General Debate 26 September 2017

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Captain Mainwaring

Dear Mr. James Shaw,

You are in the unprecedented position of giving the Green Party some serious influence after 20 years in the wilderness. It’s time for you and your team to suck a few dead rats in order to give your party some long term credibility and actually achieve something.

1. NZF will be history after this parliamentary term. You need to position your party as the one which can work with either major party for the good of the country.
2. There is no convention that Green equals left. The environmental record of Communist-era USSR and China proves this.
3. A party with the ability to manage a prosperous economy is going to have the resources to provide for environmental initiatives. That party is National.
4. You voted for National’s budget announcement on family support. Why would you side with the only party that opposed it?
5. You campaigned on ‘changing the Government’. Having the Greens in coalition would be a big change to the Government, whether it be a coalition with National or Labour/NZF.
6. Having Winston calling the shots will be destructive for the Parliament and the country, and a three-party coalition would be unmanageable.
7. Winston’s 40 years of baggage and the revenge he will seek on a number of National members will be totally counter-productive. We would all be better off if he was out of it.
8. You’re not that far away from National on environmental policy, and that should be the cornerstone of your party’s culture. It’s social engineering where there’s a bit of a gap, and the co-leader you had who was the torch-bearer for that is no longer there.
9. Suck it up for three years James, perform well in coalition and if National doesn’t deliver, you will be in the box seat to go with Labour next time.

As a National supporter I can appreciate that they need an environmental conscience, and that is your party’s role. Just get on with it and make the only decision that makes sense for the future of our country. The wider electorate would thank you for it.

Working with either major party seems to work OK for all the Green Parties in Europe. Why should it be any different here?
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September 26, 2017 8:01am
- Kimbo
  
  1. Because Shaw and the Greens promised to “end” the National-led government.
  
  2. His deranged quasi-religious supporters would tear him to pieces with their bare hands if he dared to apostasise. And to be fair, so too would a lot of other parties’ supporters if, having been promised one thing, they then found the opposite happening.
  
  3. The Greens would be voted out of parliament at the next election, if not seeing their parliamentary party split during this term. The likes of Marama Davidson and Jan Logie would be leading the revolt leaving maybe Shaw and Genter within the Green parliamentary rump in coalition government with National.
  
  4. National is unlikely to give Shaw and the Greens any concessions that would make it worth it.
  
  Other than that, yeah, a plausible idea.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:07am
  - pdm
    
    Kimbo said:
    `1. Because Shaw and the Greens promised to “end” the National-led government.’
    
    You overlook the fact that the Greens do hypocrisy like no other Political Party does.
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:17am
    - kowtow
      
      To be fair
      
      The old one
      
      “How can you tell a politician is lying” , always applies and to just about all of them. Blue , red ,black ,green whichever.
      
      PS , now the election is over they can get back to business as usual around the trough and forget about us Plebs for another 2 and half years ,who might get some of the scraps that get spilled in the feeding frenzy.
      
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      September 26, 2017 8:36am
  - Keeping Stock
    
    I concur. Shaw and Genter are the only moderates remaining in the Green caucus, but they could possibly be joined by Eugenie Sage, who is the least radical of the rest.
    
    But Davidson, Logie, Hughes are hard-core Left-wing activists, and would never tolerate the Greens doing a deal with that evil while fulla, Bill English.
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:17am
    - david
      
      I’ve seen little evidence that Shaw is an environmental champion. His absolute support for me tu and unwillingness to declare her actions as morally repugnant along with the indecent haste with which he despatched two MPs who took a stand on moral principle and refused any appeal, actually Place him far from the conservative, moderate environmental end of the Green Party continuum of crazy.
      
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      September 26, 2017 12:28pm
    - Paulus
      
      But do not the Greens have a new little schoolgirl version of Cinderella whose praises have been played albeit that she has never even had a job.
      Can’t think of her name though – from Auckland North Shore.
      
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      September 26, 2017 2:36pm
  - Paulus
    
    Russell Norman has spoken – so that’s it.
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:18am
    - sooty
      
      How do you know that Shaw will remain leader?
      
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      September 26, 2017 9:59am
  - holysheet
    
    The Greens would be voted out of parliament at the next election,
    
    Whats make you all so sure they will be still here after the specials have been counted?
    There is nothing to say all special votes will go to the left. Everyone says this is a most unusual election, it’s entirely possible that they might be out.
    
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    September 26, 2017 11:20am
    - GazzaW
      
      but but but the media politico journalists just know that the specials will deliver two or possibly three seats to the Labour-Greens because that’s what happens. It’s irrelevant though because Jacinda, James and the journos have already declared Labour-Greens as having a majority because the country wanted a change. Precisely how Labour-Greens combined 41% percent surpasses the Nats 46% is beyond me but then maybe Robbo did the sums.
      
      If Winston goes with the Nats just wait for some ‘me too’ anti-Trump style demos because it’s just not fair.
      
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      September 26, 2017 4:01pm
- RRM
  
  Will never happen, their voters are left wing I hate John Key types and he knows it.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:09am
- CHFR1
  
  Great sentiments but you ignore the fact that there are no environmental members of the Greens left, Me Tu took care of that. I am afraid this election has proved we have about 6% hard core socialists in this country as evidenced by their level of support after the campaign.
  I know a few Green party supporters through my daughters school and to a man/woman they are hard core wealth redistributionist politics of envy because my life isn’t as great as I think I deserve types.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:11am
  - calendar girl
    
    I fear there may be many more than “about 6% hard core socialists in this country” – don’t overlook plenty in Labour who fit that description, including those doing the bidding of the Council of Trade Unions (Andrew Little’s lot).
    
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    September 26, 2017 5:20pm
- DifferentPerspective
  
  Very well put Captain.
  
  Sadly, the Greens surrendered the last vestiges of their greenness when they carried out a Stalinist purge of honest men (maybe their gender was the issue) like Doc Graham and Clendon.
  
  If there is anything that might give the cot-case of MMP a chance of succeeding it would the existence of a true Green party (one that was environmentally radical, yet economically and socially moderate). They would be perpetually in government as the natural coalition party for both sides of the political divide.
  
  I doubt James Shaw has the ‘nous’ to read KB. I’m sure both his mum’s keep him away from it.
  
  But I hope and pray he does read this and sees that this is the opportunity to guarantee the Greens existence. You know, if they jettisoned the marxists, I’d join their party even though I don’t believe all the Chicken Little AGW nonsense – it would be so great for NZ’s political stability.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:18am
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    He will read it. I’ve sent it to him.
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:29am
    - billmurray
      
      Winston seems to be determined to hold New Zealand to ransom.
      On a 8% vote.
      What load of shit and bluster this piece of dung really is.
      
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      September 26, 2017 8:56am
    - sooty
      
      Maybe the secretary will bin it, before he sees it
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:03am
    - DifferentPerspective
      
      I do hope you are right Capt. But sending isn’t reading. James “2 mums” is just as closed minded as the rest of them in the Greens.
      
      Again, this is a once in a generation chance for James Shaw to re-focus the Greens. He should, but he’s a little beta-male and he won’t do it.
      
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      September 26, 2017 12:22pm
- MCos
  
  Previously the National Party was able to form administrations with the help of the Maori Party, among others.
  The Maori Party support immediately started to fade away and they only hung on only because they had electrate representation, which the Greens don’t.
  I would suggest that if the Greens were in cahoots with the Nats, Labour would pick them off at the next election and that’s the last we’d see of them.
  They know that, because it’s obvious.
  Your post is totally self serving. You see the Greens as less of a problem for National to handle than the unpredictable NZF & I don’t blame you one bit!
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:56am
  - MCos
    
    The Maori Party extracted concessions from National during their time in partnership.
    Now watch it unravel.
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:59am
    - Prince
      
      Exactly. Unlike the Greens, the Maori party actually achieved some policy – demonstrated by the wailing and gnashing of teeth by some on this blog about National giving way to the natives, and ‘one rule for all’.
      The Greens are happy just having their snouts in the trough.
      
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      September 26, 2017 9:55am
- Colville
  
  Captian.
  I tried to have exactly this conversation over at the Standard yesterday…
  The answer I got was a resounding No..No way…Never…not over my dead etc…Nats are scum…Nats are owned by banks…Why would Greens do a deal on a single idea when they can have it all with the Messiah Taxcinda etc etc…
  
  I was dismayed but enlightened.
  
  Its a real pity. If Greens did go with the Blue team then at the end of three years we would see some change in the Nat thinking and it would do the Nats some good and the Greens would have achieved more in the 3 years ( 17 – 20 ) than the preceding 21 years of MMP.
  
  I would have no problem at all with Shaw replacing Nick Smith as Min of Environment.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:00am
  - Ross12
    
    Looking at comments on Stuff you get the same reaction.
    Supposedly one of the reasons Gareth Morgan started TOP was because he made the same suggestion to the Greens last time and they basically laughed at him ( I think I recall Shaw saying the conversation took place)
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:19am
  - Rich Prick
    
    The fact that the greens won’t even consider the possibility of getting into Government and actually achieving some of their alleged environmental goals with National reveals that they aren’t Green at all. They really are nothing more than thinly veiled social justice warring Marxists. Which of course is like oil and water with National.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:42am
- Peter
  
  True Captain, but logic is a white mans construct.
  
  The Green MPs will be tied to the wishes of their party members. It’s likely that most of those are idealist hippies who have no concept of “the art of the possible”. They are in politics but don’t seem to be aware of what politics is.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:02am
- fluffykiwi
  
  The Greens must be blind to any form of logic if they cannot see this. They need to be an environmental party only, and the party they go into coalition economically enables them to be that. It can be either “right” or “left”.
  Most people have an environmental part of them, we like the thought of a green clean green image. But like all things it takes money. It also takes the “willing” of the electorate to achieve it.
  Spewing forth “communist” type ideas, of “rich and poor” divisions in the country achieves nothing. Rich and poor alike want clean and green.
  Green Party, it is time to grow up and become realists, achieve a little at a time is better than standing on so called principles and achieving nothing.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:10am
  - Gabby
    
    Not sure you get to determine what a political party you didn’t vote for ‘should’ be fluffer.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:16am
    - fluffykiwi
      
      And that is why the Greens as they are will not get my vote. They also will not get a lot of other votes. I suppose it depends whether they wish to have any “power” or not. A lone voice in the wilderness or inside the tent where they could make a difference. It is ultimately over to them.
      
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      September 26, 2017 9:21am
- Gabby
  
  Dear Captain
  If you insist on wearing undies on your head, why not try a clean pair. My mums never let me leave the house in crusty gruts. You stupid boy.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:11am
  - softail 1450
    
    that’s a lie grubby .
    
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    September 26, 2017 12:46pm
    - Gabby
      
      You get your tits caught in the chain of your fat girly bike again softcock.
      
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      September 26, 2017 5:39pm
      - Rachael Membery
        
        God you sound bitter, sad really.
        Is life hard? Is it the only thing that is?
        
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        September 26, 2017 9:22pm
      - softail 1450
        
        It doesn’t have a chain you uninformed moron,as usual grubby you know nothing about everything, you insane POS.
        
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        September 27, 2017 6:56am
- RF
  
  Captain M.
  
  I truly believe that Shaw lacks the intelligence and ability to look at the big picture. This is owing to his tunnel vision and not being able to think outside the square.
  
  This was recently proven by his blind support for Crooked Metiria that came close to crashing his party and now he has the golden opportunity to lift his party into parliament… sadly he will choke on this.
  
  I know of several greens who are very disappointed by this selfish attitude.
  
  What a stupid man.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:17am
  - Peter
    
    I know of two Green voters who are severely pissed off at Shaw’s position. Small sample size, but….they are genuine environmentalists, not socialists, and they see the Greens position as a negation of their environmental values.
    
    The Greens really are between a rock and a hard place of their own making. They should change their name from Green to The Socialist Party which would clarify their brand.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:22am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  Regardless of what people may think of the Green MPs, their party is on 6% and a sizeable chunk of that is voters who will always choose the most socialist party in Parliament. Without those voters the Greens are toast and they must know that.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:25am
  - jcuk
    
    But But But … surely for every dead leftie they would loose they would gain a couple of pragmatic ‘two votes blue’ like me.
    I too had this argument with WEKA at the standard awhile ago. I am quite sure that a lot of Alliance voters moved green-ways when it folded.
    Such a pity a useful party is scuppered by such folk.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:54am
- KevOB
  
  Excess greenism is a waste of space. We all know that it is smart to take care with what we have but to make a religion of it?
  Where is the climate change except in weather reports?
  Why ETS? Aren’t cows entitled to a life?
  What if the activists have got it completely wrong and we head into a cold spell unprotected?
  Isn’t it irrational for the UK to import wood chips from the USA to burn for electricity production?
  
  I’m sure Bill will be able to contain Winston, particularly after Winston’s humbling comments the other day. They go back a long way together. I don’t expect the wreck that media are promoting. Many media have become too irresponsible to be allowed to continue. Recording is not partisanship unless declared.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:40am
- Albert_Ross
  
  Has anybody seen a reasoned (ie, not simply based on instinctive hate) explanation from an actual Green, as to why they wouldn’t want to do this?
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:18am
- Awww C-mon
  
  This 2017 election will go down in history as destroying all the small parties, 3 are standing but they are all dead men walking.
  
  The greens will not recover from James Shaw’s lack of leadership and political nous, firstly in the MeTu debacle and now by failing to open the door to National. His arrogance is only matched by his stupidity.
  
  The greens will be left out of a coalition from either side and both a CR or a CL government will make significant environmental movements in this next term forever leaving the political greens irrelevant.
  
  Well Done Mr Shaw, possibly the worst political leader in NZ this year… and that is some feat in itself.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:44am
EAD_TWO

I was listening to the news report on Red Radio this morning and they had a clip of some German lefty admitting that the AFD shouldn’t be labelled Nazi’s as they were just conservatives. He then went on to say that more should have been done to tackle conservative ideas.

I couldn’t believe it, even conservatism is unacceptably extreme now in Germany, anything other than complete surrender to demographic annihilation is beyond the realm of the mainstream.

We are living in quite extraordinary times – the current age is going to be written about in history books for centuries to come.
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September 26, 2017 8:04am
- kowtow
  
  Merkel’s decision to allow the illegal immigrants in has come back to haunt her .
  I notice no one is calling the “business friendly ” FDP ‘far right’ even though they too want the illegals out .
  The simple fact is Merkel has been punished by the voters for letting in the horde and the MSM need to acknowledge that reasonable people are not “Nazis” for wanting to keep their country safe from Islam.
  
  https://www.thelocal.de/20170925/green-party-to-flex-muscles-as-potential-merkel-allies-after-election
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:27am
- Positan
  
  It’s also clear that leftism is unacceptably extreme all over the world, especially in the U.S.
  
  The U.S. media use “liberal’ as a categorising noun for leftist Democrats, whose actions and outlooks fall nowhere near “liberal” as defined in any dictionary. Liberal is: “willing to respect or accept behaviour different from one’s own; to be open to new ideas; to favour individual rights and freedoms, etc.
  
  To describe Democrats as Liberals would equate to describing Republicans as Democrats.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:28am
- nasska
  
  …..”We are living in quite extraordinary times – the current age is going to be written about in history books for centuries to come.”…..
  
  Probably in Arabic.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:29am
  - Brigitte
    
    More likely in Chinese.
    
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    September 26, 2017 11:02am
    - kowtow
      
      Not likely.
      
      The only thing holding China together is the party , when tht goes there’ll be chaos ,again.
      
      It is that chaos that the party is doing all it can to avoid , it is what they fear the most as well as being out of power.
      
      It’s not a question of if but of when.
      
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      September 26, 2017 11:30am
  - realityczech
    
    Hilarious as the West is dictated to by the USA who’s foreign policy is controlled by Israel.
    
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    September 26, 2017 5:22pm
- Odakyu-sen
  
  There are two key points.
  1. Do the citizens of any nation have the right to control who comes to live there?
  2. Is this right dependent on the citizens’ perceived status as either oppressor or oppressed?
  
  In other words, a nation of the “oppressed” can keep people out; however, a nation of “oppressors” must let them in.
  
  Or is this far too simplistic a view?
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:45am
  - kowtow
    
    Another way to put it would be
    
    Haves (oppressors) (whites) and
    
    Have nots ( oppressed) (non whites)
    
    And we all know that you take from the haves to give to the have nots , all in the name of “equality”
    
    And that applies across the board.
    
    “From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs”
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:57am
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      Is Japan a nation of oppressors or oppressed? There have been calls for Japan to open her doors to cheap labor from Asia, but this would permanently change Japanese society.
      How much is the soul of your nation worth?
      
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      September 26, 2017 11:12am
      - kowtow
        
        From a left point of view they are oppressors , as they don’t allow the hordes to migrate there , not to share their hard won wealth with others you see.
        
        Snap election result and new constitution could be very interesting.
        
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        September 26, 2017 11:32am
  - KevOB
    
    Citizens have always excercised the right to choose whom they will willingly admit to live among them. Those denied have attempted to overcome by force.
    
    Many communities do not got on readily together. Ethnic migrants frequently are found too, choosing to live in close communities. The integration can take many years. First the children are culturally socialised at school, later their children may begin to intermarry. Interaction in the work force brings needed mixing too.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:55am
    - Odakyu-sen
      
      There are ways to circumvent the issue of intermarriage.
      I have an ethnic Indian friend who grew up in Fiji. His son is 26 and has been corresponding with a 20-year-old girl in rural India who is related to some friends of his family who live in Auckland. This girl works at a bakery. She has minimal education, knows no English, and cannot drive a car.
      My friend tells me that his son has never met this girl, but will likely marry her and bring her to Auckland to live in a flat on his parents’ section.
      This is like the pre-war Japanese custom.
      I pointed out the obvious to my friend. The girl will initially be totally dependent on her new husband and his parents. If she has gumption and intelligence, she can make friends, learn English, get her driver’s licence and adapt to Auckland life. I pray that her New Zealand-born husband-to-be is not the controlling type.
      Not all cultures choose to dilute their “purity” with others.
      
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      September 26, 2017 11:22am
      - kowtow
        
        Yeah but we shouldn’t dilute our values to allow that non sense either.
        
        But then we are a stale boring white culture that must be enriched .The pollies and media say so.
        
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        September 26, 2017 11:35am
Monique Watson

National didn’t so much win the popular as lose by failing to get over the line. Shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone if the 3 horse buggy coalition form a government. We’re not FPP. And Paula Bennett has royally dumped National up shit creek. Balls I know but it’s the reality.
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September 26, 2017 8:07am
- RRM
  
  What’s our Paula done?
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:26am
  - peterwn
    
    Paula allegedly tried to shaft Winston following Winston paying back over-claimed NZ Super. But for the ‘no surprises’ policy this would have remained confidential within WINZ and Ministers and their staffers could not be accused of leaking. Lessons should have been learned from 2002 when there was another issue involving the ‘no surprises’ policy. This policy needs to be revamped as it causes more trouble than it is worth. There is absolutely no need for the Responsible Minister to know that there has been an ‘issue’ between IRD, WINZ, etc and a MP and hopefully no sane person would blame a Minister who is in ignorance of such an ‘issue’.
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:53am
    - Happychappy
      
      If it had been fact Winston Peters would have played it for all it worth before we got to the Election and the only reason it has again raised its ugly head is that some Journalists like Barry Soper are pissed about Bill English being able to swat them away like flies is over the 450 texts that Bill and his ex staffer sent between them. Soper has wanted a change of Government from day one and will come at any thing to discredit National.
      
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      September 26, 2017 9:14am
      - RF
        
        Happychappy.
        
        I agree 100%. If Paula had been outed to be the leaker, Winnie would have been climbing all over her demanding Utu. Maybe the two resignations are linked to the leak.
        
        Anyhow something has fired up hardly sober as for some reason he is in full flight bagging National. He is a sad sack with a very large chip on his shoulder.
        
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        September 26, 2017 9:35am
      - peterwn
        
        There have been various theories on what happened but the common feature is the ‘no surprises’ policy enabled blame to be fastened on to National ministers and staffers.
        As far as blaming IRD is concerned – very unlikely. IRD legislation would effectively over-ride any ‘no surprises’ policy.
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:07am
      - Ross12
        
        Eagleson’s resignation was reported in the Trans-Tasman newsletter the week before the election. People like him don’t decide to resign “overnight”.
        
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        September 26, 2017 12:34pm
      - GoVege
        
        B/s Arf!
        Winston hates Paula for the same reason as me….because she shamelessly admits to eating her pets!!
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:48pm
    - KevOB
      
      No one knows what happened. My odds are on a rogue staffer or a cloaked journo.
      
      Winston’s conciliatory humbling speech the other day has been completely ignored by those would foment nuisance. I believe the matter is past but that dosen’t make copy.
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:00am
      - All_on_Red
        
        Kev
        A comment on a Whaleoil post
        ‘Clark Hennessey, a former staffer of Paula Bennett, and one who was involved in the leaking of private information around the head of Te Puea Marae, has also resigned. How curious.’
        https://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2017/09/nats-start-cleaning-house-ahead-negotiations-eagleson-gone-former-bennett-staffer-also-gone/#more-335547
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:07am
    - Paulus
      
      Alleged ?
      Evidence please.
      
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      September 26, 2017 2:42pm
- MrTips
  
  Geez Monique, have they run out of gin in Stepford or something?
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:51am
- Lance
  
  Just because Winston imagines something, it doesn’t make it real.
  He initially blamed IRD.
  
  So either he was full of shit blaming IRD without any evidence or he is full of shit now blaming Paula without any evidence.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:18am
  - oldpark
    
    Labour Party did it, leaked the story i have the same amount of evidence that that silly old moth eating pest Barry Soper has. Lie-bour flattened the Greens, and then did the same to Winston Peters Party.Barry Soper the arse licking Liebour/Green sycophant, may be up for a huge case of Libel ,in the NZ Courts,once the new Government gets embedded.
    What dummy from National Party in their right mind, would set out to kneecap Peters. After all they knew he was the only running mate ,they could depend on ,should they not get the 61 seats.
    Soper will be in all sorts of trouble. National Party are like Winston Peters ,they have long memories. Soper be warned a huge Libel case is pending ,tell the truth and who is involved from Lie-bour Party.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:40am
    - RF
      
      Yes…. rarely sober is a bloody liar.
      
      I hope National sue his arse……
      
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      September 26, 2017 8:45pm
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    Blaming someone for something, real or perceived, in an envelope or not, true or not, printed on a placard or no, is normal for our Winnie, so no change there.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:43am
Paulus

I have worked out a new Electoral system which would save so much money that budgets can be achieved easily.
All the minor parties, National, Labour, Greens, ACT and Nobs, and all the others can submit what they would like to see to the Winston Party leader, who will the review over a few Whiskeys what he wants, and then what he chooses from these submissions can be it.
There, QED, so simply done..
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September 26, 2017 8:16am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  Excellent comment Paulus.
  
  We could call it Mad Motherf***ers Politics – we wouldn’t even need to change the accronym and no one would notice the difference.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:21am
Happychappy

The Greens keep saying that they will get the lift out of the special votes like normally happens of one or two seats. Well I think that theory could be well tested at this election as I think overseas voters will be less impressed by their party Leader condoning fraud by a co Leader of their party. They will see in the country they live that fraud can taint the way people judge other countries and will not like to be part of the joke when praising how our country compares to others the same size around the world.
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September 26, 2017 8:17am
- DifferentPerspective
  
  It’s not the ex-pats, it’s the students who will put the not all interested in the environment muslim into Parliament along with Angie Warren-Clark for Labour.
  
  Ba bye Nicola Willis and Maureen Pugh. Close but no cigar ladies – you would have been so much more useful to have had in the House!
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:25am
- VicParking
  
  They said that the advanced voting would favour the left but when you look at the statistics it mirrors the main saturday vote
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:35am
- Gabby
  
  Depends on whether they’ve paid off their crappy student loans chappy.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:25am
- Maxx
  
  Even if does, it becomes less likely of a coalition with Lab/NZF – do you really think Winston would go into Government with a coalition partner that has as many seats as he does?
  
  If anything he is wanting them to lose another seat (unlikely) and give him more power.
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:36am
- Piniwi
  
  On the mark Happychappy. Not to forget the dumping of two senior more environmentalists members. Especially Dr Kennedy Graham who has a lot of respect outside the party from his efforts.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:13pm
oldpark

Even Blind Freddie couldnt’t help but notice how the childish kindergarten Mainstream Media are still arse licking Commie Chic Comrade Ardern. Watching the Lie-bour/Green Partys’ TVNZ on last nights so called “News”. One could have produced a bag to vomit in with the stupid fawning over their anointed Ardern. She lost for ******** she and her Party got 13 seats less than National Party. To see the hero worshipping of an electoral loser,by a Taxpayer funded and owned TV channel beggars belief.
Other supporters of” Commie Chic” Comrade Ardern was all other NZ media. who supported her to a point as if she walked on water . Their support was 75% for Ardern.Bill English 24%.
Seems they have learned nothing,with the massive beating they got by backing the wrong horse.
To hear the same sicko arse licking Mainstream Media acting as if Labour won ,National lost, must be a study in, maybe a recount of votes would satisfy them that National Voters voted for Bill English and his winning Party.
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September 26, 2017 8:21am
- Evadne
  
  What astonishes me is that even on election night, with the count showing 46% of the country liked National, there were media commentators abusing National and National supporters.
  
  Whatever your political leaning, it’s appalling business practice to tell half your audience (read: customers) that you think they’re evil, greedy, stupid, or selfish.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:45am
  - Lance
    
    The MSM seem bend on self destruction.
    They are pissing over at least 46% of their potential subscriber base. Not to mention the ones who actually read and have money.
    Duh
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:20am
    - KevOB
      
      Licensing will be needed in future for all media, journos and front people. To report with distortion without a declared bias is dishonest. It can also be commercial fraud.
      
      They must be separated out: journalists of record and activists. Both have their place but not in each others clothing.
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:15am
  - Gabby
    
    Especially if they really are evil, greedy, stupid, or selfish.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:33am
  - Prince
    
    The best delusional comment was from some Labour spokesman, around 8pm, saying he had spoken to Andrew Kirton at Labour hq and an analysis of booth results showed this was neck and neck between Labour and National.
    Just more and more Labour lies sucked up by the media.
    
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    September 26, 2017 10:05am
  - ross411
    
    It should be documented, every media person who covers the election, who shows bias. Then the next election, use it against them.
    
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    September 26, 2017 1:47pm
- Gabby
  
  They know Bingles will just say dunno donremember oussidemyarea, Jawsie will scream AAARGHH!! HOLE!! and Pullya will tell them their gran got caught in a pub under age oldfart.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:30am
Inandout

If the residents of Bealey Ave really want to get of hookers on their street, just publicise the car rego numbers.
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September 26, 2017 8:32am
- jcuk
  
  Do you ever check what you have typed in your haste to join the blog? Useless idiot!
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:10am
VicParking

They have been booted off WO and the Standard.
Because of David’s approach to moderation they have arrived here to spit out their vitriol at each other. This blog was once full of good and sound discourse but now it is full of personal abuse.
Once good reading, now one had to flick through pages of crap to find sound comment and/or witty sarcasim. If I want to read or hear this type of rubbish I only need to read the failing newspaper or listern to red radio. Please Kiwi bloggers lets get back to constructive commentary or good humour rather than the personnal crap that is taking over this site.
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September 26, 2017 8:32am
Evadne

I find myself fairly relaxed about what happens next.

English is a pragmatist, but also honourable. I trust him to negotiate a sensible deal. If he fails, then it’s either because Winston is being unreasonable and wants too much, or they can’t find common ground. If that’s the case, National’s better off without him, and he can do his worst with the coalition of the damned.

Winston might want to try his luck with the left, hoping to dominate their weak leadership. He won’t see himself as Jacinda’s junior in any way.

Jacinda hasn’t a clue how to lead a coalition (she’s only led a party for 7 weeks, and the strain showed), and possibly doesn’t want to even try. Her election night speech was a concession speech, and incredibly passive. “we’ll have to wait and see”, “MMP will decide” “I’m open to conversations” etc – it was all Jacinda waiting for others, not taking the initiative herself.

A Greens/NZ First/Labour coalition would struggle for stability at the best of times; with a one seat majority, a united opposition they’ll be under massive pressure for every decision. National would be immense in opposition.
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September 26, 2017 8:34am
- ex-golfer
  
  Good summary.
  I get the distinct impression Jacinda does not want to do a deal with Winston First because deep down she knows it will be impossible to manage and will be a complete clusterf**k.
  Three years in a stronger opposition to further build her brand for 2020 will be a better fit (if the unions let her).
  She is being goaded on by Robbo, Twyford, Parker etc and in a way, Shaw – which is ironic given the rabid lefts desire to move away from middle-older aged white men pulling the strings!
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:16am
- KevOB
  
  Jacinda’s election night speech was proper and I thought fairly put. She recognised the realities despite the other big mouths-small brains. They are not in control.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:21am
- GoVege
  
  Yeah…I thought he was honourable too…until he got Seymour to do his dirty work attacking Jacinda. ..and lied about Labour raising taxes to scare the voters.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:55pm
  - Rachael Membery
    
    That’s what happens when the truth is scary.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:57pm
oldpark

Winston Peters it is said he wants to leave a legacy and be remembered that his 40 Years in parliament ,was more than getting a gold card for pensioners and superannuands.
That is a worthy cause and probably why he gets the loyalty vote from his over 65s.
Now that the Lie-bour Party want to hold hands with them in running NZ,could be,maybe time will tell.
One of the reasons why he survived this time was he with other parties other than Labour party voted for tax cuts. All legislated for and effective on April 1 2018,providing National are the Government at that date.
Many old age pensioners are on a fixed income and would dearly welcome the extra money in their Superannuation.Labour if they are the Government will cancel the Superannuation extra money as well as all promised tax cuts.
Just imagine Winston Peters signing up with Lie-bour/Green mafias to veto the payments,and shaft his well documented supporters.
Do that Mr Peters and your Legacy,will not be so rosy. Maybe you could get an new name given to someone else long dead “JUDAS”.Surely not.
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September 26, 2017 8:39am
- RF
  
  Do you think Winnie is looking for a nice retiring gift in 3 years. Something that Labour could not give him….
  
  arise Sir Winston…..
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:48am
  - Piniwi
    
    Another mythe he dispelled on Sunday RF. He said again how he had been written off by the Media so many times in the past but is still going strong. If he goes with National do not be surprised to see him in the running for 2020. His party needs it to continue and cement his legacy as it rebuilds.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:30pm
- KevOB
  
  The Winston Gold Card is a great legacy. It will never be removed as it has given life to pensioners giving freedom to travel. It will have saved more on public health than it has cost.
  
  I do not see Winston tolerating the idea even of rescinding the modest increase for pensioners due on 1 April.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:27am
  - RF
    
    KevOB.
    
    Agree. He will break many old hearts if the
    increase for pensioners promised by National does not eventuate.
    
    I do believe he will go with the Nats.
    
    Just heard that he has rubbished Poor old Paddys Utu bull shit story….
    
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    September 26, 2017 8:52pm
  - Piniwi
    
    No KevOB. There is no increase in superannuation in April bar the annual review. The tax reductions are only applicable to couples who have suffered tax bracket creep. The Gold card will not be adequate for a real legacy.
    
    Keeping the party in good shape when he does go is more likely his goal. Thus rebuilding in a Nat/NZF Government will be a better foundation going forward. The alternative may well bring the same fate as the Greens.
    IMO voters fears of him forming any Government with Labour cost him half his popularity.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:40pm
- Piniwi
  
  True oldpark. But it is important to remember that the gains for pensioners is because A) tax cuts and B) only for couples. For a large % there is nothing.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:26pm
cmm

Stabbing doctor chick gets off because a conviction might hurt her career:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/97237770/oxford-student-who-stabbed-boyfriend-gets-suspended-sentence

WTF next? Can’t put a burglar away because it might get in the way of him doing burglaries?
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September 26, 2017 8:45am
- Colville
  
  cmm.
  
  Where is the problem?
  Massively educated and skilled, genuinely remorseful, on drugs at the time, off the booze and drugs now.
  
  Frankly I wish NZ had 10,000 criminals just like her!
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:18am
  - Gabby
    
    She’ll be a doozy of a heart surgeon.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:50am
  - KevOB
    
    Our Courts give second chances too, even third ones.
    
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    September 26, 2017 10:29am
    - kowtow
      
      A third chance is one too many.
      
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      September 26, 2017 11:38am
      - KevOB
        
        That’s a call by a judge in full possession of the facts. Many older youth are still growing up and with care and watching can be directed properly.
        
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        September 26, 2017 11:46am
  - kowtow
    
    Nah can’t agree.
    
    If that had been a bloke who was on drugs and stabbed a woman , first up he’d not be on bail and at sentencing he’d have gone straight to gaol and if he hadn’t there’d have been a massive feminist outcry.
    
    And by the same token I’d warrant had the defendant been some fat benefit dependant slag ,with tattoos on her face and some garish hair colour , she’d a also gone to gaol but she might have got bail in the meantime.
    
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    September 26, 2017 11:55am
    - Piniwi
      
      True kowtow. We have previously seen a callous mother who left her baby in a car to die get discharged without conviction. The reason. She is lovely person and a conviction might impact on her immigration status. That decision makes me cry whenever our family little people play in our yard.
      
      Nobody seemed concerned about the life of a child being taken in such a heinous manner. Perhaps it is true that woman can do anything but perhaps we need to add “without accountability or responsibility”.
      
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      September 26, 2017 9:53pm
Peter

Offer Peters a few baubles and that is it.

He has a lot less leverage than he thinks he has as his alternative to National is a guaranteed disaster.

Play the long game, National. One (short) term in opposition is better than compromise that will cost you a big chunk of support, then three terms of Lab/Green.
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September 26, 2017 9:16am
- Colville
  
  Peter.
  offer him sweet fu*k all.
  Dare him to go to Labour.
  Ending his career in a total clusterfu*k trainwreck is what he deserves.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:21am
- Nigel Kearney
  
  This should happen but I doubt it for two reasons.
  
  1. Bill gets baubles too and I don’t buy the line he is so virtuous they are of no interest to him.
  
  2. More importantly, if National were going to do this they would have ruled out working with Peters before the election.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:33am
  - Peter
    
    Then National risk their own vote and will get a) a guaranteed disaster and b) three terms in opposition.
    
    Long game vs short game. If National go for the short game, they deserve their inevitable downfall.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:37am
    - All_on_Red
      
      If NZ First cause the Nats to curtail immigration and fix the RMA then I’m happy.
      Having the referendum on the Maori seats is ok too. Let the people decide.
      
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      September 26, 2017 9:44am
      - Peter
        
        Winston’s track record in government speaks for itself.
        
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        September 26, 2017 9:53am
      - Colville
        
        Winstons track record suggest that he would ask for things to be done and then National does all the work and Winston signs it off and takes the credit.
        
        Which wouldnt be a bad thing IF Winston would fuck off somewhere quiet and just drink and fish.
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:23am
      - All_on_Red
        
        Perversely because of Winston track record he will pick the most stable option this time
        #Legacy
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:43am
      - kowtow
        
        Let the people decide .
        
        Not according to the elites , the new mantra is “Let the Maoris decide”
        
        Having said that , if they applied that principle fairly I could live with it
        
        ie As a taxpayer I’d like a direct say in where it goes and non taxpayers should have no say at all .
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:52am
- MCos
  
  “One (short) term in opposition”
  That’s one too many for the Comeback Kid.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:35am
  - Peter
    
    If English puts his own interest before that of the party and voters, then National will deserve their impending 23% at the next election – which will be within a year and a half.
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:43am
    - KevOB
      
      A good comment for the Standard. Try there next time.
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:31am
- Rachael Membery
  
  How can people say on one hand that the Greens should go with Nats as can achieve more in Government than out and then on the other hand tell National to go into opposition.
  What would happen to Bill’s social investment initiatives that are just getting legs.
  I wouldn’t be giving that up, fourth term, unprecedented, especially against the msm tide, interns, all the vote for change rhetoric, and I would lump the electoral commission in amongst that lot as well.
  Are we going to see any investigations? I think Bill would want to carry on with his policies, he has dealt with the GFC and earthquakes, without which he would be further down his pathways.
  If the commentary about Winston Peters is inaccurate, then I am sure that he would wish to prove that, and the only way that he can do that in my opinion is to go with National.
  
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  September 26, 2017 2:52pm
  - Piniwi
    
    Thanks RM. We are blessed to have a sound skirted view. You too have been “hearing” a lot of what was said during the election and not just listening.
    With substantial reduction of beneficiaries as well as a modest 4.7% unemployment the goal of tackling individuals problems one on one just got easier. Likewise we might suspect WP understands that 50,000 children will rise above the poverty line on 1 April. Measures he voted for.
    
    This a politician with history but few skeletons rattling in his cupboard. He above all knows how much credit he can gain from being an integral part of a stable, strong Government. The 2 party coalition with such a healthy majority have the potential to really move things ahead.
    No forgetting that there remains a healthy balance from the surplus to fund some instant improvements. His enhanced legacy is his to make or break.
    
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    September 26, 2017 10:10pm
Manolo

A pervert and good friend of the Clintons goes to jail:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/25/nyregion/anthony-weiner-sentencing-prison-sexting-teenager.html

Anthony D. Weiner, whose repeated sexting scandals cost him his seat in Congress, his bid to become mayor of New York City, and possibly Hillary Clinton’s chances at the presidency, was sentenced on Monday to 21 months in prison.

His inability to control his habit of exchanging lewd texts and pictures with women fueled his long and tortuous downfall. But it was his most recent exchanges with a 15-year-old girl that were the most personally ruinous, ending his marriage and resulting in his criminal conviction and looming imprisonment.
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September 26, 2017 9:26am
- dime
  
  he got off light.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:43am
  - Gabby
    
    dim’s gettin censorious
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:52am
  - Nigel Kearney
    
    We may soon have a Cabinet Minister whose activities with a 15 year old girl amounted to a lot more than sharing pictures. I believe he was convicted and received a small fine.
    
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    September 26, 2017 10:17am
    - Colville
      
      Who?
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:23am
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        This is well known..
        Ron Mark as a 17 year old was convicted for having sex with a 15 year old.
        http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=230935
        Happens everyday here in NZ.
        
        Quite different from a sleazy married man in his late 40s, with prior history, grooming a 15 yr old.
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:44am
    - Manolo
      
      Who are you talking about, Nigel?
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:41am
Tarquin North

As the election campaign came to an end I was thinking it would be good to get back to watching normal news on T.V rather than the disguised opinions we’ve had to put up with for the last few weeks. I was totally wrong. The news now is just opinions and wishful thinking. Somewhere along the way reporters and journalists seem to have forgotten it’s their job to present us with the facts not try to re-write them.
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September 26, 2017 9:27am
- tom hunter
  
  Watching broadcast TV news???
  
  You’re not alone of course: I read many similar comments here, which surely must be older people who can’t change their viewing habits or have no choice (Internet streaming too complex perhaps)?
  
  Anyway, I have bad news for you: they don’t care what you think of them. You are watching. That’s all. That’s really all of it.
  
  So stop watching. Fewer eyeballs, lower advertising revenue, eventual bankruptcy (private) or shutdown (state). It will take years and it’s all ready happening for other reasons, but you need to contribute to the change.
  
  Stop watching and reading the MSM and destroy them. Your complaints and opinions mean nothing otherwise.
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:51am
  - Gruffydd
    
    Whats TV?
    Oh you mean that box that peploe used to have in the living room last century.
    I can remember friends family’s sitting with mouths open as it fed them mind numbing rubbish.
    Why would any one do that when you have the entire world a few mouse clicks away.
    You don’t need to sit there letting some idiot journalist filter the world for you.
    It takes little effort to go directly to the sources they get the information from.
    
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    September 26, 2017 12:34pm
Notsofast

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
The depth of corruption involved in the Lundy case will soon be exposed. I have been hammering this on kiwiblog, yet not one question has been asked of me why I am so utterly certain.
Jacinda Ardern knows he is innocent, or is profoundly deaf. How will she deal with it? Why is she not already sorting it out?
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September 26, 2017 9:34am
- dime
  
  i gotta be honest, i never really give a f*ck about the guy
  
  but if you wanted to lay out your case in bullet points that would be cool.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:44am
  - Notsofast
    
    Judith Collins and Amy Adams don’t give a f*ck about the guy either, ministers of justice and corrections. That annoys the hell out of me.
    
    The slayings were an unintended consequence of Lundy being in Petone. The police constructed a fake case everyone now knows, and eliminated the suspects for the wrong time of night. Get it?
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:49am
    - dime
      
      not really.
      
      he looked guilty.
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:05am
      - Swifty
        
        Guilty as sin.
        
        The actions at the funeral were of a guilty, guilty man.
        
        Oh and he was back drinking, partying and whoring soon after……perhaps he thought he was in the clear and about to receive a big insuracne payout.
        
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        September 26, 2017 4:21pm
    - ex-golfer
      
      You still haven’t laid out Lundy’s case in a clear and coherant way.
      You also haven’t told us who did it.
      Given you are so sure of Lundy’s innocence surely you must know who the real perpetrator was?
      
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      September 26, 2017 10:09am
      - Notsofast
        
        What we know with certainty is it was a scientific impossibilty for Lundy to be involved, by multiple data points, not the least being he was 30 liters short of petrol, despite the cheating crown prosecutor’s claims. He averaged 100 kms per hour on a timed run in the morning. This necessarily meant hitting 180 for as much of the journey as he could, and burying his foot the whole time. This is gas guzzling, yet the crown witterede on about careful driving to conerve fuel and not draw attention.
        We also know that international scientists have lined up to ridicule Rodney Miller and his false use of immunohistochemistry. This has never been used before or since. Previous defence attempts have completely fallen for this hoax. They added dna and cns and possibly human to define it as brain. Utter bullshit. And there was cow sheep and pig dna in the spot. How??
        We also know that there are 5 things present at the crime scene that Mark Lundy has been eliminated from. Paint flecks (yes another police lie about a match), fingerprints around the broken window catch, a shoe print, and unknown male dna and cloth fibers under the fingernails of both victims.
        Dna under fingernails disappears with ordinary hygiene, but of course Christine and Amber were dead. We also know that pathologist Sage conceded that Amber would need to have eaten after midnight to have a full stomach. This is an arch fabrication, but needed for the new bullshit police case.
        What should scare New Zealanders is that the crown is still running with these lies. What hope is there for justice? The New Zealand appeal court is seriously on trial now.
        
        Why are kiwibloggers falling for this terrible hoax??
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:52am
      - GoVege
        
        All good and interesting points NSF…but da dude LOOKED as guilty as sin..
        
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        September 26, 2017 12:28pm
      - dime
        
        bullet points dude. im not reading a wall of text.
        
        until then Dime says GUILTY!
        
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        September 26, 2017 3:23pm
    - KevOB
      
      Ministerial duty is to uphold the Judiciary not second guess them. The public may question within reason but the Ministers are not supervising judicial officers. The appellate courts are where any review takes place.
      
      3 2
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      September 26, 2017 10:37am
      - Notsofast
        
        Crap. It is happening on their watch. They are fully aware of the hoax.
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:59am
  - Gabby
    
    dim’s gettin masochistic
    
    3 16
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    September 26, 2017 9:54am
- Keeping Stock
  
  Serious question Notsofast. If you are serious about Lundy’s innocence and the “depth of corruption involved in the Lundy case” why do you post here under a nom-de-plume? I don’t have a lot of time for Joe Karam, but at least he campaigned for Bain transparently and under his own name.
  
  Making allegations of corruption from behind a nom-de-plume is easy, and your allegations mean a whole sight less as a result. If you are “so utterly certain” about the facts you claim, why not profess them in your own voice, rather than anonymously, from behind a computer monitor?
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:51am
  - Notsofast
    
    Keeping Stock, Lundy has become a person to hate and ridicule. This matter is a catastrophe at so many levels it hurts. The facts are out there, the police know exactly what they did. We now know that Detective Hughes wrote the testimony for witness C in Tamihere, we know the police protected witness X in Lundy 2015, yet Burns QC proved in court that Lundy and witness X were never in the same place at the same time. That should have been a police matter to investigate instead of wheeling out that clown. Even worse, they heralded his importance in the trial at the outset. There was a 344A hearing, where it was concluded the crown could not say there was human brain on the shirt, but Morgan QC disgracefully and deviously summed up saying “no man should have his wife’s brain on his shirt”, and got the jury to convict. Rachel Smalley opened the 6 o’clock news saying that was the phrase that she could not get out of her head. Morgan gamed the system, and no doubt will try to again. What sort of man is he?
    Keeping Stock, I have tried and tried to alert you, so you can spread the word in Palmerston North. Mark Lundy deserves it, his dead wife and daughter deserve it, and so do Lundy’s few staunch supporters. You are one of the pitch fork wielding villagers, but the truth is stark. It is not too late to help sort out this tragedy.
    
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    September 26, 2017 11:12am
    - Rachael Membery
      
      Such rhetoric.
      Who is the ‘we’ of which you speak, and doesn’t your referring to the ‘few’ of you that hold the same opinion tell you something?
      As for ‘pitch fork wielding,’ how emotive.
      I agree with Keeping Stock about coming out of the shadows, you seem coherent, so lay your cards out on the table so that ‘we’ can assess your veracity, since you are trying to elicit ‘our’ support.
      
      Or are you like another poster here, who also holds on to anonymity, whose own past makes the comments that he makes ironic and self serving to say the least, especially on law and order matters and even more so on matters pertaining to unlawful killing.
      
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      September 27, 2017 5:44am
      - Notsofast
        
        The we I speak of are all those who study the evidence. The sorts of self serving fools in this case are people like John Pike QC who Ian Binnie highlighted as a serial loser in the Bain case. He is the sort of person who needs to be in village stocks. His contribution to Lundy’s 2002 failed appeal is so warped, he should be struck off. Here is what he said.
        
        The Crown made submissions to the Court of Appeal specifically to ask for a longer sentence. This document was also put forward over the name J. C. Pike of the Crown
        Law Office. He must have or should have known the facts, the truth, that is that Pippins always finished at 6:30pm and that Amber, with absolute certainty, would normally have
        been home 5-10 minutes later, certainly well before 7pm. Nevertheless, this is what Pike
        wrote –
        Clause 17.
        “The appellant elected to murder Christine in a contrived scene of a burglary “gone wrong” and once he discovered (before or on leaving Petone) that his daughter would be at home at the time chosen for the killing (initially it was arranged that she would be at Pippins), to kill Amber too, if needs be”.
        Pike then went on, Clause 18.5
        “In deciding, after it was known to him that his daughter would not, after all, be out of the house, to kill her too, with the attendant need to make her death match the circumstances of Christine’s murder”
        
        …………………
        
        I insert that because it is false and vile, yet Pike was submitting to increase the sentence of an innocent man, but Mark has been dealing with this vitriol for 17 years.
        
        I can’t see it matters a hoot who I am, Keeping Stock seems to think the facts can only exist accompanied by the name of the messenger, but they are independant. As is said, you can have your own opinions, but not your own facts. There should be a firestorm in Wellington in the appeal court, there can be only one result, the full facts are about to be revealed by a powerful attorney.
        
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        September 27, 2017 7:34am
  - GoVege
    
    Yeah but JK was a former All Black …he was used to being in the public eye….and possibly has quite an ego.
    (Please don’t sue me!!!!)
    
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    September 26, 2017 12:33pm
- Gabby
  
  WHY HASN’T SHE PARDONED HIM?? There’s just no excuse notsobright.
  
  3 19
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  September 26, 2017 9:54am
- Rachael Membery
  
  Jacinda who?
  
  3 1
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  September 26, 2017 2:56pm
  - Notsofast
    
    Prime minister Ardern apparently now we know Winstone despises Bill English and his crooked henchmen. Labour spokeswoman for JUSTICE.
    
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    September 26, 2017 3:34pm
    - Rachael Membery
      
      There you go again, where would the Justice be in a losing politician, who has had her hand held through a campaign by the media and her party, who was gifted a safe seat and has coasted through her years in parliament getting to be PM? No woman that I would support would need that amount of propping up.
      
      You probably think that Lundy is innocent with that sort of reasoning.
      
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      September 27, 2017 5:51am
      - Notsofast
        
        I have no faith at all in Ardern. She has pushed for the soft nonsense of increasing that little miscreant Teina Pora’s compensation. She has been told categorically by Steve Braunias, serious researcher, that Lundy is innocent, yet she will do nothing, as she should have done something already.
        
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        September 27, 2017 7:42am
Manolo

A Muslim mole speaks:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/donald-trump-isis-language-rhetoric-extremist-hate-speech-sadiq-khan-london-mayor-a7966501.html

Sadiq Khan has compared Donald Trump’s language to Isis, and said his antagonistic approach is playing into the hands of the militant group.

Speaking at an event hosted by The Guardian at the Labour Party conference in Brighton, the London Mayor condemned the US President’s repetition of “clash of civilisations rhetoric”.
17 3
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September 26, 2017 9:36am
- kowtow
  
  Funny how the left refuse to join the dots between Muslim terror attacks in the west and Islamic immigration to the west .
  
  Islam has always and will always be an enemy of the west. Until the west is brought into submission which is what Islam means.
  
  http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/islam-rsquo-s-house-of-islam-and-house-of-war
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:11am
- kowtow
  
  “British authorities estimate that about 850 people from Britain have travelled to Syria to fight with Islamist groups during the course of the six-year conflict. “…….
  
  …….“A bunch of the people I’ve spoken to I think will die fighting,” said Dr Amarasingam. “They are pretty hardcore and devoted to the cause.”
  
  Good , I hope there’s a bullet for each and every one of the them , including the “kiwis” who travelled there. Unlike the pussy Continentals who think they can “reintegate” the genocidists. Fuckwits.
  
  http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/09/25/dozens-british-fighters-loose-syria-islamic-state-crumbles/
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:20am
Steve (North Shore)

I do hope that Peters does not go with Labour/Greens. Labour will give NZF nothing and same with the Greens. We have seen how Labour can destroy a strong economy before – do not let them do it again.
That means National/NZF. Peters is not as strong politically as he thinks he is.
Labour leading until 2020 and then empty the bank account, leaving all sorts of new high taxes?
No thanks.
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September 26, 2017 9:49am
- Paulus
  
  Helen Clark always, despite what was said, gave nothing to the Greens.
  Don’t expect Taxinderella will do different.
  
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  September 26, 2017 2:53pm
ex-golfer

I am now firmly of the opinion that Bill English should make it clear to Winston that the only realistic option is for NZF to give National confidence and supply in a minority government.
Otherwise Winston can crawl off and do a deal with Lab/Greens – which in the short to medium term would wipe NZF off the face of the electoral map.
I also think Shane Jones would rapidly jump waka again and end up in Nationals arms – he is too lazy to do any hard work (hence coming third in the electorate race) so will go where the trough remains.
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September 26, 2017 10:07am
- Odakyu-sen
  
  I can’t imagine a coalition between Labour-Greens-NZF.
  
  It would explode so violently, the electorate would be in danger of being hit by the shrapnel…
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:13am
- nasska
  
  Agree. Confidence/supply is as far as a minor party in an MMP environment dares to go & Winston, although a pain in the arse, is not a fool.
  
  Remaining at arms length from the collective responsibility of a cabinet position is NZ First’s best guarantee of survival.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:34am
Hugh Pavletich

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
LABOURS PHIL TWYFORD TALKS SENSE …

Phil Twyford calls out Bill English for ‘overreaching’ | Newshub

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/09/phil-twyford-calls-out-bill-english-for-overreaching.html

… extract …

… Mr Twyford said Labour is “back in the game”.

“We’ve worked with the Greens and NZ First in Parliament now for quite a few years. We know each other pretty well. I’m confident that there is both the policy alignment between these three parties and the personal relationships that we can stitch something together. But we all know Winston is in the box seat right now.”

He said there has not yet been an official phone call.

“Winston himself said yesterday he’s going to take two weeks – he’s not interested in negotiating until the special [votes] are in.”
.
.
With extensive further posts / comments on this MacroBusiness Austeralia thread yesterday…

NEW ZEALAND MMP ELECTION: LIKELY LABOUR NZ FIRST GREENS COALITION BY MID OCTOBER

NZ votes ‘yes’ to housing ponzi economy – MacroBusiness

https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2017/09/nz-votes-yes-housing-ponzi/

… Pavletich post on MacroBusiness article thread above …

NEW ZEALAND MMP ELECTION: LIKELY LABOUR NZ FIRST GREENS COALITION GOVT BY MID OCTOBER

https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2017/09/nz-votes-yes-housing-ponzi/#comment-2959005
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September 26, 2017 10:09am
- Colville
  
  Hugh.
  In your view what effect will there be on the NZ housing market now that Chinese Govt has removed capital restrictions? (again)
  
  14 1
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  September 26, 2017 10:27am
  - Happychappy
    
    Hugh is clutching at flies and will say anything to have his name mentioned but when it comes to his own blog people don’t care for his opinion.
    
    15 3
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    September 26, 2017 10:52am
    - Swifty
      
      No one reads it.
      
      4 1
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      September 26, 2017 4:17pm
  - Hugh Pavletich
    
    Colville … Have not been following it over recent times … as there has been more than enough to follow up on the local front.
    
    Sorry I cant be more helpful.
    
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    September 26, 2017 10:59am
    - Captain Mainwaring
      
      Hugh, you are never helpful. Why change now?
      
      9 1
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      September 26, 2017 12:26pm
- KevOB
  
  LABOURS PHIL TWYFORD TALKS SENSE …
  
  what?
  
  Even donkeys do better.
  
  21 3
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  September 26, 2017 10:45am
  - Rachael Membery
    
    They certainly do, I have had them for years ;).
    
    5 1
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    September 26, 2017 3:01pm
- Lance
  
  Twyford can only utter a string of groundless insults and oxymorons.
  
  Beyond that he has no vocabulary
  
  18 3
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  September 26, 2017 10:52am
- All_on_Red
  
  Funny that despite the so called housing crisis National cleaned up in Auckland.
  The bigot Twyford did terribly in the Party vote in his own Electorate!
  Labours ‘Poodle’ Pavletich is barking the wrong group.
  
  19 5
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  September 26, 2017 10:53am
  - Hugh Pavletich
    
    Bill English should have given his speech on election night in mandarin.
    
    I was surprised how many Chinese there appeared to be at the function.
    
    2 24
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    September 26, 2017 11:04am
    - Hugh Pavletich
      
      All On Red … How many times do I have to tell you that I am of the Right. Indeed I am the ONLY pure Tory here on Kiwiblog who has any idea at all about the concepts of the ‘wider public interest’ and our ‘fair go culture.’
      
      There is no class distinction in this country … but there sure is behavior distinction.
      
      You guys really do need to get your snouts out of the trough … and open your eyes to the wider world … as Stephen Franks made clear about 21/2 years ago …
      
      StephenFranks.co.nz » Blog Archive » Banal business naivete on politics (and the RMA and Councils)
      
      http://www.stephenfranks.co.nz/banal-business-naivete-on-politics-and-councils/
      
      1 23
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      September 26, 2017 11:15am
      - stigie
        
        Oh fuck Hugh !~
        
        13 3
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        September 26, 2017 11:23am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        … WASN’T THIS A DISGRACE BACK IN AUGUST …
        
        … How could PM English and Deputy PM Bennett have been so dumb ?
        
        … Perception is reality in politics …
        
        National Party auctions off ice axe signed by Sir Edmund Hillary to raise funds for campaign … Nicole Lawton … Fairfax New Zealand
        
        https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/96019247/national-party-auctions-off-ice-axe-signed-by-sir-edmund-hillary-to-raise-funds-for-campaign
        
        … extracts …
        
        … But perhaps the greater attraction was the opportunity to meet the Prime Minister and his deputy, Paula Bennett, to pose for photos with them, to schmooze.
        
        The Prime Minister put himself up for auction: one lucky (and wealthy) donor and 10 close friends won the a dinner date with the English, “at your favourite restaurant” after the election. (Cost of the dinner not included).
        
        A Chinese community leader said such appearances would hold enormous prestige within the culture.
        
        “The implied Chinese business culture is around guanxi, which means relationship. Whoever won that dinner would be highly regarded because they hold a special bond with New Zealand Prime Minister.”
        
        They said if the dinner went well, the successful bidder might enjoy increased business opportunities in the future because of it. … read more via hyperlink above …
        
        Crony Chronicles: I Want To Be A Crony – YouTube
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aO9tA5DWJM
        
        … Johan Norberg explains what ethical Capitalism is all about …
        
        The Real Adam Smith: Morality and Markets – Full Video … YouTube
        
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6S6pMsKzlI
        
        … The above video will be used as a foundation for the re-education of National Party politicians and members … when the Party is deservedly sent to the Opposition benches by mid October.
        
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        September 26, 2017 11:28am
      - All_on_Red
        
        Hugh
        oh leave out the moral superiority bullshit.
        The truth is we all know that Labour have absolutely no ability to fix anything let alone the ‘housing crisis’.
        Nine years and they can’t even come up with a Tax plan.
        Your blind Poodle allegiance to them is just proving how thick you are.
        Now go on, do that Pavlovs Dog response and post screeds of shit when you see something you don’t like.
        So funny.
        
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        September 26, 2017 11:39am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Bishop Michael Yeung: Hong Kong’s youth face tough times – ucanews.com
        
        http://www.ucanews.com/news/bishop-michael-yeung-hong-kongs-youth-face-tough-times/80304
        
        … reprint …
        
        Bishop Michael Yeung: Hong Kong’s youth face tough times … Herald Malasia
        
        http://www.heraldmalaysia.com/news/bishop-michael-yeung-hong-kongs-youth-face-tough-times/38474/1
        
        Hong Kong’s new bishop says for the sake of society, young people need opportunities
        
        High levels of disparity and low social mobility is the living reality for most of Hong Kong’s young generation which Bishop Michael Yeung says does not bode well for the city’s future.
        
        Earlier this year, Hong Kong ranked as the world’s least affordable city to buy a home for the seventh year running, according to the U.S. Demographia International Housing Affordability Survey.
        
        “The younger folks have to stay with their parents even at the age of 30 something, because they have no place to set up their own family. And the original flat [with their parents] is already very small,” Bishop Michael Yeung of Hong Kong told ucanews.com.
        
        The 71-year-old bishop further pointed out that young people in the city don’t have the space to raise a child and have a proper family life which is affecting society. … read more via hyperlink above …
        
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        September 26, 2017 1:02pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Woof woof yaps the Poodle racist.
        
        7 5
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        September 26, 2017 1:10pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Very wise words from former Labour Prime Minister Helen Clark …
        
        Helen Clark says the democratic process has worked, it’s time to respect the result … Fairfax / Stuff NZ
        
        https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/97246844/Helen-Clark-says-the-democratic-process-has-worked-its-time-to-respect-the-result?cid=app-iPad
        
        Former Prime Minister Helen Clark has told Kiwis to respect the viewpoints of others, even if the election outcome wasn’t what they hoped for.
        
        Clark was head of Labour governments from 1999 to 2008, before taking a job as head of the United Nations Development Programme.
        
        Following the election, Clark said: “The people have spoken, and the result must be respected”. … read more via hyperlink above …
        
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        September 26, 2017 4:55pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Hugh loves Helen!
        Yap yap
        
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        September 26, 2017 5:04pm
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        (California) Housing crisis in Merced reflects statewide trend, poll shows | Merced Sun-Star
        
        http://www.mercedsunstar.com/news/local/community/article174388131.html
        
        More than half of California voters say the state’s housing affordability crisis is so bad that they’ve considered moving, and 60 percent of the electorate supports rent control, according to a new statewide poll.
        
        The findings from UC Berkeley’s Institute of Governmental Studies reflect broad concerns Californians have over the soaring cost of living. Amid an unprecedented housing shortage, rents have skyrocketed and tenants have faced mass evictions, especially in desirable areas. … read more via hyperlink above …
        
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        September 26, 2017 5:12pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Now go on, do that Pavlovs Dog response and post screeds of shit
        Lol
        Sad!
        Racist!
        
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        September 26, 2017 5:19pm
    - sooty
      
      So you have a thing against chinese.
      So you are a supporter of the Twitford.
      How many rentals do you own.
      
      13 3
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      September 26, 2017 11:16am
      - Hugh Pavletich
        
        Sooty … The Chinese are wonderful people who I admire enormously.
        
        I detest crony capitalism though.
        
        Do watch the Norberg / Adam Smith vid above. Also the superb Hayek one accessible on my archival website http://www.PerformanceUrbanPlanning.org as well.
        
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        September 26, 2017 11:41am
    - All_on_Red
      
      ‘I was surprised how many Chinese there appeared to be at the function.’
      ‘ The Chinese are wonderful people who I admire enormously.’
      As long as they stay in their own country eh.
      Did it occur to you that those ‘Chinese’ were NZers? Maybe like my friend who, although his surname is Fan, is a fourth Generation NZer.
      You racist bigot.
      
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      September 26, 2017 11:44am
    - Lance
      
      Racist much
      
      3 3
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      September 26, 2017 12:20pm
    - fluffykiwi
      
      Hey you can blame the Chinese for the Housing, but given the Chinese were among early settlors, and certainly among our early dairy farmers maybe blame them for pollution of the rivers, why stop there, too many cars on the road, those Chinese takeaways, clothing, etc.,
      No one looks like me, and unless you have a twin Hugh probably no one looks like you, so we are all different, why the problem with the Chinese. And why lump “Chinese” all together, what about Koreans, Taiwanese, Japanese, Vietnamese to name some of our Eastern friends.
      And I would admire bill English if he could give a speech in Mandarin, it will get us further in the world than a speech in maori.
      
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      September 26, 2017 2:01pm
    - Happychappy
      
      Jesus you are a nasty senile bitter prick.
      
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      September 26, 2017 4:53pm
sooty

Whats so good about Taxcinda? She only took them back to were David Shearer had them.
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September 26, 2017 10:21am
- RalphT
  
  When you were in danger of being flushed away, being left clinging to the rim of the bowl has got to be a plus.
  
  13 1
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  September 26, 2017 10:28am
- cmm
  
  “She only took them back…”
  
  No she didn’t. She took Jacinda Party to almost 40%, not Labour Party.
  
  As soon as the Jadazzle started wearig off and people started to realise they were voting for the old 25% Labour Party, they dropped fast.
  
  By the end of the year I expect they’ll be back in the 20s again.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:56am
Monique Watson

Haha MrTips. No not yet but I still have the school run before I slice the lemon and open the tonic. Enjoying the 20 downticks. That’s why those pricks keep on coming back. Masochists. Mind you it’s not enough for me to head over to the Stranded for an arsekicking. My point is National made a few errors in judgement and it could have cost them up to 5% of the vote which would have come out of Labour’s base in which case there is no way Labour could have got the 61 seat coalition it now has in it’s sights. But fuck it’s better this way as it’s a sight more entertaining than watching Paddy Gower bristle at Dirty Politics. It’s like watching two raccoons trying to spray each other.
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September 26, 2017 10:27am
Surely Knott

Winston is holding the country to ransom. But equally so are the Greens. If the Greens refuse to negotiate for their own party values then they alone are responsible for a Peters whose negotiating power and policies will be overrepresented, while socialist and greens policies will be underrepresented. The Greens refusal to negotiate in an mmp environment is a vote by the Greens for Winston to hold all the power and to implement his policies without contest . It is the Greens who are holding the country to ransom. They are failing the country and the environment. Great article by Smalley http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11926470
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September 26, 2017 10:50am
- Manolo
  
  The communists Greens have proven over and over that their policies are not for the betterment of New Zealand, so the Green Party position shouldn’t surprise anyone.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:52am
- fluffykiwi
  
  Indeed all our elected representatives no matter what side are paid by the taxpayer and we should expect them all to work in the interests of the country, and in a democracy ultimately that is the majority.
  The Greens are not doing this by their very refusal to even contemplate talking to National.
  I get it, they come from the left hand side of the equation, but they do not know what they might get from National unless they talk.
  They might actually get more than they will get from labour, because at the moment labour knows they do not actually have to pander to the Greens at all, they are just “there” on their side of the fence.
  If I were a Green voter I would be wanting my elected representative to do their best to get the very “best” deal in a situation like this and it could be National.
  Or are they just there to take a pay cheque and mouth platitudes.
  
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  September 26, 2017 1:56pm
cmm

Interesting reading the comments section in this Stuff pimping-the-poor article:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/local-news/western-leader/96992301/poverty-illness-and-living-on-less-than-the-minimum-wage

Over 300 likes for the “get a job” style comments and over 200 un-likes for the “It’s all National’s fault” type comments.

If that’s anything to go by, people are bloody sick of bludgers and hand outs.

Any party playing up bludgers is going to get hammered.
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September 26, 2017 10:51am
- Longknives
  
  The Maths in that ‘Poor wee Me’ article don’t add up (As usual)
  There is alot this person is not telling us- How much rent does she pay? Does she have Court Fines coming out of her Benefit?
  
  And the public aren’t buying it- Probably because the last ‘Poor wee Me’ story kind of blew up in the Media’s face as a quick search of Facebook saw their sob story having some lovely overseas Holidays !…
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:14am
  - KevOB
    
    A real poverty is that of lack of intelligence and being unable to cope with basics.
    
    The woman complained she is paying off hire purchase–not necessarily bad–but she purchased a $1,000 fridge and she’s on her own. That’s the lack of reasonable judgment trap the lesser-bright fall into. That’s not lawful poverty. WINZ helps these people a lot as do the hard working community support groups. Some people also are just not capable of getting the external help needed.
    
    WINZ also may have got worse: the paperwork I have to deal with this season is proving taxing for me. The sort of nightmare that will descend if a wealth based CGT ever comes.
    
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    September 26, 2017 12:11pm
- Left Right and Centre
  
  It’s a shame they didn’t let the comments section rip – cutting it off at a paltry 20-30.
  
  I read it – find it hard to believe she’s had no fresh produce in two years and ever misses meals.
  
  It’s only a local rag story which these days can be promoted to website main story – what a load of shit.
  
  Doesn’t say what the ‘illness’ is. The fridge ? Yeah. She’s in poverty but paying off a $1 000 fridge – that’s bullshit.
  
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  September 26, 2017 3:05pm
- Swifty
  
  I’ve stopped reading these stories – they always leave so much out that you can never form a good judgement.
  
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  September 26, 2017 4:16pm
Fletch

Jacinda’s been on TV stating that she could still be your next prime minister.

Jacinda Ardern’s relentless positivity hasn’t dimed following what she describes as a disappointing election night, maintaining there’s still “absolutely every chance” she’ll be the next Prime Minister.

But it’s not “somethink” she’s done the maths on.

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/jacinda-ardern-confidently-declares-theres-absolutely-every-chance-she-ll-nzs-next-pm

Meanwhile, Tariana Turia has been interviewed on 1 News (the headline reads that she has “come out of retirement” to help the Maori Party, but I see no evidence of that). She’s not in favour of the Maori people fitting in to New Zealand.

“I’d be worried for Maori people with Winston getting in… he wants a One New Zealand and we would just have to fit in again. I don’t want that for our people. They need to be proud and independent and do for themselves, not have someone else telling them how to be.”

She does praise National though.

“If we look at all the major developments for Maori people in this country, they’ve actually come through National Party”

https://www.facebook.com/Breakfaston1/videos/10155640698062719/
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September 26, 2017 10:52am
- All_on_Red
  
  The MP ran a shit campaign. Flavell should have easily beaten Coffey.
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:00am
- Anne Glen Eden
  
  Tariana Turia, while her ‘heart’ might be in the right place for Maoridom – which is largely being a racist flake at present – is way off base. They need to learn some humility, not continue with the pride and hubris – of what exactly? Their overwhelming presence in the worst social statistics or their abdication of all personal responsibility in their lives?
  
  It is precisely because they continue to be immersed in the main parties that they are not ‘independent’, via the Maori seats. Were the Maori seats to go, I have little doubt that a large number of them would vote for a Maori Party – and that Party would probably often hold the balance of power. Hopefully, they would elect people of the stature of Flavell, rather than puerile Coffey who’s just a brown, gay, Labour ‘baby’ – and one who will, without question, be ‘how he is told to be’, notwithstanding a great fuss being made of his ‘representation’.
  
  NZ needs to be ‘One’ – comprised of a diverse multitude who all feel they have an equal chance to a decent life irrespective of their ethnicity but able to celebrate it in their own spheres; not a mass of different interest groups with warring activists trying to gain an advantage at the expense of everyone else and blaming everyone else for their problems or ‘difference’.
  
  There is no question that this is most likely to come through National. Labour desperately want to keep the status quo to keep control and maintain the dependency, just as many activists would lose their impetus if Maori did, in fact, lift their living standards. There is a whole industry utterly dependent on Maori failing and continuing to fail. That needs to change.
  
  At the same time, the NZ people need to take back their real democracy – and that includes Maori – to determine the society they want to live in, not have ideology forced on them by political and media ideologues who feel ‘superior’ in their virtue-signalling. That, also, is an industry utterly dependent on making all NZers feel like ignorant failures. It’s not the way to lift ‘productivity’ etc. We need participation, confidence, and excellence – not disempowerment, guilt trips, and enforced failure.
  
  I hope Winston takes the opportunity to do something worthwhile for NZ. That would be the best ‘legacy’. But he’s not going to get it in coalition with Labour.
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:19am
  - GoVege
    
    Dream on Anne….
    
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    September 26, 2017 1:44pm
  - GoVege
    
    Flavell has “stature”?
    Then how come he didn’t use the God sent opportunity when the Labour leader was visiting Women’s Refuge to back him UP. ..instead of putting him down??
    Most battered women in our country are Maori after all.
    
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    September 26, 2017 2:59pm
    - GoVege
      
      And what about his mate Dame Tariana Turia, fighter against colonial oppressors/ accepter of colonial oppressors’ highest gongs, summoning the head of Womens Refuge in for a telling off for not keeping quiet about Maori violence to their women?
      
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      September 26, 2017 3:19pm
- Piniwi
  
  Interesting Fletch. This bit is funny:
  “They need to be proud and independent and do for themselves, not have someone else telling them how to be.”
  We won’t be holding our breath to see when they might make a start on “doing for themselves.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:35pm
Manolo

Multiculturalism “advances”:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3414264/Want-higher-benefits-marry-one-wife-New-welfare-rules-hand-extra-taxpayer-cash-polygamists.html

Under the universal credit welfare system, which is not expected to be fully introduced until 2021, polygamous households will be rewarded with higher benefits, The Sunday Times reports.
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September 26, 2017 11:20am
- GoVege
  
  It takes money to raise future terrorists….
  
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  September 26, 2017 12:54pm
- GoVege
  
  I hate my neighbours for selling their house to an out-of-town property investor.
  The new tenants were on the booze before 11am.
  One was holding a young baby.
  S’pose they picked up its benny money this morning and headed straight for the liquor store to spend it.
  Poor little (future) beggar. ..
  
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  September 26, 2017 12:58pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    But on Sunday you were writing that most of us here on KB were selfish, whereas you wanted to share the Wealth around.
    Let’s rejoice that your new tenants have been granted some of the Nation’s wealth and can afford to quench their thirst.
    
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    September 26, 2017 2:12pm
    - kowtow
      
      Hahahaha
      
      So funny , they’re socialists until the ferals move in next door .
      
      15 1
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      September 26, 2017 2:29pm
      - GoVege
        
        Your mates in NATIONAL are giving them money for booze, idiots!
        Labour used to pay enough to live on.
        I’m sure most poor people are drowning their sorrows in booze coz they no longer havery HOPE.
        
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        September 26, 2017 2:51pm
      - GoVege
        
        You know…it was called a living wage..even though NZ has always been a low wage economy.
        Many of those “ferals” secretly dream of holding down a job and even BUYING a home one day, poor deluded dreamers…
        
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        September 26, 2017 2:55pm
      - GoVege
        
        A while back I got into a dispute with a Maori dude.
        After he graciously apologised, he wanted to know if I owned my own home.
        I have noticed before that the poorest Maori are proud to hold down a job, no matter how humble, and long to own a home.
        Under the Nats that is impossible for them.
        That’s why I vote Labour, so they have a CHANCE.
        I still get pi**ed off when they hit the booze, but they’re not as bad as rich drunken Pakeha…
        
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        September 26, 2017 3:07pm
      - nasska
        
        …….”I have noticed before that the poorest Maori are proud to hold down a job, no matter how humble”……
        
        You should do stand up comedy. To get & hold a job requires having some skills other than talking like a Los Angeles gangster & wearing a baseball cap backwards. It also involves turning up when required, personal hygiene & a basic level of literacy.
        
        Not one of these or other attributes is denied the “downtrodden” Maori by the evil honkey. Rather the lack is homegrown & cultivated.
        
        ……”and long to own a home”…..
        
        Alan Duff’s excellent novel ‘Once Were Warriors’ offers a clue why Maori ‘long’ for so much. The main female subject, Beth, has a rare moment of contemplation when she wonders along those lines. Turns out that the answer is not the lack of Maori dreams about what they desire but the lack of commitment & hard work required to make them come true.
        
        The lack of a work ethic & self reliance is what keeps Maori in the place they create for themselves. Your & others’ pitiful socialist patronage assists them to this end.
        
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        September 26, 2017 4:40pm
      - GoVege
        
        You are right, nasska, it is not the “evil honky” holding Maori back, but their own sexist culture, which forces most Maori females to become baby-making machines from 15 or earlier.
        A high proportion of Maori women live for years on the DPB, whilst waiting for a male who won’t beat the cr*p out of them.
        The males no longer have a father figure in the picture. ..do you wonder why they lack a work ethic?
        The males of most non western society are abusive to women, but Maori seem to have more problems than most.
        Their culture when Pakeha arrived seems to have been especially brutal and war-like, and at least one third of them were masssacred by the likes of Hone Hika and Te Rauparaha as soon as they got their hands on western technology.
        It may not be “our fault” but don’t you think we have some obligation to help?
        Or should we leave it to people like Dame Tariana who thinks it is great and “our fertility” for young girls of 13 to 17 to have 4 times the birth rate of any other culture here?
        
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        September 26, 2017 5:44pm
      - realityczech
        
        So which is it GoVege;
        
        a. The culture ?
        b. Filthy evil rotten man pigs ?
        
        Or are you suggesting Maori women are not part of the culture at all and it is just man-pigs “forcing” them to breed and get free money from the tax payers ?
        
        What is holding Maori women back is people like you angrily handing them the victim card. You like your Maori poor, angry and oppressed.
        
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        September 26, 2017 5:53pm
      - GoVege
        
        Reality Czech: I’m not saying the women are blameless and the men are all brutes.
        They are a product of their cultural attitudes.
        I know Maori and Polynesian males who are gentle, hard-working and devoted to their wives, children and pets.
        But allowing males to have precedence over females leads to more aggressive males assuming the right to bash and abuse their wives and children.
        On the whole, many Maori women have pretty awful lives.
        The women abuse each other and I have even heard Maori women abuse their preschool daughters.
        The culture is down on women generally.
        Whether you care or not, many Maori women and children HAVE been victims…of sexism and culture.
        That doesn’t mean we “hand them a victim card”.
        It means we do the same we do for any victims of violence and a use: we offer them support and help.
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:11pm
      - Longknives
        
        “I still get pi**ed off when they hit the booze, but they’re not as bad as rich drunken Pakeha…”
        
        Sweet Jesus Go Vege!
        Have you ever visited Planet Earth?
        The Domestic Violence (and other Violent Crime) Stats would tend to make an absolute mockery of that ludicrous assertion…
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:13pm
      - realityczech
        
        “But allowing males to have precedence over females”
        
        Yeah cause Maori women are so sweet and submissive LOL 🙂
        
        Go eat a steak lunatic.
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:24pm
- Jack5
  
  It’s already happening in NZ. Second and third wives of Muslims are entitled to “single parent” benefits.
  
  http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO1702/S00191/polygamous-marriage-is-govt-bending-the-rules.htm
  
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  September 26, 2017 2:00pm
  - GoVege
    
    How ironic…a western nation founded on Christian principles supports and pays abusive immigrant males to commit bigamy/ trigamy and quadrigamy.
    WHY???
    
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    September 26, 2017 5:53pm
    - realityczech
      
      Yes shocking:
      
      Orthodox Israelis Spit On Whorish 8-Year-Old Girl For Going To School
      
      http://jezebel.com/5871293/orthodox-israelis-spit-on-whorish-8-year-old-girl-for-going-to-school
      
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      September 26, 2017 5:56pm
      - GoVege
        
        Yeah I know.
        These ultra orthodox creeps are as bad as conservative Muslims.
        Didn’t one of them assassinate an Israeli PM?
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:17pm
      - realityczech
        
        Yeah they do all kinds of shit.
        
        They also burn the Israeli flag and protest against zionism, are work shy, breed like rabbits and generally be a pain in the arse 🙂
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:21pm
Jack5

Where political correctness comes from …

A Hooerald staffer who happens to be a white woman born and raised in Hong Kong lambasts South Island contestants for asking a Cambodian-born Wellingtonian whether he’s a Kiwi because they can’t tell from his accent.

Two other contestants also ask where the Wellingtonian’s parents come from.

The Hooerald commentator, Joanna Hunkin, then labels this “shitty racism”. And, surprise, surprise, she brings in herself:

As someone who grew up in Hong Kong, I’ve spent my life fielding a similar kind of stupidity. As a white girl with a weird accent, Kiwis have often struggled to grasp that I could be from a South-East Asian country.

As one prominent All Black once eloquently declared, “But you don’t look like this!” while pulling slanty eyes at me.

Raised in Hong Kong? One of the white colonial ruling class? And she’s lecturing native-born New Zealanders on how to behave towards folk of Asian heritage?

But what bullshit, that you can’t ask someone what there heritage is? Is it rude to make a talking point of heritage with someone whose face is covered in tribal heritage tattoos, basically a billboard of genealogy? You are supposed to ignore it?

You make conversation with someone with a Scots or Irish accent, or an American or Canadian accent, and you you’re not allowed to ask what part of their country they come from? Are you not allowed to ask a backpacking hitchhiker where they are from?

For sure don’t ask Hunkin whether she ever heard of white folk being called gwai-lo in Hong Kong, or whether her parents and their friends had Chinese servants.

Hunkin, of the Hooerald, is billed as head of entertainment at New Zealand Media and Entertainment (NZME – publisher of the Hooerald, several regional newspapers and owner of the Radio Network, which includes the ZB and ZM stations).

Hunkin’s lecture to NZ’ers:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11926230
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September 26, 2017 11:44am
- KevOB
  
  I often ask people where are they from particularly the phone-me Windows techs. Had two calls this morning. Neither mentioned Microsoft so a new style scam is afoot.
  
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  September 26, 2017 12:21pm
  - Captain Mainwaring
    
    Had the pricks three times last night within half an hour. Different voice each time.
    Told one of them that I don’t have a computer.
    The response: “uh?”
    
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    September 26, 2017 12:30pm
    - softail 1450
      
      captain, I always tell them I can’t do it at the moment because I’m busy finishing off their older sister,,,it seems to work a treat actually.
      
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      September 26, 2017 1:08pm
    - fluffykiwi
      
      I said I didn’t have a computer and I was then asked insistently why I didn’t have a computer. I said I didn’t want a computer. Why they said, I thought for a moment I was talking to a 3 year old.
      What idiots. If you are going to try and scam at least get someone who has a sense of humour.
      
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      September 26, 2017 5:07pm
dime

is chompers pregnant?

whale oil saying she cant drink at the moment.
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September 26, 2017 12:57pm
- GoVege
  
  Stop being catty , dime….you might need to change your name.
  Maybe something like “poor prick”….
  
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  September 26, 2017 3:27pm
- Gabby
  
  dim’s gettin gossipy
  
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  September 26, 2017 4:53pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Surely nothing could compare to Vege when it comes to gossiping!
    Always watching her neighbours
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=50PbTompgB8
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BR3B8-DsXL8
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LR4bcuOBRLA
    
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    September 26, 2017 5:12pm
- Piniwi
  
  Not yet dime. As you may be aware alcohol is not compatible with most of Taxinda’s medications.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:42pm
All_on_Red

Interesting commentary from Wayne Mapp on why Labour should stay in opposition.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11926543
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September 26, 2017 1:15pm
sooty

Oh, dear! Labour are realy in the shit then. They can not bring Angry back, that would put them down with the greens. Who can they promote?
Maybe the cleaning lady will step up! Lets face it, there is no one else! Not Robo, not twitford, not Kelvin. Can not bring back Annie, or Sullen, or Helun. They are stuffed!
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September 26, 2017 1:16pm
sooty

If Taxinda is pregnent, Winstone has limited options. He ain’t going with Labour and tie himself to that rubble. Bill will be grining like a ceshire cat that got the cream!
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September 26, 2017 1:20pm
- Poppa
  
  She won’t make any announcement before the “negotiations” take place
  
  I got severely chastised for suggesting such a thing prior to the election here at work. It would really make my day if it is true
  
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  September 26, 2017 1:23pm
  - sooty
    
    Everybody will be looking for the baby bump. The media party will be all fizing and creaming their jeans. Just watch them backstab each other to get the photos, interview etc. The one that gets that will be the biggest brown noser in NZ. Wont it be lovely to find out she got paid for interview.
    
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    September 26, 2017 6:27pm
fluffykiwi

If she is game over, Winnie PM, extended maternity leave into law, back in time for the next election, womans weekly magazines all over her, breastfeeding in the house, what can’t she do for women, who unfortunately make up the largest voting population in NZ.
I am a woman and it never ceases to amaze me how sensible women suddenly become quite stupid over children. I have to admit to being quite silly over my grandchildren.
But in respect of the Government of NZ, I do not fall into that category.
What if she has “baby blues”, the baby is a sickly wee thing requiring all sorts of care, the imponderables are huge.
No Jacinda if you wish to have a child okay, but do not hold the country to ransom with photo shoots, what colour is the nursery painted, has Clarke learnt how to wash, fold and change nappies, because of course they won’t be plastic ones so bad for the environment etc.,
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September 26, 2017 1:20pm
- Longknives
  
  What’s the TAB paying on Jacinda making her Baby a prop for Political Pointscoring?
  I’m picturing the poor kid being dragged into Parliament and Adern smugly breastfeeding at work (TV Cameras everywhere)
  And God help anyone who dares suggest that isn’t an ideal start in life for the poor kid…
  
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  September 26, 2017 1:40pm
  - Gabby
    
    It worked for Ruthless lungnuts.
    
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    September 26, 2017 4:50pm
fluffykiwi

Of course she could just be “trying” I see Gayford went to Wellington with her, lapping up the attention. It might be one of those “the temperature is right” we have to do it now. that might be where she got her slogan “Lets do this” from, she keeps saying it to Gayford. We have to do it now !!!
Of course it would give her something to talk to Prince William and the Duchess about, sleepless nights, no not world affairs keeping me awake that baby just won’t sleep.
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September 26, 2017 1:27pm
- SteveRemmington
  
  Jacinda: Yes Kate, he’s never happy, he just cries and cries and cries until he falls off to sleep.
  
  Kate: oh dear, how is Clarke managing?
  
  Jacinda: I was talking about Clarke.
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:11pm
Fletch

Paul Joseph Watson on the ‘take a knee’ idiots.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thg4lnaVIT4
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September 26, 2017 1:36pm
fluffykiwi

Oh of course I forgot the photo ops, the Wedding, she wouldn’t want to have a little bastard given the Pacific Island voters.
Or would she want to be the whole picture – I don’t need a ring on my finger, I can Do This, there is that slogan again.
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September 26, 2017 1:39pm
- GoVege
  
  Oh b/s fluffy!
  Pacifica people don’t care if a couple are married or not.
  The only reason for the wedding is the chance for the minister to din it into the wife to be obedient….Adams rib etc.
  
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  September 26, 2017 1:48pm
  - Rachael Membery
    
    And the photos and selling the ‘story’. Gag.
    
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    September 26, 2017 3:38pm
    - RF
      
      Jesus Christ. I can see this lonely person with issues known as Gayford hogging the lime light from the commie chick. . He has form with lonely females.
      
      What a couple of losers….
      
      They are both well out of their depth.
      
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      September 26, 2017 9:03pm
Inandout

It has been suggested that libraries be used to house the homeless and the radio waves are hot with luvvies saying NO, the homeless may smell and spread disease to their children. It is very different when it affects their cossetted little lives. They often end their calls with concern for the homeless and ‘something must be done’.
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September 26, 2017 1:42pm
- GoVege
  
  Libraries?
  Ludicrous!
  There are plenty of community halls.
  How about building on some of those golf courses?
  Can’t golfers go out a town to golf?
  
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  September 26, 2017 2:06pm
  - Inandout
    
    RSA and Cossie clubs perhaps. Grey Lynn ‘Posh Mums’ will empathise with this mother:
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJBpGrWr_o0
    
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    September 26, 2017 2:39pm
- RF
  
  Our local library has had a group of smelly homeless people trying to move in during the day with their bags of belongings. They stink and smell like they have Shit themselves.
  
  No interest in books but keen to troll the internet for females who do not like wearing clothing.
  
  These dirty pricks are ruining it for honest citizens and their children who just want to get on with their peaceful lives and use the library for educational purposes.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:14pm
- RF
  
  Inandout.
  
  Well done I see you wish to set an example. How many smelly homeless people have you living in your lounge. I figure you could accomodate about 10.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:23pm
Michael

Dear oh dear, Notso is back on his Lundy bandwagon again.
Notso, driving at or under the speed limit Lundy could have got from Petone to Palmerston North and back with a tank full of petrol. And he would have kept to the speed limit, the last thing he would have wanted was a ticket for speeding.
He asked for that prostitute to visit him late, the reason being he wanted an alibi for the middle of the night.
His motive was the insurance money. He only had $20000 equity in the house, his business was barely breaking even, and he had a penalty interest payment due on that land he had purchased unconditionally which he had no way of paying so he would have had to declare bankruptcy which he obviously was not prepared to do.
Maybe he didn’t intend to murder his daughter, perhaps he was hoping she wouldn’t wake up, but the fact is he was the perpetrator and two juries agree . Juries do make mistakes as we have seen re the Bain retrial, but in the Lundy case both juries got it right.
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September 26, 2017 1:44pm
fluffykiwi

Winnie will be thinking, what happens if one of my MP’s decides to go it alone once they are sworn in as MPs they stay, even if they leave the party that got them there. The next on the list comes into parliament, but the renegade MP stays, what would that do to the slimmest of majorities, especially when you take the speaker into account.
Imagine if there were a couple of renegades. The coalition of labour, Winnie and greens would still have 61 or 62, but the opposition ranks just go up by the number of renegade MPs. who presumably would vote with the opposition as they would only leave their party over a huge difference of opinion. Winnie knows the score it has happened before.
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September 26, 2017 1:45pm
waripori

Just for the record, in case anyone thinks our electoral system has anything to do with democracy.

There were 125880 votes cast in 7 maori electorates for an average of a shade under 18,000 per seat.
2,043,922 cast in 64 general electorates for a shade under 32,000 average per seat. It does not matter this time as Labour have all the seats but it will one day.

If maori on the maori roll cant be bothered voting it must tell us something.
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September 26, 2017 1:49pm
- Nigel Kearney
  
  It is not just turnout.
  
  Our electorate boundaries are based on total population not voting age population. So your electorate vote carries more weight if you happen to live in an area with a larger average family size.
  
  This is by design. National started it back when rural areas had more kids. Then the DPB came along and created the situation where the choice to have kids is no longer based on ability to support them. Hence the poorest electorates now have the fewest voters.
  
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  September 26, 2017 2:08pm
  - Inandout
    
    The poorest areas have many residents who don’t want to enroll to vote because they are constantly being hunted by debt collectors. Although they move around so often they are almost ‘of no fixed abode’.
    
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    September 26, 2017 4:38pm
Manolo

The WSJ on the venal Peters:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/meet-the-maverick-wholl-decide-who-runs-new-zealand-again-1506330575?mod=e2tw
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September 26, 2017 2:25pm
Manolo

Who doubts comrade Clark is Miss Ardern’s puppeteer?
http://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/live-helen-clark-says-both-major-parties-have-viable-chance-to-govern/ar-AAssIrB?li=BBqdg4K&ocid=mailsignout

Former Prime Minister Helen Clark is speaking about the election result on Twitter, saying that some people will be elated about the result while others will not be. She said that it’s democracy and MMP in action, as both major parties prepare for negotiations.

Ms Clark says both Labour and National are each a “viable contender” to form a government.
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September 26, 2017 2:58pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  It’s none of Ms Clark’s fucking business, she was given the arse card nine years ago.
  Do we still see John Key poking his nose in?
  
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  September 26, 2017 3:24pm
  - MrTips
    
    And it would seem most of the comments on Stuff agree with that sentiment. LOL.
    
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    September 26, 2017 3:51pm
  - Gabby
    
    It’s as much her business as yours crusty.
    
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    September 26, 2017 5:57pm
Anne Glen Eden

And the MSM are on a relentless campaign to start an argument between National and Winston.

They really never give up with the blatant attempt to manipulate the outcome of the NZ election.

Clark is all ‘the people have spoken’ – trouble is she believes they should be ignored and the result overturned.
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September 26, 2017 3:22pm
- realityczech
  
  Sadly the media approach works on vulnerable low information types you see here on KB getting hysterical over Winston.
  
  With increased funding for mental health I look forward to them being tied to a bed and given thousands of free electric shocks.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:03pm
  - AgentBallSack
    
    Hopefully they start with you. The psychosis is more and more evident by the day.
    
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    September 26, 2017 6:31pm
btb

If I was Ardern I would be thinking about sacking a few lazy buggers who did not even have the basics done after years of indolence. And if they did then she made a terrible blunder. She won’t go to the next election as unprepared. I don’t think Winston will go left but its possible. I hope not but under mmp it is possible. Not likely though.
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September 26, 2017 3:28pm
- MickMac
  
  no taxinda won’t budge on the Maori seats referendum.
  
  Yeah
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:13pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Oh Goodness me!
Rest home care-givers win higher wages… but lose their jobs.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/96783299/rest-homes-way-around-equal-pay

Who could have predicted such an outcome?
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September 26, 2017 3:30pm
- srylands
  
  Yes welcome to the real world. Now wait for the screams and wailing. Along with the demand that the Government do something about it.
  
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  September 26, 2017 3:32pm
- kowtow
  
  They should have learned that from the sheltered workshops .Equal pay but no jobs.
  
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  September 26, 2017 3:33pm
  - Swifty
    
    And the youth…
    
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    September 26, 2017 4:00pm
- Poppa
  
  The law of unintended consequences
  
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  September 26, 2017 3:49pm
- KevOB
  
  My wife did.
  
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  September 26, 2017 3:55pm
- Inandout
  
  And the rest home won a good certification.
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/marlborough-express/news/7622890/Rest-home-wins-4-year-certification
  
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  September 26, 2017 4:49pm
  - Piniwi
    
    Close Inandout but a different rest home. That one is Blenheim and the wage ingenuity was Nelson. But it is the same island.
    
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    September 26, 2017 11:03pm
- Lance
  
  This is only the beginning
  
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  September 26, 2017 4:53pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    Yes, I fear it is.
    Good-quality rest-care homes will be too expensive for us/our loved ones to afford… so I reckon some under-the-table deals will eventuate.
    
    Granny will get “looked after” by some random down the road, who will drop in every now and again to do a few chores and receive $$ cash-in-hand.
    Cherish your neighbours, folks.
    
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    September 26, 2017 5:19pm
    - GoVege
      
      There IS an alternative.
      Do what other races do…look after your oldies yourselves! 🙂
      And save the country a fortune in rest home subsidies.
      (Hey….maybe they could use the savings to pay workers a decent wage!)
      
      1 5
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      September 26, 2017 7:06pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Why should my kids waste the best years of their lives looking after my dribbly, drooling, degenerating body?
        
        Their duty is to look after themselves and their sprogs.
        
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        September 26, 2017 8:05pm
- Piniwi
  
  Unintended consequences in play Maggy. This is old news which came out on Stuff about 2 weeks ago.
  It shows a better level of management skills to find an answer that will work. It helps the residents being impacted more than is necessary. A first for Nelson.
  
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  September 26, 2017 10:59pm
EAD_TWO

Remember the nonstop media coverage of the white church shooter, Dylann Roof?

Where’s the media coverage for thw negro church shooter, Emanuel Samson?

Or does it not fit the agenda?
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September 26, 2017 4:42pm
- kowtow
  
  Or the Somali cop who shot the white woman from his car.
  
  Might be nice if the very few white players in the NFL ( how’s that for diversity) made a statement in support of white victims of black cops who are too lazy to turn on their cameras or get out of the car when they shoot up nice neighbourhoods.
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:32pm
- realityczech
  
  This is the product of the dirty racist animal Obama.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:37pm
  - Happychappy
    
    RC : Do you actually like anyone and what party are you backing this week.
    
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    September 26, 2017 6:50pm
    - realityczech
      
      I back ideas not partisan bullshit the way intellectual cripples like you do. You have no principles and simply say things to appear popular. The world would be far better without you stealing oxygen from it.
      
      2 6
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      September 26, 2017 7:10pm
      - Happychappy
        
        Well its better than then crap that runs off your chin,and what I say is what I believe not like you and what tickles your fancy that day. Principles to you is like the truth you don’t know the meaning of it.
        
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        September 26, 2017 7:51pm
      - realityczech
        
        You have no principles. You just play to the audience. I have scrubbed better than you out of toilet bowls you repugnant creep.
        
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        September 26, 2017 8:07pm
MickMac

so it’s National and NZF.

The referendum on Maori seats means Labour won’t be in the mix as Taxinda won’t allow the referendum.

Brilliant.
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September 26, 2017 5:12pm
CharlieBrown

I read today that if the USA went to war with North Korea that 20,000 people could die every day for a week or two, but has anyone asked how many people die every year in North Korea whilst that regime exists due to Starvation or murder? Or how North Koreans live on average 12 years less than South Koreans? The US should be working with China on how to lance that fatty pus filled boil Kim Jong Un from this plain of existence to both countries liking.

I like the idea of the USA agreeing to the removal of all troops from Japan and South Korea if China helps deal to North Korea, maybe insist on a neutral unified Korea (similar to Finland), or maybe a Chinese run North Korea.
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September 26, 2017 5:15pm
- kowtow
  
  I like the idea of the people in North Korea having free and fair elections to decide their own future , that might be a novel experience for the oppressed masses of China.
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:28pm
  - CharlieBrown
    
    Well that’s never going to happen. And the smacking referendum shows how real “democracy” in nz is, voting isn’t all it’s cracked up to be, but not starving is.
    
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    September 26, 2017 6:13pm
    - GoVege
      
      Yeah…parents the world over need the right to bash …I mean smack…their kids.
      
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      September 26, 2017 7:47pm
- Digmen1
  
  The Russians and the Chinese keep saying dialogue is the answer.
  But Fatboy does not want to talk.
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:47pm
  - CharlieBrown
    
    Thats largely been because everyone assumes a US backed government will replace it. China and Russia don’t want another state that is politically aligned to the US on their borders. Perhaps if they change the discussion to replacing porky with a regime more stable but still aligned to China, China and Russia might be willing to help hang the fat pig leading north korea.
    
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    September 26, 2017 7:26pm
Happychappy

So Winston is not happy with the Fonterra CEO wage increase and is vowing to change the law so he can get these deals stopped. Since when have politicians been allowed to interfere in any company business and isn’t it up to farmers to vote these things down or are we heading for dictatorship and politicians making rules restricting company’s to their view.
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September 26, 2017 5:16pm
- AgentBallSack
  
  are we heading for dictatorship and politicians making rules restricting company’s to their view.
  
  Of course! Thats why we all voted for Labour wasnt it?
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:23pm
Inandout

Hillary’s close Muslim aide’s ex is going to the big house.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/sep/25/sex-addicts-recovery-anthony-weiner
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September 26, 2017 5:18pm
- Piniwi
  
  Good Inandout. He might end up as somebodies bitch. With the sort of prison population there it might be an eye watering experience.
  
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  September 26, 2017 11:10pm
AgentBallSack

Both Davis and Bennett to stand aside if Winston wants Deputy.
We need to go to the German MMP where the majority party is THE Government. All other minor parties fit under the wing of the majority and supply C&S or not.
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September 26, 2017 5:25pm
- Gruffydd
  
  ABS
  Is that a part of law or a convention?
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:40pm
- realityczech
  
  MMP means the majority rule.
  
  Using your idiotic logic a party with 10% support could rule, rather than a coalition of the remaining 90% spread over 11 parties.
  
  What you are really saying is you want National to govern. So cut the crap.
  
  Either they get into bed with the Greens or Winston, or lose.
  
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  September 26, 2017 5:46pm
  - AgentBallSack
    
    Don’t be a fuckstain all your life czech.
    Learn to branch out! Perhaps you will end up as just a stain on the footnote of history.
    Talking about idiots is Winnie back from “fishing” yet? I mean its not like he has anything important to do….
    
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    September 26, 2017 6:00pm
  - Gruffydd
    
    MMP means the majority rule.
    
    Nope RC
    It is more nuanced than that
    In your parliament with 12 party’s it is conceivable that a block representing less than 50% of the electorate could rule.
    Providing enough of the rest coincide that they are acknowledge as the party of government and they could get support from sufficient votes from the rest to pass 50% for any piece of legislation. This support would not need to be the same party’s each time .
    
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    September 26, 2017 6:01pm
    - AgentBallSack
      
      This would be the better version of MMP for NZ. 5% is to high, conceivably every caucus vote could be an electorate or conscious vote if we had no minimum, or a 1% limit. Would make laws like euthanasia and cannabis much easier to pass.
      
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      September 26, 2017 6:08pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        I support one seat for each 1% of the party vote
        From our NZ experience so far having to many small party’s is not the problem for NZ
        We still have to few party’s for true representation and startling new ones 5% seems to be an impossible hurdle.
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:14pm
    - realityczech
      
      “Nope RC
      It is more nuanced than that”
      
      True but in your example that relies on the conditional support of other elected groups.
      
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      September 26, 2017 6:27pm
- Inandout
  
  Davis being whanau will have no bearing on Winston’s decision. In fact it will make it harder for him to criticise Labour in any coalition.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:26pm
AgentBallSack

DPF is on holiday for a week!
Don’t worry, he tabulates the bans at the end of the self imposed vacation. Behave gentle folks 🙂
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September 26, 2017 6:04pm
- Gruffydd
  
  Jesus and Mohammad ABS
  It would be no fun if someone didn’t get a whack on the sack once in a while.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:08pm
- realityczech
  
  Like this Sacky ?
  
  “AgentBallSack
  Don’t be a fuckstain all your life”
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:11pm
  - AgentBallSack
    
    I think that should be acceptable when describing you jazz/kea/kriss/czech et al.
    Feel free to report me narc.
    
    11 3
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    September 26, 2017 6:17pm
    - realityczech
      
      Snitching is your game isn’t it Sacky ?
      
      Yeeeessss it is. You little sleazy little worm.
      
      3 8
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      September 26, 2017 6:18pm
      - AgentBallSack
        
        Shitting on threads and cars is your game isn’t it czech? SQUAWK?
        Swallowing the indigestible? SQUAWK?
        Fuckstain gave his vote away to Winnie? SQUAWK?
        Yet here you are cting like you actually had a decision in the Government
        SQUAWK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
        
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        September 26, 2017 6:41pm
      - realityczech
        
        Poor Sacky seems to be taking the democratic expression of the people rather badly LOL 🙂
        
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        September 26, 2017 7:46pm
Fletch

If Winston goes with Labour and the Greens it will be a coalition of the losing parties. That just doesn’t seem right, and a big ‘f-you’ to the 46% of the country that voted for National.
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September 26, 2017 6:07pm
- Gruffydd
  
  What about the other 54% Fletch?
  oops that’s right democracy sucks if it disagrees with you.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:10pm
- AgentBallSack
  
  That’s whats wrong about our MMP system. Clark & co set it up so if you don’t get the majority, WITH partners you can’t form a Government.
  In a bigger country we would have more parties, in NZ we have 5 parties vying for election. That doesn’t give us much of a choice when the election is tight.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:14pm
  - realityczech
    
    “In a bigger country we would have more parties,”
    
    Yeah like the USA. Wow look at all their parties !!! LOL 🙂
    
    Gibbering loon go back to your crayons and don’t put them in your mouth.
    
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    September 26, 2017 6:17pm
    - AgentBallSack
      
      USA doesnt have MMP fuckstain and they have MORE parties than us. Jesus Christ, the standard of troll is poor around here.
      
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      September 26, 2017 6:28pm
      - realityczech
        
        Sacky, sorry to interrupt you down loading objectionable images on your Mum’s laptop, but how is having even more more parties going to help fulfill your dream of National dominating elections ?
        
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        September 26, 2017 7:24pm
    - Gruffydd
      
      Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery kea
      Gibbering and loon are both copyrighted to Griff .
      
      6 7
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      September 26, 2017 6:28pm
      - realityczech
        
        No, bullshitting about the weather is copyrighted to Griff.
        
        6 1
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        September 26, 2017 6:33pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        ROFL
        Always back to the rain.
        Gargle some Windex screenlicker .
        
        4 6
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        September 26, 2017 6:50pm
- realityczech
  
  Fletch 46% is not a majority. I see your point but you need to accept we voted repeatedly for MMP.
  
  Under MMP you can get a simple majority just like FPP.
  
  You can also get a majority by adding up the smaller votes.
  
  In all cases the majority of peoples views will be represented, which was the entire point of MMP (that we voted for).
  
  You are just sulking because you did not get your way.
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:15pm
- Longknives
  
  Agreed Fletch.
  It fucking astounds me that Adern and Shaw are still shrieking that they won the Election (“The people voted for change”etc etc)..Despite both of them combined still getting their arses kicked by a tired,lazy (and frankly uninspiring) National Party.
  It is reflective of how utterly fucking awful the prospect of a Labour/Green ‘Communist Coalition’ is that National still sailed ahead of them on polling day.
  Winston would be batshite insane to poison his brand and shack up with the bloody lunatic Greens to form a Government- It would be Political Suicide. (And most people who voted NZ First would turn on him)
  I would have liked National to Govern alone but for the love of God can we please just have a Nat/NZ First Coalition and keep those fucking Communists away from our Economy???
  
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  September 26, 2017 6:28pm
  - realityczech
    
    You nailed it.
    
    Winston has thrown NZ a life line. If National don’t pull their heads in and play nicely Winston might do the unthinkable as his last hurrah !
    
    6 10
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    September 26, 2017 6:31pm
    - AgentBallSack
      
      Tell him to go for it czech. He will die like he lived. In a blaze of flaming shit. Will be amusing to watch him go down as the worst MP who was never PM in history. I look forward to editing his Wiki page myself 🙂
      
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      September 26, 2017 6:36pm
      - realityczech
        
        Funny thing is Sacky he has been preferred PM far more often than Bill English.
        
        Right now your boy Billy is siting there waiting for Winston to bark his orders. Great stuff I am sure you agree. National need some humbling and are about to get it. 🙂
        
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        September 26, 2017 7:19pm
  - Gabby
    
    Shrieking? That’s a bit fibby lungnuts.
    
    3 8
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    September 26, 2017 6:46pm
    - MrTips
      
      Gabby Gobby Giblet Git
      never makes sense, no not one bit,
      He eats his tea while upside down
      just to make sure it’s always brown
      And when the day is almost done
      he pulls his britches high
      to make sure his ego reaches
      his height of 3 foot nigh
      
      9 2
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      September 26, 2017 8:07pm
      - Gabby
        
        Mr Tits
        Mr Tits
        Lost his wits
        Did the shits
        
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        September 27, 2017 5:52pm
  - Surely Knott
    
    It seems Stuff is weighing in on the argument, and declaring that Winnie has 2000+ comments on his facebook page begging him to go left. The systems broken if the election will be decided by a single man who wouldn’t declare which way he leaned, looking through his facebook comments. Since when did the number of facebook comments represent democracy . #to hell with the polls lets just facebook our votes. At least if Winnie swings left we will know he is not interested in working with the party that receives the most public support he is actually a labour supporter.
    
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    September 26, 2017 7:13pm
- Rachael Membery
  
  Described as unpopular by the AM show, they need a dose of reality.
  
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  September 27, 2017 7:49am
Happychappy

Let Jacinda go with Winston and watch Labour do a uturn on their honours system and upset Helen Clark because he will have to ask to get the honour he wants.
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September 26, 2017 6:22pm
Brigitte

“People have voted for change”.

There is another way of interpreting this. What has happened – the two big parties have won and the smaller ones have just hung on. So is the change “back to FPP” or perhaps more precisely (maybe?) towards “the US 2 party system”
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September 26, 2017 7:28pm
Don the Kiwi

So I’m sitting here tooling around with the new Samsung S 7 my son bought me – getting there, but it’s gonna take me a while. Really very different to the 2004 flip top Samsung cell phone that I have been using for the last 13 years – as if it was unexpected 😉
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September 26, 2017 7:59pm
- realityczech
  
  “2004 flip top Samsung cell phone”
  
  Best phone ever. I would still use them if I did not need a smart phone.
  
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  September 26, 2017 8:03pm
  - Gruffydd
    
    Samsung flips rule.
    Its a phone not a toy.
    it makes phone calls fine .
    I charge it once every week or so .
    It links to my hands free in the car without a issue.
    If a want to fuck around on the net I use the lap top.
    I cant see the bloody net on the tiny screen on a cell phone
    
    wtf are I going to do when mine dies .
    
    4 4
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    September 26, 2017 8:14pm
    - realityczech
      
      “I charge it once every week or so .”
      
      It usually takes that long with solar panels Griffy 🙂
      
      They were such well thought out and intuitive phones. Buttons are way better than touch screens too.
      
      5 1
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      September 26, 2017 8:16pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        hello screen licker
        The phone charges the same if I power it from my solar or plug it in to the grid .
        I use a USB cable and a 24volts to 5volts converter.
        USB is only from 0.5 amp@5volts up to 3amp@5volt.
        My solar is 80 amps@ 24 volts into 850 amp hours @24 volts of storage.
        I can arc weld 10mm steel with my storage no prop
        Changing a cell phone is not even noticeable.
        
        4 4
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        September 26, 2017 8:31pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        “I charge it once every week or so .”
        
        Translation- no one rings Griff and he’s got no one to call.
        Awwwww Sad!
        
        3 2
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        September 26, 2017 8:42pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        No calls its 2 weeks plus between charges all on red .
        I don’t gibber on the phone for hours like a teen age kid .
        
        4 4
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        September 26, 2017 8:47pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Kids text.
        People with things to do talk.
        Hey, isn’t Strike 7 three months off?
        – Snigger
        
        4 1
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        September 26, 2017 8:53pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        Whatever dk
        
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        September 26, 2017 8:55pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Tick tock
        
        4 1
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        September 26, 2017 8:58pm
- nasska
  
  I pity you. I’ve just lifted myself out of my comfort zone by buying a Macbook after twenty years of Windows.
  
  I’ll get it if it kills me!
  
  9 1
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  September 26, 2017 8:12pm
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    No way would I ever go back to a PC.
    Have to laugh everytime the hubby tries to use my Macbook, ….He can’t figure out the touch pad….
    rushes back into his cave where he can scroll through his Windows XP.
    
    5 2
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    September 26, 2017 8:21pm
    - nasska
      
      I’m a cocky (retired) not an IT expert but if Microsoft had stuck to XP or similar I would never have wandered. Windows 7 was tolerable.
      
      But the arrogant bastards insist on telling me what I want (Labour anyone) & if I have to learn everything anew I’ll do it with a different company’s product.
      
      6 1
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      September 26, 2017 8:32pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        Well I have a wee problem at the moment…
        can’t get skype to work on my out-of-date operating system.
        I got bumped off the old version of skype, so downloaded new version and then got a message that it couldn’t run on my OS.
        Tried to update my OS… but must have stuffed up….so went to a hole-in-wall joint down town to see if they could fix things for me…
        told it might cost $200-300 and I’d be without laptop for 3-5 days.
        I reckon it’d be easier for me just to fly over to Melbourne, say hi to the kid, tell her to fix my laptop and organise our next skype date.
        
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        September 26, 2017 9:08pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        No way would I ever go back to a PC.
        told it might cost $200-300 and I’d be without laptop for 3-5 days.
        
        I have brought ex lease lap tops for the last fifteen years.
        400 bucks buys a 3 year old business one that costs around two grand new.
        Keeps me current at a lot less cost than shelling out for a new one
        presently levano with 8 gig 250 gig ssd and sandy bridge i5 windows 7 professional.
        You would spend near on that just to get 8 gig memory for a mac .
        A ssd hard drive is the go for speed .
        Booting up windows takes less the 30sec from cold.
        
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        September 26, 2017 9:32pm
      - nasska
        
        …..”presently levano with 8 gig 250 gig ssd and sandy bridge i5 windows 7 professional.”…..
        
        I nearly went that way myself Griff but I read somewhere that support for W7 was likely to end 2020. As it happens I didn’t have to fork out huge money to experiment with a Mac as one of my grandkids was updating so I bought their two year old machine.
        
        At least they’re not the bug magnets that PCs are. I’d swear that my Lenovo spent more time updating itself. loading patches & protecting itself from malware & other nasties than I spent using it!
        
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        September 26, 2017 9:47pm
      - Gruffydd
        
        The gf is a mac user from way back nasska.
        I can see the attraction but my arse is way to tight to pay the cost .
        
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        September 26, 2017 10:03pm
      - Jack5
        
        Have any of you PC users tried MacinCloud?
        
        I prefer the PC world, where you get into the engine and adapt with quite cheap components, new or used. I like the logical way Windows stores files, too. Linux is great, but a little too time consuming and a bit arcane for me.
        
        There’s one specialist Mac application I’m keen to try, but not keen enough to dive into the Mac hardware world. I hear that MacinCloud lets you run quite complex Mac applications from a PC.
        
        I’m interested in the opinion of anyone who can tell me how MacinCloud worked for them.
        
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        September 26, 2017 11:36pm
  - Northland Wahine
    
    Once you go Mac, you never go back!
    
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    September 26, 2017 9:54pm
Maggy Wassilieff

Oh dear!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/97220883/gloriavale-man-charged-with-sexual-violation-indecent-assault
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September 26, 2017 9:16pm
- nasska
  
  The worst offenders are found within the ranks of religious nutters Maggie.
  
  All the teachings about “God’s will’ & obedience provides them with a smorgasbord of compliant, brain washed pre-victims.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:30pm
- Captain Mainwaring
  
  And let’s hope he’s just the first from that hellhole.
  
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  September 26, 2017 9:31pm