Not Peter Burns
October 3rd, 2012 at 9:55 am by David FarrarPeter Burns has e-mailed to say it was not him, who made the post on Cam Slater’s blog about his mother’s death. A search on the IP address shows it was an IP address never used by Peter, so I apologise to Peter who is a victim of malicious impostering. This means Peter is not banned for life, but he is still suspended until December for other comments.
The IP address, 182.239.239.189, has been used three times within 24 hours of the post on Cam’s blog by the commenter Luke Mutton here. The e-mail address “Luke” uses” is luke.mutton@yourvet.co.nz. It is impossible to prove it is “Luke”, but it is very rare for two strangers to use the same IP address within 24 hours – and both be blog commenters.
A domain name lookup on yourvet.co.nz shows the registrant to be Flair Web Works Ltd, david@flair.net.nz. That company was deregistered in 2007. It’s shareholder and director was David Brindley. The fact Brindley is the registrant for the domain does not mean he is “Luke Mutton”. But it does mean he knows who “Luke Mutton” is – at least.
One of our commenters has posted on Brindley in the past.
The e-mail address david@flair.net.nz used to be used by My Name is Jack, who has been suspended four times from Kiwiblog. Luke Mutton is now banned. I think the same person was also Billy Borker who has also been suspended four times. He has a history of very abusive behaviour.
It is possible that “Luke Mutton” was not responsible for the impersonation of Peter and that awful comment on Cam’s blog, just as Peter wasn’t. If “Luke” wishes to get his ISP, Adam Internet, to contact me and certify that his account was not using that IP address at the date and time the comment was made, I’ll consider that.
I am not saying David Brindley made the comment. I am saying the comment was made from an IP address used within 24 hours by an e-mail address at a domain Brindley controls.
Personally I regard such malicious impersonation to be the despicable. Bad enough to make such a comment, but even worse to try and set up someone else to be blamed for it. Again my apologies to Peter.
Tags: Cameron Slater, David Brindley, Peter Burns
October 3rd, 2012 at 10:11 am
Interesting, I also withdraw and apologise to Pete for my comment on Kiwi Blog in regard to this matter.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:16 am
The truth is it was never necessary for you to attack Burns in the first place. It was a comment made on WhaleOil, not Kiwiblog. The only reason you did the post saying you were banning him for life was to get attention. If he is banned until December anyway, all you needed to do was simply not lift the ban, but instead you felt the need to point it out. It’s like the Westboro Baptist Church protesting at a funeral, and you make the media story about the WBC instead of the death of the soldier. They got the attention they wanted and you fell for the trap.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:17 am
The one thing in common all these bastards have: they are Labour Party supporters.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:23 am
During my varsity days, I went out with a chic named Susan Lamb who told me that her late grand-dad’s name (from her mother’s side) was David Mutton. I wondered if Susan Lamb is related to Luke Mutton. I ran into Susan Lamb late last year in New Market and she got kids. She introduced me to her husband William Shank. I asked her , which name she’s adopting these days and she replied that she’s using both names, Susan Lamb Shank. The Lamb family are staunch Labor supporters.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:24 am
How low can you get? To malign someone else by making a disgusting remark on another’s bereavement.Genuinely malicious.
He’ll be back.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:25 am
Oh dear. I wonder how his employer, Mr yourvet, feels about all of this.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:27 am
I apologise to Mr Burns. I’ve had my own email address hacked and abused in the past, so I can commiserate.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:30 am
I was away and didn’t read the post .. thank goodness. I hope the person who wrote, whatever, is found and outed as the asshole he/she is.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:32 am
Jimmy, DPF has every right to ban whomever he likes whenever he likes. There is no rule an offense has to be committed inside Kiwiblog. A certain criminal ex Blenheim, ex Chritschurch, is fishing (not phising) In Wanganui for example. The focus is on the crime and the person, not the geography. Get done for a crime in Timbuktu, don’t get to enter NZ. Simple.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:39 am
You are right Jimmy. It was not necessary for DPF to condemn. Fact is, though, he had an absolute right to do so. Just as others who were disgusted by the comments had an absolute right to do so. I condemned the comments and still do. Just as I condemn Alan Jones’ comments. They were in poor taste and I think I am able to express that view without being accused of attention seeking. I apologise to Burn in as much as I assumed that it was him (on the face of the original post, it appeared to be him). I don’t resile from my condemnation of the comment and I am not going to forgo my rights to express my views on people who deserve contempt. I also reserve the right to deny them access to my living room — just as DPF has the right to deny them access to his blog. If you don’t like that then, tough.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:44 am
Brindley’s LinkedIn profile lists him as “Chairman, MensTrust, a not-for-profit registered charitable trust working to build a community where men are accepted, supported, and encouraged to create positive change in their lives” and living in Christchurch.
D4J is also involved in some sort of men-centric lobby group, and also lives in Christchurch if I recall correctly. Is this something personal between them?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:55 am
MNIJ/borker holds a special place in my heart for his Anzac Day meltdown three or four years ago, including the views he expressed regarding NZ soldiers killed overseas. Some of you will recall his angst at the travesty that saw his father’s war-time service in the merchant marine go unrewarded by a medal and subsequently get sacked for refusing to fire someone (per borker’s explanation). It may have been because of these affronts to the House of Borker, that he drew himself up to his maximum nacisssistic pomposity to proudly announce that when the balloon went up and the red/jihadist/progressive hordes (my words not borker’s – well ‘baiters actually) invaded our shores, he wouldn’t be appearing to defend the place. Although, to his eternal credit, he did volunteer that he would give some consideration to a non-combat role.
It was this principled anti-war stance that stirred the young borker, an Australian, to commit himself to refusing to be drafted into the Australian army during the Vietnam War. In fact so resolute was the young borker, that he determined he would go to jail rather than serve. It seems however, that this signature act of defiance was undermined by pressing matters in NZ that required him to come here and, quite coincidently, avoid the Australian draft.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:58 am
The initial comment seemed nasty, but impersonating and deliberately incriminating someone else is many degrees worse.
Peter/D4J used to complain and accuse of email attacks on him, maybe this suggests possibly culpability for that too.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:19 am
Eh? Someone apparently had a public go at his mate, of course it’s necessary for him to publicly show his support for Cameron. Baby steps like that and DPF might eventually get his man-card back
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:30 am
Kowtow- “How low can you get?”
Well, about as low as a progressive apparently. This is the kind of cowardly deceit such people are frequently capable of. (I actually suspected the comment on Whale’s blog could be an impersonation)
They’ve done it to Redbaiter quite frequently -Kurt from the Libertarianz for one example has not only left fake comments all over the web but even constructed a completely false blog.
Scott Hamilton of reading the maps is another. He has either posted or allowed fake comments to be posted (and stand) on his “Reading the Maps” blog.
This is typical of Progressives who have no personal moral code. It means that if they think they can get away with something dishonest, or the act will be undiscovered, or they can somehow escape the consequences, they will do it.
Its why so many of them are pathological liars by nature and or prone to smearing their political opponents in any way they can with false allegations or distortions of fact.
The left side of the political spectrum seems to draw this kind of coward and liar like flies to a rubbish tip.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:44 am
I also condemn any impersonations of Redbaiter (presuming they happened). But it’s nonsense to claim it’s all one-sided…
I’ve seen cowardliness and blatant lying from both the left (eg at The Standard) and the right (at Whale Oil and here).
Two commenter’s in particular have repeatedly called me a liar, one a leftie, one claiming to be a true blue rightie. Attacks without facts from a pseudonym are indeed cowardly.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:45 am
“During my varsity days, I went out with a chic named Susan Lamb”
Haha, wow, is she an English teacher by any chance? Grey haired woman?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:50 am
At least it’s because of the ‘progressives’ this time in redbaiters eyes, Pete.
Vote:Makes a change from the ‘liberals’ causing all the problems of the world!
October 3rd, 2012 at 11:50 am
Me too. OTOH, only a moron would think that other site was anything but a piss-take. Oh, but then …
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:51 am
I suspected the Peter Burns comment was fake too. The phraseology of the comment was not consistent with what the real d4j would write, plus d4j never posts as Peter Burns even though it is known to all and sundry that Peter Burns is his real name.
. . don’t know why everyone was so quick to pile down on him.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:56 am
“Attacks without facts”
One example- You have claimed that I was manipulating votes for my comments on Whale’s blog. This was a lie, a completely false allegation, it had absolutely no basis in fact, and you had not one skerrick of evidence that it may have been happening.
This is exactly the kind of despicable smear you and the rest of the cowardly left specialize in Peter George. One thing I was taught as a child is that you do not call any person a liar unless you are 100% sure, and you do not accuse anyone of a dishonest act unless you are similarly sure.
Clearly, you were never taught such things PG, or more likely, you were but have discarded such moral boundaries as an easily discarded inconvenience in your mission to publicly discredit those whom you disagree with politically.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 11:59 am
falafulu fisi
I’m getting worried about you starting to sound like young Obama ,making up girlfriends you never had:)
red
Vote:that’s the name of the game,”deceit”.
October 3rd, 2012 at 12:08 pm
“a pisstake”
That’s you isn’t it Davincimoron?
Its OK to lie and smear providing you can at the end say “Oh it was only a piss take”.
Dirtbag.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:09 pm
I raised the possibility, as others have. Your ‘votes’ at Whale Oil often have unusual patterns. And you seem obsessed with being seen to be have popular support.
All you needed to do was say you have never tried to manipulate votes at Whale Oil or here (when karma was active). You don’t actually respond apart from blustering.
If you state that you have never manipulated votes here or at Whale Oil (voting for yourself excluded) I’ll accept that, and put the unusal patterns down to unusual clusters of supporters.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:10 pm
Once bitten, twice shy? I’m surprised you were so willing to give up the email address behind an ‘anonymous’ username so quickly. Adam Internet is a South Australian ISP and YourVet.co.nz is based in Rangiora.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:12 pm
I often wonder whether the author of ‘Redbaiter’ will reveal themselves and admit “Oh it was only a piss take”. But I don’t think anyone could be that clever for so long.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:17 pm
“I raised the possibility”
You’re just a liar and a coward Pete, and I have no reason to engage with such contemptible vermin or issue denials just to give you and your smears some minimal degree of credibility. You’ve crossed the line far too often to ever be due anything but derision and contempt from myself.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:21 pm
Ever since I banished a certain commenter from Riverton (who is also banned for life here), I regularly get comments from people with bizarre names, but whose style of prose are remarkably similar. He assures me that it isn’t him, and I’ve taken his word for it; but maybe I need to look a little more closely at IP addresses as DPF has done…
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:26 pm
That’s your usual sort of non-denial avoidance, trying to divert into a smear attack. So I’m not lying by saying it’s still a possibility, and more suspicious because you won’t answer a simple question. Again.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:38 pm
If only this guy had just challenged Cam to a boxing match immediately following the death of his mother then everything would have been ok.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:46 pm
FFF @ 10:23
Well done, old chap.
Reminds me of the death many years ago of one Fred Mouldy. His widow subsequently married Bill Hay.
Maybe you could run a competition for hard case double names?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:50 pm
The whole issue with the fake post on Whale’s blog is not only that in typical amoral left wing fashion the impersonator not only tried to slander and defame a political opponent, he used the death of the blogger’s mother as an opportunity to do so.
Two or three levels of deceit and cowardice on display there simultaneously, to a degree that has to be pathological.
However you only have to look at the history of the socialist/ communist political movement to know such pathological behaviour is far from unusual.
For example Barack Obama’s political mentor Bill Ayers is on record as estimating that it will be necessary to kill 25 million Americans to allow the successful establishment of communism in that country.
Some will say its a big step from impersonating someone on a message board to murdering 25 million, but my point is that both actions require a similar pathological mindset, and once that mindset is present, there is no restraint on the magnitude of the act that might be committed.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:52 pm
@ Adolf – my Dear Departed Dad assured me that there was a firm of butchers in Feilding in the 1930′s by the name of Hitchcock and Scratchitt…
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 12:58 pm
Pete George sounds like a broken record with his, “You don’t respond other than blustering.” line.
Find a new track Pete.
Also, what sort of an up themselves prig would write, “If you say, blah, blah, blah, then I will accept that.” ?
Get a life Pete.
Vote:Newsflash for Pete. Nobody gives a crap what you will or will not accept.
October 3rd, 2012 at 1:08 pm
Well I’m pleased that dad4justice has got some, um justice, and any wrongs have been amended, he was able to get a lifetime ban in this blog for a comment on another blog, which is quite legendary. Not so impressive now!
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:09 pm
bereal, are you oblivious to the broken recordness of your stalking?
Sorry I asked a question, I can understand you reacting to “You don’t respond other than blustering”, like RB you’re full of bluster abuse but then dive for cover or make excuses for not answering anything. At least RB is amusing.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:10 pm
What a brave new world it would be if blog owners ran a simple name and address verification service, even if allowing some to remain anonymous e.g. public servants (a bit tricky given DPF’s open affiliation, I admit) and just clean out those whose only path to self respect is to dish out anonymous abuse rather than engage on substance.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:13 pm
Anonymous abuse is the substance of this thread, and it was one of your side that instigated it.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:16 pm
Like i said Pete.
Get a life.
You answer a question for once. See @ 12.58 above.
“What sort of an up themselves prig would write…..etc” ?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:17 pm
So… let me get this straight… someone felt the need to SMEAR dad4justice as an intemperate, foul-mouthed and utterly deranged troll?
ACTUAL LOL
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:20 pm
And there’s Wedbaiter moaning about anonymous abuse. Oh MAN this thread delivers…
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:34 pm
One last question Pete,
What sort of a self important, up themselves prig is it that when someone draws attention to some puerile
comment they have made accuses the commenter of ‘Stalking.” ?
Isn’t ‘stalking’ something that happens to girls ?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:35 pm
Yeah, one day I might publish the hundreds of deranged comments you have left on my own blog RRM you sick fuckwit.
“So… let me get this straight… someone felt the need to SMEAR dad4justice as an intemperate, foul-mouthed and utterly deranged troll?”
You haven’t got it even near straight you sick hypocritical troll.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:35 pm
“What sort of an up themselves prig would write…..etc” ?
It’s actually quite common for people (not just up themselves prigs) to ask questions and for others to answer them without weaseling off. And to accept someone’s word – if they give it.
Why do you resort to abuse so much while avoiding answering questions?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:46 pm
beryl, girls can also be stalkers. Many of your comments are hissy abuse repeatedly aimed at specific people. That can look like stalking. If you posted your views on things more (without resorting to repetitive smears) and engaged in discussions (like answering questions) you would look more like a normal commenter.
Can you honestly say you don’t target me?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:52 pm
IF YOU RUN YOU’LL ONLY DIE TIRED
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 1:58 pm
HUNDREDS of comments I’ve left on your blog?
Bitch please… the WHOLE INTERNET hasn’t yet managed to put 100 comments in TOTAL on your sad excuse for a political forum.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 2:01 pm
Publish one with proof.
Otherwise you’re leaving yourself open to the perception that you have smeared RRM with a lie.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 2:15 pm
What’s the old saying? A gallery of rogues?
In one sense I’m going to miss old Muttonhead’s style of white-hot, iPrent-style hatred – especially on the US threads. There’s something refreshing about hatred that raw and emotional – especially when it’s combined with electoral failure.
Of course, the likelihood that he was just trolling is high, as is the probability that he will be back here in another form sooner or later. It might be fun (if you’re really bored) to do a language analysis of the next Borker/MNIJ/Luke Mutton type to turn up here.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 2:34 pm
Kowtow, Obama had to lie about some nonexistent past girlfriends when he was young because Obama was trying to hide that in fact he had boyfriends.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 3:20 pm
That particular ip address 182.239.239.189 was active on my blog on the 28th of September, but I can’t tie the IP to any commenter.
Interestingly enough, on the 28th at 09:05:54 PM, the person exited to http://halfdone.wordpress.com/2012/09/28/hacking-a-troll/ and visited the link again the next day at 11:07:26 AM. They were interested in the post http://nominister.blogspot.com/2012/09/dad-for-justice.html at 07:30:01 PM the next day as well, and then your life ban post at 07:45:27 PM.
So, the person was interested in trolling (Halfdone’s link) and then what happened to D4J.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 3:52 pm
LOL. The old “you did it first” defence. Normally deployed by children of primary school age. Oh well, it is a bit like the primary school playground here so I guess using it came quite easily to the sad old thing.
But OTOH, what about the equally rational and sophisticated: “I was just getting my retaliation in first” defence? What do you think ‘baity old thing? You can think a little bit can’t you?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 4:03 pm
Pete @ 1.46
Yes, i can honestly say i don’t target you.
However anyone as sanctimonious, superior and full of themselves as you are is very target rich.
That’s a problem for you Pete.
By the way, so is your desperation to always try and have the last word.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 4:39 pm
Yes, i can honestly say i don’t target you.
Odd then that like today your first comment is attacking me and not contributing anything positive to the discussion. Add that your only comments today have been niggling at me.
By the way, so is your desperation to always try and have the last word.
I’m not desperate, I ignore you far more than I bother responding. You sometimes contribute to discussions but often you come across as a petty stalker.
By the way, Kiwiblog is an ongoing forum, it’s impossible to “try and have the last word”. If you piss off and avoid responding that’s not my fault. I rarely have the last comment on a thread (like everyone else). Your accusation seems like more pettiness with no substance.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 5:11 pm
This is great !
Of course you are desperate. you just proved it above.
Speaking of pissing off,
Vote:i’ll just post this, ‘last word’ on the subject, just to piss you off.
October 3rd, 2012 at 6:08 pm
Gee there’s a lot of people on this thread who have their period today. PMS putting up with men’s shit?
Soon be over then you can have a cry
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 7:00 pm
I did wonder, seemed a bit low. The poor human race gets scammed so often its sad. Politicians are the prime example. The way they scam the average non politicially savvy member of the public is absolutely criminal.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 7:09 pm
This is fucking great news!
It means that the sweep stake is still on for December. I reckon that we could get D4J banned again inside ten minutes if DPF plays along. All it will need will be a post about Helen Clarke or Peter Daivs and the idiot will go back into melt down mode.
For those who missed it last time I can only say you really missed something very special.
BTW..I bags eight minutes and 30 seconds in the sweep stake.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 7:17 pm
“Adam Internet is a South Australian ISP and YourVet.co.nz is based in Rangiora”
A David Brindley posted this on the Adelaide Now site last year -
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/big-aftershock-hits-christchurch/story-e6frea8l-1226074209723
The same sort of anti-religious malevolence typical of Borker/MNIJ/Mutton. I’m prepared to call it, it’s him.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 7:49 pm
I agree. The short, punchy sentence structure is also the same, as are the words “nutters”, “wackos” and “rabbtiing on”. The only question is whether that is also a fake name – company registration legality aside?
Should be fun when he next turns up in a new incarnation here. I don’t think he can stay away, all that hate has to be channeled somewhere external.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 8:15 pm
If I were DPF I would not have been so quick to rescind the ban. D4J is a well practiced liar, it would not surprise me at all if the original post on Cam’s blog did indeed come from him.
[DPF: No, his IP address has always been with the same ISP]
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 8:25 pm
Quiet, like in a cricket match, ssshhhhhhhh. The tension.
Well the baited hook has been set by Big Blouse, just waiting for a strike from Dad. Will we see it tonight? or will Dad go in to bat tomorrow? Dad will wait for a wide, and some more sledging
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 8:40 pm
Big Bruv is a prize prat, D4J cannot respond to his trash so he spews his crap all over this thread demonstrating both an unpleasant nature and cowardice.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 8:53 pm
What Andrei said; the only thing worse than an ungracious loser is an ungracious winner.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 8:57 pm
big blouse and borker/brindley/mutton have the anti religion thing in common , do they bat for the same team?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 9:15 pm
Sterling work eisenhower !
Additionally, a cursory perusal thru Facebook finds this character here:
http://www.facebook.com/DJBrindley/info
Note the comment on religion “If all god’s children are equal, why is Jesus so special?” is straight out of the Borker/LRO/MNIJ catalogue.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 9:20 pm
Fuck apologising to D4J, ban him and Mutton for any crime real or imagined wankers both
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 9:24 pm
and they both appear to be from Christchurch WTF is the matter with that place?
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 9:40 pm
How quickly we forget the damage done over 30 or more years by the SS as D4J would call them…..Shot the messenger when he oversteps the mark but not the message.
Vote:October 3rd, 2012 at 10:11 pm
“Will we see it tonight? or will Dad go in to bat tomorrow? Dad will wait for a wide, and some more sledging”
Neither- they will send in Pete George, the nightwatchman, who will inoffensively pad every delivery off until the close of play..
Vote:October 4th, 2012 at 6:37 am
Oh this is great!
The religious fundies Andrei, Keeping Stock and Kowtow side with the Misogynist Bigot D4J simply because he believes in the sky fairy.
I guess this just shows once again how evil religion is.
Vote:October 4th, 2012 at 7:18 am
I’m with Andrei and KS on this big bruv. I’ve got no time for D4J but your accusation, despite clear evidence to the contrary, was crappy.
Hasn’t D4J accused you of harassing him by email in the past? Which I think you have denied. What if someone else was using your indentity to attack him, to stir up both of you?
Vote:October 4th, 2012 at 7:23 am
Pete
D4J is a liar, it is as simple as that.
The man is simply obsessed with chasing me around the internet, I can make a comment at another blog about something totally unrelated and the moron will jump on and start abusing me. The guy is a complete and utter nutbar and one who has serious anger issues.
Vote:October 4th, 2012 at 12:24 pm
Bigot Bruv is one of the worst and most cowardly examples of internet scrum out there.
David Farrar should rescind D4J’s ban on the grounds that he was deliberately provoked by this coward, who has admitted above that he comes here to cause trouble rather than to discuss issues.
How does such a POS avoid censure when he is so clearly intent on thread disruption?
Bigot Bruv is obviously the one more in need of a life ban than D4J.
Vote:October 4th, 2012 at 12:28 pm
Coming from Wedbaiter, this is comedy gold!
Look in the mirror, Wed Wussell, and tell me what you see.
Vote:October 4th, 2012 at 12:38 pm
I see somebody with better things to do than be concerned with worthless lowlife stalking scum like you.
How you bring Kiwiblog down.
Vote:October 4th, 2012 at 12:45 pm
Whereas you want to unzip David Farrar’s commie fly and see what flops out?
But tell me more about how I bring Kiwiblog down…
(I’ve taken screenshots lest you decide to delete that page and pretend this sorry homoerotic episode never happened
)
Vote: