General Debate 25 May 2013

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nasska

I think I’m becoming religious.

I’m sitting indoors waiting to be offended by something. 🙂
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May 25, 2013 8:11am
hj

What vested interest don’t want people to hear:
http://tvnz.co.nz/politics-news/winston-peters-warns-corruption-china-5447267
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May 25, 2013 8:15am
kowtow

The power of the state is no longer used to protect it’s lawful citizens ,like Drummer Rigby.

Instead it swings into action to stifle free speech and dissent.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2330180/Woolwich-attacks-Man-charged-making-racist-anti-religious-Facebook-comments-British-soldier-s-death.html

The BBC apologises after 43 complain at the use of the term “Muslim appearance”, So in the aftermath of that murder cretins will still complain and the BBC will apologise.

Time to get tough and stop apologising for the truth. But then it’s now a crime to be truthful.Progressives!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10076799/Nick-Robinson-says-sorry-for-saying-suspected-Woolwich-killers-were-of-Muslim-appearance.html
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May 25, 2013 8:17am
Viking2

Too bloody cold to get out of bed.

Time for a summer holiday me thinks.
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May 25, 2013 8:17am
Reid

I think I’m becoming religious.

I’m sitting indoors waiting to be offended by something.

No I think you’re just getting old nasska. But your mistake could explain a lot if it turns out to be a common misconception.
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May 25, 2013 8:21am
hj

Who would be opposed to a party that puts New Zealanders interests first:

people who have risen the property ladder and are contemplating summer holidays.
immigration agents, lawyers
anyone creaming it in our giant people servicing sector (anyone who rises above the crush -manufacturing closely tide to building).
smug elites (on the left) who see themselves as having god-like status (in their own little ways).
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May 25, 2013 8:22am
Reid

Who would be opposed to a party that puts New Zealanders interests first:

No-one of course hj.

However no such party is in sight, is it.

And if you think the party that calls itself NZF does just that, you’re the biggest moron this ~~planet~~ universe has ever produced.
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May 25, 2013 8:31am
Dennis Horne

nasska (6,414) Says: May 25th, 2013 at 8:11 am. I think I’m becoming religious.

Sorry, nasska, it’s a gift. Not everybody gets it. Some are just born to suffer and die. 🙂
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May 25, 2013 8:39am
calendar girl

Five nights of rioting now in Stockholm, capital of Sweden that is so frequently held up by socialists politicians and commentators as a model to be followed: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22650267

With a population of 9 million, twice that of New Zealand, Sweden admitted 44,000 asylum seekers last year – predominantly from countries like Iraq, Somalia, the former Yugoslavia, Afghanistan and Syria.

Current social unrest is said to arise from concerns about “immigration, unemployment and social inequality”. From our distance it all sounds so familiar as “liberal” European countries inexorably cede their own sovereignty to the EU and the UN and, with it, their traditional standard of living and their sense of social unity.
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May 25, 2013 8:41am
wat dabney

“Who would be opposed to a party that puts New Zealanders interests first”

By definition, anyone who isn’t a bigot.

What sort of moral defect are you to value people differently depending on which side of an invisible political line they were born?
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May 25, 2013 8:48am
Griff

They say you get more conservative as you age nasska
Hurry up and vote in voluntary euthanasia
anything but a life of scanning blogs and msm for a hint of offense against your imagined past perfect society
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May 25, 2013 8:49am
nasska

About the way I see it Griff. 🙂
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May 25, 2013 8:51am
hj

Reid (13,569) Says:

Who would be opposed to a party that puts New Zealanders interests first:

No-one of course hj.

However no such party is in sight, is it.

And if you think the party that calls itself NZF does just that, you’re the biggest moron this planet universe has ever produced.
……………………………………………………….

That’s silly Reid. Parties tend to favour certain groups. National is pro immigration (despite the advice of the Savings Working Group), Political Parties receive funds from vested interests and come under intense lobbying. In addition Labour is full of dreamers who don’t delineate worker in country A with worker in Country B, C or D; their country is UN H.Q. so between Tweedle Dumb and Tweedle Dee no other party covers that part of the field*.

* although Ging has been making noises about addressing demand and supply on housing demand ..
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May 25, 2013 8:52am
flipper

All homeowners, but especially all those in the Auckland city area, should read John Roughan in this morning’s NZ Herald.

If only the Herald Editor was as perceptive and up front as some of his staff.

Roughan tells an extraordinary story – one that should send shivers down all homeowners’ backs as local government change starts consolidating elsewhere!
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May 25, 2013 8:53am
Viking2

They say you get more conservative as you age nasska

Ah Griif there’s your mistake.
As you get older you care less for PC and control and become cantankerous and outspoken.
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May 25, 2013 8:55am
Odakyu-sen

[The BBC apologises after 43 complain at the use of the term “Muslim appearance”] Fair enough. Islam is not a race.
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May 25, 2013 8:56am
wat dabney

“ National is pro immigration (despite the advice of the Savings Working Group) ”

Ah hj, still angrily touting your highly-selective quotation after all these years?

You really are quite the ugly little bigot aren’t you.

What else do government reports say about the effects of immigration?

“In recent years there has been a lot of research on the economic impacts of immigration, both in New Zealand and abroad. In many areas a consensus has been reached on what the impacts are, although in some other areas there remains uncertainty. This report reviews 2005-2010 research on the economic impacts of immigration. The report concludes that immigration has made a positive contribution to economic outcomes in New Zealand and that fears for negative economic impacts such as net fiscal costs, house price inflation, lower wages, and increasing unemployment find very little support in the available empirical evidence. Moreover, the economic integration of immigrants is broadly successful. Migration increases trade and tourism, both inbound and outbound. The net fiscal impact of immigration is positive. The links between immigration and technological change are complex. Additional immigration raises gross domestic product (GDP) per capita, albeit only modestly. Without net immigration, GDP per capita would be less. Changes in immigration policy and in the New Zealand economy over the last quarter century now yield greater economic benefits from immigration than in the past.”
http://www.dol.govt.nz/publication-view.asp?ID=362

“It was estimated that the immigrant population, of 927,000, had a positive net fiscal impact of $3,288 million in 2005/06. The New Zealand-born population of 3.1 million had a lower net fiscal impact of $2,838 million. In total, migrants contributed 40 percent more to government revenue than they received in government expenditure…We conclude that immigration has made a positive contribution to economic outcomes in New Zealand, and that fears for negative economic impacts such as net fiscal costs, house price inflation, and increasing unemployment are largely unfounded.”
http://www.dol.govt.nz/publications/research/synthesis-research/synthesis-research_10.asp

Or, for the Australian government:

“While a larger population leads to a larger economy, the main issue is whether this expansion is accompanied by higher living standards. According to the PCPP, living standards, as measured by Gross National Product (GNP) per capita, are lower than would otherwise be the case for the first 12 years of the policy, but are then higher. After 20 years, the gain in GNP per capita reaches 0.6 per cent.”
http://www.immi.gov.au/media/publications/pdf/Econtech_Comparison_Report.pdf

I have provided these quotations before of course, yet for some strange reason you continue to be highly selective in your choices, intent on completely misrepresenting the evidence.

Basically you are lying to yourself and lying to us.
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May 25, 2013 9:10am
Reid

That’s silly Reid. Parties tend to favour certain groups.

hj you sound about as naive as Bryce Edwards in fact I wouldn’t be surprised if you were him and I’m afraid I simply can’t be arsed explaining how politics really works to someone who doesn’t even get the basics about life, let alone the basics of politics.

Suffice to say, vested interests, selfishness, venal and even evil motivations DO NOT VEST THEMSELVES IN ONE SIDE AND NOT IN THE OTHER and unless and until you understand that THE SIDE YOU LOVE HAS JUST AS MUCH OF THAT GOING ON AS THE SIDE YOU HATE then you will never understand the first thing about anything, in the world of politics.

Hope that helps, but I doubt it.

Not that I give a fuck, either way.
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May 25, 2013 9:15am
Viking2

Ah Smith does it again.

Aucklanders need to get over their nimbyism and accept lower quality developments if they want affordable housing, says Housing Minister Nick Smith.

When first unveiled, it was assumed the designations would be on cheaper rural land in a bid to speed up home building. But Dr Smith says greenfield subdivisions earmarked for housing within the urban limits and in areas zoned for intensification could be declared special housing areas.

“Higher quality equates to high price. You end up with conditions requiring expensive sections and expensive homes.”

Fast-track consenting and less restrictive rules were needed to get affordable houses built.

==================
As ever the devil is in Smiths head.

He wants to build tracks of cheap housing and is prepared to tell land owners what they should be doing rather than allowing the market to fill its needs.

Essentially I agree with his sentiments that no one can build cheap new houses in volume these days.

The reason is and for a long time has been really simple. Its not that we can’t, its that private developers create subdivisions for the benfit of the incoming house owners, estblishing a standard that they consider is appropriate for their sibdivision and their buyers. This encompasses council requirements like parks paths etc.
The standards are protected by building covenants and the subdivider ensures that the established standard is maintained until he sells his lat section.
OPurchasers must be happy with this for they buy and stay.

What Smith is saying is that he wants lots of cheap houses that don’t match the standard requirements of the developers and it seems he may want to force his whish upon developers.
i.e. usurp the property rights of those developers and the customers.

If the demand for the Cheap was so great there would be developers (as there has been in the past), who would create subdivisions that would allow anything to be built. As there doesn’t seem to be any on the horison then one should safley assume this is all just a socialist beat up by Smith and his kind to pandy to a section of the community that already gets great handouts.

Smith is attempting to rebuild back to the past and create more Otara’s and Porrirua’s with OPM. i.e. yours and mine as taxpayers.

If Smith is so concerned and is so passionate about doing this stuff he should invest his own time and money in creating these subdivisions and sell off to the ppoor. I’m sue he would be so successful at it and make a killing allowing him to retire forever.
The sooner the better but
He ain’t got the balls to put up his own.
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May 25, 2013 9:16am
iMP

In response to the ghastly South London attack, The political Pink Cardie Brigade in Britian has issued an edict that military service-people should not wear their uniforms in public for now. To which the fiesty British don’t-mess-with-us-you-Appeasement-Blouses have responded…

http://conzervative.wordpress.com/2013/05/25/the-pink-cardie-brigade-in-britain-how-to-fight-back/
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May 25, 2013 9:24am
Floyd60

Frm Radio NZ Business News this week. http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/business/135749/super-fund-reaches-april-high

‘The New Zealand Superannuation Fund returned 2.18% during April, reaching a month-end high of $22.56 billion.

The fund’s return over the last 12 months was nearly 20% and its return over the last three years has been more than 13% a year.’

Good on you Michael.
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May 25, 2013 10:05am
Dennis Horne

Immigration is successful statistics. The liars figure.
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May 25, 2013 10:11am
Scott Chris

The BBC apologises after 43 complain at the use of the term “Muslim appearance”

Of course they should apologise. The reference is a heady mix of racism and islamophobia.

Projected vote: 🙂 1 🙁 10
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May 25, 2013 10:21am
joana

There is a ridiculous article in the Herald this morning about the link between heart problems and extreme athletes..The writer Phil Taylor , writes as if this is something new whereas it is really old news..Several years ago , a nurse who works in our local cardiac unit told me that at any given time they usually have two or three young men , in their thirties , who are there because of over exercising. At least the article publicizes this but it is rather late in the day.
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May 25, 2013 10:29am
iMP

Colin Craig has been made an MP. The Aussies couldn’t wait 18 months. Prophetic?

http://conzervative.wordpress.com/2013/05/25/do-the-aussies-know-something-we-dont/
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May 25, 2013 10:41am
Akaroa

Calendar Girl at 8.41.

You’ve got it so right!

(I’d say: ‘I agree with you – in spades!” – but I fear that occasionally heard colloquial expression may offend some of the hyper-sensitive in the racial topics arena!)
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May 25, 2013 10:45am
Steve (North Shore)

Link to John Rouhan on housing.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10885983
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May 25, 2013 11:02am
hj

Reid Says:

Suffice to say, vested interests, selfishness, venal and even evil motivations DO NOT VEST THEMSELVES IN ONE SIDE AND NOT IN THE OTHER and unless and until you understand that THE SIDE YOU LOVE HAS JUST AS MUCH OF THAT GOING ON AS THE SIDE YOU HATE then you will never understand the first thing about anything, in the world of politics.
………………………
There is agreement between the left and the right on immigration but from different perspectives. The left tend to be humanitarian, while belonging to elite groups who don’t compete with migrants. They have a flat earth view of the world (like Watt) that doesn’t see humans in a socio/biological paradigm

In the Philippines 7/10 births are by women 19 years of age or younger ( a matter of religion and government policy). The left would look at the individuals and say ‘let the poor things in”, whereas the way I see it we have no moral obligation to compensate for their leaders stupidity.
The right (for their part) say: “house prices up- wages down”!
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May 25, 2013 11:09am
Griff

Living in Auckland gives a different view.
The infrastructure cost of expansion is paid for by Auckland rate payers.
Auckland is a city dominated by new New Zealand’s.
The social cost will be paid by Auckland as well.
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May 25, 2013 11:14am
hj

Population growth is GOVERNMENT POLICY.
“Our Future Is With China”… “NZ’rs just can’t afford these prices”
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10885983

80% of our population growth in the last couple of decades has been the net inflow of non NZ citizens .
http://www.treasury.govt.nz/downloads/pdfs/mi-jarrett-comm.pdf

John Banks called the new arrivals (1 million or so) “a great opportunity” (he didn’t specify for whom).
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May 25, 2013 11:17am
hj

Comment Roughan’s piece

Roughan – do you realise the inherent contradiction in what you are saying? You question the validity and competence of a profession that plans the regulation of land use and development – yet you want strict regulations on your neighbours rights to develop their property. Your belief in the free market and property rights seems to be restricted to when it directly benefits you.
………
How true those sort are free market libertarians as long as they are making on the deal, as long as they can have their “little peace of paradise” with no neighbours or on the top floor over looking everyone else (otherwise they join the NIMBYS)
.
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May 25, 2013 11:28am
kowtow

scott chris says
“The BBC apologises after 43 complain at the use of the term “Muslim appearance”

Of course they should apologise. The reference is a heady mix of racism and islamophobia.”

While the referenced act was a frightening mix of race and Islam.
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May 25, 2013 11:57am
kowtow

The guy in the green hat has a Muslim appearance……..oh sorry can’t say that…….might be racist(How does that work?)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2330327/Two-men-tried-cockpit-flight-Pakistan-Britain-pictured.html
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May 25, 2013 12:16pm
Redbaiter

Narsekissa’s heaven-

http://familyfirst.org.nz/2013/05/latest-joke-doing-the-rounds-in-oz/
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May 25, 2013 12:34pm
Pauleastbay

Dear Winston and other simple minds outs there.

I went to town this morning with my Australian born wife of a Croatian father and New Zealand Maori mother and our daughter

I had my hair cut by a Finnish girl in a barber shop owned by an Iranian.

Afterwards I had a coffee in shop owned and run by European New Zealanders.

I was served at the supermarket by a Tongan woman and a European New Zealander.

I have just bought our meat for the weekend at the Asian butchery down the road from home, I had to line up to be served behind Indians, Samoans, European New Zealanders and a couple of Poms.

This is how our country is made up and its bloody great.

So Winston you can be as pathetic as you like and try and scare the simple and doddery by preying on the intolerance of a few broken arses out there . Doing so does no one any sort of service and goes to show what self serving waste of fucking space you are.

Winston you are a fucking disgrace as a New Zealander and as a member of our Parliament you are nothing but scum.

And a hypocritcal piece of scum at that.
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May 25, 2013 12:37pm
Pauleastbay

Kowtow

Please describe how a catholic or a anglican looks.

Not all rag heads are muslims.
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May 25, 2013 12:39pm
Redbaiter

So Paula narrates the tale of his travels in Auckland and this is meant to be an irrefutable argument for mulitculturalism. Just to emphasize this point, and to demonstrate how tolerant and accepting of other’s people’s views he is, our liberal Paula calls those who might think differently “broken arses, simple and doddery”. (and then in next comment talks about “ragheads”.)

So in Paula’s mind there is no rational or considered argument ever to be made against “multiculturalism” and those opposed to it are bigots and stupid.

I’m no fan at all of Winston Peters, but I understand that there are many rational arguments against multiculturalism, and the one that I frequently use is that our culture is one that bought many advancements to global civilisation, and why do we need to dilute it with cultures that do not have the same values?

That multiculturalism is all one way is the most telling point. Sub-cultures are flocking to the west. Not that our culture is by any means perfect, and there is already a concerted effort to destroy it anyway by progressive white ants. Mass immigration is a means to hurry this along and this intent has been admitted by left wing politicians behind the ruination of the UK.

Paula thinks he’s a liberal. The truth is he’s a small minded bigot full of progressive prejudices and in his ignorance working on the larger scale to bring down one of the most truly liberal civilisations that has ever existed.
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May 25, 2013 12:54pm
F E Smith

Interesting point made in the decision released yesterday finding that the current fixed fee scheme for legal aid was implemented illegally:

(a) from 1996 to 2008 criminal legal aid lawyers received no increase in remuneration;

(b) in 2008, despite the recommendation of an independent committee that remuneration be increased by 15 per cent, the LSA increased it by only 10 per cent;

(c) shortly after that, the increase was reduced to 8.5 per cent;

(d) by reducing rates by 10 per cent (which has been done), the remuneration under the fixed fee regime is approximately 2.3 per cent less than the level of remuneration at 1996, disregarding the effects of inflation; and

(e) inflation between the fourth quarter of 1996 and the fourth quarter of 2011 reduced the value of the New Zealand dollar by 40.1 per cent, so that $1.41 was required at the end of 2011 to achieve the same purchasing power as $1 at the end of 1996.

Also, the elephant in the room is that the rapid increase in the cost of legal aid increased only after the Labour Government widened the eligibility criteria. The Court of Appeal says that lawyers were only reponsible for a third of the increase, and I would make the point that it also fails to take into account the large number of multi-defendant P trials that were taking place at the time, which would be a major factor in that one third that the lawyers were responsible for..

In other words, the blowout in the cost of the legal aid regime was almost entirely down to either Government policy changes, which was repsonsible for two thirds of the increase, and multi-defendant drugs trials taking up much of the rest.

Which suggests that Simon Power was in fact dishonest when he was blaming lawyers for the blowout in the cost of legal aid. It also suggests that Dame Margaret Bazely found what she was supposed to find in order to give Simon Power an excuse.

So, my question is this: how many of you would be willing to do the job you do today, with no reduction in the quality of your work, for remuneration that was 2.3% less than you would have received for that job in 1996? Not many of you, surely?
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May 25, 2013 12:58pm
KevinH

Winston is fond of the trappings of office that the position of Foreign Affairs Minister provides i.e. swanning around on the stage at the White House with Condolezza Rice, however he appears to have shot himself in the foot with his latest comments which will clang loudly in the parliament of our largest trading partner China.
There is very little possibility that Winston will be able to leverage his percentages in any coalition agreement with consideration to his anti Asian rhetoric, the left would surely choke with him on board.
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May 25, 2013 1:00pm
Pauleastbay

When I see you reply Red I know I’m right.

We are a multicultural society – fact.

Someone with your limited outlook Red will remember when you couldn’t even buy toothpaste here on Sunday because only bread and milk was for sale for a two hour window at the corner store. There was the choice of steak and chips or chips and steak when you went out for a meal and there was Chateua drain cleaner to drink, and we were men when you could scull 4 jugs and spew before 6 o’clock. I actively mourn for those days thats for sure.

And I’m not actually that liberal but I fucking loath sanctimonious pieces of shit who hide behind their supposed nationalisim and use that as an excuse for intolerance.

You are well recognised on here Red as one of the sadness buggers who posts, I mean really fucking sad and with 98 out of every hundred posts you re-enforce that for a entire new generation of readers.
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May 25, 2013 1:03pm
Redbaiter

Looked for some kind of counter argument in that screed, but should have known I was wasting my time. You’re just a progressive pull string doll with no brain of your own.
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May 25, 2013 1:10pm
Viking2

FES
So, my question is this: how many of you would be willing to do the job you do today, with no reduction in the quality of your work, for remuneration that was 2.3% less than you would have received for that job in 1996? Not many of you, surely?
———————-

Just in case you are wondering many kiwi’s are doing just that.
Indeed less than they were getting in the 80’s.

There’s another world out there beyond the inner sanctum of the Law Dept.
And you should know that.
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May 25, 2013 1:10pm
Thrash Cardiom

The BBC apologises after 43 complain at the use of the term “Muslim appearance”, So in the aftermath of that murder cretins will still complain and the BBC will apologise.

Time to get tough and stop apologising for the truth. But then it’s now a crime to be truthful.Progressives!

Could you please describe the characteristics of the person in the linked image that are of “Muslim appearance”.

http://bigpicture.ru/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Vulvich01-800×584.jpg
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May 25, 2013 1:11pm
F E Smith

In response to Viking2’s comment yesterday, which quoted a misleading article from the Herald (funnily enough)

So they spent taxpayers money to protect thier own self interest.
Hopefully the Govt. will kick this to touch or better still remove legal aid.

No, we spent our own money. But the Government acted unlawfully. If you want to get rid of criminal legal aid, that is fine. You will require most people charged with a crime to represent themselves against a prosecution agency that is given money by the government to hire lawyers to represent it. The fact is that there is already a large disparity between the resources of the prosecution and those of the defence. And that will cost a lot more in wasted court time than you ever pay in legal aid.

Plus, we have signed up to international treaties that require us to provide assistance to defendants who cannot afford a lawyer.
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May 25, 2013 1:12pm
kowtow

“Allah akbar” …………..

then there’s the butchers’ knife……

the blood…….

the dead man…..

non English perpetrators……

A scene straight out of Koranic Arabia. Played out in London.

Appearance: the way that someone or something appears;an impression given.Oxford.

Islam,complletly incompatible with what was once considered the “west”.
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May 25, 2013 1:37pm
Thrash Cardiom

What I see is a person holding a knife and cleaver. Nothing about this, his dress, or his ethnicity can be described as being of “Muslim appearance”. His religion and actions are quite separate to his appearance.
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May 25, 2013 1:41pm
Longknives

Pauleastbay-I just want to hear more about the Finnish girl…..
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May 25, 2013 1:47pm
kowtow

peastbay

The guy arrested off the plane from Pakistan looks like a Muslim.

For the purposes of this exercise describing Catholic or Anglican is redundant ,but then you know that and are simply being stupid,again.

As an aside ‘catholic’ is in the Anglican creed ,and means universal. Islam means submission.

Describe “universal” no need,best get to know what submission looks like.
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May 25, 2013 1:47pm
Pauleastbay

Kowtow

I will ask my question again – simplify it – please describe how religion looks in human manifestation. Then perhaps you could break it down into its sub-groups for us i.e muslims, catholics, presbyterians et al.
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May 25, 2013 1:47pm
Pauleastbay

Long knives

Shes lovely, my ardour cooled somewhat when she said she didn’t know Kimi Räikkönen but its a good haircut.
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May 25, 2013 1:50pm
Longknives

Dammit- A knowledge of Formula One racing is essential in a Scandinavian girl…She has blown her chances indeed.
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May 25, 2013 1:57pm
Dennis Horne

The two English religious maniacs who killed the young father because he was a soldier appeared to be Muslims.
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May 25, 2013 1:58pm
Longknives

http://thechive.com/2012/01/03/by-popular-demand-hot-scandinavian-women-40-photos/

I may be getting slightly off track here….
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May 25, 2013 2:00pm
Viking2

FES.Plus, we have signed up to international treaties that require us to provide assistance to defendants who cannot afford a lawyer
=================
No one asked me if they could spend my money like that. I see not one shred of evidence that spending the taxpayers money on those that committ crimes is of benefit to anyone other than the criminal.

Like welfare, if we removed the Social spend for anything other than an intial appearance then many would get the message and stop committing crimes. It is also true that people should self insure for their legal fees.

Lawyers are always socialists when it comes to taking the social spend but watch how they behave like true capitalists once its your money they are after.
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May 25, 2013 2:02pm
Pauleastbay

Longknives

Its “The Barber Shop”, Shortland Street- should you need a head sharpening -shes the blonde one ,not one of the Iranians who may be muslims.
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May 25, 2013 2:05pm
RF

Surprised that Toad and other soap dodgers have not been more vocal about the Denniston open cast mine. Maybe he is waiting for fresh instructions from Clint.

Its about time the West Coast work force was given a boost as the jobs created by the mine will inject much needed cash into the economy.
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May 25, 2013 2:06pm
kowtow

Trash and paule will see what they want.

Sensible folk see Islamic terror at work.Pretty simple really.

And Islam has a word for fools like that ,dhimmitude,look it up. Lenin had his own term for it; Useful idiots.
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May 25, 2013 2:12pm
cha

A belated happy birthday to Bob.

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/pictures/photos-70-photos-of-bob-dylan-on-his-70th-birthday-20110524
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May 25, 2013 2:16pm
Pauleastbay

RF

there you go with another conumdrum.

Now, are all soap dodgers greens? or are all greens soap dodgers?

Are all muslims terrorists? or Are all terrorists muslims?

We live in a grey world not a black and white one, especially with bloody religion – those that want a black and white world are just lazy and stunted they continually put forward weak arguments to justify their intolerance.
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May 25, 2013 2:19pm
Manolo

Last, final, the end of it according to the sacred word of Labour Lite: http://news.msn.co.nz/nationalnews/8664590/east-coast-hapu-signs-23m-settlement
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May 25, 2013 2:21pm
nasska

….”A belated happy birthday to Bob”….

An incredibly talented singer/songwriter Cha. It brings back many pleasant memories of sitting around in a mate’s flat in the late 60’s, out of our trees on flagon beer & weak dope listening to great albums like Highway 61 Revisited.

Happy (late) birthday Bob.
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May 25, 2013 2:27pm
Thrash Cardiom

Did you know that between 1980 and 2005, there were more Jewish terrorist attacks on US soil than there were Islamic terrorist attacks?

http://www.loonwatch.com/2010/01/not-all-terrorists-are-muslims/
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May 25, 2013 2:29pm
Thrash Cardiom

Islamaphobic perception is not related to reality

http://www.loonwatch.com/2010/01/terrorism-in-europe/
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May 25, 2013 2:33pm
Pauleastbay

The two English religious maniacs who killed the young father because he was a soldier appeared to be Muslims.

Dennis

No, they are muslims and pricks- but there is nothing physically that I could see that would make me go- bugger me, look at those muslims – as I passed them on the street.

I saw several people with brilliant teeth this morning but it was a leap for me to say -I saw several Mormons this morning ,because they had shiny pegs. Or of all the Asians I saw – Fuck, look at all those gamblers walking down Queen Street.
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May 25, 2013 2:34pm
nasska

Thrash Cardiom

I have no basis to doubt the truth of the figures supplied in your 2.33pm link. I would point out however, that there is more sense to be gained by reading the comments. Eg.

1)….”Well, except for the fact that the only terrorist organisations operating on european soil that DELIBERATLY wishes to target civilians, are islamist/jihadist groups. Easily demonstrated by the complete lack of civilian casualties from these hundreds of non-islamist-terrorist attacks”….

2)….”Religiously inspired Islamist terrorists on the other hand are usually in war against the whole western world. Their attacks aren’t there for the sake of political argument. They carry out their attacks not in places which are symbolically important but in places where people congregate.”….

3)…..”This seems like a fair representation, but if the 2006 airline bombings had gone ahead, at least 5000 people would have been killed in one go…. This is hardly comparable to setting fire to a car in Northern Spain.”…..

Sorry Thrash….No sale.
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May 25, 2013 2:49pm
Redbaiter

“An incredibly talented singer/songwriter Cha. It brings back many pleasant memories of sitting around in a mate’s flat in the late 60′s, out of our trees on flagon beer & weak dope listening to great albums like Highway 61 Revisited.”

How completely unsurprising. You would just have to be one of those fucking clapped out old dope headed freaks wouldn’t you? Had a haircut in the last twenty years?
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May 25, 2013 2:59pm
nasska

Not only a haircut but a head polish or two Reddy….something about testosterone & baldness they reckon.

Anyway, while you’re here tell us about the more exciting parts of your youth. 🙂
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May 25, 2013 3:06pm
cha

Had a haircut in the last twenty years?

Still poking the same sad old hole?.
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May 25, 2013 3:09pm
Thrash Cardiom

Thrash Cardiom

I have no basis to doubt the truth of the figures supplied in your 2.33pm link. I would point out however, that there is more sense to be gained by reading the comments. Eg.

1) Assertion without evidence. However, of the 17 deaths in Europe through terrorist events in 2012, 14 were in 2 events conducted by Islamic extremists and 3 were in 3 separate events by non-muslims. And of course there is the very non-muslim Norwegian terrorist attack in 2011 which definitely puts the lie to that statement.

2) I’m not sure I see the point. In what way does this differ from how organisations like the IRA used to operate? Bombing Harrods is hardly symbolically important but it is a place where people congregate

3) Sorry – I didn’t realise that it was the number of deaths that were important. From now on I will discount any events that have few than X deaths. Please advise me what X should be.
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May 25, 2013 3:12pm
Manolo

The cleric and his religion are vile:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2rL6NDoyKg
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May 25, 2013 3:23pm
Redbaiter

So family, fidelity, loyalty and commitment are just sad contemptible jokes to you right Yum Cha?

What’s the bet you’ve got a drawer full of Che t-shirts to go with your typically cowardly progressive temperament.

Lowlife POS.
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May 25, 2013 3:23pm
nasska

We could make X = 1 but it would still show up Islamic terrorism in a worse light than you choose to show it in. Anyone who trawls the internet looking for figures/arguments to back a predetermined position will not go unrewarded.

The salient point, for me, is that Islamic terrorism is planned on a large scale & calculated to cause as many civilian deaths & injury as possible. The fact that they are largely incompetent fools & that the authorities have been on top of most potential attacks to date does not alter the act that sooner or later the butchers will get lucky.

Then we will see real carnage & terror from “the Religion of Peace”.
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May 25, 2013 3:25pm
cha

Gone dry huh?.
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May 25, 2013 3:30pm
Dennis Horne

@Thrash Cardiom. Talk to the people in Paris and suburbs. Live in the areas of London where the immigrants congregate. Why should the locals live in fear and support layabouts? They didn’t ask for this change in their lives. (I have close relatives in both cities, and visit regularly.) You can quote all the numbers you like but you don’t actually know what you’re talking about.
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May 25, 2013 3:34pm
Thrash Cardiom

Islamic terrorism is occasionally planned on a large scale. More often it is planned by either loners or small cells and the results aren’t huge.
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May 25, 2013 3:43pm
cha

http://youtu.be/YZ2VpfUqRoo
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May 25, 2013 3:49pm
Dennis Horne

Thrash Cardiom (279) Says: May 25th, 2013 at 3:43 pm. Islamic terrorism is occasionally planned on a large scale. More often it is planned by either loners or small cells and the results aren’t huge.

That’s what terrorism is. The numbers are small but the effect is large.

What difference did the death of one adventurer (having left his family to play) who went back to get his dope after the warning explosions, when the Rainbow Warrior sank, make to the price of fish? Yet we’ve never heard the end of it.
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May 25, 2013 4:09pm
Scott Chris

Why should the locals live in fear

They shouldn’t, just as they shouldn’t expect to win the lottery.

But they still buy tickets because they are numerically illiterate and fall for the fools-hope marketing, just as they are herded into believing that the risk of falling victim to a terrorist act is far greater than it actually is by a sensationalist (maybe even an agenda driven) media.
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May 25, 2013 4:14pm
Dennis Horne

Scott Chris (4,880) Says: May 25th, 2013 at 4:14 pm. DH: Why should the locals live in fear?
They shouldn’t, just as they shouldn’t expect to win the lottery.

See how you feel after you’ve been knocked down and injured a couple of times, handbag stolen, in your own apartment vestibule. See how you feel when you drive around your building and the arseholes step out in front of you. A building once full of working French now full of layabouts. What do you do? You leave your home, you leave the city you have lived in all your life.

You twerps have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about.
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May 25, 2013 4:27pm
Dennis Horne

And, try mustering up the courage to put your children on a train when some have just been blown up. Or scrambling out of an Underground station when the sirens have gone off, caught in a mob. You fools. You haven’t got a fucking clue. Why should ordinary people live like this? They didn’t ask for it.
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May 25, 2013 4:34pm
F E Smith

Just in case you are wondering many kiwi’s are doing just that.
Indeed less than they were getting in the 80′s.

Bollocks. I don’t accept that one bit.

I see not one shred of evidence that spending the taxpayers money on those that commit crimes is of benefit to anyone other than the criminal.

It is that inconvenient ‘innocent until proven guilty’ thing, plus the overwhelming resources of the state etc, etc. Just imagine that you were being sued by, say, BP. They can afford all the lawyers they want, have all the resources they need, and can basically wear you down. That is the exact position that most people have vis a vis the NZ goverment when it brings prosecutions.

Defending a murder charge can set you back $100,000 if you do it privately. Are you really suggesting that an indigent defendant should be forced to represent themselves when they are charged with murder? Moreover, go ask a judge how difficult it is to deal with someone representing themselves in the criminal jurisdiction. It causes all sorts of problems.

Your sort of attitude is not a helpful one. There will be legal aid. It is an international obligation that the country has committed itself to. The question is will it actually mean something or are we happy to have a police state where there is no check on police power?
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May 25, 2013 4:34pm
Johnboy

“So, my question is this: how many of you would be willing to do the job you do today, with no reduction in the quality of your work, for remuneration that was 2.3% less than you would have received for that job in 1996? Not many of you, surely?”

To my new buddy: 🙂

Dear FE. I understand the pain you chaps in the legal profession are suffering. Be staunch. Strike if you must.

If all else fails here is an organisation you could appeal to! 🙂

http://www.unite.org.nz/
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May 25, 2013 4:36pm
F E Smith

Johnboy,

this might seem unusual, or even against type, to you, but I actually genuinely believe this is an important issue. It is nothing to do with whether I make a living from legal aid or not. To be honest, I make better money from other litigation than I do from crime.

But are you genuinely suggesting that we should simply accept that whoever the police charge with a crime is guilty, that we should not provide legal assistance for those with no money, and that society benefits from that?
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May 25, 2013 4:40pm
Redbaiter

“Anyway, while you’re here tell us about the more exciting parts of your youth.”

I weren’t ever into any of that middle class white boy anti-establishment dope shit Narsekissa. I’ve always been just a beer wine and whiskey drinking blues and country cowboy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQMU1S8FhKg
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May 25, 2013 4:44pm
F E Smith

I would have less of a problem with it if the Courts actually awarded full costs against the Police/Crown for failed prosecutions. Right now charges can be brought against a person with impunity because the Police know that it won’t cost them if they have it wrong.

Also, if the Courts awarded costs, you would find more people willing to instruct privately because they know they will get their money back. It would also see the LSA being repaid for the costs it incurs in cases where legally aided clients are acquitted, or charges are withdrawn.
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May 25, 2013 4:48pm
Johnboy

Not at all FE old chap. I think it would behove the legal profession and the police (with a bit of input from the general populace) to get together and decide what we should be doing about minimising crime and the cost of it.
I think it is counter-productive and very expensive to continue the lamentable situation we now have to resolve guilt.

However I do believe it is currently better for lawyers to increase their income by carrying on with the status-quo that they have created for themselves and it also looks very good for Police Commissioners to proceed in whatever direction they have decided suits their profile! 🙂
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May 25, 2013 4:51pm
Johnboy

I never realised you were a coon till you posted your video Red.

Your ma MAN! 🙂
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May 25, 2013 4:53pm
F E Smith

When I say LSA above, I actually mean MoJ. Old habits and all that.
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May 25, 2013 4:55pm
kowtow

A dead body,foreign looking fellows waving butchers knives ,shouting Allah Akbar ,blood every where……….

Has all the appearances of Jehovah Witnesses calling.
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May 25, 2013 4:57pm
Johnboy

You should never feel that you have to be so legally precise when you chat to us KB turds FE. 🙂
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May 25, 2013 4:58pm
Pauleastbay

http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/8717600/Woman-critical-after-being-dragged-behind-car-on-SH1

Bloody glad we don’t have terrorists in NZ, the place would be unsafe otherwise.
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May 25, 2013 5:07pm
Pauleastbay

A dead body,foreign looking fellows waving butchers knives

Yep, 30 April 1988, Otara town centre.
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May 25, 2013 5:10pm
Johnboy

Eastbay old chap. I have always regarded your opinions with deep regard.

What opinion do you have of the recent accord between Lord Birkenhead and my goodself? :)_
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May 25, 2013 5:11pm
cha

Partial to a little Texas psycobilly myself.

http://youtu.be/BomiqCDLcoE
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May 25, 2013 5:15pm
Pauleastbay

As I commented a couple of weeks ago, I hope the two of you are very happy together. With recent changes to the law there are now no limits to where you can take this relationship.

I for one congratulate you both
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May 25, 2013 5:16pm
Johnboy

What skill is required for embedding! 🙂
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May 25, 2013 5:17pm
Dennis Horne

This attack in the Waikato is almost certainly personal. Probably some criminal association. Terrorism is random. Anyone could be a target. That’s the whole point.
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May 25, 2013 5:18pm
Johnboy

Should FE and I be considering embedding then PEB?? 🙂
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May 25, 2013 5:18pm
Pauleastbay

Dennis

Its terrorisim to the victim. Its all just criminal sadly, those mongrols in london just had an excuse to throw up- results the same in both cases -some poor person is dead because of arseholes.

I think all religion should be done away with but that still wouldn’t stop humans doing the most outlandish things to each other
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May 25, 2013 5:25pm
Johnboy

Pommie Soldiers should just be issued with arms at all times and absolved from criminal proceedings if they have to zap a mussie! Problem solved.
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May 25, 2013 5:32pm

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