The latest nonsense claim from Peters

August 29th, 2014 at 8:10 am by David Farrar

Stuff reports:

Justice Minister has said NZ First leader Winston Peters was wrong when he said one of her people approached him about negotiations after the election if she was National leader.

This evening Peters told TV3 he had “backdoor approaches myself from the Collins’ camp… If you can’t talk to [National leader] John Key after the election, can you talk to her?”

Peters believed the move was an attempt to undermine the prime minister which Collins was likely to be aware of.

“I didn’t think the bag man was coming without her consent,” Peters said.

Collins had previously said she was not responsible for what others did, but came out more strongly this evening.

“Winston Peters is wrong. I have never approached him nor have I asked anyone else to approach him,” she said in a statement.

This is a silly almost made up story. Not made up that someone may have had a conversation with Peters, but made up that it was an approach on behalf of Collins.

I’m 95% certain I know who Peters is referring to. He is not an MP. He is not an official of the National Party. And he is not close to Judith Collins. In fact I don’t think he has had a conversation with her in almost three years!!! I’ve had more conversations with Winston Peters in the last two years than this person has had with Judith Collins, so does that mean if I say something, it can be seen as being on behalf of Winston Peters?

This is just Peters trying to get himself publicity.

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82 Responses to “The latest nonsense claim from Peters”

  1. dishy (248 comments) says:

    Winston has a rare talent: the ability to bullshit without shame. He reminds me of a real estate agent I once knew.

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  2. Lindsay Addie (1,585 comments) says:

    The way Peters was grinning and smirking I don’t think he believed the story either.

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  3. Inthisdress (291 comments) says:

    Alzheimers. ?

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  4. Lindsay Addie (1,585 comments) says:

    Inthisdress,

    I’d say way too many adult beverages! ;)

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  5. Souvlaki (45 comments) says:

    Korsakoffs Syndrome!

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  6. Tarquin North (352 comments) says:

    Drinking in the morning, it was bound to catch up with him one day.

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  7. peterwn (3,298 comments) says:

    This sort of thing seems to have lots in common with a Winston Peters claim leading up to a previous election that some government department had ordered 50 Mercedes Benzes. The claim was of course rubbish but can still have some traction with a small group of voters.

    I would not be surprised if Winston drops a few more of these just prior to the election to complement Kim’s proposed bomb. Unfortunately all these will inflict some unfair damage on John Key.

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  8. Scott Chris (6,176 comments) says:

    I think Peters must be seriously running out of ammo if he’s resorting to trying to shoe-horn himself in to the Judith Collins scandal bandwagon.

    Comforting to see him still below the 5% threshold in the latest IPSOS poll:

    http://origin-interactives.stuff.co.nz/polling/

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  9. Ross12 (1,453 comments) says:

    But Peters fools the media every time !!

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  10. Gravelroad (161 comments) says:

    Why do people get sucked in by NZ First for a few weeks every three years?
    Anyone who has even a brief experience of NZ First electeds cannot fail to be surprised at the lack of substance, skill and even general knowledge displayed by many of them.

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  11. markm (114 comments) says:

    Why should Judith Collins be responsible for Winstons conversations with his whisky bottle and within his head

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  12. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    Transcript of Peters’ interview with Gower – Peters slams dirty politics, then gets dirty

    The interview was full of irony, with Peters condemning dirty politics and then turing around and chucking the dirty big time.

    It’s worth watching his bosy language in the interview:
    http://www.3news.co.nz/politics/full-interview-winston-peters-on-judith-collins-and-dirty-politics-2014082818

    Also notable is Gower who thinks Collins should go being a willing part of this.

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  13. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    If Peters can prove (don’t hold your breath) Judith Collins has totally flipped and tried something this ludicrous then Key should dump Collins.

    If Peters can’t prove this was anything more than a casual hypothetical quip loosely related to Collins then Key should refuse to do any deals with Peters after the election.

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  14. Elaycee (4,403 comments) says:

    This is just Peters trying to get himself publicity.

    But it works! The fawning MSM will be all over him like a rash and Winston will just lap it up.

    This has been Winston’s modus operandi for years – make a baseless, outrageous statement so he gets media attention. Forget the facts – they don’t matter. Just grab the headline. No different to Winston’s claim about the ‘sale of Huka Lodge’ – that was bollocks, too. But some doddery farts will believe him – one of the great mysteries.

    Bullshit baffles brains.

    It’s long overdue for Winston to be put out to pasture once and for all by the NZ voter – we deserve better.

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  15. hj (7,059 comments) says:

    Scott Chris (5,954 comments) says:
    July 6th, 2014 at 10:52 am

    Comforting trend for me is the one that has Winston hovering below the 5% threshold.

    Perhaps the way to sink him completely is to throw the Golden Oldies a bone or two and ostensibly tighten immigration policy.
    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/07/june_public_polls-3.html

    ostensibly:

    as appears or is stated to be true, though not necessarily so; apparently.
    “the party secretary resigned, ostensibly from ill health”
    synonyms: apparently, seemingly, on the face of it, to all appearances, on the surface, to all intents and purposes, outwardly, superficially, allegedly, professedly, supposedly, purportedly.

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  16. hj (7,059 comments) says:

    Winston lies and pushes racism
    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/02/winston_lies_and_pushes_racism.html
    Or Winston set up?

    There is a danger that a sector of the economy is being augmented that is totally reliant on a
    small domestic economy. Not only do these industries have limited potential for per-capita
    growth but ‘deriving growth via factor inputs such as labour places pressure on infrastructure
    such as transport and land supply, and ultimately have a further negative impact on growth
    (ARC 2005). Finally, as the sector gets larger, it gains in lobbying/political strength and can
    lobby for immigration regardless if it is the best interests of the economy as a whole. This
    could be seen in Canada where the development industry has lobbied hard for high sustained
    immigration levels (Ley and Tutchener 2001).

    Dr Greg Clydesdale
    Growing Pains

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  17. Scott Chris (6,176 comments) says:

    If Peters can’t prove this was anything more than a casual hypothetical quip loosely related to Collins then Key

    Hmm maybe – on the other hand perhaps it was Key’s idea to get a Collins’ proxy to woo Peters at the last election as a kind of plan B if they hadn’t had the numbers. Wouldn’t surprise me.

    I think this idea that Collins holds something on Key or that Collins wants to undermine Key is even more far-fetched than my above stated theory.

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  18. G152 (384 comments) says:

    To much of the whine box

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  19. Liberty (268 comments) says:

    “But Peters fools the media every time !!”
    No the media are just lap dogs of the left.
    It is far easer to slope around some bar and get some
    tattle of some old soggy. Than get of their arse and find
    the hacker.

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  20. flipper (4,194 comments) says:

    Hagerisms from Peters?
    MSM takes the bait.
    What a surprise.

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  21. Sublime (295 comments) says:

    Ask Trevor Mallard. He knows where to find the bagmen!

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  22. WineOh (630 comments) says:

    Unwise from Peters to make these kind of noises against his largest potential political ally.

    And sorry, given the political fallout for Collins in the last 6 months, even if Nats lose this election & Key steps down… how the hell would Collins become the party leader?

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  23. NK (1,253 comments) says:

    And if those supporting National don’t give their party vote to Act this is what you’ll get for three years. You have been warned!

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  24. horacethebear (5 comments) says:

    Just have a journalist or someone ask him when did Simon Lusk start speaking for Judith Collins?

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  25. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    WineOh – the claim just doesn’t make sense considering how much Peters has harrased Collins and tried to destroy her this year.

    She would have to have gone completely off her rocker to do this. There’s no way National (or any party) could or would consider a leadership coup during coalition negotiations.

    And yes there is no way Collins would become leader of National before or just after this election. It’s ludicrous.

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  26. WineOh (630 comments) says:

    @ Pete, yep exactly!

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  27. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    rupertthebear – Cameron Slater last night:

    @Whaleoil

    Peters is FoS, no loyalist would talk 2 the one person in politics Collins despises the most, same guy said Huka Lodge was sold

    Collins stated strongly on Radion NZ this morning that Peters is the last politician she would try and approach.

    Judith Collins dismisses Peters’ deal claim

    National MP Judith Collins has firmly denied any approach was made over a post-election deal with Winston Peters, saying the New Zealand First leader is the last person she would do a deal with.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/top/253272/judith-collins-dismisses-peters%27-deal-claim

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  28. horacethebear (5 comments) says:

    So when did Simon Lusk officially become Judith Collins bagman? Or was that something else in his head?

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  29. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    If Peters can’t prove this…then Key should refuse to do any deals with Peters after the election.

    Insert the following: –

    Bribery by Selwyn Cushing

    Proof of corruption in the IRD, including by Commisioner David Henry

    Sale of Huka Lodge

    Different election. Same rubbish. Why bother demanding proof from someone who has never done so in the past? Only a fool ask and expect.

    And if folks are stupid enough to continue voting for him despite Peters’ clear track-record, no amount of evidence will shake them from that opinion.

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  30. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    Kimbo – I know Peters has a history of smearing and never fronting up with evidence – more than once he has insisted he has evidence and will produce but he comes up with nothing.

    Media should be holding him to account for this instead of willingly promoting his stunts as Gower has done in this case – and 3 News/Gower did the same sort of collusion with Peters before the last election.

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  31. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    Media should be holding him to account for this instead of willingly promoting his stunts as Gower has done in this case – and 3 News/Gower did the same sort of collusion with Peters before the last election.

    Ah, Pete the pious, waiting for a sugar gum drop world where people act with noble intentions, free of self-interest. If ordinary folks don’t do it, why, to use your poorly chosen word, should highly ambitious media and politicians do so?!

    Peters had an allleged conversation that he wants out in the public domain. Gower has a headline. Both Peters and Gower, despite their undoubted personal comtempt for one another, mutually benefit.

    Isn’t this always how media (includuing Nicky Hager) and politicians have always danced together in a symbiotic/parasitic relationship? And will do so for ever more…

    “Some sort of collusion”?! You’ve summed up the mutual job description! (although it needs the balancing phrase, “and throwing one another under the bus when the need and benefit arises…”)

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  32. Other_Andy (2,676 comments) says:

    “This is just Peters trying to get himself publicity.”

    And in another newsflash, the Pope is catholic!

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  33. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    They should do it and are more likely to do it if they are held to account and pressured rather than just shrugging and accepting it’s how it’s always been done.

    Social media gives us opportunities to nag away at them. I know Gower has noticed me having a dig on this because he tweeted me about it. While they have much greater media power they don’t like small voices calling them out on their complicity.

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  34. doggone7 (818 comments) says:

    “I’m 95% certain I know who Peters is referring to” becomes the conjecture to lead to the next bit of conjecture that then becomes fact.

    The intellectual level of this reminds me of the eight year old girls playing in their hut. Mandy says to Mary, “Maisy doesn’t like you any more” and things go downhill from there. Of course Maisy didn’t say anything but Mandy has an agenda.

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  35. Bill (94 comments) says:

    Collins was slaughtered by Susie Ferguson on National Radio. Collins came on to call Peters a liar and Ferguson called her an Internet Bully. More votes lost by National.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/audio/player/20147625

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  36. Slipster (181 comments) says:

    What next in his deranged fantasy land – a personal envoy from Ohbummer secretly offering him a senior advisor job? Or maybe the Queen offering to adopt him?

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  37. Floyd60 (92 comments) says:

    Gower has turned a bit. He may be starting to question the game plan.

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  38. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    Leaving aside your grandiose attempts to insert yourself into the political contest, a bit like a social team first five eighth expecting a call from Steve Hansen when Dan Carter gets injured

    …what you label “collusion” journalists call “sources”.

    And is it just me, or is anyone else heartily fed up with “the media” (including Whale Oil, Hager, Mike Hoskings alleged bias, etc) becoming the story?! But instead, you want to continue the nonsense of the messengers becoming the message by “exposing” Paddy Gower?!

    Memo to Pete George : As most adults have figured out, and as we all knew even before Nicky Hager’s latest sanctimonious offering, the journalists who get the dramatic headlines are in the tradition of the muck rakers. And headlines are what count. Like tow truck drivers they are of dubious morals, but they perform a necessary social function.

    But tell us, Pete. as Peters won’t be revealing who he had this alleged conversation with, and as Gower, even if he knows wont be telling (both of them based on the established ethical principle of protecting sources)

    …how, other than running onto the field uninvited wearing the No. 10 jersey, do you propose to “hold them to account”?!

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  39. SW (241 comments) says:

    Doggone – exactly. And can David tell us why he is 95% sure? What does he know that we don’t – why would someone approach Peters and say this? What is their motive?

    David obviously concedes that Peters isn’t making it up because he is 95% sure who the person is. Was Peters meant to ignore the approach in David’s mind?

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  40. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    Your rugby analogy is both flawed and way out of date Kimbo. Teams were never selected by popular vote.

    This is the Internet age. If enough people make a small difference it can add up to a significant difference.

    In some cases small voices can make a significant difference on their own. I’ve often seen direct results of this.

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  41. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    In some cases small voices can make a significant difference on their own. I’ve often seen direct results of this.

    OK, Pete.

    If you don’t mind, and as you are insistent on taking over the goal kicking as well, I’ll seek to measure the value of your efforts:

    At what point do we decide you have made a “significant difference” in this matter? Presumably Peters and/or Gower confessing in tears on national televison that as a result of Pete George of Dunedin’s searing questions, they confirm that the reporting of the alleged conversation was a cynical attempt at mutual benefit?

    As you said before, they got away with it in 2011, and 1 in 20 voters was stupid enough to fall for it.

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  42. tvb (4,491 comments) says:

    It will be a cold day in hell before Judith Collins becomes Leader of the National Party. She may have seen herself in that role once and even encouraged one or two of her young supporters. But her style of politics does not suit the broad section of the National Party. She will be lucky to hold her justice portfolio after the election and I suspect she will drop a couple of places in the cabinet. Probably no 10. She will not like that much.

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  43. polemic (460 comments) says:

    As I have repeatedly stated at least you know what your getting with Colin Craig because he stands for something.

    What does Winston stand for except Winston First he has absolutely no scruples and has mastered the art of story concoction and has no principles at all. :evil:

    A vote for Winston = a vote for Labour/Green axis = a vote for corruption.

    whereas

    A vote for the Conservatives = a vote for stable safe Govt

    You know what you are getting

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  44. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    …In fact, as the last thirty years of Winston Peters’ career have been predicated on spinning and exaggerating discordant conversations, events and facts into conspiracies that are cat-nip to headline seeking reporters and the gullible plot-theorists among the electorate, at what point can we expect your campaign to “clean up Dodge” to take effect?

    More to the point, as “advocacy journalists” such as Whale Oil, Hager, and now Paddy Gower seem the most prominent media players in this current campaign, all contrary to the calm and measured approach of Pete George, when can we expect the tide to even reverse?

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  45. Paulus (2,656 comments) says:

    I assume that his rumour was put to Peters when he visited the German Criminal on one of the occasions he went to Coatsville

    – a good lunch I expect.

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  46. freedom101 (508 comments) says:

    Remember the fleet of (non-existent) BMWs? This is a classic Winston play. Make up a story to gain air time. By the time the denials have flown around Winston has received free publicity. It’s completely bogus and dishonest, and the MSM should not buy into this pathetic self promotion. Of course the MSM will have trouble remembering the fleet of BMWs because many of them were still at school when it happened.

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  47. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    Kimbo – it probably won’t improve if too many people like you just accept crap as it is and try and ridicule any attempts to deal to it.

    Are you trying to protect or excuse the dirty side of politics or something?

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  48. ROJ (121 comments) says:

    tvb,

    I wouldn’t presume her fall down the ranking will be too great. Anyone in the front row will want to make sure she is not at their back!

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  49. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    Kimbo – it probably won’t improve if too many people like you just accept crap as it is and try and ridicule any attempts to deal to it.

    Are you trying to protect or excuse the dirty side of politics or something?

    Nope.

    Just doing my small bit holding to account those who try and inject useless and distracting milquetoast hand-wringing sanctimony into the realm of political debate, when more mature and informed analysis is of far more value for the public good.

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  50. Richard (868 comments) says:

    It was me- I approached Winston Peters- it was a sunny day, Winston was in Christchurch, I thought why the hell not. I had to sort of claim that I was acting for an MP who was sort of acting for Collins. Don’t believe me? Why not? What I’ve just said is as credible as what Winston’s said. My claims should be reported in the MSM right now, same as Winnie’s!

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  51. backster (2,184 comments) says:

    The intermediary was named either Mac Cready or Bright………Deny it was you Penny

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  52. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    So am I to take it from your Winston-like evasions, Pete, that we are unlikely to expect any fruit from your campaign to hold the NZ First leader and Gower to account any time soon?

    Or is a reply to a tweet simply the first sign the edifice of political/media duplicity is beginning to crumble?

    Or based on the principle, “all news is good news”, could giving oxygen to Paddy Gower’s inherent sliminess simply boost his profile and power?

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  53. jv (16 comments) says:

    Perhaps a long standing bag man of Winston’s – renowned for dubious dealings and gossip and a ex National Party MP colleague and reputedly “a former school chum”

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  54. minus (218 comments) says:

    Winston may be still smart enough to put two and two together.

    Last Election John Key was stupid enough to actually met John Banks when a simple public joint statement would have explained their suggestions to voters in Epsom.
    As a result the Teacup Tape emerged and people refused to divulge its contents except hint that Winston had been mentioned.
    Winston then pursued this relentlessly and through it gained enough publicity to actually get into Parliament.
    You need an issue, or a non-issue that people don’t yet know is a non-issue :-)

    Then everyone now sees Key will not, for whatever reason, fire Collins.
    Likewise Clark protected Philip Field until he indicated he could have stood next Election as an Independent, rather Labour candidate.
    Fucking fatal mistake.
    The moment he crossed Clark in that way, he was gone.
    Winston likely thinks that likewise, Key will cut Collins loose for a similar betrayal.
    So claim Collins has approached NZ First – sets up the betrayal and brings Winston into centre stage.

    This gives Winston his publicity and Collins, soiled by Hager’s DIRTY POLITICS, will be suspected of anything.

    And we have Richard’s confession at 10:53 :-)

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  55. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    Kimbo, it’s usually difficult to know what effect if any that anyone or any one action has.

    What I do know is that one can sometimes have an effect, and many can sometimes have an effect. Sometimes a major effect. And I know that doing nothing changes nothing.

    And I know that the use of social media has had a significant effect on how media and politics operates and will go on to have an even greater effect.

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  56. OneTrack (3,213 comments) says:

    Ross12 – “But Peters fools the media every time !!”

    That does not mean much.

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  57. OneTrack (3,213 comments) says:

    “Unwise from Peters to make these kind of noises against his largest potential political ally. ”

    Does anybody really think he intends going with National? Really?

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  58. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    polemic (425 comments) says:
    August 29th, 2014 at 10:13 am

    know what you are getting

    But we don’t know do we, because Colin Craig has never been an MP, and therefore we have very little idea of how he would cope, and how effective he would be.

    All we have to go by is his performance to date, which frankly has been spectacularly unimpressive.

    An MP that threatens to sue all in sundry that criticise him? I can’t see someone so emotional and sensitive lasting long, let alone performing well in the harsh environment of parliament.

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  59. OneTrack (3,213 comments) says:

    Pete – “While they have much greater media power they don’t like small voices calling them out on their complicity.”

    Or, we could do what many people are starting to do and just stop buying their bullshit product and changing the channel.

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  60. jackinabox (776 comments) says:

    “I always agree with the Prime Minister.”

    God what an obnoxious crawler! And she’s looking and acting more like Muldoon every day.

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  61. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    And I know that the use of social media has had a significant effect on how media and politics operates and will go on to have an even greater effect.

    Fair point, Pete.

    But there is “having an effect” and “tilting at windmills”.

    Bottom line: How could you possibly prove

    1. Peters made this alleged conversation up?

    2. Gower reported Peters’ account knowing it was false?

    3. By what journalistic principle can you compel them to confess to it, when both can appeal to the ethical requirement of protecting a confidential source?

    4. Even if the person concerned does exist and is exposed and no doubt denies Peters’ version of the conversation, what would you have other than a case of “You said it!”, “No I didn’t!”?

    5. How is the fact that politicians and journalists in general, and Peters and Gower and particular work together for mutual benefit in any way newsworthy or a threat to democracy, other than in the hypocritical framing of discourse by an impractical and self-serving anarchist like Nicky Hager?

    6. What is the difference between “working together” and “collusion”, and how can you posibly prove it in this case?

    7. Why bother trying to expose the manipulative nature of Peters when it is a matter of record over many years, and yet it is the curiosity of democratic freedom that fools, in spite of the facts, are free to continue to waste their vote on him – as they no doubt will once more in 2014?

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  62. G152 (384 comments) says:

    Remember in Parliament when whining Winston was confronted over some of his exaggeration or untrue claims how he would mutter that he ‘knew about XXX and was going to release the details’?
    The bladder is empty.
    Judith Collins will be there to wave him goodbye

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  63. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    2. Gower reported Peters’ account knowing it was false?

    That’s not the key point – the key point is Gower conducted and promoted the interview knowing that Peters had produced no evidence to back up his claim.

    That Gower knows “the manipulative nature of Peters when it is a matter of record over many years” it is shoddy journalism feeding a liar oxygen. Peters is unlikely to change but journalists like Gower should be held to account, they misuse the substantial political power they have too often.

    So I think it’s worth nudging journalists on things like this, and it’s possible to sometimes do that.

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  64. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    Peters is still trying to stoke it.

    Peters: I’ll put my life on Collins approach

    NZ First leader Winston Peters is prepared to swear an affidavit, and “put his life on” having been approached by someone asking if he would work with the National Party if Justice Minister Judith Collins was leader.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10437549/Peters-I-ll-put-my-life-on-Collins-approach

    That’s just pointless posturing unless he fronts up with facts, details, context. Someone with some sort of connection to Collins may have talked to him six months ago, but that means nothing unless we know who and what was said – or at least what their version is of what they said.

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  65. DJP6-25 (1,389 comments) says:

    Hopefully on Sep 20th, the Conservatives will replace NZ Worst, and we can forget about them.

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  66. Kimbo (1,038 comments) says:

    @ Pete George

    …the key point is Gower conducted and promoted the interview knowing that Peters had produced no evidence to back up his claim

    But Gower can claim he is doing his job…by reporting the statements of a political figure. That Peters said it is an undniable fact. It is up to the public to decide. And Collins to take legal action if she so chooses…

    But instead you demanding that Key should refuse to go into coalition with NZ First, and possibly condemn NZ to three years of a government of the Greens and Internet-Mana over something most people realise is an exaggeration.

    Yeah, that’ll really raise the standards of New Zealand politics and public life! Take a stand on shibboleths that will be forgotten within a week.

    That’s just pointless posturing unless he (Peters) fronts up with facts, details, context.

    Yep. Sums up Peters’ entire career…

    And least with Peters you know he is bad. But if we take your advice, Pete, then we are all mad!

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  67. Keeping Stock (10,404 comments) says:

    Winston Peters making stuff up again? It must be a day ending in d-a-y…

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  68. minus (218 comments) says:

    Peters said her denials would not help.
    “I know what happened, I know why it happened … I’d put my life on it,” he told RadioLive.
    He said the approach had been by a person someone in Parliament had authorised to come to him.
    The person “deliberately bumped into” Peters in Wellington this year before the Oravida scandal surrounding Collins broke, Peters said on Radio NZ’s Morning Report.

    Before Oravida
    So if it did happen, it is fucking history already

    Winston was humiliatingly beaten time after time in his Oravida questions for weeks and didn’t use this as ammo

    Winston would have us believe he has sat on it since way back, just to drop it on Key the night of the first big debate.

    And now this makes Winston an acceptable coalition partner for National?
    “I’d put my life on it” – Winston shows as little regard for his own life, as we hold for him telling the truth.

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  69. KevinH (1,236 comments) says:

    The most common question asked by members of the public at electoral meetings to candidates is “Who could you work with” and secondly could you work with so and so. Winston is expert at batting off those inquiries usually telling the questioner to wait till the results are in. On several occasions I have heard people ask him ( Winston) whether he could work with Helen Clark through to Hone Harawira and he usually bats them off.
    Winston’s public meetings are great to attend I would recommend folks to go, because there is a buzz about the hall and you can observe first hand his electoral support( usually Goldcard recipients). It would be fair to say that the audience is a somewhat grumpy lot who usually are not happy with the direction the country is heading politically.

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  70. Mark (1,489 comments) says:

    As shameless a stunt as this is Collins simply cannot defend herself right now given the stupidity of her interaction with Slater. Peters understands this so pulls the “a person known to Collins approached me…” stunt knowing doesn’t have to prove the allegation (which he probably thought up over a couple of whiskeys last night) and it sits out there as Collins trying to undermine Key’s leadership.

    Gutter politics but Winston gets on the front page and Collins looks conspiratorial, whats to lose.

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  71. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    But instead you demanding that Key should refuse to go into coalition with NZ First, and possibly condemn NZ to three years of a government of the Greens and Internet-Mana…

    I’m not demanding that. I’ve expressed my opinion, that if Collins has done as Peters alleges she should go (Key agrees with that) and if Peters is lying to destabilize Key and National then Key should make it clear he doesn’t trust Peters enough to try and deal with him (something Key did last election).

    So neither suggestion is out of the ordinary.

    … over something most people realise is an exaggeration.

    a) I presume you have no way of actually knowing that
    b) It would take far less then ‘most people’ to lose this election for National, all it could take is ‘some people’ to not vote for them because they don’t want to see Peters in Government.
    c) If an MP makes things (lies) up to smear another MP and a party it shouldn’t just be shrugged off as “an exaggeration’.

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  72. minus (218 comments) says:

    The New Zealand First leader told Radio New Zealand a person associated with Ms Collins “sidled up” to him informally.
    “He bumped into me – that was clear as daylight.”
    The meeting happened in Wellington before the Oravida scandal broke, he said.
    The person was a “passing acquaintance” who did not work in Parliament, Mr Peters said.
    “I was disturbed that that was the nature of politics they were pursuing.”
    Mr Peters said he did not say anything to the person. It sounded like a plot to roll Mr Key after the election, he said.

    On Radio Live, Winston says he asked who the person was working for, and did ask other questions, as opposed to “did not say anything to the person”.

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  73. Grant500 (23 comments) says:

    NZ First and Winston…… Focused on the same two issues every election – immigrants and the elderly. Do they actually have something like a housing policy for example? Never heard anything from them on that. Can not see anything in that party at all and why anyone would ever vote for them is beyond me. Worse than Labour voters. Heaven help us if he is the kingmaker.

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  74. doggone7 (818 comments) says:

    It is not nonsense to say the Northland Rugby team is not as good as Canterbury’s.
    It is not nonsense to say that NZ rowers will are likely to win at least one gold medal at the World Champs.

    Is it nonsense to claim that Peters’ claim is nonsense? It makes perfect sense that Collins would be looking for the top job. It makes perfect sense that Collins would be looking for support. It makes perfect sense that others would be doing her bidding.

    There may be the hope that the Peters’ claim is nonsense but stating it as a fact is nonsense.

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  75. Jack5 (5,144 comments) says:

    doggone7 posted at 3.14:

    There may be the hope that the Peters’ claim is nonsense but stating it as a fact is nonsense.

    That’s gobbledegook, doggone7.

    Doggone7’s view is tautology. It is just another way of saying what Doggone7 says is nonsense, but only what he says is nonsense is nonsense. Doggone7 takes what he judges to be plausibility and extends that to be a measure of what is fact, what is true.

    The decision of what is “perfect sense” is Doggone7’s alone, in his view.

    Doggone7 sounds like a Leftist or a Petersite clutching at straws to try to make Yul Grinner’s statement plausible.

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  76. SW (241 comments) says:

    Jack5 – riddle me this: Even on DPF’s version, someone approached Peters right?

    So how can Peters claim be nonsense? It can only be nonsense in the sense that the person was not in fact sent by Collins. Apparently DPF and Whaleoil know that to be the case, but haven’t said why or how they know that.

    But even so, someone still approached him. If not sent by Judith, why on earth has this happened? What is going on here?

    Perhaps DPF knows why this unnamed person would approach Peters?

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  77. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    SW – it was possibly an off the cuff hypothetical question something like “Hey Winston, if Collins was leader instead of Key do you think it would be easier or harder to negotiate a coalition agreement?”

    It could have been even more vague than that, and Peters is deliberately trying to over-egg something benign.

    And it was six months-ish ago so irrelevant now except for attention seeking opportunism.

    Without any details or evidence from Peters it’s meaningless media fodder, and they lap it up and spit it out over the electorate.

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  78. SW (241 comments) says:

    Yea possibly Pete, you do never know with Winston.

    But if that was the case, how do people like DPF know with certainty who this guy is? Not strange to you?

    Time will tell I guess

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  79. doggone7 (818 comments) says:

    Jack5

    For you I’ll cut fiddling with the semantics. (Although a news broadcast I just heard used nonsensical, illogical statements as if they were factual when they were not factual.)

    It is nonsense for Farrar to claim that Peters’ claims are nonsense.

    Quibble about the language all you like but don’t be surprised that everyone doesn’t accept the nonsense and propoganda. (e.g. “This is a silly almost made up story.”)

    Peters tries every day to create impressions. David Farrar does the same. Some of the MP’s claims are hard to disprove. Some of Farrar’s are easy to establish as fanciful and seemingly crafted in language to mislead.

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  80. Pete George (23,677 comments) says:

    Yes, this is curious from DPF:

    I’m 95% certain I know who Peters is referring to. He is not an MP. He is not an official of the National Party. And he is not close to Judith Collins.

    And this from Whale Oil:

    If my information is correct then Winston is about to make a complete fool of himself because if it is who he will claim it to be then that person last met Judith Collins at parliament in a room full of 30 people…three years ago…hardly a loyalist I would have thought.

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/08/winston-bullshit/

    Slater also pointed out “You’re willing to swear an affidavit that something is LIKELY to be true?” in relation to

    NZ First leader Winston Peters says he is prepared to swear an affidavit that someone asked him if he would work with Judith Collins if she was National Party leader. He would “put his life on it”, he said.

    Peters said he believed the approach had been an attempt to undermine the prime minister and that Collins was likely to have been aware of it.

    Another bizarre attempt at hijacking the campaign.

    3 News have just claimed the main suspect is Simon Lusk. Good grief.

    And now Peters is challenging Collins to sue him. That sounds like game playing, if he could prove what he’s claimed he would have instant success at ending Collin’s career.

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  81. goldnkiwi (1,504 comments) says:

    My edict, no questions, no answers, no speculation, no information gathering and above all NO Talking!!! Or data inputting blog reading or contributing, no need for press secretaries or the fourth estate. No newspapers or magazines, as nothing to put in them. Done Sorted!!!

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  82. coolas (115 comments) says:

    To put some folk out of their misery it went like this: Simon Lusk bumps into Winstone at Hummingbird bar.
    “Hey man, you wont go with Key ‘cos he fucked you over in 2008 with the Owen Glenn crap. Would you come with us if Judith was PM?”
    Winstone repies, “Get me another gin and I’ll think about it.”

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  83. Scott1 (572 comments) says:

    Potentially a good thing for Winston except when Judith clearly became an impossibility for leader.
    Key is pretty optimistic if he thinks that none of his ministers would like to be PM. But what keeps ministers in line is the impossibility of them becoming PM and Judith now has that in spades.

    Anyway the approach seem pretty plausible – it seems like the sort of thing that would go on all the time in politics – Peters probably gets a couple of approaches a day about if he would prefer that Cunliffe was rolled.

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