General Debate 13 June 2014

June 13th, 2014 at 8:00 am by Kokila Patel
Tags:

207 Responses to “General Debate 13 June 2014”

  1. mister nui (1,020 comments) says:

    WTF. TVNZ have sent that pre-pubescent wet-behind-the-ears little twerp Jack Tame to Brasil to cover the world cup.

    FFS, couldn’t they have found someone a bit more worldly.

    Popular. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 21 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  2. duggledog (1,505 comments) says:

    Not being facetious but if the National Party can arse hole Brian Neason out of Helensville to make way for JK, after he’d been there for something like 20 years, why do some think it’s impossible to make a concession for Conservative Craig?

    I know, different party, but I don’t see why not

    Vote: Thumb up 18 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  3. Viking2 (11,368 comments) says:

    Friday the 13th and a full moon.

    All the nutbars will be out tonight.

    Howling at the moon.

    http://www.howlatthemoon.com/dueling_piano_bar/full-moon-party/
    Of course some of them spend all day here.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  4. Viking2 (11,368 comments) says:

    duggledog (1,219 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 8:03 am

    Not being facetious but if the National Party can arse hole Brian Neason out of Helensville to make way for JK, after he’d been there for something like 20 years, why do some think it’s impossible to make a concession for Conservative Craig?

    I know, different party, but I don’t see why it’s impossible…

    =======================
    Its different when Labour lite do it.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  5. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    I wonder how many “kiwis” are involved in the march on Baghdad?

    Obummer has a real dilemma on his hands.These nutters are his allies in Syria but his enemy in Iraq.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  6. duggledog (1,505 comments) says:

    Mister nui – why Jack Tame?

    because management positions in television broadcasting and production are invariably held by middle aged women

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  7. jp_1983 (204 comments) says:

    Jack Tame is a progressive remember –
    Its all about the rich taking away from the poor.

    ———
    Just like when Toni Street got the 2008 Olympic Job instead of Veitch

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  8. Keeping Stock (10,267 comments) says:

    There have been some interesting debates at my place this week as the Green candidate for Invercargill defends the NZEI over its refusal to engage with the Government on something that might just benefit students. So it’s going to interesting to see how he responds to this post, in which a young disabled man recounts his experiences with the school system…

    http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2014/06/comment-of-day-13-june-2014.html

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  9. duggledog (1,505 comments) says:

    V2 I’d like a better answer please :)

    Nice morning but I’ll be getting the fire going tonight…

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  10. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    Are you concerned about the level of immigration in New Zealand? If so, what are your concerns?

    Yes (82%)
    No (18%)
    http://www.nzcpr.com/

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  11. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Mark my words. If CCCP poll over 2.5% Murry McCully will roll over and gift East Coast Bays to Craig. If National’s Dark Knight isn’t prepared to sacrifice his seat for the salvation of the country, he should be compelled to take up a diplomatic posting in Outer Mongolia.

    Vote: Thumb up 15 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  12. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    Thanks to green regulations, many of Britains power plants have been closed. So now the Govt may be forced to enact “energy rationing” ala WW2, and force businesses to shut down at various times of day.

    The UK government will today set out Second World War-style measures to keep the lights on and avert power cuts as a “last resort”. The price to Britons will be high, however.

    Factories will be asked to “voluntarily” shut down to save energy at peak times for homes, while others will be paid to provide their own backup power should they have a spare generator or two lying around. And as part of the government’s wider energy market reforms, electricity producers will be able to name their price for bringing mothballed fossil-fuel-powered plants back on line.

    The problem is that the energy plants were closed due to compliance with EU environmental regulations, but the UK has failed to build adequate replacements. This means the country can barely cope with peak winter demand. Successive governments have chosen to build expensive, unreliable renewables instead – which can’t meet the nation’s peak energy needs.

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/06/10/uk_preps_ww2style_energy_rationing/

    Will these liberals never learn?

    Vote: Thumb up 17 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  13. david (2,552 comments) says:

    Several people have raised the legitimacy of the “war room” set up in Labour’s parliamentary office and the accompanying position of Cunnliffe’s “Chief of Staff” Matt McCarten.

    Has the Speaker, at any stage, passed comment on this apparent rort and visible breach of Parliament’s rules about use/misuse of party funding? Surely someone has posed this as a formal question to the Speaker which requires an answer.

    Recent Press reports (written by journalists, trained and skilled) indicate that they are fully aware of the activities in the War Room and its inhabitants. Has the Taxpayer’s Union got an opinion on this?

    If ever there was the need for a magnifying glass to be held over a piece of electoral fraud, this is it.

    Vote: Thumb up 19 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  14. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    http://www.salon.com/2014/06/09/the_catholic_irish_babies_scandal_it_gets_much_worse/

    What Ireland is only now beginning to fully investigate and understand is a story involving potentially thousands of children who were almost certainly neglected and mistreated, and whose deaths were addressed as a mere trash disposal issue. It is now believed a total of upward of 4,000 children were similarly disposed of in other homes across the country. It’s a story of untold even higher numbers of children who were unwitting subjects in a vaccine test that further refused to see them as human beings, capable of fear and pain. And an interesting insight into why so many children may have been so casually treated and tossed away was revealed in a recent feature on the scandal in the Independent. Babies born to unwed mothers – and this, let it be noted, would have included mothers who were raped – “were denied baptism and, if they died from the illness and disease rife in such facilities, also denied a Christian burial.” In other words, the Catholic institutions that these women and their children were forced to turn to as their only refuge viciously turned their backs on them — treating them, quite literally, as garbage. This is abuse of the highest order. Abuse in life, abuse in death. Carried out by religious orders so warped, so perverted in their utter lack of mercy that they participated in the suffering of an unfathomable number of babies and children. This is what the Catholic Church of Ireland is capable of, when it is given free rein over the bodies of its most vulnerable members. And an official inquiry hasn’t even begun. As Michael Dwyer told the Mail this weekend, “What I have found is just the tip of a very large and submerged iceberg.”

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  15. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    Looks like the Jihadists have captured Tikrit now.

    Megan Kelly report on Iraq, with General Jack Keane (Fmr Vice Cheif of Staff, Army), who warned that this would happen if U.S troops were withdrawn.

    http://video.foxnews.com/v/3618304357001

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  16. Keeping Stock (10,267 comments) says:

    @ hj (8.12am) – I would have voted “yes” in that poll too. I would like to see more immigration, and I am concerned that the level of immigration isn’t high enough :D

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  17. Than (450 comments) says:

    duggledog;

    It’s certainly not impossible. But McCully has indicated he would like to keep the seat, and National wouldn’tt want a fight that spilled out in public, so if there is to be a deal it would have to start with placating McCully somehow. Either a winnable list place and good ministerial roles, or a good job offer for him to retire from politics.

    But getting McCully to agree is only a small part of the calculation Key will have to make regarding the Conservatives. The bigger part is whether making an arrangement with the Conservatives will help or hinder National’s chances of re-election. Which group is larger – those who will vote Conservative even if they are not going to get into parliament, or those center voters National would lose from making the arrangement?

    I’m in the later group (I will not vote for National if they make an arrangement with the Conservatives), so that biases my view. But the poll numbers don’t look good for Colin Craig. The Conservatives got 2.7% last election, and have polled 1-2% ever since. People don’t like wasting their vote, so if the Conservatives don’t get a deal I’d be surprised if they get over 2% in the election. If making an arrangement with the Conservatives cost National even a 0.5-1% swing (so a corresponding 0.5-1% gain to Labour) they’d be worse off for it.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  18. Harriet (4,794 comments) says:

    Dead Ernest #

    “…………Mark my words. If CCCP poll over 2.5% Murry McCully will roll over and gift East Coast Bays to Craig. If National’s Dark Knight isn’t prepared to sacrifice his seat for the salvation of the country, he should be compelled to take up a diplomatic posting in Outer Mongolia……….”

    Exactly. This was posted last night.

    “…………..kiwitory (4 comments) says:
    June 12th, 2014 at 1:56 pm

    Here here Colin Craig excellent addition to the Government; I was smacked as a child and I smacked my children and there is nothing wrong with them.

    Fortunately those marxist lefties are not intelligent enough to understand tactical voting or otherwise Mr Key may have a problem.

    If Labour / Green supporters voted National in the seats where National has come to an accommodation with the Conservative and Act we could actually end up with a National candidate winning the seat; what a disaster that would be!….”

    Key will watch the polls…….and gamble a maxist future against going alone.

    But to do that he has to do exactly like Keating said “Carry the people with you” – and that’s quite telling – as the longer he leaves it that he supports the Conservatives – tells us the direction he wants to take the country in; with Abbott, Harper & Cameron — or with Hillary —-and her village —- Hulun’s current place of work!

    By leaving the option of playing it safe by giving the seats to the Conservatives – the more he looks like a Marxist! :cool:

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  19. Other_Andy (2,576 comments) says:

    Iraq……
    One of Obama’s government’s great achievements.
    According to the towering intellect of our time, Uncle Joe Biden.

    [youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLteUGkvpOc?feature=player_detailpage&w=640&h=360

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  20. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    Griff @8.32, what a load of sensationalist clap-trap.
    If it weren’t for homes like this, these children and orphans would have had nowhere to go at all. I’m not saying that some of these places weren’t harsh – it sounds like they were, but mush of this mistreatment stuff has been debunked – the Magdalene laundries (where women who were there say they were NEVER mistreated, and never saw anyone else being mistreated), to the Tuam “pits” to Letterfrack.

    http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/article/the-tuam-tank-another-myth-about-evil-ireland/15140

    Laters – must dash off to work.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  21. Chuck Bird (4,835 comments) says:

    Than, so who would you vote for if not National?

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  22. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    david – I asked the Speaker about it and got a response:

    Thank you for your email. I can confirm that the relocation of Labour’s parliamentary staff into a large open plan office aligns with the functions that these parliamentary staff members perform in support the Labour Leaders Office. I am assured it is not related to election activities which you rightly point out should be kept separate.

    Thank you for writing to me on this matter.

    Yours sincerely

    Rt Hon David Carter
    Speaker of the House of Representatives

    That seems clear, so it’s odd that media open talk about an election campaign ‘war room’.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  23. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    Wasn;t peak oil seen off?

    The inevitable demise of the fossil fuel empire
    Rocketing production costs, proliferating write-downs, stranded assets pave the way for renewable renaissance
    http://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2014/jun/10/inevitable-demise-fossil-fuel-empire

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  24. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    Beautiful day. A bit of humour to make it better.
    Sir Les Patterson ( Barry Humphries) interviewed by Michael Parkinson 1982
    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nULFMp4jKBo

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  25. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Than, If you don’t vote National, will you vote for one of the component parts of a Labour, Green, NZF, Mana Dotcom government then?
    The point I am making is, even if people don’t like a CCCP deal, they will hold there nose and vote National, than risk contributing to the total asphyxiation of a nation that the alternative promises to be.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  26. Than (450 comments) says:

    Chuck Bird, that’s an excellent question which I don’t know the answer to yet. The Civilian Party or simply not voting are the most likely answers.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  27. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    There’s been a number of comments at Whale Oil from potential National voters who wouldn’t vote for them if they pull McCully and try to gift East Coast Bays to Craig. It would be a risky move for National. It would take away from them some useful campaign ammunition that would instead be fired at them.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  28. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    One thing about being brave enough to say you support Colin Craig and the Conservative Party, it shows you’re not suffering from the morbid communist pathology that afflicts most NZers.

    In particular the many National sycophants who comment at Whaleoil and Kiwiblog.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 15 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  29. Ryan Sproull (7,095 comments) says:

    Megan Kelly report on Iraq, with General Jack Keane (Fmr Vice Cheif of Staff, Army), who warned that this would happen if U.S troops were withdrawn.

    You can go a few years further back and check out all the people who warned that this would happen if the US illegally invaded Iraq.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  30. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    re Peak Oil: we’re due for the Big One on the Alpine Fault. Just because it hasn’t happened doesn’t mean it isn’t going to.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  31. Other_Andy (2,576 comments) says:

    hj says:

    Wasn;t peak oil seen off?
    The inevitable demise of the fossil fuel empire
    Rocketing production costs, proliferating write-downs, stranded assets pave the way for renewable renaissance

    That’s what you get when you read the Gruniad.
    The Gruniad has been warning us about peak oil for the last 40 years.

    Then on July 2, 2012 they published this….
    We were wrong on peak oil. There’s enough to fry us all .
    George Monbiot: A boom in oil production has made a mockery of our predictions. Good news for capitalists – but a disaster for humanity.

    The Gruniad…..

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  32. david (2,552 comments) says:

    Pete George @ 8:50am

    Thanks for that.

    Someone is telling porkies then.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  33. EAD (950 comments) says:

    John “rapidly emerging multiculturalism in New Zealand” Key should read this article by James Delingpole about why Western Culture is the best and why the vast majority of the population who whilst opening with wide arms immigrants who add to this lucky country, don’t want to see it’s Western roots and pillars changed and diluted by backwards cultures (particularly from a certain religion) and lose what we have got. It is HIGHLY worth a read:

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/06/12/Look-it-really-is-very-simple-Western-culture-IS-the-best

    The Western Culture of course that we so highly value and which enables us to live the relatively free & independent life that we do is eloquently described by Delingpole as being:

    “based on the wisdom of the ancients, combined with Judaeo-Christian morality, filtered through the empiricism of the Enlightenment. Fundamental values include: property rights; religious tolerance; habeas corpus; universal suffrage; equality under the law; love thy neighbour as thyself; free-ish markets”

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  34. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    Jack Tame got the job at TVNZ because he has an invisible knapsack of white privelege (and because he’s good looking – another knapsack advantage).

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  35. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    EAD ironically quotes “religious tolerance;” while commenting “don’t want to see it’s Western roots and pillars changed and diluted by backwards cultures (particularly from a certain religion)”.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  36. Than (450 comments) says:

    Dead Earnest, that may be true for most economically right wing but socially liberal voters. But the group I’m talking about are swing-voters in the center, people who don’t see a Labour (or even a Labour-Green) government as a particularly bad outcome.

    Elections are won and lost in the center, and right now National firmly holds this ground. An arrangement with the Conservatives risks ceding some of this back to Labour.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  37. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    @ EAD
    I’m not so sure Western culture is the issue. Could we have Islamic culture on Friday and Saturday nights please?
    I watched this TED talk on China last night. The Chinese have a very strong culture and identity. 90% see them selves as Han (the other ethnicites are around the fringes. They see the state as the patriarch, like the head of the family. We are going hell bent to destroy our national identity – a Marxist goal. I think countries with a strong national identity wouldn’t tolerate the sort of behaviour we saw in Henderson (us attacking them)?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  38. Nigel Kearney (971 comments) says:

    Fundamental values include: property rights; religious tolerance; habeas corpus; universal suffrage; equality under the law; love thy neighbour as thyself; free-ish markets

    The fact that another culture has values inferior to ours doesn’t tell us much about the values of people specifically choosing to leave such a culture and come here. On average, I would expect that someone who stepped off a plane from China yesterday is more likely to support the values you listed than someone whose grandparents were born here.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  39. Ed Snack (1,838 comments) says:

    So supporting Saddam Hussein’s rule over Iraq now Ryan ? Or perhaps if you make a commitment to “regime change” perhaps one should follow through with it and not just cut and run. But no doubt we can once again recognize how effective the new “smart diplomacy” as practiced by the current administration, has been. It was all Bush’s fault in the first place wasn’t it ?

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  40. OneTrack (2,981 comments) says:

    Than – “Chuck Bird, that’s an excellent question which I don’t know the answer to yet. The Civilian Party or simply not voting are the most likely answers.”

    That will no doubt help you feel warm inside when the Green/Labour/ManaNet/Winston taniwha takes power. A protest vote or not voting is an enabler for the hard-socialist nightmare.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  41. EAD (950 comments) says:

    Hang on a minute there Pete, I said that we need to discriminate against backwards cultures…backwards cultures that happen to have their belief system rooted from a certain religion that promotes women as 3rd rate citizens, non-believers as “Kaffirs” and believes that Gay should be stoned.

    Perhaps if I called it an ideology rather than a religion then perhaps I would satisfy the oracle of NZ political blogs “Pete George”

    @hj – no – Western culture is what has to be defended.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  42. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Possibly Than, but most in the centre would be more far moe afraid of a Hone-Dotcom-Minto-Norman-Peters-Cunliffe trainwreck than Colin Craig cutting a deal with Key to cross question Neil Armstrong in return for confidence and supply!

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  43. Than (450 comments) says:

    Chuck Bird; I regard a hard-socialist nightmare that might last 3 years at most as better than a conservative nightmare getting into parliament indefinitely.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  44. Chuck Bird (4,835 comments) says:

    Than, there are also many of thousands of voters who will not vote National because of their liberal stance on issues like smacking and the redefinition of marriage.

    BTW, what have you got against the Conservatives? Unlike the liberals they do not what to force their views on the majority. Their policy is for moral issues normally decided by a conscience vote to be decided by referenda.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  45. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “On average, I would expect that someone who stepped off a plane from China yesterday is more likely to support the values you listed than someone whose grandparents were born here.”

    That’s nuts. They could quite easily be a committed communist with deep attachment to the ideas of Chairman Mao. (If you’d said Taiwan I’d be more ready to accept it.)

    Chinese communists are by intent infiltrating Pacific nations and who is to guarantee that they have no plan to eventually dominate local culture?

    With the Bolshevik white ants we have here in NZ already we don’t need any more from Maoist China.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  46. minus (174 comments) says:

    Mike Treen exonerates Kim Dotcom of all wrong doing, but observes –

    He wants to take his revenge on this government. This is perfectly understandable. He has every reason to do so. In fact, given his treatment, he has more reasons than most. The most effective way for that to happen is for this government to be defeated in the coming election. The Mana-Internet party alliance is the best way to make that happen. He was smart enough to see that.
    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2014/06/12/why-the-mana-internet-alliance-is-a-potential-game-breaker/

    So Dotcom is in it only for revenge.
    And Key’s crime appears to be the claim that he hadn’t heard of Dotcom, until the raid on Coatsville was about to happen.
    So whether a Labour-lead Government is best for New Zealand or not, fuck us all meantime, one man would like to destroy New Zealand’s current Government to satisfy some personal slight.
    That’s democracy? Vote for Laila Harré? Or Internet / MANA?
    [ _________] no ! insert whatever expletive you feel fits

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  47. OneTrack (2,981 comments) says:

    Than – “But the group I’m talking about are swing-voters in the center, people who don’t see a Labour (2014) (or even a Labour-Green) government as a particularly bad outcome. ”

    You mean the people who answer yes to polls as to whether NZ is heading in the right direction ( 62%? on the last poll ), and will in the same poll then indicate they are voting for a change of government. Those people?

    If the worst happens, then the buyers remorse will be deafening after about 6 months – “Wah, I didn’t think that would happen…..”

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  48. Chuck Bird (4,835 comments) says:

    Than, it looks like our comments crossed. Which party would you be most concerned about getting into Parliament – the Conservatives or NZF. If the voters felt that the Conservatives would likely get ECB they may vote for them rather than NZF.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  49. Chthoniid (2,035 comments) says:

    @Dead Earnest

    Mark my words. If CCCP poll over 2.5% Murry McCully will roll over and gift East Coast Bays to Craig. If National’s Dark Knight isn’t prepared to sacrifice his seat for the salvation of the country, he should be compelled to take up a diplomatic posting in Outer Mongolia.

    Let me assure you, that as an ECB voter, I intend voting for McCully.
    I will in no conceivable circumstances vote for Craig and the CCCP. I would also baulk at giving the Nats my party vote if they attempted this sacrifice-gambit.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  50. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    Islamic culture?

    The biggest sporting event in the world started today with three doves released in the stadium.

    Where does that imagery come from? Peace and hope,from the Old Testament.

    As opposed to prisoners being executed under the black banner with it’s Koranic verse.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2655977/ISIS-militants-march-Baghdad-trademark-bullet-head-gets-way-control-north.html

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  51. OneTrack (2,981 comments) says:

    Than – “I regard a hard-socialist nightmare that might last 3 years at most as better than a conservative nightmare getting into parliament indefinitely.”

    Which is more likely – that John Key can keep Colin Craig and his “team” under control, or that David Cunliffe (brain the size of a planet) can keep the Greens ( Russel and Metiria), Winston, Hone, Laila, DotCom and the flakes in his own party under control.

    I don’t see your conservative nightmare coming out of a party which has 2.5% of the vote, especially when most of his policies appear to align with old National. I do see a socialist/communist nightmare coming out of mish-mash of hard left wingers pushing for their new world order, with none of them having any likelihood of control of the other parts. Metiria, Russel and Laila would just run over David Cunliffe for a start.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  52. Than (450 comments) says:

    Chuck Bird:

    My apologies, I directed a reply to OneTrack’s comment to your name. As to which I’d be more concerned about, the Conservatives without a doubt.

    I have zero respect for Winston Peters and NZF is nothing but his vanity project. But at the end of the day they are harmless. Winston’s support can be bought for a fancy title, a few million for lollies to scatter for his supporters (various expansions for the GoldCard), and not making changes to super which National didn’t plan on anyway. There is also the fact that NZF are already in parliament. That horse has bolted. The Conservatives aren’t, and if they don’t get in this time I suspect they never will.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  53. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    “Yet in the West, this self-hatred and cultural embarrassment are considered by our left-leaning intellectual class a sign of sensitivity and sophistication.”

    http://makingitinakl.blogspot.co.nz/2012/12/the-brilliance-of-doubt-meet-steve.html

    http://www.tasa.org.au/conferences/conferencepapers07/papers/29.pdf

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  54. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Dead Earnest (33 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 9:38 am

    I disagree. Craig sounds more like a nutbar on a good day, than Winston Peters does on a bad day, or when he’s on the turps ( and that’s pretty bad).

    Colin Craig appears to be someone that is offering to fix all the popular policies that people have disagreed with over the years, but fails to offer anything substantial on how he would actually run the country. It’s all very well allowing to parents to smack their children again, but what will he do about the number of child abuse cases that frequent our communities?

    Promising to cancel an unpopular policy is one thing – and I’m sure ‘Bob the Building Craig’ is up to doing that – I’m just not sure he knows what to do after he’s pushed the cancel button – on every aspect of governance.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 16 You need to be logged in to vote
  55. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “I will in no conceivable circumstances vote for Craig and the CCCP. I would also baulk at giving the Nats my party vote if they attempted this sacrifice-gambit.”

    Good.

    Fuck off and vote for Labour then.

    Its your support of National anyway that has over the years taken them far from what they stand for and slowly shaped them into a virtual Labour party sub-group.

    Vote: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  56. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    Fundamental values include: property rights; religious tolerance; habeas corpus; universal suffrage; equality under the law; love thy neighbour as thyself; free-ish markets

    “property rights” Did anyone say land monopolists: the current property investor crowd who have built large property portfolios? Riding asset inflation and (currently) pushing immigration to keep prices high?

    Tonight, a pumped de Roos tells his audience that he wants people to invest in property and write to him 12 months down the track and tell him they’ve “made one million or three million, or you’ve got 16 properties, or we’re taking six months off because our cash flow now exceeds our outflow!” He says, “I don’t know any other activity where the rewards are so huge. If you want to invest a million dollars in the sharemarket, you need a million dollars. If you want to invest a million in real estate, you only need $100,000.”

    You can buy one property, get it revalued, use the equity to buy another property and then buy another and another. “And you do it all with OPM. Other people’s money. OPM. It’s like being high on drugs!” What’s more, the wonder of depreciation claims on the building and contents means “the government subsidises your investment! It’s delightful!”

    and don’t tell me it didn’t work – it’s all been written about..

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  57. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ OneTrack (2,316 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 9:54 am

    But it wouldn’t just be Key and Craig, would it. Just like you point out the melting pot of the left, the right (National) would also need a similar cauldron in order to rule. It is likely to be Key, Craig, Dunne, Act?, and whoever from the Maori Party.

    I’ll wager my best silk knickers that our next government, whoever it is, will be the biggest conglomeration of misfits ever witnessed before in this country – and they’ll do such a bad job that the electorate will be begging someone to abolish MMP before the following election. Whoever wins that election will have one hell of a mess to clean up.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  58. Ross12 (1,388 comments) says:

    Fletch & Other_Andy

    http://seekingalpha.com/article/2264063-the-bakken-gets-bigger-likely-a-lot-bigger

    Can you see a Tui billboard going up for hj and his mates ?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  59. SPC (5,563 comments) says:

    So Bush launched a regime change in Iraq that required a continuing US military presence to secure. Yet the continuing presence was not affordable and the deficits and debts piled up.

    No succeeding POTUS could make this work, just leaving them to get blamed for the consequences of the Bush PNAC programme.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  60. flipper (3,950 comments) says:

    It would a very good day when idiots with a fetish for immigration TAKE A HIKE.
    Senseless harping over migration patterns, and demonstrating a control mentality in respect of planning do nothing to enhance KB’s GHD.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  61. flipper (3,950 comments) says:

    Jabba the Dot…

    I guess we have all been a bit slow in failing to properly identify and name the alien presence.
    The resemblance is so great that I cannot understand how we missed it.
    But perhaps it was the ceremonial chaining of Laila of squeaky voice to Jabba that made us realise our error.
    :-)

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  62. All_on_Red (1,559 comments) says:

    SPC
    True, but Iraq does now have the money from oil which they could have used to reimburse the US for security.
    The US always makes this mistake and leaves too early. To be frank they probably needed to stay 20 years or more to try to achieve a generational change. It’s the classic , put policemen ( or troops) in every suburb to live, is what gives the locals confidence and security. Once they leave it’s easy for terror to take hold.
    Judith made a comment the other day about how in her youth the local cop out in Henderson always being around and keeping all the young tearaways in line. It works. Different scale of course but same philosophy

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  63. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    So do I take it Chthoniid that you would be prepared to risk a Hone, Minto, Dotcom, Norman, Peters, Cunliffe government, than put aside your distaste for Craig? I doubt it

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  64. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    The impression I get is that (for obvious reasons) Conservative supporters want National to gift Craig an electorate, but voters inclined towards National are much less likely to back a jack-up.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  65. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    I wondered if the letter read on morning report was worth a complaint ? On Radio NZ they don’t usually read an email “(blah blah) “an idiot like Colin Craig”? I’ve never heard “an idiot (anyone) read in an email.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  66. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    An enterprising attempt by ex-Mana candidate Clinton Dearlove to conjure up support for three MPs for Te Tai Tokerau by voting him for the electorate with Kelvin Davis and Hone Harawira getting in via their lists.

    Unless supported by Harawira in particular (is it another cunning plan?) it has little chance of success as intended. It is more likely to split the electorate vote and then anything could happen.

    Three MPs for Te Tai Tokerau?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  67. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    Dead Earnest (34 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 10:27 am
    So do I take it Chthoniid that you would be prepared to risk a Hone, Minto, Dotcom, Norman, Peters, Cunliffe government, than put aside your distaste for Craig? I doubt it

    Nothing like a bit of scare mongering or outright lies to start the day huh?

    1. Dotcom cannot be in government.
    2. It is highly unlikely that Minto would be in government as it means the IP party would need to win more than three seats in order for that to happen.

    How about you put aside your distastes and start adopting some reality instead?
    The type of Government you describe is not a risk, it would be a bloody miracle to achieve considering all that would have to happen in order for it to eventuate.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  68. Chthoniid (2,035 comments) says:

    @Dead Earnest

    I don’t buy the scenario that Craig is the white knight that will rescue the National government. And I find his party completely unpalatable as a voting option. So yes, I’d take that risk.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  69. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    Apart from being wrong about Dotcom “Hone, Minto, Dotcom, Norman, Peters, Cunliffe government, than put aside your distaste for Craig?” doesn’t detail who might get in with Craig. The Conservative list should be taken into account if you want to make comparisons.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  70. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    @ Ross12.
    I’ve been a believer in peak oil and I expected we would all be aware of an event of one degree or another. The bump wasn’t felt but I think we are aware we have gone off the tar seal and are now on gravel?

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  71. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    It would be bad enough if an election was decided on voters choosing the least worst large party to run Government, but it could become farcical if it’s decided by voting for the least worst fringe parties.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  72. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Chaos in the lovely world of the followers of the religion of peace. Those shitholes continue to burn.
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/iraq-crisis-islamist-militants-warn-battle-will-rage-after-seizing-mosul-and-tikrit-9530899.html

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  73. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    Cameron Slater:

    The National Party are going to make a huge mistake entertaining a Colin Craig deal. This isn’t about cups of tea. The man would never be selected as a National Party candidate on his talents alone. He is just completely unsuitable for the job.

    Now, I realise a fair proportion of my readers are a fan of a more right leaning National, and they see the Conservative Party as a vehicle to pull National to the right. In fact, National can even “donate” some of its policies and pretend they are less right than they want to be, yet still get it done.

    All of this looks great on paper – until you meet and have to work with Colin Craig. He’s just the wrong guy. Let’s see how desperate, pragmatic or principled National are.

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/06/cup-tea-needed-act-gifted-epsom/

    National’s internal polling will have to be quite compelling to go against what seems to be strong opposition to an electorate accommodation with Craig.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  74. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    “Pete George (22,210 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 10:28 am
    The impression I get is that (for obvious reasons) Conservative supporters want National to gift Craig an electorate, but voters inclined towards National are much less likely to back a jack-up.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0″

    Like the cuppa for Epsom?

    All tea is equal but some tea is more equal than others.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  75. Viking2 (11,368 comments) says:

    duggledog (1,221 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 8:12 am

    V2 I’d like a better answer please :)

    Nice morning but I’ll be getting the fire going tonight…
    =====================
    well how about;
    Don’t do what I do, do as I say.

    Nice day here too. As you say a fire tonight.

    Oh and watch out for the werewolves.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  76. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Most atheists are so hung up on their beliefs that when it came to voting for any party they thought had even the remotest connection to Christianity, they’d prefer to vote Labour.

    That’s why they’re worthless in the fight to restore civility in our community and respect for our heritage.

    We won’t make progress in defeating the left until obsessive atheists, dividing and weakening our defence, are out of the way. They must be recognised as part of the problem and forced to accept their real allegiance is to Progressivism.

    Let them go to Labour and divide and weaken that side of the political spectrum.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  77. J Bloggs (226 comments) says:

    “All tea is equal but some tea is more equal than others.”

    Amen for that!!! (can’t stand Earl Grey)

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  78. Alan (1,087 comments) says:

    If National do want to give NZCP a seat, then surely the best one is Helensville?

    Key can go on the list at number 1, frankly I’m sure being a electorate MP is a chore he could do without as he’s far too busy running the country.

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  79. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    Slater says “The man would never be selected as a National Party candidate on his talents alone.”

    Really? What short memories we have when it comes to slagging off Colin Craig.

    Aaron Gilmore springs to mind.A talent for rudeness seemed to be his strong suit.

    Vote: Thumb up 14 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  80. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Your call Chthoniid, Its a democracy after all.
    Judith Dotcom may not be in government, but as the left always tells us “money talks”.
    Minto hopefully won’t make it either, but he’s been waiting along time to practice a bit of old fashion marxism, so I guess Hone and Harre, well be happy to oblige!

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  81. Chuck Bird (4,835 comments) says:

    National in 2017 will definitely need a coalition partner that can bring in extra MPs. There is little chance that either ACT of UF can bring in more than one. The Maori Party will be lucky to have more than one MP.

    National needs an excuse to have a binding referendum on the retention of the Maori seats. If the Maori Party gets one or no seats they may support the referendum if the threshold was dropped to 4% and coat tailing stopped. That would mean the Maori Party would likely get in next time with 4 or 5 MPs and Home would be history.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  82. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Cameron Slater is John key’s mouthpiece.

    They both represent the Progressive faction of the National Party.

    John Key is using Slater as a willing partner in his objective to turn the National Party away from its Conservative founding principles.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 14 Thumb down 13 You need to be logged in to vote
  83. hj (6,855 comments) says:

    @ Other Andy

    We were wrong on peak oil. There’s enough to fry us all .
    George Monbiot: A boom in oil production has made a mockery of our predictions. Good news for capitalists – but a disaster for humanity.
    ….
    what Mombiot refers to is not the same thing. He’s saying that there is lots of oil to continue the upward trend in greenhouse gases. He isn’t addressing efficiency (EROEI) and the subsequent effect on industrial society. The bottom line is if it becomes too expensive to recover and the oil companies aren’t making a profit. That would imply a percentage of those goods and services the oil is used for are no longer worth it? A market economy functions like an eco-sytem and in that case it has found it’s limiting factor.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  84. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    If you want national to lean right it is the ACT party you need to support with your party vote
    NOT a christian conservative fruitcakes vanity project.
    Now Banks has gone act has no longer got the taint of Christian Authoritarianism and lingering stench of conservative cronyism.

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  85. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Pete George (22,211 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 10:47 am

    Now there’s a first, for once I agree with Slater.

    Colin Craig is just simply ‘wrong’. To try and incorporate him into a National coalition government would simply make it unstable, especially if you also need Maori in the mix as well. The cost of having both sitting at the same table as National would be horrendous, and eventually lead to indigestion and tears.

    For Key to back away from his previous stance on things like anti-smacking etc, would weaken his image and make him appear flakey, as would the deals he would have to make with Maori to get them there as well considering Maori opposition to their lack of improvement despite supporting the last two National governments.

    Better to have Key governing alone, than to have Craig in the mix – IMO (and considering how I don’t like Key, that’s saying something).

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  86. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Manolo, KB is a most useful place to vent your bile and spleen but as a contributor to understanding the world we live in ( no matter how vile it appears ) you might as well confine your posts to say Aryan Nation or Stormfront or whats the Tea Party official website.? You’s be most welcome at either.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 12 You need to be logged in to vote
  87. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “I don’t buy the scenario that Craig is the white knight that will rescue the National government. ”

    This idea exists only in the minds of the completely self deluded.

    Craig is deeply flawed but it doesn’t matter for what is most important is that the combined power of the Labour/National Progressive bloc is weakened.

    The CP is the thin end of the wedge that is needed to eventually lever the big govt high taxing big spending Progressives out of our lives.

    Vote: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  88. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    I’m wondering whether we might not see a minority National government, just supported on confidence by a few tiny parties and negotiating issue by issue on everything else.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  89. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Don’t get me wrong, I am not a great fan of Colin Craig, but if he starts polling over the 2.5% National will have to do some serious thinking. Tough decisions will have to be made, and East Coast Bays is the obvious place for a deal.
    One positive of Craig is in many respects his constituency is also NZF’s. If he can appeal to enough NZF voters to drive NZF below 5% he would finish off Peter’s for good – He’ll need a walking frame by 2017!

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  90. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “You might as well confine your posts to say Aryan Nation or Stormfront or whats the Tea Party official website.?”

    A cowardly smear that is a perfect example of the vile communist pathology I was referring to above. This is neo-Bolshevism where a strategy of collectivist hate is the foremost tactic and if not confronted for the evil it is, will eventually be backed up with violence and bloodshed.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  91. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Dead Earnest (35 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 10:54 am

    Whilst in essence it may appear that way, there are two factors that you need to consider.

    Firstly, if Dotcom is deported, and there is no reason to think he won’t be unless his $5 million bid for information turns anything substantial up – Dotcom will have no influence from offshore, especially with no money.

    Secondly, you are under estimating Hone and Harre. Hone is really stubborn, and doesn’t like anyone telling him what to do. Whilst he might be happy to play along for now – he is not going to take being told what to do by Dotcom well at all. He simply has to be boss – and there isn’t room on the top chair for his ego and Dotcom’s bum.

    Harre is ‘principled’ (in what she believes in) and there is no way she would take action to block Dotcom’s extradition – knowing full well that is what everyone will be watching for. The only way that could/would happen, is if the due process and evidence allows it – and only then it would have to get past the other parties that they are in coalition with. Harre is very aware of claims that she has been bought, and she will, as history has shown, push back to try and demonstrate that is not the case. Dotcom might think he’s bought them – but all he may have bought is a whole lot of trouble for himself.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  92. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Stephie, you a child of progressivism. As such, your enfeebled politically correct approach to everything is repugnant.
    For once, stand for your principles, if you have any, not the namby-pamby crap you usually utter.

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  93. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ mikenmild (9,896 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 11:04 am

    I think that would be disastrous for the country. They would not have sufficient backbone to do what is needed and in short would be held to ransom by the smaller parties and the very different things they want.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  94. Chuck Bird (4,835 comments) says:

    “he would finish off Peter’s for good – He’ll need a walking frame by 2017!”

    Maybe but not NZF if they go with National.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  95. James Stephenson (2,145 comments) says:

    Most atheists are so hung up on their beliefs that when it came to voting for any party they thought had even the remotest connection to Christianity, they’d prefer to vote Labour.

    It’s the economy, stupid. I really don’t give a flying fuck about Craig’s god-botheringness, I just don’t get the “Conservative” brand alongside opposition to asset sales, free trade agreements…

    If you want a “drier” National Party, your only options are to vote for the National Party and cross your fingers, or vote ACT.

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  96. SGA (983 comments) says:

    Redbaiter at 10:51 am

    Most atheists are so hung up on their beliefs that when it came to voting for any party they thought had even the remotest connection to Christianity, they’d prefer to vote Labour.

    or ACT, or National, or Greens, or Civilian :-) .

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  97. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Judith did you say Harre was “principled”?
    I beg to differ.
    The poster girl of leftwing feminism, who accepts the tainted cash of an immensly wealthy racist foreign fraudster who accumulated vast sums of money facilitaing access to degrading images of women.
    Principled you say?

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  98. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    With the 101st otherwise occupied Iran’s Revolutionary Guard have stepped up.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/jun/12/irans-revolutionary-guard-deploys-iraq-stop-sunni-/

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  99. Judith (8,534 comments) says:

    @ Dead Earnest (37 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 11:17 am

    I did put it in inverted commas for that very reason. Being principled is a subjective state. Principles vary from one to another. My principles won’t allow me to feed my dog grains – as I believe our pets should be fed only food they would naturally eat in the wild. My dogs principles are very different. It believes if it can be swallowed, it can be eaten. ;-) We have different principles.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  100. Chuck Bird (4,835 comments) says:

    I just don’t get the “Conservative” brand alongside opposition to asset sales, free trade agreements…

    The Conservatives view on these issues are not important. The same applies to NZF. National would not allow a minor party to dictate on such important policies that affect the economy. The could on an issue such as smacking or the Maori seats especially if the Maori Party gets none or one.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  101. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Redbaiter, Manolo is quite capable I think of answering for himself without your cheap shots.He has and thats great.
    BTW Redbaiter , a repeat question. ? how many visits do you get a day to your blog. ? One, two.??
    But to the Iraq situation.! The tragedy unfolding there, as cha reveals , is Shia and Sunni factionalism at its most bitter.Behind that is the enmity between Sunni Saudi Arabia and some gulf states versus Shia Iran.It is very conceivable that if the US supports the Iraqi government with airstrikes then that would make Assad ( Shia ) very pleased. Iran as well of course.
    I think this underlines the complexity of the situation that would be seriously aggravated by the war mongering Republican and Tea Party bubbleheads.
    Besides how do they propose paying for full scale military intervention .? Tax cuts. ?

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  102. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “It’s the economy, stupid. I really don’t give a flying fuck about Craig’s god-botheringness,”

    Well then you’re obviously not one of the obsessive atheists I was referring to are you? Learn to read you bore.

    BTW, as someone who professes to be concerned with the economy then why are you so committed to National? The cold hard truth is their economic management is little better than Helen Klark’s.

    And the way to a “drier” National is to kick John key and his prog faction out of the Party. With their belief that the Nats should be a “Progressive” party, they obviously should take their ideas and join the Labour Party. Its truly where such ideas belong.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  103. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    What is wrong with voting for the Nat’s if you are not a follower of the sky fairy?

    Given that Bedwetter is so fond of quoting the Nat’s founding principles I thought I had better check them out and see if there was any mention of the sky fairy.

    ““To promote good citizenship and self-reliance; to combat communism and socialism; to maintain freedom of contract; to encourage private enterprise; to safeguard individual rights and the privilege of ownership; to oppose interference by the State in business, and State control of industry”.

    So there you go, no mention of the sky fairy at all. We now know that anybody who does not want to vote for the CCCP and thus align themselves with Chem Trails nutters and those who think the world is only 6000 years old can safely vote for the Nat’s or ACT.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  104. James Stephenson (2,145 comments) says:

    BTW, as someone who professes to be concerned with the economy then why are you so committed to National?

    I’m not, I’ve never given them a party vote. I will be voting ACT, as I would have thought was perfectly clear to someone so keen to recommend reading lessons – by the way, they teach 7 yr olds to do comprehension, James Jnr could assist you if you’re struggling.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  105. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “To promote good citizenship and self-reliance; to combat communism and socialism; to maintain freedom of contract; to encourage private enterprise; to safeguard individual rights and the privilege of ownership; to oppose interference by the State in business, and State control of industry”.

    Dead right.

    Its only obsessive fucked in the head fools like you who make Christianity an issue.

    Vote: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  106. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    @felixmarwick

    PM signals his MPs could accommodate on deal with Conservatives. Any member of caucus will want National to be part of the next Gov’t,

    It depends on what sort of accommodation by National and what compromises on policy by Conservatives.

    @toby_etc

    Keep hearing rumours Murray McCully being lined up for either Washington or UN(SC?) posting. Would suit going list-only..#ECBays #ColinCraig

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  107. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Retreat in Irak: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/06/12/americans-being-evacuated-from-iraqi-air-base/

    Americans were being evacuated Thursday from a major Iraqi air base as Al Qaeda-aligned militants toppled cities in the country’s north and threatened to advance toward Baghdad.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  108. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    NZF is basically Muldoonist -Left wing economic policy married with social conservatism. CCCP aren’t alot different.
    The problem with NZF is that their leader has proved time and time again he would sacrifice the good of the nation to soothe his own ego.
    I would rate potential election results in the following order from best to worse.
    1. National Majority – Great but unlikely.
    2. National/Act/UF Coalition – Could ask the Maori Party in, but don’t need them.
    3. National/Act/ UF/ Conservative Coalition. Still workable but getting unwieldy
    4. National Act/UF/NZF- Only workable if you mke Winston Foreign Minister and keep him out of the country.
    5. National/Act/UF/Maori- If you need the Maori party they’ll ask for the world (and the fish and the radio waves etc)
    6. Labour/Greens/NZF/Maori/Mana/Internet. – Buy your tickets for Oz!

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  109. thedavincimode (6,627 comments) says:

    Could somebody please let the nurse know that he needs to have his pad changed.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  110. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    I wonder it its possible for the Con party to do a purge of its chem trailcCreationist and Moon Hoax , Redbaiter etc factions.?

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  111. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “I will be voting ACT”

    After the way that party has been so fucked over by the “classical liberals” who placed the now discredited electoral liability chameleon Banks as its leader, you might as well throw your ballot paper over Huka falls.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  112. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “Could somebody please let the nurse know that he needs to have his pad changed.”

    Another excellent example of the same vile communist pathology that controls Stephieboy and other bitter and twisted neo Bolsheviks.

    Vote: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  113. dirty harry (446 comments) says:

    Iraq , Syria , Egypt et al, muslims..these fuckers are never going to be happy and they are a blight on world safety.

    USA , go in there and nuke every single hot spot…burn them all to a cinder. Dont stop until the jobs done properly.

    Its the only answer.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  114. OneTrack (2,981 comments) says:

    Red – “After the way that party has been so fucked over by the “classical liberals” who placed the now discredited electoral liability chameleon Banks as its leader, you might as well throw your ballot paper over Huka falls.”

    While I don’t agree, that was a good one :-).

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  115. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    Bedwetter

    “Its only obsessive fucked in the head fools like you who make Christianity an issue.”

    Lol, this from the man who lives in constant fear of having reds under his bed, this from the man who swore that he was agnostic.

    Christianity is only an issue Bedwetter because morons like Colin Craig (and your girlfriend the equally stupid Sarah Palin) insist on making it so. If those idiots did not insist on trying to force the rest of us to live by the words in their book I think you would find that any religious based opposition would disappear.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  116. stigie (1,066 comments) says:

    “Could somebody please let the nurse know that he needs to have his pad changed”

    All very well but dont forget the bag !~

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  117. James Stephenson (2,145 comments) says:

    you might as well throw your ballot paper over Huka falls.

    There might be a job in the lamestream media for you Red, that’s the line they try to push every election, and I have no doubt they, and you, will be wrong again.

    Anyhoo, I rate their new blood, and mine is a vote that left them because of Banks and is coming back to them this year (Libertarianz, in case you were wondering, and because I love the way that word makes you splutter :D ).

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  118. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “Anyhoo, I rate their new blood,”

    I’ll tell you why I don’t.

    1) Their leader is an academic who didn’t even have the foresight to have a contingency plan in place in the event of Bank’s conviction. What happened after Banks was found guilty was complete disarray.

    2) Another of their leaders said he had been overseas for 5 weeks and “didn’t have a clue what was going on”.

    3) The moron Lisa Own walked all over their Epsom candidate when he was interviewed by her the other day. If he can’t handle her what use is he?

    Their “new blood” just seems more of the same old same old “Classical Liberal” bullshit that no one understands and has nothing to do with party’s founding as the Association of Consumers & Taxpayers.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  119. wf (420 comments) says:

    Why did the score go from 4 to 7 when I up ticked?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  120. Alan (1,087 comments) says:

    The NZCP seem much closer to Labour on most matters of economic substance than they are to National. They pretty much NZF with a richer, sober, honest but less charismatic and politically astute leader.

    Fine if that’s your thing, but thinking they are to the right of National is deluded.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  121. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    dirty harry (302 comments) says:
    June 13th, 2014 at 12:00 pm,

    “.. USA , go in there and nuke every single hot spot…burn them all to a cinder……”

    Are you Collin Craig’s Foreign Policy spokesman.?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  122. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “thinking they are too the right of National is deluded”

    For the sake of the argument, there is no “right” in NZ.

    The spectrum under discussion when we talk of the Conservative Party and their opposition is Progressive-Conservative.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  123. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “Why did the score go from 4 to 7 when I up ticked?”

    CIA.

    They also know the guy you think of as your father is someone else.

    Vote: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  124. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    “Why did the score go from 4 to 7 when I up ticked?”

    That can happen when others have clicked the same thing since the last refresh, your tick initiates a refresh.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  125. James Stephenson (2,145 comments) says:

    The spectrum under discussion when we talk of the Conservative Party and their opposition is Progressive-Conservative.

    The word that comes to mind when I visit their site is “Populist”

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  126. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    Iraqi soldiers captured in Tikrit by ISIS.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  127. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “The word that comes to mind when I visit their site is “Populist””

    That’s pretty funny coming from someone who prefers JK to CC.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  128. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Actually red
    progressive retardist.
    That way we can label you a retard.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  129. UglyTruth (4,551 comments) says:

    USA , go in there and nuke every single hot spot…burn them all to a cinder. Dont stop until the jobs done properly.

    Its the only answer.

    … and I was like die ragheads bam bam bam whoosh! USA! USA! USA!

    http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/03/americans-overwhelmingly-oppose-us-intervention-ukraine-syria-iran-anywhere-else.html

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  130. James Stephenson (2,145 comments) says:

    That’s pretty funny coming from someone who prefers JK to CC.

    Why is it “funny”? Populism has it’s place, and it’s good if you want to capture the middle ground that wins elections or grab the bewildered “back to the good old days” 5% to sustain your MP salary, but Winston doesn’t seem to be letting go of that any time soon.

    You’re trying to paint CC as the guy to encourage JK to spend some of his vast wealth of political capital, rather than sitting on it like Scrooge McDuck, and sorry, but I just don’t see it.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  131. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Redbaiter, and what about the Kylie Chapman and his RWR option in your political game of thrones.?

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  132. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    Elon Musk has followed through on his hint that Tesla Motors will free up their patents to help speed up electric car development.

    .

    Yesterday, there was a wall of Tesla patents in the lobby of our Palo Alto headquarters. That is no longer the case. They have been removed, in the spirit of the open source movement, for the advancement of electric vehicle technology.

    http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/all-our-patent-are-belong-you

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  133. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “You’re trying to paint CC as the guy to encourage JK to spend some of his vast wealth of political capital, rather than sitting on it like Scrooge McDuck,”

    No, I’ve long ago given up on JK, I just want him gone because taking the Nats as far left as he has, I view him as the worst Nat Party leader this country has ever seen. He’s focused on popularity at the expense of the kind of leadership shown by Tony Abbot and Nigel Farage.

    As I said above in a statement that seems to have passed you by, I merely see the Conservative Party as the thin end of the wedge that will eventually get the Progs out of National and out of our lives.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  134. dirty harry (446 comments) says:

    You are very scared of Colin Craig Stepieboy , why is that? Got something to hide ?

    Vote: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  135. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    The Rainbow Branch of the Labour Party should take notice:
    Gay men who use smartphone apps to hunt for a sex partner run a higher risk of contracting a sexually transmitted disease than those meeting online or in bars, researchers say.

    Apps such as Grindr, Scruff and Recon use the smartphone’s geolocation facility to help the user hook up with other men in the vicinity who are also looking for sex.

    http://news.msn.co.nz/worldnews/8859515/phone-apps-linked-to-sexual-diseases

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  136. dirty harry (446 comments) says:

    scottchris can clarify all of that Manolo..being ‘that way’ inclined..disgusting habit

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  137. igm (1,413 comments) says:

    The filthy PSA-Labour slugs are demonstrating for more money. Well, if they are so good, let them join the private sector, showing their abilities. Oh, can’t do that, will lose all the perks of being a leeching PSA member, and may need to work. Get a grip Public Servants, you are doing your Labour mates no good . . . you are a despised, overprivileged, and overpaid group of losers.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  138. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    P.G. disguised as Tom Scott drew the cartoon: http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/comment/cartoons/

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  139. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Red
    The chance of getting progs out of our lives is nonexistent.
    Frst progs would have to be in your life.
    If you chose to live as a christian, deluded wingnut, great battler of imaginary hoards or whatever in private no prog will stop you.
    You want to dictate to all how they live.
    This is were the problem occurs.
    Because progs don’t want a bitter twisted self deluded old man dictating how they live, who they fuck, the recreational drugs they take,the imaginary friends they pray to, the books they read to or any other of the controlling authoritarian constraints you think is best for them.
    I suggest that you tell nusey to up the meds or change them gran pops because judging by your output today they are no longer having the required calming and banishment of delusions effect.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  140. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “What is wrong with voting for the Nat’s if you are not a follower of the sky fairy?”

    Little Sis is a very confused little poppet. :)

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  141. Andrei (2,547 comments) says:

    Hmmmm

    I wonder who did this and why?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  142. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “If those idiots did not insist on trying to force the rest of us to live by the words in their book I think you would find that any religious based opposition would disappear.”

    No it wouldn’t, because idiots like you would just find another excuse.

    Of course, your happy to force the rest of us to live by…………..what exactly is the basis for your beliefs?

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  143. stephieboy (2,693 comments) says:

    Andrei, unquestionably all the hallmarks of the FSB.

    dirtyharry,
    No more and no less than that clown your perhaps more familiar with ,Kylie Chapman.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  144. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    Yes Andrei, I wonder who…

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  145. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    Rick Perry showing he still has what it take to be a GOP presidential candidate:
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/10153426/Being-gay-like-alcoholism-Rick-Perry

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  146. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    Interesting how some try to blame the Bush monster for a collapse in the Iraqi army (SPC).

    Can we by the same token credit him with the Kurdish peshmerga holding onto the outskirts of Kirkuk?

    There are probably more prisoners in that column posted by cha than in the whole ISIL onslaught. Poor leadership by Iraqi officers is most likely at fault.

    Likewise the Iraqi gummint is calling for international assistance and yet can’t even convene its own parliament to address the crisis…..I suppose that’s down to the Bush’s too.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  147. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    Also in the good old US of A:

    Archbishop Robert J. Carlson claimed to be uncertain that he knew sexual abuse of a child by a priest constituted a crime when he was auxiliary bishop in the Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis, according to a deposition. Attorney Jeff Anderson asked Carlson whether he knew it was a crime for an adult to engage in sex with a child. “I’m not sure whether I knew it was a crime or not,” Carlson replied. “I understand today it’s a crime.” Carlson was then asked whether he knew in 1984, when he was an auxiliary bishop in the Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis, that it was crime for a priest to engage in sex with a child. “I’m not sure if I did or didn’t,” Carlson said.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  148. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    Who said it?.

    If you’re going to go in and try to topple Saddam Hussein, you have to go to Baghdad. Once you’ve got Baghdad, it’s not clear what you do with it. It’s not clear what kind of government you would put in place of the one that’s currently there now. Is it going to be a Shia regime, a Sunni regime or a Kurdish regime? Or one that tilts toward the Baathists, or one that tilts toward the Islamic fundamentalists? How much credibility is that government going to have if it’s set up by the United States military when it’s there? How long does the United States military have to stay to protect the people that sign on for that government, and what happens to it once we leave?

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  149. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Precedent mike
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-05-05/child-sex-abuse-hearings-told-law-impediment-to-prosecutions/5431048

    The Christian Brothers who ran children’s homes in Western Australia in the 1940s, 50s and 60s did not consider the abuse of students a crime, a royal commission has heard.

    Brother Anthony Shanahan, a former province leader of the Christian Brothers in WA, today gave evidence at the Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse in Perth.

    The inquiry is examining alleged sexual and physical abuse in four homes run by the Brothers in Perth, Tardun and Bindoon between 1947 and 1968.

    Brother Shanahan told the hearing the mindset at the time meant abuse was not thought of “first and foremost” as a crime, but as a moral fault or failing.

    “I think they saw it as something that was abhorrent, harmful – although I don’t think they understood it as harmful in the way we would now, in terms of consequences for the victim, but something that was abhorrent and harmful and that was the way they dealt with it,” he said.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  150. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    New Zealand faces the same dilema.

    There’s no way taxpayers should be funding serial and lifestyle choice abortions.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/10895765/Lifestyle-abortions-warning-as-serial-termination-numbers-surge.html

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  151. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    If the Conservatives want to encourage Key, English, McCully and Joyce to do them a big electorate favour then posters like this are a very strange approach: With Friends Like These Who Needs Enemies?

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  152. tom hunter (4,704 comments) says:

    Who said it?.

    Dick Cheney for 10 points!!!

    Actually those are all the reasons I grudgingly accepted in 1991 – even though I thought the right thing to do was finish off Saddam for good.

    Funny thing is that none of my leftie friends accepted those reasons at all, especially from the likes of Cheney. No, all those reasons were dismissed as mere “apologetics” from a Republican administration that did not want Saddam gone because of the glorious revolution that would occur in his wake and yada, yada, yada.

    Of course I loved it a decade later when I heard Iraq war protestors channeling Mr Cheney!!! Perish the thought in 1991.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  153. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “With Friends Like These Who Needs Enemies?”

    Good on you Colin, get after those useless Nat party poseurs.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  154. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Kow tow
    yip stop them having abortions

    Instead make them have the baby in a catholic run care facility where they can work for free for the next twenty years to pay for their sins.Bonus is the church can then sell the baby’s for cash or keep them as sex slaves until they reach twenty one.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 9 You need to be logged in to vote
  155. cha (3,935 comments) says:

    Unless the Iranian’s can pull one out of the bag it looks like it’ll be all over soon enough.

    “Baghdad is going to be overrun. The Green Zone is going down.”

    – U.S. intelligence official

    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/06/12/as-jihadists-take-aim-at-baghdad-iran-steps-in-to-help-historical-foe/

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  156. stigie (1,066 comments) says:

    It will be a real shame if National could govern alone come September !~

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  157. tom hunter (4,704 comments) says:

    Of course if we are going to talk about lessons here I do wonder whether this question of Cheney’s …

    It’s not clear what kind of government you would put in place of the one that’s currently there now. Is it going to be a Shia regime, a Sunni regime or ….. one that tilts toward the Islamic fundamentalists?

    … ever crossed the minds of the trio of Obama, Clinton, and Power when they decided to destroy Gaddafi in Libya, throw Mubarak to the wolves in Egypt, and wander around for a couple of years saying that Assad had to go. And that’s before we get to the whole “Redline” farce.

    What did they call it again? R2P? No, that’s the UN, but we’ve not heard much about that since Libya.

    Oh I know – SMART POWER – with added Leftism for increased smarts.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  158. Pete George (23,436 comments) says:

    An unfortunate comparison or a deliberate likeness? Spot the difference.

    Fair or not Craig is opening himself up to more ridicule.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  159. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    Spot the difference?

    Where?

    In the comments about Craig at the Standard and the comments on Whaleoil?

    There is none.

    Progs all.

    Same neo-Bolshevik attitudes at each forum.

    Why we need the Conservatives.

    I’m sick of these dimbulb look alike progs in National & Labour fighting over worthless shit and pretending there’s something gained.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  160. kowtow (8,186 comments) says:

    Comparison or likeness?A beige badger.

    http://animal-backgrounds.com/badger/badger-snow-wallpaper.html

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  161. Longknives (4,686 comments) says:

    I saw one of Jack Tame’s ‘reports’ from the World Cup.
    Rather than talking football or reporting on the fantastic Brazilian culture and hospitality he was rambling on and on about ‘inequality’ and ‘poverty’.
    For fuck’s sake kid- We already figured out you have political aspirations..give it a rest and do your bloody job…

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  162. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    I would be happy if National could govern alone, I just seriously doubt that will be the case, and on that subject, let’s inject some actual reason into the debate about Craig.

    The Conservative party is not going (even if it could) force Christianity on anyone. It’s major policy proposals are: Binding referenda, opposition to asset sales, and repealing the anti-smacking legislation, and that’s pretty much it. No sane, rational person (which excludes BB and Naaska) could reasonably argue that that amounts to forcing anyone to be Christian.

    There are already Christians in government. One of the most genuinely and consistently conservative Christians is our finance minister. People paranoid about Christians in government who also vote National are clearly not thinking straight, or thinking at all.

    People who want this or any government to reflect their deepest values and who vote accordingly are not “forcing” anyone, they are participating in democracy, and that is true regardless of whether their values are “secular” or “religious.”

    BB and Naaska are quite happy to, using their silly and irrational rhetoric for a moment, force their right wing values on Lefties who do not want them. It is therefore utter hypocrisy to rant against Christians doing the same.

    The Conservative Party is not going to turn NZ into a theocracy. The Conservative Party in a coalition with National will not turn NZ into a theocracy, or force anyone to go to church or believe in God. BB and Naaska are behaving like a couple of paranoid, hysteria driven women at the wrong time of the month on this issue.

    Hell, the Conservative Party is not even particularly Conservative in any real sense of that word. The reality is that their actual policies are little different to NZF’s, but without the anti-Asian hysteria.

    National must cultivate potential coalition partners. It cannot rely on ACT alone, and Peter Dunne on current polling will not bring anyone else with him.

    Whatever Craig’s faults, anyone who thinks Winston First will be a reliable coalition partner is engaging in serious self-delusion. Peters would happily bring a government down if he felt like it. I suspect Craig would not.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  163. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “Bonus is the church can then sell the baby’s for cash or keep them as sex slaves until they reach twenty one.”

    Take your meds Griff. Your insanity is showing.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  164. Dead Earnest (160 comments) says:

    Griff; I’m quite new around here, but you seem to have a bit of an axe to grind with Christians.
    Maybe you had a bad experiece at convent school or found a guilty conscience felt better when you hoped God didn’t exist. Only you can answer that.
    Look it’s not hard to find some pretty dreadful things that people that call themselves christians have done. But buddy if you want to get in to serious genocide in the tens miillion you atheists win hands down. Nothing can compare with the atrocities of Hitler ,Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot.
    When you take away eternal accountability hell becomes a present reality.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  165. goldnkiwi (1,264 comments) says:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11273483

    Dignity and ‘aplomb’

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  166. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Yip reds on to it
    the conservative movement is on an upswing.
    Clearing the filthy proggs and hippy Marxist back country scumsuckers from the offices of power has never been so close.
    They may even get more than 3% of the votes this election.
    Obviously with millions of dollars and such startling personality involved as colon grag.
    and
    and
    and
    well anyway they are the party to watch.
    I can even see them beating the past efforts of christian conservative party’s in nz.
    There is a such a strong legacy of christian behavior to uphold and build upon. Graham Capill was so effective at placing the brand in the New Zealand voters mind with his clearly defined sense of Christian morels. Nothing but good can come of a new party bringing his legacy forward into a new century.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  167. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    UT will be delighted: http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/iraq-isis-crisis-medieval-sharia-law-imposed-millions-nineveh-province-1452401

    Back to oscurantism and savage times!

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  168. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Some Atheist find reference to “god” in politics and the continued insistence that Christians are the fount of all morel behavior offensive.
    After the century’s of persecution non believers suffered you find it strange that some of us chose to push back ?
    Outside of kb my life partner is a committed christian. In my private life I have no problem with whatever belief you hold.
    Try to use GOD to justify your political standpoint is another matter and my posts are in reply to the thousand of posts by Christians that I find offensive including those apologist for the past abuse society suffered when Christians held sway over society.

    stick around and you will see.

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  169. ShawnLH (4,482 comments) says:

    “After the century’s of persecution non believers suffered ”

    What persecution?

    “you find it strange that some of us chose to push back ?”

    Given that you haven’t actually been persecuted, yes.

    “Try to use GOD to justify your political standpoint is another matter and my posts are in reply to the thousand of posts by Christians that I find offensive”

    Why do you think you have a right not to be offended?

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  170. Redbaiter (8,350 comments) says:

    “Griff; I’m quite new around here, but you seem to have a bit of an axe to grind with Christians.”

    Its not only Grief. There’s a swag of equally deluded ranters who comment here.

    Forget them. They’re obsessive unhinged lunatics with only the most tenuous grip on reality, imagining all kinds of ills are about to befall them as a result of other people having Christian beliefs.

    You can’t change that kind of insane mindset here, and they only post their obsessive shit to bring some attention to their sad mentally crippled selves, so its really not worth trying.

    Leave them to their nightmares.

    Vote: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  171. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    A f_ckin disgrace. American DJ Casey Kasem is being starved to death. All food and water withheld.

    http://www.lifenews.com/2014/06/11/judge-rules-casey-kasems-daughter-can-starve-and-dehydrate-him-to-death/

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  172. Fletch (6,256 comments) says:

    The leader behind the ISIS Jihadis was released by Obama in 2009…

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iraq/10891700/Iraq-crisis-the-jihadist-behind-the-takeover-of-Mosul-and-how-America-let-him-go.html

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  173. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    FIRST JOHN BANKS – THEN JOHN KEY?

    Now that Labour have confirmed that they will vote against an Epsom by-election (unfortunately), then, in my view, it will be up to the continuing work of proven ‘anti-corruption Public Watchdogs’, and others to keep the pressure on!

    Grace Haden in Epsom and Penny Bright in Helensville.

    By using the electoral process to focus on the issues – particularly the main one that ex-Wall St banker John Key is SO vulnerable on – CORRUPTION!

    Given that PM John Key is seen as National’s main ‘asset’ – then anything that detracts from his ‘personal popularity’ – will directly affect support for National.

    Which is why I’m standing against John Key in Helensville – to help keep that public spotlight on CORRUPTION, including HIS!

    (It is my personal goal to help wipe 20 points of his preferred status as Prime Minister, and to help the National Party drop 10 points in the polls).

    In case you’ve missed this –

    My 2008 (pre-election) complaint to the Police and SFO about John Key’s corrupt ‘insider trading’ over TranzRail, and my subsequent private prosecution – not ONE sentence of which was ever reported in the NZ Herald …

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFTYZVQo-A8

    Those who might attempt to write off this bold plan , may care to remember that John Banks was not expected to be committed to trial – then to be found guilty for electoral fraud?

    How many pollsters and political pundits predicted THAT?

    And – please don’t forget THIS huge political upset in the USA

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/10145170/Big-upset-in-US-politics

    “US House Majority Leader Eric Cantor has lost in his Republican primary election to a little-known economics professor, a stunning upset for the No. 2 Republican in the House and a major victory for the ultraconservative tea party movement.”

    Again – how many pollsters and political pundits predicted THAT?

    What can YOU do to help?

    SHARE SHARE SHARE the link to this You Tube

    Is John Key Shonky? (New Zealand Election 2008)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFTYZVQo-A8

    because this story was effectively CENSORED /BLOCKED from mainstream media back in 2008!

    It’s time has come!

    PLEASE share this link by facebook / email / phone / cut and paste to blogs / mainstream media – whatever / wherever!

    YOU are the centre of a Universe – with HEAPS of contacts – YOU can help make a HUGE difference to this election by sharing the TRUTH about NZ Prime Minister John Key (arguably one of the most spin-doctored politicians on the planet?)

    Cheers!

    Penny Bright

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 11 You need to be logged in to vote
  174. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    I just followed PG’s 4.21pm link to Whale’s post on the CCCP campaign poster.

    Ye Gods…..four poorly drawn chooks with four pathetic attempts to liken them to senior Nats. It has all the sophistication & impact of a Xmas issue of the Boys’ own Paper circa 1954.

    Obviously Colin is a bit short of the readies & sees engaging the year 4 class at his local primary school as his advertising gurus as a way to make the dollar stretch.

    If this is as good as the Conservowhacks get I guess I worry too much. :)

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  175. Steve (North Shore) (4,544 comments) says:

    The full moon rose at 5.26. No need to look, you can tell from the comments here. Redblatter has been off his trolley all day.
    Wonder if Colin Craig knows it is a full moon? he should have a look – it is still there with the American Flag

    Vote: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  176. mandk (954 comments) says:

    Griff: “… Christian morels …”

    These must be fungi you can only eat if you are a believer :-)

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  177. itstricky (1,772 comments) says:

    Wonder if Colin Craig knows it is a full moon? he should have a look – it is still there with the American Flag

    There are too many sinister chemical vapours clouds from where I’m looking, can’t quite see the flag.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  178. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    JUDITH COLLINS’ BROKEN PROMISE:

    http://www.transparency.org.nz/…/New-Zealand-to-Ratify… New Zealand Almost Ready to Ratify UNCAC!

    Ten years after signing UNCAC in 2003, New Zealand appears almost ready to ratify the United Nations Convention against Corruption. New Zealand’s failure for a decade to take action to ratify the UN Convention disappointing for a country that prides itself on its clean international image. TINZ has actively encouraged ratification for the last 10 years as noted in our letter to several ministers in August.

    In a much welcomed development in a letter to Transparency International New Zealand dated 7 August 2013, the Hon Judith Collins, Minister of Justice, states that she has “announced a package of legislative reforms that will allow New Zealand to ratify UNCAC.”

    The necessary amendments to make New Zealand’s domestic law compliant with the treaty obligations will be included in the Organized Crime and Anti-Corruption Bill. Once passed, the minister has confirmed that “officials will promptly take steps to deposit New Zealand’s instrument of ratification of UNCAC.”

    The Transparency International NZ letter to Ministers about ratification of UNCAC (dated 30 May 2013)

    http://www.transparency.org.nz/docs/2013/UNCAC-Letter-%20to-Hon-Ministers-McCully-Collins-Groser-30-May-2013.pdf

    Minister for Justice Judith Collins’ reply, dated 13 August 2013 (promising to introduce her ‘Organised Crime and Anti-Corruption Legislation Bill’ in 2013 ….

    http://www.transparency.org.nz/docs/2013/Hon-Judith-Collins-Minister-of-Justice-Letter-to-TINZ.pdf

    Parliament has only FIVE sitting weeks left to go, and this crucial Bill has yet to be introduced into the Parliamentary legislative ‘sausage machine’?

    Meanwhile – this corrupt Minister of Justice, in whom Prime Minister John Key ‘has confidence’ – is swanning around getting her photo taken with celebrities – serving WHOSE interests?

    http://www.3news.co.nz/Collins-breaks-Twitter-silence—with-Brad-Pitt/tabid/423/articleID/348379/Default.aspx

    In my considered opinion, NZ’s CORRUPT Minister of Justice Judith Collins is an absolute disgrace, and should be sacked as a Minister forthwith.

    NZ Prime Minister John Key, in my considered opinion, is equally a disgrace, for continuing to defend her indefensible behaviour (as he did with John Banks) however – he’s hardly likely to sack himself.

    That will be left to the voting public on 20 September 2014 …

    Penny Bright

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 10 You need to be logged in to vote
  179. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    Penny, we get that it’s a full moon…

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  180. goldnkiwi (1,264 comments) says:

    Fletch (5,869 comments) says:

    June 13th, 2014 at 5:55 pm

    Wouldn’t be allowed to do it to a dog.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  181. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    What has Colin Craig actually ever done for the public or the public interest, apart from stand for public office?

    What is his PROVEN TRACK RECORD?

    Oh – that’s right – he hasn’t really got one – but still expects to be ‘gifted’ a seat by National?

    What sort of electoral RORT is that?

    Penny Bright

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  182. Colville (2,254 comments) says:

    I might actually read a comment by Penny Dim if there was a small chance it was about someone on the red team, but no chance of that.
    Nothing to see here move right along.
    Penny is more corrupt than Banksie by a mile and Banksie is actually sane ;-)

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  183. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    ….”Wouldn’t be allowed to do it to a dog.”…..

    Quite right….you would have the vet put them down painlessly & near enough instantly.

    But because some believe in a magic man in the sky no one can offer a fellow human that level of mercy.

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3 You need to be logged in to vote
  184. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    Which FACTS do you particularly dislike (Oravida) ‘MilkMaid’?

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

    Who – unlike many others – does not ‘howl at the moon’ but takes actions which result in outcomes ….

    ie: Today. 13 June 2014 – DODGY JOHN HAS GONE .COM

    (Took a while, but proves again that focus, timing and perseverance pays off? )

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  185. nasska (11,185 comments) says:

    ….” Banksie is actually sane”….

    So’s Waterwoman Colville…..she’s got the discharge papers to prove it. :)

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4 You need to be logged in to vote
  186. mikenmild (11,247 comments) says:

    I think an appropriate punishment for Banks would to be locked up with Penny for a few months. Life changing for both of them.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  187. Manolo (13,518 comments) says:

    Pay your rates before opening your mouth, you corrupt woman, Miss Dim.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  188. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    Ah ANONYMOUS / GUTLESS ‘Colgate’ using defamatory words you don’t understand?

    Guess you haven’t seen this – the speech I gave at the end of the LEN BROWN STAND DOWN rally 22 February 2014

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ-MJxsawec

    Kind regards

    Penny Bright

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 6 You need to be logged in to vote
  189. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    “Who – unlike many others – does not ‘howl at the moon’ but takes actions which result in outcomes ….”

    Fucking great idea. I have a few days off coming up. One of the first things I will be doing is contacting the Auckland Council and demanding to know what the story is with you not paying your rates.
    If as I suspect they try and fob me off I will lodge an official information inquiry, when I receive the documents I will post a link to them so everybody can see what a bludger you are Penny.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  190. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    GUTLESS/ANONYMOUS BOYolo – go to hell.

    (Meant of course in a caring way … :)

    Nope – I will NOT pay my rates when it is Auckland Council who are breaking the law and not implementing the Public Records Act 2005, and telling us exactly where our monies are being spent on private sector consultants and contractors.

    You aren’t one of these are you BOYolo?

    (That might help explain a few things ….. ?)

    Kind regards,

    Penny Bright

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 8 You need to be logged in to vote
  191. wat dabney (3,709 comments) says:

    Vote Labour, otherwise Penny might have to pay the very taxes we are told constitutes good citizenship.

    Fuck off Penny, you are a self-indulgent bludger living at the expense of everyone else.

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  192. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    Ahhh….. getting lots of nibbles from the normal Kiwiblog gutless, gormless, gummy wee goldfish ….:)

    Keep going!

    You have NO idea how much this makes my evening – proves you’re reading my posts and you feel moved enough to make your usual ad hominem comments…….. yawn ……

    So!

    If I’m upsetting you lot – I MUST be doing something right!

    You have a lovely evening :)

    Kind regards,

    Penny

    http://www.dodgyjohn HASgone.com

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 7 You need to be logged in to vote
  193. wat dabney (3,709 comments) says:

    Penny,

    Child kidnappers would provoke a similar response.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  194. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    Ahhh ‘whatever’ – but I helped get John Banks committed to trial, found guilty and removed from Parliament.

    You done anything of note lately ‘whatever’ – WHOEVER you are?

    At least Rodney Hide gives credit where it is due:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11269717

    “Justice Wylie’s decision on John Banks provides a very elegant result: everyone’s a winner, sort of. Graham McCready is clearly a winner. He declared the police wrong in not prosecuting Banks. With the indefatigable Penny Bright’s help, he got the case to court. That was no mean achievement.

    A private citizen of very limited resource took on government might and won. Justice Wylie’s decision proves McCready right and the police wrong. He toppled a minister and shook the Government’s majority. … ”

    Kind regards

    Penny

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  195. wat dabney (3,709 comments) says:

    Penny,

    Like your socialist mates you are nothing but a parasite and a leech on the workers of New Zealand.

    You are the voice of special-interest groups whose only purpose is to arse-rape the workers.

    You must be proud.

    Vote: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  196. Griff (7,387 comments) says:

    Time for some lite comedy maybe

    CAUTION: PENNY BRIGHT IN COURT CLAIMING TO REPRESENT OCCUPY AUCKLAND THREE DAYS AFTER SLAMMING US IN THE MEDIA.

    If you look at Vinnie Eastwood’s You Tube Channel (GuerillaMedia) you will see an interview from last Sunday where Penny Bright publicly bashes:

    the Occupy movement,
    the Aotearoa is Not For Sale movement,
    Unite Union,
    Socialist Aotearoa,
    Joe Carolan
    John Minto (amongst others)

    yet then three days later claims to a court to represent.

    Quite obviously, she does not represent us. As proven by her conduct.

    You may remember Penny Bright & Chris Glen spent nearly the entire 2012 GA’s trying to DISBAND Occupy working groups, full of people who had donated countless time & resources to promote Occupy.

    She has thwarted the cohesion of the movement at every turn. Her continuing similar conduct at other movement planning meetings led to her being expelled from several other movements than Occupy.

    As such we denounce any attempt by her to “represent” the Occupy movement.

    Please read http://occupysavvy.com/2012/09/24/cointelpro-occupy-the-war-within/ for full details. Ctrl-F “Penny Bright” to get to the part about her quickly.

    Thank you to everyone who, despite the saboteurs and infiltration, continues to support our voluntary efforts to educate & unite the New Zealand people.”

    The comments from the smelly hippies are most illuminating

    Katrina Crews why doesn’t this surprise me?
    September 27, 2012 at 11:12am · Like · 2
    Laurie Ludlow Old mouth piece at it again! How does she find the time to be so irritating?
    September 27, 2012 at 11:16am · Like · 2
    Occupy New Zealand Laurie Ludlow according to her own interview last Sunday, she is a “professional protester”. Which must explain why she is the first person to demand compensation from donations for everything she does, while the rest of us work 100% for free…
    September 27, 2012 at 11:29am · Like · 5
    Laurie Ludlow Yes Ive heard that line from her before, shes a professional pain in the ass lol. I had to block her on Facebook long ago
    September 27, 2012 at 11:33am · Like · 4
    Flo Brown That Silly hag, that stupid useless piece of egotistical, blow hard human excrement…I long for the day somebody actually pushes her self proclaimed bullshit in the mud once & for all.. she is a total nutter…I have been unfortunate to have know her .

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  197. publicwatchdog (2,516 comments) says:

    Ok Kiwibloggers – it’s been such fun – but that will do for today.

    If you find any of these FACTS too much, and you can’t ‘handle the jandal’ – have a cuppa (very fashionable this time of the election cycle) relax, and have a wee lie down.

    However upset you feel, it will pass, and tomorrow is another day …

    Sweet dreams!

    Penny

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 5 You need to be logged in to vote
  198. Colville (2,254 comments) says:

    The thing I love about Ms Din not paying her rates is that she is too utterly thick to notice that the Council is getting better than twice the normal rates levy out of her. 10% penalties per quater compounding soon add up to a whole house!

    I may even fly up to attend the auction :-)

    We should have a Kiwiblog pissup to mark the day ;-)

    Vote: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  199. big bruv (13,686 comments) says:

    I have a question for other contributors here.

    Do any of you read the shit that Penny posts here?, I have to admit that I very rarely do, I just skip over most of her stuff and go straight to asking her questions. Questions she remains determined not to answer.

    Still, with the official information enquiry request soon to be in the pipe line at least I will have the truth soon.

    Vote: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2 You need to be logged in to vote
  200. wat dabney (3,709 comments) says:

    Colville,

    I think you mean “Princess Penny.”

    Vote: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  201. Colville (2,254 comments) says:

    wat, if I said what I meant i would get a slap or a ban from DPF !

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  202. Nookin (3,273 comments) says:

    Of concern is the fact that Penny believes that a seat in Parliament comes as a reward for public service.

    Principles, values, intelligence, business acumen and a knowledge of how to make the world go round do not seem to feature in the scheme of things. I guess that if Penny had her way Parliament would be chocka with activists and charity cake-stall organisers and attendants.

    I am not saying that Craig has any or all of the above. Penny, however, rules him out altogether due to perceived absence of public service.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  203. Steve (North Shore) (4,544 comments) says:

    7.42, the heat is hot.
    Uma rapiti, uma rapiti, uma uma uma

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  204. wat dabney (3,709 comments) says:

    “Public service” is providing goods and service that the public desires at prices they can afford.

    It is Capitalism.

    “Public service” is not politicians using the state’s monopoly on violence to reward their constituents, as Princess Penny supposes.

    Capitalism rewards true public service.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  205. Chthoniid (2,035 comments) says:

    @big bruv

    I have a question for other contributors here.

    Do any of you read the shit that Penny posts here?

    Nope, she is in a small set of people I treat as just white noise. Don’t read, don’t reply.

    Life is short. Stupid can’t be fixed. Move on.

    Vote: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1 You need to be logged in to vote
  206. RightNow (6,973 comments) says:

    @tom hunter… thanks for coming back.

    Vote: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote
  207. deadrightkev (425 comments) says:

    Redbaiter

    “I’m sick of these dimbulb look alike progs in National & Labour fighting over worthless shit and pretending there’s something gained.”

    It is a fact that is hard to refute. As long as these two parties are allowed to carryon playing dumb and dumber every election we will get closer to the UN and lose our sovereignty. Although I respect the office of the PM it has been clear to me since year one in office that John Key is not the reformer or commander we need to turn this nation around.

    We need a strong leader who can kick the Greens for touch, restore basic values and economic prosperity. That leader is not here yet and I suspect it is because he/she does not have the vehicle to enter the fray.

    Vote: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0 You need to be logged in to vote

Leave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.