Police “terror” evidence online

November 26th, 2007 at 5:13 pm by David Farrar

I thought this might happen. Someone has put online a copy of the 155 page Police file on the “terror” suspects as a pdf.

The website it is on appears to be a group called the NZ Civil Liberties Union – a different group to the well known Council with a similar name. It is registered to a Michael Ross in Missouri.

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47 Responses to “Police “terror” evidence online”

  1. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    Oh dear, the ACLU has come to New Zealand, in the form of the NZCLU. Dont get me wrong, I want to see the terror evidence but the ACLU are a bunch of idiots who want to wreck weastern society.

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  2. Sam Dixon (630 comments) says:

    Yeah, Nick, I’m sure that’s exactly what the ACLU wants to do, I bet they have meetings where they sit around in darkened halls plotting how to wreck western society.

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  3. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    Well, yeah pretty much. Whenever a Christian in America does anything religious in a public place they take them to court. Whenever a Muslim does anything in a public place they praise them for promoting tolerance. They are strong defenders of the right to freedom of speech, unless ofcourse you are speaking out against homosexuality, a religion other then christianity, flag burning or a country that is not part of the weastern block.

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  4. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    ACLU: Anti Christian Liberals Unite!

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  5. dad4justice (7,967 comments) says:

    ACLU like AK47′s !!

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  6. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    Also they support the rights of some individuals. Particularly if those individuals in question are illegal immigrants, serial killers or terrorists. They are however less supportive of the rights of Christians and unborn babys.

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  7. David Farrar (1,871 comments) says:

    As amusing as the merits or otherwise of the ACLU are, I do not think this group is associated with them.

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  8. MikeE (555 comments) says:

    Time to get my google on

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  9. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    I wouldnt be so sure DPF; Micheal Ross from Missouri…

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  10. cha (3,853 comments) says:

    I see ya gotcha “culture warrior” cloak on nickc, got a mug as well?.

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  11. Adolf Fiinkensein (2,830 comments) says:

    Having read the first 65 pages, I’d say the cops got it right. Clark let them and us down with her incoherent legislation. It seems Fiji knows how to keep terrorists under lock and key.

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  12. MikeE (555 comments) says:

    Yeah, makes for an interesting read

    It appears to be a bit more than what Minto described as “What you’d hear in any gun club”

    I’d comment further, but I’d be breaching supression orders.

    Still, I don’t see any of it as an argument that we need further laws restricting individual rights, and the freedom of legitimate firearms owners (terrorism supression act and amendments to the arms act respectively) to prevent such action.

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  13. Inventory2 (10,170 comments) says:

    Question for one of our resident legal eagles (but not you Sam Dixon!) – is the reason that charges have only been laid under the Arms Act and not the Crimes Act because of the admissability of evidence eg phone and text intercepts?

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  14. John Dalley (394 comments) says:

    ANybody Know?
    once the Terrorist act is reworded and pssed into law, could they relay the charges again?

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  15. dad4justice (7,967 comments) says:

    Inventory2 ; like you I am totally lost as to why the crown did not lay representative charges from the Crimes Act as text messages and phone records are admissible evidence within Criminal jurisdiction . This whole thing is a smoke screen – cock up, really the Arms Act – terrorist – does not add up to me? She’ll be right says Auntie Lemon Face . Does anybody in the New Zealand just actually know what the f##k they’re doing ?

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  16. barry (1,317 comments) says:

    I understand that the police couldnt get all the access that they wanted under the acts (firearms etc) other than the terrorism act. The terrorism act allows far greater access to phone taps and general surveylance.

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  17. dad4justice (7,967 comments) says:

    Bullshit Barry, police have full access to telephone / text records . I see , so this smoke screen was a show of support for the terrorism act ?

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  18. Buggerlugs (1,609 comments) says:

    Has anyone called the pencilled 021 number on the front page?

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  19. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    Great call buggerlugs. I should prank call some of these phones and see if anyone responds. If u go further in there are literally hundreds of phone numbers to call.

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  20. Buggerlugs (1,609 comments) says:

    Tame’s not answering his.

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  21. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    I called one of them b4 and a surprisingly high pitch voice said: “Hello, Sam Dixon speaking”.

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  22. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    It’s fascinating, but I can’t see why the cops thought they had a case under the TSA, unless there’s additional evidence postdating what’s here.

    Although a core of those involved were clearly discussing and training for what reasonable people would consider terrorist acts (their competence in carrying them out is a matter for debate), there is no *specific* act of terrorism being planned. The SG got it right in law.

    The quotes used by the Dom Post aren’t really the most damning parts. Some of them do read like bullshit talk. Some of the rest is quite alarming.

    And I don’t think Iti and Kemara’s chief interest in Jamie Lockett was his fighting skills.

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  23. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    Man, forget the hollow men. This would make a great action novel! I would buy it.

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  24. dad4justice (7,967 comments) says:

    Maybe the Nicky Hagar pillock could do a play called the Para Military Pillow Fighters From Down under ?

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  25. Fletch (6,142 comments) says:

    I don’t get it…
    The website that this document can be downloaded from seems to be critical of the Police and what they did re: the ‘terror raids’ and yet the document itself (IMHO) is pretty well damning of the activist group and their activities. Most NZers in reading said document would more likely be convinced that the police did the right thing I think.

    The website then, it seems to me, is almost metaphorically ‘shooting itself in the foot’ if it is trying to get any sympathy for the ‘political activists’ it supports.

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  26. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    Fletch: I think although they dislike the police they (being civil libertarians) support the right of people to know the information.
    D4J: He’s probably already half way done. He will have hacked into the police website as soon as the raids were exicuted to get this info. He will later no doubt claim that “5 disillusioned Tuhoe freedom fighters supplied me with various documents detailing their activities in the Uruweras”.

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  27. David Farrar (1,871 comments) says:

    There’s so much to enjoy in the affidavits. I thought 32.1 explaining that John Bulls are a brand of boot was great.

    Also of interest was a certain female peace activist from Wellington talking about getting trained up on a silenced rifle, and allegedly having it delivered to her. A new definition of “peace” activist.

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  28. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    Also of interest was a certain female peace activist from Wellington talking about getting trained up on a silenced rifle, and allegedly having it delivered to her. A new definition of “peace” activist.

    Quite. OTOH, it seems that some others developed misgivings about the project and even disengaged from it.

    The source, and the handwritten notes, indicate that it has come from the defence side.

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  29. Nick C (340 comments) says:

    Yes, i wonder what the good people at frogblog think about this new evidence.

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  30. Right of way is Way of Right (1,129 comments) says:

    There is a great book in this, I agree.

    I also think it will be a big surprise to many in the organisation as to how completely infiltrated they are.

    Additionally, I note with concern a number of messages in the report indicate that there are elements within the Police who have also been funnelling information to some of the members of the group.

    It’s also surprising to note how many of the locations in this affadavit are known to me! Some of the purchases of illegal and restricted weapons took place within walking distance of my house!!!!!!

    This absolutely confirms to me that the Police were correct in acting as they did, and that the Terrorism Supression Act is a crock!

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  31. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    I also think it will be a big surprise to many in the organisation as to how completely infiltrated they are.

    You’ll note a number of redacted paragraphs marked “INF: INF” for “informant information”. The SG presumably saw those.

    Additionally, I note with concern a number of messages in the report indicate that there are elements within the Police who have also been funnelling information to some of the members of the group.

    It’s not quite clear, but there is a ministry mentioned.

    It’s also surprising to note how many of the locations in this affadavit are known to me! Some of the purchases of illegal and restricted weapons took place within walking distance of my house!!!!!!

    Yeah, me too. Freaky.

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  32. Right of way is Way of Right (1,129 comments) says:

    Just finished looking through the rest of the document, only one page is missing, pg 144. This page is the the page than commences the Personal Summary in respect of James Beattie Lockett. Additionally, the majority of the additional notes written in the document pertain to the actions of the afore mentioned James Lockett.

    Won’t take a rocket scientist to figure out exactly where this document has originated from now, will it!

    What a bunch of morons!

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  33. better (41 comments) says:

    I hope that charges of wasting police time are added to the firearms charges.

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  34. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    Won’t take a rocket scientist to figure out exactly where this document has originated from now, will it!

    Yep. I wonder if this has been prompted in any way by the efforts of the others arrested and their supporters to disassociate themselves from Lockett.

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  35. PhilBest (5,120 comments) says:

    Hey, this is encouraging. Helen will have to take a leaf out of the Chinese Communists book on regulating the internet if she wants to establish a propaganda stranglehold over NZ. Hope there’s more of this in the pipeline. “The Resistance”, supported by expats operating online, offshore in the “land of the free”. I like it.

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  36. Russell Brown (405 comments) says:

    Hey, this is encouraging. Helen will have to take a leaf out of the Chinese Communists book on regulating the internet if she wants to establish a propaganda stranglehold over NZ.

    In this case, I don’t think she’ll be terribly unhappy that it’s out in the wild now.

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  37. Linda Reid (407 comments) says:

    I’d say ‘disturbing’ is a mild word for these activities. The police were on the right track. As I thought.

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  38. Ben Wilson (523 comments) says:

    I don’t think any outcomes from this whole soap are certain except that it shows the TSA is toothless.

    Which doesn’t especially bother me. We don’t have a problem with terrorism that needs laws, any more than we’ve got a problem with people deliberately infecting others with bird flu. It could happen, but it hasn’t yet, and it’s probably covered by existing laws anyway. Even if it did, it’s got a looong way to go before it’s a problem of any significance.

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  39. drinks-after-worker (59 comments) says:

    Dad4Justice:

    Does anybody in the New Zealand just actually know what the f##k they’re doing ?

    Only you, dad. Only you.

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  40. LG (8 comments) says:

    Clearly a lot of effort went into the website. It doesn’t even have the months on the timeline right :)

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  41. beautox (434 comments) says:

    I can see why a peace activist would want to use a gun with a silencer. That’s peace as in ‘peace and quiet’

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  42. slightlyrighty (2,499 comments) says:

    Given the fact that a lot of informer information is missing, I’d put the house on the fact that this was leaked by the defence. Given the pedigree of the website that this is published on, I’d guarantee it.

    Given that the defence is arguing for dismissal on the basis that because this information is in the public domain through their own actions, I say the trial must proceed.

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  43. davemc (102 comments) says:

    It looks like someone has put pressure on the website hoster.

    The site is down.

    A message on it says: “This site is currently unavailable. If you are the owner of this site, please contact us at 1———— at your earliest convenience.”

    The solicitor-general’s reach goes all the way to America, I wonder?

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  44. valeriusterminus (247 comments) says:

    Did anyone notice the striking correlation between the advocacy of this nzclu site and kiwisfirst.co.nz which which is registered to Spartan News Limited of which Vince Siemer is a director?

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  45. davemc (102 comments) says:

    I wondered where I had read those attacks on Justice Potter, etc, before.

    Thanks for that, valeriusterminus, I think that is a “bingo!”

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  46. splodge (2 comments) says:

    valeriusterminus wrote
    >> Did anyone notice the striking correlation between the advocacy of this nzclu site and kiwisfirst.co.nz …

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  47. splodge (2 comments) says:

    Jamie Lockett’s lawyer is promoting kiwisfirst on his blog seriousfraud.blogspot.com – (listed under ‘links’).

    Small world isn’t it?

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