation. Which is imminent.

    But like the girly men you lefties are, you won’t tie said destructions to the consequences of your own actions. No. Like children, you think you’ve done nothing wrong. Don’t you. Sorry pal. You’re playing big boys games, penalties are required for misbehaviour. The hammer will be falling Yoza.

    Sleep well.

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  304. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    Deep breaths, Reid.

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  305. doggone7 (850 comments) says:

    Johnboy; “…I took one look at that…”

    Ah, political credibility by appearances! So Hager misses out and you’re going with Slater? Mmmmmmmm…..

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  306. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    I hate it when them lefties try to treat us like sheep reid! :)

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  307. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Whales are nice. Stick insects are yucky dogone7! :)

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  308. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    goldnkiwi (1,088 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 8:30 pm

    Yoza (1,630 comments) says:

    August 18th, 2014 at 8:23 pm

    How peculiar, I take the opposite view, the sunlight needs to be shone on those that are complicit in the theft of private property. Let alone profiting from it.

    There is a passage where Cactus Kate urges Hooton, Farrar and Slater to publicise Hager’s address so very rich Chinese people might deal to him, and you are saying this form of terrorism should remain hidden?

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  309. EAD (1,454 comments) says:

    That is true Reid. These “useful idiots” who support whatever malignant, liberal cause, naively believe themselves to be a force for good

    Once these useful idiots have been used to overthrow the basis of Western Civilization , they will be the first ones lined up against the wall and shot as they take down the scenery, pull back the curtains, move the tables and chairs out of the way and the liberals will then see the brick wall at the back of the theatre.

    They don’t read history and understand that the first ones the Bolsheviks, Pol Pot, Mao et al. lined up against the wall were the intellectual class once they’d been used to achieve their goals.

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  310. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    dad4justice (7,895 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 8:21 pm
    So freemark we on the same page, however don’t start a flame war by saying you think I am lurcher.

    Wise words Dad,leave me out of it.

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  311. Johnboy (17,051 comments) says:

    Quite right EAD. You can understand them shooting the rich but what sane bastards would shoot the peasants?

    I mean for fucks sake who would clean the drains etc. Yuk yuk yuk! :)

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  312. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    Yoza (1,632 comments) says:

    August 18th, 2014 at 8:46 pm

    Did it happen? Private communications should be just that. If the police, GCSB etc consider that there has been a ‘crime’ then they have evidence and get a warrant. Where is the authority for a hacker to take it upon themselves to be an ‘authority’.

    Personally I think what is happening is treasonous. My opinion is that we have quite benign governance so why is there such a concerted attack to ‘bring down the government? .com, other political parties? Self interest not for the public good.

    As for the perceived threat, not sure if I have seen you on a Bain associated thread, go have a look, now that is toxic. :)

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  313. Jack5 (5,286 comments) says:

    Unless Hager the Horrible (HH) reveals his source so that the emails can be verified as authentic, all of HH’s “revelations” are untested and unproven. Some or the whole lot may be forgeries, either by HH or by his alleged source, or those behind the alleged source.

    How easy to print out alleged emails, or to post alleged emails to some site.

    One thing l puzzles. Why did the anti-Semitic poster vandals apparently synchronise their nastiness with the HH release? What is the connection between HH and Herr Dotcom? HH’s statements about his visits to Herr Dotcom have so far been unconvincing.

    I’m astonished the MSM in its excitement at being able to rip into Key and National are ignoring the veracity tests. Has the Hooerald, which apparently seems to be in touch with what HH alleges is his source, made any forensic attempts to prove the veracity of the emails? That would entail learning how and when they were hacked, with method disclosed. Not merely accepting some statement from some HH source.

    I’m unconvinced there is no link between HH’s alleged source for the latest leaks, and his alleged source for the hack that sank Don Brash and National much earlier.

    HH initially tried to pass off the hack as part of or related to a DOS attack. So either he is ready to lie about his alleged source, or he is a computer illiterate (which is very unlikely).

    Sadly, many even in National swallowed HH’s bullshit that the much earlier Brash emails were an inside leak. So I suppose there is some justice in National being caught again by HH.

    IMHO, the prime suspect is still a rogue leftist in, or with strong connections to, the GCSB, and that bullshit from HH and his allies is to throw everyone off the scent. However, I’m intrigued by HH’s visits to Hefty Herman the Lefty German.

    Tens of good right-wing hackers would relish being loosed on HH’s trail. Will anyone in National let the dogs out?

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  314. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    Jack5 (4,713 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 8:57 pm

    Unless Hager the Horrible (HH) reveals his source so that the emails can be verified as authentic, all of HH’s “revelations” are untested and unproven. Some or the whole lot may be forgeries, either by HH or by his alleged source, or those behind the alleged source.

    Watching John Key stumble throw a growing queue of interviews should be enough to convince any sane person these emails exist and are extraordinarily damaging. The ‘nice guy’, ‘easy go lucky’ persona that has been so carefully cultivated during Key’s reign is being seriously threatened by this PR disaster – without the Key personality cult National are in a hole.

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  315. RightNow (7,015 comments) says:

    So your argument is Key is being hounded my the media therefore we should believe he is guilty of something?

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  316. stephieboy (3,535 comments) says:

    Shawn L H,
    MSNBC etc pale in comparison ,

    Examples ,

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News_Channel_controversies#Photo_manipulation

    Inside the Fox Lie Machine
    ,
    http://www.salon.com/2013/10/18/inside_the_fox_news_lie_machine_i_fact_checked_sean_hannity_on_obamacare/

    and RT for a change declares the Truth about something ,

    Confirmed: Fox News makes people dumb

    http://rt.com/usa/fox-people-study-watch-055/

    Glen Beck’s complicity in the Fox lie machine,

    http://mediamatters.org/research/2011/04/06/the-50-worst-things-glenn-beck-said-on-fox-news/178421

    What If… Fox News Covered The Marvel Universe?

    http://thedailybanter.com/2014/06/fox-news-covered-marvel-universe/

    Fox has a sulk and fails to report the Republican led House Committee Intelligence report clearing the Obama administration of any wrong doing over Benghazi ,

    http://thedailybanter.com/2014/08/listen-fox-news-covers-house-benghazi-report-vindicating-obam

    And on it goes.

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  317. Reid (16,740 comments) says:

    Unless Hager the Horrible (HH) reveals his source

    No the question is, where did the source get it from. Trace it back. Through multiple hands. To the real source.

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  318. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Johnboy (15,374 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 8:42 pm
    I hate it when them lefties try to treat us like sheep reid!

    It’s not the lefties treating us like sheep.

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/u37dvm7ef3ir56m/1977484_10203263957063157_381467780_n.jpg

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  319. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    RightNow (6,771 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 9:11 pm

    So your argument is Key is being hounded my the media therefore we should believe he is guilty of something?

    No, my argument is the content of the emails is so terrifying for Key he is refusing to answer questions and is attempting to talk over interviewers, which in turn is aggravating those in the media who are generally docile.

    goldnkiwi (1,089 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 8:57 pm

    Did it happen? Private communications should be just that. If the police, GCSB etc consider that there has been a ‘crime’ then they have evidence and get a warrant. Where is the authority for a hacker to take it upon themselves to be an ‘authority’.

    Personally I think what is happening is treasonous. My opinion is that we have quite benign governance so why is there such a concerted attack to ‘bring down the government? .com, other political parties? Self interest not for the public good.

    It is those who exercise the greatest degree of authority who should be subject to the greatest degree of scrutiny. If it is treasonous to question the legitimacy of the activities of National party proxies then we seriously need to redefine the definition of treason.

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  320. Left Right and Centre (3,014 comments) says:

    Whoa . . . Reid . . . go you good thing . . . what a bitch-slapping – go boy

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  321. Reid (16,740 comments) says:

    It’s not the lefties treating us like sheep.

    The thing about sheep Judith is they don’t know they are one.

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  322. stigie (1,458 comments) says:

    Well fuck me, has Judith taken a trip over the hill to Wainui and taken a photo of Johnboys sheep ?

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  323. Nostalgia-NZ (5,323 comments) says:

    Was Collins a ‘leaker’ before JK’s arrival, was it something that already existed and which he became lulled into thinking that it was par for the course or price to pay for internal, party, support? Right at the moment he looks flustered, perhaps its because of something he inherited from within some of the party when he entered politics – a way of doing things that was engrained for some in the Executive or those aspiring leadership.

    Judith Collins has displayed venom toward her predecessor, spoken about ensuring people fear her ‘if’ they don’t love her, paying ‘back double.’ It’s likely that it will be exposed in Court that she doesn’t appreciate what ‘Executive Powers and responsibility’ are – that in fact they are not tools at her disposal to go about settling ‘pay back,’ of old or imagined scores – even the return of ‘favours.’ With the words ‘executive’ and ‘prerogative’ time seems to have moved back to the days when a King or Queen ruled only with fear, set out to ensure the safety of their reign against the merest hint of treachery. In that scene, who walks forward into the Royal Court with the other’s head displayed on a tray, JK or the benefactor of his generosity?

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  324. adc (558 comments) says:

    well, I think JK is going to have to turn around on this one, and time is running out.

    I can understand he doesn’t want to make a judgement without considering facts, and Espiner shouldn’t try to force that issue, just like he wouldn’t wander into a court at the start of a trial and try to force the Judge to give a verdict there and then. But the allegation is serious enough (breach of privacy), that it needs to be investigated and answered.

    There are 2 issues around the labour website breach. The nature of how the data was accessed, which has been

    * handled clumsily by JK and the media
    * handled dishonestly by Cunliffe and the Herald, talking about infiltration and exploitation of security vulnerabilities.

    And what was done with the information, which is a bigger issue. JK can’t ignore the second issue, and that means he will need to burn Jason Ede.

    As for whether there is dirt in politics, “dirty politics” is a tautology and most people feel that and are sickened by it. I think a more popular stance would be instead of saying everyone does it so it’s ok, even if JK said everyone does it and it’s an unfortunate and unpleasant side of politics he’d move onto the right side of the voters on it. It’s fundamentally not OK, but we would be kidding ourselves if we thought some parties don’t do it.

    How both sides are dealing with this is creating some opportunities that are being squandered as well. Nobody is pulling Cunliffe up on his outrageous claims.

    Tick tock.

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  325. Jack5 (5,286 comments) says:

    Reid posted at 9.13:

    No the question is, where did the source get it from…

    The source needs to prove he or she did get it from someone else, that the hack is clean and any downloaded material has not been adulterated for political purposes, whether the material is genuine or any part of it is genuine.

    I’m no lawyer, but doesn’t the anonymity of this major attack at election time by Hager the Horrible in some way attack an ancient Western political right. This is the right of being able to identify your accuser. This goes back to the Romans not carrying out the death penalty on a person before that person was able to exercise his right to face his accuser.

    Wikipedia explains that the 6th amendment of the US Constitution provides that “in all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right…to be confronted with the witnesses against him.”

    HH’s hacks are initially a political matter, but in the views of many they are illegal. Surely the targets have the right to know the sources of the allegations of what they are claimed to have been stating in emails. This guy is frigging around with a general election. If he is bullshitting, this may not be proved until after the election, and in the meantime is Leftist friends will benefit.

    HH alleges anonymity protects his source, but there is a question over whether he is a bona fide journalist. He said on TV that he was a writer, and that is not necessarily equivalent to being an authorised journalist with some rights, such as access to court coverage and so on.

    For fuck’s sake National, get some decent hackers on HH’s trail. If this leads to the international hackers known as Anonymous, let us voters know that these international bandits are interfering with our electoral process.

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  326. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    Yoza (1,634 comments) says:

    August 18th, 2014 at 9:29 pm

    What rot, I can think of many postings on facebook that I consider unwise but which are written in the heat of emotion, but they at least are known to be in a public forum. I would consider my emails benign but I believe private communications are exactly that, private, or do you think the disclaimers regarding being the intended recipient often found beneath communications are only to be adhered to by some?

    Was Whale Oil trying to bring the elected government down or something? That would be seditious. The level of loathing and hatred for ones fellow man evidenced by all this crap is not my idea of NZ as a paradise.

    Every indicator I have seen puts NZ as an admirable place to be economically and socially ffs what more do some of you people want. We are already the envy of many anecdotally, clearly that is not enough.

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  327. Nostalgia-NZ (5,323 comments) says:

    Obviously things are not all good in fairy land, or even down the isles between the wine and whisky.

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  328. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    Aisles

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  329. Nostalgia-NZ (5,323 comments) says:

    Sure.

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  330. SGA (1,276 comments) says:

    goldnkiwi at 10:04 pm

    Aisles

    Or not, perhaps it’s somewhere in the Channel between Scotland and France?

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  331. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    Jack5 (4,714 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 9:50 pm

    For fuck’s sake, National get some decent hackers on HH’s trail. If this leads to the international hackers known as Anonymous, let us voters know that these international bandits are interfering with our electoral process.

    Did you just drop out of a vacuum Jack5? Nicky Hager would have been the subject of intense GCSB scrutiny since he connected them to the 5-eyes network in 1996 in his book Secret Power – New Zealand’s Role in the International Spy Network.

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  332. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    goldnkiwi (1,091 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 9:56 pm

    What rot, I can think of many postings on facebook that I consider unwise but which are written in the heat of emotion, but they at least are known to be in a public forum. I would consider my emails benign but I believe private communications are exactly that, private, or do you think the disclaimers regarding being the intended recipient often found beneath communications are only to be adhered to by some?

    Was Whale Oil trying to bring the elected government down or something? That would be seditious. The level of loathing and hatred for ones fellow man evidenced by all this crap is not my idea of NZ as a paradise.

    Slater and his cohorts were/are undermining the democratic process by attempting to discredit and intimidate critics of the Key regime, they are acting against the interests of the New Zealand public by performing in such a way.
    Privately conspiring to undermine the public good is not a private activity and should, obviously, be subjected to public scrutiny.

    It’s not that hard to understand, goldenkiwi.

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  333. adc (558 comments) says:

    Yoza, except what do you do if your opponents are doing it, or you have information that proves they are lying so you want to use it.

    I guess they feel it’s war out there.

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  334. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    SGA (907 comments) says:

    August 18th, 2014 at 10:07 pm

    Surely Isles with a capital then? It was not a benign random statement SGA. I know what is behind that pseudonym and I know that it knows who I am ;) I do not usually acknowledge its existence but I do so hate spelling mistakes. :)

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  335. Reid (16,740 comments) says:

    Did you just drop out of a vacuum Jack5? Nicky Hager would have been the subject of intense GCSB scrutiny since he connected them to the 5-eyes network in 1996 in his book…

    And Yoza “knows” this, how?

    Because he hallucinates this is “how things work?”

    Or does he have any evidence?

    And does the incongruity of his hallucination that this is really what is happening with the fact “the state” has clearly been blindsided by Hagar’s revelations, make any difference to this fevered yet truly held, tightly held, “belief?”

    No, of course not.

    Conclusion:

    Yoza believes what he wants to believe. Like an evil cop on the force he deliberately discards evidence that conflicts with his chosen fantasy about whodunnit. He approves of evidence planting because he hallucinates he knows best, never mind the proof. And just like the evil cop, he hides behind the uniform, the front of the good and faithful lefty, who wants to help people and just be kind, because he weally weally weally cares.

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  336. SGA (1,276 comments) says:

    adc at 10:24 pm

    I guess they feel it’s war out there.

    The descriptions within The Prince have the general theme of accepting that the aims of princes—such as glory and survival—can justify the use of immoral means to achieve those ends.
    “ He who neglects what is done for what ought to be done, sooner effects his ruin than his preservation. ”
    —Machiavelli, “Chapter 15″, The Prince, Wikisource

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  337. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    Yoza (1,636 comments) says:

    August 18th, 2014 at 10:22 pm

    Funny that is exactly how I feel about the diminutive .com who does not even belong here. Seems to me that Whale is pretty open about his allegiances, biases and purposes. Perhaps Nicky would like to show and tell his own emails?

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  338. flipper (4,332 comments) says:

    Heh Nos…

    Loved your earlier (9.47). :-)

    Power was as good as his word, and the agreed process was endorsed by the Cabinet.

    Collins was nothing less than …. well, I re-read OTB’s analysis this afternoon. Love to post it all here, but it runs to about 21,000 words. Then there was the follow-up.

    If Collins thought Oravida was a problem…. well that 5000 ton Binnie freight train is still roaring down the tracks at 85mph, and Collins + the porno judge are still trying to emulate the old time railroad “brakeman”.

    But that cunning “judge”, and former Police/Thomas Royal Commission attack dog, gave himself a “get out of jail free card”, by saying Binnie might have reached the same conclusions even if he had followed Fisher’s childish academic process.

    As I have said before, there will be only one National Party looser (post September 20) in all of this – Judith Collins.

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  339. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    adc (580 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 10:24 pm

    Yoza, except what do you do if your opponents are doing it, or you have information that proves they are lying so you want to use it.

    I guess they feel it’s war out there.

    The government controls a serious chunk of New Zealand’s economy, the depths to which some have demonstrated they are prepared to descend to ensure their cabal maintains its influence over that chunk of the economy has gone beyond the ‘cut and thrust’ of politics as usual.

    I think this episode will be the event that defines John Key’s contribution to New Zealand’s political history. Rob Muldoon: Think Big. David Lange: Rogernomics. Jim Bolger: Rogernomics. Jenny Shipley: Rogernomics. Helen Clark: Rogernomics. John Key: Dirty Politics.

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  340. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    Good night, Reid. :)

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  341. Jack5 (5,286 comments) says:

    Yoza posted at 11.10:

    Nicky Hager would have been the subject of intense GCSB scrutiny since he connected them to the 5-eyes network in 1996 …

    Would have been????

    More speculation, just like Hager the Horrible. An ounce of fact, a pound of extrapolation and leftist interpretation. Then off to bed.

    Two hundred or so people at least in the GCSB, and one of them is likely to be a rogue leftist who is the central hacker.

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  342. goldnkiwi (1,617 comments) says:

    And if he isn’t/wasn’t I damn well hope he is now along with all his known ‘cohorts’. His idea of the public good and mine are world’s apart. Gee I hope the language isn’t too strong!!!

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  343. cha (4,144 comments) says:

    From tonights news.(NSFW)

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  344. publicwatchdog (3,162 comments) says:

    How many decent members and supporters of the National Party are as appalled and disgusted as growing numbers of New Zealanders and are realising that their Party is being led by venal, corrupt cockroaches who have infested our House of Parliament, are out of control, and need to be cleaned out on 20 September 2014?

    How will the decent members and supporters of the National Party help make that happen?

    Penny Bright

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  345. Jack5 (5,286 comments) says:

    Re daffy Penny Bright at 11.04:

    You’d be all for the Labour bloke who’s apologised for being a man, wouldn’t you Penny.

    Are you the person everyone’s always banging on about not paying her rates?

    If so, you are a bit of a hypocrite talking about venal cockroaches, aren’t you?

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  346. niggly (832 comments) says:

    Yoza (1,638 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 10:22 pm

    “Slater and his cohorts were/are undermining the democratic process by attempting to discredit and intimidate critics of the Key regime, they are acting against the interests of the New Zealand public by performing in such a way.
    Privately conspiring to undermine the public good is not a private activity and should, obviously, be subjected to public scrutiny. “

    Hmmm, let’s undertake the role-reversal test:

    H1, H2, H3 and their cohorts were/are undermining the democratic process by attempting to discredit and intimidate critics of Clark’s Labour regime, they are acting against the interests of the New Zealand public by performing in such a way.
    Privately conspiring to undermine the public good is not a private activity and should, obviously, be subjected to public scrutiny. “

    Hmmm, even the simplest of name changes still renders the same meaning …

    Which simply goes to show, you seem genuinely surprised Yoza that’s how politics always has been played, including the Left (and they are the masters aren’t they)?

    Which is what some journos in the MSM have been saying all along, so I don’t think the Left’s message is necessarily all believed, despite the Left fawning loudly over Nicky Hager’s duplicity of using stolen private information ….

    But do we hear the Right braying for the release of the Left’s emails (H1/H2/H3 would be fascinating, well worthy of a book or two)? Nope, there are more important things to deal with.

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  347. niggly (832 comments) says:

    Jack 5 – this rogue leftist in the GCSB meme you mention.

    I doubt that … GCSB is hardly MFAT! ;-)

    However we live in a globally interconnected environment in which anonymous hackers including criminal elements can hack into government systems (let alone the situation we’re talking about here with the WOBH hacking). These people, along with the likes of KDC (and the Greens and other Leftie activists) want the one entity (GCSB) that can monitor them, stopped or disbanded. Interesting fact the MSM gloss over eh?

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  348. Jack5 (5,286 comments) says:

    Niggly (11.58):

    I agree the GCSB is a necessary safeguard for the country, and I hope it is up to the mark technically. I’m sure its links with other traditional allies helps with that.

    Still, in a few hundred people there are bound to be tens of folk who veer to the left, and there are likely to be one or two loose cannons among them.

    Someone with skills honed in the GCSB in my view would be one likely profile for a hacker behind the National-Brash and the National-Key hacks. If it hadn’t suited some people in National to go along with the Hager-Leftist bullshit that the first hack was a National insider job, this second hack mightn’t have occurred.

    It shouldn’t be too hard to track down Hager the Horrible’s source. Here is evidence of the MSM’s Leftist slant and its peevishness at the encroachment of hackers into the field of influencing public opinion: the MSM is showing virtually no interest in tracking down Hager the Horrible’s source, or even its veracity.

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  349. Yoza (1,927 comments) says:

    niggly (809 comments) says:
    August 18th, 2014 at 11:38 pm

    Hmmm, even the simplest of name changes still renders the same meaning …

    Which simply goes to show, you seem genuinely surprised Yoza that’s how politics always has been played, including the Left (and they are the masters aren’t they)?

    You have evidence of this?
    The attacks organised by Slater and his band of National party support network go beyond politics as usual, publicising Nicky Hager’s address in the hope he is rubbed out by rich foreign Chinese is terrorism.

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  350. niggly (832 comments) says:

    Yoza, Yoza, Yoza, where have you been with your head in the sand all these years?

    Duncan Garner exposes former PM Helen Clark underhandedly feeding information to the media to discredit one of her Ministers:
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/comment/10388408/Politics-is-a-sleazy-business-regardless-of-who-is-in-power

    There are now MSM articles on-line now in which she underhandedly fed info to the media (Oskar Alley was one of them) to discredit former Police Commissioner Peter done:
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10123094

    Oh dear.

    As for publishing Hager address, granted not something I would condone, but here’s the thing … Hager publishes his address quite regularly (eg in submissions etc) and Slater’s chit-chat about Chinese Triads was simply scuttlebutt between himself and someone else talking big and boasting, if the Triads really wanted to go after Hager then his address is already out there courtesy of Hager himself.

    The fact is, Hager has never been threatened by Triads, so it’s simply a Hager red hearing to talk up the issue. Death threats = zero.

    On the other hand Slater receives death threats all the time, we know that because they are discussed and published on his website occasionally (and unbelievably Hager brushed off Slater’s death threats as being “untrue” on Sunday, Q&A I think). Perhaps Hager should read WOBH to see rather than make things up. After all didn’t Hager write about the Slater article on “ferals” who crashed a car on the West Coast and killed his passengers? He did didn’t he but selectively dismissed the resultant death threats to Slater. Hager’s credibility = not good.

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  351. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ niggly (810 comments) says:
    August 19th, 2014 at 8:00 am

    So because something is said by Whaleoil, it must be true – the evidence being it was discussed on his website – really?

    and when Hager says he has been threatened, it isn’t true because he’s still alive?

    Do you see the fault in that rationality? Cameron Slater is also still alive – and everyone knows where he lives.

    The best you can take from that is either they are both lying, or the are both telling the truth about the threats and we have some very incompetent assassins in this country.

    And NO, it wasn’t the driver of the car he called the feral, it was one of the passengers that were killed he did that to.

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