General Debate 20 July 2012

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barry

The Maori council and their legal people tell lies. Their claim that they have been paid the minimum wage (Manu Paul said yesterday) is a lie.
They simply havent filled in and filed the paperwork they have to, to get the pay they are entitled to – according to the justice dept.
Yet the legal guy started yesterdays winding up with a wild claim that he hadnt sleep for 72 hours due to the worry he had over not being paid – he then made a dramatic claim that he might not start his widning up due to his state of mind. The court then asked if he was going to start (with the obvious consequence that if he didnt, the court would move on.) So he decided to do what he is paid for.

What a wanker.
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July 20, 2012 8:04am
Pete George

Something that happened virtually unnoticed yesterday was the launch of the New Zealand Formulary, a medicines database available to everyone online and downloadable (ebook or PDF). This is a great resource.

NZ Medicines Formulary launched by Peter Dunne

This is the result of a multi group, multi government project. Dunne became involved in 2005.
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July 20, 2012 8:06am
Manolo

This is the result of a multi group, multi government project. Dunne became involved in 2005.

He’s a national treasure, isn’t he? Let’s keep the chameleon in Parliament until 2057.
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July 20, 2012 8:16am
hj

On the Panel (Radio NZ) they were discussing the downturn in tourism. A lecturer in tourism from Lincoln University pointed out that tourism from China had increased (off a low base) by 26%. He said we will have to advertise in China and upskill with the language. The Chinese will/ are doing this for themselves, however and even if a Kiwi learns mandarin at polytech they will still struggle compared to a native born speaker. These days there are more Chinese born driver/ guides that Kiwi (by a long shot) and that includes buses with a guide.
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July 20, 2012 8:18am
Komata

Apropos the Maori Council: Did anyone else notice that when they didn’t get their own way they, via their lawyer, very quickly resorted to the tried and true ‘racism’ accusation, accusing the Justice Department (by statute an apolitical organisation), of being guilty of this sin?

Also, aren’t lawyers supposed to only convey their client’s viewpoint, rather than express their own personal opinions? if that is the case, then Mr. Gyringger(?) would seem to have forgotten his brief when he started his rant. A bit petulant really.

BTW: Are there elections for seats on the Maori Council due soon? This would seem to be one explanation for their most peculiar actions over water. Perhaps some of the Council’s members feel threatened and need to be seen to be ‘doing something’ to retain their (well paying?) seats? One wonders . . .
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July 20, 2012 8:24am
Bed Rater

Peter Dunne and Peter George, both riding on the coattails of the currently favoured political party and associated mouth pieces.

I’ve often wondered what would happen to blogs like Yournz and Keeping Stock if Kiwiblog decided to turn off the comments.
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July 20, 2012 8:25am
Keeping Stock

The Comedian goes back to Court to be resentenced this morning. He may well have been able to “make people laugh” in his past life, but what he did to his daughter was anything but funny. Here’s hoping that the sentencing District Court judge takes a cue from the High Court’s decision, and at the very least enters a conviction against him so that he experiences some of the consequences he exposed his partner and daughter to.

http://keepingstock.blogspot.co.nz/2012/07/no-laughing-matter.html
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July 20, 2012 8:26am
hj

When the Japanese market grew in the 1980’s there would be an old guy with a limousine at the airport with a Japanese person on a working holiday visa for “honeymooners” and a bus with a Kiwi driver and a guide. After a good long run, as the Japanese market declined Japanese started driving vans. Chinese however have migrated here after filling flexible immigration requirements and simply take over.
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July 20, 2012 8:31am
flipper

Did I hear/see wrong? Has the Government “agreed” to pay legal and associated expenses for lawyers and other amounting to $1million plus. Moreover, the reason they have not yet got their ,money is that they have not detailed thior expenses (etc. nd therby seek to justify their claim), is it not?
Wonder whether la Harawira’s coists are included ……
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July 20, 2012 8:43am
Pete George

Manolo and Bed Rater – can’t you give any credit where it’s due? The NZF is an example of how a lot of what parliament does goes under the radar because it’s not controversial, it’s just good, effective politics.

Murray Tilyard drove the Formulary project, he’s a Dunedin GP and Professor of General Practice, at the Dunedin School of Medicine.

Peter Dunne became involved in 2005 as Associate Minister of Health in a Clark led government. The project continued under the Key government, but it involved many other people and groups.

One cannot forget groups like the Health Information Strategy Action Committee, the Health Information Standards Organisation and its Expert Advisory Group, the Safe Medication Management Programme and the NZULM Steering Group for their pioneering work with regards to a medicine terminology for New Zealand and the New Zealand Universal List of Medicines

In 2010, a clinically led reference group with broad sector representation helped further define what a medicines formulary for New Zealand should be.

Out of six parties interested in providing medicines formulary for New Zealand, a partnership between BPACnz, BPACinc and the UK based Royal Pharmaceutical Society was selected.

This is an example of good politics combined with good medicine. Criticisms are an example of being stuck in a negative rut.

It seems you can’t please some of the people any of the time.
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July 20, 2012 8:46am
James Stephenson

It seems you can’t please some of the people any of the time.

I don’t know why you bother trying.
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July 20, 2012 9:01am
liarbors a joke

http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8502158/journo-murder-accused-back-in-court

nothing short of the noose for these vermin…
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July 20, 2012 9:04am
Mark

Just spare a thought for Tim Brown and his family today. Tim and Infratil director was run down by a bus in Willis Street yesterday and is in the ICU at Wellington. Hell of a nice guy.
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July 20, 2012 9:09am
MT_Tinman

Pete George (13,886) Says:
July 20th, 2012 at 8:46 am
“One cannot forget groups like the Health Information Strategy Action Committee, the Health Information Standards Organisation and its Expert Advisory Group, the Safe Medication Management Programme and the NZULM Steering Group for their pioneering work”

I agree but by god I’ll sure give it the ol’ college try!
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July 20, 2012 9:09am
Puzzled in Ekatahuna

Why the Maori Party won’t walk – not until Pita gets a better offer

Maori Party co-leader Pita Sharples – Monday February 8, 2010
The Maori Party hoped to be a part of any government, regardless of its leanings. Then he confessed: “Actually, I got so used to the increase in salary I told the Prime Minister you’d better be good because if the other guys get in, I’ll go sell myself over there to keep my ministerial salary. I just got a new house, man – I can’t afford it on a backbencher salary so I’m up for grabs.” Whoops.
– http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10624773

No so puzzling after all
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July 20, 2012 9:11am
David Garrett

Puzzled: Many a true word said in jest, as the old saying has it…
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July 20, 2012 9:19am
Michael Mckee

I’ve never understood why WCC hasn’t put railings up at black spots, but then I don’t understand why they won’t buy 12 sirens at $5000 a pop for tsunami warnings, when they spend that on tea and cake for the committees each year.
I guess dead ratepayers don’t vote.
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July 20, 2012 9:20am
barry

re:

Mark (694) Says:
July 20th, 2012 at 9:09 am — Tim brown etc.

Yes feel sorry for him – but dont forget hes on the body that decided to re-route buses in Wellington despite warnings that people would be hurt. Even after several people had been hit they only decided to reduce the speed.

Now if I as a private person had run down several people on the street of wellington – the police would surely have charged me by now with dangerous driving – as they do to most people who have accidents where people are hurt or killed.

But whats happend to people who made these decisions for the Wellington buses? I beliveve nothing……
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July 20, 2012 9:25am
Michael Mckee

Good points Barry, though wouldn’t wish this on anyone least of all people with kids.
condolences to all involved including staff.
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July 20, 2012 9:35am
Reid

…he then made a dramatic claim that he might not start his widning up due to his state of mind. The court then asked if he was going to start (with the obvious consequence that if he didnt, the court would move on.) So he decided to do what he is paid for.

Surprised he didn’t start blubbing while his clients sang a haunting waiata. I imagine they would’ve if it had been just a silly old white mans court room. It’s only because the tribunal (arguably) understands Maori culture they were able, without massive accusations of racism, to call bullshit on his mentalism. Even then it’s almost certainly going to be one of the grounds for appeal if they don’t immediately get 100% water rights with a substantial taniwha maintenance allowance. How the hell all those taniwha have managed to just lurk away without anyone noticing them and without the taniwha themselves ever doing something to protect their homey tribes like say, sabotaging the turbine blades, is just a miracle. Clearly the whole country has been dodging bullets for hundreds of years, and we never even knew.

It occurs to me that this could be the answer to changing our current national ranking in Jane’s World of Target Opportunities, where we currently list as a THLG (Totally Helpless Little Girl). Imagine if we can just head along to our local taniwha infestation, grab a few bucket loads of them and just drop them from any old Orion or Hercules and hey presto – there ya go! Take that, you enemy country you! So there!

There’s always a silver lining.

BTW, if anyone feels like some humerous Obama captions, I posted lots last night from a site I just found.
http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2012/07/general_debate_19_july_2012.html#comment-998688

barry, Micheal, I don’t understand why it happens. I know the area. I just don’t get why. Any thoughts?
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July 20, 2012 9:46am
Yvette

The koru is the Maori name given to the newborn, unfurling fern frond and symbolises new life, growth, strength and peace. It is an integral symbol in Maori carving and tattoos. The koru is an iconic symbol of New Zealand flora.

So why mention this?
It’s just that this morning, prompted by reports of tobacco company protests at ant-smoking measures, I looked at the Action on Smoking and Health [ASH] website and see their logo is a
stylised cigarette with a koru [new life, growth, strength and peace ] superimposed over it.
What were they smoking when they designed that?
🙂
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July 20, 2012 9:55am
kowtow

puzzled
While there may have been some intended humour in that statement if the MSM don’t pick this up and create a furore then they are hypocrites, Imagine the response if Winnie had said that.

Just like Air NZ ripping off it’s NZ customers by charging more for NZ to Britain than the fare for Britain to NZ, that story will die or be killed.
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July 20, 2012 9:58am
Manolo

The scourge of political correctness: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07/19/fort-hood-report-recommends-many-changes-for-fbi-no-disciplinary-action/
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July 20, 2012 10:04am
Weihana

Keeping Stock (7,883) Says:
July 20th, 2012 at 8:26 am

The Comedian goes back to Court to be resentenced this morning. He may well have been able to “make people laugh” in his past life, but what he did to his daughter was anything but funny. Here’s hoping that the sentencing District Court judge takes a cue from the High Court’s decision, and at the very least enters a conviction against him so that he experiences some of the consequences he exposed his partner and daughter to.

While legally I think the judge’s decision was wrong, it was entirely understandable. In law it was wrong because the man entered a guilty plea which implies an admission of intent in which case the man’s intoxication was irrelevant. But that plea is inconsistent with what the comedian actually claimed. The comedian claims he was drunk and he says he didn’t know what he was doing. The judge took into account this reality while effectively ignoring the guilty plea. The judge, like many others, obviously considered this man not to be a paedophile per se and thus the offending was at the very low end of the scale.

Indeed I think it’s reasonable to suspect that the consequences to which his daughter has been exposed has very little to do with the incident itself and much more to do with the fact that this family has broken up and the daughter feels responsible. While the mother’s actions are entirely understandable, ironically the daughter may have been better off had the mother simply given her husband two black eyes and imposed a drinking ban.

That’s if you accept the notion that the incident resulted from intoxication and an inability to know what he was doing, rather than those circumstances serving as an excuse for intentional abuse.
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July 20, 2012 10:25am
Manolo

Helping the incompetent’s cause: http://entertainment.msn.co.nz/article.aspx?id=8502215
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July 20, 2012 10:47am
cha

Something that happened virtually unnoticed yesterday was the launch of the New Zealand Formulary, a medicines database available to everyone online and downloadable (ebook or PDF). This is a great resource.

So Medsafe was a waste of time?.
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July 20, 2012 10:53am
Keeping Stock

@ Weihana – if The Comedian was so drunk that he could not tell the difference between the gentilalia of his partner and those of a four-year-old girl, then he is entirely the author of his own misfortune.

What happened that night and since is totally of his doing, and it is fatuous to try and pass off the blame to his partner or their daughter. Good on him for pleading guilty, but he now needs to take his punishment and understand that his partner and child were the victims that night, and not his career. He should have thought about that before getting pissed.
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July 20, 2012 11:09am
Pete George

What are taniwha? They can be different things. That makes it hard to know how to deal with the current taniwha. Are we confused, or are we being exploited?

In the current context of taniwha guardianship over water, are taniwha:
– highly respected spiritual kaitiaki (protective guardians) of waterways?
– predatory beings, which for example would hijack a political process for financial gain?

That gives us the taniwha dilemma.
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July 20, 2012 11:09am
KevinH

@Pete George
If I am not mistaken your blessed leader is the man with the most power in our current coalition arrangement, the King Maker, the Deal Breaker, on his vote the government swings or falls. Surely with that amount of power he can do more than publish a medicines database, a mere trifle for a man with such influence.
This is his time to shine, if he has the courage.
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July 20, 2012 11:15am
Manolo

This is his time to shine, if he (Dunne) has the courage.

Top prize as winner of joke of the century.
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July 20, 2012 11:21am
Reid

From Pete’s link:

There are people who genuinely believe in old spiritual legends, and there are people who use any advantage they can to extort a financial advantage.

And it’s difficult to tell them apart.

No I’m afraid I disagree Pete, it’s not hard at all. The timing on this is the giveaway as to which category these current complainants come under. They didn’t even lodge their case at the time the asset sales were being first mooted around 3-4 years ago. That was really the latest time they could have lodged it if they want to claim their claim is genuine. After all, if this is something you truly have in your consciousness, then the first time one hears about the ownership being affected, is when you lodge it. You don’t muck around.

If we had any decent journalism in this country, we would be getting stories explaining the background lobbying that has gone on in the months and weeks prior to this claim being lodged. So far in the entire media coverage I have only seen this mentioned in one passing sentence and the millions and millions of written and spoken words have never ever mentioned it again. Doesn’t that speak volumes, for the traitors who call themselves journalists and editors in this country.
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July 20, 2012 11:23am
Pete George

@KevinH, you are mistaken.

Peter Dunne is not my blessed leader, he is someone I have an association, I think for mutual benefit.

Peter Dunne is not “the man with the most power”, he has 1/121 of the parliamentary vote and 1/64 of the coalition vote. The fact that he doesn’t abuse his power is a reason why he is respected and worked with (by those who matter). Those who would like to abuse power and can’t abuse him.

However Peter Dunne does do more than assist with the Formulary. Quite a bit more. It so happens that he is not the headline maker that MPs like Peters and Harawira are, so what he does doesn’t get much coverage.

For example, MSM have ignored the launch of the NZF, the only hit obn Google News just now is:
Formulary team at centre stage for go-live moment
‎

New Zealand Doctor Online

A 10-year contract to develop and operate a national medicines information resource bore its first fruit with the launch yesterday of the New Zealand Formulary.

The Otago Medical School general practice professor says he has no doubt the formulary will save lives, reduce mortality and prove extremely cost-effective.

Isn’t it odd that we are in a pop-a-pill pandemic but there’s no interest in this?
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July 20, 2012 11:30am
Joseph Carpenter

Is Peter Dunne/United Future prepared to abolish the Maori seats in 2014 rather 2017 as is their current policy? And if not why not?
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July 20, 2012 11:37am
cha

FFS, loons and their sky fairies.

However, Victoria University biology sciences professor Shaun Holt said the therapies were a “strange mix”. “Meditation and massage great – the others not so.”

There was no evidence-based research on reiki, Christian prayer and Maori healing being useful.

He described reiki – which involves the practitioner placing their hands lightly on the body, supposedly allowing a free flow of universal energy – as “witchcraft”.

That was a term also used by Whanganui District Health Board member Michael Laws, who described the therapy service as a “seriously stupid decision that hasn’t gone anywhere near the DHB board table”.

Fellow board member Clive Solomon suggested the hospital “should pay some attention to getting proper standards of care and empathy in conventional Western medicine (which is sorely lacking) first before embarking on bone-throwing with taxpayer money”.
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July 20, 2012 11:37am
Manolo

Is Peter Dunne/United Future prepared to abolish the Maori seats in 2014 rather 2017 as is their current policy? And if not why not?

Did you say how much?
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July 20, 2012 11:40am
Jimmy Smits

http://controversy.wearscience.com/

http://filebox.vt.edu/users/brwill14/zimmerman.png
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July 20, 2012 11:45am
publicwatchdog

Seen this Kiwibloggers?

🙂

WELLINGTON!!

BEWARE OF THE $UPERCITY – SUPER RIPOFF!!!

http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/wellington-%E2%80%98super-city-options-out-consultation-wb-123980

The Auckland $UPERCITY experience?

Bigger contracts for bigger private contractors.

Rates increases for citizens and ratepayers.

The ‘books’ STILL not open.

Residents and ratepayers are STILL not given the ‘devilish detail’ showing EXACTLY where our public monies are being spent.

We do not know the NAMES of the 12,500 suppliers who have 5000 contracts with Auckland Council and the five CCOs (excluding Auckland Transport and Watercare Services).

We don’t know the SCOPE, the TERM or the VALUE of these contracts.

There is no publicly-available ‘Register of Interests’ for either elected representatives or Council / CCO staff responsible for property or procurement.

How much corruption is involved in the awarding of these contracts?

How can ‘conflicts of interest’ be minimised – if interests are not DECLARED and available for public scrutiny?

WHO IS CHECKING?

The Auckland $UPERCITY was a corporate takeover of the Auckland region, and the public majority have effectively become a giant ca$h cow – all pay – bugger all ‘say’.

WELLINGTON! BEWARE!

Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

http://www.stopthesupercity.org.nz

http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com
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July 20, 2012 11:49am
KevinH

By himself Peter Dunne cannot abolish the Maori Seats, that requires a consensus within parliament and a vote comprising 75% of all seats, besides there are more weighty measures that he could influence if he so chose, such as asset sales.
As I mentioned before, now is his time to distinguish himself beyond housekeeping, do something of substance or be remembered as the grey man of New Zealand politics, a polite description under the circumstances.
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July 20, 2012 11:54am
Joseph Carpenter

KevinH you are completely wrong. The Maori seats are not entrenched in the Electoral Act, it only requires a simple majority (50%+1) to remove them. The reason I ask is that it is long stated National and Act policy to remove them (= the 50%), the only reason they aren’t gone is because of National’s coalition agreement with the Maori Party. But if that coalition fails, as is entirely possible, will United Future become +1? It’s UF policy to abolish them in 2017 but why not 2014? I think it’s a fair and relevant question.

And how the hell could he influence the asset sales now given the MOMSOE Act is already law with his vote?
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July 20, 2012 12:10pm
Pete George

Peter Dunne already has influenced the MOM Bill, as much as he had said that he would.

I’ll ask him about the Maori seats, but it looks like he’s had trouble getting backing:

Dunne calls for resolution of Maori seats ‘distortion’
6 October 2008

UnitedFuture leader Peter Dunne today reiterated that if New Zealanders want the MMP system of government to work properly, then the issue of the dedicated Maori seats in Parliament needed to be resolved once and for all.

“UnitedFuture wants to see a binding referendum in 2010 on whether the seats should be retained or not, and the resulting decision implemented at the 2014 election,” he said.

http://www.unitedfuture.org.nz/dunne-calls-for-resolution-of-maori-seats-1/

Where does it say that it’s UF policy for 2017? Current policy – Ethnic Affairs:

Hold an early referendum on the future of the Maori seats in Parliament, as UnitedFuture believes that no ethnicity should have special privilege above others in our proportional electoral system.

http://www.unitedfuture.org.nz/ethnic-affairs/

It’s possible that 2017 is now the earliest possible realistic timeframe.
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July 20, 2012 12:19pm
Weihana

Keeping Stock (7,884) Says:
July 20th, 2012 at 11:09 am

@ Weihana – if The Comedian was so drunk that he could not tell the difference between the gentilalia of his partner and those of a four-year-old girl, then he is entirely the author of his own misfortune.

I agree. He is still responsible for being so intoxicated that he cannot control himself, notwithstanding the claim that he had a predisposition to acting out in his sleep. But if the incident was intentional, as opposed to accidental, then it dramatically changes how we should view the best interests of the child.

What happened that night and since is totally of his doing, and it is fatuous to try and pass off the blame to his partner or their daughter. Good on him for pleading guilty, but he now needs to take his punishment and understand that his partner and child were the victims that night, and not his career. He should have thought about that before getting pissed.

I don’t believe anyone is blaming the mother or daughter for his actions, whether intentional or otherwise. But it is nevertheless relevant to consider that how we deal with this incident can exacerbate the harm to the child. The child’s interests should be paramount in this matter and it appears as though the consequences of legal action and social interest has likely had a more profound impact on the child than the incident itself did.

While it is fair that this man is punished for irresponsible drinking which led to this incident, and arguably the end of his career and his reputation (we all know who he is) is a reasonable punishment in that context. However, it is hard to see what purpose is served by treating him as if he were an actual paedophile intending to abuse his daughter. He may have plead guilty implying that he is an actual paedophile but it would seem even the trial judge did not believe that to be the case. The judge’s reference to his comedic career was not well thought out, but I think it reflects the judge’s attitude that the man was guilty of being irresponsible, he was not intrinsically a bad person and hence the sentence should reflect that.
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July 20, 2012 12:22pm
Joseph Carpenter

Mr Peter George, current stated United Future Policy/Manifesto on Electoral System: “Initiate a referendum on the future of Maori seats in Parliament with a view to abolishing the seats by 2017. This would give effect to the recommendation in the 1986 Royal Commission on the Electoral System.”. Interesting, I was unaware he wanted them gone far earlier and indeed supported removing them by the 2014 election. I just considering the following scenario: What if the Maori Party is indeed only in it for the baubles, in which case it would make perfect sense for them to hang in there until a few months out from the next election in 2014, spit the dummy, campaign against National and have secret coalition negotiations with Labour and the Greens with entrenchment of the Maori seats as their bottom line. Once they’re entrenched they will never go, and for National or a left wing coalition to ever form a Government again it will extremely likely be a straight out bauble bidding war for the Maori seat MP’s, would that be in NZ’s best long term interest?
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July 20, 2012 12:40pm
Pete George

From Peter Dunne:

Our policy is actually for a referendum on the future of the Maori seats, with the commitment to implement their abolition by 2017, if that is what people decide. This issue, like all major constitutional issues, is one the public, not the politicians, should decide.

I think he makes a good distinction – the politicians should enable a decision by the people on major constitutional issues.

It would be an interesting referendum, with both sides needing to sell their case with modern arguments.
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July 20, 2012 12:53pm
Paulus

Arn’t the Tanhiwha related to the Leprechaun.
I’ve seen them (after a few Guinness) too, so I know they are real.
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July 20, 2012 1:18pm
Manolo

NZ judiciary is a bloody joke. The sentence given to this animal is far too lenient:
http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8502330/dad-on-home-detention-for-injuring-baby
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July 20, 2012 1:19pm
liarbors a joke

I blame those bwad white people…they made me do it..they made me break babies bones..
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July 20, 2012 1:22pm
Keeping Stock

@ Weihana (12.22pm); generally, I agree. I don’t think that jail time would serve any purpose, but at the very least The Comedian must be convicted for the offence that he admitted. The discharge without conviction by Judge Philippa Cunningham was a very poor decision, as the High Court has indicated. It took far too much account of The Comedian’s circumstances, and far too little of the effect on the victims of his offending; his daughter and his partner.

And as for the stuff about making people laugh; he was never really that funny anyway!
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July 20, 2012 1:32pm
Weihana

Manolo,

Except that the jury found that it had not been proven that the defendant had deliberately harmed the child. The sentence must reflect the findings of the jury. The raft of injuries seems to me to support the prosecutor’s claim of abuse (rather than mere ignorance) but still the jury only convicted him on the basis of reckless disregard and the sentence would seem more or less fair in that context.
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July 20, 2012 1:34pm
Pete George

Jane Clifton starts her column with a bit of a look at the difficulties of the Maori Party but then launches into a majoe examination of the Labour/Green scenario.

A Labour-Green coalition could make the Maori-National water tiff seem a storm in a teacup.

The polls show a Labour-Green coalition is fairly likely – but with a big discount in the humility/suck-it-up quotient we’ve come to expect from minor partners.

With a bedrock vote of about 10%, the Greens won’t be doing minor. It’s likely they will be much less gracious in the art of compromise over core issues than the Maori Party has been.

Because, not to put too fine a point on it, the Greens are all core. And with a vote count potentially a respectable third of Labour’s, they will be extremely assertive.

Jane Clifton: Minority report
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July 20, 2012 1:43pm
Elaycee

“While it is fair that this man is punished for irresponsible drinking which led to this incident,….”

Whaaaaat? Jesus wept…. what total bollocks.

This idiot’s drinking is not a charge. Never was part of any charge. This moron will be punished for his appalling actions in bed with his daughter. So don’t try to paint this prick as something other than what he is…

“I was drunk” is not a ‘defence’ for his actions. In fact, there is no defence for his actions.

Locking the prick up is the only logical outcome.
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July 20, 2012 1:47pm
Manolo

This “thing” couldn’t be any closer to a primitive of 20,000 years ago:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/7310024/Lawyer-argues-for-gang-insignia-on-graves
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July 20, 2012 2:07pm
Reid

Jane Clifton starts her column with a bit of a look at the difficulties of the Maori Party but then launches into a majoe examination of the Labour/Green scenario.

I’ve always thought the most dangerous thing the Gweens could ever do to themselves is to actually gain real power. For then, you see, the voters will finally realise what towering monstrous mentalists the whole damn lot of them really truly actually in fact are.

The Gweens will as a consequence of this short but memorable public folly never ever be permitted to stand again for public office anywhere in NZ in fact the nation may even demand a new law requiring all Gween members to declare themselves to police so that, like sex offenders, we can be sure they aren’t allowed ever to do anything at all, ever again.

I’m planning to leave the country for the period of time they are in power, BTW, but I wish those of you who stay around, all the very best, and thanks for being so courageous, I truly respect you for that.
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July 20, 2012 2:10pm
Weihana

Elaycee,

“I was drunk” is not a ‘defence’ for his actions. In fact, there is no defence for his actions.

True, being drunk is not a mitigating factor under the sentencing act. But what the offender claimed wasn’t as simple as that. My understanding is that the offender claimed to have a history of acting out (unaware) while asleep. Arguably that could be taken as a mitigating factor regardless of intoxication, however I’m not sure how given that he plead guilty which implies intent.

But aside from that, my understanding of our common law system is that people are generally not convicted on actions alone. If the man had not have plead guilty he may have been acquitted if the prosecution could not prove intent. If I am not mistaken he had a recognized history of acting out unaware in his sleep. Whether that is just a convenient excuse I don’t know.
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July 20, 2012 2:18pm
kowtow

paulus

While the leprechaun and taniwhas are related there is one big difference.

In Ireland there was never a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow aand you could never catch that leprechaun (no matter how much Bushmills you’d consumed) but in New Zealand there ‘s always a government willing to spend tax payer money on a taniwha at the foot of a waterfall,or near where a power station needs building.
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July 20, 2012 2:24pm
Reid

You mean we’re dumber than the Irish kowtow. That’s what you’re saying, isn’t it. Don’t pull any punches now. You can be honest.

people are generally not convicted on actions alone

That’s right Weihana. For a crime, you need to be found guilty of committing the act and have a guilty mind (guilty act – actus reus and mens rea). If you don’t have both of those, you’re not guilty.
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July 20, 2012 2:39pm
Manolo

Laziness index (courtesy of Lindsay Mitchell):
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/07/a-graph-of-the-laziest-countries-in-the-world-hooray-were-not-1/260022/
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July 20, 2012 2:48pm
kowtow

No reid we’re not dumber than the Oirish but we’re dumb to shell out based on ethnicity and alleged past wrongs.

Regarding beliefs in spirits and folklore I remembe r in the 70s and early 80s there was a strong belief in superstition ,the little people,enchanted trees and fairy forts etc . Unfortunately no one could make money out of the government on the back of that.
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July 20, 2012 2:57pm
mikenmild

Well, lots of people are still superstitious of course. Especially those folks who imagine they are eating the body and drinking the blood of their savious on a regualr basis.
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July 20, 2012 3:26pm
Elaycee

@Weihana – By pleading guilty, he actually confirmed that the charge, as laid, was valid and that the facts, as presented, were an accurate portrayal of events. Otherwise, he would have contested the charges.

So for the sake of any debate, it may be best to stick to the facts.

He admitted his guilt. And he has been convicted. Now he needs to accept the consequences of his actions.
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July 20, 2012 3:28pm
kowtow

on our tea break are we milky?

you’re a great fucken ad for the public service,ya sad prick. There’s a bit of Christian love for ya,arsehole.
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July 20, 2012 3:35pm
mikenmild

It is tea-time actually. Taxpayer-funded cake today, too.
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July 20, 2012 3:37pm
David Garrett

kowtow: that’s a bit harsh mate…Milky doesnt abuse anyone…and some of his posts contain more than a little grain of sense…and at least he can write and English sentence, unlike he who shall not be named…

Does anyone know what happened to him? Has he been institutionalised? I don’t think he quite managed the ban threshold…
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July 20, 2012 3:41pm
kowtow

grains of fricken non sense….

I hope my cake gives him infrickendigestion…..
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July 20, 2012 3:45pm
Pete George

Tahu Potiki makes an interesting comparison betwen Owen Glen…

I was staggered to learn of the $80 million donation made by Owen Glenn to assist in the battle against the social malady that is domestic violence in New Zealand.

He has already proven his generosity by donating to worthy causes and projects, but this surely stands out as the single most generous personal donation to a single community issue such as this in New Zealand’s history.

…and Ngai Tahu…

I could tell you for a fact that Ngai Tahu has spent more than $80m since settlement on bureaucracy, political manoeuvring, governance and public relations.

They have spent nothing like that on housing, health, welfare and domestic safety of their tribal members.

Potiki is challenged by some values…

Over the past 20 years I have been involved in several interesting and exciting discussions and developments amongst iwi planning for their futures in a post- settlement world.

In many, if not most, instances when the question of iwi investment in social issues that impact upon Maori arises the expectation is on the government to resolve the problems.

In theory I agree that the government has the primary responsibility to address these matters, but maybe social policy from an iwi perspective requires revisiting.

He also expresses admiration for Willie Apiata’s new choice of career in his Press column.
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July 20, 2012 3:52pm
Reid

By pleading guilty, he actually confirmed that the charge, as laid, was valid and that the facts, as presented, were an accurate portrayal of events.

Elaycee, not necessarily. As in, yes legally that is the follow on but this doesn’t mean that the guilty plea was not a mere manoeuvre opening the way for the resolution which arose prior to this appeal reversing it.

I don’t know if it was that but if it was, then from a factual perspective no it doesn’t mean he confirmed the charge etc. Like I said, I don’t know if that’s what happened, but it could have. And more to the point, you don’t know that it didn’t happen that way.
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July 20, 2012 4:12pm
Weihana

Elaycee (2,630) Says:
July 20th, 2012 at 3:28 pm

@Weihana – By pleading guilty, he actually confirmed that the charge, as laid, was valid and that the facts, as presented, were an accurate portrayal of events. Otherwise, he would have contested the charges.

So for the sake of any debate, it may be best to stick to the facts.

People often plead guilty for a variety of reasons, not necessarily because they truly accept the charges. That something must be accepted as fact under law does not necessarily mean that it is a fact in actuality. In my view the claim to have acted unaware whilst asleep contradicts his guilty plea. But unfortunately for him he cannot use a defence as a factor in mitigation.
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July 20, 2012 4:12pm
redeye

Please please Mr Carter. Can you do anything about this
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July 20, 2012 4:28pm
Reid

This is really good:

This documentary is about the foreign policy of the United States. It demonstrates the importance of the political economy, the Mafia principle, propaganda, ideology, violence and force.

The Mafia principle is the way that if someone refuses to pay their protection money then even if the Don doesn’t care about the money it’s still necessary to go and make an example of him because you cannot have resistance let alone successful resistance even if it’s in a small country. This is the domino theory which is why they went into Vietnam but they didn’t go there to win the occupation they went there to poison the country so it would never be a successful example of resistance and so they not only trashed the whole country they installed nasty dictators in all the surrounding countries as well.

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/power-principle/
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July 20, 2012 4:33pm
Sofia

Seen this kiwibloggers?

🙂

WATER ‘OWNERSHIP’ NOT THE ISSUE

– http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/7315880/Water-ownership-not-the-issue

Briefly, nobody has a whucking clue as to what anyone else is on about –

Maori Council co-chair Maanu Paul … likened it to someone coming into your home and putting a stranger in your living room. “That’s exactly what’s happening in this case, they’re installing a group of people called the 49 percenters to have shares in an institution that is using our water without our consent.”

…Mana Party leader Hone Harawira said it was difficult to define and translate the Maori idea of ownership. Debate over water rights was difficult for Maori who wanted to assert their rights without having to succumb to the commodity notion of ownership, he said. “The relationship for Maori is far deeper.”

Maori Council lawyer FELIX GEIRINGER said hapu involved in the case were seeking FULL OWNERSHIP of water resources in their area and wanted the sale of state owned energy companies halted until their quest for redress was finalised.

________________________

MEANWHILE, as someone mentioned YESTERDAY [or, shit, was it today]

WAIKATO RIVER DEED OF SETTLEMENT SIGNED WITH WAIKATO-TAINUI – 🙂
 Thursday, 17 December, 2009 – 10:47 The Crown and Waikato-Tainui today signed a revised deed of settlement in relation to their historical Treaty claims over the Waikato River, Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations Christopher Finlayson announced.

[NOTE: Maori did not separate the water in a river from the river bed or banks.
– Geiringer, yesterday]

AND

Louise Upston, current mail-out in the Taupo region lists
$220 million clean up and CO-GOVERNANCE fund for [the] Waikato River environment.

WHY ARE THEY SORTING IT ALL OVER AGAIN
WHEN IT HAS BEEN ALREADY SORTED
OR IF IT WASN’T back in 2009 WHAT THE WHUCK WAS WRONG WITH THEM?

Have a really great evening 🙂

http://www.waterpressurelikePennyneversaw.org.nz
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July 20, 2012 5:01pm
kowtow

The ACLU suing the US govt for killing terrorists.
This is another reason they need genuine Republicans in govt,to stop the taxpayr from funding terror lovers.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2012/0720/1224320450140.html
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July 20, 2012 5:37pm
kowtow

Sodomy,

now that I’ve got your attention ,have a look at this clip from jihadwatch. It’s a different perspective on the don’t ask don’t tell policy the US had.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/07/wahhabi-fatwa-permits-sodomy-to-widen-the-anus-as-a-means-to-jihad.html
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July 20, 2012 5:49pm
Reid

That reminds me of this, kowtow. Thanks for that.

Hey anyone technical, does anyone have a workaround for the irritating way YouTude is now throttling its delivery whereby it pauses every 5-10 secs and if you pause it it no longer builds up a buffer?

Any info as to why they are torturing the whole world or even simply what to do so it behaves as it used to, is most appreciated.

Am watching this fantastic doco on NY, if you need a living example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoZLMlEhHlk&feature=relmfu
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July 20, 2012 6:02pm
kowtow

How shit is TVNZ news?
They’ve just led the 6 news with breathless reporting and emotive and inaccurate language about a dog shooting incident sentencing.
Execution and massacre were words used. These words apply to people not animals.
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July 20, 2012 6:09pm
Monique Watson

yeah to Milken for not taking the bait.
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July 20, 2012 6:09pm
nasska

Stay strong kowtow….don’t let the Islamist’s propaganda seduce you into converting. After all the promise of 72 virgins & the joy of sliding semtex up your bottom may just be Satan testing your Catholic staunchness! 😀
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July 20, 2012 6:20pm
publicwatchdog

Seen this Kiwibloggers?

🙂

PRIVATISATION AND INCREASED COMPETITION FOR NATURAL MONOPOLIES LIKE WATER AND ELECTRICITY REDUCES PRICES?

BOLLOCKS!

The evidence…..

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wzt78xdczyqi1zv/A%20Tale%20of%20Two%20Networks.docx

Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com
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July 20, 2012 6:21pm
Reid

They’ve just led the 6 news with breathless reporting and emotive and inaccurate language about a dog shooting incident sentencing. Execution and massacre were words used. These words apply to people not animals.

Yeah. So what?

Did you know if they don’t obey their teleprompter, they get shocked?

It’s true.

How else do the nightly news deliverers we “invite into our homes” create the mass delusion using people intelligent enough to pronounce properly the big words they sometimes have to use, if not through that? I mean this is propaganda people. This is deadly-freakin-serious-I-tell-you-what. This-is-PRODUCT! ADVERTISER-PRODUCT!!@!@!@!! Ramp it up people. Whose getting killed tomorrow tonight? Let’s hope they’re lots of kittens or puppies, they’re worth much much more.

Too bad about the real actual Syrian people killed by the ~~Americans~~ Syrian govt forces, but never mind about real people, they’re not as important as the PRODUCT. This is PRODUCT, people.

Sorry for the caps, but the same principle you’ve raised applies kowtow in all propaganda. It’s tragic, you know. And the anchors remain empty airheads. I mean if you think they’re not, just look at Ali Mau, for example. What a fucking bimbo der.

PRIVATISATION AND INCREASED COMPETITION FOR NATURAL MONOPOLIES LIKE WATER AND ELECTRICITY REDUCES PRICES?

Penny I don’t know what your evidence is, but I have to say I’m with you on the statement. I have never understood the obsession with these two utilities, in this country, it just doesn’t work.
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July 20, 2012 6:30pm
kowtow

Talking of Syria ,a nws report from there commented that when you lose control of your borders ,even for a day, that’s a sign of big trouble……

so that’s Britain ,Australia and the US stuffed then.
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July 20, 2012 6:48pm
David Garrett

Penny…I don’t do this often…but PFO…you are BOOOOORING …
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July 20, 2012 7:02pm
mikenmild

But David, you can scroll past the boring bits and consider the essence of Penny’s posts – which is, um, nothing actually.
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July 20, 2012 7:04pm
David Garrett

Milky: Yes, I know,…just as – in theory – one can do the same with the other idiot who chooses to post here in other than recognisable English sentences….It’s not easy…

I hope you noted my defence of you earlier against what I saw as a somewhat unreasonable attack by kowtow…
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July 20, 2012 7:12pm
mikenmild

Oh yes, thanks David – much appreciated. Kiwiblog is a funny place at times, often full of bile, conspiracy theory, amazingly partisan positions, or just plain nuttiness. But here is also some reasonable and amusing discussion to be had.
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July 20, 2012 7:32pm
Steve (North Shore)

Oooh eerrr.
Mike is softening, he likes this place. Bile, conspiracy, opposites, and funny can work together? who wouda thunk it?

We will get you right thinking sooner or later Mike. You have seen the light 🙂
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July 20, 2012 7:46pm
mikenmild

Oh, it’s entertaining all right. Who’d be on here unless for enjoyment?
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July 20, 2012 7:48pm
Sofia

Mana Party leader Hone Harawira said it was difficult to define and translate the Maori idea of ownership. Debate over water rights was difficult for Maori who wanted to assert their rights without having to succumb to the commodity notion of ownership, he said. “The relationship for Maori is far deeper.”

That was this morning, of the final day of an urgent tribunal hearing at Lower Hutt’s Waiwhetu Marae, Maori Council co-chair Maanu Paul, who said debate on definitions was “diversionary”.
But it could have helped everyone to know what they are talking about for a week.
No wonder John Key may consider the finding, if he can follow it, but not feel bound by it.
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July 20, 2012 7:53pm
Steve (North Shore)

Enjoyment and information.

How do you feel about Taniwha? not now, but when stranded at 3am with a flat tyre just by the bridge at Rangiriri.
The Tainui are out wondering around in the fog
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July 20, 2012 7:55pm
nasska

Two guys were walking down the street one day when they came across a small pair of gym shorts on the ground. They decided to put a sign up on the church bulletin board so the rightful owner could claim them.

The first one starts to write out the sign: ‘FOUND: one pair of boys gym shorts’

“Hold on” says the second “Those are girls gym shorts”. “No they’re not” says the first “They’re boys shorts!” The second grabs them from him and takes a closer look, “No, no… definitely girls gym shorts!”

The two of them are inspecting the shorts in turns and arguing. “Boys shorts!” “No, girls shorts!” “Definitely boys shorts!”… and so on.

The local priest is walking past as the two men argue and can’t help but ask them what the commotion is all about. The first guy tells the priest and asks him if he could sort out the argument.

The priest takes the shorts, has a good long sniff, and after pondering for a few moments he looks at the two men and says: “Definitely boys shorts!… but not from my parish!”
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July 20, 2012 8:00pm
Viking2

Sean is the pastor of a Church of England parish on the Northern Ireland/
Eire border and Patrick is the priest in the Roman Catholic Church across
the road.

One day they are seen together, pounding a sign into the ground, which says:

THE END IS NEAR!
TURN YERSELF AROUND NOW
BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE!

As a car speeds past them, the driver leans out his window and yells, “Leave
people alone, you Oirish religious nutters! We don’t need your lectures.”

> From the next curve they hear screeching tyres and a big splash.

Shaking his head, Rev Patrick says “Dat’s da terd one dis mornin’.”

“Roight,” Pastor Sean agrees, then asks, “Do ya tink maybe da sign should
just say, ‘Bridge Out?'” http://screencast.com/t/9FfwMzUe
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July 20, 2012 8:13pm
nasska

Racial Profiling:

To ensure that Americans never offend anyone — particularly fanatics intent on killing them — airport screeners are not allowed to profile people. They will, however, continue to perform random searches of 80-year-old women, little kids,
airline pilots with proper identification, Secret Service agents who are members of the President’s security detail, and 85-year old Congressmen with metal hips.

Let’s pause a moment and take the following test…

In 1972, 11 Israeli athletes were killed at the Munich
Olympics by:
(a) Grandma Moses;
(b) The night cleaning crew at Rockefeller Center;
(c) Invaders from Mars; or
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1979, the U.S. embassy in Iran was taken over by:
(a) Norwegians from the Lichen Herbarium of the University of Oslo;
(b) Elvis;
(c) A tour bus full of 80-year-old women; or
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1983, the U.S. Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by:
(a) A pizza delivery boy;
(b) Crazed feminists complaining that having to throw a grenade beyond its own burst radius in basic training was an unfair and sexist job requirement;
(c) Geraldo Rivera making up for a slow news day; or
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:
(a) Luca Brazzi, for not being given a part in “Godfather 2”;
(b) The Tooth Fairy;
(c) Butch and Sundance, who had a few sticks of dynamite left over from their train mission; or,
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1993, the World Trade Center was bombed by:
(a) The entire cast of “Cats”;
(b) Martha Stewart;
(c) Cheese-crazed tourists from Wisconsin; or
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1998, the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:
(a) Mr. Rogers;
(b) Hillary, to distract attention from Wild Bill’s women problems;
(c) The World Wrestling Federation to promote its next villain: “Mustapha the Merciless”; or
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked and destroyed by:
(a) Bugs Bunny, Wil E. Coyote, Daffy Duck, and Elmer Fudd.
(b) The US Supreme Court,
(c) Barney; or
(d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

Hmmm…nope, no patterns there. Buggered if I know why they should even even think about profiling.
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July 20, 2012 8:26pm
publicwatchdog

If some of you Kiwibloggers find FACTS and EVIDENCE boring – then try this for size?

🙂

http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/auckland-council-headquarters-move-vy-124051#comment-468930
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Any untoward conflicts of interest between those who bought this property and those from whom this property was bought?

Where are the publicly-available ‘Registers of Interest’?

WHO IS CHECKING?

I did some checking.

This is what I found…………….

________________________________________________

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10816011

Council eyes $122m ASB tower for new HQ
By Anne Gibson
5:30 AM Thursday Jun 28, 2012

The Auckland Council plans to buy new upmarket headquarters so it can quit a civic high-rise block tentatively earmarked for demolition.

The council has entered private negotiations to buy the ASB Bank Centre, valued by an Australian institutional fund at $112 million, substantially upgrading it for its staff and housing many of them under one roof.
………………………………..

ASB Bank Centre, 135 Albert St.
Valued at $112 million, owned by Brookfield Multiplex
31 levels with extensive carparking.”
____________________________________________________________

http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/886938
_______________________________________________________

BROOKFIELD MULTIPLEX CONSTRUCTIONS (NZ) LIMITED (886938)

Last updated on 14 Dec 2011

Company number:886938
Incorporation Date:17 Dec 1997
Company Status:Registered

Company Addresses:Registered Office
Level 8, 66 Wyndham St, Auckland , New Zealand

Address for service
Level 8, 66 Wyndham St, Auckland , New Zealand
View all addresses

Directors Showing 2 of 2 directors

George KOSTAS
36 Johnston St,, Annandale, Nsw 2038, Australia ,

Peter George WALL
233 Beach Road, Campbells Bay, North Shore City, 0630 , New Zealand ”

______________________________________________

EXECUTIVE TEAM OF AUCKLAND COUNCIL PROPERTY LTD

http://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/EN/ABOUTCOUNCIL/REPRESENTATIVESBODIES/CCO/Pages/council_property.aspx

“Peter George Wall
BCA – Bachelor of Commerce and Administration
ACA – Associate Chartered Accountant

Peter has enjoyed over 30 years in the Property industry participating in development, investment management and the acquisition and disposal of some $1.2 billion of Property assets. He has held CEO roles in public property companies, operated in UK, France and Canada and for 3 years
was Managing Director, Property for Brookfield Multiplex in NZ and he continues to provide consulting services to this company.

Peter is a past National President of the Property Council in NZ, President and Trustee of the North Harbour Charitable Trust, Trustee of the Graeme Dingle Foundation trust and Chair of the Harbour Access Trust which has as its responsibilities the development of the National Ocean Water Sports Centre at Takapuna and ferry services to Takapuna and Browns Bay.”

__________________________________________________________

hmmmmm…………………….????

Penny Bright
‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com
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July 20, 2012 8:28pm
hj

A Coroner’s report into the death of Glenn Mills slams the Corrections Department. Chief Coroner Judge Neil MacLean.

http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/2525669/coroner's-report-slams-corrections-department.asx

sad, sad, sad…..???????

I wondered who the sad case was and then realised it was the sex maniac train driver who didn’t tell his numerous gay liasons he was HIV+.

He did the honorable and right thing. What happened to honour?
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July 20, 2012 8:33pm
publicwatchdog

Reid – I provided the link to the evidence in my previous post?

PRIVATISATION AND INCREASED COMPETITION FOR NATURAL MONOPOLIES LIKE WATER AND ELECTRICITY REDUCES PRICES?

BOLLOCKS!

The evidence…..

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wzt78xdczyqi1zv/A%20Tale%20of%20Two%20Networks.docx

Cheers!

Penny Bright

‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com
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July 20, 2012 8:34pm
Steve (North Shore)

Hi Penny, when is it Phool’s turn to get out of the straightjacket?
You shut him down, didn’t you? You are far more important so you used your connections
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July 20, 2012 8:43pm
mikenmild

philu and Penny up a tree?
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July 20, 2012 8:46pm
hj

I was under the house installing insulation. I heard Brian Edwards on The Panel say how he “loves working” and “why would anyone want to retire?”.
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July 20, 2012 8:46pm
mikenmild

Living the dream eh, hj?
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July 20, 2012 8:48pm
hj

Thinking about people who get name suppression etc, the guy on Target who sniffed the ladies u/w and masturbated in front of her computer… he was recognisable by shape and occupation. Did he have children, wife who could be subject to ridicule???
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July 20, 2012 8:51pm
Other_Andy

@nasska

As for your not profiling.
It gets even sillier………..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1299914/Airline-security-probe-veiled-women-board-Heathrow-bound-flight-showing-faces.html

Sometimes I wonder.
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July 20, 2012 8:52pm
Harriet

Ilich Ramírez Sánchez (born October 12, 1949), also known as Carlos the Jackal, is a Venezuelan currently serving a life sentence in France for the 1975 murder of two French counter-intelligence agents and an informant for the French government.[3][4] While in prison he was further convicted of attacks in France that killed 11 and injured 150 people and sentenced to an additional life term.[5][6]

A committed Marxist-Leninist ideologue, Ramírez Sánchez is widely regarded as one of the most famous political terrorists of his era.[7][8][9] When he joined the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) in 1970, recruiting officer Bassam Abu Sharif gave him the code name “Carlos” due to his South American roots.[10] After several bungled bombings, Ramírez Sánchez achieved notoriety for the 1975 raid on the OPEC headquarters in Vienna, which killed three people. This was followed by a string of attacks against Western targets. For many years he was among the most wanted international fugitives. Carlos was dubbed “The Jackal” by The Guardian after one of its correspondents reportedly spotted Frederick Forsyth’s 1971 novel The Day of the Jackal near some of the fugitive’s belongings.[11]

For his part, Ramírez Sánchez denied the 1975 killings, saying they were orchestrated by Mossad, the Israeli secret service, and condemning Israel as a terrorist nation. During his trial in France in 1997, he said, “When one wages war for 30 years, there is a lot of blood spilled—mine and others. But we never killed anyone for money, but for a cause—the liberation of Palestine.”[12
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July 20, 2012 9:02pm
nasska

Other_Andy

It is political correctness gone absolutely off the wall……their compatriots are the arseholes who necessitated the security measures & they should be the ones to suffer the inconvenience.

I also read somewhere recently that Muslims make up a large proportion of the airport security at Heathrow. I can just imagine how well searched ‘certain’ people are when an Imam gives the nod.
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July 20, 2012 9:04pm

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