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April 24, 2010 11:06am by David Farrar

General Debate 24 April 2010

Now that was a good sleep in!

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Redbaiter

“Now that was a good sleep in!”

Claire there?
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April 24, 2010 11:09am
Inky_the_Red

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/3618534/Officials-opposed-ECan-changes

It seems this Government ignored Ministry of Justice advice again.
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April 24, 2010 11:24am
Redbaiter

This is the normal language for certification of nomination for President and Vice President of the US, filed by the DNC only in the state of Hawaii-

http://www.canadafreepress.com/images/uploads/williams042010.jpg

This is the language filed by the DNC in the other 49 states, however-

http://www.canadafreepress.com/images/uploads/williams042010-2.jpg
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April 24, 2010 11:51am
philu

whoar..!

http://whoar.co.nz/2010/the-imminent-crash-of-the-oil-supply%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0/

“..What Is Going To Happen And Why Weren’t We Forewarned?

– Look at this graph and be afraid.

It does not come from Earth First.

It does not come from the Sierra Club.

It was not drawn by Socialists or Nazis or Osama Bin Laden or anyone from Goldman-Sachs.

If you are a Republican Tea-Partier, rest assured it does not come from a progressive Democrat.

And vice versa.

It was drawn by the United States Department of Energy .. and the United States military’s Joint Forces Command concurs with the overall picture.

What does it imply?

The supply of the world’s most essential energy source is going off a cliff.

Not in the distant future .. but in a year and a half.

Production of all liquid fuels, including oil .. will drop within 20 years to half what it is today.

And the difference needs to be made up with “unidentified projects,” ..

.. which one of the world’s leading petroleum geologists says is just a “euphemism for rank shortage,”..

.. and the world’s foremost oil industry banker says is “faith based.”..”

(as i said..’whoar..!.’..eh..?..)

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 24, 2010 11:56am
philu

and..um..!

is anyone having bacon for breakfast..?

http://whoar.co.nz/2010/well-done-meat-doubles-bladder-cancer-risk/

“..“..Eating lots of meat, especially if it is overcooked, increases the risk of bladder cancer, say experts.

Frying, grilling and barbecuing until meat is charred can form cancer-causing chemicals, research shows.

In a study, people whose diets included well-done meats .. were over twice as likely to develop bladder cancer than those who preferred meats rare.

The research findings, based on over 1,700, people were presented at a US cancer research conference.

The University of Texas investigators found the risk was highest for those who ate well-done red meat such as steaks, pork chops and bacon..”

(mmm!!!!!!..eh..?..)

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 24, 2010 12:04pm
Fisiani

Can I ask the astute and experienced readers of this blog for help.
In todays Otago Daily Times there is a report about an Otago University Senate meeting on Wednesday to disestablish Design Studies at Otago University. This is the first leak of such changes.

I have a vested interest in that my daughter is currently in her third and honours year of study in this dept.

Gillian Mcc here is a link to the latest odt article concerning the recommendations for the design department which will be voted on at the senate meeting this wednesday. Looks like students will have to finish their degrees at polytech (who don’t offer honours)

Design studies death knell | Otago Daily Times Online News
http://www.odt.co.nz
A document leaked to the Otago Daily Times shows Vice-chancellor Prof Sir David Skegg will recommend the department be closed at a university senate meeting to be held this Wednesday

Any strategic advice for how to deal with this in the next 4 days
thanks
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April 24, 2010 12:11pm
Yvette

What other bad news do you have Phlu?

I’ve just read an item which says
“…Being fat is bad for your brain . That, at least, is the gloomy conclusion of several recent studies.
For example, one long-term study of more than 6,500 people in northern California found that those who were fat around the middle at age 40 were more likely to succumb to dementia in their 70s.”

and in general world gloom –
“Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
We hear endless talk in Washington about belt-tightening and deficit reduction, but hardly a word about whether the $161 billion being spent this year to fight unnecessary wars of choice in Afghanistan and Iraq ..
.. might be better spent helping embattled Americans here at home..”

and culture is doomed –
“..Bob Dylan is “a plagiarist”, Joni Mitchell said in a rare interview this week, offering cranky comments on old Bob .. and warm memories of Jimi Hendrix.

This is all enough to turn anyone to smoke pot.
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April 24, 2010 12:13pm
RAS

Vegetarianism is harmless enough though it is apt to fill a man with wind and self-righteousness.
~Robert Hutchison, address to the British Medical Association, 1930

I know, feeding the troll. Sorry.
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April 24, 2010 12:17pm
Michael

Vegetarians don’t live longer, it just seems longer.
Meat is murder. Tasty, tasty murder.

You are what you eat, turnip!
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April 24, 2010 12:27pm
Luc Hansen

You are what you eat

Is that why I am such a pussy?
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April 24, 2010 12:31pm
Rufus

No Luc, that’s just you… 😉
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April 24, 2010 12:53pm
Jack5

How our NZ MSM toes the PC line….

On a report of a South Park episode being changed after threats from Muslim extremists against the creators, Stuff posts the heading: Network censors South Park creators.

Too PC to say something on the lines of: Muslims force cuts to South Park.

The link:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/tv/3619653/Network-censors-South-Park-creators
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April 24, 2010 1:07pm
LeftRightOut

nO jACK5, no one is too PC to tell an outright lie. You may prefer the lie that “muslims force cuts to South Park”; I prefer the truth that self censorship plays in to their hands. I stand with Theo van Gogh, Geert Wilders, Salman Rushdie and the writer of jesusandmo.net.

You seem to just grandstand.
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April 24, 2010 1:16pm
dad4justice

Jack5, Jesus is a swear word and the Prophet Muhammad are dangerous words these days.
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April 24, 2010 1:17pm
Swiftman the infidel

Swiftman’s perfect Lamb and Red Wine Casserole.

I prefer to cook this in a crock pot or slow cooker.

Mix lamb chops or shanks with:

1 tin of spiced tomatoes
1 packet of Maggi Lamb Casserole mix
1 diced onion
1 chopped onion
Some red wine

Cook until the lamb falls of the bone (a knife should not be necessary).

Suck that up you vegetarian tossers (Hitler was a vegetarian)
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April 24, 2010 1:24pm
Swiftman the infidel

Proof that the Greens are both mad and evil…

1) http://tumeke.blogspot.com/2010/04/national-promotes-legalized-hatred-of.html

‘and to show what a callous and depraved society we really are.’

That’s right folks. We lock up a creep who rapes and murders a child and WE are the evil ones for not letting him have a say in the way our society is run!

2) http://www.nzherald.co.nz/environment/news/article.cfm?c_id=39&objectid=10640574

‘A conference on climate change wants US$300 billion ($422 billion) in ANNUAL compensation from wealthy countries and global companies to deal with global warming effects.’
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April 24, 2010 1:38pm
cha

Parker and Stone>/a> respond to Comedy Central’s decision to alter an episode after a Muslim group’s warning:

In the 14 years we’ve been doing South Park we have never done a show that we couldn’t stand behind. We delivered our version of the show to Comedy Central and they made a determination to alter the episode. It wasn’t some meta-joke on our part. Comedy Central added the bleeps. In fact, Kyle’s customary final speech was about intimidation and fear. It didn’t mention Muhammad at all but it got bleeped too. We’ll be back next week with a whole new show about something completely different and we’ll see what happens to it.
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April 24, 2010 1:38pm
Southern Raider

Just read Willie Jackson’s second weekly column in the East & Bays Courier lambasting Africanas. This is in response to the backlash against Julius Malema.

Both Willie’s columns can be summed up as white man bad, black man can do no wrong.

He even goes so far as claiming that news stories about corruption at senior SA govt levels is fabricated by white men wanting to return to aparthied.

I wonder if Willie has ever been to SA and spoken to both white and black people living there. Julius Malema is the next Mugabe yet Willie and the left seem quite content on doing a Chamberlain and deriding those raising the issues.
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April 24, 2010 1:44pm
Southern Raider

Cha and then you get this shit on the other side

“A Dutch court has acquitted a Muslim group of inciting hatred with a cartoon that questions the Holocaust, in the latest case to provoke debate about freedom of speech in the Netherlands.

The Arab European League (AEL), which published the cartoon on its website, was cleared of insulting Jews because it was not aiming to dispute the Holocaust but to highlight perceived double standards in free speech.”

So it is okay to threaten death to Stone and Parker, but Western Courts defend the other way round.
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April 24, 2010 1:55pm
Pete George

Some more bad news – a new book in the UK has said that crying could damage a baby’s brain. But the bad news is in how it was reported – scaring the shit out of parents doesn’t seem to matter when sensation in the news is required.

Research: Leaving babies to cry harms their brains
By Emma Jolliff

For years, debate has raged about how to deal with crying babies – respond to them, or leave them to cry themselves to sleep.

Now a British psychologist is warning parents that leaving babies to cry can harm their brains. Dr Penelope Leach says new research shows leaving babies to cry can be damaging.

“They build up so much stress that their bodies release stress hormone cortisol, which is washing around the brain and central nervous system. It’s actually toxic to the brain.”

What TV3 didn’t report:

If this happens over long periods and repeatedly, it can be “toxic” to their brains, she says in a new book. Dr Leach suggested unattended extreme crying bouts of 30 minutes or more could be damaging to babies.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/education/8636950.stm

Not many parents, and virtually no good parents, would leave their baby “unattended extreme crying bouts of 30 minutes or more” anyway, so they shouldn’t have anyhting to worry about.

I wonder how many parents will be unnecessarily stressed by this sort of grossly irresponsible reporting.
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April 24, 2010 2:00pm
peterwn

Fisiani – Persuade the University to a reach an agreement with the Polytech so that University students can complete their degree under the aegis of the University. It would not seem unreasonable for the agreement to include seconding a senior University staff member to the Polytech to help with this.
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April 24, 2010 2:12pm
philu

“..(Hitler was a vegetarian)..”

no he wasn’t..

that was all part of a propaganda campaign from goebbels..

..who wanted the fuhrer to appear as more of a ‘revolutionary ascetic’..than he actually was..

(go figure..!..eh..?..)

http://whoar.co.nz/2010/why-hitler-was-not-a-vegetarian/

“.. so I decided to look up the specific passages in Payne’s biography of Hitler .. and Dione Lucas’s The Gourmet Cooking School Cookbook that cast doubt on Hitler’s vegetarianism.

Sure enough, Robert Payne, whose biography of Hitler, The Life and Death of Adolf Hitler, has been called definitive, scotches the rumor that Hitler might have been a vegetarian.

According to Payne, Hitler’s vegetarianism was a fiction made up by his propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels to give him the aura of a revolutionary ascetic ..

.. a Fascistic Gandhi, if you will.

It is worth quoting from Payne’s biography directly:

“Hitler’s asceticism played an important part in the image he projected over Germany.

According to the widely believed legend, he neither smoked nor drank, nor did he eat meat or have anything to do with women.

Only the first was true. .”

mmm..kay..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 24, 2010 2:17pm
Jack5

Leftrightout at 1.16 alleges it is an outright lie that Muslims have forced cuts to SouthPark.

Leftrightout is right out of his skull if he thinks that. It’s crap to say the extremist group Revolution Muslim did not force the cuts when they warned South Park creators Matt Stone and Trey Parker risked the same fate as slain filmmaker Theo Van Gogh. The extremists posted the address of Stone and Parker’s Los Angeles production offices, but denied they were encouraging violence.

Leftrightout, are you an apologist for Muslim extremists or are you just accusing the producers of cowardice by trying to protect Stone and Parker? If you are the former, you should fuck off to Kandahar and sign up with the Taleban. If you are the latter, I’m not sure what point you are making. Are you denying a production company the right to protect business associates, and more basically protect its income stream?

As for your comment:

… I stand with Theo van Gogh, Geert Wilders, Salman Rushdie and the writer of jesusandmo.net.

You seem to just grandstand.

How exactly do you make your stand, Leftrightout? Have you been in the British or American forces or the NZ SAS on the front lines? Do you put write anti-Muslim material that might just set extremists on the path to cut your throat? I doubt you even stand outside a mosque with a billboard?

Or, as I suspect, are you just a weekend blogger, grandstanding like the rest of us?

Meanwhile, Danish cartoonist Kurt Westergaard, who has been attacked and repeatedly threatened over a cartoon of Mohammed, has been placed on indefinite leave by his newspaper “for security reasons.” I suppose, LeftRightOut you think Westergaard’s employer is weak-kneed, too.
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April 24, 2010 2:22pm
Rex Widerstrom

Fisiani:

That’s appalling. My first thought is that when a privately run school (say, a language school teaching migrants) stops doing so, the students have a remedy in tort law. Would that apply to a university, or have they contracted themselves out of actually delivering the service they’ve advertised themselves as offering?

Surely the appropriate action to shut a multi-year course is to say “no new enrolments from today” and then process through everyone who is currently enrolled?

Could she not do such a degree remotely? (I have no idea what’s involved in a design degree… maybe she’d have to submit steel bridges or something).

Perhaps get an injunction (you’d probably get one given the short time frame they’ve allowed) and then explore all your options.
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April 24, 2010 2:27pm
starboard

geez you talk some shit whore…absolute bollocks…
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April 24, 2010 2:31pm
Rex Widerstrom

Swiftman the infidel suggests:

That’s right folks. We lock up a creep who rapes and murders a child and WE are the evil ones for not letting him have a say in the way our society is run!

Really? So we’re sentencing child rapist / murderers to less than 3 years jail now are we?! Because the law always said that someone sentenced to more than 3 years couldn’t vote.

But let’s not let facts get in the way of blind ignorance and emotive tosh now shall we?

The Bill to ban prisoners from voting affects only a tiny number of people and really changes nothing much so it’s reasonable to draw the conclusion, as Tumeke has, that it’s only practical purpose is to give some people in society a group at which to direct their pitchfork-and-torch ignorance, thus distracting at least their limited attention away from the absolute mess this government is making of everything it touches.
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April 24, 2010 2:31pm
philu

“..geez you talk some shit whore…absolute bollocks..”

what are you questioning..?..the links/evidence i have provided..?

care to detail yr queries..?

or are you just blowing it out of that usual orifice you use..?..there..star-bored..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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April 24, 2010 2:38pm
cha

@Jack5 &Southern Raider

Anderson Cooper interviews Ayaan Hirsi Ali about these threats, and the murder of her associate Theo Van Gogh in Amsterdam
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April 24, 2010 3:00pm
Owen McShane

Camco International Ltd., bills itself as “a leader in demonstrating strong financial structuring and placement capabilities for carbon credits,” and is 19.5% owned by Al Gore’s Generation Investment Management. It was trading at 91 British pounds per share in April of 2007. Its shares, which trade on the London Stock Exchange, are now down in the 13.50 pounds per share ($20.56) range.

In the carbon offsets market, “nothing of economic value” is being exchanged except something whose value is created by regulation, he said.
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April 24, 2010 3:13pm
noodle

Yvette, speaking of doom and gloom, and we do far too much of it, I am glumly reminded of a comment by the fabulous Alan Coren when discussing the brevity of life … “life’s little irony number eight, there’s no pleasure, however intense, that cannot be flawed by a brief reflection upon its inevitable transience.”
I shall stop reading these bloody “new” health reports.
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April 24, 2010 3:16pm
Steve

Phool, I have something for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paKJUTBXUoc&feature=related

I like the part about 3.58 where Bourdain is shown a Shanghai trapdoor, he says “I want one of these for my restaurant, vegetarians on table one, bang!”
All vegetarians should be Shanghaied. You should watch more of Bourdain, he can cook meat lol!
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April 24, 2010 3:22pm
Dave Mann

Fisiani, it seems like a clear breach of contract to me so I would suggest that you put your daughter’s case to the Vice Chancellor respectfully and non-confrontationally and give the university a genuine opportunity to come up with some alternatives for cross-credits to an institution of similar status or something like this.

In the meantime, behind the scenes, canvass as many of the other students on the course as you can with the object of joining together to sue the university for breach of contract if they don’t take your concerns seriously or fail to act reasonably.

At the very least the university should be prepared to refund your daughter’s fees and living expenses for the period of the course that she will be unable to complete.
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April 24, 2010 3:31pm
malcolm

Mix lamb chops or shanks with:

1 tin of spiced tomatoes
1 packet of Maggi Lamb Casserole mix
1 diced onion
1 chopped onion
Some red wine

Cook until the lamb falls of the bone (a knife should not be necessary).

Suck that up you vegetarian tossers (Hitler was a vegetarian)

Hitler might have a bit odd, but I feel sure he would have first sweated the onions off.
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April 24, 2010 3:33pm
side show bob

Owen with luck the bastards will go belly up, parisites!!

Boy there are some crooked bastards in Aussie. Six bets were placed with Sportbet (bookies) with the first bet placed on Wednesday. The bets were the Melbourne Storm to take the wooden spoon and $200 was put down, Sportbet was paying $201.Given the storm had won the last two grand finals this was a very unusual bet. The next day 5 more bets were placed with the odds dropping sharply. The scandal then broke and it was announced the storm would be this years wooden spooners, $250,000 was lost by the bookies (so sad). The punters were paid out but are now been hunted. Talk about inside knowledge.
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April 24, 2010 3:41pm
Brian Harmer

Fisiani (249) Says:
April 24th, 2010 at 12:11 pm
…
In todays Otago Daily Times there is a report about an Otago University Senate meeting on Wednesday to disestablish Design Studies at Otago University. This is the first leak of such changes.

…

Any strategic advice for how to deal with this in the next 4 days thanks

I have no connection with Otago, but I would have thought unusual for them to termnate a course midstream. What institutions usually do when a course is no longer economically viable, is to stop admitting people. Instead they allow the those in mid stream to complete and then shut it down. I hope for your daughter’s sake that this is the proposal here. And they often try for some transfer to a related degree as a second option.
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April 24, 2010 4:07pm
starboard

The supply of the world’s most essential energy source is going off a cliff.

…whore , there’s approx 11 trillion barrels of available oil left in the ground ( I work in the energy/aviation industry ) so stop pullin ya pud. I think its gona last past our expiry dates.
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April 24, 2010 5:27pm
JiveKitty

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/stories/2010/04/24/1247fea2ce11

“Waatea News reports the Maori Party MP says he will ask Maori Affairs Minister Pita Sharples to if 500,000 copies can be made so this can happen.

Mr Harawira says the more people use the Declaration the more it will become understood in courts and become part of the law, like the Treaty of Waitangi.”

The Treaty of Waitangi is understood now? I guess that’s why there’s so much debate about its meaning. Ohh, he meant it’s part of law and the Declaration will be too. How nice of Hone to clarify the government’s true intent. (As an aspirational document, it will have a legislative impact, as government will now aspire to create legislation around it.)

Re: South Park, they already depicted Mohammed in the Super Best Friends episode. This amuses me to no end as there was little controversy about it at the time, but I guess times have changed and we and governments and corporations have become paranoid and amenable to bowing down to religious extremists/fundamentalists, especially if they threaten violence. (The appropriate response to violence is not to back down from one’s principles.) The funny thing about these so-called extremists/fundamentalists and their problem with the depiction of Mohammed is that the ban on it is fairly recent historically, so it’s not really what one can consider a fundamental aspect of the faith.

http://zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive/
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April 24, 2010 6:59pm
LeftRightOut

The funny thing about these so-called extremists/fundamentalists and their problem with the depiction of Mohammed is that the ban on it is fairly recent historically, so it’s not really what one can consider a fundamental aspect of the faith.

Bit like Jesus, no one knows what he looked like so how does anyone know when he’s being depicted?
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April 24, 2010 9:14pm
Hurf Durf

In fact, Kyle’s customary final speech was about intimidation and fear.

Delicious irony.
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April 24, 2010 10:05pm
Guy Fawkes

Why are the main roads in NZ called ‘State Highways’ please?

Thought this country was a country and not a State. Or am I a bit thick?
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April 24, 2010 10:23pm
Jack5

New topic…

We’ve had Bollywood and Wellywood, but had you heard about this one in Nigeria, Nollywood

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,690344,00.html
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April 24, 2010 10:27pm
reid

The funny thing about these so-called extremists/fundamentalists and their problem with the depiction of Mohammed is that the ban on it is fairly recent historically, so it’s not really what one can consider a fundamental aspect of the faith.

In fact, Kyle’s customary final speech was about intimidation and fear.

The main reason for it is piety. To outsiders of a belief system, piety: i.e. sincere adherence to and defence of the faith; can come across as intimidating intimidation and fear.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not defending it, I’m merely explaining it as I see it expressed by Muslims.

In Islam you’ve got a large bunch of pious moderates who are just like you and I, except they’re pious compared to us but basically they just want to relax, watch sport, etc. Then you’ve got the small bunch of really radical stirrers who hide behind piety and use it like a cloak and do not just some, but all of the shit that hits the 6 o’clock news.

The only difference between Islam and Christianity in terms of its social influence by way of attitude is the degree of piety within its followers. You will recall of course the piety level in 18th century was rather high amongst our Christian selves, since diminished to a mere whisper, and some including me say, we’re not better for it. However Islam is merely riding that same wave, right here, right now.
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April 24, 2010 11:20pm
NOt1tocommentoften

Guy Fawkes – you are a bit thick.

Rex – what remedy would you have in tort?
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April 25, 2010 1:35am
boredboy

“The supply of the world’s most essential energy source is going off a cliff.

…whore , there’s approx 11 trillion barrels of available oil left in the ground ( I work in the energy/aviation industry ) so stop pullin ya pud. I think its gona last past our expiry dates.”

I also work in the aviation industry; however I am not involved in the energy industry as it relates to aviation.

There is 11 trillion bbl left but I’ll bet you that at least the last 3 trillion wont ever be tapped.

the next 6 trillion will be so difficult to extract that, due to costs of extraction and scarcity, aviation will fold.

The figures are a guess but don’t think for a moment that we are going to get $80/bbl oil right up till the last drop.
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April 25, 2010 4:08am
starboard

There is 11 trillion bbl left but I’ll bet you that at least the last 3 trillion wont ever be tapped.

the next 6 trillion will be so difficult to extract that, due to costs of extraction and scarcity, aviation will fold.

..by the time they tap the first 6 trillion you mention there will be advances in process and recovery…the remaining oil will become easily retrievable… I agree re the price…its only going to skyrocket. Aviation will find an alternative to Jet A1…sooner than you think I believe.
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April 25, 2010 4:22am
boredboy

Granted jet engines can pretty much burn anything you like but there are problems for the alternatives.

Discounting the fact that 99% of alternatives starve 100s of millions of people…

Jatropha is fine but we have only managed to fly a 50/50 mix. You would think that with the potential for it that someone would have lit, or at least designed, a 100% Jatropha jet?

If 50/50 is all we are going to get out of it, all we are doing is delaying the inevitable?
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April 25, 2010 4:45am
boredboy

I’m just cynical because of absence of some sort of Warren Buffetesque type who has been prepared to bet large sums on a viable alternative for when the jet a market fails.

(Pistons don’t count as aviation in this context!)
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April 25, 2010 4:52am
starboard

I believe Air NZ have done away with the idea of Jatropha after trialling it in a 747…didnt hear the full report on why.
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April 25, 2010 5:37am
boredboy

Yeah. I was looking for a reference. I had the spiel back when I was in NZ from CP Morgan. IIRC they cited the economics of trialling for dropping the programme.

As an aviation industry employee, I am gunning it in the sector for now but mindful of the fact I will likely retire from a different industry.
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April 25, 2010 6:29am
Viking2

We will probably make jet feul from milk. after all we can make vodka from milk. Same thing in my book.
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April 25, 2010 9:07am
side show bob

Heard a radio interview the other night April 13th (USA), the long and short of this was there are negotiations under way for development of a motor that will make jet engines or any other engines look like a horse and cart. I wouldn’t start hording oil although it will always be required. Every price rise in oil just makes the future a little closer. If anyone is interest try johnsearlstory.com. Apparently this technology has been around for some years.
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April 25, 2010 9:44am
tvb

An airforce helecopter has craashed near Pukerua Bay on its way to ANZAC parade in Wellington with 4 on board 3 killed. There must be senior Military/VIPs on Board, so far silence. I guess families must be told first and the PM if VIPs are involved. Thank goodness the PM is out of the country so it cannot be him.
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April 25, 2010 9:52am
cha

New topic…

We’ve had Bollywood and Wellywood, but had you heard about this one in Nigeria, Nollywood

Snap!

Links don’t work though.
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April 25, 2010 10:05am
cha

An airforce helecopter has craashed near Pukerua Bay….

.
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April 25, 2010 10:08am
RKBee

Viking2 @9:07 am
>We will probably make jet feul from milk. after all we can make vodka from milk. Same thing in my book.

Fonterra shareholders creaming it….

Fonterra shares up 50%…. a milk solids investment…
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April 25, 2010 1:44pm
MikeNZ

Redbaiter (9459) Says:
April 24th, 2010 at 11:51 am

Can you explain this to me?
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April 25, 2010 2:52pm

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