General Debate 05 September 2014

September 5th, 2014 at 8:12 am by David Farrar
Tags:

210 Responses to “General Debate 05 September 2014”

  1. hj (7,021 comments) says:

    In light of Dirty Politics revelations of journalists plugging vested interests you have to wonder about (eg) NZIER running a model which tells us More migrants increase our incomes Despite treasury saying:

    Since then, New Zealand has had substantial gross and net immigration, which has been
    relatively skill-focused by international standards. However, New Zealand’s economic
    performance has not been transformed. Growth in GDP per capita has been relatively
    lacklustre, with no progress in closing income gaps with the rest of the advanced world,
    and productivity performance has been poor. It may be that initial expectations about the
    potential positive net benefits of immigration were too high.

    Based on a large body of new research evidence and practical experience, the consensus
    among policymakers now is that other factors are more important for per capita growth and productivity than migration and population growth. CGE modelling exercises for Australia and New Zealand have been influential in reshaping expectations.

    Sir Peter Gluckman was mentioned in that regard on The Pnel 3 September.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 17 You need to be logged in to vote
  2. duggledog (1,557 comments) says:

    Astute article by Hosking in this morning’s Herald.

    He notes that during the leaders’ debates, Cunliffe comes surrounded by an army of fluffers, all lubing him up to the point the poor guy is over-advised before he reaches the pdium, whereas Key virtually walks alone.

    You can just see Cunliffe’s mob; led by Salmon; all with pursed lips, ipads, politics degrees, acne.

    This is Labour’s problem. They are bullshit, and the vast majority of New Zealanders – who don’t necessarily follow politics – can spot it a mile off.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 57 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  3. IGM (392 comments) says:

    Why has there been no mention of the latest polling on Newstalkzb? Is their editorial, like APN, Fairfax controlled by Little, McCarten, and company.

    Vote: Thumb up 18 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  4. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    MIA: Hone Harawira

    Missing in Action

    Authorities are appealing to members of the public to come forward with information as to the whereabouts of Te Tai Tokerau identity, Hone Pani Tamati Waka Nene Harawira – Also known as George Hadfield.
    Friends say, Mr Harawira was having “relationship” problems and was depressed with after having to compromise his principles to satisfy the demands of a foreign loan shark.

    Mr Harawira “partner” Laila claims to be unconcerned at his disappearance, but sources indicate that her body language and a barely perceptible tremor have caused authorities to regard her as “person of interest” in their enquiries.

    Rumours that Mr Harawira may be in Australia have not been able to be confirmed, but those heading the investigation have indicated Mr Harawira may be anxious as to an approaching September 20th deadline of a failing joint-venture project he had been involved in.

    Anyone with any information as to the whereabouts of Mr Harawira should email in confidence to the officer in charge of the investigation at: whaleoil@whaleoil.co.nz

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 55 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  5. MH (757 comments) says:

    Right,who’s had a decent breakfast yet?
    It’s not too late to get down to your local school and get a brekkie,don’t be shy, St John ( pronounced SinGin ) Campbellabacteria is footing the bill, or is it all the alcohol and Sth Auckland Loan sharks ? Has anyone seen a starving child this week,stomach distended, or just the obese sugar laden kids queing up to have a free second break fast. Has UN Helen sorted out the govt over these poverty kids,250,000 of the little blighters. Even Professor Latta Day Saint says the baked beans are full of sugar, obesity diabetic epidemic here we come again.
    And for goodness sake when you go back for a second helping don’t say to the head mistress because there are so few men teachers “please sir,can I have some more” because you’ll get sent to the naughty corner or made to become a Fun Terror milk monitor for the whole week.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 33 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  6. James Stephenson (2,180 comments) says:

    Dead Earnest wins the internets.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  7. Griff (7,715 comments) says:

    China Plans a Market for Carbon Permits
    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/01/business/international/china-plans-a-market-for-carbon-permits.html?emc=edit_tnt_20140831&nlid=38021197&tntemail0=y&_r=1
    BEIJING — China plans to introduce its national market for carbon permit trading in 2016, a government official said on Sunday, adding that Beijing is close to completing rules for what will be the world’s biggest emissions trading program.

    The nation accounts for nearly 30 percent of global greenhouse gas emissions, and it plans to use the carbon market to slow its rapid growth in climate-changing emissions.

    China has pledged to reduce the amount of carbon it emits per unit of its gross domestic product to 40 to 45 percent below its 2005 levels by 2020.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  8. Elaycee (4,392 comments) says:

    IGM: Why has there been no mention of the latest polling on Newstalkzb

    You missed it… was on both the 6.30am and 7am News. Newsreader Niva Ritimanu was clearly unhappy about it, too…. when she read the latest poll results, she sounded as if she had just been told she had won a free colonoscopy.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 32 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  9. hj (7,021 comments) says:

    Sir Peter Glukman was mentioned in that regard on The Panel 3 September.
    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/thepanel/audio/20148247/the-panel-with-dita-de-boni-and-john-bishop-part-2

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  10. oldpark (330 comments) says:

    It will be comforting to know that that nice man Winston Peters will tell all the older people who are planning to vote for him.Nice Mr Peters will tell them that his potential coalition partners Labour/Green Party’s, if elected will bring in an INHERITANCE/DEATH TAX on their house,and investments,or worse their nest egg, Nana’s special fund for grandchildrens education,or even their wedding day.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 22 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  11. kowtow (8,475 comments) says:

    The world’s MSM ,academia,Hollywood and other cultural marxists constantly lecture us on the virtues of the Saint Nelson Mandela Rainbow Republic. Freedom, liberation ,all things bright and beautiful………..

    …….the next best thing to God Himself isn’t allowed to visit, bwahahahahahahaha……..

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/southafrica/11075608/South-Africa-bars-Dalai-Lama-after-pressure-from-China.html

    Kowtow to the Emperor.We did too,both Labour and National. Pretended they were a free and open economy.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  12. mandk (993 comments) says:

    @ hj
    It’s obvious from reading the snippet you posted that the Treasury and NZIER views are not inconsistent with one another.
    Tsy do not deny that immigration has an effect. They simply say that other factors are more important.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  13. IGM (392 comments) says:

    Elaycee: Bet it wasn’t a lead item, she would have had union support not to read it.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  14. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    Time for the Government to get rid of the blatantly unfair tax on diesel fuel in the form of road user charges. Case in point, the Nissan Qashqai:

    The RUC is now $58 per 1000 kilometres. Add that to the fuel cost of the Qashqai TS turbodiesel’s official consumption of 4.9 litres per 100km, and it means this Nissan costs $13.05 in fuel and tax to travel every 100km. That’s a lot higher than the $10.37 in 91 octane fuel costs it takes to drive every 100km in a petrol-engined Qashqai ST-L that is specified to the same level, and which consumes fuel at a rate of 6.9L/100km

    So it costs 30% more to run the diesel Qashqai even though it uses 30% less fuel than the petrol Qashqai. Brain dead tax structure.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/lifestyle-vehicles/10453857/Unfair-tax-sullies-a-brilliant-new-Nissan

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  15. hj (7,021 comments) says:

    The Panel with Dita de Boni and John Bishop (Part 2)
    [From 9 minutes]
    Catherine Rich Food and Grocery Council
    Sugar: mention of tax etc always attacked by right-wing blogger$
    element at Governmental level
    Sir Peter Glukman reversing rules for tuckshops etc
    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/thepanel/audio/20148247/the-panel-with-dita-de-boni-and-john-bishop-part-2

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  16. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    He notes that during the leaders’ debates, Cunliffe comes surrounded by an army of fluffers, all lubing him up to the point the poor guy

    I am haunted by that imagery. :omg:

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 22 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  17. RRM (9,924 comments) says:

    Scott Chris –

    If they “get rid of” RUC then diesel drivers would be paying nothing towards the upkeep of the roads.

    Perhaps the RATES need to be revised, to keep them in line with petrol tax on comparable vehicles?

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  18. RRM (9,924 comments) says:

    5th of September, isn’t Slim Dotcrim going to drop his neutron bomb any day now?

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  19. IGM (392 comments) says:

    Is Campbell the Labour candidate for Christchurch Central? If not he must be on the party payroll. I happened to watch a little of the slimey left-wing bastard last night and damn near threw a book through the screen. He should be dispensed with now, instead of waiting for his contract to expire.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 23 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  20. hj (7,021 comments) says:

    hj (6,763 comments) says:
    Reaction to my earlier comment seems to support this view from Dr Greg Clydesdale (excommunicated from Massey by the Holy See).

    While immigration played a key role in house inflation in the three years after 2001 (Reserve
    Bank 2007), it is unknown to what extent on-going immigration continued to drive price rises.
    The housing boom has meant good profits for many New Zealand companies supplying
    materials and building services,
    but it implies investors would rather invest in their country’s
    homes rather than its businesses (Bollard 2005). The high returns for property has attracted
    finance and reduced the capital available for productive investment (Moody, 2006). The
    consequence is investment is going in to industries with limited capacity to increase per capita
    incomes. For example, real estate and building are domestically bound and do not have the
    market potential of export industries. They also have less opportunity to increase productivity
    through new processes and products. The irony is, as these sectors grow, they have incurred
    skills shortages which in turn has increased demand for skilled immigrants. The Department
    of Statistics ‘Long Term Skill Shortage List’ of 28/3/2006 includes carpenter/joiner, plumber,
    electricians, fitter and turners, fitter welders; all indicative of a nation building its
    construction/property sector.
    There is a danger that a sector of the economy is being augmented that is totally reliant on a
    small domestic economy. Not only do these industries have limited potential for per-capita
    growth but ‘deriving growth via factor inputs such as labour places pressure on infrastructure
    such as transport and land supply, and ultimately have a further negative impact on growth
    (ARC 2005). Finally, as the sector gets larger, it gains in lobbying/political strength and can
    lobby for immigration regardless if it is the best interests of the economy as a whole.
    This
    could be seen in Canada where the development industry has lobbied hard for high sustained
    immigration levels (Ley and Tutchener 2001).

    Between Vested interests and The PC Front the rebels are squeezed.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  21. holysheet (389 comments) says:

    Dead right, Dead Ernest.
    You can bet she is pissed at not getting some of that 500K kraut money Hatfield got.
    Follow the money, and you will find the mofo hater.

    Come on Kelvin Davis win TT.

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  22. RRM (9,924 comments) says:

    Scott Chris (5,984 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 8:29 am

    He notes that during the leaders’ debates, Cunliffe comes surrounded by an army of fluffers, all lubing him up to the point the poor guy

    I am haunted by that imagery. :omg

    I got a semi :oops:

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  23. OneTrack (3,104 comments) says:

    RRM – “Perhaps the RATES need to be revised, to keep them in line with petrol tax on comparable vehicles?”

    Perhaps the RUC needs to be thrown out for light vehicles and a fuel tax applied across the board to diesel. Just like petrol. And then diesel can compete on its own merits.

    That would be one way.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  24. Harriet (4,972 comments) says:

    The British Government affirming Rape Culture.

    “………..“British Police Arrested Parents for Trying to Rescue Their Daughters from Islamic Rape Gangs”. The article begins:

    Imagine finding out that your young daughter is being regularly gang-raped by a mob of Muslim pedophiles. You go to police, only to be called a racist, a bigot, and a hate-monger. When police refuse to help, you go to the house where your daughter is being gang-raped and you try to rescue her. The pedophiles then calmly call the police and have you arrested for trying to rescue your daughter from being gang-raped. This is reality in Rotherham, England. And if you don’t approve, you’re a racist, a bigot, and a hate-monger.

    Commissioned by Rotherham Borough Council, the report makes grim reading. It says that from 1997 to 2013, 1,400 children and teenagers were subjected to “appalling abuse” by gangs of older men.

    The vast majority of the abusers were of Pakistani and Muslim origin; the vast majority of their victims were white and working class.
    Some of the victims, almost all of them girls, were trafficked around Britain to be sexually abused. They were often threatened with violence against their families to stop them from seeking help.

    A researcher who raised the alarm over the sexual abuse of teenage English girls in Rotherham by Pakistani/Muslim gangs was sent on a ‘ethnicity and diversity course’ by child protection bosses who refused to act on her evidence. The researcher, who was seconded to Rotherham council by the Home Office, was told she must “never, ever” again refer to the fact that the abusers were predominantly Pakistani/Muslim men.

    Speaking to the BBC’s Panorama programme under the condition of anonymity, the researcher said that she identified more than 270 victims of trafficking and underage prostitution by mainly Muslim gangs in Rotherham. But, despite being sent to Rotherham Council, the report, based on interviews with underage girls seeking help from the council’s anti-child prostitution project, called Risky Business, was never published.

    Indeed, the council tried unsuccessfully to sack the researcher after she resisted pressure to change her findings. Data to back up the report’s findings also went missing from the Risky Business office the weekend after she submitted her report, the researcher told the programme.

    Wow, what absolute insanity:

    let’s just allow children to be tortured and raped, because that is less important than not offending Muslims and rocking the PC boat. This is utterly despicable and diabolical: poor little children sacrificed at the altar of multicultural madness…..”

    http://billmuehlenberg.com/2014/09/04/pc-and-the-rape-of-children/

    Vote: Thumb up 17 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  25. RRM (9,924 comments) says:

    Onetrack:

    Why should the operators of diesel tractors, diesel diggers, diesel bulldozers and diesel ships – which never use the roads – pay petrol tax towards the upkeep of the roads?

    The system isn’t perfect, but the people who initiated it weren’t idiots.

    It was/is a pragmatic solution to the dilemma that virtually all petrol is consumed by road vehicles, but only some diesel is consumed by road vehicles – while almost ALL off-road motorised plant is diesel.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  26. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

    Unpopular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 48 You need to be logged in to vote
  27. WineOh (630 comments) says:

    I’m surprised that nobody has made comment about the Stuff article polling Nats at 54.2% – enough to govern alone without coalition partners.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  28. IGM (392 comments) says:

    ste3e: That would be the lowest post I have ever witnessed. It is obvious you are a Labour/Green supporter with the morals of a rodent.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 28 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  29. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    Perhaps the RATES need to be revised, to keep them in line with petrol tax on comparable vehicles?

    I’d suggest parity in excise tax per litre on both diesel and petrol. Certainly one litre of diesel equates to more road distance covered (and hence more wear on the road) than one litre of petrol, but that would be off-set by the environmental benefit in incentivising the use of a more efficient fuel.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  30. Keeping Stock (10,340 comments) says:

    @ WineOh; that might be because DPF did a post about the Stuff and Herald polls two-and-a-half hours ago, which has already attracted more than 50 comments ;-)

    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/09/two_more_polls-3.html

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  31. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    @ste3e

    I call bullshit on the crap you just scribbled down

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 24 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  32. hj (7,021 comments) says:

    mandk (900 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 8:21 am

    @ hj
    It’s obvious from reading the snippet you posted that the Treasury and NZIER views are not inconsistent with one another.
    Tsy do not deny that immigration has an effect. They simply say that other factors are more important.
    ….
    Bullshit the NZIER say population is definitive.
    NZIER say there will be large positive effects from a larger population Treasury’s discussion paper says

    3.8 Large positive effects: conclusion
    Overall, the evidence points to modest, rather than large positive effects from factor price
    equalisation, different migrant characteristics, changes to capital utilisation, scale and
    agglomeration, improved international connectedness, population ageing and fiscal
    balance. However, it is possible that scale or international connection effects could
    operate with very long lags: a new paper by Brunow et. al. (2014) provides tentative
    empirical evidence suggesting that while net migration does not impact on growth
    positively or negatively in the decade in which it occurs, it may boost growth in the longer
    run. Some of the possible channels the authors identify include education and training
    decisions, skill and diversity spillovers, trade, entrepreneurship, and clustering. It is also
    possible that scale and agglomeration could create larger positive impacts if future
    migration flows increase significantly. Existing evidence on these possibilities is too
    uncertain to enable estimates precise enough to guide policy.

    4.5 Large negative effects: conclusion
    Overall, the evidence points to small domestic labour market effects (which may be
    positive or negative), moderate negative effects on the housing market (which also reflect
    the operation of local government and other regulations that inhibit a greater housing
    supply response to increased demand), and modest net costs from replacing skilled
    emigrants with skilled immigrants. Meeting the infrastructure needs of migrants may also
    divert resources from more productive activities, imposing potentially significant
    macroeconomic costs via higher interest and exchange rates, and lower productivity
    growth. This latter point is difficult to establish empirically, and warrants more in-depth
    formal research.

    In the conclusion the auther observes “the evidence is not symetric: we have had 20 years of population growth”
    http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/research-policy/wp/2014/14-10
    Kudo’s for being troubled this sophistry.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  33. WineOh (630 comments) says:

    @ Harriet, yes when the news finally broke in mainstream media here there has been an uneasy silence about it. It seems we still have a sacred cow in our media about calling it how it is. All those crying about how NZ has a “rape culture” perhaps need to open their eyes a tad more.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  34. Keeping Stock (10,340 comments) says:

    @ ste3e – apart from shamelessly politicising the tragic death of two WINZ staffers, you completely ignore the fact the man alleged to have committed the murders was offered help by WINZ and by other social agencies, and turned it down.

    Go back to your cesspit.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 31 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  35. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

    Unpopular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 35 You need to be logged in to vote
  36. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    @ste3e
    Hurry up, you’re late for school

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 21 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  37. Griff (7,715 comments) says:

    Powered vehicles with 2 axles Not more than 3.5 tonnes $58/1000 km
    http://nzta.govt.nz/vehicle/registration-licensing/ruc/rates-fees.html
    There needs to be a lower rate for cars under 2 tonnes preferably extremely low to encourage a fleet with the higher efficiency and lower co2 emissions of diesel engines.
    Personally I prefer to drive diesel and was looking at replacing the Camry with a diesel Focus however its not worth it with the present road user regime.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  38. WineOh (630 comments) says:

    @ Keeping Stock, Thanks I didn’t go into the full body of that one as I saw Nats at 49% on the front of it but the stuff article saying 54+% so assumed it was out of date.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  39. PTM (47 comments) says:

    RRM: It pisses me off having to pay road taxes on my log splitter, chainsaws, mulcher and mowers.
    Having to pay the tax, (even if I could claim for the tax later) would be a step too far!

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  40. Harriet (4,972 comments) says:

    RRM#

    Well RRM, roads arn’t soley paid for by petrol taxes.

    It’s called the consolidated fund.

    You may as well argue why workers should have to pay for the retired.

    But seriously, it’s the tax rate that is your issue – diesel for off-road tractors should only inncure GST as diesel in that case is just an engine running cost – and not a ‘road tax’.

    A better example is that between petrol and electrical water pumps on farms – why should petrol in that case incure more tax than electricity?

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  41. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    Why should the operators of diesel tractors, diesel diggers, diesel bulldozers and diesel ships – which never use the roads – pay petrol tax towards the upkeep of the roads?

    Give em a rebate. Good cross-checking mechanism for the IRD too.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  42. Ashley Schaeffer (487 comments) says:

    ste3e (96 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 8:58 am
    Truth is too low for the right because it interferes with their profits.

    Where are all these communist drones coming from? Hopefully, they will flitter off again after the election.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  43. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    @IGM

    That’s an insult to rodent morals :-)

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  44. hj (7,021 comments) says:

    Re my suggestion that the NZIER is bent (for hire):

    The lack of evidence is not symmetric. New Zealand has had high levels of inward
    migration for 20 years now. Arguments for large positive effects invoke the possibility that
    there are long lags, or that more positive effects will occur once some higher population
    threshold is reached. In this case there is presently no evidence, but a possibility that
    positive effects will eventually be reaped. In contrast, stylised facts such as real interest
    rates that are high by international standards and a real exchange rate which has not
    adjusted to the sustained deterioration in New Zealand’s relative productivity performance
    are real and demonstrable, but cannot be definitively linked to migration policy.

    http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/research-policy/wp/2014/14-10

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  45. Elaycee (4,392 comments) says:

    RRM: Why should the operators of diesel tractors, diesel diggers, diesel bulldozers and diesel ships – which never use the roads – pay petrol tax towards the upkeep of the roads?

    Don’t forget KiwiRail. At one stage the diesel used in their loco fleet included the RUC (because it was too hard to differentiate between diesel used in their loco fleet and diesel used for their trucks).

    Not sure if this is still the case, but if so, KiwiRail could surely put up a similar argument?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  46. OneTrack (3,104 comments) says:

    RRM – “The system isn’t perfect, but the people who initiated it weren’t idiots”

    I don’t know about that. It has the unintended? consequence of every man and his dog buying big four-wheel drives just to get little Tarquin to school. Because it’s “cheaper”.

    What is the relative usage of those non-road functions? I would have thought very little. But we have to have a big bureaucracy to handle the RUC and the exclusions and inclusions.

    Just bite the bullet, and make things a lot easier. Yes, your tractor might cost a bit more to run. Would you actually notice it? And you probably drive it on the road anyway.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  47. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    You suffer this amazing delusion that self responsibility is a thing that some people do not have. Every body acts in their own best interests that is how the mind works. It is the situation that largely determines what interest are best for the individual. If you have a society that ramps up situations where people act criminally it is not because the genetic pool has suddenly changed, it is because the society has become rotten and placed people in invidious situations.

    The self responsibility you think that other people lack is actually, if you would look at it, your own pre-conceptions about how others should act. You would try to dictate against the innate self-responsibility of all humans your own agenda. Getting tough on crime is nothing other than despotism to those whose will is opposed. If you want to change their will to accord with the general good then change the society so they do not find crime advantageous. As they do in equal societies.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 1 Thumb down 25 You need to be logged in to vote
  48. kowtow (8,475 comments) says:

    The British Courts affirming rape culture. How the hell can you get bail on such serious charges.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2743613/Rapist-deliberately-infected-woman-HIV-goes-run-granted-bail.html

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  49. RRM (9,924 comments) says:

    OneTrack – so your solution is to transfer to the productive sector, the taxation PITA thay you are complaining your private car incurs?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  50. questions (207 comments) says:

    What is wrong with David Seymour and why is Jamie Whyte fronting everything?

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  51. OneTrack (3,104 comments) says:

    ste3e – “You suffer this amazing delusion that self responsibility is a thing that some people do not have”

    Only left-wingers. They always want someone else to pay to bail them out or for their grandiose schemes (1.5 million dollar state house with $750 thousand dollar chandelier on Queens Wharf), complete with their unintended consequences. Like Cunliffe and his CGT which they obviously haven’t actually thought about longer than it took them to drink the bottle of Chardonnay while they were scribbling the “policy”(tm) on the back of a wine glass coaster. And the first question somebody (Key) asks about it and Labour don’t know and/or they disagree what the answer is. Policy development on-the-hoof – condition normal in lefty-land.

    And what happens if they get it completely wrong. Who cares, let’s just tax rich pricks more. Because they deserve it. Lefty mindset in a nutshell.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  52. OneTrack (3,104 comments) says:

    RRM – “OneTrack – so your solution is to transfer to the productive sector, the taxation PITA thay you are complaining your private car incurs?”

    I am saying that the costs of the present system are outweighing the supposed benefits.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  53. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    As for National’s claim that inequality has not increased under their watch, how would they possibly know. They are not keeping stats on how many people have ended up on the street earning zero income. If you start adding zeros as the amounts that some people earn that is going to affect the amount of inequality the figures will show.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 22 You need to be logged in to vote
  54. IGM (392 comments) says:

    ste3e: Are you a public servant or beneficiary? You would be unemployable, and not have the ability to operate your own venture. People like you are the types that support Hager, Campbell, Cunliffe, or any other flotsam with a noise . . . go crawl in your taxpayer provided cesspit.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  55. Left Right and Centre (2,979 comments) says:

    Woes of minimum wage felt by family

    Oh well – go back to the islands then mate.

    Ta’ufo’ou said savings is not a word in his vocabulary.

    Quite a few words aren’t in islanders vocabulary – if you hear half of them speaking English. Half of them talk island with their kids – like a lot of other foreigners. That will break the cycle of poverty if the kids don’t learn English eh ?

    “At the moment I can’t afford to take my girls to the movies. So I have to ask: Who has failed my family? The system has.

    Well I’ll be. The system forced this fella to have kids. The system is why he’s only worth minimum wage. Are they getting Working For Families ? Let’s not count that top-up. Maybe the Greens can introduce cinema discounts for low wage earners. Here’s your community popcorn card.

    Their combined fortnightly income is $2000, nearly half of which is spent on rent.

    $1 000 a week for two adults two children. It doesn’t say if WFF in included in that or if they claim it. Always something dodgy in these sob stories. Always. I don’t know – if that’s the bottom it could be worse, couldn’t it ? Again – we don’t know everything. Sending any money back ‘home’ ? (NZ isn’t home). Paying off dumb stuff ? Debts ? Who knows. Let’s cry tears of sympathy . . . won’t someone please *please* . . . think of the children !! They might be starving like the father clearly is. Poor fella is skin and bone by islander standards – doesn’t have nearly enough chins.

    Really ? Nearly $500 a week ? If money is that tight can’t they downgrade a bit ?

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  56. kowtow (8,475 comments) says:

    “Where are all these communist drones coming from? Hopefully, they will flitter off again after the election.”

    I get the impression the publicity around Hager has brought out a lot of thse mosquitoes who have come to “right wing blogs” to buzz around and be a general nuisance.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  57. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Sorry mate, but a slight diminution of your wealth is not worth more than a child’s life. Who in their right mind can think otherwise?

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 1 Thumb down 29 You need to be logged in to vote
  58. holysheet (389 comments) says:

    Steve with a 3 is looking like a Judith incarnation.
    Another one who cannot do, so goes teaching instead?

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  59. Lance (2,655 comments) says:

    @ste3e
    So have you given all your assets to charity?

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  60. flash2846 (284 comments) says:

    Sean Plunket just attacked WhaleDump and immediately Krim Dot Com phoned in. I think we now know who WhaleDump is.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 22 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  61. G152 (341 comments) says:

    5th of September, isn’t Slim Dotcrim going to drop his neutron bomb any day now?

    I’d say by now its going to be a fizzer..
    And the whaledump came back and nothing.
    Love those poll figures though

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  62. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    I’m surprised there aren’t three posts by Penny Bright already crowing over how her vague claims and allegations are validated by the attention that spamming them here gives her.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  63. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    The worse thing is that the right are so dumb economically. If the government were to fund wood processing plants to add value to timber rather than exporting the logs offshore they would be stepping into a area private and foreign capital is not filling. If the government issued bonds off the back of future revenue they would be generating jobs, export revenue and expertise for no outlay. I cannot believe that such a product could fail. And even if the bonds did fail because private enterprise stepped in after the fact and reaped the profits, the jobs and export revenue would be secured.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 0 Thumb down 25 You need to be logged in to vote
  64. Griff (7,715 comments) says:

    ross411
    dont call the devil it may hear.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  65. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    ste3e (99 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 9:20 am
    Sorry mate, but a slight diminution of your wealth is not worth more than a child’s life. Who in their right mind can think otherwise?

    Ah, the weak “if it even saves one child’s life, it’s worth it” justification. Of course, any question of how much other damage whatever is being justified by this will do, is dismissed as irrelevant. How many children over the years have really died because of this empty philosophical reasoning that ste3e employs, and of course he would never accept blame when it happens, right ste3e?

    ste3e, you are clearly a weak person who can’t argue rationally, and has to resort to hyperbole.

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  66. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    ste3e

    It has been widely reported ( and pointed out to you by others above) that the guy was help by WINZ and other agencies but he turn it down. What were they meant to do ? Grab him and physically force him into the accommodation they had offered him ? Force him in any way possible to take the other assistance offered ?
    But no you just say it is all the Governments fault and you shamelessly blame the deaths of the two people on the Government.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 22 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  67. Griff (7,715 comments) says:

    ste3e (100 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 9:29 am
    We tried that back in the day it was called think big
    Glen brook steel paper mills etc all ended up being costly mistakes.
    If there is profit the private sector is many times more efficient at seeing opportunity and taking advantage than the public sector.Under your proposal all that happens is wealth capture by those with power…. crony capitalism.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  68. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    I have argued that people do what is in their best interests; how is it in my best interests to put myself on the street? What I am saying is that putting anybody on the street is not in anyone’s best interest because they are likely to pick up a shot gun and shoot people. If you don’t think people should be shooting other people then don’t put them on the street.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 24 You need to be logged in to vote
  69. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    ste3e (100 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 9:29 am
    The worse thing is that the right are so dumb economically. If the government were to fund wood processing plants to add value to timber rather than exporting the logs offshore they would be stepping into a area private and foreign capital is not filling. If the government issued bonds off the back of future revenue they would be generating jobs, export revenue and expertise for no outlay. I cannot believe that such a product could fail. And even if the bonds did fail because private enterprise stepped in after the fact and reaped the profits, the jobs and export revenue would be secured.

    ste3e, where your “logic” again falls down, is that if this were such an opportunity to be taken advantage of, then you could start up a business which made a mint. Instead, it’s whack-a-doodle nonsense you’ve constructed with no study or research and then trotted out. So you’re either stupid and ignorant, or a troll? Which is it?

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  70. polemic (460 comments) says:

    Update re
    MIA – Hone Harawira

    Sources close to the Kaipara Coastguard report that search authorities have activated all available life boats in the Kaipara Harbour area.

    Sources report that late Wednesday evening a trial run was being conducted with a new Multi- Captained Vessel called a Co- Boat that had been taken there for sea trials from an undisclosed location in Coatesville. :-(

    Apparently there was a disagreement on board and a rather large imposing figure was seen arguing near the rear of the vessel with a obviously frightened Maori gentlemen.
    Due to the inherent instability of the vessel it immediately lurched very strongly over to the left or starboard side and a large splash was reported from those watching from the shore. The vessel started taking on water and remaining listing to the left/starboard side.

    A woman’s voice was heard screeching over the water saying what was that splash and a strong Germanic accent called back and said probably just a Whale but I did not cee anysink. :cry:

    Police were not called because no offence has been committed and no one was reported missing yet.

    Update: A very upset woman known as Titiwhai has asked Police to assist with the search but Police say until someone is reported missing they will not be helping in the search.

    The Co-boat meanwhile was taken back out of the water and the boat builder told he would not be paid.

    Stay tuned for more updates

    Vote: Thumb up 18 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  71. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    ste3e (101 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 9:33 am
    I have argued that people do what is in their best interests; how is it in my best interests to put myself on the street? What I am saying is that putting anybody on the street is not in anyone’s best interest because they are likely to pick up a shot gun and shoot people. If you don’t think people should be shooting other people then don’t put them on the street.

    No, again you mislead. You’ve argued they do what’s not in YOUR best interests. And then rambled with lots of self-serving nonsense.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  72. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Taranaki oil fields are a mistake? The employment and the kids raised off the back of that employment was a mistake? No, the mistake is that Rob borrowed the country into 20 billion debt and bankrupt us in the slanted vision of Roger Douglass while building jobs and futures. Key has simply borrowed 60 billion so he could pretend to give tax cuts.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 21 You need to be logged in to vote
  73. publicwatchdog (2,595 comments) says:

    Good moaning Kiwibloggers :)

    Well – what a day this is going to be.

    5 September 2014 is my 60th birthday.

    Goodness me – doesn’t time fly when you have so much trouble to make! :)

    Of course – being a veteran protestor and all that, it is only fitting that today should be the day where I help to organise another very important protest.

    WHERE: Outside the Auckland High Court
    Waterloo Quadrant

    TIME: 1.30pm – 2.15pm

    WHY: To oppose Cameron Slater’s attempt to injunct and muzzle the media to prevent any further publication of hacked emails from Whaledump.

    Am looking forward to the attendance of all those who believe that the public’s right to transparency and accountability of those who hold public office at the highest levels – especially Ministerial – trumps any attempts they, or others may make on their behalf, to claim ‘privacy’.

    This, in my view, is an attempt to use the Court to help cover up CORRUPTION at the highest levels.

    Not on.

    NOT ok.

    Look forward to seeing the DECENT New Zealanders defending democracy, transparency, accountability and freedom of the press.

    Kind regards

    Penny Bright

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 2 Thumb down 27 You need to be logged in to vote
  74. duggledog (1,557 comments) says:

    Whoever is watching the minor parties’ debate tonight on TV1 – here’s something to watch out for: Harre’s hands.

    Nobody seems to pick up on it; even the supposedly professional pundits who gather after a debate don’t seem to spot this, but her hands twitch like crazy. I saw it plain as day, twice on the debate / dinner thing that Campbell Live hosted the other night. When they took a close up shot of her opening her fortune cookie you could see it plain as day.

    Why?

    I believe either she’s tremendously excited at being back in the fray again (enjoy it darling, it ain’t going to last) OR she is under intense internal mental pressure.

    Same as Helen Clark’s cheek twitching away during the final leader’s debate with John Key when it was plainly obvious the game was finally up. Not one single commentator saw it, but I believe this clear body language spoke volumes

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  75. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Who is being ridiculous now. Where the hell am I going to get the capital to kick the thing off the ground? If private and foreign capital won’t do what needs to be done the government should do so for both economic and social reasons.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 20 You need to be logged in to vote
  76. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    ste3e

    If it is so easy to set up a business to use the log to produce wood products to export that are more profitable than just selling logs, why don’t you get together with like minded people , raise the money and start the business up.
    There are few closed saw mills around –you might be able to buy them cheap. It has to be a winner because you think the Government is so stupid not to fund it for others.
    In other words put your money and effort where your mouth is.

    (Edit –If private and foreign capital won’t invest it would be because it is not economic –simple.)

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  77. Griff (7,715 comments) says:

    The mistake was the Motunui gas to petrol plant wasting the Maui field with inefficient processes.
    if you think Douglas was anything like Muldoon you really are a ignorant lefty propaganda deluded twat.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  78. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Polemic this is alarming news, possibly the biggest celebrity mystery since the 7th Earl of Lucan disappeared on the 7th of November 1974!

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  79. Gravelroad (155 comments) says:

    A man with mental and other health issues, who has received tax payer funded counselling, health care, housing assistance and financial welfare benefits decides one day that this isn’t enough and someone else must pay more.

    He has enough resources to own and operate a firearm.

    Three ladies in a small town office end up paying.

    End of story.

    Vote: Thumb up 17 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  80. nasska (11,510 comments) says:

    In case anyone could be in doubt the troll “ste3e” plagued KB in the lead up to the 2011 election.

    Union flunky from memory.

    Vote: Thumb up 19 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  81. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    The stupid thing is the direction that the economy dictates. For the economy dictates that the opportunity and the jobs should not be created because the enterprise might not be “economic”. Hell’s teeth, economy is things like turning logs into usable items; it is not simply profit in the banker’s pocket; therein lies the perversion. Shit, the banker’s profit would have us all taking out options on markets so we could all be rich and nobody producing a damn thing.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 16 You need to be logged in to vote
  82. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    The story begins with a kid who was disadvantaged from the start and was diagnosed as mentally challenged. We never used to have so many such kids. And it is appalling that innocents were caught up in what will be a continuing trend until such time as we wake up realize that crime is an expression of a sick society rather than willful disobedience on the part of some de-contextualized individual. The sickness is the current economic direction.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 16 You need to be logged in to vote
  83. graham (2,335 comments) says:

    publicwatchdog at 9:43 am:

    Funnily enough, I was thinking about you last night Penny. (Ooh-err!) You know the sad thing is, if I could get past the two major problems that you suffer from, I could actually start looking at your opinions. Even though I may not necessarily agree with them, I would at least agree with your right to voice them and fight for them. But there are two major hurdles that I cannot get past; that every time you post cause a kneejerk reaction from me; two hurdles that I suspect most people stumble at.

    Hurdle number one: For the past couple of weeks everybody’s been talking about dirty politics. The way that you approach politics, Penny, is “nasty politics”. You ridicule, abuse, denigrate, and insult people. You call them names – “dodgy”, the “Not-So-Honourable”, “shonky”. You call them corrupt, greedy, and useless. You opine that they don’t have the life experience, that Jami-Lee Ross is too young to be of any use. You depict people as rats, as pigs wallowing in mud. You accuse them of having no morals or ethics. You harangue, bully, and intimidate people. You vandalise the billboards of your political opponents.

    You may see these actions as “gutsy” or “fierce” or satirical, but they’re not. They’re just plain nasty. And I think you will find that the majority of decent New Zealanders, don’t appreciate “nasty politics”.

    Hurdle number two: arrogance. The approach you demonstrate on Kiwiblog, and in all public arenas that I have witnessed, is unbelieveably arrogant. You put your point but refuse to debate it, instead demanding that people accept you are right. You dump large swathes of “copy-and-paste” on various blogs. You loudly pose questions and demands, insisting that people respond and accusing them of hiding information if they don’t – yet if anybody has the audacity to question you, you fallback to your nasty approach, calling them names and insulting and belittling them. You demand that people address your so-called “facts”, yet refuse to acknowledge the facts that other people point out to you.

    Nasty politics, and arrogance. If you could get past those two hurdles, Penny, I think most people would be prepared to give you a fair go. I certainly would. In contrast to what some people have said, I have never believed you to be corrupt, or crazy. But as you’ve found on Kiwiblog, nastiness and arrogance are not actually the most effective tactics for actually ACHIEVING anything, apart from getting people annoyed. And if you ever make it into Parliament, you’ll find these tactics don’t work terribly well there, either. Oh sure they get you attention, they get you noticed, they get you talked about. Hell, Hone’s built his Parliamenary career on these very same tactics. But to actually achieve anything of substance, you need to be able to work with other people – and funnily enough, when you’re busy alternately insulting them and ignoring them, other people tend not to want to work with you.

    If you do, by some miracle, make it into Parliament; and if you behave there in the same way that you have carried on for the past few years; then I genuinely wish you luck Penny – because to actually ACHIEVE anything with that approach and not be just another waste of taxpayers’ money, you’ll need it.

    Vote: Thumb up 20 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  84. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    BREAKING NEWS:

    Another alarming development in the Hone Harawira missing person case.

    A bedraggled person washed up in Northland beach claims skullduggery.

    Authorities at this point are unable to confirm whether the new informant is a male of female; but say G. Beyer is alleging Mr Harawira is the victim of a dastardly plot hatched between a Nazi sympathiser and his feminist partner.

    Police emphasize that at this point G. Beyer’s testimony needed to be subject to independent corroboration due to the confused state Beyer was in.
    “Really she didn’t know whether she was Arthur or Martha”, the Hokianga Community Constable said.

    Vote: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  85. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    publicwatchdog (2,351 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 9:43 am
    WHY: To oppose Cameron Slater’s attempt to injunct and muzzle the media to prevent any further publication of hacked emails from Whaledump.

    Thank you for being honest Penny. These are not leaked, they are hacked personal property illegally obtained and received. I suggest you and the others retain a lawyer to assert public domain over these currently illegally obtained and unethically read emails, so that you can legally hold them as things you should have access to for political reasons.

    I say this, because I would like all the other “journalists” to scurry for cover, having received these stolen goods and then be facing the possibility of their own emails being hacked and implicitly becoming public domain in the way Slater’s has.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  86. Sofia (857 comments) says:

    Penny, Happy 60th Birthday
    with kind regards, Sofia

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  87. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    ste3e (105 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 9:44 am
    Who is being ridiculous now. Where the hell am I going to get the capital to kick the thing off the ground? If private and foreign capital won’t do what needs to be done the government should do so for both economic and social reasons.

    Take a loan, start small. If the money is there, then the banks will be willing to help you. I congratulate you on identifying a promising opportunity, and being willing to get out there and make something of yourself and it. And not being someone who moans about stuff they wouldn’t bother doing themselves, and bemoaning how the rest of the country should pay on their behalf to do it.

    I am not your slave to pay taxes so that you, my self-appointed massa, may spend it on whimsical personal ideas which have not been well researched and are otherwise spat out in a blog’s comment section as THE TRUTH WE SHOULD ALL ACCEPT.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  88. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    No you have the sight of a mole. Able in a single bound to see your advantage and blame the other for their imposition upon that. Such sight will surely remove the blight and enter the wondrous realm were advantage alone reigns. Not actually. You will simply be trapped in the bile produced whenever you have to give a hand up to those you chose to let perish. The more that are left the greater that cost. Inescapable.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 19 You need to be logged in to vote
  89. Colville (2,268 comments) says:

    Moderation.

    I would be keen to see some sort of scheme where someone who picked up say 100? or 200? downticks in a day (takes a bit of work!) would be given a holiday for just maybe the next day.

    Your thoughts?

    Please dont ban me DPF :-)

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  90. Left Right and Centre (2,979 comments) says:

    nasska – you are handy.

    Trinity: I need a download to hotwire a motorcycle.
    Link: Not a problem, one crash course in motorcycle…
    Trinity: Wait. Cancel that. [to Keymaker] You are handy. Jump on.

    – The Matrix Reloaded

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  91. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    That would be fine if I were simply spitting abuse and profanity. A bit odd if I were simply presenting an opinion that was unliked. What sort of democracy would it be where those who did not agree with John Key and prostrate themselves before his nonsense were by fiat of complicity trespassed. But such oddity might not be the exception but the rule for the right who it seems cannot reason so well as to accommodate opinions that differ from their own.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 14 You need to be logged in to vote
  92. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Colville
    Penny has really degenerated in the last week or so into a full on Troll. As DPFs Posting Policy makes clear, just complain and he will Demerit point her. Eventually she’ll get a “holiday”.
    Its 35 points for trolling. 100 and you’re gone.
    “4. So how else can I get banned?
    It is subjective, and ultimately a decision on whether the nature and style of your posts is detracting from the usability of the blog. The idea is to be debating issues and events.
    If I think that your purpose is to disrupt the blog, rather than genuinely offer honest opinion, I’ll lose patience at some stage. If you continually turn the blog into a personal flamewar I’ll suggest you go get your own blog.”

    You need to point it out as he doesn’t read General Debate.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  93. Keeping Stock (10,340 comments) says:

    @ Penny – where is the public interest in the release of hacked/stolen Facebook chats where someone is upset after a relationship break-up? I suspect that even a public watch-dog like you would be concerned that Rawshark took a step too far yesterday.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  94. OneTrack (3,104 comments) says:

    ste3e – “… was diagnosed as mentally challenged. We never used to have so many such kids.”

    Yes, we did actually. But in those days we used to look after them properly with organisations dedicated to that role.

    Then the progressives came along, closed down those organisations and threw those people out into the street. Because they are “equal”(tm). She’ll be right.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  95. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Re Ste3e
    DNFTT

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  96. alloytoo (543 comments) says:

    @Penny

    Happy Birthday.

    ——————-

    I must confess I’m disappointed that you intend to intimidate our independent judiciary through mob action.

    I’m however not surprised that you value neither his privacy nor his property rights.

    Disappointed but not surprised.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  97. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    RRM (9,690 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 8:42 am

    Scott Chris (5,984 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 8:29 am

    He notes that during the leaders’ debates, Cunliffe comes surrounded by an army of fluffers, all lubing him up to the point the poor guy

    I am haunted by that imagery. :omg

    I got a semi :oops:

    You must have started with solid wood.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  98. Keeping Stock (10,340 comments) says:

    Oh; and from one who will next year reach the milestone you are celebrating today; happy 60th birthday Penny :D

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  99. Fletch (6,389 comments) says:

    A woman beheaded in London a few hours ago –

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-29068391

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  100. big bruv (13,895 comments) says:

    Ste3e

    Tell me, why is it that you think you should have unfettered access to my bank balance?

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  101. alex Masterley (1,517 comments) says:

    Happy birthday Penny.
    If I wasn’t playing golf today I would have wandered down to the High Court to watch the fun outside.
    Inside the court it will be as dull as dishwater for the uninitiated.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  102. graham (2,335 comments) says:

    And I will say, happy birthday Penny. At this milestone I sincerely hope you take the time to reflect on where you are at, where you are heading, and – most of all – how you intend to get there.

    Nuff said.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  103. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    Just heard Josie Pagani on ZB talking about the CGT.

    She said it was a shame that Cunliffe and co had got dragged into discussing the detail of the policy and not just talk of the “concept” –this seems to be the standard party message on the issue. ( Must have got instructions from the war room)

    Firstly as has been point out many times , this key Labour policy has been around for at least 4 years. If you cannot workout the detail and a way to easily communicate it in that time then something is wrong.

    Secondly, in general , why should voters not expect to see detail of policies ?? Especially tax policies.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  104. Ashley Schaeffer (487 comments) says:

    Many happy returns of the day Penny.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  105. Griff (7,715 comments) says:

    http://www.electionresults.co.nz/
    Epson
    ACT 79.6
    National 15.2
    Conservative 5.2

    Party vote ACT and get a vote that counts toward a more right leaning government.
    Party vote conservative and waste your vote…

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  106. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    st3e.

    Your suggestion needs to be much more than what may seem like a good idea.

    So, have you done the market research to ensure that there is a market for the “added value” products you wish produce?

    Have you done a cost benefit analysis to ensure that you can produce a product that is equal in quality and at a competitive price? This would include logistics – transport, delivery and distribution of the product.

    Have you considered the effect of those raw materials thus used, then not being available to overseas manufacturers, and therefore the country/company would lose a valuable market?

    Have you considered the effect of those companies which presently add the value to our raw materials overseas, react to a competitor in their ballpark and adjust their operation accordingly?

    When you come back and advise all those things and present a proper marketing plan for your idea, you may be listened to – but all you are presenting is a socialist scheme to get the govt. to waste taxpayers money which could be used instead to help your underpriveleged poor and mentally unstable that you were bitching about previously.

    Finally, have you checked out why in recent years local companies and also large overseas companies have closed their operations doing exactly what you suggest because they were not viable? Because the market conditions changed.

    You’re really not very bright, are you?

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  107. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    How you manage to draw the inference from children should not starve and nobody should have to live on the streets, to full access to your bank balance is beyond me. Nobody is pretending that those who work for it should not benefit from doing so. The point is that by not sharing that wealth to eradicate the former you end up paying anyway, either through crime, hospital visits, etc. Or do you wish not to pay for the justice service either and we can let the strongest and meanest and murderest rule.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 12 You need to be logged in to vote
  108. big bruv (13,895 comments) says:

    Those of you who have not been listening to Radio Live this morning have missed something special. Kim Dotcom called the show twice and had a mini melt down on air. I am not going to lay out what happened but those who missed it really should go to the Radio Live site and have a listen.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  109. big bruv (13,895 comments) says:

    ste3e

    “The point is that by not sharing that wealth”

    So, if I were to have paid over $60,000 in PAYE last year why is that figure not enough?, or “not sharing”?

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  110. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    You are wedded to the idea that the economy has to make profit. The Australian aborigines ran about the desert placing sticks in the earth and gaining mana and spiritual capital by doing so. This notion of profit is an artifact of our society, it is not real, and it is no measure of what humans should be doing with their lives. It is the reason the last five hundred years have seen the environment collapse. Even today, after establishing recycle bins upon the argument that landfills were filling with plastic, the council, doubtless for financial reasons, have removed plastic bags from valid items to recycle. Time and again the economy keeps asking us to do the stupidest of things. Letting children starve because it is profitable is stupid. The reason you might build such a venture is because it is socially responsible.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 18 You need to be logged in to vote
  111. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Missing person update.

    In a shocking new development in the Harawira mystery, secret details have been leaked to a MSM outlet (no doubt “hacked” from a reputable blogsite) who have published “broad-brush” details of the sensational disappearance on their website.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10464344/Where-is-Hone-Harawira

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  112. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    That depends on what you earn. If you earned 2 billion last year and only paid 60K tax then you are asking someone who earns 40K to pick up the slack. Their picking up the slack means real privation, not just an inability to buy the latest Porshe. It used to be the case that someone driving a Porshe was respected as someone who worked really hard and did really well. Then the 80/90s and people driving Porches were just yuppie wankers earning money for nothing; indeed many of them were busy dismantling the very industries that employed the currently unemployed because such sales were profitable. I think I would rather be paying high taxes, buying the vehicle I wished and being respected for having done so well.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 13 You need to be logged in to vote
  113. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    ste3e (109 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 11:58 am
    You are wedded to the idea that the economy has to make profit.

    ste3e, what I like about you, is that you honestly seem to believe what you are saying, unlike some of the other Labour supporters who just come here to spread hate and provoke.

    No-one is against your idea. It might even be a good one. But the problem is that these types of ideas are never well justified and thought out in a business sense, they’re pushed as inherently the right thing to do. And that’s the problem. Phrases like “if it even saves the life of one child” are thrown out. You can’t convince people with this. And it’s wrong to just demand people assume you are right, and that their tax money be spent the way you want. And that’s exactly what it seems like you are doing.

    Don the Kiwi laid out a pretty good start on why your idea can’t be accepted as is. Or taken seriously. If you ignore where he stuck the boot in at the end. Go read it and ignore the last sentence, and then respond to it. Then people can address the details which make it a viable idea. Don might even give you the names of some businesses who did similar work to what you propose, so you can check it for yourself. Maybe then you’ll provide some more detail which rallies support for your idea. Or come up with a different better one.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  114. big bruv (13,895 comments) says:

    ste3e

    “You are wedded to the idea that the economy has to make profit”

    You’re really not very smart are you?

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  115. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    ste3e (110 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 12:07 pm
    That depends on what you earn. If you earned 2 billion last year and only paid 60K tax then you are asking someone who earns 40K to pick up the slack. Their picking up the slack means real privation, not just an inability to buy the latest Porshe. It used to be the case that someone driving a Porshe was respected as someone who worked really hard and did really well. Then the 80/90s and people driving Porches were just yuppie wankers earning money for nothing; indeed many of them were busy dismantling the very industries that employed the currently unemployed because such sales were profitable. I think I would rather be paying high taxes, buying the vehicle I wished and being respected for having done so well.

    Again, you are building a strawman argument which is not supported by facts. We all agree that someone who earns 2 billion and pays 60k tax is not doing their fair share. The problem is that there needs to actually be someone who meets this description.

    Can you provide details this strawman exists?

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  116. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    big bruv (13,578 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 11:54 am
    Those of you who have not been listening to Radio Live this morning have missed something special. Kim Dotcom called the show twice and had a mini melt down on air. I am not going to lay out what happened but those who missed it really should go to the Radio Live site and have a listen.

    Is there any way to listen without using the flash thing? Like downloading an MP3? A summary would be appreciated for us on limited internet access.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  117. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    A question for Cunningham if he/she is around.

    Yesterday you mentioned your 5year old came home from school with a letter asking her to go to school in purple today to support the NZEI protest. So I presume the school did go the step further as apparently many others have and had a “teachers only day” so they could all go on the protests.

    I wonder if the Board of Trustees of these schools were consulted about this ??

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  118. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    ross411

    Just google radio live, and you’ll get a link to the facebook page and then a link to the radio interview.

    Very interesting. Thanks bb.

    And yeah, St3e, you’re really not very smart – probably another youthful idealistic dreamy socialist who is complaining about people making profits.

    Where do you think the taxation comes from? (shakes head in disbelief.)

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  119. Tauhei Notts (1,713 comments) says:

    Sean Plunket has been very good recently.
    If he doesn’t win a Qantas Award, then the game is not fair.
    I think he is much better on talkback than he was on Moaning Report.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  120. Gravelroad (155 comments) says:

    Ste3e-
    Heard a talk a few months ago from a man who said he hadn’t had a lot of advantages in his early life.
    He’d lived in state owned house and his father died when he was a young kid.
    There wasn’t a lot of spare money.
    But, he’d got out of bed every morning, gone to school, ate the lunch his solo parent mother supplied, did some work, built a career, made money.
    He made the most of opportunities available and did not blame others (ie a “sick society” or the government of the day) for set backs . He did not buy into the grievance business and learned not to make excuses.
    He paid/pays a lot of taxes and donates to charities as part of a social conscience.

    Life is what you make it.

    PS: the speaker referred to is John Key.

    Vote: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  121. Nookin (3,343 comments) says:

    Ross411

    http://www.radiolive.co.nz/Audio.aspx

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  122. Jack5 (5,137 comments) says:

    Further on the Rotherham mass child rape scandal as mentioned by Harriet in an 8.45 post.

    A New Yorker article questions whether the multiculturalism ideology is to blame for this outrage.

    http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/old-contempt-rotherham?utm_source=tny&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=dailyemail&mbid=nl_090414_Daily&CUST_ID=27594376&spMailingID=7036042&spUserID=NDk0ODY2MTUyNDAS1&spJobID=520321564&spReportId=NTIwMzIxNTY0S0

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  123. kowtow (8,475 comments) says:

    Elderly lady decapitated in London. Police ( very quickly) say it’s not terrorist related………but it appears to be Muslim related!

    “‘Ello,’ello,’ello, a decapitation, move along please, nothing to see ‘ere”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/11075380/Woman-beheaded-in-north-London-garden.html

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  124. Kiwi Dave (89 comments) says:

    Ste3e
    In my arrogant idealistic ignorant youth, I would have agreed with you, but then I discovered reality.

    Companies make profits by selling what people want to buy. Because they are risking their own future in areas where they have direct involvement, they usually make better decisions than politicians and bureaucrats playing with tax-payers’ money. If companies don’t make profits, they go bust. If companies go bust, workers lose jobs, governments lose taxes, retirees lose dividends, so, hooray for profits.

    Now, answer Don the Kiwi’s questions.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  125. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Cost/benefit analysis has been extensively used in America which is trillions of dollars in debt and has spent the last two three years printing money; obviously that works. Rather, what we have is a bunch of mates who agree on how things should be while going into the kind of debt the pre-cost/benefit “economic” world knew not. While congratulating themselves heartily they have sold off their productive capacity, and wasted the ingenuity of the dispossessed to unemployment, drugs, despair and crime.

    The point is not that there is a solution to hand. The point is that the present system does not work (crime, destitution, debt) and we need a government that acknowledges that there is a problem and hopefully has the intelligence to plot a more fruitful path. National are wedded to the most bizarre of failed policies; increasing cattle, deep-sea drilling, draconian welfare, reduced research. Hoping against hope that the obvious failure is imagined.

    Your comment is patronizing. It is not because I do not understand it is because I do not believe the paradigm that is being pushed, and I do not believe the paradigm because there are so many counter-factuals that disprove it.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 13 You need to be logged in to vote
  126. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Well that sounds exactly like the sort of crap preached from the pulpit while the English aristocracy and government built a production-line that extended from the streets to the poor-house to the gallows. Oscar Wilde, “The Soul of Man Under Socialism”

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  127. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    Ste3e.

    Your comparison with America is disingenuous. These problems arise when governments bail out failing companies – crony capitalism that is constantly criticised here – just another form of socialism with a capitalist veneer. The Obama administration would have done much better to not bail out GM – it would have gone into managed bankruptcy and either died or become rejuvenated without the waste of taxpayers money
    Again, look at all the “green industries” that Obama has promoted and put billions of dollars into, and after five years have all failed – Solyndra and the like – all failed socialist policies.

    Check out every socialist country in the world, and see how they’re doing – Argentina, Venezuela, Cuba, North Korea – they’re all shit holes with their people living in dire poverty, yet they have a wealth of natural resources – in particular Argentina and Venezuela.

    I’m not saying capitalism is perfect, but its the best system yet devised to raise the living standards of ALL men, as long as socialists don’t interfere in it, but sensible regulation by sensible governments to avoid exploitation by a few greedy people. We live in an imperfect fallen world – greed is apparent – but so is ENVY – which is a greater destroyer.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  128. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    Look at education. The privatization of schools is largely underwritten by the fact that the government paid for setting up the education system. Without the existing infrastructure and social commitment to education private enterprise would not have initiated to bring this about; according to your own arguments. For private education businesses it makes sense that the government established a niche that they can now adopt.

    Fonterra is another case. Fonterra was established off the back of an existing but relatively poor infrastructure of farmers. Their co-operation has developed an industry on top of the raw product that has added value and export revenue. Forestry is kind of like dairy was before Fonterra; private owners more or less making some profit off their trees. The whole assumption of the arguments I am hearing from the nay-sayers is that Fonterra cannot be duplicated. I do not buy the assumption. And the country is missing an economic opportunity because it is tethered to a failed economic paradigm; the one failing under debt, environment and social dislocation.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 12 You need to be logged in to vote
  129. ciaron (1,434 comments) says:

    @ polemic

    Due to the inherent instability of the vessel it immediately lurched very strongly over to the left or starboard side and a large splash was reported from those watching from the shore. The vessel started taking on water and remaining listing to the left/starboard side.

    For your future informations….
    Right is Starboard,
    Left is Port.

    Otherwise, very good and carry on :)

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  130. polemic (460 comments) says:

    My mistake and thank you for the correction ….

    Actually the illustrious co-boat due to it flailing around in the water and they probably dont have a Red/Port/left side because it would have to be co shared ……….. :roll: :-D

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  131. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    5 September 2014 is my 60th birthday.

    Happy 60th Penny.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  132. ste3e (118 comments) says:

    But it is also blinkered to say that America’s crony capitalism is an utter failure. The money spent has employed people, has given them skills, allowed them to marry and have children and feed and educate those children. And, after all, the money was printed so all this life was bought for naught. The question is, is it better to boil the pot from the bottom and ensure everyone has opportunities that they might find economically or artistically beneficial to society; or is it better to blast the flame from the top and over-cook the wealthy hoping they repay their benefits through time, or more cynically, by voting for their benefactors.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  133. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    I have it on good authority there’s been no red port left in the co-boat since Winston got on board.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  134. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    ste3e, don’t you have a blog post to write for The Stranded?

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  135. Jack5 (5,137 comments) says:

    Yes, Penny, many happy returns!
    Blog right on to the end of the road,
    though it’s decades away.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  136. lilman (959 comments) says:

    Been on Whale oil,read the blog about Cunliffe being shafted by his own party.

    Interesting to say the least.Seems Mr Cunliffe is in for a torrid time in the next few weeks.Politics can be such a damaging affair.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  137. nasska (11,510 comments) says:

    ….”5 September 2014 is my 60th birthday.”…..

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/gwvfrvzwp8cgkmf/Cuckoo%2042.jpg?dl=0

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  138. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    Ste3e
    your 1.45 pm.

    Now you’re making some reasoned argument, but I do suspect your questions show your youth- I may be wrong.
    Many private schools – particularly church sponsored ones, Catholic, Anglican, Presbyterian etc. – were originally set up with no funding from government back in the late 19th and early to mid 20th centuries. This is also the case in other countries – particularly in Europe, where schools go back many centuries and were never funded by governments.

    Back in the 1960’s and since, with government regulation WRT curriculum, building standards, teacher qualification etc many private schools were subject to more rigorous requirements than state schools, and the state and the private institutions came to an agreement for the state to put up much – not all – of the costs of the schools. With the government legislating compulsory education the private schools slotted in with a sharing etc. Id it wasn’t for those privae schools already being in existence, the costs to the government would be very much higher – and would have ahd to spend the money anyway. Remember also that the people involved in the private schools also pay tax to fund education – so it is only fair that the taxes they pay should also go toward the education of their children.

    Your point about Fonterra is correct – but it took a long time to develope. I remember when I was a kid in the 1940’s and 50’s our local co-operative dairy company produced milk for local consumption, made butter and cheese for local and export markets, made milk powder and casein. After a couple of decades as transport improved and roading became better, many of the smaller less efficient dairy companies were closed, and large regional efficient factories were built. I think Fonterra was formed in the late 80’s ?? by amalgamating all, or most, the regional dairy companies.

    The point is, it took a long time for the market to develop, and for the company to devise products to meet the demand in the marketplace. And it took massive amounts of capital investment to do so – and that is why Fonterra is a world leader today.
    The Fonterra story can be duplicated – it is not a failed paradigm. Some fail, some succeed, and some do both spectacularly. Business has become very complex nowadays, and expensive – that is why the research has to be done to demonstrate that it will be profitable – businesses that don’t make a profit cannot be sustained – even by socialist governments – they eventually run out of money – and that’s OTHER PEOPLES’ MONEY. Governments don’t make money – they add cost, not value; it’s their job to ensure that any regulation is designed to help the business and the people involved – investors, management and workers. All factors are vital for the venture’s success.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  139. Jack5 (5,137 comments) says:

    Ciaron posted at 2.01:

    Right is Starboard,
    Left is Port.

    Only when you are facing the bow, Ciaron.

    If you’re hanging a picture, which do you think of the left border? You take it in relation to your own position facing the picture, I presume. For a ship, you need to include an onboard observer’s position facing the bow.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  140. Elaycee (4,392 comments) says:

    ….”5 September 2014 is my 60th birthday.”…..

    I wonder if she will be treating her pet skunk to some nibbles when she swings by the Langham on the way home today… :D

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  141. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    California is in the third year of one of the state’s worst droughts in the past century, one that’s led to fierce wildfires, water shortages and restrictions, and potentially staggering agricultural losses.

    The dryness in California is only part of a longer-term, 15-year drought across most of the Western USA, one that bioclimatologist Park Williams said is notable because “more area in the West has persistently been in drought during the past 15 years than in any other 15-year period since the 1150s and 1160s” — that’s more than 850 years ago.

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/weather/2014/09/02/california-megadrought/14446195/

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  142. UrbanNeocolonialist (288 comments) says:

    Mai Tais might be a fun way to spend an evening, but they can cost you a lot and may produce a terrible hangover, and so should be avoided by campaigning politicians.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  143. minus (194 comments) says:

    Further to lilman 2:43 –

    On WhaleOil

    There are also rumours that Cunliffe’s personal life is going to come under great scrutiny in the last few weeks of the campaign, and that the knifing delegation is already lined up for the day after the election.

    some comments –

    • If you don’t have integrity in your private life (surely the most important area), why would you expect anyone to believe that you have integrity in any other area of your life?

    • I agree. Unless his private live and work life overlap. Do they? Oh yes. [Whaleoil staffer]

    • Please National, don’t go after Cunliffes home life, that’s just low and looks petty. His leadership style & his parties policies are more than enough to lose him the election, please leave it at that.

    And this last comment does raise a concern, and indicates where it could backfire on National.
    However this may all become a Labour revelation if another rumour is true – that it is Grant Robertson behind the spreading of the Cunliffe rumour.
    If some in Labour see it now more important to rearrange the deckchairs rather than win an election, that is Labour’s doing, not National.

    PS: Why has David Cunliffe got a band aid on the back of his neck? Couldn’t one of his minders afford a strip that blends in better?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  144. lilman (959 comments) says:

    Also I heard on Sean Plunket that Bomber Bradberry was at KDCs mansion when Internet/Mana was being developed and we now see Bomber in David Cunliffe advisory panel.

    Seriously who hasnt been to the Mansion?

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  145. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    Jack5 (4,937 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 2:47 pm

    Ciaron posted at 2.01:

    Right is Starboard,
    Left is Port.

    Only when you are facing the bow, Ciaron.

    Port and starboard on a boat are always the same sides, never in relation to the observer. Port is always left when facing the bow, starboard always right. They never get reversed on a boat. At night the running lights of a boat help tell you which way a boat is facing. A red light in the port side, a green light on starboard. It helps avoid collisions that way.

    But yes, if you aren’t facing the bow then port won’t be on your left.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  146. twofish (94 comments) says:

    The Labour Caucus all showed solidarity in sitting behind Shearer as he held up his two dead fish in Parliament, as it seems several advisors blithely allowed Cunliffe’s Queenstown lunch date to go ahead with the Man Who Has No Name.

    National need not really do anything about rumours of Cunliffe’s privates life, it is purported Robertson has been already labouring on it.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  147. Fletch (6,389 comments) says:

    From RadioLive, apparently, Cunliffe’s Cheif Of Staff has had communications with Whale Oil.

    David Cunliffe has confirmed his Chief of Staff Matt McCarten has had communications with Whale Oil. Says he’s seen them and not worried.

    https://twitter.com/LIVENewsDesk/status/507724768498286592

    #rtpt Cunliffe not happy to release the emails/coms even though they are “not of concern”. Says it is a smear campaign from Key.

    https://twitter.com/LIVENewsDesk/status/507725082764918786

    #rtpt David Cunliffe says the fact John Key knows about McCarten’s coms proves he’s been in touch with Slater recently.

    https://twitter.com/LIVENewsDesk/status/507725777467473922

    So, communication with bloggers only matters when John Key or someone else in National does it…

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  148. Jack5 (5,137 comments) says:

    Rightnow (at 2.47):

    We are saying the same thing, different ways.

    When you say “when facing the bow” you are implying an on-board person to give orientation, otherwise who or what is facing the bow? It’s convenient to hypothesise a human is on the vessel facing the bow.

    Regardless, its insufficient to say as Ciaron did:

    Right is Starboard,
    Left is Port.

    Next question for Ciaron: when you are facing a picture on a wall which is the picture’s right side, and which is its left side? I would guess the observer’s right-hand side and left-hand side? Is that correct?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  149. nasska (11,510 comments) says:

    ….”National need not really do anything about rumours of Cunliffe’s privates life”……

    Far better that National & blog commenters stay out of it. The polls show that the general electorate have had a guts full of dirty politics.

    Let the backstabbers in Labour do the job for us.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  150. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    Jack5, agreed

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  151. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    Only when you are facing the bow, Ciaron.

    What if the boat has capsized and you’re sitting on the hull? (or even worse, you’re half way through being keelhauled)

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  152. holysheet (389 comments) says:

    Bugger me, I spilt my coffee listening to whaledump/rawshark/.com talking to shaun just now.
    The hun was bitching about his copywrite on his private video had been breached.
    Pot kettle black etc. How we reap what we sow.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  153. ross411 (839 comments) says:

    lilman (938 comments) says:
    September 5th, 2014 at 3:20 pm
    Also I heard on Sean Plunket that Bomber Bradberry was at KDCs mansion when Internet/Mana was being developed and we now see Bomber in David Cunliffe advisory panel.

    Ah, Martyn Bradberry, who used to do the dodgy radio show late at night when I was a kid where he’d have teen girls call up and give detailed accounts of how they lost their virginity. Listened to that once, then went back to bland but less creepy zm.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  154. polemic (460 comments) says:

    Is Keelhauling what KDC ordered Harre to do to Hone and they capsized before they started …..

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  155. Jack5 (5,137 comments) says:

    Re port and starboard, Scott asked which is port and starboard if you’re sitting on the upturned hull.

    You just accept you’re in a hull of a fix, Scott.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  156. holysheet (389 comments) says:

    : Why has David Cunliffe got a band aid on the back of his neck?

    A.1.Thats where the backstabbers in the liabore party removed the knife
    A.2. He got a big hickey from someone, as the lastest revelations about his private life will prove.
    A.3 Who cares?

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  157. goldnkiwi (1,304 comments) says:

    Couldn’t get over that Bradford woman masquerading as a reporter, while talking about Cameron Slater’s court action managed to say the words dirty politics at leas 5 or 6 times at least.

    I hope the media have to swallow a huge rat. I think your behaviour regarding Whale Oil is appalling. As for stating that any action today ie Shark bait dissembling, was heralded before Cameron took it to a court, I do not believe you.

    When Whaledump was dumped why did ‘they’ bother with a Whaledump 2.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  158. holysheet (389 comments) says:

    Silent t is at it again caught lying about their CGT policy. Yesterday he was asked if they had discussed this with the IRD. he replied with a emphatic yes. Today in a letter to radio live, IRD have denied this conversation.

    You just cannot trust the slimy bastard.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  159. Gulag1917 (917 comments) says:

    “Chinese Australians are being lectured, monitored, organised and policed in Australia on instruction from Beijing as never before”.
    The Australian 19 August 2914, p.9

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  160. SPC (5,619 comments) says:

    Why has Slater’s legal action targeted the New Zealand Herald, TV3 and Fairfax Media and excluded Radio and TV New Zealand?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  161. RightNow (6,994 comments) says:

    holysheeeeet:

    A 4. It’s where the unions inserted the chip.
    A 5. That’s where they went in to remove his balls.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  162. SPC (5,619 comments) says:

    The credibility of whaleoil is not high – the bluff that they had other women to come forward re Len Brown was palpably false (Slater was at the time fishing for someone by using a contact to trawl brothels to find someone who had Brown as a client).

    That there is a story here promoted by leadership rivals is simply another bluff – to discredit both Cunliffe and the party. It is just the sort of dirty politics he resorts to.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  163. goldnkiwi (1,304 comments) says:

    Seriously, does the Herald have to use a picture of Cameron Slater sneering, they do not fool me about their bias. Shame on anyone that they do.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  164. SPC (5,619 comments) says:

    goldnkiwi, maybe Slater could learn to smile for the Herald photographer?

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  165. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    Cameron Slater has got an interim injunction. Round one to W/Oil

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  166. Michael (3,745 comments) says:

    Karl du Fresne
    Social media spurs prejudice.
    OPINION: Everyone agrees this has been the ugliest, most vicious election campaign period in memory.

    The previous benchmark was set in 1975, when the Citizens for Rowling campaign foolishly lit Robert Muldoon’s fuse. But the past few weeks have been even more ill-tempered than Muldoon at his most belligerent.

    What is different this time? Well, there is Kim Dotcom, for starters. The big German’s motive for entering politics was wholly negative: he wants to get rid of John Key. It may be the first time in New Zealand history that a party has been founded on the basis of a personal grudge. Dotcom likes to play the amiable prankster, but the “F… John Key” video was an attempt to legitimise pure abuse as a political tactic – something not seen here before.

    Then of course there was the cleverly-timed launch of Nicky Hager’s book Dirty Politics – a limpet mine attached to the hull of National’s supposedly unsinkable dreadnought.

    But underlying all this is a bigger incendiary influence: the role of social media.

    Twitter, Facebook and the blogosphere have played a large hand in dictating the tone of this election. Cameron Slater’s WhaleOil blog is just the tip of a large and dirty iceberg.

    Much of the political commentary in online forums, on the Left and Right, is extraordinarily toxic and abusive.

    Mercifully, much of it fails to penetrate the mainstream. And to their credit, most politicians try to stay above it.

    But among activists on both sides of politics, overheated online forums have created an atmosphere of rage and bigotry that has reshaped political dialogue. You can sense this baneful influence filtering through into media coverage, which is more intense and aggressive than ever before.

    How could this happen in a country with a deserved reputation for being civilised, liberal and tolerant?

    A couple of factors come to mind. The first is that the internet enables instantaneous comment. Someone feeling a rush of anger can be on Facebook or Twitter within seconds.

    In a previous era, if you wanted to comment on politics, you wrote a letter to the paper. That allowed time for sober reflection – a cooling-down period.

    Then there is the fact that in online forums, the person you are attacking is unseen. You have probably never met. In such circumstances it is all too easy to demonise your imagined enemies.

    Online, you are safely distanced from those you are attacking and feel less compunction about putting the boot in. I have succumbed to this depersonalising effect myself and know how easily it can happen.

    And politics has become intensely tribal. Each political blog, whether it is WhaleOil on the Right or The Daily Blog on the Left, has its own tribe. They are united in hatred against the other tribe. There are even factions within tribes that hate each other.

    Any member of the Left-wing tribe foolhardy enough to stray into the Right-wing tribe’s territory, or vice-versa, will be eviscerated.

    How did we arrive at this point? At the risk of being ridiculed for romanticising the past, I believe it has come about partly as a result of the decline of the traditional news media.

    The old-style newspaper was a “broad church”, presenting a wide range of information and comment from which readers were able to form their own conclusions. But the digital revolution has given politically- minded people an alternative.

    They now tend to gravitate to the online forum that represents their tribe. They show no interest in hearing what the other side thinks, still less in considering whether an opposing view might have some merit.

    The newspaper was also the traditional forum for political debate via its correspondence columns. Good newspapers took the trouble to ensure a broad spectrum of opinion was published, and still do.

    Crucially, letters were subject to an editing process which filtered out abusive and defamatory comment. And just as important, anonymity was prohibited. The price of being able to comment publicly was that you had to identify yourself. No such constraints apply online, where anonymity gives courage to cowards. Champions of the internet applaud the fact that public comment is no longer controlled by gatekeepers in the mainstream media, and they are right, up to a point. But the gatekeepers were a civilising influence whose absence from social media we may come to regret.

    – The Dominion Post

    Ring any bells?

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  167. SPC (5,619 comments) says:

    Ross12, rawshark retired and left some more stuff with media.

    Can those of the media who have read them be prevented from mentioning their contents?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  168. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    A knighthood should be in line for larry williams,NewsTalkZBs attack furball even if hes a bald headed shit.He loves,slater he wants slater to do a whaledump3 of the shit that the TIP LINE(very important hack deposit) has on labour.Wlliams must be important in the right wing world but he to me sounds like a droll fuckwit,said by me in a gentle non threatening way……….ps what does whale oil have on williams… pictures?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 12 You need to be logged in to vote
  169. RRM (9,924 comments) says:

    Polemic –

    Left is the PORT side.

    RIGHT is the starboard side.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  170. goldnkiwi (1,304 comments) says:

    SPC (5,508 comments) says:

    September 5th, 2014 at 5:12 pm

    I am sure they have many to choose from, in fact I also see a normal one as well. I hope media’s arses are nailed to the tree. UNBIASED what a load of absolute crap.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  171. Don the Kiwi (1,757 comments) says:

    There is no..PORT LEFT…….in the bottle. :-)

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  172. Griff (7,715 comments) says:

    Look out for a new “smiley face” Colin Craig.

    The Conservative Party leader says his campaign team has begun swapping billboards featuring a “stern and seriously mad” image of his face with new smiley and obviously loony ones.

    He says it was always their intention to change out their billboards
    http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/auckland/news/nbpol/1608342268-craig-to-turn-billboard-frowns-upside-down
    hat tip to redbaiter

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  173. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Slater’s temporary injunction only applies to the hacker, not to the media. Bit of a clayton’s win, because the hacker has already said he won’t be exposing Slater’s dirty dealings anymore. :-)

    Silencing a person that had already gone silent – kind of makes Slater look even sillier than he already does, IMO.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  174. Pete George (23,562 comments) says:

    Yesterday David Cunliffe told Duncan Garner that Labour had checked with IRD that their computer system could handle CGT (but not Cunliffe himself because, he said, as leader he didn’t “get down in the weeds” – except that when the policy was put together Cunliffe was one of the weeds).

    Today Garner says that IRD have told him they had no discussions with Labour.

    In 2012 Labour’s Revenue spokesperson said “Well placed sources tell me that the Government couldn’t currently implement a capital gains tax…” due to the aging IRD computer – that was on Labour’s blog Red Alert.

    Cunliffe trips over CGT and IRD

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  175. lurcher1948 (151 comments) says:

    As an aside – the latest dump in the last 24 hours included extremely disparaging comments about women – Slater suggesting if women weren’t useful for sex, then they’d probably be stoned.

    Slater will seek his injunction at 2:15pm in the High Court, but whatever the outcome the horse has already bolted.

    We know enough. We know about the dark shadow that’s been cast across our democracy by some of the murky figures who were handing over cash, trying to influence democratic process.

    We know how one man emerged as a powerful figure in politics with a direct line to the Prime Minister’s closest staff members.

    Yet still, quite remarkably, John Key hasn’t moved to distance himself or his Party from Cameron Slater or the Whaleoil blog. Why is that? Why won’t he publicly severe that relationship?

    That remains perhaps the most telling unanswered question of them all.

    John Keys best friend,a friend who has a hold over key,it might come out one day,PS the grease ball dosnt like females,but likes guns,its a right wing thing

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 14 You need to be logged in to vote
  176. goldnkiwi (1,304 comments) says:

    Judith, you would say that, Raw shark will still be prosecuted for his endeavours. There will be others out there who would love to out him as a feather in their cap. Raw Shark first media second, the media in my opinion seem to have lost their way.

    I will not care if they never find relevance again.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  177. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    SPC here is an early comment

    “It’s a win for the Whale Oil Blogger in his battle to muzzle the hacker Whale Dump.

    The High Court has granted Cameron Slater’s request for an interim injunction to stop Whale Dump from passing on any more of his stolen emails.
    The order doesn’t apply to material already passed to the media or previously published information.”

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  178. nasska (11,510 comments) says:

    ….”The Conservative Party leader says his campaign team has begun swapping billboards featuring a “stern and seriously mad” image of his face with new smiley and obviously loony ones.”…..

    This should fit the bill perfectly Griff. :)

    Ref: https://www.dropbox.com/s/sk89382glbfxppa/CCCP%209.jpg?dl=0

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  179. Pete George (23,562 comments) says:

    The third poll today and with similar results:

    ONE News Colmar Brunton poll:
    NAT 50%(+2)
    LAB 26%(-2)
    GRN 11%(-1)
    NZF 7%(+1)
    CNS 3%
    IMP 2%

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  180. waikatogirl (423 comments) says:

    ste3e
    Bought up by indolent parents’ who gave you everything you ever dreamed of? Maybe when you have worked for yourself, or been paid for a decent days work you take pride in, you will get it, and not expect hard-working kiwis to have their income divided up for your and your ilk’s personal benefit

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  181. Sublime (295 comments) says:

    Can those of the media who have read them be prevented from mentioning their contents?

    As in do they have to say who the source contact was? No, they probably won’t have to. From memory it’s Section 68 of the Evidence Act that you’re after.

    The law means life is fairly safe for sources/leakers/whistleblowers most of the time. There could be some legal snags regarding the future publication of the material that was stolen from Cam though.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  182. Reid (16,457 comments) says:

    Karl du Fresne
    Social media spurs prejudice.

    Maybe the delicate Karl needs to grow a pair and recognise robust conversation amongst adults on political blogs which no-one but the beltway generally inhabit anyway, does not indicate the entire process of NZ political discourse is going to hell in a handcart.

    Maybe the delicate Karl also needs to recognise the main poison this election has been seeping from a desperate, breathless and worthless media who can’t even be fucked doing the extraordinarily foundational basics of their wretched so-called profession and talk to the accused before they go ahead and j’accuse away.

    Maybe the delicate Karl needs to ask himself why the fuck the media have been doing that, but he probably won’t do that, one suspects. For that would reveal what everyone who has a 3-digit political IQ already worked out years ago – that the media is populated largely with a few exceptions but largely with screaming babbling dribbling fanatical lefties who just couldn’t fucking stand the fact that the hated conservatives were cruising to a victory unlike their beloved Hulun and so they just had to, no choice, no question, put a stop to that.!!!

    Maybe the delicate Karl needs to ask himself that.

    But he won’t.

    P.S. I deliberately swore and insulted all the journos above just so the delicate Karl would poo his pants and vomit on the floor when he reads this, like the little girl he really does appear to be.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  183. wiseowl (895 comments) says:

    PTM @9am.
    Re your discussion on fuel tax.
    I hope you claim the tax back on petrol used off road.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  184. Michael (3,745 comments) says:

    Reid
    If Karl du Fresne does happen to read your diatribe he will be no doubt be saying you have just proved his point.
    How about you grow a pair and let’s be having your surname as well. That’s assuming Reid is your christian name.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  185. Richard (82 comments) says:

    How dumb is Cameron Slater? Can’t make a successful hit on Len Brown despite Daddy’s contacts and the whole of Key’s black ops department at his disposal.

    Then, when his rude hate speech is laid bare before the nation by the efforts of a concerned citizen, he fails again after a cry baby “don’t publish my psych reports” plea to the court.

    Haha. Loser should go shoot some goats. It will make him feel better.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 15 You need to be logged in to vote
  186. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Is that right, Dick.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  187. Richard (82 comments) says:

    Yes, it is right, gambler man.
    Even Graham McCready took down John Banks.
    Perhaps dipshit Slater should spend some time reading the law instead of abusing minorities.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  188. Tauhei Notts (1,713 comments) says:

    I’m 66 years old so won’t be around to see it. But here goes.
    Political historians write about the effect of the Citizens For Rowling campaign 39 years ago. History records how ineffective that campaign was.
    I think the possibility exists that in 2053 political historians will be writing about how, 39 years ago, the main stream media lost all of their credibility in the run up to the 2014 election.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  189. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Dick
    Banks ain’t out yet. The appeal will be revealing.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  190. Richard (82 comments) says:

    Oh yes that’s really going to work well isn’t it? Banks, and his wife, is dishonest, racist poison to NZ politics and everyone knows it.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  191. big bruv (13,895 comments) says:

    Remember when you were at school and the boring maths teacher told you how important it was that you pass the Algebra test?

    Name the last time you used Algebra?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  192. All_on_Red (1,583 comments) says:

    Stop telling lies Dick. Banks got a lot of votes in Akld and has many supporters. Your just showing your ignorant bias. It’s pathetic . A couple of nice witnesses with integrity are going to contradict Dot com and his ex wife and show they have perjured themselves. Which will pretty much make sure Dot Com gets extradited. The walls are closing on the fat boy.
    Good job too. Now fuck off troll. Back to folding up your tin foil hats to protect yourself from JKs ” black ops” dept.
    Black ops- what a dick

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  193. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Spend 6 minutes on this … I dare ya!

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=467_1409893210

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  194. hmmokrightitis (1,590 comments) says:

    Will the MSM pick up the fact that the dark web just went mental about an “AnonYmous shark” boarding a plane to the US?

    Or so my guys tell me :) I honesty dont think said shark even landed on nz firma. But then geeky nerdy boys are telling me different. NZ 6 tonight apparently. Who knew :)

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  195. Reid (16,457 comments) says:

    Reid
    If Karl du Fresne does happen to read your diatribe he will be no doubt be saying you have just proved his point.
    How about you grow a pair and let’s be having your surname as well. That’s assuming Reid is your christian name.

    I’ve already given those details before on here Michael and yes Reid is my christian name. So since I’ve already obliged, how about you do the same? BTW if you can’t drive google and find out my last name, don’t expect me to oblige you by repeating myself.

    And BTW dummy, I phrased my post the way I did specifically so it would confuse the delicate Karl (and apparently, yourself) into thinking precisely that, as well as making my point at the same time.

    People with 3-digit political IQs would have picked it up, it’s not rocket science, “Michael.”

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  196. nasska (11,510 comments) says:

    The body of the hacker of the Jennifer Lawrence photos was found earlier.

    He’s apparently the first man to be Hi 5’d to death.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  197. OneTrack (3,104 comments) says:

    Pete – “Yesterday David Cunliffe told Duncan Garner that Labour had checked with IRD that their computer system could handle CGT”

    So how the hell can they even ask if the IRD computer can handle it, if the “expert committee” haven’t even decided what the CGT will cover and how it will work.

    The guy is just a bullshitter.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  198. Richard (82 comments) says:

    Hey OneTrack. How do you expect an opposition party to liaise properly with the IRD when all sort of shutters are put up by this corrupt government we have at the moment?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  199. hmmokrightitis (1,590 comments) says:

    Oh Dick do fuck off. Its a simple question. We plan on doing x, can your systems cope? IRD: Well, if you keep changing your policy daily, we really dont know.

    Nice try with blaming the gubbermint (da man, right??) but FFS, do try harder.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  200. Tauhei Notts (1,713 comments) says:

    Big Bruv at 8.00 p.m.
    I last used algebra at 4.30 to 4.55 this afternoon.
    I last studied algebra in 1966.
    Trouble is, when I used a simple algebraic equation to explain how the club’s part year subscription was worked out the person I was talking with had as little brain as you, apparently, have.
    Had the person I was talking with had a fourth form knowledge of algebra, my 25 minute discussion of what I had calculated, would have taken about 2 minutes.
    And fifth form geometry helps me play snooker somewhat better than others with a much better hand eye co-ordination than I have.
    And when I saw a sign that said;
    “Calculus and beer do not mix. If you drink, don’t derive.”
    People with the intelligence of Big Bruv wondered what I was laughing about.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  201. Nookin (3,343 comments) says:

    I see Slater had two court cases. He won one and lost one. How else can you possibly reconcile these headlines? Another interpretation is that the Herald headline is dishonest.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11319673

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10465275/Court-halts-Whale-Oil-leaks

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  202. Richard (82 comments) says:

    Hi hmmokrightitis. You seriously believe the IRD could respond to anything that quickly?

    A more inefficient waste of a department I’ve not seen.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  203. lilman (959 comments) says:

    Judith I did waste 6 minutes reading your panty liner of a diatribe on Key.

    I thought Penny was a bloody nutcase but she is only a minor compared to you.

    Seriously you actually spent time reading that and then asking others too.

    God youre seriously devoid of any common sense or reality.

    Penny flings shit everywhere,you on the other hand have no direction or plan on how your moving forward after the left get shafted in a couple of weeks.

    Judith,are you on drugs?

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  204. Ross12 (1,428 comments) says:

    Hey Dick –Labour have been working on the policy for 4 YEARS. Plenty of time to talk to the IRD.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  205. Richard (82 comments) says:

    Like they’d talk to Labour.

    The IRD, like all public servants have been told to work for the government and no one else.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  206. lilman (959 comments) says:

    Must be a bastard being called DICK all youre life.(and voting labour)

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  207. Scott Chris (6,139 comments) says:

    One of the best final rounds of NRL I can remember. Started last night finishes Sunday.

    Watch it if you like Rugby League.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  208. tom hunter (4,843 comments) says:

    You seriously believe the IRD could respond to anything that quickly?

    A more inefficient waste of a department I’ve not seen.

    It’s good thing that left-wingers like you don’t want to impose new types of taxes then ….. Oh Wait!

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  209. Lindsay Addie (1,514 comments) says:

    I was at a large corporate conference this week in Chch. The political joke of the week from the MC was “Winston Peters is the only person who suffers from self inflicted love bites”. :)

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  210. Jack5 (5,137 comments) says:

    Nasty work in Hamilton yesterday with five protesters accusing Paula Bennett of being responsible for the no-hoper’s shooting of WINZ staff in Ashburton. The five gained a lot of publicity considering for their tiny numbers.

    Sad to see Paula Bennett harassed by nutters.

    The lead protester seems to have been one Kyro Selket, who may or may not once have been called Karen Peters. She was one of the organisers of the event to mark the twenty-fifth anniversary of the sabotaging of the rugby match in Hamilton during the Springbok tour. Presumably this is the Selket who is a mid-life university student, and whose research has included a 200-plus pages paper entitled “The Contested Space of Lesbian Funerals”.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10465187/Protesters-taunt-Paula-Bennett

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  211. Left Right and Centre (2,979 comments) says:

    Reid for a male first name . . . hmmm

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  212. Tauhei Notts (1,713 comments) says:

    Lilman at 9.10 p.m.
    “your panty liner of a diatribe”
    That is the put down comment of the month.
    It would be wrong to say there are holes in your argument; more like spots.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote